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Democrats push to pass health care by Christmas

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Republicans are determined to give Democrats no help, eager to deny Obama a political victory and speculating openly that the health care issue will hurt Democrats in the 2010 midterm elections.

Wow, the AP is at it again with their one sided pro-Left "news". I just wish anyone in Congress would oppose this monstrosity for the sake of the nations financial future and the freedom of individuals to chose their own health care without government coercion.

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What about the people who can't afford health insurance or those who are denied coverage? What about making the medical field more conservative and only get test that are truly needed and start looking at test taken by another doctor? I just wish that the public option had gone through. < :-)

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I just wish anyone in Congress would oppose this monstrosity for the sake of the nations financial future and the freedom of individuals to chose their own health care without government coercion.

LOL!! Give it a rest.

The only way the issue could be used to hurt Dems is if Republicans could accuse them of not taking the kinds of actions the Dems are taking now. The Dems made solid gains in the elections of '06 and '08 and put health care at the very top of their agenda -- so it's not as though the American people have been blindsided by all of this.

In the immortal words of George W. Bush circa 2001: "If they have no ideas or policies except obstruction, they should step aside and let others lead." Chew on those words, Republicans.

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Now that the public option is off the bill, the American support warmed up 6 points to 42% but still below the majority. Seems some Americans support the bill but just don't like the public option.

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isn't anyone concerned about how some of these guys benefitted? People in Michigan will enjoy not having their state insurer not being taxed, the AMA not being taxed for botox.. Oh, you anglos, no offense, but aren't you upset about the tanning salon tax? Nebraska, Louisiana, etc.. No concern at all?

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Even with the imperfections skiptheson and this may not be the exact bill that each of us wanted...It's a damn good start. < :-)

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excuse me - skipthesong < :-)

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Usually Liberals like to crow about how they care for the little guy and rail agaisnt greedy corporations and the 'fat cats'.

Investors are seeing the Senate's version of health care reform as a massive public subsidy for insurance companies -- and as a result, are sending the sector's stock prices shooting up, up, up. Stripped of a government-run insurance plan, the bill would give tens of millions of Americans no option but to start paying hefty premiums to private companies.

The rise in stock prices has been particularly striking in the period since Sen. Joe Lieberman (I-Conn.) said on October 27 that he would filibuster a Senate health care reform bill if it included a public option - a threat that caused Senate leaders to cave without much of a fight.

Here's a quick breakdown of major health insurance company stock performance from Oct. 27 to Friday's market close:

Coventry Health Care, Inc. is up 31.6 percent;

CIGNA Corp. is up 29.1 percent;

Aetna Inc. is up 27.1 percent;

WellPoint, Inc. is up 26.6 percent;

UnitedHealth Group Inc. is up 20.5 percent;

And Humana Inc. is up 13.6 percent.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/12/21/seeing-public-subsidy-not_n_399733.html

Good Job Liberals........Think the big insurance companies are ever going to lower premiums now? They just got a guarenteed captive market with Government cash forever, courtesy of the Democratic party.......Sad day for our children and future generations, sad day indeed.

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'Obama called the vote “a big victory for the American people,”'

He must be sitting in the same cave Osama Bin Laden is if he thinks the American people want this.

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sailwind after reading what you posted I have to ask why are republicans so upset with it. Just think of the control that insurance companies will wield. Just look at the profits that will pour in. Why are they so against it?

The last time that I went through brochures and price list to purchase I don't remember them posting a stock price, just a premium amount.

sailwind do you know anyone who will benefit from this bill? Just a question, please no attack intended. Are there any people in your life that will benefit? I do and I'll be glad when it goes into effect. Some benefits start now and some between now and 2012. < :-)

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aday, where are you getting your time frames?

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sailwind -

courtesy of the Democratic party.......Sad day for our children and future generations, sad day indeed.

Speak for yourself. I'm delighted for my children to finally have what every red-blooded American should have had all along.

Merry Christmas, America!

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"I'm delighted for my children to finally have what every red-blooded American should have had all along."

Props, usafdude,I wish the rest of our military forces were more like you . But dont forget, coverage will be extended to millions of undocumented workers, all but forced to come to America, and do the jobs so many of us wont.

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Speak for yourself. I'm delighted for my children to finally have what every red-blooded American should have had all along.

Massive Debt?

sailwind do you know anyone who will benefit from this bill? Just a question, please no attack intended. Are there any people in your life that will benefit?

No attack intended in this response either. Anyone that will benefit that I know? not really most people that I know have already made sure they have taken care of their families already by having health insurance, it is the main reason they get up everyday and go to work so they can do the right thing by their families. They do not need to forced to buy health insurance by Uncle Sam as this bill will now do.

The only people I see that will really benefit is Big Pharma, Big Insurance and trial lawyers, there health care racket is just about to be codifed as legal theft and there isn't anything hardworking Americans can do about it now. You don't have a policy get fined or go to jail or don't worry those hardworking Americans that do have insurance is going to subsidize you with their tax dollars.

Well aday, many of those taxpayers are going to go Galt and jump into the cart and so there will not be anyone pulling it. Being dependent on the Government is never a good thing, Government exists to serve the people not enslave them, this bill is just another step in the wrong direction and our country is going to suffer mightily for it.

Don't believe me look at public housing and our raging success in that department over the years (sarcasm).

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Define bum rush, pushing a 2,000+ page document through a typically lengthy approval process with most of the senator not even knowing the contents in a about a week and voting on it in the middle of the night when even C-Span watchers need to sleep.

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"and do the jobs so many of us wont."

Heh......then props to you lazy fatties that errounously believe Manual Labour is some hispanic dude, oldest ever friend!

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skipthesong, these parts of the health care bill take effect immediately.

TOP 14 PROVISIONS THAT TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY 1. BEGINS TO CLOSE THE MEDICARE PART D DONUT HOLE — Reduces the donut hole by $500 and institutes a 50% discount on brand-name drugs, effective January 1, 2010. 2. IMMEDIATE HELP FOR THE UNINSURED UNTIL EXCHANGE IS AVAILABLE (INTERIM HIGH-RISK POOL) — Creates a temporary insurance program until the Exchange is available for individuals who have been uninsured for several months or have been denied a policy because of pre-existing conditions. 3. BANS LIFETIME LIMITS ON COVERAGE—Prohibits health insurance companies from placing lifetime caps on coverage. 4. ENDS RESCISSIONS—Prohibits insurers from nullifying or rescinding a patient’s policy when they file a claim for benefits, except in the case of fraud. 5. EXTENDS COVERAGE FOR YOUNG PEOPLE UP TO 27TH BIRTHDAY THROUGH PARENTS’ INSURANCE— Requires health plans to allow young people through age 26 to remain on their parents’ insurance policy, at the parents’ choice. 6. ELIMINATES COST-SHARING FOR PREVENTIVE SERVICES IN MEDICARE—Eliminates co-payments for preventive services and exempts preventive services from deductibles under the Medicare program. 7. IMPROVES HELP FOR LOW-INCOME MEDICARE BENEFICIARIES—Improves the low-income protection programs in Medicare to assure more individuals are able to access this vital help. 8. PROVIDES NEW CONSUMER PROTECTIONS IN MEDICARE ADVANTAGE— Prohibits Medicare Advantage plans from charging enrollees higher cost-sharing for services in their private plan than what is charged in traditional Medicare. 9. IMMEDIATE SUNSHINE ON PRICE GOUGING—Discourages excessive price increases by insurance companies through review and disclosure of insurance rate increases. 10. CONTINUITY FOR DISPLACED WORKERS—Allows Americans to keep their COBRA coverage until the Exchange is in place and they can access affordable coverage. 11. CREATES NEW, VOLUNTARY, PUBLIC LONG-TERM CARE INSURANCE PROGRAM—Creates a long-term care insurance program to be financed by voluntary payroll deductions to provide benefits to adults who become functionally disabled. 12. HELP FOR EARLY RETIREES—Creates a $10 billon fund to finance a temporary reinsurance program to help offset the costs of expensive health claims for employers that provide health benefits for retirees age 55-64. 13. COMMUNITY HEALTH CENTERS—Increases funding for Community Health Centers to allow for a doubling of the number of patients seen by the centers over the next 5 years. 14. INCREASING NUMBER OF PRIMARY CARE DOCTORS — Provides new investment in training programs to increase the number of primary care doctors, nurses, and public health professionals. PREPARED BY OFFICE OF SPEAKER PELOSI – OCTOBER 29, 2009.

The rest are incrementally phase in till 2012 when it all kicks in. < :-)

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Taxing the benefits of middle class Americans is a bad idea. Taxing anyone to pay for the Barack Hussein Obama Memorial Healthcare Scam, where most of the money goes to insurance companies and big pharma, is a huuuuge political mistake.

Fortunately, the republicans aren't connected to this bill as the democrats didn't even allow them in on discussions. This whole steaming pile is on the Democrats.

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This whole steaming pile is on the Democrats.

We're glad to assume the responsibility. < :-)

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"Fortunately, the republicans aren't connected to this bill as the democrats didn't even allow them in on discussions. "

Well, I've not really read up on this so can't really comment on the actual bill - but I think it shows the stagnant two-party democracy in the US needs a serious overhaul.

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Please set me straight, how does putting a tax on my medical insurance make it less expensive? I can not wait for my children to get their Amtrak health plan, even though I constantly work to escape the grasp of Uncle Sam and provide for myself and family the wizards of smart in DC continually want to help me out by taking my income.

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Taxes are going to be put on Cadillac plans. I don't know what you pay per year, but unless you have a medical plan that cost $20K (number I've heard) then your health insurance is safe from taxation.

You haven't seen anything yet when it comes to taxation. We still have to pay for the Iraq War. We've collected no new taxes to offset what has been spent, we won't be getting oil reserve money from Iraq to pay for it. At least the health care bill helps Americans. < :-)

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Republicans are determined to give Democrats no help, eager to deny Obama a political victory and speculating openly that the health care issue will hurt Democrats in the 2010 midterm elections.

Heh, if President Bush had told as many lies that are as obvious and provable as what Obama has done and is continuing to do, the media would be crucifying him and his administration. They would be tearing him apart on his lies.

But Obama is getting a free ride with the liberal media. These media sources that refuse to call Obama on his lies are losing credibility with the American people by covering for him.

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Obama said:

"if we are able to slow the growth of health care costs by just one-tenth of 1 percent each year -- one-tenth of 1 percent -- it will actually reduce the deficit by $4 trillion over the long term.

Today's health care expenditure: $2,555,000,000,000. That's $2.5 trillion. So 1/10th of 1 percent of $.5 trillion is $2.5 billion. Divide the $4 trillion deficit by $2.5 billion and Obama's "long term" is 1,600 years.

Why doesn't the MSM call out Obama on this pants on fire statement?

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RomeoRamenII I can't find where they come up with the $4Trillion numbers. I don't know whether this statement can come to fruition.

I was for the health care bill without hearing that figure. It's not the $4Trillion over 1600 years I'm even concerned about. It's the millions that will have health care insurance after this bill gets signed.

A perfect bill, hell no. Can it be improved on, hell yes. And it will, but we have to get it through first. We've been fighting too many years to back down now. < :-)

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A perfect bill, hell no. Can it be improved on, hell yes. And it will, but we have to get it through first. We've been fighting too many years to back down now. < :-)

You want a way to improve this bill? Take it out, tear it up, flush it down the toilet. That would markably improve it. It sure couldn't hurt it.

Anyone else looking forward to November where the Dems will own this boondoggle? The only question now is, will they lose their majority in both houses.

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sailwind said:

They do not need to forced to buy health insurance by Uncle Sam as this bill will now do.

This from someone who gets their health insurance from Uncle Sam. Or maybe he likes Japanese universal health care better? Didn't he claim to use the Japanese system in the past?

Hopefully we will get the Public Option. This can be done skillfully in the Reconciliation Bill. Now that would be a beautiful gift for the liberals to hand the conservatives for christmas.

Wouldn't that just look wonderful with a big bow sitting under the national christmas tree?

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Today's health care expenditure: $2,555,000,000,000. That's $2.5 trillion. So 1/10th of 1 percent of $.5 trillion is $2.5 billion. Divide the $4 trillion deficit by $2.5 billion and Obama's "long term" is 1,600 years.

LOL! Looks like someone does not understand the time value of money (TVM). Or the facts regarding the numbers.

Why doesn't the MSM call out Obama on this pants on fire statement?

Perhaps because they understand TVM and would end up looking as silly as someone yelling "pants of fire."

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What a beautiful, joyful, glorious day for America! Thanks to the Democrats, who were of course overwhelmingly elected by the vast majority of American voters, Americans will have the health care we should've had all along. I have to agree with RomeoRamenII - the whole country knows that the Democrats are to credit for this unparalleled achievement; the Republicants never had the integrity to do this for the people.

Heh, the Republicans are going the way of the Confederacy - we all know what we Americans did to them! xD

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This from someone who gets their health insurance from Uncle Sam. Or maybe he likes Japanese universal health care better? Didn't he claim to use the Japanese system in the past?

My health insurance is rationed and I have to wait two months to get an appointment, I pay into the Japanese system so I can get treatment when I actually need it. I pay into a system that I shouldn't have to, but Uncle Sam isn't keeping his promise that he made to me or any other Military retiree in Japan.

And since I actually pay for insurance in Japan that I shouldn't have to, because of the very reason my U.S Govie provided health care is so crappy, you expect me to crow about how wonderful I have it?

How about you provide me a reason why I had to go into the Japanese system to take care of my immediate health needs and care instead of my 'free' U.S Govie care system.

And that is the system you want to foist on all Americans.....Nuff said.

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What a beautiful, joyful, glorious day for America! With the midnite passage of this 2,700 bill(too funny!, the wingers were powerless to stop all that pork) , and the virtual nationalization of 1/6th of the US economy, the Cloward-Piven plan for a whole new America, the kind Barack was actually referring to on the campaign trail, is close to realization. Next we just need to unite as progressives and pass cap and trade so we can hobble the industrial base that finances the repubs.

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Thought I'd reply to USAFdudes statement...

Thanks to the Democrats, who were of course overwhelmingly elected by the vast majority of American voters,

Americans who are now bitterly regretting having voted for them.

Americans will have the health care we should've had all along.

That only a very small minority of Americans actually wanted, the vast majority preferring what we had

I have to agree with RomeoRamenII - the whole country knows that the Democrats are to credit for this unparalleled achievement;

Achievement is not the words I'd use to describe this boondoggle accomplished only by bribery and malfeasance.

the Republicants never had the integrity to do this for the people.

Or the rank stupidity to try to foist this upon an unwilling populace. I also just can't let someone use the word integrity when talking about this bill, without pointing out the complete and total lack thereof shown by the Dems. Is like calling Monaco the most influential country in the world, complete nonsense.

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Thought I'd reply to Molenir's statement:

Americans who are now bitterly regretting having voted for them.

Name one.

That only a very small minority of Americans actually wanted, the vast majority preferring what we had

You're proven wrong by the fact that the Democrats were elected, largely due to campaigning for the exact health care reform you see taking place now.

Achievement is not the words I'd use to describe this boondoggle accomplished only by bribery and malfeasance.

Boondoggle is not the word I'd use to describe this unparalled achievement by legislators voted into power, by the vast majority of the American people, to accomplish precisely this.

I also just can't let someone use the word integrity when talking about this bill, without pointing out the complete and total lack thereof shown by the Dems.

You don't "let" me use the word integrity to describe this amazing feat; I choose to do so regardless of your opinion and with my above statements, among many others, to prove myself right.

Next?

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You don't "let" me use the word integrity to describe this amazing feat;

Integrity..as if your actually in the military? just asking.

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Name one.

No. Names are none of your business, I'll simply state, that 3 of my co-workers who voted for Obama, have since said they regret having voted for him. Their names however, are none of your business, believe me or not as you will.

You're proven wrong by the fact that the Democrats were elected, largely due to campaigning for the exact health care reform you see taking place now.

I'm proven right by the polls showing only about 30% support for the health care inititive. That means 70% of the people either oppose it, or don't feel they know enough about it one way or another. By the way, over 50% strongly oppose.

Boondoggle is not the word I'd use to describe this unparalled achievement by legislators voted into power, by the vast majority of the American people, to accomplish precisely this.

Nevertheless, it is so.

You don't "let" me use the word integrity to describe this amazing feat; I choose to do so regardless of your opinion and with my above statements, among many others, to prove myself right.

Perhaps I should clarify. I don't choose to "let" you use it... without challenge. You can use whatever language you wish in describing this. Just like you could go out and call the murder of Hawker, by Ichihashi a stunning, and wonderful achievement. You could use that language, but you should of course be prepared for comments stating how idiotic such statements are. Using the word Integrity to describe dems is about the same really. Oh, no one was murdered of course, but its so lacking in reality that its hard not to shocked when reading it.

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Molenir - Let's see:

Three people do not make up a majority.

The only "poll" that matters is the election.

"Nevertheless, it is so" is not a counter-argument.

Comparing health care reform to Hawker's murder is a blatant slap in the face to both Hawker and Obama for which you should apologize or risk being seen as having no integrity - I choose the latter.

Your points are too emotional and out-of-touch to merit further consideration. Calm youself and act like an adult, or at the very least get some therapy.

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sailwind -

Integrity..as if your [sic] actually in the military? just [sic] asking.

Sure am. Are you finally willing to come to Ramstein where I can prove it? Or is this just the typical knee-jerk reaction (again) to a US troop who so often defeats your arguments?

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For how the health care plan will benefit the vast majority of Americans, consider the following chart:

http://www.tnr.com/image/kaisergif

Only those spite-filled folks who can't take their party being pushed out of office -- through their own malfeasance, incompetence and culture of corruption -- refuse to admit to the benefits.

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Only those spite-filled folks who can't take their party being pushed out of office -- through their own malfeasance, incompetence and culture of corruption -- refuse to admit to the benefits.

Yabits, mind if I quote you on this come November? You know, when the party you support is pushed out of power due to their own malfeasance, incompetence, and culture of corruption.

Three people do not make up a majority.

lol, you were making a joke here right? I mean, I make a general statement about how Americans are regretting having elected Obama, and noticing that the polls are bearing this out. I make a more specific statement about how I know 3 people who voted for Obama who now say they regret having voted for him, and thats your response?

The only "poll" that matters is the election.

This is true of course to a certain extent, however like it or not, polls do influence policy.

Comparing health care reform to Hawker's murder is a blatant slap in the face to both Hawker and Obama for which you should apologize or risk being seen as having no integrity - I choose the latter.

Did I directly compare health care reform to Hawkers murder? Perhaps you should go back and read what I wrote again. I referenced it, in response to your referring to Dems as having integrity, such a nonsensical statement, in the face of bribes and showing an obvious and total lack of integrity is hard to stomach. I stated that you might as well call her murder a good thing, it would make about as much sense. In other words, so you don't try to twist my words again, its a despicable statement that is complete nonsense, rather like using the word integrity in relation to Democrats.

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Molenir -

So fun to see you on the ropes again!

lol, you were making a joke here right?

Nope, I'm serious as a heart attack. You have utterly failed to proved that Americans in general regret electing Obama. That's my response; prove it wrong or concede.

Did I directly compare health care reform to Hawkers murder?

Directly, no; indirectly, yes. Man up to your very crass mistake.

so you don't try to twist my words again, its a despicable statement that is complete nonsense, rather like using the word integrity in relation to Democrats.

No word-twisting needed on my part, so you'll just strike the misuse of the term "again" or risk looking like an even bigger fool. I don't care which.

Integrity is a word I will constantly use in relation to Democrats because it's fitting and proper. Your inability to show any semblance of rational evidence otherwise, and instead embarking on emotionally-charged nonsensical statements, shows you to be the easily-defeatable troll I've always accused you of being.

Goodbye, Molenir; I'm no longer interested in defeating such an easy opponent.

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Nope, I'm serious as a heart attack. You have utterly failed to proved that Americans in general regret electing Obama. That's my response; prove it wrong or concede.

Heh, you can't be serious here. He started with what, 53% electing him, now polls are showing his support at only 44 or less. Those self same people who voted for him, now regret having done so. Unless you're a complete idiot, its hard not to see a direct correlation here.

Integrity is a word I will constantly use in relation to Democrats because it's fitting and proper.

That is of course your own opinion. Myself, when I see people giving and accepting bribes, lying about what they're doing, claiming to do one thing, and being exposed as doing another, I view that as a lack of integrity. I grant, that both Democrats and Republicans both suffer from this. I'll also grant that there are some Dems who truly do have integrity. They openly say what they believe in, and vote accordingly, but those Dems are few and far between. Most of them fall exceedingly short of the mark and simply don't qualify. Getting back to the topic at hand, the whole exercise, of passing this bill has nearly no integrity at all.

Your inability to show any semblance of rational evidence otherwise, and instead embarking on emotionally-charged nonsensical statements, shows you to be the easily-defeatable troll I've always accused you of being.

I'm amused at you, I really am. You throw out this nonsense, and then when you get a response, you claim to have "won". I suppose if you're just trolling, a response equals victory. Otherwise, I fail to see how any of your statements, as idiotic as many of them are, have won you anything. Well, apart from well deserved scorn.

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Molenir said:

No. Names are none of your business, I'll simply state, that 3 of my co-workers who voted for Obama, have since said they regret having voted for him. Their names however, are none of your business, believe me or not as you will.

I think USAFdude was referring to non-fictional people.

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I'm glad that the Dems pushed this so hard. Can't wait for 2010 and 2012 to vote these bums out of office. What's most fascinating is that while Obama campaigned on open and transparent Govt, we got nothing that even remotely looks like it. Yet another slimy politician.

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Molenir writes:

Yabits, mind if I quote you on this come November? You know, when the party you support is pushed out of power due to their own malfeasance, incompetence, and culture of corruption.

I recall it was you who said the financial crisis was largely caused by banks being forced by legislation/regulation to lend to people who could not afford the loans. (And I showed you the obvious facts which proved of the gross falseness of that claim.)

Being so provably wrong on key issues does not seem to prevent you from spouting more nonsense and false reports. It is well understood how lies and innuendoes fuel the Republican constituency against health care (and every other policy that might benefit the vast majority of the American people).

If we review why the American people threw the Republicans out in 2006 and 2008 so resoundingly, we have only to go back to the campaign of 2000, when the Republican candidate promised the American people that his proposed tax cuts would not create deficits -- since he was going to see to it that he kept discretionary federal spending at or below the level of his predecessor. And then, after election, he and the Republican Congress went on the biggest discretionary spending binge since LBJ's Great Society programs.

The American people should be reminded of this major Republican lie. Alongside the fact that their "Contract with America" called for term limits, a balanced budget amendment, and a line-item veto -- none of which were ever introduced as serious legislation when the Republicans had full control of the Congress and the White House.

The American people would have to be grossly stupid to return that pack to the seat of power and authority. It is sad to see just how many of them are in that sad condition.

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