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Europe should be grateful for spying, say U.S. lawmakers

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It’s a good thing. it keeps the French safe. It keeps the U.S. safe. It keeps our European allies safe,” he added.

For now, maybe, although I seriously doubt there has been any real effect. But who will keep us safe from the United States? People who have such callous disregard for one set of rights don't need much nudging to start violating other sets of rights. Much better to stop the buck now. Anyone violating our rights against our wishes cannot be called a protector.

3 ( +13 / -10 )

Europeans should be grateful for U.S. spying operations because they keep them safe, U.S. lawmakers said Sunday, urging allies to improve their own intelligence and oversight efforts.

Gee, I am really curious to know how tapping Merkel's phone keeps EU allies safe? Is the US implying that EU leaders like Merkel are a threat to their own people?

6 ( +12 / -6 )

Yes I'm grateful to you for protecting me when my wife asks me what I want for dinner...

-3 ( +3 / -6 )

Obama has virtually thrashed the US Constitution.

-3 ( +9 / -12 )

It seems that Americans' arrogance has no bounds.

Next it'll be 'say thank you for the drone strikes!'

0 ( +10 / -10 )

For now, maybe, although I seriously doubt there has been any real effect. But who will keep us safe from the United States?

The USofA

-10 ( +6 / -16 )

“They need to have a better oversight structure in Europe,” Rogers said. “I think they would be enlightened to find out what their intelligence services may or may not be doing.”

They'll get around to looking at themselves in about....3-6 months. That's how long the process takes to play out. The US gets accused of doing something in Europe, then Europe explodes in anger. They start to investigate and find out that their own government knew about it all along. Then the results are published in the back of the newspaper after all of the attention has died down. That's how the rendition stuff played out.

-1 ( +7 / -8 )

The US Empire (govt) is its own worst enemy, not to mention the victimization of its own population. Not unlike the Roman Empire was in its hayday.

5 ( +13 / -8 )

Europeans should be grateful for U.S. spying operations because they keep them safe

Wake up call U.S.A. the European Union has a bigger armed forces than you and it comparable in levels of training and equipment. Do you REALLY want to wake the sleeping giant?

I bet that Russia and China are laughing their heads off at the U.S's constant self-sabotage. The U.S.'s worst enemy isn't terrorists.... its the U.S.

0 ( +7 / -7 )

US paternalism

-3 ( +4 / -7 )

Its all a show. Theyll be in a back room eating a nice steak in no time.

0 ( +3 / -3 )

"The White House has said it is not monitoring Merkel’s phone calls." Probably true, but the NSA is and is probably monitoring The White House, too.

If that is the case, Americans should, no doubt, be grateful someone is monitoring their president.

-1 ( +3 / -4 )

@frungy

Wake up call U.S.A. the European Union has a bigger armed forces than you and it comparable in levels of training and equipment. Do you REALLY want to wake the sleeping giant?

If you are insinuating what I think you are, you are only kidding yourself. Biggest joke of the day. That will never, ever happen. But it would make for an interesting Spielberg movie.

I bet that Russia and China are laughing their heads off at the U.S's constant self-sabotage. The U.S.'s worst enemy isn't terrorists.... its the U.S.

I highly doubt it, but I will say, besides the terrorists, I will put congress at a close second place for sure.

0 ( +6 / -6 )

We are eternally grateful, Big Brother. Double plus good!

-2 ( +4 / -6 )

Merkel is one of the terrorists that the world needs to be protected from?? lol The ppl at NRA just dont want to lose their job thats why they r defending it. No spying no more work!

0 ( +6 / -6 )

When do they get the NSA spybill in the mail?

1 ( +3 / -2 )

Well, then U.S. is a nurse man in a nuthouse where patients need to be protected from themselves.

Or a racketeer who helps to keep business "safe".

-5 ( +1 / -6 )

and i would wonder how obama would react if the it came out that europe was listen to obama's conversations. the righteous indignation would be deafening i'll bet...

actually what europe should be pushing for is full access to what the US intercepts....

-4 ( +3 / -7 )

Without the spy network and the military machine = perpetual war, the US would go bust quickly. A peaceful world would be the end of them and their gangster like scams. There needs to be a constant enemy to assert control. The US was not always like this, they couldn't have gotten away with this a few decades ago, their population would have rioted and gone crazy. Now they are dumbed down enough that many believe they live in the greatest country on earth. Yeah, great place, rampant poverty, highest percent of population in prison of any country (kinda awesome) and a great choice of government, 2 parties run by the same paymasters.

This is why they need to pretend there is danger, they are a force for good. They can't even have a fair country, yet it is ok to break international law in drone attacks and spying. Have a great week.

0 ( +9 / -9 )

Angela Merkel must have been wondering why she was making so many miss dials.

"Oh, Obama? Sorry!" (Oh no, not him again!)

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

Really? And how pray tell are the US keeping Europe safe? They claim that "thousands" of lives have been saved by their spying endeavours. Prove it. Show us all the conclusive proof that every single one of those thousands of people would have been killed if not for the NSA. Do that, then I'll believe their propaganda. But they won't prove it. They'll just ask us to take it on faith, to trust a warmongering nation that spies on its own allies. I bet spying on me is really entertaining: an endless chain of rants, and the occasional drunk text. Fascinating. Because, according to the NSA's logic, I'm a potential terrorist too. What am I going to do? Slap David Cameron with a banana? Actually, that sounds like fun, but I don't fancy getting manhandled by the police and gang raped in jail, so I think I'll stick to just insulting him in Facebook posts or work conversations.

2 ( +5 / -3 )

falseflagsteve - I was about to post a comment pointing out how silly I found your post, but that sudden "Have a great week" at the end just trumped everything I was about to say. There is no answer for that overwhelming confidence..

-3 ( +3 / -6 )

Orwell's "1984" should now be reclassified as History instead of Fiction.

Safety by ubiquitous surveillance. They must also actually believe that Freedom is Slavery, too.

-3 ( +4 / -7 )

Whatever happened to the daily accusations of Chinese spying prior to Snowden's revelations?

7 ( +9 / -2 )

But Representative Peter King, who chairs the House Subcommittee on Counterterrorism and Intelligence, said Obama should "stop apologizing" about the NSA's phone-tapping scandal, claiming the programs had saved "thousands" of lives.

I think this line is very handy for justifying anything from tapping to A bombing.

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

the European Union has a bigger armed forces than you and it comparable in levels of training and equipment. Do you REALLY want to wake the sleeping giant?

Oh yes the military forces that pretty much had to rely on the US for logistics and intelligence to launch the Libya air attacks. In fact if I'm not mistaken one European nation almost ran out of bombs during the campaign.

-3 ( +3 / -6 )

"Who will keep us safe from the United States?

You'd be better off worrying about who will keep you safe from the maniacs who would torture and kill you without hesitation or remorse.

-9 ( +1 / -10 )

It's been going on for years, the US and their allies spy on their own people and the rest of the world via their assets in the US, UK, Canada, Germany, Australia, NZ, other allies and even Japan; and shares the 'take' with them selectively, as long as it is not prejudicial to US or allied national interests. It all goes back to a 1941 treaty, and its successors, and is extensively documented in the public domain.

They have a whole matrix of agreements so that their lawyers and politicians can plausibly deny that they are spying directly, they just do it indirectly.

However, vacuuming the whole contents off the internet has come as a surprise to many, who only considered spying to be satellite cameras in orbit and tiny bugs in telephones, submarine cable intercepts and furtive exchanges of documents in the dark, telephone intercepts of cell phones and laser beams picking up and recording conversations off window panes. Relics of the Cold War.

It's called moving with the times.

But there is no longer impartial oversight of the system, there are too many interested parties using it to further their own agendas, and too many lies have been revealed and exposed so that Joe Public has lost faith in the system.

A massive breach of trust.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

Oh yes the military forces that pretty much had to rely on the US for logistics and intelligence to launch the Libya air attacks. In fact if I'm not mistaken one European nation almost ran out of bombs during the campaign.

Not to mention France ASKED that they ( the US ) should take the lead in the attacks. One reason, the coalition (if you want to call it that) troops didn't have the extreme hardware capability, payload and weaponry systems to do the job the way the US could.

Europe, you're welcome, again. But I know this sadly won't be the last time, they'll ask us for help and being the nation we are, we'll probably bail them out as well.

-8 ( +2 / -10 )

bass4funk...

Europe, you're welcome, again. But I know this sadly won't be the last time, they'll ask us for help and being the nation we are, we'll probably bail them out as well

Ah, the old "we pulled your asses out of the fire" mantra again. Lest you forget, my Colonial chum, you arrived late for WW1 and only your superior numbers prevented German victory, as for WW2, only 2-and-a-bit years late and again superior numbers saved the day. (The RAF saved Britain in 1940... over a year before your country was shaken from its complacent slumber by the Japanese)

America does have superior numbers of men and equipment, but as the old adage goes - quality over quantity.

3 ( +8 / -5 )

Europe, you're welcome, again. But I know this sadly won't be the last time, they'll ask us for help and being the nation we are, we'll probably bail them out as well.

Where was the US during the Winter War, Continuation War and Lapland War? See you guys can't use that card against Finland ;)

8 ( +9 / -1 )

Ah, the old "we pulled your asses out of the fire" mantra again. Lest you forget, my Colonial chum, you arrived late for WW1 and only your superior numbers prevented German victory, as for WW2, only 2-and-a-bit years late and again superior numbers saved the day. (The RAF saved Britain in 1940... over a year before your country was shaken from its complacent slumber by the Japanese)

America does have superior numbers of men and equipment, but as the old adage goes - quality over quantity.

Thunderbird2 - That is a bit much. Lets face it, if it were not for the US (and to a lesser degree, us "Colonials") Brits everywhere would be wearing lederhosen and goose-stepping around Picadilly Circus.

-9 ( +3 / -12 )

"Brits everywhere would be wearing lederhosen and goose-stepping around Picadilly Circus."

Not really, after the end of the Battle of Britain, Hitler gave up on his plan for an invasion of the UK and turned his attention to Russia. He didn't want to sustain any further losses of Luftwaffe aircraft, a much needed asset on the Eastern Front.

Once again, Obama takes the heat for idiotic measures started by Bush administration. If Obama has a failing, it's that he doesn't overturn the Bush policies fast enough.

4 ( +7 / -3 )

if it were not for the US (and to a lesser degree, us "Colonials") Brits everywhere would be wearing lederhosen and goose-stepping around Picadilly Circus.

All this "if this", "if that"... if the allies had handled Germany better after WW1 then WW2 would never have happened. What if France, Spain and Holland hadn't have supported the US during the American Revolutionary War? And what if my auntie had three balls, would she be a pinball machine?

7 ( +7 / -0 )

You'd be better off worrying about who will keep you safe from the maniacs who would torture and kill you without hesitation or remorse.

@Serrano--The CIA? Of course they won't post my killing on youtube so nobody will know what happened to me until some whistle blower releases a bunch of documents.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

I see the old "saving your ass" has surfaced from the US. Does showing up late to a battle that has essentially been one count as saving? I think not. As for US superiority, think again. The US Delta Force is (and has for several years been) the third best Special Forces division. The second is the British SAS, and the best? The French Foreign Legion. Yep, that's right, the country "famed" for surrendering has the greatest Special Forces. FFL soldiers train Delta Force and SAS soldiers in Desert Warfare. Part of that includes an endurance challange, wherein the soldiers are buried up to their neck in the desert sand, enduring the blistering heat for as long as possible. As I recall, the criteria for passing that test is needing to endure the heat for an hour at least. The French are cowards? Think again.

No, this spying program by the NSA is nothing more than keeping tabs on other nations, trying to find out any juicy information that could be used in an underhanded manner by the US if Europe or any other world leaders try to do anything that might upset the big baby in the White House. The NSA can take a hike for all I care. The only reason the UK gets targeted by terrorists is because former PM Tony Blair decided it was a good idea to appease President big baby Bush by joining him in an ongoing war that was never ours to fight in the first place. If Blair had had the backbone to tell Bush to jog on, we wouldn't have to worry about terrorists. We should let America fight its own battles, and let it suffer the consequences of trying to boss the world around.

3 ( +6 / -3 )

"Who will keep us safe from the United States?

You'd be better off worrying about who will keep you safe from the maniacs who would torture and kill you without hesitation or remorse.

For most of us on planet Earth, the former is the latter

1 ( +4 / -3 )

As if Merkel didn't know her cell phone wasn't a secure line! Of course she did. That's why she had a secure land line in her office. The pretend outrage is amusing.

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

The only reason Americans have not called for impeachment of obama is due to the fact that he has destroyed the American way of life pitting one race against another and making one job not enough to make ends meet.

The next you will hear is that American is not really a free country it is a dictatorship run by congress to destroy America and her Allies.

The largest terrorist organization is the Congress of America fo0r they have actually trained every terrorist organization in the world.

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

"Who will keep us safe from the United States?"

Serrano: "You'd be better off worrying about who will keep you safe from the maniacs who would torture and kill you without hesitation or remorse."

Get Real: "For most of us on planet Earth, the former is the latter"

So, the United States of America would torture and kill most of the people on planet Earth, eh? Har!

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

"Thanks to US spying, we are safe from terrorists."

Right.

Reminds me of a story.

Stop me if you've heard this one.

Bloke lives next door to very odd bloke. Every morning he walks around his garden, scattering torn up newspaper shreds.

"Wotcha doin' that for?" asks bloke.

"Keeps the elephants away," answers very odd bloke.

"But there aren't any elephants around here," retorts bloke.

"See, it works doesn't it!" answers very odd bloke.

-1 ( +3 / -4 )

Bertie - I've heard that one, but that has nothing to do with the very real situation we have today in which there are maniacs who would torture and kill you without hesitation or remorse, and there is no doubt NSA spying has stopped some of them before they were able to carry out their despicable murderous acts.

-3 ( +2 / -5 )

Serrano,

Yes. There are terrorists, as you say, who would torture and kill without hesitation or remorse. Some of them were made available to us courtesy of Bradley (or Chelsea) Manning.

I know what you are saying. I do get your point, but there is also another side to this. A lot of people objected very strongly to the "War on Terror," the invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan - all because of a set of paper thin lies that would have been more appropriate in a Hollywood "B" movie. We put up with this. Well, we had to, didn't we? Our governments were under American control, with some very minor exceptions.

But now, not only the people, but European governments have had quite enough of US imperialism and cowardly spying.

American politicians usually respond to problems like this with stout denial and more lies. And, whereas that may work with American people, it isn't going over in Europe.

The US has stepped over the line.

Real friends don't spy on each other.

1 ( +3 / -2 )

So, the United States of America would torture and kill most of the people on planet Earth, eh? Har!

@Serrano--How did you go from "you" to "most of the people on planet Earth"?? I am afraid that anything I would have to say about such a shift would be too insulting to be allowed to remain posted.

And you also went from the U.S. government to just the United States, and I assume you think all Muslims are represented by al-Qaida as well.

Look, the CIA and other American government and military orgs have been credibly accused or proven to have committed very horrendous, tortuous and murderous acts from the inception of the United States up to the present day. Anyone who thinks the United States government and military are completely innocent and trustworthy without any checks or balances has been drinking an awful lot of Kool-aid.

1 ( +4 / -3 )

That is a bit much. Lets face it, if it were not for the US (and to a lesser degree, us "Colonials") Brits everywhere would be wearing lederhosen and goose-stepping around Picadilly Circus.

Not to mention, the national dish would have been Bratwurst instead of Fish and Chips.

So now the Brits are saying because we showed up late, it's irrelevant and we in actuality didn't save them? They were fully capable of handling Ze Germans give credit where credit is due.

@Control

The CIA? Of course they won't post my killing on youtube so nobody will know what happened to me until some whistle blower releases a bunch of documents.

Stop watching all those James Bond movies.

@dave

All this "if this", "if that"... if the allies had handled Germany better after WW1 then WW2 would never have happened. What if France, Spain and Holland hadn't have supported the US during the American Revolutionary War? And what if my auntie had three balls, would she be a pinball machine?

What if the British never ruled 2/3 of the world and colonized oppressed non-whites? Please don't deflect. The point is, you were saved by the US, in a war we didn't want to get involved in, but did and saved you, nothing to be ashamed about, it's NOT about gloating, it's about facts. Please don't try to write revisionist history.

@bertie

I know what you are saying. I do get your point, but there is also another side to this. A lot of people objected very strongly to the "War on Terror," the invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan - all because of a set of paper thin lies that would have been more appropriate in a Hollywood "B" movie. We put up with this. Well, we had to, didn't we? Our governments were under American control, with some very minor exceptions.

Even so, we had the legal right to dispose of Saddam and even if the entire world was against it, it doesn't matter because, the world didn't have to deal with Saddam or his thuggish sons and please don't even start with the, you guys were supplying him with weapons because NO one is denying that and at the time with the Iranians becoming more unstable and a threat, not to mention the hostage situation, Saddam seemed like the best option to cozy up to. So I don't know what you are talking about when you say lies. But probably if you inside Syria, you might find your so called lies after all.

But now, not only the people, but European governments have had quite enough of US imperialism and cowardly spying.

Get off of it, the US is NOT an empire. If we were, all of you guys would be in lock step with us, every time, all the time.

American politicians usually respond to problems like this with stout denial and more lies. And, whereas that may work with American people, it isn't going over in Europe.

Sorry, bertie, but NEWSFLASH, ALL politicians do it and ALL OF THEM ARE FULL OF....! ALL OF THEM.

The US has stepped over the line.

When it comes to spying, they all do, NOT just the US, sorry, but you are totally wrong. Again, if you want to bash America, do it, but please don't use the NSA spying as a catalyst to vent your anger towards the states.

Real friends don't spy on each other.

Well, if we go by that, then all of us on this planet are not real friends.

-7 ( +1 / -8 )

SInce the article doesn't make it clear, I will:

All the lawmakers cited in the article are Republicans.

1 ( +4 / -3 )

CrazyJoeOct. 28, 2013 - 08:33AM JST

Obama has virtually thrashed the US Constitution.

Why do you blame only Obama? This has been going on since 2002 by Bush and Dick Chaney. They are the ones who started this.

US spying capability is far advanced than others, and it has been used to protect Americans, Americans living abroad, all allied nations safety. It should strike a balanced between civil liberty and national security issues.. Obama is now taking an initiative to improve transparency of NSA for moving forward.

Speaking about US Constitution, how does it apply to a wire tapping on German PM? Please explain. Sounds like you are totally confused in this regards.

0 ( +3 / -3 )

@JT

All the lawmakers cited in the article are Republicans.

Which the Democratically elected Democrats took over ratcheted up the program beefed it up with steroids. Thanks to our socialist buddies.

Just need to make that clear.

-8 ( +0 / -8 )

and where is the governments gratitude at this chaps selfless act of testing there security system and helping to keep them safe http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-24712214

1 ( +2 / -1 )

In its latest glorious understatement, the White House says "additional intelligence constraints are needed"

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-24719830

What next, less absolutist denials are needed?

1 ( +2 / -1 )

Wake up call U.S.A. the European Union has a bigger armed forces than you and it comparable in levels of training and equipment. Do you REALLY want to wake the sleeping giant?

You're annoying. I'm not a fan of the US government and don't support ANY government infringing upon the rights of citizens, but it's not like they're the only country conducting this type of spy program. You've got to have your head in the sand if you think otherwise.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

and where is the governments gratitude at this chaps selfless act of testing there security system and helping to keep them safe

@toby2663-- I will tell you where it is. Its in the filing cabinet, under "H", in the file labeled "Hypocrisy".

1 ( +1 / -0 )

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