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Iran leader's comments on Israel spark Western walkout at U.N. meeting

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This may all seem meaningless at first, but I do hope and pray that this humble U.N. meeting on Racism is a start in the right direction. If you are white it may seem redundent to bring these matters up in the 21st Century but if you are black, brown, yellow etc..as the majority of this world is, and if your people were once colonized and exploited (as many Arabs now see their brother Palestinians in Gaza etc... being gunned downed by the white Jews in their own lands) then you can maybe begin to understand the hate in the world. If we do not speak to each other, this will only continue, so even if that dude from Iran got jeered at this conference, I do think it is a step in the right direction.

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Walkout: a childish act. They should learn from ordinary people all over the world who hear or read Western Media daily.

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The walkout and the clown noses are as silly as anything Mahmoud Ahmadinejad may have said. Ironically, Palestinians and Jews are both Semites, which means they belong to the same gene pool. The difference is that the Palestinians are poor and neglected by North American and Europeans nations while Israel is a poster child that can get away with anything. The facts of Israel as a military, theocratic and ethnocentric murderous monster are under your nose. If you hate Mahmoud Ahmadinejad for his idiotic remarks about the Holocaust, then you should hate Israel for what it did in Gaza and for its illegal settlements, among many other outrages.

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For shame. A'jad missed yet another chance to impress Sec of State Hillary Clinton by unclenching that fist.

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If you are white it may seem redundent to bring these matters up in the 21st Century but if you are black, brown, yellow etc..as the majority of this world is,

Whatever. The ugliest "racism" in this world is what people of the same or proximate "races" do to one another.

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Jeancolmar: I make your words mine. Very well explained.

That´s why US and other nations should attend this event. Behind any sort of rage there´s an agente provocateur.

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The facts of Israel as a military, theocratic and ethnocentric murderous monster are under your nose.

Are they? Why is it people like you can never spell them out?

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many israelis had lost family memebrs and friends who were stabed,gunned down,blowen up or kidnaped by palestinians.but you dont see those israelis retaliet by blowing them self up in a palestinains bus or snipering a baby in the head(shalhevet pas). many israelis are offspring of allmost a milion jews from arab countries that were dceported after 1948,living thier houses and possesion behaid,and they lived in tents in the deserts for almost 10 years togheter with other more then a milion jews that were deported from europ living their houses and possesion behaind.but you dont see them stab a 15 years old girl(helena rap). that the difeent betwin the 2 people. land? from the 418 evacued arab viliges on 48,more then a 100 were old jewish towns,like yavne,ono,tsipori,bnei barak and many more. there are stil more then arab cities in israel that are old jewish towns,like sachnin,shfaram,jenin,nablus,rammala and many more.some were jewish town up until 1841 like kfar yasif. the jewish land was under 1800 years of occupation,1300 of it muslim occupation.now the jews libaret their land,it is only natuaral that the arab occupaires will get mad on that.

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United States and Europe helped establish Israel after World War II at the expense of Palestinians

This is an historical fact. Palestine was a British territory when this happened.

“If we actually believe in freedom of expression, then he has the right to say what he wants to say,”

That's true. The same way that the US is anti-Iran, Iran is anti-Irael. Freedom of speech that the US invades other nations to promote. But when someone disagrees with, they walk out.

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If you are white it may seem redundent to bring these matters up in the 21st Century but if you are black, brown, yellow etc..as the majority of this world is, and if your people were once colonized and exploited (as many Arabs now see their brother Palestinians in Gaza etc... being gunned downed by the white Jews in their own lands) then you can maybe begin to understand the hate in the world. If we do not speak to each other, this will only continue, so even if that dude from Iran got jeered at this conference, I do think it is a step in the right direction.

Your statement is paradoxical at best. By declaring that all 'whites' are bigoted and inherently prone to discrimination you are, in effect, being racist by your own definition. In addition classifying all North Americans and Europeans as white could result in an international fiasco, nations like Italy and Spain are descended from a variety of different cultural groups and would probably resent being placed under the same ethnic label as the French and god forbid you compare France to Italy or Spain in front of one of the French.

In all technicality racism is, by definition, not the same as discrimination but rather the fact that one person identifies a person of another ethnic group, nationality, or skin color as a different ethnicity than themselves and is not, in itself, a bad thing. To be more accurate it should have been a U.N meeting against discrimination and ethnocentrism but now we're just arguing semantics.

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The advancement of UN meets see another walkout after PM Ahmednejad of Iran, gives speech.

History of UN meets has had uncountable walkouts since cold war era. Through walkouts and other confusions,the cold war era has ended.

Even many national parliaments/legislative assemblies have had walkouts in many nations. It is process of understanding the issues involved.

Walkouts are a process of UN changes . The important thing in UN meets is engagement of all parties in various issues in all nations of UN.

Progress of UN even though slow, is slow progress of world unity and unity of world nations. Slow nations of world,will be slow to catch up with advanced nations, The UN is a unity among slow poorer nations and advanced nations of world.

The unity is slow because vast difference in advancement of nations. Advancement in palestine and north korea is slow,this is a fact.

Human lives can be given all respect from poor slow ,not advanced nations to all advanced nations via UN meets with discussions of the issues.

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jeancolmar: very well said.

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I agree with Ahmadinejad. I feel the Europeans are like bitches, they do not really take responsibility for the mess they helped make. I find it very disturbing and immature that the answer to someone's critism about one's actions is to get up and walk out. Obviously they know they are wrong, helping support the massacre of innocent people. First they massacred jewish people, now they aid the jewish people to massacre Palestinians. Their answer is to walk out? Great...they must be so much better. They must feel their racism is justified.

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but if you are black, brown, yellow etc..as the majority of this world is, and if your people were once colonized and exploited...

What's the statute of limitations for blaming your country's failures on past colonization, or is the formula only whites are capable of racism and all people of color are innocent victims?

then you should hate Israel for what it did in Gaza

Gee, Jean, did the Islamic terrorist group Hamas, which openly seeks the destruction of Israel, play any role in this? Anyway, we understand you're a self-proclaimed Socialist and are obligated to hate white capitalist nations such as Israel and the US.

Walkout: a childish act.

What is childish is showing up and believing this conference had something to do with solving racism. How naive can people be? Certainly they can't all be leftists.

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Palestinians are poor and neglected by North American and Europeans nations while Israel is a poster child that can get away with anything." JC: you are correct but the way I see it, its the flip for the Palestinians, where as when they attack, its celebrated throughout most of the Muslim world, which is a lot larger than than NA and Europe combined.

Additionally, if all these Arabs are so concerned about the Plight of the Palestinians, why doesn't Egypt open its borders to them as well as Jordan or Syria too? Bear in mind, that when those Arab nations decided to attack Israel, they are the ones that told many Palestinians to get out of the way and return once they win. Well, they didn't win and it was they who left the Palestinians out to dry.

Sabi states that the Jewish state has no right to exist, whether that is right is really not the point, its there now and you just can't up root a nation of people.

This was supposed to have been a conference on racism. It should not have been a place where this one issue steals the whole show.

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Palestinians are poor and neglected by North American and Europeans nations

Their Arab brethren want them as shock troops/cannon fodder at the frontlines in the endless jihad against the Jews that the Koran prescribes but they do not want to extend them citizenship in places like Egypt, or Kuwait, or even Iran.

Why is that?

Who is being 'racist'?

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Ahmadinejad is proving to be a great man.

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Why were all these Western leaders attending in the first place? They knew very well this "racism" meeting was a platform for Israel bashing by the muslim countries, as all previous have been.

Isn´t it one definition of insanity to repeat the same action over and over, expecting a different result?

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If they want to walk out while the guys speaks, so be it. how many of you would listen to Bush?

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Do Ahmadhinejhad's fans and apologists here actually think that serious students of history, not to mention most Jews, are unaware that the date set for this conference is the birthdate of Adolf Hitler?

There are some sick people in this world.

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You do know that Iran did indeed side with the Nazis, which was before Israel declared independence.

I think what fans of Ahmadhinejhad fail to realize is that you had a group of people declare independence and then an influx of Jews came. Yet, many were cheering when another country declared independence just a few months ago.

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skipthesong at 10:52 AM JST - 21st April You do know that Iran did indeed side with the Nazis, which was before Israel declared independence.

Not a fan of Iran but I also a fan of history. What I have read Iran was neutral during World War II. When the allies demanded that Iran expel all German nationals they refused and were invaded by the Soviets and British.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anglo-Soviet_invasion_of_Iran

World War II began in 1939 and ended in 1945. Israel declared independence from the British Mandate of Palestine in 1948.

To attempt to rewrite history to try and prove a point is wrong.

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It's fair to criticize the West for atrocities, but when you stand next to a man like Ahmadinejad you lose all credibility and your message will be ignored. The guy is a laughing stock on the world stage and he's lost a lot of respect from his own people. When you make it obvious that you're willing to overlook all of that then there's no way people will take you seriously.

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I'm not going to deprive some here of the reward to be gained by learning for themselves the history of 'Palestine'.

But I would recommend you start with the absentee landlord system initiated by the Ottoman Turks decades before the dissolution of their corrupt and far-flung imperialist empire and examine the damage it did in the region being discussed.

I often wish that the rest of the world, forced to deal with this never ending conflict, could get the UN or the IMF or the US State Dept to have each and every citizen in Palestine submit to DNA testing - I think the results would be very interesting, and would go a loooong way toward refuting the popular, post - '67 notion that the 'Palestinians' have 'been there for millenia.'

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teleprompter at 10:44 AM JST - 21st April Do Ahmadhinejhad's fans and apologists here actually think that serious students of history, not to mention most Jews, are unaware that the date set for this conference is the birthdate of Adolf Hitler?

Adolf Hitler was born April 20th 1889, this conference was held The Durban Review Conference (20-24 April 2009).

Other people in history born between April 20-24

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/April_20

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/April_21

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/April_22

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/April_23

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/April_24

teleprompter you will be stunned to find that allot of people were born between April 20-24th. To try and sway the folks here into believing that this is some grand plot is in itself a bit far fetched.

I do hope that you check out wiki and see how many people were born between those dates.

You far right wingers are really going overboard with your,"the UN is evil!" ideas.

You guys need to step back and take a real deep breath, then try and look at this story for what it is and not what you want it to be.

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teleprompter at 11:24 AM JST - 21st April post - '67 notion that the 'Palestinians' have 'been there for millenia.'

History in this subject is one very murky subject. I will say this in my opinion, no one can ever say. Even if one day someone proves that the Palestinians had lived there for 100 years there would be those that would never believe it. Vise versa if someone proved that they had not, then there would be those who will never believe it either.

This is a never ending cycle that can only end one way, very violently.

SuperLib at 11:15 AM JST - 21st April It's fair to criticize the West for atrocities, but when you stand next to a man like Ahmadinejad you lose all credibility and your message will be ignored.

Who was criticizing the West for atrocities? What atrocities are you talking about? For anyone to stand next to that man would be as bad as standing next to any loon. He is an extremist and his views show him for what he is.

But let us not forget that there are those that are against him who are also extremist. Let us not paint this brush to make ourselves look innocent.

The only way to rid the world of racism is to shine a light on it.

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When will the Arabs and Persians realize that they lost the War for Palestine and just move on? How do they think the whole Middle East became Muslim in the first place, by people being nice and converting everyone to Islam with a smile? The Middle East became Muslim because of War, the same reason why Palestine became Israel today. If we use the whole Muslim argument about "historical claims" etc., then Istanbul should be Christian Constantinople again, and so should Damascus, Baghdad and a whole lot of other areas there. California and Texas should be part of Mexico. Afghanistan should be Buddhist, etc. Get over it. As for Ahmadinejad, he's no different from Borat, only the latter is a lot more fun.

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No Joe, The Shah, lend more to the Brits and Soviets, his father and many people there did not. I am not going to bother looking at wiki, my maid is Iranian and well spoken. I'd listen to her before I listen to many here. Mind you, one of the founding ideas why the Shah was hated was his willingness to speak to others. That got ball rolling, which is one of the reasons he became paranoid and went on a rampage..

Iran my friend has no cred as far as I am concern to be talking about racism. Do you think you and I, especially, can get away with our music, dance, and good looks there? I doubt it.

Do you really have a big reason to hate Israel? There is a large Cuban Jewish community center near my mom's house. I know you are pro-Castro, so does that anything to do with it? I heard he sent some units there in the 70's.

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skipthesong at 12:16 PM JST - 21st April Do you really have a big reason to hate Israel? There is a large Cuban Jewish community center near my mom's house.

Actually my Mothers side of the family are of Jewish ancestry. I hold no dislike for Israel I find it to be a friend of us.

Tell me what made you believe that I was anti-Israel? I believe that my post are very neutral. What I am is a person that loves history and when folks try to sway the hearts and minds of people with non-factual stories about history I take it to task.

I ask questions and if I discover that what I was reading was incorrect then I accept it and take the source to task. But when I ask a question and all I get is the famous,"Because I say so" answer then I call it for what it is worth.

To question a person's story that is not factual is what we must all do. The moment we accept a story as fact without looking into it is when we join the ,"because" group and we lose our freedoms.

skipthesong at 12:16 PM JST - 21st April I know you are pro-Castro, so does that anything to do with it? I heard he sent some units there in the 70's.

LOL, good one, I am anything but pro-Castro.I maybe pro-Cuba but that is as far as that...I maybe more moderate than some here when it come to that subject and some may consider me proCastro because of those beliefs. Maybe you should have tossed the ,"Tu eres un Comunista" line to try and get my blood boiling. But that will not work either.

But that is another subject we can discuss in another topic.

It is good to be an Independent because if you are, you are not swayed by political rhetoric. Just the fact Sir, just the facts.

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Boycotting the conference is one thing. Walking out on Ahmadinejad's speech is another. Of the two, boycotting the entire conference is the sillier.

In regard to the walkout, however, repudiation is not refutation. Listening costs nothing and leads to greater understanding of the weaknesses and strengths of another person's argument. What is wanted and needed is refutation, not repudiation.

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Ahmadinejad is proving to be a great man.

Every neo-Nazi, neo-Marxist, and Islamist would agree.

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JoeBigs, you will be surprised to know Ahmadinejad also has Jewsih roots!

http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/129649 http://www.answers.com/topic/mahmoud-ahmadinejad

I think he is just too silly for a president ...

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Ahmadinejad calling Israel the “most cruel and repressive racist regime” is very appropriate. It is not hateful to speak the truth. What is hateful is Israel's actions, including just a few months ago when they murdered over 1000 Gazan civilians, which they have imprisoned within the Gaza borders. What is also hateful is that, knowing full well what Israel has been doing for the past 6 decades, the US continues to fund and arm it (and boycott conferences critical of Israel).

That some are complaining about the date coinciding with Hitler's birth date only shows how desperate they are to smear the conference.

“It is unfortunate that U.N. Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon deemed it appropriate to meet with the greatest Holocaust denier of our time,” the Foreign Ministry said. “This matter is especially severe, as it took place on the eve of Holocaust Memorial Day.”

What nonsense! Why does anyone continue to listen to Israel's foreign minister. Ahmadinejad is not the "greatest holocaust denier", he is simply asking why we cannot have an open discussion on the holocaust and why is it that the Palestinians are paying for something that was allegedly done by Germany. These are two valid questions that everyone should demand a answer to.

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Listening costs nothing and leads to greater understanding

What more do I need to understand from a leader who invites racists like David Duke to speak at holocaust-denial conferences? I have all the understanding I need. What a sad commentary that you believe there's some "greater understanding" to learn from this guy.

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Amusing how for some here if someone walks out on a Holocaust denier,sponsor of state terror and leader of a regime that murders its own critics they are supposedly narrow-minded and boorish.

But if a paid shill for the thug Al Sadr, taking cynical advantage of the freedom in Iraq, throws his shoe at the democratically elected leader of the free world he is a hero to these same people.

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Israel has been doing for the past 6 decades

Yeah, defending itself against Muslim Arab terrorists who want the Infidel ethnically cleansed from the Middle East.

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There's this odd dynamic going on where some people seem to want to prove they have a high level of tolerance by accepting other people's intolerance. That seems to be where common sense flies out the window.

Hate speech turns into free speech. Racism turns into expressing an opinion. Intolerance from one group turns into your intolerance for not accepting them. So when a man like Ahmadinejad puts forth hate speech rooted in racism and intolerance it's suddenly a question if I'm tolerant enough to support free speech when one man expresses his opinion. The actual content of the message gets ignored as if not accepting any and all messages is proof of my own intolerance. That's not part of the natural evolution of free speech and tolerance, it's actually just a circle that moves us back to where we were before.

There's a reason why the KKK isn't the keynote speaker at an NAACP conventions, just like there's a reason why the Nazi party doesn't open up for Holocaust meetings and Michael Jackson doesn't sing at Boy Scout conventions. Having Ahmadinejad open up a racism conference makes me want to find the person who made this possible, slap him upside the head, and ask, "What the hell were you thinking?!?!" In reality maybe the leader of a nation shouldn't have been invited to speak. Maybe a better choice would have been an individual who is famous for fighting racism. Come to think of it, it seems pretty obvious now.

Maybe in the future we're going to see hate speech and racism as some kind of protected class as the ultimate show of our support of free speech and tolerance. We seem to be heading down that path.

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What more do I need to understand from a leader who invites racists like David Duke to speak at holocaust-denial conferences?

Yes, that's the question.

I have all the understanding I need.

Whether it be right or wrong, your mind is made up.

What a sad commentary that you believe there's some "greater understanding" to learn from this guy.

Did I say that? I said that listening leads to greater understanding. It could, for example, reinforce the understanding that your previous understanding was correct and show how to clearly refute positions that you find obnoxious. It could also show that there are overlooked points of agreement.

Of course you would have to listen with a mind that is at least open to being open. The sad commentary is that there are so many who cannot.

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A politician should know the protocols of being on the world stage. U.N. Sec-Gen Ban shouldn't have to warn Ahmadinejad. Brinksmanship should not be in the equation during an international forum – he is after all using fighting words.

Inflammatory remarks that he knows will stir the crowd? Come on. He's gotta be stupid forgetful how the world is tired of his same speeches. You tell the same joke too often and no one will laugh, let alone invite you to the next party. Well, he said the same old rhetoric too many times and people rolled their eyes and walked out. It won't be long before he falls out of favour in Iran... and find him back selling kabobs in Tehran.

Listening costs nothing... but you also learn nothing in this case!

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SuperLib,

nicely said!

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Of course you would have to listen with a mind that is at least open to being open.

I gotta admit, SezWho, my mind is closed when it comes to racist Holocaust-deniers. Apparently yours isn't.

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When Ahmadinejad speaks, the only people who ignore the actual content are those who refuse to listen. You don't accept Ahmadinejad's views by the simple act of listening to them.

If people are incapable of listening to painful points of view, then by all means, let them excuse themselves. If people want to morally posture, let them walk, too. In my estimation, however, high dudgeon won't do anything to solve problems of racism, to solve the problems in the Middle East or to solve the problems in the world.

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Well, for those who missed his speech, here are some quotes:

The victorious powers [of the world wars] call themselves the conquerors of the world, while ignoring or down-treading the rights of other nations by the imposition of oppressive laws and international arrangements.

Following World War Two, they resorted to making an entire nation homeless on the pretext of Jewish suffering. They sent migrants from Europe, the United States and other parts of the world in order to establish a totally racist government in the occupied Palestine. In compensation for the dire consequences of racism in Europe, they helped bring to power the most cruel and repressive, racist regime in Palestine.

It is all the more regrettable that a number of Western governments and the United States have committed themselves to defending those racist perpetrators of genocide, whilst the awakened consciences and free-minded people of the world condemn aggression, brutality and the bombardment of civilians of Gaza.

[Conflicts in Iraq and Afghanistan were] a clear example of egocentrism, racism, discrimination or infringement upon the dignity and independence of nations.

Today, the human community is facing a kind of racism which has tarnished the image of humanity. In the beginning of the third millennium, the word Zionism personifies racism, that falsely resorts to religion and abuses religious sentiments to hide hatred.

Efforts must be made to put an end to the abuse by Zionists and their supporters of political and international means... Governments must be encouraged and supported in the fight aimed at eradicating this barbaric racism and moving towards reforming the current international mechanisms.

You are all aware of the conspiracy of some powers and Zionist circles against the goals and objectives of this conference... It should be recognised that boycotting such a session is a true indication of supporting the blatant example of racism.

Wise words from a wise man!

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I gotta admit, SezWho, my mind is closed when it comes to racist Holocaust-deniers. Apparently yours isn't.

There's no "apparently" to it. I listen because racist Holocaust-denial is not the sum and substance of what the man has to say. If you choose to reject everything because you cannot tolerate one thing, I think that is a poor choice.

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Every neo-Nazi, neo-Marxist, and Islamist would agree.

Thanks for proving my point sabi.

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Every neo-Nazi, neo-Marxist, and Islamist would agree. Thanks for proving my point sabi.

I love you too, helter!

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If you choose to reject everything because you cannot tolerate one thing, I think that is a poor choice.

SezWho, you've convinced me. I've got to keep an open mind and not reject everything. I'm going to start going to Klan meetings.

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I've got to keep an open mind and not reject everything. I'm going to start going to Klan meetings.

If you feel you need to go to extremes, OK. However, you could start with something a little simpler--like not walking out of meetings you've already decided to attend.

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I gotta admit, SezWho, my mind is closed when it comes to racist Holocaust-deniers. Apparently yours isn't.

Helter, I guess you agree that people should not be allowed to freely research and discuss the holocaust. And you also agree that the Palestinians should pay for Germany's alleged actions. These are the two main points Ahmadinejad is making regarding the holocaust.

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Sabi, no need to continue the charade of "research and discuss" the holocaust. We all know what it's really about.

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Saw it live last night.

Just when I was thinking the countries that boycotted the conference were in the wrong, Ahmadinejad pulled that stunt.

Imo he is a douche and he screwed himself and his country over by giving that speech.

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SezWho: If people are incapable of listening to painful points of view, then by all means, let them excuse themselves.

Sanitizing "hate speech" into "painful points of view" tells me that you're not being honest with yourself about the message that you're giving a platform to. I think that allowing a man like Ahmadinejad to speak at a racism conference is actually a step back for us. Again, giving someone a platform to spread intolerance isn't a symbol of our own tolerance, it's just taking us back to the days where that kind of speech was acceptable.

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Fairyprince:

" Imo he is a douche and he screwed himself and his country over by giving that speech. "

Not in the muslim world, he didn´t. They sat and applauded his antisemitic hate rant, as indeed they are here.

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Why I said, "imo".

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When people say there is too much violence on TV, the other side says, "censor yourself if you don't like it." SezWho says, "no, you should watch it even if you don't like it."

Why should anyone listen to Ahmadinejad's drivel if he doesn't want to. Self-censorship shows self-restraint at its highest level. This is the same reason why I think Nazis are garbage and Mother Teresa was a saint (small 's' even though I'm not Catholic). I'd walk out of a movie if I thought it sucked. Why should I watch the credits rolling when I disliked it from the beginning?!

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sabi,

u still haven't expressed what you wish for.. do you really agree with this guy 100%?

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Back to 1938. The locus of anti-Semitism in the West is again firmly on the Left.

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"The locus of anti-Semitism in the West is again firmly on the Left."

Hey, you guy on the radical right are pretty good at the hate thing too. I consider both you and fellow Islam haters such as willib to be anti-semetics in light of your posting history here.

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The UN is to blame for causing this stupidity.

Iran, and its' president are in violation of UN resolutions. Surely that should have been enough to deny him this soap-box to shriek from? Talk about enevitable...

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teleprompter: You know, you hit a note there. I see a very large scale anti-semitism and a big hug to Islam lately.

You can not possible tell me that such a small place is the reason. No, its hatred, which is why the Jews were never allowed to hve their own land to being with. And they still don't want to have one.

If you want to talk about the Palestinians problems, man, there are a lot of, even larger groups who are oppressed worse than these people. They are the right wing arm of the left wing and the UN has bowed to it..

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i would have stayed and have a good laugh at his sprouting nonsense.

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Not in the muslim world, he didn´t. They sat and applauded his antisemitic hate rant, as indeed they are here.

No! He did not criticize Jews. He only criticized Israel. There is a big difference between the two, stop pretending not to see it.

Why should anyone listen to Ahmadinejad's drivel if he doesn't want to. ...Why should I watch the credits rolling when I disliked it from the beginning?!

True, but going to a movie (or a speech) knowing in advance that you'll walk out in the first minute is rude and childish. This was their childish attempt at trying to discredit Ahmadinejad. By walking out, these childish individuals only exposed themselves as supporters of the murder of Palestinian women and children; I hope they each get well deserved criticism when they return home.

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No! He did not criticize Jews. He only criticized Israel. There is a big difference between the two, stop pretending not to see it"

Ok, if I criticize say Mecca, am I not being anti-Muslim?

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Israel has murdered hundreds of thousands of people (one third of them children) and yet for people who still rely on American media propaganda for information the story is about the Iranian President who criticize Zionism. Americans believe that Iran, Hamas, Hezbollah, Syria is intent on destroying Israel when in fact is it has already agreed to a peace agreement on the lines of the 1967 UN resolution. You can see from the UN votes how isolated the US and Israel really are. It will not be long before Israel runs out of money, since their main patron, the United States, is bankrupt. At that point Israel will have no choice but to shed its paranoid fortress mentality and accept a peace agreement based on the 1967 UN resolution and end it's apartheid policies.

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Israel will have no choice but to shed its paranoid fortress mentality and accept a peace agreement based on the 1967 UN resolution"

and what happens then?

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"Israel has murdered hundreds of thousands of people (one third of them children)"

Did you just make that figure up?

Heh, it sounded good though.

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And, where the heck are Jews suppose to go?

That's a strange question. There is no reason for them going anywhere. American Jews can stay in America, Russian Jews in Russia, and so on. If they can't stand the presence of non-Jews, they need help, not their own homeland; especially not at the expense of murdering and kicking out the Palestinian inhabitants.

Also, Jews already had Birobidjan; there was never any need for a second Jewish homeland. The Palestinians only had Palestine, but that was wiped off the map.

How is Israel the most oppressive when I can go there, date who I want, do what I want,

Funny, why is then that Palestinians have had their right of return illegally taken away from them?

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Ahmadinejad is an idiot and a bigot and is placing his country (Iran) in a very awkward position in world affairs. Having said that, there were two interesting factors at the UN Conference. One is that people (the EU nations for example) seem to have very short memories. It wasn't so long ago that over 200 young Palestinian children were murdered by Israeli military action in Gaza and most of the nations who walked out on Ahmadinejad were the very same ones who were outraged with the Israeli military action in Gaza. The other is that whilst the EU delegates walked out, most of the other nations stayed put and some of them even applauded Ahmadinejad. In a way, despite Ahmadinejad's rant, it was quite nice to see most of the other nations not pay any attention to the EU's predictable pro-Israel/ pro-US reaction.

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Actually, it's hard to tell if Ahmadhinejhad's apologists here are indulging the casual anti-Semitism that modern collectivists habitually espouse or if we are witnessing a younger generation of Europeans, Brits and Canadians that actively crave dhimmitude, of the sort that Islamic totalitarians like Iran's clown-president would be all too happy to impose on the gullible, useful Lefty allies they have beyond their borders.

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It is obvious that Iran has no real desire to be a constructive part of the international community. The strategy is clear, if they can cause confusion, contention, and division, then the UN will be unable to reach any kind of a consensus concerning punitive actions against Iran.

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Vid shows a lot of delegates walking out on this clown Mahmoud Ahmadinejad;and the crowd cheers them.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kRzd9obLjfQ

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He is just saying it as it is. Take off your shutters. What is happening in Palestine is a disgrace.

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I'm with the Zionist murderers. I hate humanitarians.

Next question?

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Now coming to the Middle East headache created by the creation of the state of Israel in 1948. There will be no peace as long as the Zionist control Israel and the USA. The only solution to the Middle East problem is that the Palestine should be re-instated as a full sovereign state which should consist of present day Israel and whole of Palistine. The Jews, the Moslem and Christian Arabs will become equal citizens of Palestine. The running of the Palestine state should be based on a system similar to Lebanon where as the Parliament has proportionate representation from each community - however, the offices of the President, Prime Minister and other offices be split according to the system in Lebanon e.g. the President can be a Jew, Prime Minister a Moslem Arab, Deputy Prime Minister a Christian Arab etc. etc. I can submit more details if interested or why not contact the Lebanese government and the French who created this system which works for the Lebanon and will most certainly work for the joint state of Palestine acceptable to all and peace will prevail the world over.

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Sabiwabi:

" No! He did not criticize Jews. He only criticized Israel. There is a big difference between the two, stop pretending not to see it. "

Yep, that is the standard excuse by the Jew-haters. They are not against Jews, they are only against the existance of the Jewish state.

But of course, it is the same. The reason that all muslim countries (even those far away) are solidly opposed to the existance of Israel is based in the koranic hatred of jews. Being a muslim yourself, you know that very well. So spare us the double-talk.

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More of the same and that's why the US didn't attend this little Israel bashing festival. What in the hell has Iran contributed to the goal of a Palestinian state exactly? Just more inflammatory rhetoric from a guy who doesn't present solutions only supports insurgencies and terrorist groups.

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9785426

" As any educated Jew can assure you, Zionism is not Judaism. "

On an anonymous forum, we can call ourselves what you want, but lets just say if you are an educated Jew then I am the Easter Bunny.

You know very well that the Israel is the only country in the region that has a functioning democracy and grants equal rights to its citizens.

And you know also very well that the only reason all muslim countries oppose the existance of the state of Isreal is that the existance of a non-dhimmi Jewish state in the middle of the islamic ummah is offensive to islam.

As for token representation of Jews (and Zoroastrians) in the Iranian parliament, I wonder for how gullible you take us.

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Finally the debate has clarified the difference between Zionists, Jews and "israel". So the Iranian President is "a guy who supports insurgencies and terrorist groups?" That would put him in the same league as all of the signatories to the US Declaration of Independence, the Bill of Rights and the US Constitution. That would also put the Likudniks and their thugs on the wrong side of history. Thanks usaexpat for clearing that up.

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LIBERTAS: cheeky reply but do you support Ahmadinejad's stance that Israel should be wiped off the map. I support a two state solution and both the Isreali's with their incursions and settlement building and the Palestinians with their rocket fire keep sinking the negotiations.

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An excellent analysis of Ahmedinejads supposed differentiation between Antisemitism and Zionism is here, by Howard Jacobson:

http://www.independent.co.uk/opinion/commentators/howard-jacobson/howard-jacobson-let8217s-see-the-8216criticism8217-of-israel-for-what-it-really-is-1624827.html

But of course those who´s mind is made up won´t read it...

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To put things in perspective. Every Palestinian leader, Iran, Syria, Hezbollah has already agreed to make a state according to 1967 borders, what are the Zionists waiting for? To be able to have a genuine state there are only 2 options and it is not very difficult to achieve this.

Israel retreats to the 1967 borders according to UN resolution 242 which every single country on this planet is in favor of except USa and Israel.

Make 1 state where both Palestinians and ZIonists have equal rights. 1 person under god. 1 person 1 vote.
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Nessie, since when Israel is part of Asia?

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9785426

" Make 1 state where both Palestinians and ZIonists have equal rights. 1 person under god. 1 person 1 vote. "

As an "educated Jew", I would have expected you to know that all citizens of Israel have 1 vote. They have several Arab muslim Knesset members, and last time I looked even a Cabinet minister.

What the "Palestinians" (aka muslim Arabs) want, is of course to swamp 5 million Jews with much greater number of muslim Arabs, and turning them into a minority in their own country.

Now pull the other leg.

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978

Make 1 state where both Palestinians and ZIonists have equal rights.

Jews are way too proud, and agressive, to even think of this.

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Nessie, since when Israel is part of Asia?

Since whenever Iran was part of Asia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:LocationAsia.png

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If Israel didn't exist, Ahmadinejad would have had to invent it.

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I don't know what all the fuss is about. I mean, th Iranian geezer only told the truth didn't he? Granted Iran aint no angels, but they don't use their military superiority to force another people into a living hell.

Israel is very racist, that fact is well known to us with a decent eduction and who have studied the nations small yet genocidal history. Israel is a disgrace and should be treated as a paraiah state like.

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That would put him in the same league as all of the signatories to the US Declaration of Independence, the Bill of Rights and the US Constitution.

An attempt to draw some moral equivalency between an Islamofascist and America's founding fathers. Is the left so deluded that they believe this guy is somehow going to help in their struggle for international socialism?

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[Make 1 state where both Palestinians and ZIonists have equal rights. 1 person under god. 1 person 1 vote.]

How do they recognize the Jews from the Zionists? This sounds like all Jews are Zionists. Isn't that opposite of what was mentioned earlier? I'm confused exactly what a Zionist looks like now... Is it like a ranting Islamofacist at an international conference who demonstrates his own intolerance when given a soap box to stand on? Who's the Zionist equivalent of this Dictator?

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9785426 has made a lot of claims with copious ideological formations, but has yet to provide a single parse of relevant supporting data for his phenomenology concerning Israel.

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SuperLib,

Characterizing Ahmadinejad's remarks as "hate speech" tells me that you are not being honest.

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IN the end victory will come to the people who supported justice and equality and not segregation and oppression.

Will this be the same kind of justice and equality we see in the neighboring states of Saudi Arabia, Egypt and Syria? Cuz if it is , count me in!

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First let me be clear. I am not anti-semitic. My views are shared by many Jewish people who are not pro-Zionist. We must make clear distinctions between Zionism and being Jewish. They are not one and the same. While many Jews support Israel and her policies, many do not.

Second. I want to point out that Israel has practiced policies akin to Apartheid for a considerable time now.Their repression of the Palestinian people equals the former repression carried out against South African minorities and in some ways exceeds it given the military nature of the conflict.

Third. Palestine did not belong to the Zionist, it was a multi-cultural state until Zionists, backed by several western powers enabled Israel to exist at the cost of the Palestinian community. Prior to the end of WWII this region had been allies of the west in both world wars. But post WWII politics caused the west to abandon those allies in favor of the Zionists who they felt were more reliable in keeping with their political objectives in the region.

Fourth. The only solution to Palestine is a unified shared state with equal interdependence. The two nation policy will not work now or ever.

Iran's president is not one of my favorite people. But his criticism of Israel's policies and racist practices cannot be blamed. Israel is an repressive, race centered state and should no longer be supported by the west. A multi-cultural nation that includes Israelis and Palestinians should be established with the intent of assuring mutual interdependence and cooperation.

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Bushlover. A Zionist is a person who believes in the "god" given right of Israel to establish a Jewish state in the Holy Land. Zionism is a lot like the old idea in American of Manifest Destiny which was used to justify taking lands from the Native Americans and for decades of wars waged in Mexico and South America during the 19th century.

Zionists believe that the migrant populations of Jews to Israel in the early 20th century was fully justified given their historical ties to the region. And that the establishment of an independent Jewish state was their god given right and morally justifiable by their historic ties.

Yet real history tells us that the region has always been multi-cultural and has been home to Arabs as long as it has been home to Jews. The less settled nature of early 20th century Palestinians enabled immigrant Jewish populations to gain an upper hand both economically and politically. When backed by military support from the west, the state was taken in a neo-manifest destiny ideology called Zionism.

Zionists have no more claim to the region than Romans, Egyptians or other national groups who ONCE held populations there. It is clear that Palestine was divided and stolen by Zionist immigrants last century at the cost of the autonomy, economic power and political freedom of groups that had already been living there.

The separation of Jews from Zionists is easy. Jews are people of many colors and nationalities. Some share faith practices while others are simply ethnically and historically tied to Jewish communities. Like any other people, they are spread around the world and integrated into many socieites.

Zionists are idealogues who believe in the divine right of a Jewish state to exist in the Holy Land. While Zionists are also Jews, not all Jews are Zionists.

Zionism is not limited to Jews. Other nations have practiced similar "historic right to location" policies that are equally divisive and repressive.

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So all Israelis are Zionists because they chose to live there? If this is not so then why do the Palestinians target more than just the Zionists? What exactly did the USA do to help Israel militarily to become a state? If anything Britain should be blamed for losing it for the Palestinians from the Zionists. So what's the solution? Kill all the Zionists? or accept your losses and negotiate a deal in good faith? So far that former way seems to be the one that has been chosen so it's no wonder Israel is on the defensive and those against perceive it as 'apartheid policies'. You can't gain trust and compromise when you are constantly trying to eliminate the other party. This is exactly why there will never be peace there. The unforgiving side of the Palestinians and their fake supporters like this clown of a leader of a country trying to gain nuclear technology. Personally I am not comfortable with these types of 'leaders' having that control. One day they'll get out of control and start enforcing their uncompromising position onto the other party. So this guy at this conference is somewhat of a joke no matter what your view of how Israel came into being. He should be seen as the stubborn old man that can never change his ways and shunned in the name of future peaceful relations. A true racist gets to demonstrate it at an international meeting. Classic.

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Bushlover. Of course not everyone in Israel is a Zionist. Just like not everyone in the US is not a a particular party or political affiliate. When talking about Zionism we are talking about the persistent ideology that Israel has an undeniable right to exist in priority over other local populations interests and in place of a greater Palestinian state.

As for the US and Britain. Sure England is to blame for much of the establishment of Israel. But long standing cold war US policy is to blame for the ongoing conflict and for continued support of the Israeli state. These are facts, like them or not.

The idea of a unified state has been offered up by more enlightened leaders on both sides of the conflict on and off for decades. But the extremes on both sides have kept this approach impossible. Largely due to the ongoing and anti-productive support by the US on the Israeli side and by various parties on the Palestinian side.

The only way of assuring relative peace is to create a degree of equality among all people in the area. This means economic empowerment and equality for Palestinians. It means legal protections and rights for all groups. It means power sharing and 1 person 1 vote politics. And it means the establishment of a secular multi-cultural state.

As for racist. Over the years I have heard everyone who is against Israeli politics called anti-semitic or racist. Yet many Jews I have met share the belief that Israel is an illegitimate state and should be replaced with a secular shared Israeli-Palestinian state. The constant accusation of racism is unfair when the issue is clearly about the politics of Israel and not the race of the people living there. We must once and for all separate the issue of Jewish race and religion from Israeli political behavior and policy.

As for unforgiving. How would you feel if a political group of mostly foreign immigrants moved into your state and began to dominate political and economic power? Then your allies from two previous world wars began to supply that same group with weapons and logistical support to gain military control over parts of your state. Then, when powerful enough, they began to wage war to secure their own separate state out of lands once held by you and your family.

Over the following years you were herded into the less desirable regions of your state, guarded by the enemy military, told when and where you could go and repressed physically and economically.

I bet you would be out there in the streets fighting back too. And even a midwestern good old guy would soon be thinking about armed insurgency to gain back his or her autonomy and freedom.

I argue that it is racism against Arabs that has dominated this issue. Racism that has allowed people to forge the suffering and oppression practiced against the Palestinians. And largely ignored out of misplaced sense of post WWII guilt applied not to the interest of Jews world wide, but to a select group of radicals with manefest destiny for a region that does not belong to them.

The only way the conflict between the west and the Islamic world will ever begin to be resolved requires that we first address this issue. Palestine must be restored as a unified Israeli and Arab state with a shared economic and politial future. This unification will compel all parties to reconcile in order to move forward. Will it be hard. Absolutely! Is it possible. Yes.It must be made to be so.

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So all Israelis are Zionists because they chose to live there? If this is not so then why do the Palestinians target more than just the Zionists?

For someone whose handle is "Bushlover", you seem strangely unfamiliar with the idea of "collatoral damage."

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The President of the Islamic Republic of Iran is an international pariah - or should be. He presides over a regime that is one of the most cruel and repressive in this world. It sends toung men to their deaths simply because they love each other, and it also does not tolerate any other religion than that of his brand of fanatical, hate-filled Islam.

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the 2 state solution will never work.

ehud barak in 2000,and ehud olmert has already agreed to established a palestinian state in the judea and samaria,in return of a complite peace and a stop to the terror,but the palestinans refused. they also want a full control on the temple mount in the old city of jerusalem,and the return of the 1948 evacuet arabs. no israeli goverment will agree to that. because it is clear that even after establishing a palestinian state and siging a peace contract that will assure jews the right to pray in their holly temple ruins,the palis would make it imposible to do in reality. the jordanian did the same until 67,they didnt allow jews to visit the western wall for 19 years,even though they promidsed too..the palis are already doing that in rachel tumb and josef tumb and also in the patriach tumbs in hebron. second,how israel is suppost to evacuet allmost a million jews from judea and samaria and then compinsent them?and on addition to that,evacuet other cities that are claimed by the arabs like acre,yafa,yavne,ashdod?the army and the police wont cooperat and the people will rebel against the goverment,it would be imposible. besaide,what right do palestinain have on this land?a land that most of them didnt live before the egyptian occupation in 1831,the increas of job oppurtunities that come with the news jewish towns from 1882,and the british ocupation in 1917. this land was occupaied for 1800 years by forginers,and its inhabitats.the jews,were murdered,de-poppoleted,oppresed and occupaied. you cant find a single year in history without jewish present in israel. the arabs,as occupaiers,oppresed the jeews in israel long before the rise of zionisam.in the 1841 revolt many jews in zfat,hebron,and jerusalem were murdered,zfats's jews were murdered afew times by the arabs. in 1799 many jews were attacked by arabs,especialy in gaza,but in zfat too.the city of tiberia was revived in the 16 century by the jews,only to be murdered by the arabs in the 17 century. and lets not forget the noturios oppresion of the jews of jerusalem in the 17 century by the gaza's proch family.

more then a 100 of the of those evacuet arab towns were old jewish towns,like yavne,yehudiya,tsipori and many more. there are stil today more then 130 arab cities in israel that are old jewish towns,a fact approved by traditions,travels records,tax paying records,and archealogic excavation finding. the jews under muslim occupation,didnt had the right to own land or to repair houses,so any beduim/mongol/crusaid war/revolt in the area,and there many,left the surviving jews that temporarly run away without their land when they returned.this is what happen in fkar yasif in 1841,and sachnin in the crusaid massacer. israel belong to the jewish people,just like spain was occupaied by the muslims for 800 years,so is israel,and now it is free.

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I still think Mr. A of Iran is a joke of a person to put on a pedestal and give him a platform for lecturing on racism when he is clearly one himself. Despite what he thinks of Israel or Jews or Zionists. The ME and it's people have time and time again painted the west with one brush just like you did with me because my opinion is more right wing than left in your own opinion.

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if you want to know where all that money that is being donated and colected fro the palestinians ill show you:

according to the law in the palestinain authority,it will support any arab,or israeli arab that seat in israeli jail,and belong to the patach party. every prisoner recive a 1000 shekel a mounth if he is jailed fora year to 5 yeras period. 4000 shekel a mounth if he is jailed for 25 yeras and more. every prisoner get extra 300 shekel a mounth if he is merried,and an extra 50 shekel a mounth for every child he has. if the prisoner is from the jerusalem area,he recives an extra 300 shekel amounth.there is also and addition 800 shekel a mounth puted in is cantine account in jail for purchasing close. from march 2009,the basic monthly salary will increas in 800 shekels.

prisoners that are relised from jailed,recive 500 dollars for les then a year jail time,and more then 10,000 dollars for more then 25 yeras jail time. they also get thousend of shekels for a mounth until they find a job.

until march/2008,there were 11,600 arab prisoners in israeli jails that were trailed for terror attacks.485 of them are from the jerusalem area,710 are on more then 25 years sentenc,and 287 are for over then 15 yeras.3205 of them are merried. without including child support,thats 13 milion in a mounth.and 165 milion shekel in a year. this is of course without the generos reward that the palestinina authorities gives to families of shaids. most of those prisoners area convicted terrorist that kill jews. maruan barguti,that is responsiblie fro many terror attacks,and a-sad,that among his terror attack was the famous murder of israeli minister,and wappa el bas,that tried to blow herself up in the erez crossing gate,and failed to.they all enjoy that.

so who his stopping the palstinan from growing? maybe its all that money they spand on terror attacks,and suppporting all those terrorist in jail?

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Look, you cannot just throw your hands up in despair over this situation or simply sit back and say "That won't work." Something has to work or this will be a legacy generations will carry forward.

Who would have believed that the Soviet Union would fall? Who would have believed that South Africa would be governed by all races? Or going back farther, who could have imagined a real democratic state existing?

Solutions begin with dreams for the better and must be carried forward with persistence. If the international community stopped funding Israel or made funding contengent upon the initiation of a joint state, then change would follow. That step alone would be enough to re-engage more moderate Palestinians in efforts to create a better state.

This must be done.

As for all the religious issues in the region. Frankly speaking, I would be happy if all the so called holy sites were obliterated. Their existence divides people and is a rationale for countless years of conflict. These ancient superstitions are a plague to humanity. One need only to look at the nearly inevitable war coming with Pakistan as the religiously mad Taliban are growing ever closer to controlling a nuclear armed state. Or look to the religious conflicts throughout history that have killed countless millions.

A secular multi-ethnic state in Palestine that protects the interests of all its citizens is the inevitable end for this problem. Until then, we will see endless bloodshed and it will increasingly spill into Europe, America and the rest of the world.

So you have two choices. Believe and advocate, or carry on with the status quo ad infinitum.

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If the international community stopped funding Israel or made funding contengent upon the initiation of a joint state, then change would follow.

That can only happen if the international community is lead by decent and honest people. Unfortunately, most leaders are corrupt and placed in leadership positions to carry out the dirty work of their masters.

A secular multi-ethnic state in Palestine that protects the interests of all its citizens is the inevitable end for this problem. Until then, we will see endless bloodshed and it will increasingly spill into Europe, America and the rest of the world.

I agree completely, that is the only thing that can work. A well informed world population would definitely push for this solution, so a truly free press is essential to achieve this.

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tkoind2: If the international community stopped funding Israel or made funding contengent upon the initiation of a joint state, then change would follow. That step alone would be enough to re-engage more moderate Palestinians in efforts to create a better state. This must be done.

I think what you're saying is that the world must agree to force Israel to wipe itself off the map. It's absurd. Literally. That's as much of a solution as saying the Palestinians must have over the keys to Gaza and the West Bank to Israel.

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have over = hand over

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I'm not sure that's what tkoind2 is saying. Even if it were, that would be no more absurd than allowing Israel to put itself on the map by ethnically cleansing its territory.

We can choose to look at this problem apart from its history and it is convenient for the beneficiaries of the history to do so. Not so for those who seem themselves as the victims of the history or who see their current claims being ignored.

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amedin should just muzzle it. he could let the palestinians live in iran or hand em some dough, but i bet he wouldn't.

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