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Christians and Muslims clash in Cairo, 1 dead

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Oh dear, this is a bad sign.

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This is terrible. I hope they are all safe.

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You will soon see the muslims haters coming with their posts full of hatred and stereotypes.This incident shouldn't make the images of christians protecting muslims while they were praying during the unrest.Hope the situation will improve for both side.

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" Coptic Christians held protests in several locations in Cairo against perceived persecution by the country’s Muslim majority. "

Why "perceived"? The discrimination against the Copts by the Egypt´s muslim majority is well-documented, and increasing. There is nothing "perceived" about it.

And this is only going to get worse, once the Muslim Brotherhood takes its seat in the post-Mubarak government.

Why is the Western press so blind about it?

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afroengineer:

" This incident shouldn't make the images of christians protecting muslims while they were praying "

What were they supposed to do? Copts are only 5% of the population, and under permanent threat. Of course they have to put on a good face on the inevitable.

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This is just the second omen of Egypt bending to muslim brotherhood. The first one was the iranian navy by passing the Suez canal!

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You will soon see the muslims haters coming with their posts full of hatred and stereotypes.

Yep, you were correct.

Why "perceived"? ... There is nothing "perceived" about it.

There are certain people who's MO is to carry out false flags to spark sectarian fighting. Unfortunately, some of the more naive members of these groups fall for this well documented protocol. I hope this incident problem can be fixed soon, before it gets out of control and wrecks their best chance at freedom and democracy.

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There are certain people who's MO is to carry out false flags to spark sectarian fighting.

No, you are incorrect. The protests by the Coptics are not false flags. They are a truthful and angry reaction to a true burning of a church by a true mob of Muslims. Paranoia cannot change this.

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You will soon see the muslims haters coming with their posts full of hatred and stereotypes.

Still waiting and I haven't seen one yet.

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WilliB: And this is only going to get worse, once the Muslim Brotherhood takes its seat in the post-Mubarak government.

Agree with you here. Fundamentalism is wrong.

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I think JT has the solution for all world problems

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This is a disappointment. The "Egypt-for-All" organization had been working to bring together Copts and Muslims. Many Muslims went so far as to offer themselves as human shields around Coptic churches during the celebration of Coptic Christmas in January. This was done as a sign of solidarity with the Copts after an attack on New Year's Eve on a church in Alexandria. Sad and worrying.

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Christians in Egypt are very well educated and quite powerful in Egypt, Orascom is a well known zaibatsu conglomerate run by Christians there (search Orascom wiki and other sources has documented the sawiris family, one of the sons being the 60th richest man on Forbes). Orascom has various companies, telco company that has cell phone companies around Asia, EU, US, Canada, Korea, real estate, construction, also within those regions. Of course in regards to the majority, they do fear Christians, Jewish and other minorities, considering that they control most of the economy and stock market in Egypt, so if the majority feels threatened at times they resort intimidate them and try to control them in other ways, as what has happened with the church incident.

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It is quite sad, though thankfully, muslims in Egypt arent radicals and are quite modern, they arent like those in Iran and other Shiat muslim majorities who have radical views and warped ideals (but again, I can not stereotype, as there is the good and bad there too). In general, no country should have religion and state as one.. religion should never be involved in economic affairs either. It is good to note, that Egypt is 'democratic' in a sense and does not have sharia law, the muslim brotherhood will NEVER win as there will be more uprising in riots etc. The Riots in general started due to the demands to increase minimal wage, fight corruption, more human rights etc. Internet etc is not censored and is not like the great firewall of China. I know as I have used the internet there and no content was blocked, youtube, facebook etc was all openly available. In closing, I think before just reading the biased propaganda the media feeds the world, its good to research the news in more detail.. as what I have myself done. Egypt's economy has also had strong reforms, a booming IT (look up Smart Village Egypt), Engineering and manufacturing sector, they don't have much oil.. and don't rely on commodities.. their GDP levels for last year stood at 5-7% which is great for any developing emerging markets. India stood at 7-8%, China stood at 7-9%

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Excuse any typos or errors desu

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"last week's burning by a Muslim mob of a church in a Cairo suburb"

Wow, some Christians must have done something real bad to deserve that.

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So far the people of Egypt have been winning this revolution, but if they cannot get all the factions together and unite the powers still in Gov and behind it will win and enforce a tyranny thru chaos.

=the burned church should be built immediately as a show of union.

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You will soon see the muslims haters coming with their posts full of hatred and stereotypes

It's all so sad. The poor Mohammedans. People criticize them and tend to lump them into one monolithic group even though Mohammedans killing Christians in Pakistan are different "racially" than the ones killing xtians in America, or in Lebanon, or in Palestine, or in Nigeria, or in the Phillipines...

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This could be an opportunity for the two sides to rebuild the church together. Maybe they need a law in Egypt that says every new church and mosque must be built with 50% Muslim-manufactured bricks and 50% Christian-made bricks. There is no God but God, after all.

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New Cairo and New Egypt will progress,no worries. Only 1 Casualty,no big deal here.

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New Cairo and New Egypt will progress,no worries. Only 1 Casualty,no big deal here.

If you get your news from JapanToday you might be tempted to think that. But there yesterday was the first large march in Cairo's Tahir Square for women's rights, and it was basically shut down by thousands of frothing angry Egyptian males - and I am not talking about Coptics here...

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But there yesterday was the first large march in Cairo's Tahir Square for women's rights, and it was basically shut down by thousands of frothing angry Egyptian males

It's lead on today's csmonitor.com, pretty petty!

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I seem to recall quite a clamor from the multicultural Left when Mohammedans wanted a mosque at Ground Zero. Why do the same ppl not rush here to demand Mohammedans rebuild, as an act of good faith, the Coptic Church destroyed by yet another tiny handful of violent extremists who in no way represent the religion as a whole????

Oh, and will the champions of a "right of return" come here to point out that, you know, the Copts were there first???

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So far the people of Egypt have been winning this revolution, but if they cannot get all the factions together and unite the powers still in Gov and behind it will win and enforce a tyranny thru chaos.

Exactly, some will do whatever it takes to get the different groups fighting. Its a damn shame.

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solidaritea:

" I seem to recall quite a clamor from the multicultural Left when Mohammedans wanted a mosque at Ground Zero. Why do the same ppl not rush here to demand Mohammedans rebuild, as an act of good faith, the Coptic Church destroyed by yet another tiny handful of violent extremists who in no way represent the religion as a whole???? "

Won´t happen. Under islamic laws, tolerated "dhimmis" can worship in existing churches, but are not allowed to build new, or re-build. So every time the muslim crowds destroy one church, that is one less.

How do you think the Copts shrank down to 5% in Egypt?

And this will only get worse under the muslim brotherhood.

Ah, the glorious "democracy"...

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Wow, some Christians must have done something real bad to deserve that.

Yep, to the Muslims, there is no greater crime, then being Christian. That is about as bad as it gets.

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Yep, to the Muslims, there is no greater crime, then being Christian. That is about as bad as it gets.

Ergh, expect for maybe being a Jew but to some Christians there is no greater crime then being a Jew. Humans using human constructs to kill each other, a beatiful world we do live in.

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Would it not be funny if say, all the Christian majority countries of the world said, hmm, you kill innocent Christians in Egypt, we BOYCOTT your country, pyramids etc..see how long it would take the Egyptian army to start really protecting its minority Christians then!

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Exactly, some will do whatever it takes to get the different groups fighting. Its a damn shame.

What is a damn shame is you trying to make this story into something it is not.

The protesters want more steps to improve the status of Christians in Egypt. These Christians are demanding that they are given equal rights and better quality of life. This has absolutely nothing to do with false flags or people trying to get them to fight. It has to do with a minority being discriminated against and being sick of it and that minority being attacked by members of the majority religion in Egypt. The Christians live there and know what they are talking about, were that we could say the same for you.

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@atamant, they are here now! ;)

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Yep, to the Muslims, there is no greater crime, then being Christian. That is about as bad as it gets.

That is about as bad a BS statement as it gets; Christians and Muslims get along fine. You can always find a few morons in any religion who can be convinced to do anything.

Exactly, some will do whatever it takes to get the different groups fighting. Its a damn shame.

What is a damn shame is you trying to make this story into something it is not.

I am mainly referring to the lead up to the current tension, including the blowing up of the church a few months ago; interesting to hear what the church leaders had to say about that.

Anyway, the US has essentially controlled Egypt for decades. I am sure they will not just stand by and say "oh gosh darn, nothing we can now, the people are now free". They will do everything they can to sabotage this revolution and retain control.

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That is about as bad a BS statement as it gets; Christians and Muslims get along fine. You can always find a few morons in any religion who can be convinced to do anything.

Please learn to read. The protesters are protesting institutional discrimination on the part of the Muslim majority. You cannot escape this fact with threadbare conjecture.

I am mainly referring to the lead up to the current tension,

See above. This is about general discrimination and mistreatment of the Christian minority in Egypt.

They will do everything they can to sabotage this revolution and retain control.

Speaking of BS. Obama himself asked Mubarak to step down. BTW, the military, which is still very much in control and will be for the foreseeable future and has the support and respect of the very people who made the revolution you speak of take place very much wants a friendly relationship to continue with the US. Consider yourself corrected again.

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atamant, if there is anyone who needs to "learn to read", its you. The comment was "Yep, to the Muslims, there is no greater crime, then being Christian." Molenir was referring to "the Muslims", and it was a typical anti-Muslim comment which I am amazed is still permitted on this forum.

When I criticize someone who happens to be Jewish, you and your other IDs throw your usual accusations of my being anti-Jewish (you call it anti-semitism). So while "anti-semitism" seems to be the worst possible crime, anti-Muslimism is just fine on this forum, and you defend it.

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I am talking about the reality in the article and you are talking about people's comments. YOu wrote that Christians and Muslims are getting along fine in Egypt and the article plainly shows they are not and that Christians in Egypt are protesting about it. You were incorrect in your assessment of the situation. We are not talking about 'the Muslims', we are talking about the complaints of the Christian minority about the Muslim majority. Again, consider yourself corrected.

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you and your other IDs

Ha, ha! I am the world! I am JT! You have an overactive imagination.

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When the Egyptian protesters attacked the state’s internal security headquarters, they rescued lots of documents that were about to be destroyed. They document many of the Mubarak-era crimes, and they confirm government involvement in the New Years Eve attack on the Coptic Church in Alexandria. Hmmm, why would they want to do that, could it be to give the military an excuse to crack down on the population?

Hopefully these revelations will help the people focus on the real culprits and ease tensions between the different groups.

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Where did you read that the government is confirmed to have been involved in the bombing of the church?

Hopefully these revelations will help the people focus on the real culprits and ease tensions between the different groups.

The tensions have been brewing for a long time and as mentioned not only by me, but also by many reports the tensions arise from the discrimination the Christians have been victims of. The 'culprits' are the people who have allowed this discrimination to continue. Do you disagree with the Christian protesters that they are the victims of institutional and societal discrimination? Maybe you ought to have a talk with them instead of claiming there are no problems.

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The article writer tries to create a false equivalency here, but there isn´t. The Copts are a small minority in Egypt today, and have been been the victims of muslim violence for a long time, while the Western press is silent about it. Only when the Copts react and protest, then suddenly it is reported as "clashes between", as if there were 2 equal sides.

Note that once again in this story, a coptic church is in smoldering ruins, one copt is dead, and many are injured. NOTHING like this on the other side. And yet the writer sees this as a balanced event. Shame.

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That is about as bad a BS statement as it gets; Christians and Muslims get along fine. You can always find a few morons in any religion who can be convinced to do anything.

So Sabi, what you are saying, is that any Muslim that discriminates against, or commits an act of violence against a Christian, because he is Christian, is then a moron? So much of Egypt with its institutional discrimination, Pakistan where Christians have next to no rights, and most of the middle east is basically filled with nothing but morons. Again, going by what you've said. Where Muslims are a minority, I'd actually agree with your statement, at least in general. I except places like France and the Netherlands that have huge problems with Muslims. I also exclude generally Indonesia, one of the largest concentrations of Muslims in the world. Despite its religious police, they are actually pretty tolerant of Christians in general. However in just about every other single Muslim majority country, they despise Christians. Its institutional and endemic. Trying to deny it does no change this reality.

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sabi: Christians and Muslims get along fine.

Once again, sabi makes statements like these actually believing he might convince someone of it. Let's see, Muslims attacking and murdering Christians in Egypt, Pakistan, Sudan, Ethiopia, Philippines, Nigeria,... not to mention firebombing churches and throwing acid on Christian schoolgirls. And that's just against the Christians.

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