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24 dead as fire crews try to corral Los Angeles blazes before winds return this week

42 Comments
By CHRISTOPHER WEBER and HOLLY RAMER

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Newsom on Friday ordered state officials to determine why a 117 million-gallon (440 million-liter) reservoir was out of service and some hydrants had run dry.

The answer is on slide 6 of this PDF published last fall by LADWP

https://www.ladwp.com/sites/default/files/2025-01/2024_BOOKLETS_WIP_Digital%20Final.pdf

The reservoir was drained to permit the repair or replacement of the floating cover, which was worn out and not protecting the water underneath.

Here is a description of the original project two decades ago to cover the reservoir. It was previously open air and thus the water was not protected from animals, birds and anything that could be blown in. They also had algae blooms that would periodically shut the reservoir down.

https://www.ladwp.com/sites/default/files/documents/Santa_Ynez_Reservoir_Initial_Study_MND.pdf

6 ( +12 / -6 )

Crowley, the LA fire chief, said city leadership failed her department by not providing enough money for firefighting. She also criticized the lack of water.

.

Who could have foreseen that a lack of water supply would be a catalyst for mass destruction?

Public authorities in California have a lot to answer for.

-7 ( +7 / -14 )

Who could have foreseen that a lack of water supply would be a catalyst for mass destruction?

That is just a right wing conspiracy. When the media officially announces it as true, sweep it under the carpet or act like you never called it a conspiracy and find something else 47 said to whine about.

-14 ( +5 / -19 )

firefighters and scientists have been warning about the tinderbox of southern california for decades. millions of acres burned, thousands of buildings destroyed and hundreds of deaths in the last 10 years alone.

apathy and whistling by the graveyard.

5 ( +9 / -4 )

Building codes are reviewed and updated after every major disaster, wildfires, earthquake, etc. Rebuilding houses need better fireproofing—zoning where some areas are restricted for houses.

2 ( +7 / -5 )

Again, you either save your life and cut off the leg or die from gangrene, you only have two choices

Cite even one expert who is proposing using ocean water.

(BTW, yesterday you denied proposing this. Today you’re really pushing for it.)

4 ( +9 / -5 )

fire prevention money won't stop lightning, arsonists, 100mph winds or people building in a "high risk fire hazard" region.

if any government in california mandated non-flammable roofs, emergency outdoor dousing sprinklers, etc., developers and maga would go nuts about over reaching regulations suppressing their freedom to build houses like kindling.

4 ( +9 / -5 )

All the very best to the brave fire-fighters and first responders. Working in those conditions would be insanely difficult and hazardous.

It looks as if the conditions with wind and weather are worsening over there. Sadly, the worst of the fires and destruction is probably yet to come.

1 ( +9 / -8 )

Owners of poorer properties need to be aware of "land grabbers" who try to buy the land cheaply when owners are facing difficult situations over all their losses.

4 ( +7 / -3 )

Pray For LA,

So many broken Dreams, So many broken hearts, hard to imagine watching your own Home and others go up in flames and nothing you can do to stop it.

-5 ( +0 / -5 )

Banks in the LA area are now offering a $1,250,000 interest FREE loans to home owners affected by the fires.

-4 ( +1 / -5 )

Cite even one expert who is proposing using ocean water. 

https://youtu.be/cad7oFZTSE4?si=zfIT3Mycxnn_wY7T

(BTW, yesterday you denied proposing this. Today you’re really pushing for it.)

No, I support anything that gets the fire out. By the way, now I understand the ramifications that come with that, but I want to live, so I’m cutting off the leg. Libs just want to die of gangrene.

You’re right.

I know

-17 ( +4 / -21 )

Best thing to do is to leave California. Leave the headaches, corrupt politicians, high taxes and quality of life or lack of…

-10 ( +8 / -18 )

Some people do not want to leave their birthplaces, and their homelands and will rebuild and stay whatever the consequences of that.

4 ( +7 / -3 )

Comparing with Australian bushfires , it seems nothing can stop a raging furnace , not water from helicopters , back burning, fire breaks and at this point in time, no man made structures are invincible either.

The fire intensity bends steel.

That says a lot.

7 ( +10 / -3 )

"No cause has been determined for the largest fires and early estimates indicate the wildfires could be the nation's costliest ever. A preliminary estimate by AccuWeather put the damage and economic losses so far between $135 billion and $150 billion."

And that's without counting the lives of the 16 who perished in that inferno. These perennial fires are nothing new, but every year is the same oh same ohh. I'm sorry we have been to the Moon, Mars, Mercury, Jupiter and back yet we haven't figured out the effective ways of fighting fires in our own backyard.!!

-6 ( +2 / -8 )

Best thing to do is to leave California....

And go to....?

1 ( +4 / -3 )

Probably some of us on here have witnessed or been involved in a raging wild fire, fueled by worst case scenario conditions - dryness and extreme winds.

Having been in the infamous 1983 Ash Wednesday fires in South Australia, that did in fact begin on Ash Wednesday, I know what an unstoppable hell can be. My small town did not suffer any person/property damage as we were alerted to evacuate and 15 mins before the Firey Maelstrom arrived, a sudden wind change saw it bypass the town by kms.

Others were not so lucky. I saw flames racing across the canopies of trees often leaping 100mtrs and exploding on contact. The undergrowth burning came quickly after. Some reports of embers igniting fires downwind kms away. Ember Rivers are a real thing. No escaping that.

I saw iron sheets & wooden poles blowing across the road mid-air with visibility very low with the air thick with black smoke and ash.

It was the perfect storm and sadly 14 people died in my area and a total of 75 perished across the states.

Nothing could stop such an inferno. The winds gusting up to 100km/hr with rapid changes prevented any real fire fighting attempts. This scene was repeated in dozens of places across 2 states. A day(s) of horror. A total of over 5,000km2 was destroyed.

I imagine the LA fires conditions to be no different - just that the population and buildings numbers to be far greater, hence so much more destruction.

Here is an extract from a radio journalist live to air watching his house burn in Adelaide on that first day.

At the moment, I'm watching my house burn down. I'm sitting out on the road in front of my own house where I've lived for 13 or 14 years and it's going down in front of me. And the flames are in the roof and—Oh, God damn it. It's just beyond belief—my own house. And everything around it is black. There are fires burning all around me. All around me. And the front section of my house is blazing. The roof has fallen in. My water tanks are useless. There is absolutely nothing I can do about it.

In the aftermath of this great tragedy there will be many questions to be answered, much reflection needed and much more thought to go into infrastructure, rebuilding, safety protocols, emergency services etc etc.

But for now, anyone who thinks this fire was fueled by politics just doesn't know.

Hoping the serious conditions forecast for this week can be overcome for the sake of all people of LA.

5 ( +7 / -2 )

Had those in charge focused on readiness and competence, this tragedy could have been avoided.

-7 ( +4 / -11 )

Beagle mate...I think it is in the nature of "tragedy " that it cannot be avoided.

Read Brownies comment above.

Eye witness account and eye opening.

0 ( +5 / -5 )

Beagle mate...I think it is in the nature of "tragedy " that it cannot be avoided.

I was listening to a professional firefighter and he said it would take 25,000 firetrucks to fight something like this. No state has this California, Texas, NO state.

2 ( +5 / -3 )

Who could have foreseen that a lack of water supply would be a catalyst for mass destruction?

It wasn't a lack of water supply. The problem was that fire fighters were pulling more water than the big trunk lines could deliver. The system was delivering four times its designed normal volume for 15 hours straight.

9 ( +11 / -2 )

fire prevention money won't stop lightning, arsonists, 100mph winds or people building in a "high risk fire hazard" region.

There is actually a great deal that can be done to prevent a repeat of this, and it has absolutely nothing to do with, cough cough, "forest management". There are no forests where these fires are burning. If you look it is homes and cars burning. The landscaping isn't burning for the most part. Burning embers from burning homes were flying miles, landing on other homes and businesses and setting them on fire. This is an urban fire. The city itself is burning and sending embers down wind to set more of the city on fire.

There are things builders can do when building new homes, and modifications existing home owners can make to their existing homes, to harden their homes against fires. Some of the most important are fire rated roofing materials ( and they include fire rates asphalt shingles ), non flammable exterior surfaces like stucco or metal siding, sealed eaves, dormer, attic and soffit vents with very tight mesh and a steel baffle to prevent embers from entering the attic and setting the home on fire (attic vents are one of the primary ways burning embers get into homes and set them on fire). Fiberglass window frames instead of vinyl, which melts, or metal, which transmits heat to the wood structure and to any indoor window coverings. Fiberglass window frames char but do not melt and don't transmit heat to the wood frame of the home. Use tempered glass in all windows so the heat of a fire outside doesn't burst the window and let flames in. On new homes make the eaves as shallow as possible to eliminate a fire trap. Use fiberglass exterior doors. Keep rain gutters clean. Don't let pine needles or leaves accumulate on your roof.

All these steps are well known and proven. Building codes need to change to require these features on all new and remodeled homes.

4 ( +7 / -3 )

That photo is heart breaking. Looks like modern day Hiroshima after the bomb.

-6 ( +0 / -6 )

Building codes are reviewed and updated after every major disaster, wildfires, earthquake, etc. Rebuilding houses need better fireproofing—zoning where some areas are restricted for houses

I agree. Good luck getting such changes through the legislative process. The building and real estate industries, those bastions of leftist socialism, will fight tooth and nail to prevent the State Legislature or local governments from implementing such changes. It required decades and many tragic losses to pass a law prohibiting new cedar shake roofs. People loved the look of a wood shingle roof, never mind the fire danger it represented and home owners, the real estate industry and building industry fought off efforts for many years to outlaw that kind of roof. It took a lot of lost homes to finally pass that law.

1 ( +6 / -5 )

The_BeagleToday 12:48 pm JST

Had those in charge focused on readiness and competence, this tragedy could have been avoided.

Because of course you can put out fires that spread acres every few seconds with no air support?

2 ( +5 / -3 )

One guy saved his house while others all around burnt down put six garden sprinklers on his roof. Sometimes simple solutions work.

In Japan, Kayabuki no Sato, also known as Miyama's Thatched Village, is a Japanese village with a hidden sprinkler system that protects the village from fire.

The village has 62 metal sprinklers hidden in traditional-style wooden houses. When a fire is detected, the roofs of the houses open to reveal the sprinklers, which shoot water into the sky. The water rotates around the village, creating a fountain effect. 

https://superinnovators.com/2024/01/automatic-giant-sprinkler-system-protects-thatched-japanese-village/#:~:text=Kayabuki%20no%20Sato%2C%20an%20ancient,and%2039%20have%20thatched%20roofs.

Another simple solution to a complicated problem.

-3 ( +3 / -6 )

Wallace - while the sprinkler systems as you described may work very well in Japan - as they also do in many other places - the conditions of the past week in LA would have seen such systems pretty much useless in many cases.

Tinder dry growth, desert dry air and up to cyclonic level winds fanning it all would not have been influenced much by sprinklers.

Then of course there's the water supply/ pressure problem and power outages that may have well complicated things for private sprinklers.

In such horrendous conditions a wet roof may help but it will not stop embers streaming into every nook and cranny of a building, esp in 100km gusts.

Saw on the news one guy who had a high pressure fire hose to spray his house, said the wind just blew the water stream back over his head.

Tough times.

7 ( +7 / -0 )

The Australian system has a number of warning statements finishing with "too late to leave ....preserve life "

Thats bloody scary.

Scary work fighting fires of any type.

Kudos to those that do.

3 ( +6 / -3 )

Why is it that California has so many wildfires -- while other hot and dry places in the U.S., such as Texas and Arizona and New Mexico, never seem to have them?

The knee-jerk blaming of "global warming" makes little sense. Or is "global warming" not so much of a thing outside California's state lines?

Between 2016 and 2019, the then-U.S. president repeatedly warned California and its governor about poor management of forests and of federal resources with regard to wildfires. He was essentially ignored.

-7 ( +4 / -11 )

This is from an article in 2021:

The California governor pledged in 2019 to reform California's approach to wildfire prevention, but a 2021 NPR investigation reported the governor overstated the efforts. 

"The investigation found Newsom overstated, by an astounding 690%, the number of acres treated with fuel breaks and prescribed burns in the very forestry projects he said needed to be prioritized to protect the state’s most vulnerable communities," Scott Rodd wrote of the findings in 2021. "Newsom has claimed that 35 ‘priority projects’ carried out as a result of his executive order resulted in fire prevention work on 90,000 acres. But the state’s own data show the actual number is 11,399."

https://www.capradio.org/articles/2021/06/23/newsom-misled-the-public-about-wildfire-prevention-efforts-ahead-of-worst-fire-season-on-record/

-6 ( +2 / -8 )

Have you ever visited any of these states, champ? Cacti don't burn as readily and violently as 200+ feet pines, firs and redwoods.

Why is it that California has so many wildfires -- while other hot and dry places in the U.S., such as Texas and Arizona and New Mexico, never seem to have them?

Wildfires were endemic to what would eventually become the state of California long before the White colonists arrived.

-4 ( +3 / -7 )

The knee-jerk blaming of "global warming" makes little sense.

Florida? North Carolina? Surfside condo collapse? East coast? Had a slight problem with hurricanes there? Global warming contributes to that (a lot)

Lionel Messi Paid $9 Million for a Condo in the Porsche Tower, Now the Building Is Sinking

(News source)

Not knew jerk. Just logical reason that is long term.

0 ( +3 / -3 )

It wasn't a lack of water supply.

Lack of what definitely had to do with the spread of the fires.

It came out of the fire chiefs own mouth. I mean she should know being the fire chief.

https://x.com/doveportland/status/1878613260305662131?s=46&t=YGWP_lcRZjddiWlx4QxURQ

The problem was that fire fighters were pulling more water than the big trunk lines could deliver. The system was delivering four times its designed normal volume for 15 hours straight.

That’s a different problem all in itself.

-11 ( +2 / -13 )

Why is it that California has so many wildfires -- while other hot and dry places in the U.S., such as Texas and Arizona and New Mexico, never seem to have them?

While Texas, Arizona, and New Mexico do experience wildfires, California tends to have more frequent and severe wildfires due to a combination of unique factors. California has a Mediterranean climate with hot, dry summers and mild, wet winters. The seasonal dryness creates an ideal environment for wildfires, especially after vegetation dries out in summer. Add to that, the state experiences seasonal Santa Ana (as was the call for this current blaze) and Diablo winds, which are hot, dry, and will definitely spread fires rapidly.

-9 ( +2 / -11 )

Apparently the San Joaquin Valley used to be the bottom of Tulare Lake, once the largest freshwater body west of the Mississippi before it was drained for agriculture.  Many wildlife and water scientists believe that restoration of the lake could create an abundant, biodiverse habitat. Even though it was drained 130 years ago, did this have any consequences related with the wildfires?

-5 ( +3 / -8 )

Hopefully President Trump can bring the rake manufacturing industry back to the USA from evil China to combat wildfires in California and other lefty states.

-2 ( +3 / -5 )

The media says that had a massive water reservoir been online, it wouldn't have made much difference to LA firefighters. It actually would have made a massive difference. And now a whistleblower has come forward to say the reservoir should never have been drained in the first place.

-5 ( +2 / -7 )

If Shirakawago can protect their gassho zukuri with a local network of water cannons, techno SoCal should be able to manage something.

1 ( +4 / -3 )

The media says that had a massive water reservoir been online, it wouldn't have made much difference to LA firefighters. It actually would have made a massive difference. And now a whistleblower has come forward to say the reservoir should never have been drained in the first place.

This is such a mess, and it’s only getting worse. I knew it…

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/fires-california-palisades-fire-homeowners-insurance-state-farm-fair-losses/

-6 ( +1 / -7 )

The most effective tool I have ever seen for use on fires when they are in the hills was C-130s equipped with modular fire suppressant systems. Unfortunately, President Reagan, in his infinite wisdom, decided that aerial fire fighting should be done by private companies, not C-130s operated by the various National Guard units. It makes me very sad when I see the civilian planes trying to fight the hill fires. The cannot carry as much suppressant as the NG planes, they cannot get in as close as the C-130s use to, they cannot land on the smaller airfields that the NG planes use, they take longer to reload, and, besides being less efficient, they are way, way more expensive to use. As for the planes and helicopters that go in and drop water, their loads are so small that it is a joke.

So, for idealogical reasons, most of the planes used to fight fires, no matter how inefficient, are run by private companies rather than by the government, the way they used to be run. The result is a higher cost to tax payers, more destruction to property, and more lives lost.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

@Desert_Tortoise.

it's all the things you say it's not.

Why stop forestry industry altogether? Surely managed COMMERCIAL logging would mean someone will care about out of controlled fires??? NZ has millions of Ha of managed forests, people who earn al living off of it, takes care of it.

Why drain water storage and not have temporary redundancy??

There's an entire ocean right next to those burnt out houses, why not pump, more water bombing etc.

Why let water flow into oceans to mimick conditions 200 years ago??

It's not a single solo thing, it's an orchestra of mismanagement.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

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