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Israel drafting new list of goods banned from Gaza

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“From now on, there is a green light of approval for all goods to enter Gaza except for military items and materials that can strengthen Hamas’

I wonder what items they consider as materials that can strengthen Hamas.

Under its blockade, Israel has banned all exports from Gaza, further crushing its economy. It has not yet said whether there will be any change in the export ban.

This says it all. The zionist regime is not concerned with security, they just want the Gazans to suffer.

When will the world draft a list of goods to be banned from "Israel".

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Not only do they block materials, they also block people, such as the German Development Minister who wanted to visit Gaza in order to inspect a sewerage works that has been financed by German aid funds.

http://www.thelocal.de/politics/20100620-27975.html

What possible security excuse could they have to deny him access? Who the ____ do they think they are, and why does the world tolerate this?

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I wonder what items they consider as materials that can strengthen Hamas.

Food, water, medicine.....

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Who the ____ do they think they are, and why does the world tolerate this?

They are the people who fire rockests......

As soon as each country "GETS OVER ITSELF" and stops the playing then perhaps the world will take notice. It cant be changed if only one comes to the table and the other continues fighting (firing rockets or attacking boats)!!

Come on us logic here people, those who say that Israel are the only ones who are fighting need to get a grip and notice what the Pals have done!

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And - each side is as bad as the other.....

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Somebody should consider implementing a total embargo on Israel. Put the shoe on the other foot and see how these folks like it.

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Palestinian population growth is the major threat to Israel and they know it. Poor medical services and a high infant mortality rate amongst Palestinians is in Israel's interest. Expect this to continue until world pressure makes Israel act in a more humane way.

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"Israel government and Hamas agreed to ban hope and peace"

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Poor medical services and a high infant mortality

With all the billions in foreign aid that have gone to Gaza for medical services, they should have Mayo Clinic quality healthcare at this point. What did Hamas do with all that money?

Sabi: the zionist regime is not concerned with security, they just want the Gazans to suffer.

You vote in an Islamic terrorist organization like Hamas, best expect some consequences.

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@Helter Skelter, please post a link to your proof of billions given to Gaza for medical services. PS: How well do you think the Mayo clinic would operate under the conditions imposed upon the Palestinians by the Israelis?

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Let in the "goods", keep out the "bads". Exporting from Gaza would only provide funds for Hamas. The Palestinian people would not benefit from exporting goods.

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hrd1231, oh come on! Everybody knows that cash alone can be rolled into everything from artificial arteries to artificial hearts, not to mention that its a great and sterile way to patch up holes. It also cures cancer. And it makes Julienne fries! No hospital needs anything but cash!(end sarcasm)

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BTTSimon said: Come on us logic here people, those who say that Israel are the only ones who are fighting need to get a grip and notice what the Pals have done!

Could you point to the posters who said the Israelis are the only ones fighting? Thanks.

I did not think you were a supporter of welfare over people having jobs. In fact, I did not think anyone was! You have quite a unique position there I think...if you actually have a job that is.

However, I myself have basically stated that the only ones who set up a blockade stopping fresh meat, honey, concrete, butter, rice, wheat etc. is Israel. If I am wrong on that, please let me know. And if you are going to justify such a blockade, give a shot.

djuice said: The Palestinian people would not benefit from exporting goods.

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djuice said: The Palestinian people would not benefit from exporting goods.

I never thought I would see anyone ever try to claim that welfare was better that having people employed! You must be the king of welfare supporters!

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sabiwabi:

" The zionist regime is not concerned with security, they just want the Gazans to suffer. "

Fyi, it is not the "zionist regime", it is the Israeli government. And as far as Gazans are sufferent (especially those who are not Hama supporters), they can thank the Hamas regime for it.

By the way, Egypt also keeps the border to Gaza closed, where is your anger about that?

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MistWizard: hrd1231, oh come on! Everybody knows that cash alone can be rolled into everything from artificial arteries to artificial hearts, not to mention that its a great and sterile way to patch up holes. It also cures cancer. And it makes Julienne fries! No hospital needs anything but cash!(end sarcasm)

Israel used to have a program where they'd help some Palestinians by giving free medical treatment in Israeli hospitals. That all ended when the militants convinced a disfigured woman to carry a suicide bomb with her to the hospital. She lost her nerve and confessed to the guards at the border.

That's the nature of people like Hamas. They took a program that was desgined to help Palestinians and the peace process and decided it would be a great opportunity to smuggle in a bomb.

My guess is that the embargo will be relaxed and Hamas will position itself to take over as much aid as possible and use it against Gazans to keep their iron fist rule. They've raided UN trucks in the past. Even when Egypt opened their borders you couldn't leave unless you were on a Hamas approved list. You can joke all you want about aid but in all reality it's not going to be what you imagine.

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WilliB said: Fyi, it is not the "zionist regime", it is the Israeli government.

One does not cancel the other. What is your objection to the term "Zionist Regime"? You got something against Zionism?

And as far as Gazans are sufferent (especially those who are not Hama supporters), they can thank the Hamas regime for it.

Hamas has only been in power since 2006. You think it was peaches and cream in 2005?

By the way, Egypt also keeps the border to Gaza closed, where is your anger about that?

Where is your memory about that? We have been through, under, over and around that. Israel occupies Gaza by virtue of controlling Gaza's inner borders, sea and air access. This is recognized by the U.N. If Egypt allows Gazans to have whatever they want over their border, they will be in deep doo-doo with Israel, possibly to the tune of war. Egypt's blockade started immediately AFTER Israel's. If you cannot see that Egypt is just following Israel's lead, then God help you with your Alzeheimer's.

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SuperLib said: Israel used to have a program where they'd help some Palestinians by giving free medical treatment in Israeli hospitals. That all ended when the militants convinced a disfigured woman to carry a suicide bomb with her to the hospital. She lost her nerve and confessed to the guards at the border. That's the nature of people like Hamas.

You are losing it big time Super. That may qualify as a reason to stop the program, but MOST CERTAINLY NOT to block imports of medical equipment. And that is why I am not even going to demand a link to prove it was Hamas and not some other militant group, since you first say "the militants" and then switch over to Hamas.

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"In one notorious case, Wafa Samir al-Biss, a 22-year-old burn victim from Gaza, went routinely to an Israeli hospital where she received free medical treatment as a humanitarian gesture. Militants convinced her and her family that since she was disfigured she would never get married and that she was better off becoming a martyr. A surveillance camera at Erez checkpoint captured al-Biss's anguish and desperation when her suicide belt failed to go off. Later, crying, she told journalists, "Maybe I have been used" by the recruiters. Al-Biss intended to blow up the very doctors and nurses who had been treating her burns."

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1617542-2,00.html

Looks like I had it wrong. She didn't have a change of heart until after. It's been a while since I read that.

The article says "militants," but I'm sure you can see my previous posts where I really make no distinction between the militants (usually the different groups within Palestine) and Hamas. It's the "bombs are the only solution" crowd that lives in Gaza.

You were joking about getting assistance to a hospital, so I was reminded of that story. At one point Palestinians were getting care from Israelis but we can see how the influence of militants can slam shut what seems to be a no-brainer. It's too bad that program couldn't continue, but its cases like this that show how the militants want Gazans to suffer as long as they are able to strike at Israel.

By the way, have the flotilla supplies arrived yet? I still haven't heard about that. Is Hamas still refusing them? And will any of the aid be going through Hamas? If so then you can imagine how it's going to be used as a weapon against Gazans if it isn't used as a weapon against Israel first. The militants and Hamas screw everything up.

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MistWizard,

And if you are going to justify such a blockade, give a shot.

This is what it is like to live within range Hamas's rockets. You have about ten seconds to find shelter once the alarm goes off.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ggKOjY_daiM&feature=related

Hama's could care less where they land, missed the school here though, lucky for them that day.

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But as Mist has said before, Hamas' terrorism is mitigated.

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For a brief moment today, Israel inadvertently banned it's national dish when a spelling mistake resulted in "Hummus" being added to the list of prohibited goods near Gaza....

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Under the new system, the government said practically all non-military items can enter Gaza freely.

I worry about that word, "practically." Practically can encompass quite a bit.

Taka

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Hey Sail, this is what its like to live in Gaza:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l0aEo59c7zU

You have no warning that helicopters are about to strike a car they already hit ten minutes ago, and never mind the crowd. Enjoy your schrapnel.

I would rather brave the rockets, thanks.

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And sail, I don't mind the blockade as far as it blocks weapons. I mind that it blocks butter, fresh meat, chocolate, rice, wheat, etc. Sorry, I should have been more specific. Please justify the blockade of these foods. Good luck with that.

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“A Hamas Cabinet minister, Ziad al-Zaza, rejected the Israeli decision, calling it “deception.” He told The Associated Press the blockade must be lifted completely “to allow Gaza to import all necessary materials, particularly cement, iron, raw materials for industry and agriculture, as well as import and export between Gaza and the world.”

The nitpickers are having their usual go at what Israel keeps out, but take a closer look at what Hamas wants in. “iron, raw materials for industry and agriculture” All materials suitable for the manufacture of either rockets or mortars. Yes, even the agriculture materials. Think about it because I am sure Hamas already have.

MistWizard

Allow me to ask you a simple question. Do you think Israel would allow groups of private individuals inside Israel to set up their own rocket launching sites (even very primitive ones) to fire rockets into Gaza and not do something about stopping them?

If this were to happen you would be one of the first to demand that Israel put a stop to it yet you forgive Hamas for not doing just that in the Gaza. Maybe you are not as fair minded as you believe yourself to be. Remember the last person to be killed by one of these ineffectual rockets out of Gaza wasn’t either Israeli or Jewish. He was a migrant farm worker from somewhere in Asia. So Gaza rockets do kill innocents.

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The nitpickers are having their usual go at what Israel keeps out, but take a closer look at what Hamas wants in. “iron, raw materials for industry and agriculture” All materials suitable for the manufacture of either rockets or mortars. Yes, even the agriculture materials. Think about it because I am sure Hamas already have.

Dude, nobody is blindly supporting Hamas. We know darned well what Hamas wants those things for. What we cannot figure out is what butter, chocolate, fresh meat and children's shoes have to do with it. Instead of constantly trying to pull us off course, and accuse of things we are not doing, could you please explain the list to us? Do you support it all, some or what? Will it kill you to criticize Israel over this? Is fresh meat a matter of nitpicking now? You a vegetarian?

To answer your question, no I do not. But this not a matter of pure willpower. You blithely skim over the fact that the Israelis are armed to the teeth and Israel is not under a blockade. Their jets and helis fly over Gaza every single day. Meanwhile, Hamas is not allowed to have even guns, things considered a basic right in some countries. These guys launch rockets and run. Do you think Israel shares info with Hamas so they can track the perps??? You think Hamas even has a spy drone???

So Gaza rockets do kill innocents.

As far as I know all 22 people killed were innocents. But I still guarantee you Israel has killed hundreds of innocents in the same time period, if not thousands. And they still deny fresh meat, chocolate, butter, etc. etc. ad naseum. and deny all exports. If you live under those conditions I doubt you would stop at rockets.

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Israel had an allow list and being the typical bureaucrats that exist in all countries they simply stuck to what was allowed. Wrong yes, of course it was wrong. A stop list would have been the way to go and it seems that is what is now to be used. Sadly I do not have that much faith that the bureaucrats wont screw that up too, but you don’t have to be pro or anti Israel to see that one coming.

“Hamas is not allowed to have even guns, things considered a basic right in some countries.”

You still can’t get your head around the simply matter of Hamas being the real problem here can you? Fatah have guns and Israel makes no effort to disarm them or block them from getting weapons, but Fatah are (for the most part) using their weapons responsibly. Give Hamas weapons of any kind and they will continue attacking Israel with those weapons. Even if you say Israel have no right to stop these weapons surely from a common sense point of view in makes sense to stop the weapons to take away what could be seen as Israel’s excuse, because that is all Hamas is doing, giving Israel the excuse to do whatever they please. Hamas could never win a war with Israel so what is the point of these meaningless attacks that do nothing but bring down more pain on the people of Gaza?

“Do you think Israel shares info with Hamas so they can track the perps??? You think Hamas even has a spy drone???”

Come on! I expect better from you than that. That’s more like a Sabi twist of reasoning. Hamas know exactly who is firing rockets and does nothing to stop them, and you know that as well as I do. I will take you seriously if you don’t slide into silliness.

“If you live under those conditions I doubt you would stop at rockets.”

If I wanted peace I would, wouldn’t you?

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MistWizard: What we cannot figure out is what butter, chocolate, fresh meat and children's shoes have to do with it. Instead of constantly trying to pull us off course, and accuse of things we are not doing, could you please explain the list to us?

The list was too harsh and it's good that it's being amended. Israel went too far with it and they should be criticized for it. And yes, I've criticized Israel in the past as well.

I do think, however, that whatever aid and supplies are let it will be used as a weapon by Hamas against Gazans. And like with North Korea we'll probably see a lot of skimming off the top by the government and militants.

As far as I know all 22 people killed were innocents. But I still guarantee you Israel has killed hundreds of innocents in the same time period, if not thousands.

That's why you don't start a shooting war with a country that's much stronger. Perhaps another way would be more productive. Since the rockets have been kept to a minimum the Israeli strikes have also been kept to a minimum. I don't think you can deny that when Hamas and the militants stop attacking, so does Israel. When they fire dozens of rockets a day they get a harsh response. Which option would you take?

I think grafton is right...I don't see you really coming to terms with Hamas or the militants. Until you're ready to accept who you are dealing with your message just won't be as effective.

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Perhaps another way would be more productive.

Both you and Grafton need to solder that into your programming. Hamas IS the other way. You both want Gazans just sit there quietly and accept the situations of Israeli theft and Israeli economic and military control.

Grafton you speak of peace but you always forget about the abuse. You would tell a battered wife to go home and just stop arguing with her man. Surely he will calm down if she keeps her mouth shut. Damn easy for you to say.

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Oh, and I love this "the blocking of food and medicine was just an innocent beaurocratic oversight" thing, and "Oh well, it was wrong but it will be okay now.". You guys do realize that people had to die to get this changed don't you? You guys do realize that it took violence from both sides to change this no? You guys do know that it is nearly always the cost of freedom?

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Hamas IS the other way.

Well I hope you're satisfied with the results. Personally, I think non-violent resistance would be more productive than "freedom rockets," but that's just me.

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Hey Sail, this is what its like to live in Gaza:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l0aEo59c7zU

Thank you for the 10 minute video and the "non-bias" commentary.

I hope you don't mind my link and it's lack of commentary on this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ygb6VrW8WZw

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Thank you sail for your patchwork of disjointed video the half of which I cannot even say has anything to do with the rockets.

I suspect we could play a nice game of "which is the most horrifying video" but its pretty damned pointless and you know it. I don't like the rockets but I like the aerial bombardments and helicopter attacks on Gaza even less. This attitude that rockets are terror and terrible but blockades of food and aerial attacks are just self defense is totally untenable bullcrap. How you cannot see it or at least smell it is beyond me. Then again, maybe you do and you know it well and you just come here to enjoy stirring the crap? Yeah, I have certainly run across those types enough in my life. They are the same kind of people to block fresh meat to a people just for the fun of seeing what happens.

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SuperLib said: Well I hope you're satisfied with the results. Personally, I think non-violent resistance would be more productive than "freedom rockets," but that's just me.

Educate me on non-violent resistance. When did it ever work? Of those cases, how can Gazans apply it in the same way?

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This attitude that rockets are terror and terrible but blockades of food and aerial attacks are just self defense is totally untenable bullcrap.

Please explain exactly what targets those rockets aimed for? Also please explain why a blockade would not be in order to stop them.

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Non violent resistance = Ghandi

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MistWizard at 10:38 PM JST - 22nd June

Nobody here has any influence on either the Israelis or Hamas, we cannot continue the blockade or stop it, we come here to discuss the subject and although we may come close to being rude to each other we do usually manage to control out tempers and not allow them to intrude into what we write. No we are not going to make the slightest bit of difference to what is happening in the Middle East but we do have and are allowed to have our opinions, and does include you. To suggest that anything any of the posters writes is “bullcrap” is going too far. I disagree with you and will try to show you why I disagree, I will make comparisons that I hope will allow you to see why I think the way I do, though I doubt that they will have much effect in changing your thinking. No your battered wife analogy was way off because to simply doesn’t work and the reason it doesn’t work is, as always, because you refuse to separate the people of Gaza from Hamas. Now there might be some reason for this in that obviously Hamas are gazans, but then by the same reasoning the leaders of North Korea are North Koreans, but you wouldn’t you in their case merge the two, but you do with Gaza, I don’t and as such see Hamas as the problem, not the Gazan people. Until you can separate these two you will never be able to condemn Israel without facing the obvious answer that Israel are facing a group of people that will never be anything but terrorists who cannot be reasoned with.

“Then again, maybe you do and you know it well and you just come here to enjoy stirring the crap? Yeah, I have certainly run across those types enough in my life.”

Maybe you have come across such people because of something in your personality that generates that type of reaction. Many here that you disagree with have shown that there are points on which they agree with you and nobody has wholeheartedly defended all of Israel’s actions. Yet if you had the power to do it you would lift the blockade totally today and allow Hamas the total freedom to do whatever they wish. Your indignation blinds you what the consequences of that would be. No I do not simply mean bigger rockets hitting Israel, I mean Israel hitting Gaza back and killing a large number of Gazans. And that end result would have been created not by Israel but by Hamas. There is no profit to be had fighting a war that cannot be won, a war that only leaves your people dead. And you would give the weapons needed for just such a war to the people that would start such a war. Israel’s blockade may be nasty, but is has probably kept more Gazans alive than it has killed. You are being unrealistic if you believe Hamas cares about the people of Gaza.

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Educate me on non-violent resistance. When did it ever work? Of those cases, how can Gazans apply it in the same way?

Two words: Mohatma Gandhi.

Taka

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MistWizard: Educate me on non-violent resistance. When did it ever work? Of those cases, how can Gazans apply it in the same way?

They just did.

By reducing the amount of rockets there has been very little violence over the last year. If Hamas or the militants had fired 100 rockets into Israel the week before the flotilla, how much of a change in world reaction would there have been? A lot, I think. This is a specific time when the violence can't be blamed on Hamas and the world is coming down with some harsh condemnation of Israel.

I told you before - the only thing that can stop Israel is international pressure. We're seeing that right now. The potential is there. Do you want to see sympathy for Gazans end? Just start firing rockets again.

It's just blindingly obvious that the less force the Palestinians use the better off they become. Israel becomes isolated and a change is forced. I just don't see how someone can actually advocate armed resistance as the best and only option for the Palestinians when there is decades of evidence saying otherwise. They cannot win militarily. It's counterproductive since it gives Israel protection from international pressure.

You really should read Dr. Martin Luther King's book. It's all there.

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Madverts and Taka, one name does not answer my questions does it? And you don't anything about Ghandi if you think his ways can be applied to Gaza. Ghandi's way was non-cooperation and it floundered for decades before a lucky break came. That break was WWII and the British were desperate for help from everyone including India. Non-cooperation was the lever that got Britian to grant independence. What in God's name is there for the Gazan's to not cooperate with that can excert that sort of leverage on the Israelis?

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Superlib, you totally forgot that the Israeli commandos were attacked as they boarded the last ship. You don't seem to realize why it was such big news. Without the attack, there would have been no deaths and it all would have been buried on page 7. The Israelis are not quite dumb enough to attack people like mounted police attacked MLK's peaceful marches. Besides, where the hell are the Palestinians going to march too? Its not peace that gets Gaza the world attention it needs to leverage Israel. Its not the lack of rockets that got things going either. However, the lack of rockets recently might have had an effect. But you know what? There had to be rockets before a lack of rockets would have done anything!

What you all fail to see is the simple need for leverage to get anything. You cannot sit there peacefully and expect a deal to fall into your lap.

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sailwind said: Please explain exactly what targets those rockets aimed for?

They can't be aimed for any targets. They are mainly pointed at towns.

Also please explain why a blockade would not be in order to stop them.

Wow! How many times do I have to say I don't mind so much the blockade stopping weapons and things that could be used to make rockets? My problem is food, medicine, wood, cement, kid's shoes, etc. etc. ad naseum. There really is nothing to crack, so stop trying to crack it. My postion on that is as pure as driven snow, and you only look like a fascist trying to justify the blockade of innocent goods.

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The flotilla is a unique situation. Turks died, not Palestinians. There's a difference. Had the attackers been from Hamas the story would have been chalked up as just another violent confrontation and yet another reason why Israel needs to defend itself. You'll see the difference if/when Iran starts sending ships to Gaza.

The Palestinians need to disarm and openly renounce violence. They need to stop violent attacks on Israel. It's not about marches or bus boycotts. It's about convincing the world that they do not choose violence as their response.

You seem to be using the death of the flotilla thugs as proof that violence works. But you're missing the bigger picture. The "victory" was that more supplies will be entering into Gaza. But you miss the point that there was a much bigger victory that they passed up on. By launching thousands of rockets and kidnapping Schaltt, Hamas brought the blockade on themselves. That was the net result of Palestinian violence. You're saying that attacking Israelis brought about an ease to the blockade and I'm saying that the entire blockade could have been avoided in the first place had they not used violence.

Peaceful resistance doesn't work in all cases. It won't work against the Taliban. There's no external influence to get them to change their ways. But we're seeing the external influences that can force Israel change their ways right now. And the international community will not continue to exert force on Israel if Palestine uses violence. It's that simple.

The key to peace in the region is not Palestinian violence. It's strange that you support that method.

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You seem to be using the death of the flotilla thugs as proof that violence works.

Maybe because it worked?

By launching thousands of rockets and kidnapping Schaltt, Hamas brought the blockade on themselves.

I cannot find those as justifications for the blockade nor as terms for its removal. Not saying you are wrong, just saying, how is anyone supposed to know that so that it can be done, ya know, if its true?

I'm saying that the entire blockade could have been avoided in the first place had they not used violence.

And you seem to think the blockade is the only thing going on. What about right of return? What about Israel trying to take Jerusalem? What about Israeli military patrols in Gazan airspace? What about Yassir Arafat airport, bombed out long before Hamas came along? What about fishing? What about freedom?

And you keep saying "peace". Peace this and peace that. Peace, peace peace. Peace is not the only issue either. An oppressive peace is no peace at all. They are not fighting for peace!

But we're seeing the external influences that can force Israel change their ways right now.

And it was all brought about by violent resistance.

And the international community will not continue to exert force on Israel if Palestine uses violence. It's that simple.

Its no longer about Palestinian violence. Its about Israeli screw ups. If violence and tunnel digging and complaining and jumping up and down will force more Israeli screw ups, it will be another victory.

The key to peace in the region is not Palestinian violence. It's strange that you support that method.

First, again, its not about peace. Its about freedom and right of return. Second, I don't support violence. I am just acknowledging that it can and has worked. I hate violence. But sitting there in the crap hole preaching peace will lead to nothing but more living in the crap hole oppressed by Israel.

You talk about MLK. You totally forget about the Black Panthers and Malcolm X. They played a role too. You also can't seem to realize that none of them went out searching for peace. They went out to demand their rights! I would like nothing more than for a Palestinian to be the next Ghandi and MLK and prove me wrong and you right. But my analysis says it can't and it will not happen. The only reason the Isrealis want peace is because they have just about every other thing they wanted, including and especially land that was not theirs, and also a country with a Jewish majority at any cost (and that cost was the lives and land of Palestinians and locking them up in a pen.)

In parting, things look pretty peaceful over in West Bank. What is it getting them? You think they will get Jerusalem for it? You think Israel will pull back to pre-67 borders? You think Israel will declare borders? Recognize the Palestinian Declaration of Independence from 1988?

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OK, so you support violent resistance and you think it's the best method for the Palestinians. We'll just go ahead and agree to disagree.

We're 60 years into this war but maybe, just maybe, the armed struggle is about to pay off. They did just get cake mix, after all. Things are looking up. If you see no reason to change the strategy then so be it.

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SuperLib said: so you support violent resistance and you think it's the best method for the Palestinians. We'll just go ahead and agree to disagree.

Stop putting words in my mouth. I don't support violence. I support Israel giving up what is not theirs and to stop oppressing Palestinians among other things. The Israelis don't budge so they get what they get. I am not suprised and I am not angered and I don't see any other method to get them to budge, but NO, I do not support it. You won't catch me sending money for arms to Palestine, or even researching the possibility.

If you see no reason to change the strategy then so be it.

I wish you would take the time to explain to me how the situation has improved in peaceful West Bank. The stategy did change. It changed with Hamas.

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sailwind said: Please explain exactly what targets those rockets aimed for?

They can't be aimed for any targets. They are mainly pointed at towns.

Towns that contain normal everyday civilians going about their daily lives. They target innocent civilians on purpose to turn them into bloody human posters for their cause. You alluded that I was some sort of fascist because I understand why Israel would blockade Gaza to protect her innocent civilians and also why they would try the make blockade as with enough hardship that the people of Gaza would take it upon themselves to rid them of HAMAS.

I for one refuse to reward murderers who target innocent civilians on purpose or give them the dignity to 'understand their cause'. I refuse to lie to myself that a terrorist is something more than just a cold blooded killer who kills innocent people on purpose.

Want to clear the intellectual fog ask yourself this. If a soldier targets innocent civilians on purpose he is guilty of a war crime. When a terrorist targets innocent civilians on purpose he is guilty of what?

Murder of defenseless human beings. You may be able 'understand' the lie a terrorist has to tell himself, that the 'cause' is so important that he can do away with his humanity to kill a bunch of shoppers in a market. I for will not put aside mine and refuse to reward it or nurture it. I condemn terrorists and those who support it to achieve a political victory no matter how bad the oppressor might be.

I do support armed resistance against an oppressor that is actively actively engaged in using deadly force against me or my brethren. But terrorists are not freedom fighters because terrorists target the innocent. Terrorists select women, children, airline passengers, office workers, and others uninvolved in combat and generally speaking incapable of defending themselves.

I also refuse to accept the concept that those who have to suffer under oppression do not know right from wrong when it comes to the difference between a terrorist and that of a fighter willing to try to protect them from the harm of an oppressor by giving their lives in armed combat.

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They target innocent civilians on purpose to turn them into bloody human posters for their cause.

No dude. They cannot target anything. That is why thousands and thousands of them and only 22 dead. I challenge you to go to Gaza and just point to a town in Israel.

You alluded that I was some sort of fascist because I understand why Israel would blockade Gaza

No, it was because you have so little say about the blockading of food and medicine. How does that get rid of Hamas? It doesn't. Its just fascist.

I refuse to lie to myself that a terrorist is something more than just a cold blooded killer who kills innocent people on purpose.

Then start condemning Israel. They drop bombs a lot more precisely than Hamas can even dream about it. Yet they kill more innocents. Freakish bizzare that you refuse to compute that.

I know the Palestinians are darned sloppy sometimes. But they cannot aim the rockets better without the tech. The Israelis on the other hand know exactly where their bombs and rockets go. The Israelis terrorize and kill more innocents than Palestinians. Why can't you apply your outrage by body count? Why can't you assign more blame to the guy who precision killed innocents and more of them? What part of blocking food and medicine being wrong confuses you?

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MistWizard,

Nice deflection. Once again targeting innocent civilians now don't miss these two key words 'on purpose' if you are in a nations military is a war crime and that includes the IDF.

A terrorist targets innocent people on purpose that makes him guilty of 'war crime' also. That should level the playing field for you in the discussion.

So Why are you are defending the criminals on the Palistinian side and only condemning the Israeli side?

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They can let in all the kaviar and luxury goods in the world -- it won´t stop stop the rockets and terrorists.

All the Hamas defenders here ought to read the Hamas Charter. It very clearly sets out the goal of the organization, which is to wage war on Israel until all of Palestine is under strict islamic rule.

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