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Anti-Brexit protesters stage mass rally in London

41 Comments
By Joe JACKSON

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It was rammed all the way from Park Lane, down Piccadilly through Trafalgar Square to Parliament Square. Impressive.

Im very interested to see how many Farage can muster next week.

2 ( +4 / -2 )

There were at least eleventy five million there yesterday!

But seriously, The People's Vote campaign have a habit of exaggerating the number of people in attendance. The last time they had a protest in London, they claimed around 700,000 people were there, but in reality it was nearer 300,000.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/01/05/peoples-vote-march-attended-third-number-organisers-claimed/

But to be honest, it wouldn't even matter if they managed to get 10 million to attend, protests don't overturn elections or referendums.

-1 ( +3 / -4 )

If the Remainers lose the second referendum will they demand a third one?

-1 ( +4 / -5 )

The Metropolitan Police believe there was over 2 million people at the People's Vote demonstration. Biggest demo ever. I was there, it was very good natured, no trouble at all, unlike mots of the Brexiteer demos. Farage's march that started last week cold only manage a couple of hundred.

3 ( +6 / -3 )

Hundreds of thousands of ppl begging euros to take 'em back with 'i love EU', "am a euro', "i dont wanna leave' etc placards, thousands of EU flags etc. Turns out UK's the most pro-EU country in Europe lol! Bottling it.

Don't think you can (or should) have a 2nd referendum though, have to find a way to remain (if that's what the majority wants) without losing what little dignity/credibility you've left.

The Dutch & French voted against the EU constitution back in 2005; EU technocrats had no other option but to stop the ratification process and create another -unratified- treaty (Lisbon treaty).

If you're pro-eu, revoking article 50 would probably be the least-bad solution (no 2nd ref); if you're a leaver, gotta make yourself heard next week.

0 ( +3 / -3 )

The whole thing was stupid right from the start. Get the uninformed public to make a yes/no decision on an undefined issue, because the people who were elected to make decisions were too weak to do it themselves.

Stop throwing good money after bad - cancel Brexit, go back to the EU hat in hand, and get back to business. The whole idea was stupid from the start.

-1 ( +4 / -5 )

Problem is goldorak is that the majority of British people still want to leave. I understand that some remainers are absolutely convinvced that they are in the majority, but alas, they are not.

Also, British people don't like the EU's style of voting again and again until the desired answer has been achieved. I find that really funny. When the answer is the 'correct' one, there is no more discussion to be had and life goes on.

-1 ( +3 / -4 )

Although I believe ECJ ruling did not formally state a “legislative requirement" to hold a second referendum is required to revoke article 50. However the ECJ ruling insists that the member state would have to revoke Article 50 “in accordance with its constitutional requirements and following a democratic process”.

I suggest that “following a democratic process" could at least politically indicate a 2nd referendum would be necessary.

ECJ ruling on Article 50......

https://www.instituteforgovernment.org.uk/explainers/ecj-ruling-article-50

Strangerland, assuming you're British Citizen, fair enough that is your qualified opinion. However, for better or for worse 17.4 million, the dimwitted or uninformed, legitimately voted to follow a different path and leave.

On the other hand Strangerland if you are not a British Citizen, your best course of action is to lobby your national government to consider starting EU membership proceeding.

After all if the UK does eventually leave I am sure the 27 other member states will welcome a new member.

Of course there are rules and regulations to be complied with, that will be decided by, directives, qualified majority voting, subservient to ad-hoc rulings of the ECJ

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

Brings back memories of the 2 million march in 2003. A great day and always good to see people power in action.

I wish the best of luck to the leavers. The EU will be better off without them and Ireland can be a nation once again. Win win situation for everyone.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

Problem is goldorak is that the majority of British people still want to leave.

Could be, am not bothered one way or another. My issue with this brexit mess is that some leavers (there are quite a few on JT, that's why i occasionally post on the topic) have spent the last 3 years spitting at Europeans (couldnt care less about the eu tbh) spruiking bs saying euros 'need' Britain & can't live/survive without the Brits, claiming euros are trying to derail brexit etc. Reckon most euros want one thing and one thing only: uk pls make up your mind & syso.

Also, British people don't like the EU's style of voting again and again until the desired answer has been achieved

You think euros do?

2 ( +2 / -0 )

The whole thing was stupid right from the start. Get the uninformed public to make a yes/no decision on an undefined issue, because the people who were elected to make decisions were too weak to do it themselves.

Stop throwing good money after bad - cancel Brexit, go back to the EU hat in hand, and get back to business. The whole idea was stupid from the start.

A) we weren't uninformed and claiming we were just shows how ignorant you are. (again)

B) 17.4 million was the biggest vote in UK history. No small number and to ignore the irrefutable facts about the win, you may as well be a dictatorship!

And now that they've had a couple of years to figure out what that means, at the very least they should be asked again.

And our answers would be the same!

We voted to leave and that's it! You can't have another referendum just because you don't like the one that won! Deal with it!

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

Hundreds of thousands of ppl begging euros to take 'em back with 'i love EU', "am a euro', "i dont wanna leave' etc placards, thousands of EU flags etc. Turns out UK's the most pro-EU country in Europe lol! Bottling it.

Who’s bottling it? I imagine these people were pro-EU from the start.

The Brexiteers don’t seem to be bottling it. Many of them are prepared to put the livelihoods of millions in jeopardy, often including their own.

2 ( +4 / -2 )

Why are you so scared to find out what the people think? This is a huge move, wouldn't it be responsible to re-confirm that people actually want to do this? How is that not a prudent step? How is skipping that confirmation not irresponsible. As a business owner, I always get final confirmation from my clients on major issues, even if we've had agreement before, to make sure that at the end, they have fully confirmed that everything is a go. It's called being responsible.

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

Nearly 90 percent of young voters who weren't allowed to vote in 2016 would vote to remain,"

So basically, Remainers want what amounts to a rigged election, by allowing now voting age voters, clearly influenced by the plethora of ignorance by Remainers, to have a vote, and basically say to the original 17.4 million," Your vote doesn't count! "

Farsical!

Why are you so scared to find out what the people think?

17.4 million made it clear what we think. Are our thoughts less important than yours? I think not!

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

17.4 million made it clear what we think.

They did, and now two years further down the road, before making a move that will impact the future of Britain forever, how is it not prudent to re-confirm that the people still want to do it? What if only 20% of the people currently still want to leave? You'd be taking an action that after gathering more information, 80% of the people do not want to do. In such a case, how is not having a referendum a good idea? You'd be taking an action that 4/5 of the people don't want to take. Or, maybe 80% of the people now want to leave. If that's the case, it gives the leavers a strong voice to say 'quit yer whining'. Right now the ambiguity makes it unclear either way.

I'm not sure how you can think it responsible to not ask the people once again if they still want to leave. It's entirely irresponsible to think that such a drastic move should be taken on a single referendum.

-1 ( +3 / -4 )

@goldorak

I think there's only about 4 of us leavers who comment on these articles, although there are some others who are not from the UK who support the original result. I agree with you in that most other Europeans want Britain to just get on with Brexit. I also agree with you that they probably don't like being asked to vote again and again.

@strangerland

It isn't a case of being scared of another referendum. It's like the losing team asking for a World Cup final rematch because they believe they could beat the other team. It has already been decided.

But let me pose a question to you. If there were to be another referendum and remain won (which I state again, it wouldn't) at a percentage of 50.1%. What should happen next? Stay in the EU and move on?

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

It isn't a case of being scared of another referendum. It's like the losing team asking for a World Cup final rematch because they believe they could beat the other team. It has already been decided.

Um, it's not a game, it's the permanent future of your country. Is not the goal to move forward according to the actual wishes of the people? Are you saying people have not, can not, and in fact would not potentially change their opinions one way or the other?

How is it not a good idea to re-confirm that this is what the people want. I don't an analogy to a game, I want an actual answer to this question. "It's been decided" is like a petulant parent who doesn't have an answer to a perfectly good question from their child. So again, how is it not a good idea to check that the people still want to do this thing that is going to affect the future of every British citizen and all of their descendants from now until the end of time? You know, this thing that is most definitely not "the world cup".

-1 ( +3 / -4 )

So what would happen in the result of a marginal victory for remain?

-3 ( +0 / -3 )

Who’s bottling it? I imagine these people were pro-EU from the start.

Most probably were, not all though. Have read plenty of 'i voted to leave but i would now vote remain', 'I didn't know' etc comments. Don't think brexiteers are 'that' determined tbh (pollies sure arent).

Denying leavers their win would have meant chaos/revolt in many/most other euro countries. If you really want something you gotta fight for it sometimes (it's been 3 years ffs!). Too 'phlegmatic' imo.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

So what would happen in the result of a marginal victory for remain?

The same thing as if it were a marginal victory for leave.

You follow the will of the people.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

@goldorak

Have read plenty of 'i voted to leave but i would now vote remain', 'I didn't know' etc comments. Don't think brexiteers are 'that' determined tbh (pollies sure arent).

There are a lot of remain voters pretending to be leave voters.

@strangerland

The same thing as if it were a marginal victory for leave.

You follow the will of the people.

The thing is, we were told this by remainers in 2016. What makes you think that if leave won again with a result of under 60% that remainers wouldn't demand a third vote?

The problem is that you are not going to get a result with a super majority.

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

The thing is, we were told this by remainers in 2016. What makes you think that if leave won again with a result of under 60% that remainers wouldn't demand a third vote?

The problem is that you are not going to get a result with a super majority.

Who cares about a super majority at this point. You are talking about the entire future of every single citizen of your nation.

Why are you so afraid to find out what the people want? And why won't you answer the question of how reconfirming that this is what the people still want, is not a good idea?

How is it not a good idea?

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

It is not a good idea for the following reasons:

You won't get the result you want and people will demand another.

It will disenfranchise millions of people who voted for the first time in their lives in 2016.

It will destroy trust in the democratic process.

It will lead to civil unrest.

People on both sides will be at each others throats during the campaign.

It will deepen divisions which may spill over into violence.

The UK will not survive another referendum.

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

@goldorak

So, those who have changed their minds on a political issue ‘bottled it’? I’ve bottled it loads of times if that’s the case. I thought I was getting more information and being persuaded by better minds than my own, but in fact I was just being a coward?

I get the sense part of you is enjoying this circus but there are jobs at stake here.

Let’s keep the nasty digs for the footy, eh?

3 ( +3 / -0 )

I sincerely believe the UK and a number of other members states should consider whether the direction the EU is moving in politically, economically, and democratically is in their national interests to continue membership.

The direction the European Council is heading towards is the very definition of a federal body without any mandate to govern, or the will of its citizens.

The UK electorate, the people took a decision at the ballot box, I contend a brave decision to leave the EU, not Europe, leave a political body that cannot in all honesty provide continuing political or economic stability for all 28 member states equally.

Spilt between north and south both politically and economically, the refusal of the northern states to enter genuinely onto momentary,banking and fiscal union, only aggravates the accusation that it not a Union of equals.

European Council

https://europa.eu/european-union/about-eu/institutions-bodies/european-council_en

2 ( +2 / -0 )

I get the sense part of you is enjoying this circus but there are jobs at stake here. Let’s keep the nasty digs for the footy, eh?

fair enough. (bottling it was a wind-up, obviously. i knew you guys would like it ;).

It's not that i am 'enjoying it' tbh; just that, as i said earlier, am tired of reading/hearing ppl blame it (the brexit fiasco) on others, esp euros.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Tomorrow in the House of Commons, MPs that never ever countenanced respecting any referendum that would end UK forty year EU membership, will take control of the process and could well consign Britain's departure from the EU to history.

These arrogant parliamentarians will congratulate themselves and wallow in self righteous satisfaction in their conceited self important I know best, we thaught them a lesson philosophy.

It is impossible to gauge the motivation or mentality of the population that voted leave, whether cretinous imbecile, uniformed dullard, loony tunes bonkers, barely able to hold a pencil correctly.

However the voter that chose to remain, especially the metropolitan hardcore elitist insist that every last one of the 17.4 million leave voters fit perfectly into a category of blockhead or simpleton.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

You won't get the result you want

I have no direct horse in the race. I don't "want" any result. I think the people should have their say again.

and people will demand another.

Some people will. But that's too bad.

It will disenfranchise millions of people who voted for the first time in their lives in 2016.

Boohoo. Better to disillusion a few people, than to make a mistake.

It will destroy trust in the democratic process.

Why would it do that? It's a further extension of the democratic process.

It will lead to civil unrest.

There is already civil unrest.

People on both sides will be at each others throats during the campaign.

People on both sides are already at each others throats.

It will deepen divisions which may spill over into violence.

No referendum may lead to the same.

The UK will not survive another referendum.

The UK may not survive NOT having another referendum.

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

Better to disillusion a few people, than to make a mistake.

And that arrogant attitude there is why leave won.

-3 ( +0 / -3 )

And that arrogant attitude there is why leave won.

Maybe. And maybe leaving is the right thing to do. What isn't the right thing to do is say 'we already decided', when it's the future of the entire nation forever in the balance.

Better to confirm that this is actually what the people want. If they want it, then you have nothing to lose. If they don't want it, it means you're pushing something that your people have changed their mind on - which makes no logical sense.

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

What isn't the right thing to do is say 'we already decided', when it's the future of the entire nation forever in the balance.

Democracy isn't 'best out of three'.

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

@strangerland, what kind of ‘logic’ are you operating under? The vote was taken. You want to confirm it? And how about in another two years - another confirmation? And again after that ad nauseum? Bizarre.

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

@strangerland, what kind of ‘logic’ are you operating under? The vote was taken. You want to confirm it?

Of course. Two years ago, people voted based on what they thought Brexit may mean. Two years later, they have two years worth of information on what it will mean.

Do you think people won't change their mind? Are they not allowed to change their mind? This whole silly idea that there need to be more votes after that is just trying to make up some sort of reason why not to have the vote. It doesn't actually hold any validity. Two years ago the people said they want to leave. Considering it is the entire future of your country, how can it be anything other than responsible to confirm that people still want to do that?

There is nothing baffling about what I'm saying. There are simply a group of people that are scared that the rest of the people may have realized this was a bad move. If they weren't scared of that, they would welcome the referendum to prove that the people still do want to do this.

The idea that it should be done without doing a final check of how people feel right before doing it is only responsible. The idea that it shouldn't be done is nothing less than childish.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

“A final check.” Yeah, and another one after that if it doesnt go your way eh? Ludicrous.

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

“A final check.” Yeah, and another one after that if it doesnt go your way eh? Ludicrous.

Who is talking about a third vote?

1 ( +1 / -0 )

“A final check.” Yeah, and another one after that if it doesnt go your way eh?

No, one is enough. And I don't have 'a way'. I'm an outsider.

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

Having another referendum is the logical thing to do before making a move that affects every UK citizen from now until the end of time. Not having another referendum does not make sense on a logical level.

I’d go for a vote on what kind of Brexit should be pursued, but not respecting the outcome of a referendum is a very dangerous precedent. I just can’t accept that the result can be thrown out.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Referendums are not legally binding.

True, but the referendum was framed in a way that it was assumed that the government would carry out the wishes of the electorate.

Btw, great to see you back. Hope your heart is standing up to the title chase.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

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