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German vandals ordered jailed, caned in Singapore

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If looks could kill. That young woman in the car with one of them looks like she's ready to start caning that guy right now.

3 ( +4 / -1 )

Not they I condone their stupidity but Singapore is a barbaric country in terms of its laws and punishments. I dont fly through there or even use their airline. I find them incredibly arrogant.

-7 ( +10 / -17 )

Seems appropriate for vandalism. I loath vandals.

12 ( +15 / -3 )

Steve, what would an appropriate punishment have been for two adults who knew they were committing a crime?

And from my experience, their airline is the BEST in the world in terms of cool uniforms for the female flight attendants and generally personable attitudes.

3 ( +9 / -6 )

There's are many places in this world where Germans can loosen-up, so WHY did they have to pick Singapore?

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

Agree with Steve, that kind of sentence for such a petty crime is medieval and ridiculous, I can't imagine how miserable it must be there

-7 ( +9 / -16 )

Maybe this will beat some sense into them.....

6 ( +9 / -3 )

Yeah I agree with Steve too much for just some spray painting (graffiti). They should have got the 2 of them to clean up the mess not jailed and caned. This is 2014 after all

-7 ( +6 / -13 )

I wonder if these vandals will contemplate doing their dirty deed again in Singapore? Probably not!

I wonder if Germans will be well aware after this about what kinds of punishments they will face for vandalism in Singapore? You bet!

Singapore is famous for showing no mercy to those who destroy, deface or even dirty their tiny city-state. These punks knew better and still they did what they did.

Don't go to other countries to trash the place without thinking about the consequences first, please.

5 ( +8 / -3 )

Well, I bet they'll never do THAT again. And in the meantime, they have plenty of pain and jail to look forward to to think about what they're dumb little stunt will cost them. I guess they were a little to young when the American did a similar thing and got caned.

1 ( +4 / -3 )

"I can't imagine how miserable it must be there"

It's the most popular country in the world for immigrants on a per capita basis. So it can't be that "miserable."

0 ( +4 / -4 )

@dcog9065

I can't imagine how miserable it must be there

I lived there for almost 2 years and it's a fantastic place............just don't break their laws and don't bring your "I'm smarter than everybody" attitude with you.

1 ( +5 / -4 )

Jail time is deserved in this case, they did damage public property.

I wish they would replace caning with some serious hard labour. These thugs deserve pain.

-2 ( +3 / -5 )

"A well adjusted person is one who makes the same mistake twice without getting nervous." - Alexander Hamilton.

Three reasons could well define Andreas Von Knorre, 22, and Elton Hinz, 21, being an exception to that rule.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

You do the crime you get the time , the boys knew what they were doing , you would imagine , thrill seekers ! ? Punks ! ? I bet they knew what risk they were taking and thought they had gotten away with it . would love to hear their side of the story especially after the porridge stunt. Reminds me a bit of the mathias rust story the young german kid that flew a cessna plane into the red square certainly something to tell the grandkids .

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

Every time I have visited Singapore, whether by commercial plane or ship we were always given orientation on how strict Singapore is if you break their laws. These "two" immature German lads knew full well the consequences of breaking the law or were to ignorant to pay attention to the briefing you receive before entering Singapore. As they say "Ignorance is NO excuse" and common sense alone should tell you not to vandalize but then again, common sense is not so common these days.

4 ( +6 / -2 )

More countries should take this approach to mindless defacing of public property by idiots who can't get their kicks any other ways. Good on Singapore.

5 ( +8 / -3 )

This was not a stupid mistake. They broke in. If more countries had laws like Singapore, maybe there would be fewer crimes in those countries as well. I will bet that these two don't go around breaking in and spray painting again. They deserve what they are getting.

0 ( +5 / -5 )

Agree with Steve, that kind of sentence for such a petty crime is medieval and ridiculous, I can't imagine how miserable it must be there

Petty? It's vandalism... can't do the time, don't do the crime :D

1 ( +5 / -4 )

I would prefer that Singapore um, switch the caning to some other form of punishment, but otherwise I've no quibble with this sentence. I've really got no patience for graffiti, defacement, vandalism. It's the height of arrogance and selfishness. This reminds me of that Clet fellow who defaces street signs in the name of art, whose girlfriend was arrested in Osaka a while back. Wonder if he has ever tried doing his art in Singapore? How much caning would he get? I actually do like his clever and amusing designs and would be happy to look at them on a homepage, in a book or a gallery. But not on the actual signs.

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

Absolutely sure they knew what they were doing, as they were trying to get out of the country after said vandalism. Although the sentence seems harsh to western standards, the sentence is (should be) understood in Singapore. Do the crime, and face the punishment.

@ Jalapeno I travel to Singapore twice a year, and Singapore Airlines used to be good. They are absolute shyte now. I refuse to travel with them anymore. Plus, they only allow 1 check-in bag now, as opposed to other airlines still allowing 2 check-in bags.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

I've no sympathy for them, they are old enough to know what they are doing is a criminal offence. I sure as hell did when I was their age.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

Both asked for mercy before sentencing and called their acts a “stupid mistake”.

Not mistake but crime. Only 9 months and 3 canes. They may be lucky that Singapore keep them in jail. In some states in USA, cops are trigger happy against vandals.

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

I feel that the actions taken by Singapore have their merit, though I can see why some people here object to corporal punishment. The biggest problem, however, appears to be not that Singapore do so much against people who flagrantly break the law by breaking and entering and causing criminal damage, it's that so many other countries do so little.

And let's get one thing straight. These are grown men, not children. At least chronologically speaking. If they are still doing immature things at that age, then perhaps they need some sort of mental evaluation. Otherwise, as somebody already said here, if you can't do the time...

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Some good news for a change!

1 ( +3 / -2 )

The two vandals knew they were breaking the law. And their is a reason NYC has a graffiti everywhere as opposed to Singapore.

1 ( +4 / -3 )

Germans are the new Chinese..

-7 ( +0 / -7 )

Seems appropriate for vandalism. I loath vandals.

You realize the Vandals were an East Germanic tribe right?

1 ( +3 / -2 )

Singqpore does not tolerate nonsense. A lot of places could learn a thing or two from it.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

In Germany these days you don’t get punished for petty crimes at all, even murder often gets you only ~6 actual years in prison, if not 3 years when it’s called “manslaughter”. No wonder those guys thought they could pull this BS in other countries as well without any consequences.

3 ( +5 / -2 )

All Asian countries should enforce serious punishment for ANY foreigner(s) commiting serious crime. It's the only way to prevent them from happening in the first place. Country like Indonesia would be an extreme case but they could easily become the next Mexico if left unchecked. As money & power flow into Asia, so does criminals. It's a message from Asian governmenst to all criminals "Don't f*** with us."

-3 ( +0 / -3 )

It's a bit too severe for my taste, but only in order of magnitude. I'm not keen on corporal punishment and think 9 months is too long, maybe one month would suffice, with a major fine.

To those who say they should have just been asked to clean up their mess, no. The point is that you cannot possibly catch every vandal, can't even catch most of them. So just asking them to clean up their mess when they're caught has next to no dissuasive impact, it would be like punishing theft by asking the thieves to give back what they stole, and then send them on their way. Who wouldn't be a thief in that case? You try to steal, if you're successful, you get to keep what you stole, if you're caught, you just give it back. There's no risk at all to thieving.

Likewise, if vandals were just told to repair what they broke, vandalism would essentially be a no-risk operation (unless the costs of repairs are sky-high). Harsh punishment is thus required to dissuade people not to do these relatively minor crimes, so that people tempted to do them think twice about it. I'm not too keen on prison time because prison is expensive to society, big fines would be better I think.

3 ( +4 / -1 )

Singapore, a leading Asian financial hub, is known for its tough stance on crime.

Understatement of the week.

Anyways, now the yunguns know what all of us already knew: when you're not in the West, don't expect Western style justice.

1 ( +3 / -2 )

Thoughts: 1) Caning is barbaric. Support for caning because you think you are all "tough on crime" is also barbaric. 2) Despite the above, not a lot of sympathy for the accused... "called their acts a “stupid mistake” - stupid, yes, but if a mistake it was a calculated one. They knew exactly what they were doing and what the consequences were, and chose to do it precisely because of where they were and what the laws were like. 3) "Caning is a punishment dating back to British colonial rule" - thanks a lot, Brits. Oh the white man's burden, spreading civilization and enlightenment to the benighted races...

1 ( +3 / -2 )

A slap on the wrist would be too lenient, 9 months seems to harsh. How about public caning of 5-10 strokes? Those two are young adults, no longer children. regardless, if they can't go to a foreign country and respect their laws, thinking it doesn't apply to them, they need to be taught a valuable lesson. Surely, they won't do that again in Singapore.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

"...we were always given orientation on how strict Singapore is if you break their laws."

Who gave you all these orientations? I've visited about a dozen times and no one has ever given me an orientation. In fact their immigration and customs officers are among the most courteous and easy-going I've ever encountered.

2 ( +3 / -1 )

Singapore is safer than Japan.Walk around the streets and be assured of your personal safety. Singapore makes for one of the most relaxing vacations one can have due to anti social behavior not being tolerated!

These two will certainly be reflecting on this fact long after the stinging has stopped....

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

This was not a felony case. Being sentence to jail for short time is one thing, but the problem of Singapore judicial system is that they use torture in the form of caning, to punish crimes that should be misdemeanor is a blatant disregard for international human rights standards. People who have been caned have called the pain excruciating. If the first sentence is so harsh for minor crime, maybe the repeat offenders won't see the daylight anymore.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

It's frightening to see how many people think a public caning and 9 months in jail is an appropriate punishment for spray painting. Such tribal thinking belongs in Saudi Arabia and North Korea, not a supposedly liberal democracy. Anyway, Singapore's allowed to do what they want, but I do think it makes them look silly and backward with disturbing civil society expectations

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

Silly or not, you don't see much graffiti in Singapore.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

Singapore is a British creation and as a Brit i would like to see its downfall. I Hate everything of this place. The way they treat people like cattle, the they way they want to get you for running drugs even though u completely innocent. And the arrogant staff of Singapore Airlines. Worse than JAL.. I fly Korean Air thanks.

0 ( +4 / -4 )

@holyholly

Although the sentence seems harsh to western standards, the sentence is (should be) understood in Singapore. Do the crime, and face the punishment.

It's a false distinction to make this into an issue of Singapore/western standards. The punishment doesn't just "seem" harsh, it is harsh.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Map_of_judicial_corporal_punishment.svg

In Southeast Asia, only 4 countries use judicial corporal punishment. The majority don't. East Asia doesn't have it at all. Likewise, in the rest of the world, other than a cluster of Islamic countries in the middle East across to Iran, Pakistan and Afghanistan, most countries, rich or poor, democratic or not, do not have corporal punishment.

Considering the list of countries that do, Singapore's not in the greatest company.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

"Singapore's not in the greatest company."

These guys are getting three strokes -- three - for breaking into a rail facility and destroying property. The blogger in Saudi Arabia is getting 1000 lashes....1000...for, um, blogging. And facing the death penalty for "apostasy."

These two countries are NOT in the same "company"

0 ( +1 / -1 )

Singapore's allowed to do what they want, but I do think it makes them look silly and backward with disturbing civil society expectations

This brings up the question, which is sillier; The country that canes for breaking and entering and graffiti or the people that go to Singapore knowing that Singapore canes for breaking and entering and graffiti and then proceed to break and enter and spray graffiti in Singapore?

My vote for which is sillier goes to the people who broke and entered and spray painted graffiti.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

These guys are getting three strokes -- three - for breaking into a rail facility and destroying property. The blogger in Saudi Arabia is getting 1000 lashes....1000...for, um, blogging. And facing the death penalty for "apostasy."

Actually they're getting three strokes - by no means trivial in itself, if you know what that involves, and I assume you do - plus nine months in prison.

It's lighter than the Saudi punishment for apostasy. Looks like we both agree on that.

Singapore's still in crappy company with its use of this form of punishment, but maybe one day it will join more enlightened countries. You never know.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

A bit harsh, but looking at the graffitied mess in German cities, I feel quite sympathetic to the Singaporean government.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

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