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Death toll hits 50 as Israel pounds Gaza

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Too bad these Palestinians can't overthrow their Hamas mis-leaders and put a stop to all this.

-4 ( +8 / -12 )

**** Israel!

2 ( +2 / -0 )

'Too bad these Palestinians can't overthrow their Hamas mis-leaders and put a stop to all this.'

Seventeen women and children killed in an Israeli operation in one day. It's truly shocking that it's possible for some not to even use the word 'Israel' in a comment.

2 ( +8 / -6 )

For the Israeli zealots who are begging for an excuse to grab more territory, Hamas is an answer to their prayers.

It's a shame the Palestinians don't have leaders who can see through the game that's being played on them.

-4 ( +7 / -11 )

Since Tuesday, more than 170 rockets struck Israel,

Kind of tossed there at the end as an afterthought.

The Palestinians need to root out the radicals and disarm. If they did that then the world would put enough pressure on Israel to break them in half. Firing endless rockets give Israel a lot of wiggle room in their responses.

2 ( +8 / -6 )

well when it says in the Hamas charter that it's primary purpose is to exterminate the Jews and drive them into the sea.....yeah....peace is kinda a joke

1 ( +9 / -8 )

Both sides are guilty here. Both sides need to make concessions. Both sides can make it work if only they try.

Otherwise more of the same since Israel's inception nearly 70 years ago. We bomb you, we bomb you back!

-1 ( +4 / -5 )

well when it says in the Hamas charter that it's primary purpose is to exterminate the Jews

No, it does not say anything about "exterminating" the Jews, or driving them into the sea. Yes, it wants to see the state of Israel abolished and the religion of Islam primary in Palestine. (They claim that other religions can live side by side with Muslims. One can be skeptical of that claim, but it's vastly different than claiming their charter states a goal of exterminating Jews.)

By the same token Jewish religious zealots are equally dedicated to removing non-Jews from all lands they consider to be historically part of Israel. If you ask what that entails, some will tell you it runs all the way to the Euphrates River.

-4 ( +6 / -10 )

Here we go. Israel finally responds after months of rocket attacks on Israel by Hamas, lately reaching as far as Tel Aviv. And the Western press, which was busy looking the other way, now suddenly wakes up and reports on Israels "attack", the context of which they never reported. And of course they feed us the Hamas version of events, which is unsurprisingly loaded with civilian victims but hardle mentions any Hamas terrorists. Why am I not surprised.

0 ( +10 / -10 )

Both sides are guilty here. Both sides need to make concessions. Both sides can make it work if only they try.

When Hamas stops terrorizing Israel there will be peace. Until then expect the Israeli's to defend themselves. It's as if the Left wants Israel to disarm and allow themselves to be slaughtered. It's all in the hands of Hamas's, Iran, and the Palestinian people.

-3 ( +7 / -10 )

@Wolfpack

How about Israel stops stealing Palestinian land and putting "settlers" (thieves) there?

That would be a great start....

2 ( +10 / -8 )

Once again, libs think that Israel should never protect itself, as if the Palestinians in Gaza would ever want peace, but like the way some libs here on JT think, it kinda mirrors how Obama thinks, Israel do nothing and in a short time, they would be overwhelmed. It's very simple, the Palestinians should lay down their arms, renounce violence and leave the Israelis in peace, if not and they want to use violence and terror, they have the right to use any method necessary to neutralize the threat.

-6 ( +5 / -11 )

@bass

I'm a liberal (as I'm sure you're aware!) but I'd always recognise Israel's right to self-defence.

What's indefensible, though, is the ceaseless expansion into Palestinian territory. If Israel would tear down her "settlements" and retreat behind her original, agreed borders then no fair-minded person could have a complaint.

4 ( +9 / -5 )

@Mark

Exactly! Very well put.

-1 ( +3 / -4 )

"A man who saves a life, save the entire human race"... or it went something along that line, the old Jewish adage

The contrary can be said that is true also....

So much for the "peace loving" and "we know what is to suffer" people... play the victim and pull the trigger.. good.. just like their god and religion tell them to do, I suppose.

-1 ( +3 / -4 )

'Once again, libs think that Israel should never protect itself, as if the Palestinians in Gaza would ever want peace, but like the way some libs here on JT think, it kinda mirrors how Obama thinks, Israel do nothing and in a short time, they would be overwhelmed. It's very simple, the Palestinians should lay down their arms, renounce violence and leave the Israelis in peace, if not and they want to use violence and terror, they have the right to use any method necessary to neutralize the threat.'

I don't think anyone here is defending the tactics of rocket attacks by vicious crackpots nor is anyone saying that Israel shouldn't defend itself ( although anyone with a shred of morality or perspective would call retaliation in the form of the slaughter of innocents excessive to say the least ). Can you just agree with the simple statement that Israel needs to stop stealing land which doesn't belong to it? It isn't your bogeymen 'libs' who are taking a one-dimensional view of this problem from what I can read here.

-1 ( +5 / -6 )

@luca

With the exception the Israeli settlement expansion, I would tend to agree. I also don't agree tit for tat, but I will always agree that Israel has the right to DEFEND itself.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

I suppose some people here will say that they deserved the missiles form Israel.. because they are clearly Hamas members, right????

WAKE UPPP!!!!! Israel is not the victim here!

https://scontent-b-lhr.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpa1/t1.0-9/923425_888191947864960_1918169521572421592_n.jpg

https://scontent-a-lhr.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xap1/t1.0-9/s851x315/10456822_888193617864793_6076260574979766931_n.jpg

-1 ( +4 / -5 )

Daniel Neagari:

Actually, Israel is the victim here, much as the large parts of the media tries to portray otherwise. Israel is RESPONDING after months of Hamas terrorism.They did not start bombing Gazah out of the blue. And unlike Hamas, they try target Hamas military operatives and to avoid civilians.

Yabits: I have not heard the claims from Jewish extremists that you quote, but note that they don´t run the country, unlike Hamas. And Hamas objectives are clearly stated in their charter: Destroy the state of Israel, and impose Shariah on all the inhabitants of the area. Great neighourly attitude that.

0 ( +4 / -4 )

Israel has fantastic leadership potential in the region, once it learns proportionality:

Fatalities during Operation Cast Lead (27 December 2008 - 18 January 2009):

Palestinians killed by Israeli security forces 1,398;

Israeli civilians killed by Palestinians 0;

Israeli security force personnel killed by Palestinians 5.

Fatalities since Operation Cast Lead (19 January 2009 - 31 May 2014):

Palestinians killed by Israeli security forces 565;

Palestinians killed by Israeli civilians 6;

Israeli civilians killed by Palestinians 18;

Israeli security force personnel killed by Palestinians 7.

<http://www.btselem.org/statistics/fatalities/after-cast-lead/by-date-of-event >

-2 ( +3 / -5 )

17 women and children eh?

Yep, that's Israel. Back to top form.

1 ( +6 / -5 )

@SenseNotSoCommon

So it is just a numbers game? As long as the numbers killed on both sides are about even then that makes it better?

But of course you have to factor in that most Israelis try and protect themselves from missles while many Palestinians intentionally put themselves in harms way. And Israel tries to put its military installations away from civilian areas while Palestinians intentionally put their military equipment among civilians. And usually Israel warns Palestinian civilians before attacks and tries to just attack military targets, while Palestinians never warn Israelis before attacks and fire essentially unguided missles and mortars not caring whether they hit a military or civilian target.

-3 ( +3 / -6 )

I have not heard the claims from Jewish extremists that you quote, but note that they don´t run the country,

Their numbers are growing, and each one has a vote to nullify any Israeli leader they think will push too much to accommodate the Palestinian position. Just ask Yitzhak Rabin -- well, if you could.

unlike Hamas.

Hamas runs only Gaza, and they won't for too much longer as their support among young Palestinians in Gaza has declined to single digits.

Destroy the state of Israel, and impose Shariah on all the inhabitants of the area.

Big deal. The radical, extremist Israelis want to completely eliminate the Palestinians from all areas they consider part of the land promised to Israel. (Ever seen a map of what they think that is?) While Hamas influence is on the decline, their influence has increased. Hamas has been an answer to their prayers. And don't think the ultra-orthodox Jewish believers don't have their own form of shariah: A recent article in the New Republic cited the report of an orthodox Jewish woman who was pelted with rocks because her dress didn't meet the strict code of those religious zealots.

1 ( +4 / -3 )

Just following on from yabits' very relevant point, many people don't pay enough attention to the fact that there are nutters from all three monotheisms making peace in this area impossible. The radical Islamists, Jewish extremist settlers with fantasies of bringing about the coming of their messiah ( these people hold real sway in Israeli elections given how fractious politics is in that country and are often supported by nutters in the US and elsewhere ) and Christian fundamentalists in the US in particular influencing government policy. I recommend a reading of Kevin Phillips's 'American Theocracy' written by a man who was himself a Republican strategist to see just how far beliefs in the imminent 'second coming' have influenced the perspective of presidents such as Reagan and Bush in particular. Reagan was lending his ear to luminaries like Jerry Falwell on the Middle East. I wouldn't defend radical Islamists for a second but to lay the blame for the problems on them alone doesn't seem to be the whole story.

1 ( +4 / -3 )

I wouldn't defend radical Islamists for a second but to lay the blame for the problems on them alone doesn't seem to be the whole story.

Many Palestinians are acting just as we would if someone was threatening our land and our homes.

But the radicals among the Jews do not consider any land to belong to non-Jews if it falls within the area that was promised to their forefathers thousands of years ago. More importantly, they continue to act upon that belief -- their faith requires them to act on it -- which is what accounts for the "illegal" settlements. Once a settlement is in place, the Israeli government is obliged to protect it. The Arabs see this for what it is: a land grab to push them out. Naturally, radicals among them want to respond in kind.

If Israel truly wanted peace, it could handle that issue very easily, starting with a declaration that it disavows the concept of a Jewish return to lands outside of internationally recognized borders. Any Jewish settlements on lands outside that will have to be returned. Israel has to get right with the law in that respect. It can't expect any concessions for a return to legal boundaries.

Note: any attempt to create a proclamation by Israel which permanently disavows any attempt to expand or recover lands promised in the Jewish bible will be met with the mother of all internal debates.

And here's the irony: many Jewish zealots also despise the modern secular state of Israel, and live for the day when it will be abolished and replaced with the theocratic regime promised by their prophets. I listen to some of these folks every Saturday.

2 ( +4 / -2 )

If Hamas stopped firing rockets into Israel then Israel would stop bombing Gaza. And if Hamas stopped using the civilian population as human shields there would not be as many civilian casualties.

-3 ( +3 / -6 )

If Hamas stopped firing rockets into Israel then Israel would stop bombing Gaza.

Israel's military would stop bombing Gaza, but extremist Jewish settlers would still continue their program of encroaching on Arab land. That has to stop, and a program put in place to return all lands illegally acquired.

-1 ( +4 / -5 )

The Israelis deserve severe degradation.

-1 ( +3 / -4 )

The U.S. supports Israel with $3 billion dollars a year, yet cities like Detroit go bankrupt since apparently Americans' tax dollars are best used elsewhere. In the meantime, land, houses, farms, etc. that belonged to Palestinians for centuries are bulldozed, confiscated and made part of Israeli territory. It's incredible how much land Israel has stolen since 1946. It doesn't seem like they're going to stop anytime soon.

http://scgnews.com/the-bombing-of-palestine-through-the-eyes-of-a-neo-con-loon

2 ( +4 / -2 )

The U.S. supports Israel with $3 billion dollars a year,

The United States has had the worst foreign policy in the region for decades. We certainly deserve a large portion of the blame for current conditions. The Arab countries in the region haven't been much better; they have used the Palestinians like pawns.

The average American is being completely duped, thinking that what is driving Israel can be understood by watching Exodus a few times.

It's incredible how much land Israel has stolen since 1946. It doesn't seem like they're going to stop anytime soon.

But you see that the ultra-orthodox Jews don't view it as land being stolen. It was promised to their forefathers several thousand years ago and they are laying claim to it as theirs. The people living there for generation upon generation have to claim to it at all. And the drive by the fanatics won't stop until Israel reclaims all land their bible says was promised to it. I advise people to do some research on just how extensive an area that is.

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

A large number of civilian casualties can probably be attributed to Hamas' firing rockets from heavily populated areas. The response to a rocket attack is usually directed at rocket launchers. Hamas is using mobile rocket launchers. When they fire rockets from mobile launchers located near civilian neighborhood, then move the launchers, the Israeli response will be seen as targeting civilians. That makes it a win-win for Hamas. They're able to launch their rockets and then blame Israel for any civilian deaths or injuries.

1 ( +3 / -2 )

lucabrasi,, The Israeli are above the law or any morality, the can do anything, the can vanish a country, can vanish a nation, can grab the land, can slaughter the women and children, can bulldoze the houses. can you imagine in the face of these heinous crime, some people support them.

60 years ago, there was a country called Palestinians, where is it now? if it happens to some other nation what a hell will comedown on earth.

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

wake up Palestenians, nobody cares for you and your dumb Hamas Egypt, Lenanon, Saudi, Jordan, and all surrounding countries have left your cause decades ago. Come to terms and accept Israel as a part of this world then maybe you can start.

Nobody's coming.

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

mikihouse

Come to terms and accept Israel as a part of this world then maybe you can start.

This isn't the issue. Israel treats the people of Gaza like dogs. It's like a big prison. They also continue to convert land they have stolen from Palestinians into permanent Israeli territory by by clearing out the Palestinians, then building Jewish housing estates and sending in the army to protect them.

Israel are a treacherous overlord.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

This isn't the issue.

Actually, it is the issue. Hamas does not believe in Israel's right to exist. They have Israel's destruction in their charter. Hamas has never been willing to negotiate for a true and lasting peace (please do not bring up the 10 year truces, as Hamas has said they would not be renewable and that they would be used to prepare for the final battle to 'liberate' all of Palestine, meaning Israel), Hamas has been against any attempts by the Palestinians to negotiate for peace with Israel.

Israel are a treacherous overlord.

Israel left Gaza a long time ago. There were to be fully negotiations after that. The use of Gaza as a base for firing rockets into Israel is one of the main reasons Israel has anything to do with Gaza now.

Over 300 rockets fired into Israel and no one makes a peep until Israel responds. That is why this will never get resolved.

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

Hamas does not believe in Israel's right to exist.

Actually, it is Israel that has never believed in the Arab Palestinian's right to exist in their own homeland. From its very inception, Israel has mounted a concerted and patient effort of ethnic cleansing. Forces within Israel have been dedicated to terrorism from the beginning. (See the King David Hotel bombing, which killed nearly 100.)

Why did a well-known Israeli general and his son devote their lives to justice for the Palestinians? Because they know the truth about Israel's instigation of war to acquire land. Yes, there are many of the Jewish faith who take it seriously, and who know right from wrong.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=etXAm-OylQQ

0 ( +2 / -2 )

@slumdog

"Israel left Gaza a long time ago."

Very decent of theme seeing it wasn't Israeli territory to begin with.

Now if they'd get out of the West Bank, East Jurusalem and the Golan Heights we might have something to cheer about.

Like that's going to happen....

0 ( +2 / -2 )

Actually, it is Israel that has never believed in the Arab Palestinian's right to exist in their own homeland.

Rabin believed in a two state solution and he died for his beliefs.

Very decent of theme seeing it wasn't Israeli territory to begin with.

So, damned if they do and damned if they don't, eh? Gaza was Egyptian territory and the Egyptians treated the Palestinians like scum and no one batted an eye over it. The fact is Israel left Gaza completely pulling out dragging settlers kicking and screaming and got rockets and terror in return for doing so.

Like that's going to happen....

It will never happen as long as Hamas fights against any decent negotiations and solutions.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

Rabin believed in a two state solution and he died for his beliefs.

Yes, at the hands of a Zionist. Think the South African apartheid system. I advise anyone to look at the link: the son of an Israeli general and former Zionist.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

@slumdog

Why on earth should anyone be interested in negotiating with an invader? The entire world (with the obvious exceptions) condemns Israel's illegal occupation.

Israel's response? Keep building, keep settling. Screw the world and screw the Palestinians.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

Yes, at the hands of a Zionist.

? Rabin was also a Zionist. Being a Zionist had nothing to do with it. The man that shot Rabin was a lunatic. You incorrectly claimed Israel has never been interested in a two state solution and you were wrong. Rabin was interested, Barak was interested. The Palestinians were not interested enough to stay on at the negotiating table.

At any rate and for your information, Hamas has never been at all interested in a two state solution. Israel has.

Why on earth should anyone be interested

in negotiating with an invader?

Sorry, you have been on record as agreeing that negotiations were the solution to this. Have you changed your mind? The Palestinians should be interested in negotiating because that is the only way they will get what they want. More than sixty years of fighting certainly has not gotten it for them.

The entire world (with the obvious exceptions) condemns Israel's illegal occupation.

The UN has already said that the deal is land for peace. To get peace, there must be negotiations.

Israel's response? Keep building, keep settling.

The settlements will be gone if Israel gives up the land, just as they are gone from Gaza and Sinai. Why is it I almost never see anyone point this out? The Palestinians have nothing to lose by giving up the rockets and going for negotiations and everything to gain. Or, they can keep on doing what they have been doing for decades and get the same situation they already have. When they got Gaza back, they could have used that and the investment foolish people like myself made to make their situation better. Instead, Hamas smuggled weapons from Egypt and shot rockets into Israel. I can't see myself ever taking a chance and investing in the Palestinians again. I might as well have thrown the money down the bog.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

60 years ago, there was a country called Palestinians, where is it now?

No there wasn't, and it would have been called Palestine if it ever existed. But such a country never existed. The area called Palestine has been a province of various countries/empires during it's history but has never been a seperate country. What you seem to be referring to is the Mandate given to the Brirtish to administer the region from 1920 until 1948.

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

But such a country never existed. The area called Palestine has been a province of various countries/empires during it's history but has never been a seperate country.

Nevertheless, there were people living on the land that encompasses the present day Israel-Palestine. They had been living there for many, many generations. At the turn of the 20th century, those people were 90% Arab and about 10% Jewish. (As for the ancient land of Israel, it was divided and apportioned among ten tribes, with Judah (Jews) having one part.)

The European Jews might claim they are descended from Israelites of thousands of years ago, but such a claim seems specious at best. Still, to claim they are entitled to land that had been owned by Arabs for many centuries is really quite something.

The hard-core Zionists in Europe never accepted any notion of living together with the Arabs, as long as there was any possibility that Arabs would be in a majority. They felt they were entitled to the entire land of historic Israel (not just the part allocated to the tribe of Judah), and the main goal was to push as many Arabs off of their lands as possible, by any means necessary. Keep in mind these were Europeans with no claim to the genetic lineage of King David of old. It's really an amazing story.

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

@lucabrasi:

How about Israel stops stealing Palestinian land and putting "settlers" (thieves) there?

If the Palestinians, Hamas, Iran, and various other terrorists organizations were not continuously attacking and killing you might have something to complain about. Until then, the Palestinians are paying the price for their deal with the devil. If the terrorism actually ended I would bet my house that the Israelis would stop putting up settlements and perhaps even give all of the land back that they lost due to their aggression (see Oslo accords that the PLO backed out of in favor of killing Jews).

2 ( +3 / -1 )

(see Oslo accords that the PLO backed out of in favor of killing Jews).

The first multiple killings after the first Oslo I process happened on February 25, 1994, with the Hebron massacre, where an Israeli killed 29 and injured 125 worshipers at the Mosque of Ibrahim.

Israel did not stop the settlement process one iota after Oslo I.

But it's all the Palestinians' fault. Right.

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

But it's all the Palestinians' fault. Right.

Finally you see the truth.

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

Yabits

But it's all the Palestinians' fault. Right.

You seem to think its all Zionism's fault.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

You seem to think its all Zionism's fault.

Not me exclusively or anywhere near most importantly. Some of the most devout members of the Jewish faith assert this .

www.nkusa.org

The Palestinians are as responsible for the Gaza Ghetto as the Jews were for the Warsaw Ghetto.

-3 ( +2 / -5 )

On Monday the Mukhtar of the Jerusalem neighborhood of Sur Baher praised Israel for defending the city from Hamas rockets. He said that Hamas, which claimed to be “defending” the Arabs of Jerusalem, was doing quite the opposite.

What Hamas is doing is not, and has never been, because of settlements in the West Bank. The sooner people in the West, claiming to support the Palestinians, realise this, and start making demands of Hamas, instead of spewing lies and hatred about Israel, the sooner the lives of ordinary Palestinians might start to improve.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

Yabits

So, then, you do think it is all Zionism's fault then.

Good to know,

2 ( +2 / -0 )

www.nkusa.org

They are a small fringesect. They do not represent the greater number devout Jews that support the State of Israel. To suggest they do is to misrepresent the situation.

The Palestinians are as responsible for the Gaza Ghetto as the Jews were for the Warsaw Ghetto.

Perhaps you could reference where the Nazis offered negotiations with the Warsaw Ghetto to be free and have their own land there living in peace with Germany? Perhaps you could find a reference that suggests that the Nazai Germany cabinet voted and Nazi Germany wanted a truce and with the residents of the Warsaw Ghetto and yet the residents of the Warsaw Ghetto rejected it? I could not find any such thing anywhere. Israel and Hamas are offered a truce, the Israeli cabinet votes to accept it and Hamas rejects it and shoots off more rockets. As such the comparison is ridiculous.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

They do not represent the greater number devout Jews that support the State of Israel. To suggest they do is to misrepresent the situation.

It is their conclusion, which they have held from the start, is that a Zionist state is a direct affront to the Torah and to G-d Himself. Naturally, this will be a minority opinion. The majority will ignore clear warnings and worship the idol.

Perhaps you could reference where the Nazis offered negotiations with the Warsaw Ghetto to be free and have their own land there living in peace with Germany?

The Warsaw Ghetto, like Gaza, was allowed to have its own administration (Judenrat) and police force. Naturally, the Jews of Warsaw could not travel freely in the area around the Ghetto, and neither can the Gazans. Naturally, if an anti-Nazi force arose within the Ghetto, the Nazis would brutally crush it. One German death might bring reprisals of 40 or more Jewish deaths. Just like the Zionists deal with the people of the Gaza Ghetto. The Jews had "freedom" under Nazi terms, just as the Arabs will have "freedom" under Zionist terms.

You keep falling for the charade and delusion that Zionists were willing to live sharing a Palestine with a free and independent Palestinian Arab state. A thorough study of the history of the Zionist plan for Palestine from 1919 to 1948 should make their intentions very clear. Say all you want about past history being irrelevant, human nature does not change, except if a people are willing to reflect, repent, and return to Torah. (This is your "solution" by the way. It is the only solution.)

The Jewish community raised those young adults who went and kidnapped a young Palestinian, forced gasoline down his lungs before dowsing him and lighting a match. In their minds, they thought their community would sanction that act. This is what occupation and dominating others does to a people over time: it makes them depraved.

As Jeffrey Goldberg writes in The Atlantic: "But I think that while the murder of 16-year-old Muhammad Abu Khdeir is a terrible crime, the non-fatal beating of his cousin, the Palestinian-American teenager Tariq Khdeir, by Israel's Border Police, is, in one way, more consequential. Obviously, murder is the ultimate crime, but this murder was committed, we believe, by thugs operating independent of state authority. The beating of Tariq Khdeir was conducted by agents of the state. We judge countries not on the behavior of their criminal elements, but on 1) how they police their criminal elements; and 2) how they police their police. Those of you who have seen images of the beating of Tariq Khdeir know that this assault represents a state failure....Unfortunately, this is not a one-off failure. On too many occasions, Israeli police officers and soldiers have meted out excessive punishment to Palestinians in custody. I've witnessed some of these incidents myself, both as a reporter and as a soldier."

One can imagine a young Adolf Hitler looking at a map of Europe after WWI and dreaming of a German resurgence in lands that it did not control, but once did, and in which there was a minority German population. Then, consider the Zionist plan of 1919 for the entire area of Palestine,.also drawn up in Europe. It was an area 90% owned and settled by Palestinian Arabs for many centuries. And these Zionists made public a plan that was going to just take it all away from them. It was a plan for domination over others that would lead to their depravity. At least give those rabbis opposed to this from the beginning credit for having called it correctly.

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

Naturally, this will be a minority opinion. The majority will ignore clear warnings and worship the idol.

You are not listening. I am not saying the are the minority opinion of the general population of Jews, I am stating that they are the minority opinion of Orthodox Jews and Haredim. They are a fringe group.

I wouldn't try to claim that the majority of Haredi support the Zionist state. Pictures like this belie that claim:

http://www.timesofisrael.com/thousands-of-haredi-jews-protest-draft-in-nyc/

So, let me see if I understand your misunderstanding correctly. You see a photo of a bunch of Orthodox Jews and you decide with no reason whatsoever that they belong to Neturei-Karta? I guess they do all seem to dress the same in the photo. However, you could have at least attempted to read the article you linked before commenting on it. This was not a protest against Israel in the slightest. It was a protest against being asked to join the draft. The Orthodox, most of whom are supporters of Israel despite your attempts to paint an incorrect picture, have been exempt from military service and have received welfare from the state in order to study. The people quoted in the article are not against Zionism or the state of Israel, they just do not want Haredim to be required to join the army. So, again, you are wrong about Haredim and your own article proves you incorrect.

The Warsaw Ghetto, like Gaza, was allowed to have its own administration (Judenrat) and police force....

I am truly sorry you seemed to have not understood my questions to you. I will pose them again as your attempt at a response has little or nothing to do with what I asked. I can only assume you must have misunderstood me.

Perhaps you could reference where the Nazis offered negotiations with the Warsaw Ghetto to be free and have their own land there living in peace with Germany? Perhaps you could find a reference that suggests that the Nazai Germany cabinet voted and Nazi Germany wanted a truce and with the residents of the Warsaw Ghetto and yet the residents of the Warsaw Ghetto rejected it? I could not find any such thing anywhere. Israel and Hamas are offered a truce, the Israeli cabinet votes to accept it and Hamas rejects it and shoots off more rockets. As such the comparison is ridiculous.

Your above long response does not answer my questions to you at all. The residents of the Warsaw Ghetto had no offers of negotiations for peace between the two peoples. The people in Gaza have had them and still have them. So, would you care to try again and respond to my points this time? Thanks.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

Yabits

What would you have Israel do? And what would you have Hamas do?

2 ( +2 / -0 )

Israel today bombed a beach on Gaza where kids were playing -- and not the site of any rocket launches -- and killed four boys, averaging age 10. Israel's descent into depravity and madness continues.

The centuries of peaceful coexistence between Arab and Jew in Palestine are but a memory -- wiped out when Zionists decided they wanted control over all of Palestine.

you keep calling 'Zionists' evidently still unaware that Rabin, a man you suggested was correct and good, was a staunch Zionist and a believer in the state of Israel's right to exist.

May the reader note that this writer brought up Rabin as an example when a person -- even a Zionist Jew -- crosses a line that hard line Zionists feel is going too far, that person will be taken out. Make no mistake about it: among the Zionists are such cunning and remorseless killers -- people without conscience -- as would have made the SS very proud. May the reader search on the name "Folke Bernadotte" for another example of a person -- in this case a U.N. mediator from neutral Sweden whom the Zionists assassinated -- and then decide if I am supplying my own version of history.

But the Truth is more relentless than any Zionist assassin. There will be readers who see this and will comprehend. But to those who are lawless and depraved, they will read and not comprehend; they will see and fail to know.

What would you have Israel do?

Prepare for what surely awaits murderers and the oppressors of widows and orphans, or repent. It is their choice.

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

Repent?

Did it ever occur to you that the problem is too much religion?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

May the reader note that this writer brought up Rabin as an example when a person -- even a Zionist Jew -- crosses a line that hard line Zionists feel is going too far, that person will be taken out.

I did no such thing. I brought up Rabin's support for a peaceful two state solution. You came back with something like, "Yeah, but he was shot and killed by a Zionist. I responded that Rabin himself was a Zionist. Why would you feel the need to misrepresent what I have written when it is all still here for people to see? You really should apologize for that misrespresentation.

Sorry, yabits, Israel will not just disappear as you seem to fervently wish. Israel is here to stay and hopefully a Palestinians state will be too, someday.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

Did it ever occur to you that the problem is too much religion?

There is too much false doctrine. True religion is all too rare. But the Jews have a higher responsibility because of what happened at Sinai. You may scoff, but if that is fable than the rationale for a "Jewish homeland" is ridiculous.

-3 ( +0 / -3 )

False doctrine. And you have the True Doctrine, do you?

Please, enlighten.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

There is too much false doctrine.

Absolutely. Your posts have been full of that.

True religion is all too rare.

Again, what is your qualifications to judge what is a 'true religion'?

But the Jews have a higher responsibility because of what happened at Sinai

What happened at Sinai was that Israel made a peace deal with Egypt and gave the Sinai back to Egypt. It would be wonderful if the Palestinians and Israel would also negotiate for land for peace in that way.

than the rationale for a "Jewish homeland" is ridiculous.

Not any more ridiculous than the rationale for the US being your homeland.

Israel is an active member of the UN. It is a legal nation. Your false doctrine cannot change this. Hamas' desire to destroy Israel cannot change this. The only hope for the Palestinians are serious negotiations for peace.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

Yesterday, Israel murdered four very young children from the same family with shelling from a naval boat. The family on warning of bombing from the Israelis' had left their home and gone to the beach for safety? Collective punishment is an international crime, not that Israel has ever been interested in that point nor on illegal weapons like white phosphorus bombs which at least at the moment they don't seem to be using.

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@zichi

Can you tell me if the Israeli's phoned the beach to let everyone know the shells were coming?

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

Israel says it only targets Hamas but there were none on the beach were the boys were killed and the current death toll is about 220.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

Israel says it only targets Hamas but there were none on the beach were the boys were killed and the current death toll is about 220.

There is no excuse for the death of innocents. None whatsoever.

zichi, how do you know there were no Hamas members on or near the beach? How do you know no rockets were fired from that vicinity? Are you seriously suggesting that Israel was aiming at children on purpose? Hamas has been specific in saying they are aiming at civilian centers and cities.

Hamas continues to fire rockets and refuse a truce. Amazing that people can think this is okay.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

slumdog

zichi, how do you know there were no Hamas members on or near the beach? How do you know no rockets were fired from that vicinity?

Not according to a BBC World News report from the beach. There is a Hamas police station to monitor the fishing boats, but since they are banned from leaving port the station is empty.

Are you seriously suggesting that Israel was aiming at children on purpose? Hamas has been specific in saying they are aiming at civilian centers and cities. Hamas continues to fire rockets and refuse a truce. Amazing that people can think this is okay.

I never stated that but when you start firing live shells from a boat out at sea towards a beach full of people and young children playing something is going to go wrong and in this case it did with the murder of four very young boys, sadly all from the same family.

Hamas don't fire rockets from beaches.

Again, I repeat in case you missed my point, **collective punishment is illegal and an international crime, even if Hamas were to fire a million rockets. Destruction of schools, hospitals and UN buildings is the norm in Israeli bombing attacks.

When the IRA were bombing mainland Britain, up to 1000 lb car bombs and killing troops in Northern Ireland, we didn't go and bomb Catholic homes and murder Catholic people nor did we bulldoze them?

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Hamas don't fire rockets from beaches.

I did not see that part of the Hamas charter. Perhaps, Hamas themselves have not seen it. They have fired rockets from the beaches in the past. Why would you suggest they do not fire rockets from the beaches when they have done so before?

Destruction of schools, hospitals and UN buildings is the norm in Israeli bombing attacks.

The rockets often come from those places. So, they are attacked.

Again, there is no excuse for innocents being killed. None at all. Israel has apologized for killing the children.

This is what happens when Hamas shoots hundreds of rockets instead of making peace instead.

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