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NATO rules out any halt to expansion; rejects Russian demand

19 Comments
By LORNE COOK

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19 Comments
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Sorry Vlad, your puppet is no longer in power.

What does Putin think he's going to do? Fail so hard that somehow the United States fails as well?

Plummeting GDP, plummeting birthrates, no one emigrating there, and they think they can make demands?

The world recognizes weakness.

4 ( +10 / -6 )

Sorry Vlad, your puppet is no longer in power.

Puppet? Lol

What does Putin think he's going to do? Fail so hard that somehow the United States fails as well?

Statements like that are even more reassuring to hear that November will be the best year for the GOP because the left just don’t get it. If Europe thinks it can take on Russia then reality has completely eluded them.

Plummeting GDP, plummeting birthrates, no one emigrating there, and they think they can make demands?

They have nukes and a very hardened and trained military and the Europeans haven’t seen any military conflict since the Second World War.

The world recognizes weakness.

Oh, yes they absolutely do.

-3 ( +5 / -8 )

the Europeans haven’t seen any military conflict since the Second World War.

This is incorrect.

2 ( +6 / -4 )

https://amac.us/woke-culture-threatens-to-demoralize-us-military/

Well, that seals the deal. The US military has definitely gone woke because an op-ed in the "Association of Mature Americans" tells me so. Was this post even supposed to be taken seriously?

2 ( +4 / -2 )

I don’t disagree with the NATO position in any way but I hope Mr. Stoltenberg and the leaders of NATO member nations are prepared for a major mobilization to defend Ukraine. It is telling the US chose to keep a carrier strike group in the eastern Med and the USAF has been exercising LRASM armed B-2Bs in the Black Sea where American carriers are prohibited by the Montreaux Treaty from operating. Two Bones and their 72 LRASMs could give Russia’s Black Sea squadron a really bad day.

4 ( +6 / -2 )

Well, that seals the deal. The US military has definitely gone woke because an op-ed in the "Association of Mature Americans" tells me so. Was this post even supposed to be taken seriously?

Take your pick, many more, many, many more are talking and concerned about it, but no, I don’t think the left does take it seriously and that is absolutely frightening.

-6 ( +1 / -7 )

There are too many variables at play to know how things will play out. I doubt either Russia or the US are sure of how far they can go and what they can get away with.

The UK government has already said that, should Russia invade the Ukraine, there will not be a military response. Although the UK will do whatever the US tells it to, the Western response to Russia taking the Ukraine (or China taking Taiwan) would most likely be economic and diplomatic, pulling down a new iron curtain and replaying the latter half of the 20thC, with small wars fought by proxy in developing countries flooded with military kit.

It would suit the major players to have external enemies. Americans seem to need to hate a common enemy to stop them hating each other, whilst Russia and China can wipe away all Western influences as traitorous and seal their borders.

The biggest hit would be to what is left of the global economy, Germany (energy) and Japan (trade and physical isolation - no Euro/JP flights over Russia and China). Although there is no international tourism left to lose, the economic hit for Japan would be fearsome. No chips from Taiwan (Sharp's owners are Taiwanese you'll recall), nothing at all from China. South Korea are hardly a friendly trading partner. Japan's closest ally would be Australia.

Leaders will act according to their domestic needs. NATO has zero interest in invading Russia although Russia would like to recover control over the Ukraine and the surrounding dictatorstans that emerged after the break-up of a Soviet Union that Putin would love to revive. China want Taiwan but still have some international trade to lose. If they feel domestic heat from their Covid Zero policy and Xi's reforms/restrictions, an external enemy might be preferable. Hong Kong turned out to be easier than they would have expected. They will be weighing up the costs and benefits Re: Taiwan.

For Russia, the Crimea was easy, but the Ukraine may be a lot more like Chechnya once they are in it. Neither Washington nor Moscow are politically solid enough to bat away an endless stream of soldiers returning in body bags.

It's interesting because it is a mess, and because the big options are finely balanced. Anything could happen and whatever does, is unlikely to be good. Nobody seems to care much any more about peace or trade. It's all now about borders, turf and conflict.

4 ( +4 / -0 )

It seems foolish to ignore Russia's red lines, further expansion may be the final straw. America was ready to start WWIII over the Cuba missile crisis and yet it seems to that Russia will accept expansion as fait accompli as it has in the past.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

that guy on photo is totally out of touch with reality.

really incompetent "boss".

you could proceed easier way now you will learn hard way.

molodec.

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

It's going to be interesting to see how the Americans etc react when China decides to create a military alliance amongst its trading partners most often threatened by the US.

No, they won't establish Chinese military bases, but might set up a hosting/co-training/standardized equipment system. And Iranian missiles and drones in Cuba with a small contingent of IRGC members, and a declaration that an attack on Cuba is deemed a direct attack on Iran, across all theatres, well, the spittle would definitely be flying, propelled by the thumping of chests, in Washington.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

After this, expect some 'incidents' that Mr. Putin will use as excuses to go 'protect' ethnic Russians living in Ukraine.

But I don't understand why in the winter. Even for military units which have trained for winter combat, sustained operations are difficult to maintain, and no one can control the weather. Napoleon and Hitler learned the hard way what the winter weather in eastern Europe can be like. A storm front can paralyze any invader, even those coming from the east.

Or is it to threaten Western Europe with turning off the gas supplies while their populations are most vulnerable?

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

NATO rules out any halt to expansion; rejects Russian demand

What a disgrace. NATO needs to go down the drain.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

NATO rules out any halt to expansion; rejects Russian demand

Exactly the correct course of action. NATO makes it's own rules and if Russia wants a say in that then is needs to apply for membership. Failing that it needs to mind it's own business, not interfere with it's neighbors decisions and return stolen and occupied lands to their rightful owners.

Of course Russia wants to expand its territory and put other nations as a buffer between it and NATO. Russia also knows nobody in the world has any intention or desire to invade Russia. Russia is the invader in Eastern Europe and has been since WWII.

Old Soviet satellite states see a brighter future in the EU and more safety in NATO membership at the moment which Russia finds tough to take as it wants to be the main force in Europe. After all, why be the worlds strongest nuclear power if you cant get your way with those countries around you? It is a little embarrassing for Putin at home that smaller nations especially ones it used to order around, no longer do what Russia dictates.

Russia has CSTO and Europe has NATO. Europe makes no demands of CSTO and Russia should have the same policy with NATO.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

@zichi

We have Putin/Crimes. Putin/Belarus. Putin/Ukraine. Putin/Georgia. Putin/Kazakhstan

And what are Putin's crimes there? The more correct picture will be like that: NATO crimes - Yugoslavia, Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, Ukraine.

@Sal Affist

After this, expect some 'incidents' that Mr. Putin will use as excuses to go 'protect' ethnic Russians living in Ukraine

No such incidents needed. Any shelling of Donetsk rebels by Ukrainian regime forces is a clear violation of the Minsk peace agreements of 2015 (and the Ukrainians violate them regularly), any such shelling can be used as a perfect reason for a peace enforcement operation. Putin does not do it simply because he knows that it's easy to defeat the Ukrainian army and take under control the whole Ukraine, but after that he'll to have to feed something about 30 million people on a territory with barely alive economy, to support the whole populace of a country ransacked by the West after it staged a coup d'etat in 2014. The West broke it, the West will have to keep it and support it.

@Peter14

Russia is the invader in Eastern Europe and has been since WWII

Taking into account NATO's criminal record it can be said that NATO is the invader not only in Europe.

Old Soviet satellite states see a brighter future in the EU

As long as they get EU subsidies. EU pays - they demonstrate love. When the subsidies program ends (and it will be in three - four years max) they will say bye-bye to the bureaucrats from Brussels and their silly demands. No money - no honey. Look at Poland and Hungary.

Russia also knows nobody in the world has any intention or desire to invade Russia

USA, the main engine of NATO, desperately needs a major deflection from its dire financial situation - its national debt is already unsustainable and keeps ballooning, the dollar step by step losing its status as a world reserve currency, USA is losing economic supremacy to China. The US considers China as the more urgent threat and wants to deal with it first while keeping Russia busy with local conflicts. A little war will be even better, and brainless Ukrainians are the perfect cannon fodder for it. All the US has to do is to give them some money and weapons. If Europeans are involved in such a war it is even better, after all they are also economic rivals to the US and Americans will not shed tears if Europeans get hurt. Nothing personal, it's business.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

Or is it to threaten Western Europe with turning off the gas supplies while their populations are most vulnerable?

What is interesting is that in the last two weeks or so over two dozen ships loaded with CNG for China have been diverted to Europe. China apparently over estimated their energy needs going into the Lunar New Year where the nation more or less shuts down for weeks, and the price of gas in Europe has spiked higher than it is in Asia right now. So traders are taking advantage of an arbitrage opportunity to make some more money diverting loads from China to Europe. One ship loaded in Louisiana, transited the Panama Canal and was making its way across the Pacific to China when it turned around. The seller is even paying for a second trip through the Panama Canal ($400,000 or so) because the price in Europe is so high.

An aside, the US is ready to cover any shortfall in Russian gas deliveries. So far the EU has refused to contract for gas from the US because US production methods are exceedingly sloppy. Methane emissions are uncontrolled in much of the US and it is a powerful greenhouse gas. But if Russia closes the spigot that could change overnight.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

That NATO clown circus just bark at the beat US orders..

0 ( +1 / -1 )

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