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Islamic State militants claim responsibility for deadly attack in Jakarta

27 Comments
By NINIEK KARMINI and ALI KOTARUMALOS

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27 Comments
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As IS claim they are a "State", the Indonesian Govt should do what most states do when they are attacked by another state - go to war.

11 ( +10 / -0 )

RIP two brutally murdered citizens. Burn in hell five dirtbags.

ISIS must be destroyed. Moreover. Better still, they should not have been permitted to bloom.

2 ( +5 / -4 )

I clearly checked the box that said, "Do not let ISIS bloom" on my tax returns. Not sure what happened.

-1 ( +3 / -4 )

They were JV league by the liberals hero. At that time they were murdering Christians, Kurds and others. A mear few months later the were beheading westerners, burning people alive and taking over ex Iraqi armaments as they fled.

-4 ( +3 / -7 )

As IS claim they are a "State", the Indonesian Govt should do what most states do when they are attacked by another state - go to war.

the only option is go to war?create another terror?must be a joke!

0 ( +1 / -1 )

MarkG: They were JV league by the liberals hero. At that time they were murdering Christians, Kurds and others. A mear few months later the were beheading westerners, burning people alive and taking over ex Iraqi armaments as they fled.

Ah, yes. The JV team quote that you no doubt have on laminated cards by this point. You are correct. Obama "allowed" ISIS to form. He should have gone into Syria personally and stopped it, but he didn't. It's his fault, and by extension so is every single terrorist group on earth. He could have gone in and stopped any one of them, but he just screwed it all up.

1 ( +6 / -5 )

It's actually fairly easy to figure out what is Obama's fault by republican standards:

1) Is it something bad for everyone, and did it happen on our planet, or within a few thousand km of it? If yes - Obama's fault.

2) Is it something bad for Republicans? If yes - Obama's fault.

Conversely it's easy to figure out if something is not creditable to Obama by republican standards:

1) Does it make Obama look good? If yes, then Obama cannot take credit for it.

-1 ( +4 / -5 )

Fear not lads-No matter who the POTUS is the fact is the rest of the world is at stake & the rest of the world has to step to the plate as one to defeat these nasty beasts!

1 ( +2 / -1 )

You know Jakarta has for awhile been a destination that I wanted to visit though people warned me from doing so.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

IS is getting closer,Japan should stay alert.

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

Not really. Jakarta is thousands of I'm from Japan physically, and being a Muslim state, it's very far socially from Japan as well.

-8 ( +1 / -9 )

The Islamic State, built on literal, salafist interpretation of the Koran, continues to strike a chord with believers in islam all over the world. As long as there is movement in the islamic world to reform islam itself, this will only continue to grow.

3 ( +5 / -2 )

strangerland:

Not really. Jakarta is thousands of I'm from Japan physically, and being a Muslim state, it's very far socially from Japan as well.

Jakarta is a "muslim state"? Since when?

4 ( +4 / -1 )

The most populous Muslims in the world, most Indonesians are against ISIS. It'd be hard for ISIS to create a caliphate over there. Indonesia produces fewer ISIS fighters per capita than even Western Europe. ISIS is trying to project that they have a long reach halfway across the globe, but as this attack exemplifies where more terrorists got themselves killed than civilians they're targeting, it's a mess.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

@MarkG. President Obama was/is right---absolutely no sarcasm intended---ISIS, IS or whatever they call themselves are JV in terms of military might and intelligence. Save for their barbarism, there is nothing unique about this group. They florish for one simple reason; the lack of will to confront facts regarding ISIS and Islam in general.

If you don't want to be killed by ISIS, don't go to Islamic countries and don't intervene in their matters. Let the Syrians fight it out; it's not our problem. Ditto for Libya, Egypt and so on. If you don't want ISIS in your country, seriously curb and control Muslim immigration. What does this mean? It means telling people who are fleeing Islamic countries in order to be free from Islam that they must not recreate the Islamic conditions in their adopted countries that caused them to flee in the first place. That means no Shariah law, that means no altering school lunches or traditional holidays or curriculums to suit your paritcular superstition. If you want to pack a sack lunch on a day they serve hotdogs, that's fine, but the menu stay stays the same! That means no "special zones" where Islamic law is enforced like in Dearborn Michigan where the police look the other way when violence is Muslim-based. It means immediate deportation for any non-citizen---and those who immigrated with that person---proven to be in collusion with ISIS or any terrorist group.

That's what should be done. That's what some are advocating and why they are called bigots and racist.

1 ( +4 / -3 )

lostrune:

" The most populous Muslims in the world, most Indonesians are against ISIS. "

I don´t know what you mean by "the populous Muslims in the world". Do you mean "the most populous muslim country?" In that case, please note that Indonesia is NOT a "muslim country". Indonesia`s state ideology is Pancasila, not islam. (Although muslim parties are trying to change that).

And, as you can see in this article, ISIS does find some followers in Indonesia. Abu Bakar Bashir has a considerable following, and he has pledged allegiance to ISIS. Check it out, it is no secret.

3 ( +4 / -1 )

Wondering ... Will this cause Indonesia to try and exterminate ISIS as well?

2 ( +2 / -0 )

" The most populous Muslims in the world, most Indonesians are against ISIS. "

I don´t know what you mean by "the populous Muslims in the world". Do you mean "the most populous muslim country?"

The largest Muslim population in a country is in Indonesia.

And, as you can see in this article, ISIS does find some followers in Indonesia

Of course but

ISIS fighters per million population:

France ~14 per million pop.

Germany ~3 per million pop

Russia ~3 per million pop

Indonesia ~1 per million pop

http://www.deltatec.in/new1.asp?international/archive/2016/01/isis-indonesia-foreign-fighters/422403/

0 ( +1 / -1 )

bruinfan:

" Will this cause Indonesia to try and exterminate ISIS as well? "

No.

lostrune:

" SIS fighters per million population: France ~14 per million pop. Germany ~3 per million pop Russia ~3 per million pop Indonesia ~1 per million pop "

Firstly, why "fighter"? Any sympathizer can turn into a fighter any moment. Secondly, what "population"? If you count the non-muslim majority as "population", your figures are pure polemic. ISIS only attracts muslims, not non-muslims.

Last figure I saw was that Germany alone has a contingent of about 10,000 ISIS fighters... out of of Muslim German population of about 5 million. What math are you using to turn that into a "3"???

-3 ( +0 / -3 )

Sorry Republicans. ISIS started from the remnants of Saddam's Hussein's army that Bush and Cheney broke and Rumsfeld was unable to destroy. Because your boys forgot the following:

To win a war, destroy the armed power of the enemy.

Bush,Cheney and Rummy allowed OBL to get away from Tora Bora. Bush Cheney and Rummy failed to destroy the Ba'athist army.

Bush Bush,Cheney and Rummy were and are to blame for ISIS. Everyone knows this.

2 ( +4 / -2 )

Black Sabbath:

" Sorry Republicans. ISIS started from the remnants of Saddam's Hussein's army that Bush and Cheney broke and Rumsfeld was unable to destroy. "

Sorry Democrats... ISIS started from Jihadis which Obama supported in Libya and Syria (calling them "vetted rebels") does not change that, plus from disenfranchised Sunni tribes in Shia run Iraq. Yes, undoubtedly there are some ex Iraqi armee officers in there, but last time I looked Iraqi armee personnel did not serve in Syria, and the tens of thousands of ISIS "fighters" from Europe, Chechnia, and even as far as China (the Uiguirs) certainly had nothing to do with Saddam.

Maybe you want to go easy on the talking points and check some facts.

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

Firstly, why "fighter"? Any sympathizer can turn into a fighter any moment. Secondly, what "population"? If you count the non-muslim majority as "population", your figures are pure polemic. ISIS only attracts muslims, not non-muslims.

As ya even mentioned, any sympathizer can turn into a fighter any moment - they need not be Muslim; they can convert to Islam later.

Last figure I saw was that Germany alone has a contingent of about 10,000 ISIS fighters... out of of Muslim German population of about 5 million. What math are you using to turn that into a "3"???

http://www.rferl.org/contentinfographics/foreign-fighters-syria-iraq-is-isis-isil-infographic/26584940.html

Cite your source?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

"ISIS started from Jihadis which Obama supported in Libya and Syria"

ISIS formed in 2006 in northern Iraq well before Obama came to office. Is your memory so bad that you forgot who was in the White House at the time, and who was supposed to be running things in Iraq?

0 ( +1 / -1 )

Lostrune:

" As ya even mentioned, any sympathizer can turn into a fighter any moment - they need not be Muslim; they can convert to Islam later. "

ISIS is a radical Sunni organization that is murdering and force-converting non-muslims. The idea that a non-muslim (and a non-Sunni for that matter) would join ISIS is bizarre.

" Cite your source? "

German government estimate. And again, your source takes a ridiculously low number and then compares it to the total population, including the non-muslim majority. That is dishonest, to put it mildly.

Jefflee:

" ISIS formed in 2006 in northern Iraq well before Obama came to office. "

That was Al Quaeda, under different names. (Yes, same ideology, but different strategy.) ISIS declared its caliphate in 2014. And in 2006, Assad was firmly in control of Syria, so no, there was no Caliphate capital in Raqqa.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

" As ya even mentioned, any sympathizer can turn into a fighter any moment - they need not be Muslim; they can convert to Islam later. "

ISIS is a radical Sunni organization that is murdering and force-converting non-muslims. The idea that a non-muslim (and a non-Sunni for that matter) would join ISIS is bizarre.

If ya haven't noticed, ISIS takes credit for anything. They're opportunists; they're not like Al-Qaeda where ya have to be a member first. As long as it serves their agenda, they can convert their sympathizers into their brand of Muslim later, even postmortem. Being a Muslim is not a prerequisite for them.

" Cite your source? "

German government estimate.

Again, please cite your source. Don't tell us; show us.

And again, your source takes a ridiculously low number and then compares it to the total population, including the non-muslim majority. That is dishonest, to put it mildly.

You yourself said any sympathizer can turn into a fighter any moment. It's not just Muslims who are sympathizers. They can convert Muslim after doing the deed, or 5 seconds just before doing the deed (making the Muslim statistics useless after the fact), or not even convert at all just sympathizing in spirit. Potentially anybody can be a fighter any moment. Unless people and governments realize that, they'll always be blindsided. Too many times have we heard, "Oh we never expected such and such to turn out like that - he/she was never like that ever before." Anybody is potential.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

lostrune2:

" You yourself said any sympathizer can turn into a fighter any moment. It's not just Muslims who are sympathizers. They can convert Muslim after doing the deed, "

You keep saying that, but saying does not make it true. The claim is absurd. ISIS narrative is 100% radical islam, there is nothing in it to attract non-muslims. Why in the world would an atheist, a Christian, a Yazidi, a Jew, a Hindu, a Buddhist join ISIS? Or for that matter a Shiite (who are heretics in the ISIS narrative)? If you have not noticed, ISISI murders non-muslim men and takes the women as sex slaves. What in the world would the attraction be of either being murdered or a sex slave???

Can you name even one single non-Sunni muslim who has joined ISIS? Of course you can´t.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

The claim is absurd. ISIS narrative is 100% radical islam, there is nothing in it to attract non-muslims. Why in the world would an atheist, a Christian, a Yazidi, a Jew, a Hindu, a Buddhist join ISIS?

What do ya think the religions are of those ISIS sympathizers before they converted?

They weren't born Muslims. They converted. Why do ya think they converted? Obviously, there must be something that attracted them enough to convert; otherwise, they wouldn't have converted. They weren't born ISIS sympathizers - they became ISIS sympathizers.

For example, they're recruiting Christians:

http://www.ibtimes.com/islamic-state-recruiting-christians-muslim-converts-joining-isis-militant-fighters-1912252

"As many as one in six Europeans joining the caliphate are converts to Islam from non-Muslim faiths, including Christianity, the Washington Post reports. Others are coming from non-religious backgrounds."

Anybody can convert going to ISIS' side. They don't have to be Muslims until after the deed.

Can you name even one single non-Sunni muslim who has joined ISIS? Of course you can´t.

Ah that's not too hard: the renowned Sally Jones - she joined ISIS in Syria then converted.

BTW, ya still haven't shown us your German source yet.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

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