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Irish bishop resigns in Vatican move against abuse

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A bishop will resign, but the church hasn't turned anybody over. < :-)

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adaydream, who do you suggest be turned over and why?

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People wanted results and now they're starting to get some. More steps need to be taken but it's a start.

A bishop will resign, but the church hasn't turned anybody over.

What? Do you think they have documents on this sort of thing? Or maybe they go to annual molestation conventions with well notarized guest lists. They're cooperating with authorities, putting pressure on those involved in cover ups, meeting with those harmed by the priests, and they're speaking to the public. They're already doing more than most critics expected but people don't care about that as long as there's some reason to lambast the church.

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Maybe, by the facts laid out, the Pope allowed a pediphiles to continue to practice. I'm sure he wasn't the only known pediphile priest to be practicing.

I haven't heard the leader of the church who was known to allow pediphila to continue apologize either.

Oh sure they do. Just like the Boy Scouts of America, they got all kinds of records. They don't throw anything away. < :-)

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who do you suggest be turned over and why?

The Pope, because he aided and abetted pedophile rapists.

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another Bishop takes the flack for Cardinal Brady, shameful.

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borscht said: The Pope, because he aided and abetted pedophile rapists.

Name one he aided and abetted while knowing he was doing so.

knackerz said: another Bishop takes the flack for Cardinal Brady, shameful.

At last, someone names a name! Brady was involved in a church legal process that had alleged victims of one Brendan Smyth stay silent during an investigation. But I know few details. On one hand it is smart to stay silent during an investigation. The real question is, did the investigation take place? But there is a larger question: why in God's name were the parents and children trusting in the church to do something? Isn't this the realm of the police? And that my friend is what so many of you are missing in you haste to attack the chuch. This whole thing was far more a failure of the legal system than the church system. It is not the job of the church to enforce the law. It is not primarly the job of the church to conduct internal investigations of illegal activities. Even the parents of the victims fumbled the ball there. Why do they get off scot free?

This dude Brendan Smyth was covered up Irish priests, not the Pope. He committed crimes in North Ireland but when found out escaped south to the Republic of Ireland. Does the church do extradition? No. It was the Irish authorities that messed up his extradition. What was the church supposed to do about that?

Smyth was the worst of the worst. But there is no evidence to think Irish priests covering him up has anything to do with the Vatican. All forms of abuse have been rife in Irish institutions for a long time now. No sense singling out the church at all. In fact, Irish society in general just tossed waifs into institutions and forgot about them. But somehow Irish society gets off, the Irish police get off, the parents get off, and the Vatican gets the blame.

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Oh sure they do. Just like the Boy Scouts of America, they got all kinds of records. They don't throw anything away.

That I can refute from a position of authority. I'm on a BSA district committee and our rules on this are very clear that we're to act in the best interests of scouts.

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TheQuestion, I was a Boy Scout Leader for 15 years, also. But, I was so enlightened by a CBS news story recently. They showed the files at a Boy Scout of America Center. They were not allowed access to the files, but the BSA had folders of abuse information. Then I'll remind you of the Oregon BSA leader that has been charged with abuse and they allowed him to stay in the unit as a leader for years.

The difference here is that the Boy Scouts haven't gotten the media attention that the Catholic Church has. The Church has been forced to apologize but you haven't heard any apology from the Boy Scouts organization.

I'm still waiting to hear the Pope's apology. I'm not a Catholic. But, it just makes a mockery of the public opinion of the Church. < :-)

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The catholic church seems to think it is important - or above the law. The need to be shown in the strongest possible way that neither of these are true. They are full of themselves. I say bring the grubs in this organisation to justice - and if this involves a raid on the "pope's" office, then so be it. Justice for the children whose lives have been destroyed is far more important than protecting a grubby mob.

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They were not allowed access to the files, but the BSA had folders of abuse information. Then I'll remind you of the Oregon BSA leader that has been charged with abuse and they allowed him to stay in the unit as a leader for years.

Then they were acting against stated procedure. I don't know what they do in other districts but I know how mine is run the same goes for the Church. I've been to churches all over eastern Michigan, I recently sponsored my nephew at his confirmation and all the clergy members I've spoken to are appalled by the activities of those perpetrating the crimes but assert that they do so outside and against the teachings of the church.

But, it just makes a mockery of the public opinion of the Church.

By and large the people really up in arms right now are the same ones that have been actively criticizing the church for years on every topic from abortion to abstinence in Africa or those that are against organized religion in general. We all recognize that the current problem necessitates a rapid solution but we're not out to placate anybody, it never works anyway.

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I see the hypocracy within the Catholic Church. But since I'm not Catholic I usually don't give a damn. I got tired of all churches in the last 15 years. I don't care for organized churches or organized crime.

But this is about child abuse. I do care. As a parent and prior BSA leader I just get disgusted at this. < :-)

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I don't care for organized churches or organized crime.

Well that statement was certainly enlightening.

As a parent and prior BSA leader I just get disgusted at this.

As any rational person should be. As all Catholics are.

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I say bring the grubs in this organisation to justice - and if this involves a raid on the "pope's" office, then so be it.

You mean the Vatican? That's not an office friend, it's a soverign country.

Justice for the children whose lives have been destroyed is far more important than protecting a grubby mob.

I never see this kind of outrage when it's a teachers union protecting a child abuser or, as adaydream pointed out, when the BSA center does it. I agree, step need to be taken and perpetrators need to be brought in but the notion of expanding their crimes to the entierty of the church is both ridiculous and insulting.

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TheQuestion

I never see this kind of outrage when it's a teachers union protecting a child abuser or, as adaydream pointed out, when the BSA center does it

Got to remember that the teachers/school union is a small entity, but the Catholic Church or the BSA touches almost everybody, whether Catholic or not. The tentacles of the Catholic Church and the BSA extend way past one city or county. < :-)

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The Catholic Church has been shuffling priests and bishops around the world for decades. Then it comes to the surface that the Pope may have conducted the same practice of hiding sexual abusers. < :-)

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Got to remember that the teachers/school union is a small entity

That's funny.

The Catholic Church has been shuffling priests and bishops around the world for decades.

There are relativly few reported cases of priest shuffling for this purpose.

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TheQuestion

There are relativly few reported cases of priest shuffling for this purpose.

This whole scandle has just opened up. Wait for the numbers start adding up. It won't be as few as you suspect. I don't have a number, but the US Catholic Church did a lot of it. I'm sure the rest of the world was just as active as the Catholic Church in America. My opinion. < :-)

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This whole scandle has just opened up. Wait for the numbers start adding up.

I've heard that one before.

My opinion.

Indeed.

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adaydream, name names. Above I talked about one priest who was hidden by other priests. You would blame the whole church for that when in fact it just seems that abuse is endemic to a host of Irish institutions. You said you care, but your collective blame is not remotely helpful. The Catholic Church is mostly helpful to children, just like the BSA, just like schools. I hate the politics of the Catholic Church as much as anyone, but its wrongheaded and destructive to go after the whole church for what a few priests did.

I agree with The Question that this is not really about child abuse. Its about people who hated the church already using this as a new weapon. Or, if you really care, name me another name. Just don't do it to continue a charade please.

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