Malaysia says nerve agent killed Kim within 20 minutes

Nasty stuff. How stable is it? I wonder how long it takes to break down in an uncontrolled environment.

The really weird part is that the use of VX proves that their was a state actor here. It's not something you buy on eBay.

That can only mean that NK wanted people to know who did it. And that NK didn't care what China thought about it.

Wikipedia says VX can be delivered as a two part binary. Safe until mixed. That explains the two woman attack.

KJU's purged campaign resulted over 300 deaths of DPRK privilege class, and more to come. They all live in fear worshiping a young and insecure dictator. How many more VX nerve agent killings before U.N starts to wake up? Nations around DPRK should have enough stock pile of antidote to protect owns citizens. This nutcase is getting out of control.

North Korea has denied any role in the attack.

Deny it all you want. We know that asian Porky Pig was behind it.

Poor sod.

I don't take for granted Nk is behind it.First he was living years ago in exile made no threatens of any kind for his brother or regime ,everyone knows that,why now and why at airport?!if they were able to identify and reache him at airport,why no where else?!why no other nationalities but four Nk men in case Nk is standing behind?!Nk citizens-up to my knowledge-can't escape from their country,how comes they travel to Malaysia as tourists using their original passports,not faked ones?why they were not stopped or at least watched by Malaysian securities?!what I can say,there are lots of questions and mistries needed to be answered and revealed.until this happens and I doubt it wil!!I can say clearly am sorry am not fairy tales believer))!!

not sure DPRK would kill him so publicly. Unless to send a message. he was anyway living in Kim family property. They could have offed him any time.

Kim was dead within twenty minutes, both women that were arrested are still alive. Key question - why? If the arrested two were really given antidotes, then it debunk the whole "prank" story they were telling to the cops.

Good luck to the Malaysian police to sort it all out.

If the arrested two were really given antidotes, then it debunk the whole "prank" story they were telling to the cops.

How so? Maybe they weren't told they would need antidotes until after the fact.

Again,yes why and how comes the two women still alive to be witnessses?!why wasn't he killed easily away from airport without this BIG SHOW?!what threatens Kim was presenting to his brother regime?!he was all time enjoying his life!! I believe. If he would have represented 1 percent hreaten to NK regime he wouldn't be left like that without top protection ,nor living several years in exile without being hunted,this very simple security criteria kids in kindergarten know it))

Well, as Crazy Joe has already researched for us, it looks like each woman was in possession of one of the binary components of VX. The first one wiped his face with one component but it was not until the second one used her component that it became lethal. The first woman escaped but the second one reacted physiologically - she threw up, it seems - because she came in contact with residue from the mixture. She was probably lucky to escape with her life. And this seems to me to be congruent with a prank, the consequence of which was unknown to at least one and maybe both of them.

StrangerlandFEB. 27, 2017 - 10:30AM JST

If the arrested two were really given antidotes, then it debunk the whole "prank" story they were telling to the cops.

How so? Maybe they weren't told they would need antidotes until after the fact.

If they were given antidotes after the attack and before their arrest, they should have told the police so.

If they were given antidotes after the attack and before their arrest, they should have told the police so.

How do you know they didn't?

How do you know they didn't?

First, because the police would have told it to the media already. It would definitely make the case a clear-cut premeditated hit, without the prank side story.

Second, why to give antidotes after the attack? Do you think that for the organizers of the hit good health of the attackers was so important?

First, because the police would have told it to the media already.

How do you know? Are you privy to Malaysian internal police policies on media reporting?

Second, why to give antidotes after the attack?

How do you know they were given antidotes? The article only says:

more tests were needed to determine if the two arrested suspects were given antidotes so the nerve agent wouldn’t kill them.

It doesn't make sense for them to give antidotes after the attack since the suspects would be dead before they found out which anidote to give them.

How do you know? Are you privy to Malaysian internal police policies on media reporting?

I'm privy to logic. They told the media the whole scenario of the hit as they see it, then why hide a fact that only strengthen their case?

How do you know they were given antidotes?

I don't. Read more carefully, in my first post I wrote "If the arrested two were really given antidotes".

I'm privy to logic. They told the media the whole scenario of the hit as they see it, then why hide a fact that only strengthen their case?

If you were privy to logic, you'd know that the police release what they want, and only what they want, and if they have a reason not to release it, they won't. And since you are not privy to the internal investigation, logic would dictate that you cannot know if they would have a reason not to release this information, and therefore cannot know whether or not they'd release the information.

why hide a fact that only strengthen their case?

If they thought that releasing this information would impede upon their investigation and/or their long term case, they wouldn't release it.

Read more carefully, in my first post I wrote "If the arrested two were really given antidotes".

I read it, and in a later post you wrote:

Second, why to give antidotes after the attack?

The premise of that question is that an antidote was given.

If they thought that releasing this information would impede upon their investigation

So, they told the media the whole picture of the crime as they see it, they gave a lot of info about the suspects, named the possible organizers, fully aware that it would start a scandal with NK, but concealed this information? Sure, sure.

The premise of that question is that an antidote was given.

If you were privy to logic you'd read the whole sentence and comprehend that I doubted that the two suspects were given antidotes after the attack because it made no sense. May be before the attack, but after? Why? For the organizers of the hit the two attackers are better to be dead.

So, they told the media the whole picture of the crime as they see it

How do you know that they told the whole picture? Are you privy to the inside investigation?

If you were privy to logic you'd read the whole sentence and comprehend that I doubted that the two suspects were given antidotes after the attack because it made no sense.

How do you know they weren't?

North Korea has denied any role in the attack.

Well I'm glad that's been cleared up. For a mad moment I thought NK may have had a hand in this.

StrangerlandFEB. 27, 2017 - 10:30AM JST

Maybe they weren't told they would need antidotes until after the fact.

You are the one who started the hypothetical discussion.

When other people joined the hypothetical discussion, you blame others because the argument is hypothetical.

Enough is enough.

Time to stock up on atropine epi-pens, plastic sheets, and duct tape. Better make sure you have plenty of penicillin and an up to date smallpox vaccination.

What's the bigger picture here? Would the top brass expect that the population in N.K. would eventually learn of this? Is this killing part of a game plan to keep any dreams of insurgency in the country quelled? Was this more of a lesson than simple paranoia? Or both? It's true horror, no matter how you see it. Número UNO doesn't have to worry about his media, does he? By the way, Trump's team use of the phrase "corporate media" is really a joke. Does he expect the American population to be that stupid?

not sure DPRK would kill him so publicly. Unless to send a message.

That was probably the point - but the method was more important than the publicity. My guess is that they expected his death would be attributed to something like a heart attack, his body would be "repatriated" to NK, and no one would "know" except for those who are privy to the grapevine - to whom the message was intended: Don't FWM.

As it is, it's become a royal screw-up. Word has it that North Koreans are being prepared for further separation from the PRC, anticipating blowback that would have been coming anyway but will be fiercer now. http://www.dailynk.com/english/read.php?num=14383&cataId=nk01500

You are the one who started the hypothetical discussion.

I wasn't hypothesizing. My comment was in reply to this:

If the arrested two were really given antidotes, then it debunk the whole "prank" story they were telling to the cops.

My comment was showing another possibility to show that they could have been given antidotes for a reason other than the one claimed. I wasn't hypothesizing at what actually happened, I was debunking a conclusion that could not logically be made from the premise given.

Strangerland

How do you know that they told the whole picture?

The key words "picture as they see it".

How do you know they weren't?

You want to repeat it again, back from base A? OK, I can repeat again - I don't know, that's why I used "If".

But CH3CHO is right, enough is enough. No time for exercise in rhetoric.

The key words "picture as they see it".

And how do you know they told everything?

I can repeat again - I don't know, that's why I used "If".

And I pointed out how the hypothetical conclusion you reached wasn't supported by the hypothetical premise that you gave.

Or in other words:

Even if the arrested two were really given antidotes, it would not necessarily debunk the whole "prank" story they were telling to the cops, as it may be that they weren't told they would need antidotes until after the fact.

VX is a very potent agent and very hard to make - not something ya would do in the kitchen (it has to be a state-of-the-art controlled lab with resources)

So chances are it's a nation-state with the means

And not only is it against the Geneva Convention but also brought into a busy populated airport where anything can happen

Would make you think twice about mouth to mouth to help out.

The two women were expendable. Do you think NK really cared if they died or not? Just that they could not point a finger to NK. As reported, they kept their hands away from their side and went to a restroom! So they know something was going on. Yes, VX soaks through the skin, but something can be put on the skin that could delay or prevent that. He was a playboy, do you think a jealous lover went to the trouble of obtaining VX for the murder weapon, I don't think a crime of passion. With VX being used, it was a State, not an organization. Even ISIS can't get their hands on VX. Go down the list of States that may have wanted him dead. Do you think US or China is trying to frame NK? Throwing up, could be physiological, but also people in good physical condition after a bad experience have thrown up. Could be physiological. My thought, it was NK, but why so public? Possibly not on on Chinese soil to avoid angering China. If NK did not have his schedule in Malaysia, then waiting at a 'choke point' such as the airport would make sense.

The fact that neither attacker suffered from delivering the VX agent is interesting. My guess is that the first attacker smeared his face with let's say agent #1 and the second attacker sprayed his face with agent #2 activating the VX and that is why neither attacker got the VX in their system. In any case all involved will get the death penalty.