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Bush, Democrats bicker over soaring energy prices

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This weasel had 6 years and the republican controlled congress and passed through everything that he could. he ran out of time screwing the American people to get through some meaningful energy package.

He didn't submit one till after the democrats took over. 6 long years.

And dick cheney's energy package suggestions are locked up and nobody is the wiser, except for the collaspe of Enron.

But when all else fails, blame the democrats. < :-)

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They are all avoiding the real cause; the falling American dollar.

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In blaming the Democrats Bush is speaking truth to power. I mean, when the Dems are in power they are really effective, right? But when they are out of power is when the extent of their power becomes known and the weakness of the GOP is revealed. Has the GOP ever owned up to an error of judgment, policy or sleeping partner? Perhaps once or twice, but overwhelmingly they acknowledge their vassal state by admitting their powerlessness and blame the all powerful Democrats.

It must be hard for the Republicans to always feel so inferior. Of course they would not feel this way if it weren't for ... you guessed it ... those Democrats.

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He didn't submit one till after the democrats took over. 6 long years.

Well daydream, gas prices really weren't a big issue from 2000-2006, and with low oil prices it's not economically viable to start new drilling.

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I've heard that a lot of the current contracts are in ares that are difficult/expensive to explore...? Areas that are out in the ocean, for example. The new drilling areas would be easier to access. Has anyone else heard that?

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Superlib, haven't heard that, but doesn't matter really. I am assuming that this latest push by Bush is to further dismantle any regulator obstacles. The current argument being proffered is merely a straw man in order to advance a neocon policy that is anti-anything not in keeping with its political objectives.

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Do you even know what a Neocon is?

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What's the issue here? High gas prices? Are you kidding me? The people in the richest nation of the world paying half as much for gasoline as people in other developed countries? If only North Americans would pay fair prices for their energy (and I don't doubt others have said this before), only then this country could be a leader in conservation and protection of the environment. The leader Bush wants it to be. Didn't he mention new technology too? Well, he and his nation still have a long way to go. Which isn't a big surprise for a young nation where the land could be pillaged for so long.

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Here's a link that shows why Europe's gas prices are so high. Their taxes are so much more on every gallon. So their gasoline isn't anymore expensive.

http://www.petrolprices.com/fuel-tax.html < :-)

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Gas which is inexpensive at the pump doesn't help a lot with conservation and environment consciousness.

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Superlib, is that a trick question?

Neocon are persons who takes no responsibility for their actions by blaming others. This is justified under the I'm-right-you're-wrong-end-of-discussion type of mentality (not unlike their leftist counterparts). Ideology trumps the rule of law to which they give obligatory lip service. As to the rule of law itself they seek to change it to reflect their ideological ends. As for the legal infrastructure they seek to undermine it and "drown it in a bathtub" (or something pleasant like that - see Steve Hadley). They will starts wars under false pretexts. And finally, they prefer to rule in secret so that they can escape oversight (because they are always right).

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"GEorge Bush dont care about gas prices"

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The people in the richest nation of the world paying half as much for gasoline as people in other developed countries?

You're comparing apples to oranges. American wasn't a country built hundreds of years ago before cars where cities have a very high densities. A city like LA was developed in the 40s, 50s, and 60s, right when cars were becoming common and before people knew of the dangers of CO2. You can't just drop a few trillion dollars, dig up the entire city of Los Angeles, triple the density, and add rail everywhere. They do have some rail but the problem is that people are so spread out that you can't reach enough people to really make it work. Because of that the automobile is a requirement for a lot of newer cities (newer compared to the age of a lot of European cities), and you can't just quadruple the cost overnight of all transportation just to make the Europeans happy.

A lot of the older, larger cities like New York and Chicago have excellent public transportation that is often used. You don't need a car and many people don't have them and don't want them. Cities that are confined to smaller areas like San Francisco also have excellent public transportation. But I've lived in LA, New Orleans, and Tucson (Arizona) and you simply cannot operate without a car since it's impossible with the population so spread out.

You also have issues where it takes over 5 hours to fly from New York to LA. A comparable trip would be from London to Athens. Do you guys often take the train for that kind of trip? I'm guessing you don't. We can't hop on the train and go from border to border in a few hours like you can do in many European nations. This not only impacts personal travel but all manufacturing in the US where they have to deliver products to customers over thousands of miles.

Can the US do more? Yep. But I grow tired of Europeans saying that gas prices should be the same in the US as in Europe as if we all have the exact same population densities and size. Quite often it's a question of logistics and not Americans being lazy and wasteful as some Europeans quickly point out because, dare I say, you are too lazy to learn what the real hurdles are. We aren't the same so stop telling me the prices should be the same.

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New York and Chicago have excellent public transportation that is often used.

New York's public transportation is disgusting, I've never seen Chicago's, so I can't say, but your right on the LA thing, the problem with urban sprawl, same thing happened in Houston.

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We aren't the same so stop telling me the prices should be the same.

I like the way you say "We". And you are right about not being the same. You may want to use the phrase more often when posting on international issues where the US differ from the rest of the world. Anyway, yes, the US of A so far have not developed an effective high speed railroad system like Europe and Japan, so keeping fuel prices for transport low is understandable. But should the policy of these low prices be applied to wasteful home heating/cooling and industrial use as well? I suppose you will say 'Yes', because that's good for the economy. (Uhh, who said that before?). I can see where "we" are "not the same".

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Simple supply and demand scenario. The US has enough natural resources to supply a huge amount of it's energy consumption and the only people blocking this are the environmental whackos & liberals. It's total hypocracy for the libs to be screaming for current producers to increase production to lower prices when for more than 30 years they have blocked production & refinery capacity at home, while at the same time saying that new drilling & plant development won't do anything to reduce prices.

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This crisis is a sad reflection on how broken our political system is when all the leadership can do is engage in personal and party damage control through a lot of knee-jerk posturing. The oil industry is well represented in Congress and whenever proposals to develop alternative sources came up for discussion they had enough members of Congress in their pocket to make sure it never moved beyond the discussion stage.

In recent year alternative sources of energy were often pitched as a solution to global warming which itself became deeply politicized. If you didn't believe in it, well there was no need to make such adjustments.

The American people also have to take responsibility. Democracy requires citizen participation yet few seem to care what goes on in Washington until they get hit in the pocketbook.

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presto,

But should the policy of these low prices be applied to wasteful home heating/cooling and industrial use as well? I suppose you will say 'Yes', because that's good for the economy. (Uhh, who said that before?). I can see where "we" are "not the same".

Superlib did a great job in bringing some factors that you haven't about and I would also to add to his post because it relates directly to heating/ cooling.

Europe is roughly the size of the United States. Some European countries do well in energy effiency some due poorly, mainly eastern Europe stuck with large stste run factories from the Soviet days. Also you haven't thought about the most important factor.......Weather. Much of Europe has been blessed with mild summers without the need for air conditioning. The States aren't so fortunate. I though you and superlib would find this interesting as I did a little more in-depth research on the subject.

Since Europe is as diverse in individual countries that make up the E.U. I decided to compare not United States as a whole but the individual states energy intensity rankings to see where they would fall.

The results were pretty suprising.

The number one nation that uses energy most efficiently is Japan at 4,519 BTUs per capita, next is Denmark at 4,845 BTUs followed by Switzerland at 4,901 BTU's.

What is rather suprizing is if you rate California as a seperate nation not part of the United States she would rank second in the world at 4,840 BTUs just edging out Denmark. California benefits from having a mild year round climate and an industrial base reliant on high tech industry not heavy iron belt industries. My sources of information below, I like to use non-partisan sites.

http://www.forbes.com/2008/07/03/energy-efficiency-japan-biz-energy_cx_jz_0707efficiency_countries.html

http://ecoworld.com/blog/2008/06/22/energy-intensity/

Can the U.S do better as a whole, of course, but it's going to take an approach that is tailored to each region of the country to get better all around not the country as a whole. The South couldn't survive without air-conditioning nor could the midwest who has the double whammy of cold winters and humid summers.

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The trend in American life since the 1950s has been surbanization. I grew up in an older city with excellent public transportation. My parents have only ever had one car (at a time) since my Dad took a commuter train to work every day. Those who bought homes on the other side of the city line, less than five miles away, lived a very different lifestyle although their level of wealth was probably comparable to ours.

Anyone knowledgeable about post-WW II residential development will be familiar with "Levittown" which is evident around any city, new or old. Communities were developed with the idea adult members of the family had their own wheels which they needed to go anywhere. This was the "American Dream" lifestyle to which everyone was supposed to aspire particularly as deindustrialization created large unemployed minority communities in most older cities.

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Thank you, sailwind, for your informative response. I am sorry I was not clear on some points. You are of course correct that as large and wide a country as the US needs different approaches for different regions how energy is used. Superlib has already mentioned differences exist on either side of the oceans. My point is that cheap fuel encourages wasteful habits. To be fair I reflect on gasoline prices. In the early 70s we paid about 50 yen for a liter of gasoline here in Japan. Americans probably less than a dollar for a gallon. Now users in both countries pay 4 times that much. So the rate of increase is approximately the same. And the difference remains!

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"Americans are fed up every time they go to fill up"

Quit filling up, then! Take the bus, ( yeah, I know they use fuel, but many people can ride one bus ) ride a bike, walk. Just for awhile, until the oil companies drop the price of gas, and they will if they're twiddling their thumbs all day waiting for customers.

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until the oil companies drop the price of gas

The margin of profit being made by oil companies isn't really any greater than that of companies in other industries. The high prices are not a result of the world's oil companies conspiring to bankrupt us.

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The margin of profit being made by oil companies isn't really any greater than that of companies in other industries. The high prices are not a result of the world's oil companies conspiring to bankrupt us.

One reason for the steady rise in price is that oil "wholesalers" no longer hedge their bets on the future price being lower than today's by offering buyers the option of locking in the current price for a multiple year period. There's been no need since demand has consistently increased.

Can the U.S do better as a whole, of course, but it's going to take an approach that is tailored to each region of the country to get better all around not the country as a whole.

This is the reason Arnold Schwarzenegger has blasted the GWB administration (see other thread). His proposals, which have bipartisan constituent backing, to raise emissions levels higher than federal standards, and that's just one example, have been shot down by Washington which prefers a "one size fits all" model.

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this blame game is more proof that the two party system the US has run on for so long shouldn't be the norm. We need more than two parties, so politicians can see what they feel is right and move on it instead of playing political games.

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We need more than two parties

But that could make winning a majority even harder as well as requiring a complete restructuring of the gov't and election system.

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