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Fighting rages in Gaza as death toll nears 1,000

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Hamas has so far rejected any international monitors

Why?

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Why? Stupidity is one guess. Propaganda potential is another.

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This article is propaganda. Israel say Hamas must disarm and you know they will not do that. Egypt is not sealing the borders it is Israel. Egypt should say they will control the borders together with Palestine. The part of teh broken case fire agreement was that Palestine stop firing rockets on conditions that Israel keep the borders open. Besides Gaza is under occupation as long as Israel does not let go of the borders.

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Egypt has closed their borders, they have even fired on Palestinians fleeing. But Anti-Jews have decided to ignore that.

Besides Gaza is under occupation as long as Israel does not let go of the borders." Egypt has more right to that place than do the Palestinians, its up to them and Israel to decide if you really wanted to get down to it.

agreement was that Palestine stop firing rockets on conditions that Israel keep the borders open" But rockets get fired into Egypt.. Why should Israel, or any country for that matter, open its borders to its enemies?

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Meanwhile Israel pushes the US to vote the right way...

I guess all Americans here must be feeling very proud of their country. Once again.

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Egypt has closed their borders, they have even fired on Palestinians fleeing. But Anti-Jews have decided to ignore that.

Don't you mean Anti-Israelis?

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Hamas has so far rejected any international monitors

Why?

Probably for the same reason that all foreign journalists have been banned from entering Gaza by the Israelis. There, does that answer your question for you ?

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Hamas has so far rejected any international monitors Why?

Would these be the same international monitors that branded Hamas a terrorist organization? Maybe, Hamas did not get any assurance that the monitors would be fair and impartial. Just like the monitors sent to Iraq to investigate its WMDs who were confirmed to be spies.

Why should Israel, or any country for that matter, open its borders to its enemies?

But why would Israel control the borders of Gaza that do not border Israel; I am referring to Israel's control of Gaza's shore and airspace. There is no reason why Israel should control that.

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Would these be the same international monitors that branded Hamas a terrorist organization?

I believe the proposed monitors would be UN monitors...either Hamas would like the UN's help or they would not. The choice is theirs.

But why would Israel control the borders of Gaza that do not border Israel; I am referring to Israel's control of Gaza's shore and airspace. There is no reason why Israel should control that.

The was the agreement made amongst the Palestinians, Egypt and Israel. You may not agree with that, however that is the fact. Negotiations were planned for increased controls by the Palestinians. Events since then have stopped those negotiations. You continue to suggest there is no reason for Israel to control the air and sea, for you support Hamas using air and sea to bring in weapons to attack Israel. However, Israel does not want Hamas to bring in weapons, so they continue to control the air and sea around Gaza.

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But why would Israel control the borders of Gaza that do not border Israel; I am referring to Israel's control of Gaza's shore and airspace. There is no reason why Israel should control that. The was the agreement made amongst the Palestinians, Egypt and Israel.

Was the blockade part of the agreement. Also, just because a group was pressured to make some agreements, I would hope that common decency would prevail.

You continue to suggest there is no reason for Israel to control the air and sea, for you support Hamas using air and sea to bring in weapons to attack Israel.

But you seem to have no problems with Israel importing weapons to attack the Palestinians, even during ceasefires. All Israel has to do to stop the rockets is not to kill all Gazans, but to simply stop treating them worst than cattle. The real terrorists are the Israelis, not Hamas, I would have thought you would have realized that by now, or are you simply blindly repeating the talking points provided by Israel's ministry of foreign affairs?

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Was the blockade part of the agreement.

No, I don't remember seeing that it was. Your point is?

Also, just because a group was pressured to make some agreements, I would hope that common decency would prevail.

There was nothing uncommon or indecent with the agreement regarding handing over power to the Palestinian Authority nor with plans for negotiating further control on the part of the PA. Again, your delusive arguments aside, the reasons why Gazan does not have control over its air and sea borders has been discussed and answered truthfully. Just because you do not like the answers does not make them false nor does it make the reasons why the answers are true false.

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Why won't Iran allow Hamas to at least negotiate a short-term ceasefire?

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Was the blockade part of the agreement. No, I don't remember seeing that it was. Your point is?

Oh my! So they make an agreement whereby Israel (and to some extent Egypt) controls Gaza's borders. And then Israel uses that to basically make life miserable for the Gazans. They even prevent fishing, attack ships bringing humanitarian aid, and attack UN humanitarian aid delivered by trucks.

I realize you have certain loyalties, but to continue to defend such people is truly remarkable.

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Loyalties aside, to defend the actions of a terrorist group as the only means to solve a situation is just foolish. And to defend Hamas as just is just idiotic.

Israel has to be the bigger man in this situation and attempt to create peace, but I dont think they will. I feel bad for the innocents caught up in the idiotic actions of Hamas( and those who think they are a just group) and Israels goverment (and those who think that violence will reduce violence).

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The Israeli military said it carried out dozens of airstrikes on squads of gunmen, rocket launching sites and smuggling tunnels along the Egyptian border.

In the southern West Bank city of Hebron, the Israeli military said, a Palestinian was shot and injured after he tried to grab a gun from an Israeli soldier whose patrol stopped him for questioning.

The important words to notice here are "Israeli military said". They have been confirmed to be liars countless times.

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kinniku,

I'm not sure where the reason that Gaza does not have control over its air and sea borders was discussed and answered truthfully. However, I don't see that answer on this thread.

I think that the reason that Gaza does not have control over its air and sea borders is that Gaza is not a country, nor is Palestine a country. I don't think that Gaza ever will have this control unless either it or Palestine is a country (which will not happen until the territorial issue is determined) or until the stateless land is subsumed into some other country (which cannot happen until other such other country candidates find a way to palliate the Palestinian sense of outrage).

Israel is responsible for the conditions in Gaza. Granted it has had help. But it has done nothing to help itself. The issue is not rockets. The issue is as old as the hills. The issue is land and resources.

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Early Wednesday an Israeli warplane fired a missile at the former Gaza city hall, used as a court building in recent years, witnesses said. The 1910 structure was destroyed and many stores in the market around it were badly damaged, they said.

Looks like they are just set on destroying the nation. But then they have had great teachers.

Hamas, which is backed by Iran, cannot hope to score a battlefield victory over the powerful Israeli military, but mere survival could earn it political capital in the Arab world as a symbol of resistance to the Jewish state. Lebanon’s Hezbollah, another Iran-backed group, largely achieved that goal in its 2006 war with Israel.

It's too late, Hamas has already gained a victory across the world. Little Gaza being utterly destroyed by big bad Israel and if only 1 Hamas member survives, he's wasn't defeated.

That's what so insensed many people after the first Gulf War. Saddam was seen as a victor in the Middle East, even after having his ass kicked back into Iraq.

Israel has made Gaza the little country that has been mistreated. Like it or not, that's the world's perception. < :-)

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All Israel has to do to stop the rockets is not to kill all Gazans

The Islamic terrorist group Hamas has launched thousands of rockets at civilian targets in Israel for the last eight years. Why in the world do you think the Hamas terrorists will stop now? I'm afraid Israel is going to have to be the one to stop the rockets, and hopefully in the process eliminate the Hamas scum as well.

The real terrorists are the Israelis, not Hamas

Really? Because pretty much the entire civilized world recognizes Hamas as a terrorist organization. And their history of suicide bombings and rocket attacks targeting civilians pretty much bears this out. Thank goodness there are still countries with cajones to confront Islamic terrorism.

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SezWho2,

I'm not sure where the reason that Gaza does not have control over its air and sea borders was discussed and answered truthfully. However, I don't see that answer on this thread.

Yes, you are correct. Both about some of the reasons for why Gaza does not have control of its borders and the fact that all of the reasons have not been mentioned on this thread. However, they have been mentioned in the many threads before this one and Sabiwabi has read them. He just chooses to ignore them or to not believe them.

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Oh my! So they make an agreement whereby Israel (and to some extent Egypt) controls Gaza's borders. And then Israel uses that to basically make life miserable for the Gazans.

"Oh my!" Right back at you! They made an agreement with the Palestinians and the Palestinians were not able to control extremists along the border. That is the reason BOTH Egypt and Israel closed their borders. That is one of the reasons those borders remained closed now. NEITHER Egypt nor Israel want Hamas in charge of the borders of Gaza.

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Nippon5,

You stated "your calling out a whole race." When have I done that?

Above I used "scum" twice: "They even prevent fishing, attack ships bringing humanitarian aid, and attack UN humanitarian aid delivered by trucks. In other words, they are scum!" und "Those committing this genocide are scum" Indeed those who do such things are scum. If you think its reasonable to attack humanitarian aid or to carry out a genocide, please explain. And why would you resort to change the context of my posts, why such deception? Kinniku, is that you?

And when you have a so-called democracy, the people are also responsible for their leader's actions. Americans are also responsible for Bush's actions.

Hamas isnt a country, it isnt a n ethnic group, it isnt even a goverment, it is a terrorist group, and therefore it cant be genocide.

Not paying attention are you? Israel is killing Palestinian civilians. Yes some are Hamas, but most are not. Who would be deceptive enough to say that I was referring to the genocide of Hamas?

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Never done that. And unless you can back it up

Heh, it is easy to back up. During Christmas (of all days) you sought to blame the Jews for the death of Jesus. How can you expect people to take anything you say seriously about the Israeli/Palestinian conflict when you take great efforts to attempt to blame Jews for everything from killing Jesus to controlling Western countries and media?

The only hope for the Middle East and for the Israelis and Palestinians (especially Gazans now) is for moderates to take the day and find middle ground. There are certainly enough people on the extremes of both sides to keep the fight up if allowed to do so. People need to support moderates both in the Israeli and Palestinian communities and invest in businesses owned by moderates on both sides.

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The important words to notice here are "Israeli military said". They have been confirmed to be liars countless times.

Considering how you play hard and fast with the truth, I do not think you are the best judge of what a 'liar' is. However, both sides have moved the lines of reality at times.

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SezWho2,

I think that the reason that Gaza does not have control over its air and sea borders is that Gaza is not a country, nor is Palestine a country. I don't think that Gaza ever will have this control unless either it or Palestine is a country (which will not happen until the territorial issue is determined) or until the stateless land is subsumed into some other country (which cannot happen until other such other country candidates find a way to palliate the Palestinian sense of outrage).

I thought I would add, while what you have written is certainly part of the reason, it should be pointed out again that the Palestinian Authority was given control over the Rafah border in 2005. Plans were in the works for negotiations about expanding this control. Unfortunately, the PA was not able to control extremists along the border. This is another reason for Gazan not controlling their borders.

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Have the whole of Gaza moved to the West bank. Easier to stay more secure that way. Then the Israelis can turn Gaza into another successful green spot in the desert.

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Israel uses that to basically make life miserable for the Gazans.

The "Palestinians" create their own misery. Did they expect peace to break out when they voted in an Islamic terrorist group to run their country?

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Israel is killing Palestinian civilians. Yes some are Hamas, but most are not.

What are you basing this estimate on? How do you know how many are members of Hamas?

And why would you resort to change the context of my posts, why such deception? Kinniku, is that you?

Why are you bringing up my name in your discussions with others? If you are writing to others, write to them. If you want to have an exchange with me, have an exchange with me. In addition, I challenge you to point out an example of my changing the context of your posts. I have merely quoted your posts in the past.

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Hamas use of women and children as shields should shame anyone still in support of their lost cause. From this article is another abominable tactic Iran has trained them in, which is also in defiance of any accepted rules of engagement Israel and its Western allies observe:

"Gabi Ashkenazi, chief of staff of the Israeli military, said Hamas militants also have put on Israeli military uniforms to try to approach troops and carry out suicide bombings."

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sabi, you've been going on this air space bit for a while today. Let me ask you, would all things possible to prevent your enemy from having access to weapons(take the Hamas and Israelis out of the equation for a moment), have their allies come and help them, as well as do you best to dismantle them by preventing them from fishing.

Besides, I can see why air space would even be an issue at this point, unless they have planes and according to you, they don't. What's you point on this air space?

Hamas militants also have put on Israeli military uniforms to try to approach troops and carry out suicide bombings."" Again, take your side out of the equation, if they did this, that's a good idea, and it probably works.

Did they expect peace to break out when they voted in an Islamic terrorist group to run their country?" Solid point. That goes back to the US elections, as if McCain were to be voted in, we would be having the same problems with the left saying the same thing "What did you expect, you voted in Bush #2."

I think Egypt should open their borders, the area in question was once their land and they are also responsible for pushing many Palestinians (what ever they were called then) into the place.

Hamas is an enemy of Israel, I can't see why Israel should play into their wants and desires. (again, without taking sides, ask yourself the same question).

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if sabi was truthful he would tell you that Israel embargo prevented Hamas from obtaining weaponry that would have killed a larger number of Jewish women and children.

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vor, I am asking for an unbiased answer. Hamas' whole reason for even coming into existence was for the destruction of Israel. Now, once and if they do, what happens, everyone just lives happily ever after?

Also to note, I don't understand why the other Arab countries have gotten a passing grade on the plight of the Palestinians, especially Gaza. They haven't been the innocent spectators on the sidelines.

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Everyone seems to be focussing on the recent events, but the conflict in this region has been going on since before that fellow was nailed up on a cross two-thousand years ago and it's likely they will continue to attack each other for another two-thousand years unless one of them actually succeeds in wiping out the other, which just will not happen. As bad as it sounds, but the rest of the world should just butt out and let them wipe each other out.

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Helter: Anyone who has been posting on this site for even a month already knows full well that you blame all of the world's problems on Islam; we got it already! In this case, though, while religion may play a part it is not limited to religion alone, and is by far more of a land issue than anything else. The differences in religion allow for hostilities to be direct at the 'other' group more easily, but again.

skip: "Also to note, I don't understand why the other Arab countries have gotten a passing grade on the plight of the Palestinians, especially Gaza. They haven't been the innocent spectators on the sidelines."

Plenty of people on here have also criticized Egypt and Jordan, etc., but remember that in the case of the former in particular, they are a very active part of the peace process, and are calling on Israel to cease fire. That's not really being just a 'spectator', despite not joining in the aggression of either side.

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skip, good luck getting an unbiased answer from sabi. i hope you are not holding your breath.

jordan would be the only arab country that deserves some credit for incorporating the Palestinians into their society but its still a far cry from the democratic freedoms the Palastinians living in Israel enjoy. Jordan was ceded 80% of the Palestine Mandate prior to Israel obtaining its small and barren slither. Its a shame the Arabs attacked Israel immediately after Jews were provided an enclave from continual persecution and attempts to eradicate them from the planet. This shameful war against Israel is a crime against humanity and the international community is largely to blame for not standing up once again to hate mongers and anti Semites.

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"Palestinian fighters who are responding with RPGs"

If the Palestinian fighters would respond with white flags, the killing would stop.

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does Israel realy wants peace or do they want lebensraum?

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VOR

This shameful war against Israel is a crime against humanity and the international community is largely to blame for not standing up once again to hate mongers and anti Semites.

It is a shameful war VOR. I'm hearing about children and women dieing everyday.

I don't hate Jews. I don't hate anybody. But I've been the little guy on the block most of my life, and I know what it's like being pushed around.

For me I see where Gaza has been kicked in the teeth numerous times and pushed around by the big guy. Yes I know we disagree, we always will.

I hope they get an agreement. And I pray for peace from both sides. < :-)

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VOR

Jordan was ceded 80% of the Palestine Mandate

If that is the case, then what is the difference between a Jordanian and a Palestinian – language, culture, religion, etc.? Why is right of return perceived as an Israeli / Palestinian issue, and not a Jordanian issue? (An honest question form an ignorant person.)

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what does Israel stand to gain through the aquisition of the west bank or gaza? Israel is motivated by security. They are surrounded by hostile stats that have either already attacked them or working very hard behind the scenes to destroy them by proxy. If anybody is practicing lebensraum, it would be Iran and Syria and the Isalmic Brotherhood.

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does Israel realy wants peace or do they want lebensraum?

Considering how much lebensraum Israel has handed over in the past 30 years or so. I would suggest they're looking for peace.

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TJrandom - You do understand, that the so called "right of return" is nothing more then a cover for the destruction of Israel. Allowing more then a million people, who apart from having ancestors that lived in Israel back when it was originally created, and who hate Israel and Jews, to take back their ancestors lands would result in nothing else. It would also result in real genocide, with hundreds of thousands dead. To put it simply, it is a very, very bad idea.

Jordan, Egypt, and Syria need to simply acknowledge the so-called Palestinians in their territory as citizens, and allow them out of the refugee camps they have been stuck in for the past 60 years.

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Molenir

Is that all there is to it? Is there no difference between the Palestinians in the camps and the rest of the population - save the fact that they are in the camps? Could they be integrated into the Jordan, Egypt, Syrian societies without the same level of bloodshed you predict would happen if allowed ancestrial return rights?

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no thats not it. The Palestinians never secured their own national borders. They are made up of multiple ethnic groups that sort of drifted around the region and treated as second class citizens in Arab countries. The fight is not over land. The fight is over the destruction of Israel. The Palestinians are proxies to the war and once again suffering at the hands of their arab brothers.

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democratic freedoms the Palastinians living in Israel enjoy." True, but as of today, to my dismay, yet to my delight, political parties based on Islamic laws have been banned from elections. I say to my delight that at least one religion is out of the democratic process, just a few more to go...

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i agree. once a country agrees on a constitution that protects the rights of all people, religion should be a non factor in the governing of the people.

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They are made up of multiple ethnic groups that sort of drifted around the region and treated as second class citizens in Arab countries. The fight is not over land.

"Sort of drifted"? Were driven from their land by Israeli irregulars and terrorists more like. The politics of the Israeli/Palestinian conflict may have festered - but it is most definitely over the land.

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Israel’s bombardment of Gaza is not self-defence – it’s a war crime For 18 months Israel had imposed an unlawful blockade on the coastal strip that brought Gazan society to the brink of collapse. In the three years after Israel’s redeployment from Gaza, 11 Israelis were killed by rocket fire. And yet in 2005-8, according to the UN, the Israeli army killed about 1,250 Palestinians in Gaza, including 222 children. Throughout this time the Gaza Strip remained occupied territory under international law because Israel maintained effective control over it.

Israel’s actions amount to aggression, not self-defence, not least because its assault on Gaza was unnecessary. Israel could have agreed to renew the truce with Hamas. Instead it killed 225 Palestinians on the first day of its attack. As things stand, its invasion and bombardment of Gaza amounts to collective punishment of Gaza’s 1.5m inhabitants contrary to international humanitarian and human rights law.

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It is Israel with US who voted against a peace deal.Rice wanted to vote in favour of the peace deal but Olmert made sure Rice would not in favour of the peace deal. According to Olmert.

He [Bush] gave an order to the secretary of state and she did not vote in favour of it, a resolution she cooked up, phrased, organised and manoeuvred for"

When Olmert found out that RIce was going to vote in favour of a peace deal that she had made together with others, Olmert called Bush and demanded Rice not to vote in favour of the peace deal and Bush then changed his stance and followed Olmert orders.

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Israel’s bombardment of Gaza is not self-defence

Not so sure. If I were throwing stones across the street at a police station, I believe that they would take action. Self-defence, or by any other name - if I kept it up long enough, I suspect that I would pay a heavy price.

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if sabi was truthful he would tell you that Israel embargo prevented Hamas from obtaining weaponry that would have killed a larger number of Jewish women and children.

Any group that imprisons over a million poor people under such terrible conditions deserves to be attacked.

The rockets would stop the moment Palestinians are treated like human beings and Israel respects international law and UN resolutions. But Israel has NEVER done so and they clearly have no intentions on ever doing so. This conflict will only end when the international community will force Israel to behave.

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deserves to be attacked

And then of course, since attacked - is righteous in counter-attacking? Or was it - in using self-defense?

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once a country agrees on a constitution that protects the rights of all people, religion should be a non factor in the governing of the people.

Indeed, but Israeli citizens do NOT have equal rights. Israel is a judeo-supremacist society, a comment that tends to cause a post to be deleted despite being very true.

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In a speech late on Monday, Olmert said Condoleezza Rice, the US secretary of state, was left "pretty shamed" at the vote and had to abstain on a resolution she had helped arrange.

Sean McCormack, a US state department spokesmen, who was with Rice at the UN last week during debate on the security council resolution, went further and said the remarks were "just 100 per cent, totally, completely untrue".

McCormack said that Washington had no plans to seek clarification from Israel.

First US wanted to vote in favour of a peace deal and were sure not to seek any clarification from Israel but a telephone call from Olmert to Bush changed Rice's stance who felt ASHAMED that she could not vote in favour of a peace deal she had made.

This just illustartes what enormous power Israel has over US. Many political leaders have boasted about how Jews control US and that Americans were well aware of this.

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The Egyptian brokered cease fire agreement which now have collapsed stated that Israel had to open up the borders on conditions that militants did not fire home made projectiles. THe militants did not fire a single shot yet Israel did not open up the borders. Now by the looks of things it seems as if Israel had already planned this Holocaust which is the word the Israeli politicians have used for this latest onslaught already 6 months ago, and the starving of the Palestinian people was phase 1 in this onslaught. It is easier to fight an enemy who is starved and tired.

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sabi keep ignoring Hamas charter to destroy Israel. you probably can afford to because your life is not on the line. Its the ordinary Palestinian that must decide whether its better to allow themselves to be treated as pawns in the destruction of Israel, or choose a better life consisting of peace with the Israelis.

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if somebody on the other side was really honest or had the least bit of concern for the ordinary Palistinians they would then have to think what would happen to ordinary palistinians that did seek peace with Israel to understand who the ordinary Palistinian needs to fear. Yes thats right brothers, Hamas. Hamas has been killing ordinary palistinians the entire time and yet you only find it a problems when Palistinians die when Israel is protecting itself. I guess its okay when the Palistinians are brutally murdered by their own (supposed) elected government.

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@Vor

or choose a better life consisting of peace with the Israelis.

Dang! Those Israeli's have just wiped out my family...guess we're better make peace with the Israelis!

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The destruction of Israel which the right winged people like to repeat over and over" I am sorry, I have to laugh. Again, we have a left leaning person dogging right wingers, yet he supports a right wing revolutionary such as Hamas. They are devout followers of the most right wing anti everything religion.

The left supports the right.. amazing.

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Hamas have been smashed. I predicted all of this! Time for the president of Gaza to choose life! Get the t-shirt, get a new flag while you're at it. That's what I say.

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extrtynt, I think you missed my point. I said I find it laughable that left wingers are calling anyone who supports Israel as a country as right wingers and throw their support behind Hamas, which use Islamic doctrine and are for the most part, Muslim and thus it should the last group they throw their support to. Read smitty's posts, he's left but makes a sensible post without the name calling.

Look, many can tell you, I am very anti-religous and whether you agree or disagree, I find Islam to be the biggest violator of rights for people than the others, which is one reason why I kind of support Israel as far as existence goes and the issue over the borders.

Let me try to be clear, if Hamas dropped Islam in favor of No Religious Parties, I would probably throw my support behind them, even cash.

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The real reason for why Israel labels Hamas a terrorist organization is because then israel does not need to negotiate with Hamas. Once they do start negotiating Israel will have to pull it's settlements from the Occupied Territories. So it is convinient for Israel to label Hamas a terror organization. Hamas was democratically voted in to power by the people of Palestine in a country occupied by Israel who Americans like to boast The Only Democracy in the Middle East while boycotting the Palestinian election results.

There is very little logic in this conflict. US votes against a peace deal they were the architects of and Hamas also is against a peace deal because the peace deal does not include them. And Israel telles US not to vote in favour of a peace deal.

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What are the objectives of this war from Israeli side?

Israel can test new weapons Israel wants to put an end to the rocket attacks There are elections in israel and an onslught on the Palestinians can boost votes in the elections.

Hamas.

It wants open borders It wants to tell a messae to israel that Israel cannot have security unless it stops the blockade

Israel can very well perhaps put an end to the Hamas rule in gaza but I doubt Fatah would then be willing take over Gaza in an Israeli supported coup so I think Hamas will still be ruling Gaza when this conflict is over.

So the situation comes down to who wil control the borders. I think thats where the conflict is at now.

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extratynt: Egypt is not sealing the borders it is Israel.

Israel is not sealing Egypt's borders, Egypt is. And it's because they want nothing to do with Hamas.

northlondon: (Hamas has so far rejected any international monitors Why?) Probably for the same reason that all foreign journalists have been banned from entering Gaza by the Israelis. There, does that answer your question for you ?

No. Can you be more specific?

sabiwabi: Would these be the same international monitors that branded Hamas a terrorist organization?

Well everyone has branded Hamas a terrorist organization except for Iran and Syria. And they're the two countries supplying Hamas. But the point remains that there needs to be some kind of system in check to make sure a cease fire isn't just a break before a larger offensive by Hamas. That wouldn't help anyone.

sabiwabi: They even prevent fishing, attack ships bringing humanitarian aid, and attack UN humanitarian aid delivered by trucks.

Sorry, I don't know anything about fishing. But I do know that Israel instituted a blockade and stopped a total of one ship whereas others were allowed to get through. Israel has been accused of firing on a UN vehicle, but even the UN rep said he didn't believe it was intentional. If you want to see attacks on humanitarian aid then you should look at Hamas. They attacked the fuel depot in Israel that supplies fuel to Palestine (scratching head), tried to organize a suicide bombing against Israeli doctors who give free medical care to Palestinians (scratching head), etc. The list is substantial.

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sezwho: The issue is not rockets.

The issue is rockets.

Helter_Skelter: Did they expect peace to break out when they voted in an Islamic terrorist group to run their country?

My guess is they expected revenge. But not the costs of it.

extratynt: In the three years after Israel’s redeployment from Gaza, 11 Israelis were killed by rocket fire. And yet in 2005-8, according to the UN, the Israeli army killed about 1,250 Palestinians in Gaza, including 222 children.

Yet they still continue the senseless and counterproductive attacks against Israel. If anyone needs a lesson about the numbers, it's Hamas. I'm betting if Hamas had chosen a different avenue then Palestine would have 225 more children alive today. But the don't.

sabiwabi: Any group that imprisons over a million poor people under such terrible conditions deserves to be attacked.

I think what you're trying to say is that Palestine should have the right to attack without consequence and response from Israel, isn't it? My guess is that part you don't agree with is the response to the attacks.

extratynt: Hamas agrees to make a state according to 1967 borders.

No one believes that. It's propaganda.

extratynt: The real reason for why Israel labels Hamas a terrorist organization is because then israel does not need to negotiate with Hamas.

Then what's the reason why the US, Europe, Russia, and just about everyone else labels Hamas as a terrorist organization? Why do their own Arab nations seal the borders from Hamas?

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Superlib.

If we are to get technical, technically speaking it is Israel because Gaza is under an Israeli occupation and not Egyptian.

Also Israel have been bombarding the Egyptian Gaza borders. Anyway you are right to a certain extent. First you have to remember that the non democratic government of Eqypt does not represent the people of Egypt. Egypt is run by a dictator. US pay the government of Egypt 2 billion dollars a year in order for Egypt to hold diplomatic ties with Israel. Egypt also doesn't want to get nuked by the Israelis for keeping the borders open. And Egypt does not like Hamas because Hamas is branch of the Muslim Brotherhood who have lots of popularity in Egypt. If there were to be held elections in Egypt the chances of them winning is high. The military rulers of Egypt fear Hamas and other offshoots of the Muslim Brotherhood that remains an influence in Egypt as alternatives to current regimes.

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Hamas accepts an israel according to 1967 borders.

Only as part of the phase for the elimination of Israel.

They're quite clear on that point.

http://jp.youtube.com/watch?v=OEXQHqXmCRg

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Superlib.

Hamas has said that they are willing to make a state of 67 borders.

US has also voted in favour of an Israeli retreat to the 67 borders. Infact every country in the world including US and also Hamas agrees to the plan that israel retreats to the 67 borders.

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Egypt is well paid to keep it's border closed. I'm sure enough of the billions the US sends to Egypt finds its way into the right pockets to make sure the border stays closed.

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extratynt:

Hamas agrees to make a state according to 1967 borders. At this point, Hamas is still firing missiles into Israel. A good starting point for peace with your neighbour would be to stop firing missiles into his town, I would say.

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The peace agreement which was brokered by Egypt 6 months ago was that Israel kept the borders open and the Palestinians stopped firing rockets. That was the deal and it was Israel who violated this agreement by keeping the borders closed. Therefore Hamas fired rockets and in return Israel started an onslaught and have so far committed war crimes and should be held responsible for their crimes.

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@skipthesong

when the us bombed both Germany and Japan, I am sure most shuttered at the thought that innocent children would get killed, but after all, the Nazis and Tojo were voted in so all anyone could do to win the war was to do what they did. The same is here with Hamas.

Your comparison is not valid:

Germany and Japan were hit by mass bombing raids with primitive bombs. Civilian casualties were to be expected even on those missions that only targeted industry.

Israel has access to the most modern weapons - Laser and GPS Guided Bombs, Advanced Missiles, Tanks and Artillery that have access to highly accurate satellite maps of their targets. Still they hit schools and houses packed with refugees. Most telling: they use their most advanced weapons not to avoid civilians - but destroy people's homes.

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Look, I do not blame Israel 100% and Hamas 0%. I think both should share the blame but when it comes to being fair and all I think Israel is the one to be blamed more than Hamas. Israel have now been using WP and DU. on a civilian population, bombing schools, apartments. When I see pictures of destroyed Palestinian homes and images of dead Palestinians, I am not smiling.

Israel has the state of the art weaponry and Hamas just a bunch of home mdae rockets. This is not a war against countries and armies. This is more like a prison riot. Israel should try the path of peace and dialogue and not oppression which has resulted in nothing but wars and conflcits for decades.

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Right, but Israel did not than keep the borders closed. They bombed Gaza. Yeah, yeah, they bombed tunnels. Tunnels was how the people of Gaza got basic necessities because of the closed borders. Also Hamas offered a cease-fire in mid-December and Israel refused. uses This is not about rockets but internal politics and Israel seizing more territory for itself.

To date ten Israeli soldiers, including at least one officer, have refused to be deployed to Gaza because of Israel's slaughter of innocent lives. They will at least get 14 days in the brig for this.

These brave soldiers know more about Hamas rockets than the posters supporting Israel's genocide in Gaza. They also happen to know first hand what their government is doing. It is the moral conscience of Jewish Israelis like this who are the best argument for Israel's right to exist, not the war makers.

I hope the posters supporting Israel's murders in Gaza are enjoying themselves as the number of Palestinian dead and wounded rise. Next time these creeps see bleeding Palestinian children let them remember that in no small way are they helping to make this happen through their support.

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First sentence should read; "Right but Israel did more than keep the borders closed."

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Bah, what is all the shrieking about?

Hamas, and the Palestinians, hate the state of Israel and would like to see it destroyed.

Israel on the other hand hate the Palestinians.

It's a 60 year stalemate. The only way I see an end to the conflict is both sides wiping each other out.

Heh, but it's still amusing to see the radical left bleating about "genocide".

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SuperLib,

The issue is rockets.

'Tis not. That's your issue. Not the issue.

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The object here seems to be to find any way possible to hold Israel responsible no matter what. Some have worked so hard towards this end that they are now sound like Hamas supports, though I know they are not.

Face simple facts, for what ever reason Hamas wanted this confrontation & worked very hard to bring it about. The blood you are all so upset about seeing on your TVs was blood that Hamas knew you would see & be upset by seeing. They callously planned for your gullibility, they knowing sacrificed their own children (& inflated the numbers) to get your attention & they are the people that Israel has to deal with. Yet you all want Israel to sit down at a table & talk terms for peace with these people! Get real, Hamas do not want peace with Israel, they never have wanted & never will want it. Allowing Hamas to “win” now because of international pressure on Israel will see the beginning of the end, not just in Israel but also in all the neighbouring states. The cancer that is radical Islam will spread & your gullibility will have helped feed it. There is such a thing as pure evil & Hamas is it & it needs to be expunged from the world, leave Israel to get on with it, most of the Arab world is.

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@grafton

They callously planned for your gullibility, they knowing sacrificed their own children (& inflated the numbers)

The Israeli forces were the ones doing the bombing and shooting of Palestinian children - not Hamas. As for number inflation - if the Israelis allowed journalists into Gaza then we could have confirmation. For some reason the Israelis don't...

Every innocent killed (in Gaza and Israel) will just make resolving the conflict harder.

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Egypt has more right to that place than do the Palestinians

I have no idea why this concept is hard to grasp: The only people who have a right to a land is the people who live there.

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The aim of Israel is probably a regime change by toppling the elected government or pressuring Hamas into raising white flags and accepting Israeli occupation conditions. But the problem here will be who will fill up the vaccum in Gaza? Fatah will not be interested in governing Gaza after an Israeli lead coup. So if Israel’s goal is to topple the Hamas government their aim seems to be short sighted. Hamas aim is to stop the blockade. Though Israel is much stronger due to the humble demands from Hamas politically they have a good chance of winning this conflict as all conflicts end with a political solution. Egypt hold the keys to a cease fire. They can say they will control the borders and turn a blind eye to whatever Palestinian smuggle. Hamas agrees to stop firing rockets in return Hamas gets open borders.

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extratynt: If we are to get technical, technically speaking it is Israel because Gaza is under an Israeli occupation and not Egyptian.

I'm not sure how that makes any sense. Most of what I've read says Egypt closed the border because they don't want Hamas or their supporters coming into their country.

extratynt: Hamas has said that they are willing to make a state of 67 borders.

Hamas wants nothing less than the destruction of Israel, period. Personally, I think the 67 borders are a good idea and I support that. I don't think Israel is necessarily obligated to return to the borders since they acquired them as a result of the Arab invasions. But I think it's a good concession to make and it will help to achieve peace and if that's what they really want then that's what it's going to take.

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proxy: Egypt is well paid to keep it's border closed.

This is entirely made up.

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Starviking: The Israeli forces were the ones doing the bombing and shooting of Palestinian children - not Hamas.

You don't know much about Hamas.

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sezwho: 'Tis not. That's your issue. Not the issue.

Since you're a Palestinian supporter I can understand why you'd want to remove rockets from the discussion. But it will be an uphill battle for you, in my opinion.

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Superlib. You need to come to terms with obvious facts. Every country in the world voted for Israel to retreat to 67 borders including US in the UN resolution 242 which was adopted by the UN SC. Therefore according to international law, every single new settlement built in the occupied territories is illeagal according to international law.

Hamas backs a 67 borders and Hamas emphasizes the Right Of Return needs to be discussed. Though the Right Of Return is an international right according to international law which also USA voted in favour of Israel will not accept this.

The biggest irony here is US. US tried to come with a peace agreement but then were told by Israel not to vote for the peace agreement that they had made, the vote in favour of UN resolution 242 and the Right Of Return.

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SuperLib: "Since you're a Palestinian supporter I can understand why you'd want to remove rockets from the discussion. But it will be an uphill battle for you, in my opinion."

No offense, bud, but according to people such as yourself it's been about the rockets for ages now, and not a wee bit has changed. What's more, not a single one of you has been able to come up with a single counter-argument to the growing calls for Israel lightening up except the tired old, "Since you are a Palestinian supporter..." argument.

Calling Israel up on its excessive force does not mean anyone supports Hamas. The innocent Palestinians dying in all this? nope, doesn't mean they support them either, though anyone who DOESN'T feel for their plight is simply heartless and lacking in dignity to begin with. But back to my point.

I don't like what Israel is doing DOES NOT = I like what Hamas is doing.

Those formulas never work, my friend.

To believe it's about one single thing and nothing else is folly at its worst. This is about Israel's overreaction TO Hamas militants firing rockets to Israel taking their land, etc. It's a chicken and egg conundrum that no single person is 'right' about. As such, BOTH parties need to admit their wrong doing, all fighting needs to cease (not only rockets!), and they need to TALK!

STOP pulling the 'they'll talk when the rockets stop' crap because they won't be able to talk if Israel is still on the attack.

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extratynt: Hamas backs a 67 borders and Hamas emphasizes the Right Of Return needs to be discussed. Though the Right Of Return is an international right according to international law which also USA voted in favour of Israel will not accept this.

Was that the catch? The right of return? Honestly, when people tell me Hamas supports peace or an Israeli state or anything related to Israel not being eliminated I know there's a catch. In the past I'd check the articles and find the catch myself, but now I don't even bother.

But like I said I support the 67 borders. Israel is just going to have to accept it.

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It is a complicated issue and conflict. There is an another catch. Say if Israel accepts 67 borders but not Right Of Return then still in a few decades the Palestinians will become the majority within israel proper due to a higher birth rate. Israel is sitting on a ticking time bomb. From Israel perspective there are 3 options.

Israel can maintain the status quo. Go back to 67 borders Merge Israel with Palestine.

I wish to see israel try something else than their current approach which is leading to violence and wars but do not think Israel will change their stance. In the end I think Israel will defeat itself.

Hamas is stupid for using the home made rockets which hardly do any damage what so ever and keep using the rockets as some kind of symbol. But Israel is also wrong for the blockade.

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smithinjapan..... Hamas and the other militants refuse to stop rocket attacks. That means Israel must go in and take out the rockets. The rockets are in populated areas by design. That means taking out the rockets will inflict civilian casualties. That's Hamas' insurance policy. Their bet is that the international community will make Israel stop before they've taken out Hamas' ability to strike. And once Israel stops, Hamas will simply build back up their capabilities and strike again, but next time it will be with even more powerful weapons. Then imagine where we'll be.

Do you think Israel has a right to take military action against Hamas if Hamas refuses to stop attacking? You can say yes but not agree with the response Israel has given to date. But if you agree that a military response is on the table and don't agree with the one Israel is currently using, then can you please tell me exactly how they should "attack better?" Can you give examples with numbers or data or weapons or operations that they should use that would change the civilian reality on the ground?

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[if the Israelis allowed journalists into Gaza then we could have confirmation. For some reason the Israelis don't..].... Gee maybe it's so that none of them end up as casualties themselves so they can report on how bad and inhumane the Israelis are. Bet you never thought of that one but have some conspiracy in your mind. Other posters can't see that it's Hamas that bring this on to win the "world sympathy factor" for their plight. They are getting off on making themselves the victim. Apparently according to ultra left wing liberals, it's ok to fire rockets into another's borders. We can ignore any damage and death they do because they are so random. When you poke at a snake it will bite you. And the liberals will feel sorry for the poker and not the pokee.

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So the non stop genocide by the Isaraeli's continues.

Strewth, what do they want, 10,000 dead? Most probably innit. All they is doing is getting hated more and more bacuase of these murders. Gaza is full of dead and injured everywhere, i saw it on bbc ,

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Oooh, this is terrible, it'sascandal i tell you, a scandal.

I saw on the telly the these awful Israeli killings. Don't the horrid Isareli's understand they are making more hatred an dmore people will be suicide bommbers. God, the Israeli's are fools to themselves, so terribly beastly, murder and carnage!

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Dear Alf,

Being a British comedy actor really doesn’t give you a great deal of credibility when it comes to making sound judgements on international issues. Also the fact that you seem not to realise that Mr.Garnett’s real name is not Warren Mitchell, it’s Warren Misell & he was Jewish. Were he alive today he might take issue with you for using his name (along with many other British TV characters) to make unfunny remarks that have little to say about the insane but necessary conflict that is taking place in Gasa today. If you have any valid & intelligent comment to make do you really need to hide behind so many names? You are almost as bad as that extremist that hides behind a number to post Hamas propaganda. The issue is serious, deal with it as such.

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grafton: Warren Mitchell is alive and well mate!!

I Know what i is talking about. The Isareli's are thugs and my point is as valid or even more valid than the next person, as i witnessed this Israeli problem from decades ago. Strewth, you should show some mannner to your elders. The Jews are even being targetted in Europe and graveyards have been vandalised, all because the Israeli government continues with its genocide unabaitted.

Send in Nato, and stop the deaths, it asout of order innit!

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Also grafton, Warren Mitchell describes himself as an atheist and has openly criticised many recent Israeli governments for their heavy handed security approaches. See i just learned you somethink.

The BBC reckon the death toll could top 2,000 within a week. Strewth, this is a scandal innit! Seeing all the kids and women dead and dying brings a lump to your throat. Let's intervene, get decent countries to sort the Israelis out and bring real peace to the region. Let'S send Tommy down there and let Israel fight a proper army, they won't seem so tough then.

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extratynt at 03:02 AM JST - 15th January

I have an idea for you that might even make sense to you. Why don’t all the people of the world call the place they were born their home. In this way the “Zionist Jews” you talk of could all go back to where they came from, that would make you happy would it not?

You might however find that you have a little problem with the Palestinians given that few of them were born in what is today Israel, though a great many Israelis (Jewish Israelis) were, as were their parents & possibly even their grandparents too.

I will simplify it for you, Israel is a fully functional country & has been for 60 years, & that would make it a little difficult sending it’s people some place else simply because of their religion. Hamas seems to be making the same misjudgement that you are making. They too think it would be a nice idea to gain peace by removing the entire Jewish population of what is now Israel, though of course they would not use the name “Israel”.

Hamas started a war as a public relations exercise, they wanted the weak stomached gullible of the world to see the blood of their children on TV & turn against the Israelis. Not a hard thing to do with a left leaning Western media that always had a trace of anti-Semitism running at the back of it’s reporting on Israel. Haven’t you ever noticed that we always get to know the names of the suicide bombers but never the names of the victims? They are always just X number dead.

Can we all also be clear on one important point, Hamas are Palestinians, and they didn’t arrive from some other place else. They are Palestinians that joined the Hamas gang rather than the Palestinian Authority gang. They are Islamic crazies in the same style as the Taliban & they are not just using other Palestinians to hide behind, they are hiding behind their own wives, mothers, children, their own families. They want to eradicate Israel & create an extremist Islamic state on the pre-1948 lands the British occupied. Nobody in the Arab world wants this (Iran is not an Arab state). All the Arab counties know the dangers Hamas represents to the whole region & want Israel to remove this Islamic cancer that is growing in Gasa. If Hamas succeeds in its insane objective they will destabilize the whole Middle-East. No sane person wants that.

Do what the Arabs are doing; leave Israel to finish what they have started.

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grafton, "leave Israel to finsih what they have started". What you mean murdering women and kids. Committing genocide and destroying the infrastructure of Gaza, shame on you.

The Israeli's will see what goes around comes around. They are a rogue state who ignore countless UN resolutions and these further murders are looked on in disgust be all decent people. Only a madman or a sadist would approve of the Israeli attacks.

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Fighting rages in Gaza as death toll nears 1,000

Maybe Hamas should stop the rocket attacks now ...

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shiuu: More anti the poor guy , this time arabs, usually you pick on helpless homeless people.

Yeah, blame Hamas, have they killed 1,000 Jews, do they bloackde Israel and control the ports the airspace and borders. Think about it mate before you blindly support the bully boys with the bigger toys (weapons).

Israel is an international disgrace. All thos ewho say where is teh arab condemnation, well there is a lot, but tehy don't want to be next on Israels death list.

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Wonder why Israel is attacking Gaza? what is the reason? fun and profit maybe? Come on where is the conspiracy the ultra left can dream up?

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SuperLib,

Since you're a Palestinian supporter I can understand why you'd want to remove rockets from the discussion. But it will be an uphill battle for you, in my opinion.

Now you're making stuff up.

First, I am both a supporter of Israel and of Palestine on an issue-by-issue basis. I support Israel's right to exist and Israel's right to defend itself. I also support the creation of a Palestinian state. To simply say that I am a Palestinian supporter rather creates something of a straw man for your continued fulmination.

Second, I have never said that I want to remove rockets from the discussion. What I have said is that the rockets are not "the" issue. As I understand your position, you say that rockets must cease before a solution can be worked out. My position is that this is not a necessary condition for finding a solution.

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Over 1000 death and 4500 wounded.

Talk about overkill.

Think that this spanking, well beating the crap out of, is gpoing to help end attacks from Gaza. Ple-e-ease.

This will only make things worse. And agreement worked out between internation parties might help, but to think that Israel and Gaza will/should work this out between themselves is assinine. < :-)

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My position is that this is not a necessary condition for finding a solution.

In point of fact, it is the only condition necessary. If the rockets stop, so does Israel. To extend it further, if the weapon smuggling stops, the borders reopen. Its a zero-sum game here, and its really up to Hamas and the Palestinians whether or not they want to die like rats, hiding behind the skirts of their women and children, or live like men and seek peace. They stop, everything improves. Not hard to understand.

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Over 1000 death and 4500 wounded. Talk about overkill.

And all because Hamas insists that it has the absolute right to fire rockets into Israel, and murder Jews. Sad really.

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Molenir at 06:22 AM JST - 15th January

"Sad really."

Not sad, insane.

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Molenir, do you think that this military action is going to stop it? < :-)

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One way or another, the rockets will stop. Perhaps not entirely, but they won't be firing off 80 rockets a day like they were doing prior to Israels finally deciding to retaliate. It would take serious casualties among the Israelis, for their public support for this war to drop. Which means the war will likely continue until Hamas agrees to a real cease fire. Something that according to the latest news, it sounds like they're getting close to.

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Molenir,

I must have missed this. When did Hamas insist it had the absolute right to do this?

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I guess you must have. I thought it was obvious what with their constant proclamations, and the continuous firing of rockets over the past 8 years. Maybe you just weren't paying attention?

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Molenir is another Israelophile who cannot see any wrong in any action they do.

Luckily most of the world are like me and can look at these events impartially. After seeing all the facts, it is plain Israel is attempted to eradicate the arab presence in Gaza and does not care about the human cost.

Luckily the decent peolpe in the world seem to see the genocide in the manner i do, the only folks on Israels side are some Jews and a handfull of American extremist nutcases.

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The only people to not care a bit about a country that is constantly under harassment by a known terrorist organization are dope smoking hippie wannabes and ultra left wing conspiracy theory believing liberals.

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@Molenir

Perhaps not entirely, but they won't be firing off 80 rockets a day like they were doing prior to Israels finally deciding to retaliate.

80 a day prior to the invasion? Got a reference for that?

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@thenewfront

it is plain Israel is attempted to eradicate the arab presence in Gaza and does not care about the human cost.

If this is the case - they have a very poor army. No larger than Gaza is, eradication would not take more than a few days. It seems to me that they are in deep restraint.

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The 80 per day reference is actually for just after the fighting started, would take me more time then I have to find a chart detailing the number of rockets fired/per day prior to the conflict. Sorry, I shouldn't even be on here now. Too much work to do.

Thenewfront - Unlike those who cannot see any wrong done by Hamas, I can look and see what Israel is doing as wrong. The difference is, I look at the larger picture, and realize that they are responding in a manner that is completely and totally justified. Rockets are fired unrelentingly, despite pleas, despite warnings etc. Israel finally acts. Terrorists and suicide bombers sneak across the border, Israel closes the border. Cause and effect. Forgive me, but I just can't blame Israel for attempting to defend itself, even while I see this whole thing is nothing but a vicious cycle.

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Molenir,

In other words, Hamas did not say this, but this is your interpretation its actions?

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...interpretation of...

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bushlover,

The only people to not care a bit about a country that is constantly under harassment by a known terrorist organization are dope smoking hippie wannabes and ultra left wing conspiracy theory believing liberals.

That comes close to being true even if you did leave out committed anti-Semites, sociopaths and probably a few other groups.

The problem is that a majority of people seem to be critical of Israel for what they view as its excessive action in Gaza. And a majority of those care at least a little about Israel. So, I'm not sure what your point is.

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BBC now reporting it is over 1,000 now, and the brutal genocide continues.

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My point is that many can't get it why israel is reacting like this. I wish they weren't but understand why they are. I wish the Palestinians weren't victims of themselves with the idiot Hamas in charge. The Palestinians worst enemy.

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bushlover,

If that is your point, then I think you are not correct. I think almost everyone gets it why Israel is reacting like this. I just think that a significant number--nay, even a majority--of those believe that Israel is wrong to do so and that its efforts will be counterproductive in the long run.

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Well I'm saying I understand why they are doing this because it is a reaction to being rocketed so many times. I can't understand why others can't see that. I know what they are doing is not nice. It's just a reaction to Hamas' rockets.

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bushlover,

Yes, I think that I can understand why they are doing this, too. That doesn't mean that I agree that it's the best course of action or that it will yield Israel any lasting benefit. I'd wager that most others, even those who condemn Israel's action, can also understand why Israel is doing this.

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shiuu: More anti the poor guy , this time arabs, usually you pick on helpless homeless people.

I single out those who are responsible.

Yeah, blame Hamas, have they killed 1,000 Jews, do they bloakde Israel and control the ports the airspace and borders. Think about it mate before you blindly support the bully boys with the bigger toys (weapons).

Thanks, I will blame Hamas. They call for the destruction of Israel, lunch rockets before the blockade and then try and use the Israeli and Egyptian blockade as justification for more rocket attacks. But only against Israel, of course. Lucky for Hamas they have useful idiots who are willing to ignore the Egyptian participation and blame it all on Israel.

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It is the palastinaians own fault how dare they occupy the land of the jews that the jews left about 2000 year ago and then when they come back and get the land back in shady deals, they start complaining, and when the jews (now israelians) start to oppress them they start to fight back how dare they.

Sarcasm off/

i never agreed how the Isrealian goernment treated the Palastinians, although they got a negative world opinion by always siding with terrorist nations, but hey, they never got support from the western countries.

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Is this Gaza thing still goin' on?

I come back to JT days later and see that apparently it still is.

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Thenewfront at 07:16 AM JST - 15th January “Molenir is another Israelophile who cannot see any wrong in any action they do. Luckily most of the world are like me and can look at these events impartially. After seeing all the facts, it is plain Israel is attempted to eradicate the arab presence in Gaza and does not care about the human cost. Luckily the decent peolpe in the world seem to see the genocide in the manner i do, the only folks on Israels side are some Jews and a handfull of American extremist nutcases.”

Thenewfront.

You reason that this comment was impartial? God help the world if you ever decide to take sides in a bigoted way

By the way, I am neither Jewish nor an American (& not an extremist of any kind)

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There is no genocide on the part of Israel, they just want to exist in peace. Though Israel has no written constitution (amazing as that may seem ; ) the drafts contain no preamble seeking to eradicate other states or governments and contain strong wording protecting the rights of all citizens including arabs. In contrast, Hamas is a religious entity/government that exists primarily to eradicate Israel and the semite bloodline from the region.

The bloodshed continues because Hamas refuses to accept the existence of the state of Israel. Though Israel has ceased hostilities, Hamas continues to barrage Israel with missiles today. When I was a kid, my daddy taught me not to poke dogs with sticks lest I get bit. The inference of my harsh old man was that it would be my fault if I were to be bitten.

I really cant understand the Hamas position as there was not a significant indigenous population in palestine. The original inhabitants were most likely from Greece or abroad. And the arab population only arrived in numbers after the Romans booted the Jews out.

It takes two to dance and if the existing islamic population in Gaza has any sense and desire for peace, they will refuse to be represented by Hamas. Should they not, continued bloodshed is assured.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

2000+ DEAD PALESTINIANS

13 DEAD ISRAELIS 3 BY FRIENDLY FIRE

And yet Israel lost.

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