Nearly 2 million excess deaths followed China's sudden end of COVID curbs: study

A nation built on lies.

Speculative.

That's just normal when you hear to and trust advice from others or outside bystanders without sufficient own thinking or when you leave a good working strategy you once used to stick to. Many of them still could live.

That's a lot of people, and probably much higher.

Chinese bleach and shining lights into bodies don't work, either. Millions around the world died unnecessarily because of their incompetent callous governments. The enormity of these crimes of negligence has been swept under official carpets to avoid accountability for the usual suspects.

AramaTaihenNoYouDidntToday 01:43 pm JST

Speculative.

Given that China's government releases nothing but lies as its "statistics," this kind of study is all we have to go on.

Were China a responsible country it would allow a full and unhindered investigation into the origins and effects of COVID (not the sham WHO visit, controlled by the CCP). But it does not. Why? Because it is guilty as charged, and the CCP doesn't want to "lose face," to the detriment of the Chinese people and the entire world.

Sickening.

But the Chinese Communist Party has never cared about the lives of Chinese people. In fact, the mega rich elites like Xi hate the Chinese people. Their negligence all through this deadly virus proves this point clearly.

From start to finish China has not been honest about Covid19. To the CCP, keeping control of the country is far more important than 2,000,000 lives.

The study by the federally funded Fred Hutchinson Cancer Center in Seattle was taken from a sample of mortality data published by some universities in China and internet searches.

It found an estimated 1.87 million excess deaths from all causes occurred among people over 30 years of age between December 2022 and January 2023, and were observed in all provinces in mainland China except Tibet.

To make even a projection or estimate to suggest 1.87 million excess deaths from all causes occurred among people over 30 years of age between December 2022 and January 2023, would require full access to all the data.

The outcome could be considerably higher than the figures quoted.

The reason why WHO needs to fully establish the origins of the virus

None of the stats from during Covid Zero can be trusted either. A pandemic will get you in the end. You can reduce the initial deaths a bit, but with severe collateral damage from lockdowns, lack of medical care for other issues, educational damage, increased domestic abuse, increased suicide and economic damage that leads to other social and medical issues. Anyone who believes that we can dodge a pandemic entirely by following their rules is a con artist. Diseases move through us just as avian flu moves through birds. Covid is just another bug of many. Accept it, mourn the dead, count yourself lucky, and move on.

No wonder people are escaping China anyway possibly!!!

https://www.yahoo.com/news/escape-china-jet-ski-dissident-185348594.html

what a 3rd world country.. nothing but lies and deception..

OK, so the number has to be double that of the US. This is pure propaganda. China has a lot of old people so the number of death normally would be higher. The point is China had successful controlled the spread of the virus for three years while the West couldn’t. What will happen next time?

A nation built on lies.

That might describe most nations.

Unfortunately this was exactly as predicted by the many different health authorities that for many months criticized China for persisting in its zero covid policy in spite of the scientific data that proved it was unsustainable and that preparations like increased vaccination of the whole population was necessary. Even at that point the experts said millions of unnecessary deaths could follow once the policy finished unless the government of China did something to protect their population.

The government did nothing, and this is the result.

Weren't all Chinese using SinoVAC? Wasn't that supposed to be as effective as whatever the west used? What we don't know is how many of those deaths were just added for political rivals and anti-CCP Chinese?

When it comes to controlling any disease, there are pros and cons to any methods. New Zealand and China mandated lockdowns. Other places effectively had no lockdowns and had a higher death rate than most of the world. Then there were places with strong public health measures that people followed with a few lockdowns, but not years of them destroying their economy.

I still blame President Trump for over 50% of the deaths in the USA. His lies killed people and lead the foolish into anti-vax land that they've not been able to get out. Fools. It is just sad what a single idiot-leader can cause for an entire country. Canada had about 50% less deaths than the USA. Canada was less than nearly all European countries.

Australia had about 50% less deaths than Canada. Japan, Taiwan, SK did a little better than Australia, but not as good as NZ. I think the way these counties handled it should be studied. Appears to be the right mix of mandates, freedoms, and vaccinations.

NZ had about 20% less deaths than Australia.

I'm eyeballing those numbers, so they are highly rounded. They are per-100,000 people.

Countries that reported fewer than New Zealand seem to be mostly bad at counting and govt statistics. I can't trust any of their claimed numbers. I don't believe NK claim of just 6 COVID deaths. Similarly, in the USA, if someone was going to die already due to other causes, but also had covid, then due to the way govt medical funding works, they would be reported as COVID deaths. That leads to over-reporting in the USA.

Almost the same level as other countries.

Proves though that the zero covid policy was the best policy to save lives, as experts have also shown in other countries such as Australia, Vietnam, Taiwan etc.

Almost the same level as other countries.

The point of the article is that the evidence indicates this "same level" was completely unnecessary, and if the number of deaths reported is actually just a tiny fraction of the actual excess deaths found, that means the numbers released by the Chinese Government are completely unreliable, it is simply more likely they have been hiding deaths in the same way as they tried to hide the debacle caused by the predicted failure to sustain the zero covid policy.

Given that China's government releases nothing but lies as its "statistics," this kind of study is all we have to go on.

True, but not any worse than in the west.

Almost the same level as other countries.

The point of the article is that the evidence indicates this "same level" was completely unnecessary

The excess deaths in the west were also completely unnecessary.

True, but not any worse than in the west.

Much much worse than "the west". No equivalent case can be found where the actual excess of deaths makes the reported cases only a tiny fraciton.

The excess deaths in the west were also completely unnecessary.

Unfortunately this applies only because antiscientific groups keep misleading the population into rejecting safe and effective measures so there were many excess deaths that could have been prevented with a much wider and strong acceptance of things like vaccines, masks, isolation, etc.

The excess deaths in the west were also completely unnecessary.

Unfortunately this applies only because antiscientific groups keep misleading the population into rejecting safe and effective measures so there were many excess deaths that could have been prevented

Yes, exactly, very true.

Yes, exactly, very true

Good that you accept vaccines, masks, isolation of the general population were effective and safe enough to promote their adoption from the beginning, and that antiscientific groups promoting things not recommended by any respected institution of science in the world were the ones in the wrong.

Yes, exactly, very true

Good that you accept vaccines, masks, isolation of the general population were effective and safe enough to promote their adoption from the beginning, 

I certainly do not accept that.

The evidence does not support it.

I certainly do not accept that.

You contradict yourself, quoting my comment and saying it is true is exactly that.

The evidence does not support it.

The experts of the world say the opposite, no institution of medical science in the world say the evidence do not support the value of those measures. It is not believable to pretend they are all wrong.

The evidence does not support it.

With regards to masks and isolation the evidence "unequivocally" supports it :

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/aug/24/lockdowns-face-masks-unequivocally-cut-spread-covid-study-finds

The experts of the world say the opposite, no institution of medical science in the world say the evidence do not support the value of those measures. It is not believable to pretend they are all wrong.

As for the experts of the world, the CDC is certainly an institution of medical science that promoted face mask use,

WHO says there is no need for healthy people to wear face masks, days after the CDC told all Americans to cover their faces

https://www.businessinsider.com/who-no-need-for-healthy-people-to-wear-face-masks-2020-4

so there were many excess deaths that could have been prevented with a much wider and strong acceptance of things like vaccines, masks, isolation, etc.

So, you must think the WHO is an antiscientific group since it was promoting things not recommended by respected scientific institutions.

As for the experts of the world, the CDC is certainly an institution of medical science that promoted face mask use,

What is the point of the comment? the quoted text even says the difference in the change of recommendations is only days different. That mean BOTH recommended masks to be prioritized for hospitals and symptomatic patients first, and for the general population months after the beginning of the pandemic when the evidence was enough to change the recommendations.

This is only something you keep posting in unrelated articles (like this) to misrepresent the WHO just because it was on the forefront to criticize China on its failed policy, even when the US government did the same for the same scientific reasons

https://www.cnbc.com/2022/11/28/china-zero-covid-us-criticizes-beijing-supports-right-to-protest.html

Plenty of graves filled with people who "did their own research."

Those who properly inform themselves are much less likely to get sick and die.

Those who properly inform themselves are much less likely to get sick and die.

Which requires listening to the experts and the data that proves what kind of measures are effective. "Inform" themselves with pseudoscience can have the opposite effect.

As usual people that like to think they know better than the whole scientific community of the world are not exactly going to be well informed.

In February, China's top leaders declared a "decisive victory" over COVID.

It is factually proven and agreed by the medical community that zero covid prevented the loss of lives more than any other strategy used in the world.

What is the point of the comment? 

I understood it. It is very clear and concise.

It is factually proven and agreed by the medical community that zero covid prevented the loss of lives more than any other strategy used in the world.

No, it is not, actually the article is about the experts proving the contrary thanks to scientific evaluation of the deeply negative effects it had and how China choose to hide the excess deaths.

I understood it. It is very clear and concise.

Yet you can't even explain it, not addressing the arguments that refuted it, clearly indicating it is not the case.