world

Netanyahu hits back at Iran Holocaust claims

100 Comments

The requested article has expired, and is no longer available. Any related articles, and user comments are shown below.

© Copyright 2009 Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed.

©2020 GPlusMedia Inc.

100 Comments
Login to comment

Ahmadinejad turned aside the subject of his questioning of the Holocaust. Instead he argued that since the Holocaust was perpetrated by Europeans, the Palestinians should not have had to pay the price by accepting a Jewish state in their midst.

How could it something that Ahmadinejad last week in Teheran claimed never even happened have been perpetrated by Europeans? He should settle on one version and stick to it. Right now he's behaving like a used carpet salesman.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

He should settle on one version and stick to it.

Its the reporting, or the misreporting of his views, that causes problems. Ahmadinejad had three main points, and nobody has been able to give a decent answer to his major one: why should the Palestinians pay for something that allegedly was carried out by Germans. He also questioned why we are not allowed to freely investigate and discuss it (anybody that provides contradictory evidenced or expresses contradictory views is jailed in many European countries). And finally, if I remember correctly, he stated that the alleged holocaust is used (abused?) as a tool; and Nettedyahoo bringing the "blueprints" to the UN sort of confirms it.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Then he held up the blueprints including gas chambers and crematoria for Auschwitz-Birkenau, the death camp where more than 1 million Jews were murdered.

Which blueprints? The ones for the camp that was destroyed by allied bombing? Or the new one they built after the war?

and strongly denounced its report accusing Israel of war crimes in its winter war against Palestinian militants in the Gaza Strip.

UN reports were made after seeing the devistation in Gaza. Schools were bombed, children were murdered. How is this different than the treatment they have received from the Nazis? How can they blame Nazis when they are doing the same thing on Palestanians?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

he asked. “Are those tattoos a lie?”

As far as I know, nobody has ever questioned the tattoos. And nobody has ever questioned the existence of the concentration camps.

“The greatest threat facing the world today is the marriage between religious fanaticism and the weapons of mass destruction,” he warned.

That is the only statement from NettedYahoo that I agreed with. The greatest threat facing the world today is Israel, a dangerous combination of "religious" fanaticism, weapons of mass destruction (including nuclear weapons and recently used illegal chemical weapons) and a complete disregard for international laws and treaties.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

And why there are laws against denying the holocaust? What happened to the freedom of speach? Which other "truth" need the protection of law? You can go on about denying anything, except the holocaust? Something is wrong with this picture.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Damien15

Perhaps the reasoning behind making Holocaust denial a crime in some countries is because anyone who denies that the Holocaust occurred is basically trying to cover up a monstrous crime. Covering up any crime is itself a crime, so I guess that applies to the Holocaust, too.

Personally, I wouldn't make it a crime. Let the Holocaust deniers come out from under their rocks and be exposed for the vermin they are. And for the record, there is absolutely no doubt in mind about the extent of the Holocaust. I've seen official documentation from both the German and U.S. governments, as well as the Nazis' own records. I have visited Auschwitz. I even spoke to a former concentration camp guard when I lived and studied in Germany in the 1970s.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Covering up any crime is itself a crime, so I guess that applies to the Holocaust, too.

Yes, but why this one is so special that there has to be a law about it? Were there that many people denying it? What were their reasons of the denial? If there were overwhelming evidence, why did they have to take those deniers seriously? Anyone can deny anything? If they have evidence, documents, there should be no doubt that it happened.

Problem is, there were never enough evidence about the 6mil figure. It was made up by allied forces and they had no reason to stick to the truth. Which is noone knows how many Jews were killed.

documentation from both the German and U.S. governments, as well as the Nazis' own records. I have visited Auschwitz

Did you know that the Auschwitz was totally destroyed by allied bombing, and was rebuilt by Russians "to the exact specs"? Did you know the original building had swimming pools and concert hall? I'm not saying that Jews were swimming in the camp, but its original purpose was not exterminating Jews. Surely many has died, but was it systematic killing? Was the number really 6 mil? I doubt it very much.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

I've seen official documentation from both the German and U.S. governments, as well as the Nazis' own records.

I'm sure you can tell us which documents you've seen that prove the holocaust claims. The truth is, there is no solid evidence of an extermination program, despite the countless claims of "mountains of evidence". Nobody can show us an actual gas chamber that was used to exterminate people. The one shown at Auschwitz was built after the war. The blueprints shown at the UN show nothing.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Yes the Holocaust occurred, but I get tired of hearing about it. It's like reliving it over and over is going to make things better. Not likely. Living past it and continuing to live in the now and future is the best thing for all.

Good grief, Ahmadinejad’s comments on the Holocaust will always fuel anger if you want it to. Ignore him and his comments and you'll be happier and less stressed out about Ahmadinejad.

I'm not saying not to be aware and not to be active about never allowing it to happen again, but Israel uses this crying jazz to get everything they want. Wa-a-a-a...Wa-a-a-a-a...Wa-a-a-a. < :-)

0 ( +0 / -0 )

but Israel uses this crying jazz to get everything they want.

Exactely. So can we also say, if Holocaust didn't happen (in the extent), they couldn't get all those things they got now? Like a country, money and one of the biggest arsenal of nuclear bombs in the world?

Also would I be out of line if I said that they Jews have declared war to industrial Germany first? Look it up.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

I think this is once again about a power hungry country, who consumes too much oil, trying to control a coutnry rich in oil. Simple as that.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Wow. I don't think I've ever been as horrified and as offended as I am after reading this thread. I'm not even going to bother to argue with you. I'll just say, Damien, sabiwabi, please, please go to Europe and openly, publicly declare your laughable belief that the holocaust never happened. You'll both find a very nice home, right where you seem to belong.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

There are thousands of pictures available to show you what went on in these camps. Mountain high piles of hair, clothes, skin etc. etc. Absolutely horrible and disgusting. Those pictures are not fake.

I admire the Iranian president for his guts, but he should open up his nuke facilities to show the world he is indeed sincere, and should have face to face talks with Obama over a beer and a Cola.

The Israeli PM should stop the building and take down the walls, and help the Palestinians. I know the Palestinian Ambassador to Japan. Really nice guy. The people just want peace, and to be able to take care of their families.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

There are thousands of pictures available to show you what went on in these camps. Mountain high piles of hair, clothes, skin etc. etc. Absolutely horrible and disgusting. Those pictures are not fake.

Yes, they left all that behind, but not the gas chambers! Nobody denies that many people died, but ALLIED forensic investigations at the time could not find any evidence of gassing. They concluded that most of the deaths were due to disease, mainly typhus.

Because the Nazis did not want the inmates to die from typhus, their heads were shaved and their cloths were deloused (gassed), that explains the piles of hair and clothes.

BTW, by the piles of skin, are you referring to the lampshade story? That is now accepted as propaganda, nobody believes it anymore, well almost nobody.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

"The Iranians deny they are producing such weapons, but Israel, the U.S. and other world powers don’t believe them. Iran so far has refused to stop enriching uranium, a process that could be used to make bombs. Israel considers Iran to be its greatest threat."

Ah yes, those "other world powers", who might be ? Anyone else see how this is playing out ? Once again, its up to the Americans to do the dirty work for those "other world powers" who insist on straddling the fence.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Mountain high piles of hair, clothes, skin etc. etc.

So, wouldn't you say that it's bit strange, where we can find all that hair and clothes and skin and all, but no trace of skulls and bones of 6mil people? Where did that number came from? Can anyone explain how is it possible to kill 6 mil without leaving any trace behind?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

concluded that most of the deaths were due to disease, mainly typhus.

And the real purpose of the Cyclon B gas was to disinfectize the beds and sheets to prevent from the typhus.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Ignore him and his comments and you'll be happier and less stressed out about Ahmadinejad.

He'd be easy to ignore if he didn't have a nuclear program which includes nuclear power plants, thousands of centrifuges for enriching uranium, and enough uranium hexafluoride gas to make 100 nuclear bombs.

How can they blame Nazis when they are doing the same thing on Palestanians?

Huh? It's the the Muslim Arabs who are continuing their quest to exterminate the Jews. They were key players in Final Solution and collaborated with the Third Reich. Israel is not going to let this happen again. As long as the Muslim Arabs continue their genocidal quest, they will suffer the consequences. Cry me a river for the poor "Palestinians."

The greatest threat facing the world today is Israel, a dangerous combination of "religious" fanaticism, weapons of mass destruction

Too funny. Israel has had nuclear weapons for half a century and proven itself to be a responsible nuclear power. The greatest threat facing the world to today is Muslim terrorists getting their hands on nukes. Imagine the consequnces of a terrorist exporting nation like Iran obtaining nukes. Or if Pakistan, which has nukes, were to be taken over by Muslim terrorists.

Islamic natons must never be allowed nuclear technology. Unless the civilized world takes the proper stand , it is Muslims who will be responsible for the next nuke to be detonated in the world. Anyway, I'm hoping Israel is going to teach the new Hitler of the ME a lesson and level his nuclear program.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Damien15 -- You're absolutely right. What's more, Hiroshima and Nagasaki were never nuked, the Turks did not massacre a single Armenian, Pol Pot ordered the Khmer Rouge not to harm a hair on a single Cambodian's head and the World Trade Center is still standing in lower Manhattan. See how easy it is? You can deny ANYTHING if you put your mind to it. But winning people over to your flat-earth theories takes a little bit better persuasion than what you've done before.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Islamic natons must never be allowed nuclear technology. Unless the civilized world takes the proper stand , it is Muslims who will be responsible for the next nuke to be detonated in the world.

Muslims huh? They are all terrorists aren't they now? Do you think comments like these will solve any problem, or can be constuctive in any way?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Muslims huh? They are all terrorists aren't they now?

Well, maybe not all.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Sabiwabi either you are just baiting us or your understanding of history is sorely lacking. With regard to documents concerning the final solution of the jewish question, I might refer you to the notes of the Wansee Conference held on 20 January 1942 in Wansee Berlin. A numbered copy of these notes (the document itself had a restricted readers list) was passed to the British SOE and is now kept by the British Archives. They make rather interesting reading if you can get your hands on a copy. The Brits also have a rather good collection of film footage including an SS training film from mid 1943 for prospective camp guards that features the mass gassing of so-called "Untermensch" at Treblinka in early 1943 before the revolt by prisoners. The film in itself is rather interesting because it is both in German (for German-speaking candidates) and Russian (for those Russians/Ukrainians, etc) who volunteered to serve.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

We need population figures. ie. There were 10 million Jews in Europe in 1936, 4 million in 1946 therefore ...

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Damien

Do you think comments like these will solve any problem, or can be constuctive in any way?

It certainly takes some cojones for a neo-Nazi holocaust denying conspiracy theorist like yourself to be lecturing about being constructive. I've got to give you credit for that. :-D

0 ( +0 / -0 )

I know my reason for believing that 6mil figure is overly exaggerated is not because I'm Muslim or hate Jews. It's pure desire of knowing the truth, only the truth, nothing but the truth. That's why I've chosen the material prepared by Jewish truth seeker, who visited the Auschwitz camp to find out what really happened. What would be his motivation? Why would he want to expose the lies we've been told about the holocaust, other than the pure desire of finding the truth.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

We need population figures. ie. There were 10 million Jews in Europe in 1936, 4 million in 1946 therefore ...

Asoka... that makes 6 million dead.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

It certainly takes some cojones for a neo-Nazi holocaust denying conspiracy theorist like yourself to be lecturing about being constructive. I've got to give you credit for that. :-D

Your comments are hateful to those who doesn't believe the 6mil figure. That's why I used the word constructive. I have done long enough research about the subject that made me believe that there is no reason behind the exagerated figure. It maybe offensive to you because of your beliefs, but I have the advantage of being sideless about this subject.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Helter: Ah, you're genocidal desires for all Muslims never ceases to rear its ugly head, even on a thread about denial of the holocaust and Netanyahu's response. The hypocrisy is so easy to see it's not even comical any more.

Kind of ties into my next point:

"The greatest threat facing the world today is the marriage between religious fanaticism and the weapons of mass destruction,”

I would eliminate 'religious' and just leave the 'fanaticism' in Netanyahu's speech and pat him on the back for it. I mean, Kim Jong Il and his nuclear program isn't exactly setting back the Doomsday clock, but are you going to tell me, Helter, that KJI is a Muslim/religious fanatic?

No one should have nukes, plain and simple, and Israel has proven itself time and time again to be more than capable of carrying out massacres and atrocities of their own. Fortunately, they have no used nukes, but nor have they left that option off the table (and indeed have threatened on numerous occasions to use them).

Anyway, I'm kind of with adaydream on this one; Ahmadinejad is a fool, and absolutely disgusting for his thoughts on the holocaust -- and even being PROUD of them!? -- but I'm also getting sick of Israel using it all the time for sympathy when they are willing to dish out plenty of violence themselves on the Palestinians, etc. Everyone with their heads on their shoulders knows the guy's out to lunch and offensive, so as long as that is known and no one is buying into his crap, ignore the guy!

0 ( +0 / -0 )

tim,

No, I ain’t baiting; I’m just getting tired of the same old baseless accusations.

As for the Wansee Conference, that has been debated many times. Although its no secret the Nazis wanted the Jews out of Europe, there isn’t anything in there that proves they were planning to kill them. Even Raul Hilberg, who was the leading holocaust authority, when he was questioned under oath during Zundel’s first trial in Canada, had to admit that there were no documents proving the nazis had such a plan. It was during the same trial that Hilberg had to admit under oath that he was unaware of any scientific investigation of any gas chamber!!!

As for the film footage you’re referring to, I’d be curious to have a look. I doubt very much they are what you’re claiming them to be.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

"Not all deniers are the same, but the fact remains that in all Holocaust denial there is a core of racist, paranoid, conspiratorial thinking that is clearly directed at Jews. It ranges from crass antisemitism to a more subtle and pervasive form. . . This bias is what drives deniers to seek and find that what they are looking for, and to confirm what they already believe. Why do they say the Holocaust never happened? Depending on whom you ask, interest in history, money, perversity, notoriety, ideology, politics, fear, paranoia, hate."

-- Michael Shermer, "Why People Believe Weird Things" (W.H. Freeman & Co., 1997)

0 ( +0 / -0 )

in all Holocaust denial there is a core of racist, paranoid, conspiratorial thinking that is clearly directed at Jews.

Don't know who said this, but he is wrong. The reason can also ba a passion to find the truth. I know that I have nothing against Jews and have lotsa friends. Not believing the holocaust does not necessarily make you a Jew hater. Can make you the truth seeker. Is anyone reading Sabiwabi's comments? He is showing historical facts and the conclusion is: there is no base for 6mil figure, there's no proven intent for Nazi's to systematicaly kill Jews. If you want to argue, please post facts like he does.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Michael Shermer, "Why People Believe Weird Things" (W.H. Freeman & Co., 1997)

And you assume this guy is correct? Big mistake. The fact remains that in all anti-revisionist statements, there are insults (sick, disgusting, racist, antisemitic,...) but no substance, the points brought up by revisionists are ignored. There are many promises of facts (mountains of documents) but nothing solid is ever shown.

Yes, many people were put in camps, about half of them were Jews. There was a typhus epidemic and many people died from that and other diseases. Because of the allied bombing campaigns, much of the German infrastructure was destroyed, making the movement of food and medicine almost impossible. These are provable facts that are not denied by anyone, but are rarely mentioned when discussing the holocaust. What deniers claim is that there was no policy to exterminate (murder) the European Jewish population, and there is no evidence to support it, not even the blueprints that NettedYahoo brought to the UN.

If people want to shut up Ahmadinejad, all they have to do is provide real proof, let people freely investigate and discuss it, and finally give an acceptable reason as to why the Palestinian people should pay for the holocaust.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Thanks, Damien15, for this opportunity to include the part of Mr. Shermer's quote that I left out. Here is the full quote: "it ranges from crass antisemitism to a more subtle and pervasive form of antisemitism that creeps into conversations as "Some of my best friends are Jews, but..." or "I'm not antisemitic, but..." followed by a litany o all the things "the Jews" are doing.

So Shermer (or "Doctor Shermer" if you like, since he has a PhD in History of Science), has called you out, and you fell right into his trap. PS: There's a shop in Nerima Ward where you can buy a bedspread covered with swastika patterns, it should go nicely with your hakenkreuz necktie and SS tie pin.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

I'll just say, Damien, sabiwabi, please, please go to Europe and openly, publicly declare your laughable belief that the holocaust never happened.

Yeah, try to lecture that in a public hall, even to a small audience, instead of anonymously on an internet forum.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

"Six million Jews were killed during World War II, one-third of all world Jewry. In Europe, nearly every family was affected — including Netanyahu’s own." Really? Oh no they weren't. A trio of the Soviet forces, the Allied forces and the ICRC at the time put the number at no more than 185,000. Whoyagonna believe?

And if Bibi thinks the Iranian president has no legitimacy up on the UN podium, what does he think about Angie Merkel? After all it was the Germans who "did" the Holocaust, not the Iranians or the Palestinians. Neither of these groups are actually wiping anyone off the map. Only Bibi is doing that.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Whoyagonna believe?

Certainly not you, Libertas.

"Like evolution denial, Holocaust denial is not . . . benign or trivial. It has had an will have ugly and dire consequenses, not only for Jews but for all of us and for future generations."

-- Michael Shermer, "Why People Believe Weird Things" (W.H. Freeman & Co., 1997)

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Let the Holocaust deniers come out from under their rocks and be exposed for the vermin they are.

Oh, and another thing. That famous (or infamous) Holocaust conference they had a while back in Tehran was a perfect opportunity to "expose them for the vermin they are". Any holocaust researcher could have attended, but they choose not to. Some poorly informed believers attended and boy did they learn something lesson. It was unfortunate that people like Germar Rudolf or Ernst Zundel could not attend (jailed in Germany) or others were not permitted to leave their Germany to attend. All we heard on the msm is that David Duke attended, with no mention of people like Dr. Robert Faurisson, Dr. Fred Toben, and many others.

BTW 185,000 sounds about right (though mainly from disease, not murder, and definitely not from gassing)

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Beelzebub, thank you so much for so clearly proving my point when I stated:

The fact remains that in all anti-revisionist statements, there are insults ... but no substance...

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Gosh, sobbywobby, the German government doesn't seem to agree with your figures.

http://www.bundesregierung.de/nn_6516/Content/EN/Artikel/2006/01/2006-01-27-german-parliament-observes-holocaust-remembrance-day.html

German parliament observes Holocaust Remembrance Day Fri, 27.01.2006

The concentration camp at Auschwitz was liberated on January 27, 1945. Since 1996 the German parliament has observed Holocaust Remembrance Day in commemoration of the millions of victims of the Nazi regime. In November 2005 the United Nations declared January 27 International Holocaust Remembrance Day.

Auschwitz was the largest of the Nazi concentration camps, where more than a million people perished.

Photo: REGIERUNGonline/Bergmann Remembrance ceremony in parliament. At the beginning of an hour-long remembrance ceremony the speaker of parliament, Norbert Lammert, called for resistance to anti-Semitism and xenophobia, adding: "We must, we want to, and we will continue to learn from our history." Against forgetting

Auschwitz symbolizes the millions of people murdered by Germans. "It is our common responsibility to see to it that Auschwitz does not repeat itself," Lammert stressed.

Foreign Minister Frank-Walter Steinmeier rejected any attempts to deny or to relativize the Holocaust, saying: "Germany will continue to categorically denounce shocking and unacceptable statements such as those made by Iranian President Ahmadinejad."

0 ( +0 / -0 )

where we can find all that hair and clothes and skin and all, but no trace of skulls and bones of 6mil people

Hair, clothes and skin could still serve a purpose. The corpses were disposed of in the ovens which operated around the clock. Witnesses have testified to the burning of people still alive.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

He is showing historical facts

Copied and pasted from the pages of neo-Nazi and Islamist websites. If this thread doesn't prove the Nazi Islamist Alliance, I don't know what does. From neo-Nazi David Duke's website:

The Iranian Holocaust Conference: http://www.davidduke.com/general/1530_1530.html

why the Palestinian people should pay for the holocaust.

Poetic justice. Payback for their participation in the Holocaust and continued quest to exterminate the Jewish Infidel. I guess what comes around....

What would be his motivation?

Dunno Damien. Perhaps to attract a following of weak-minded social misfits?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Hehe. Virtually impossible to tell the difference between the neo-Nazi, Islamist, and Socialist posts on this thread. As completely expected.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

The fact remains that in all anti-revisionist statements, there are insults ... but no substance...

Wabisabi... as politely as I can put it -- people who go out of their way to espouse ludicrous nonsense forfeit any claims they might have to a courteous response.

Moderator: Please address other posters by their correct user name.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

"If this thread doesn't prove the Nazi-Islamist Alliance, I don't know what does."

What rubbish! During the war (supposedly against Jews) a delegation from Jerusalem, all made of Zionist party organizers, flew into Berlin and met with senior Third Reich officials. and briefly eventually with Hitler. The Reich wanted to rid the German Empire of Jewish residents by having them emigrate, not be killed. The delegation which visited was assisting in having other countries accept expelled Jews, to Canada, the USA and other countries which would have them. They were also there to explain their hope and plans to establish eratz Israel (later the state of Israel) and wanted Hitler's support, which they got.

Census figures, verified by the Jewish press office in Paris showed that the total number of Jews in all of Europe at the time didn't come to 4,000,000 and that more than half of them appeared to have emigrated by 1942-43.

If you want a connection worth pursuing, then follow up on Prescott Bush's liaison with both Hitler and Mussolini, laundering money for them both so they could obtain dollars with which to buy arms to kill Allied soldiers.

If a million Jews were killed at Auswicz, as reported above, then where did the two plaques on the wall there appear from. One says 4 million, and then another later affixed (not sure if it's still there as it's been a while since I visited) said 6 million. The numbers don't add up, especially given the fact that German reparation to survivors now exceeds the number of people reported being interned.

I don't doubt for one minute that people died. I don't doubt for one minute that these camps weren't horrible places. But I DO question the repeated and repeated stories about these events. Time to clarify, codify and document this once and for all. Asking questions about fabrications does not count as denial. Doubt is good, and truth needs no legislation or antics like Bibi's to support it. Show me the facts, just the facts. But to scream "Holocaust denier!" every time someone asks for hard facts tells me somebody's got something to hide. Who, what and why?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Wabisabi... as politely as I can put it -- people who go out of their way to espouse ludicrous nonsense forfeit any claims they might have to a courteous response.

Nobody expects you to kiss our butts, but why doesn't anyone provide any substance. Why is it ludicrous? If the mountains of evidence were truly there, anyone could so easily shut all of us up.

The fact is, that if anyone truly looks at the so-called evidence of the holocaust, they quickly realize that the holocaust story (of a planned extermination) is ludicrous nonsense and we should not try to silence those who are exposing this.

And considering that some believers continue to bring up the skin story (or the soap one) just shows how little they actually looked at the evidence. The just blindly accept anything they are told.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Helter, Thanks for posting the David Duke's website. Everything I read sounds very logical to me. Which part of these don't you agree or think as a neo-Nazi beliefs?

In some Western nations, to diverge even slightly from Holocaust orthodoxy will cause an historian to face not only a loss of academic career but also imprisonment. The main theme of the Holocaust Conference is that there must be freedom of speech on this subject as on all others. Free speech, inquiry and debate is the only way to learn the truth on any issue. Many Western governments have imprisoned many academics for simply expressing their historical opinions on the Holocaust.

Is this not true?

In prosecutions of Holocaust questioners, authorities have not allowed introduction of any evidence supporting their claims. The courts have even announced in their guilty verdicts that “The truth is no defense,” i.e. that even if the defendant can be shown to be honest and accurate, and even if his claims can be substantiated by physical and documentary evidence, he has broken the law by simply questioning aspects of the official Holocaust Story.

How about this? Wrong?

It must also be understood that throughout history, the historical treatment of atrocities or crimes against humanity have often been colored by political purposes. Throughout history some crimes against humanity have been exaggerated and emphasized to justify war or other political agendas. Other crimes against humanity have been completely ignored or downplayed.

Also very true.

Some revisionists suggest that this disparity is because of the strong Jewish influence in Western media from the entertainment establishment of Hollywood to the news media centered in New York and across the European world. They suggest that an exaggeration and saturation of the Holocaust has been essential to establishment and support of the Zionist state in Israel and that it offers a psychological excuse for the large scale ethnic cleansing, repression, torture and genocide against the Palestinian people.

This is bit more controversial, not sure if their ultimate goal is to torture and kill, but not totally unbelievable. Isn't that what's happening now?

First, freedom of speech is a vital human right. It is the cornerstone of all other rights, because without freedom of speech no one has to the right to even freely know and learn of the abrogation of other rights affecting human freedom and survival. That is why the American founding fathers put freedom of speech, press and religion as the first and highest of the Bill of Rights. Second, freedom of speech and debate are absolutely vital for the truth to prevail. If one side of any controversial issue can suppress the voice of opposition, we cannot arrive at the certainty of any truth. If academics and citizens can be career and monetarily blackmailed; if they can be threatened with firings, loss of income, or imprisonment from simply sincerely pursuing an historical inquiry and publishing it, how can the truth be fairly arrived at?

Isn't this very true? You tell me.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

The delegation which visited was assisting in having other countries accept expelled Jews, to Canada, the USA and other countries which would have them. They were also there to explain their hope and plans to establish eratz Israel (later the state of Israel) and wanted Hitler's support, which they got.

Indeed, and Jewish organizations in various countries (e.g., US) pushed their governments to restrict the entry of Jews. They wanted them to move to Palestine. I wonder why this point is not mentioned so much.

Oh, and here is something I "copied and pasted from the pages of neo-Nazi and Islamist website" known as the True Torah Jews:

As late as 1943, while the Jews of Europe were being exterminated in their millions, the U.S. Congress proposed to set up a commission to "study" the problem. Rabbi Stephen Wise, who was the principal American spokesperson for Zionism, came to Washington to testify against the rescue bill because it would divert attention from the colonization of Palestine. This is the same Rabbi Wise who, in 1938, in his capacity as leader of the American Jewish Congress, wrote a letter in which he opposed any change in U.S. immigration laws which would enable Jews to find refuge. He stated: "It may interest you to know that some weeks ago the representatives of all the leading Jewish organizations met in conference ... It was decided that no Jewish organization would, at this time, sponsor a bill which would in any way alter the immigration laws."

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Further negating an Islamic-Nazi alliance:

Rabbi Stephen Wise, who was the principal American spokesperson for Zionism, came to Washington to testify against the rescue bill because it would divert attention from the colonization of Palestine.

and

This is the same Rabbi Wise who, in 1938, in his capacity as leader of the American Jewish Congress, wrote a letter in which he opposed any change in U.S. immigration laws which would enable Jews to find refuge.

In fact, there is evidence (not readily to hand unfortunately) which would seem to indicate that a certain element of what was to become Israeli society wanted "lesser" Jews to go elsewhere, not to the future Israel. They identified these "lesser" Jews to be prime candidates for exile to the likes of Canada, USA etc. etc. Rather than there being an Islamic-Nazi alliance, it would appear to have been more of a "True Blue-Blood" Zionist-Nazi alliance. Israel had been planned since Herzl, some sixty years prior, and the implementers saw the opportunity to pre-select their population during the planned chaos of the Reich's purification drive. To say that the Zionists cooperated closely with Goering has merit in historical fact. One which modern Israel studiously ignores, and blinkered Holocaust-Firsters won't even entertain, under pain of incarceration. Why? None of this answers the obvious question: Why are the Palestinian people paying the price with their land and their lives for something they had nothing to do with?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Absolutely great speech by Netanyahu.

Obama, on the other hand, made me ashamed to be American.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

I really can't believe some people here. The Jews have been the world's door mat since God was created. Seeing some of the posts above, I believe we are going to have another stomping party on the Jews..

0 ( +0 / -0 )

It's not their denying history that's so annoying as their trying to assume a smarmy air of trying to conduct an intelligent discussion. Sorry guys, it won't wash.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

“The greatest threat facing the world today is the marriage between religious fanaticism and the weapons of mass destruction,” he warned.

Yep.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Beelzebub: Gosh, sobbywobby, the German government doesn't seem to agree with your figures.

But why would one believe the German government on this issue?

Granted, they probably make a strong case, but I'm more inclined to get my information from quick-hit websites and associate myself with Holocaust deniers because on the whole I find them to be reasonable, intelligent, and stable. All of your "official statements" and "documents showing proof" are just things your average, lazy truth-seeker relies on. It takes an exceptional truth-seeker to look past the mountains of evidence and task himself with finding the most creative alternatives in order to find the truth.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

“The greatest threat facing the world today is the marriage between religious fanaticism and the weapons of mass destruction,” he warned.

Oh, no. Not WMD again.

The most urgent challenge facing the U.N. is to prevent “the tyrants of Tehran from acquiring nuclear weapons,” he said.

An even more urgent challenge is to take them away from Israel.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

To all those on a quest for truth. The truth is that we will never ever be able to count to the last person those who were killed according to the ideas put forth in Mein Kampf. But consider what is plausible... what is likely...

The 6 million figure, to my understanding, is the number killed throughout Europe, I assume, from 1939 to 1945. Lets not even count the Jews killed BEFORE then in various pogroms and other nastiness. 6 years. A million a year. That is 3000 per day. Gosh. That sure does seem like a lot, doesn't it?

But when you have ghettoes stretching from the Caucasus to Normandy and from Africa to Oslo, where you are starving people, denying them services such as basic medical care, police protection, and utilities, and then whipping up the rest of the populace to treat Jews as subhuman, what is going to happen? They were just starved in Warsaw. Just starved. Trading gold for bread.

Then send soldiers into occupied areas to take homes of Jews so that you can give them to relocated freed aryan peoples. Displace the Jews, men women and children, and kill them if they become inconvenient. Round up Jews and kill them with machineguns or bayonets in forests. Then figure out that you can work them to death before they die, so round them up and send them by the tens of thousands to work camps, like the one for Farben.

It starts to add up.

There was a guy, a young guy, by the end of the war, who had plans that he implemented for camps that left no trace. Roll the train cars in, sort and strip the prisoners, kill most of them, use the remainder as labor to stack and burn the bodies. Alternatively, you can run a three train system where one is loading living people in a city, one is unloading live people at camps, and another is loading dead bodies at the camp. Then kill those dead body loaders, and get ready for the next batch. You can achieve tremendous throughput because remember, there is no need for a hygienic standard, as there is for beef production, for instance. I wish I could remember the documentary I saw that on. I saw it and said... Wow. That guy is a logistics genius. You could do 20,000 per week easy with that operation. No bullets necessary. He was the Ray Kroc of the Holocaust. If there were only ONE such camp operating at full bore, it would make that 3000 daily quota all by itself.

Ahem. Point being, of course, that 6 million just boggles the mind. Oh. It couldn't be, could it? Yes. It is plausible. I think it happened. The nazis did it sloppily at first, and for various reasons, but as the resistance and revulsion faded, as hope in the war effort faded, the effort became silent, efficient, and much much higher paced. The camps are symbolic, but they are the tip of the iceberg. You think you have to put a man into a camp to kill him? An infant? Personally, a million dead souls makes it a terrible terrible crime. The extra 5 million, which I happen to believe, are the exclamation points that should follow the cry of NEVER AGAIN!!!!!

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Helter_Skelter: "Poetic justice. Payback for their participation in the Holocaust..."

Ummm... the Palestinians participated in the holocaust? Dude... you're so far off the mark with this one you best give up when you are WAY down in the count.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

perhaps the best solution is to let Israel and her enemies fight it out once and for all. Once the dust settles, he who is standing wins and all should just shut up. If Israel loses, let that tiny piece of land go to Muslims so their land won't be so "dirty". If Israel wins, wow, a place to live in piece of land the size of Shikoku.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

skipper - Wouldn't your solution result in the total destruction of Israel's enemies?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

sarge, I don't know. It seems their enemies have a lot of support on JT. Maybe it will be Israel that gets blown off the map.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Israel has nukes. They would win or there would be no one left afterwards anyway.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

the Palestinians participated in the holocaust? Dude... you're so far off the mark with this one you best give up when you are WAY down in the count." There are photos on the web showing a "Mufti" with Hitler. The only way he is off is that really Palestinians did exist as Palestinians, not until 1974! Before that, all people, including Jews were considered Palestinians. So, maybe Sabi is right and that Palestinian in that photo was a Jew!

0 ( +0 / -0 )

So the math convinces me. The story fits too. The sheer number of eyewitnesses. The fact that Hitler SAID he was going to do it, talked about doing it, and then did it, is damning. das Lager der Vernichtung....Endlösung der Judenfrage ... What is to deny? The physical evidence of the camps, the open discrimination and persecution of Jews throughout Europe before the war, and their utter lack of human rights once the war got going.. this is all known. What is to deny? The eyewitnesses are of so many nationalities and interests and backgrounds that any idea of a conspiracy is just ludicrous. There were about 10 camps dedicated solely to genocide. The Croats operated their own camp, as did the Byelorussians. Was National Geographic in on the whole thing too?

Do people want to quibble over the number? Is that all? The number is eminently plausible. Respectable contemporary observers with more information than I have arrived at that number, and it sure seems about right to me.

I have no idea what deniers are using for information. The more information I see, the more it fits. I can read most of the accounts in their original languages, and it all paints the same grim picture.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Israel has nukes. They would win or there would be no one left afterwards anyway." Well, maybe not a bad idea.. at least that would be the end of the problem.

But, Pakistan has nukes, they'll back their Muslims brothers. Syria has enough arms to do the job, in fact they one of the States alleged to have nuclear weapons programs http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_states_with_nuclear_weapons

Just because they have told anyone doesn't mean they don't have them.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Israel's has given up land for peace how many times?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Israel's has given up land for peace how many times?

A yes, take 10, give back 2. Then take 20, give back 2....

You're only looking at what they give back, but not what they are stealing. They continue to build settlements on occupied territory.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Why oh why do nwe have to constantly hear the beastly Israelis bleat on about alleged events that occurred 65 years ago. They make this thei excuse to ignore more UN resolutions than any other nation, have an illegal nuclear arsenal and repeatdly commit genocide against Arabs.

A ghastly nation, with an equally ghastly leader.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

repeatdly commit genocide against Arabs" Are you sure you want to bet on those words?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

"Genocide against Arabs"

I am convinced that you have no idea what the first word means. There might be three Israelis who think that all Arabs should be killed, and they are all in mental institutions.

For that very reason, use of nuclear weapons... the Jericho solution... is probably not something that Israel considers. It quietly developed its weapons... why not? From Szilard on down, most of the Hungarian physicists have been Jewish. There is speculation that they had the bomb in the Yom Kippur War and just chose not to use it.

OHECK... go read a book. The general level of discourse sure is taking a beating on sites like this. I am all for people kind of getting whimsy from time to time, but over and over again, I find people with no sense of history, no knowledge of the world, utter lack of circumspection, and willful ignorance of simple math. People just make outrageous claims that are not meant to be enlightening. All heat, no light. I am continually reminded that I should be doing something else.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

but was it systematic killing? Was the number really 6 mil? I doubt it very much.

Well, this comment and a very many recorded here present a prime reason why some nations feel it necessary to make denial of the Holocaust a crime. To hear some of you talk the concentration camps were summer resorts and the systematic liquidation of a group of people a mere exaggerated inconvenience. Many of you seem to be into fact gathering to prove a point - try doing some. The Holocaust was very real, and very, very horrible. Was it systematic killing?? Well, ever heard of the Wanasee conference (check spelling on that - not my strong suit)? It was indeed systematic and planned genocide on a grand scale. The 6 million number will always be in dispute, but in the context of human suffering and cold-blooded murder there are few events in history of its equal. And another reason the Holocaust is viewed in the reverence of extreme horror is that while history is full of examples of different types of atrocity, this one was perpetrated by a twentieth century, supposedly civilized society.

History is constantly re-written by those who start denial campaigns or implant seeds of doubt - even if there are no sound reasons, or their research is flawed or just wrong. I'm sure the thought process was/is that something this horrible must not be repeated, and the memory of those who died kept whole. Conspiracy theorists and anti-semites (and there seem to be many will undoubtedly see something sinister, but I think it's nothing more than a strong desire for it to naver happen again.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

klein2: "go read a book" and when I read a book, you say read a different one. how about this: go there. I resemble more of an Arab than I do a typical Jew. No problems.

From Szilard on down, most of the Hungarian physicists have been Jewish. There is speculation that they had the bomb in the Yom Kippur War and just chose not to use it." And most of the people that have screwed up this earth have been white, doesn't mean I should start going around kicking them out of every country like the Jews have been. Before there was a Mosque in that land, there was a Synagogue. That's history enough. I was treated with respect in Israel, where I wasn't in any Muslim led country. I like the idea that Israelis are modern in thinking and I like that idea that my daughter wouldn't be a simple baby machine and a numbered wife. I have also met and hung out with, Jewish and Christian Arabs. They are no down with the Palestinians. You are an under dog rooter. That's it. Don't need a book anymore, read enough. I really think if Israel sat back and got bombed, you would be cheering and if they retaliated, you would cry foul. So, why should they wait to get bombed when talking about such weapons? I personally think the Israelis are stupid for waiting. Besides, they gonna get the butts kicked, they might as well get a few punches in.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

why are all you Kufars supporting those who hate you?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Dilbert: Thanks for posting the David Duke's website. Everything I read sounds very logical to me.

I have no doubt. And thanks to you for showing your support for a neo-Nazi like David Duke and continuing to prove my point. Well done.

Smith: the Palestinians participated in the holocaust?

The Grand Mufti of Jerusalem Mohammad Amin al-Husayni. Now do your homework.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

The 6 million number will always be in dispute, but in the context of human suffering and cold-blooded murder there are few events in history of its equal.

Yes, it will be dispute since the evidence says about 200,000 Jews died in the camps, mostly from disease; wand on the other hand you have this mythological 6 million Jews murdered as part of a systemic plan. The latter has no strong supporting evidence, but it is enforced by law and bullying (a bit like religions were, and in some places still are).

There are many historical events that surpass this one.

At the next UN meeting, someone should bring the blueprints of the Israeli apartheid wall!

0 ( +0 / -0 )

since the evidence says about 200,000 Jews died in the camps

Well gee, then it should be quite easy for you to present this evidence...Then again you never have been able to do that, have you?

the blueprints of the Israeli apartheid wall!

How many people has the wall killed again? Umm...zero. Sorry your sad attempts to compare Israel's wall to what the Nazis did in the camps is ridiculous. Then again, you still haven't decided whether the Nazis were good or bad yet, so I guess that is clouding anything resembling judgement, huh?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Both sides need to come together and reject racist craziness like that of President Ahmadinejad.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

tigermoth:

The 6 million number will always be in dispute, but in the context of human suffering and cold-blooded murder there are few events in history of its equal.

Are you aware of the nonsensicality of your statement? First off, you admit that the number is not based on any historical reality, and yet yougo on to make the extraordinarily insensitive statement that their have been no other atrocities equal to this one. I would suggest that if you want to make such a statement, you first ascertain exactly how many were killed. Oh, but I forgot, it's illegal to discuss that!

Still, you confidently insist:

there are few events in history of its equal.

Since you seem to know of the few equal events, why don't you list them for us? Shouldn't be so much trouble, since there are so few. You are the one claiming that there are only a few events equalling "the holocaust", so go ahead and tell us specifically what events you have in mind.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Cicada,

First off, you admit that the number is not based on any historical reality

Again the trouble with reading and phonics. Do you need a good internet link to a phonics site?

You are showing your true colors. It is obvious, even if you blindly choose to disagree with it, that Tigermoth was not saying the the number was not based on any historical reality. He was just suggesting that the number is less important than the suffering of that number of people.

tell us specifically what events you have in mind.

I don't know about Tigermoth, but I suggest you go first since you seem to be such an expert yourself.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

I used to live in Japan and I am so glad I don't anymore. I usually enjoy reading this website but I am troubled at the lack of educated and factual based info that is posted here, particularly on this topic.

If all of your neighbours hated you and didn't acknowledge your right to live and exist, I am sure you would try to protect yourself. You can't communicate with nut jobs and fanatics.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

kinniku:

that Tigermoth was not saying the the number was not based on any historical reality. He was just suggesting that the number is less important than the suffering of that number of people.

Tigermoth, whom I was addressing (not you) wrote:

The 6 million number will always be in dispute, but in the context of human suffering and cold-blooded murder there are few events in history of its equal.

and I responded by pointing out Tigermoth (by his own admission) is not in a position to make those assertions about how other genocides compare. But I asked for the specifics of his assertions -- something more than emotive remarks.

Now you say "the number is less important than the suffering of that number of people" but that can be said for any number of other genocides as well. Therefore, the Tigermoth statement "there are few events in history of its equal" is without any basis.

I don't know about Tigermoth, but I suggest you go first

I'm not the one who made any claim about how many genocides in history can compare to that in WWII.

Again the trouble with reading and phonics. Do you need a good internet link to a phonics site?You are showing your true colors. It is obvious, even if you blindly choose...

I've grown tired of your repeated personal attacks on this forum. As I said in another thread, they only succeed in making your case less persuasive.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Cicada,

I responded by pointing out Tigermoth (by his own admission) is not in a position to make those assertions about how other genocides compare.

Seriously, do you want me to recommend a reading primer for you?

On September 27th you wrote:

Are you aware of the nonsensicality of your statement? First off, you admit that the number is not based on any historical reality

Now, first off, Tigermoth 'admitted' not such thing. Second, you have admitted, by using the word admitted here, that you seem to feel that the number is not based on any historical reality...or you would not have written what you wrote.

In addition, for some very strange reason, in your posts about this subject, you use quotations around the world holocaust, which to most people would suggest you don't think it should be called that...

So, I apologize for suggesting you don't think the holocaust was a genocide. I guess it is that you don't think it was as big a genocide as other genocides...that you can't mention. Do I have your 'opinions' correct now?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

kinniku:

In his recent post Tigermoth wrote:

The 6 million number will always be in dispute

and

there are few events in history of its equal.

These statements appeared contradictory to me, but I suggested:

go ahead and tell us specifically what events you have in mind.

Now, if Tigermoth does not want to provide specifics, that is fine with me.

You, on the other hand, are adding nothing to the discussion here. In your last post you once again rudely wrote:

Seriously, do you want me to recommend a reading primer for you?

So once again I will recommend that you (for your own good) refrain from personal attacks, distortions of others' posts, and ill-natured remarks such as these. Thank you.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Cicada,

It is almost as if you don't read what you write. You wrote: 'First off, you admit that the number is not based on any historical reality', when they admitted no such thing. Tigermoth's two statements are not contradictory at all and are definitely not mutually exclusive.

As I wrote earlier about your statements, you have admitted, by using the word admitted here, that you seem to feel that the number is not based on any historical reality...or you would not have written what you wrote.

In addition, for some very strange reason, in your posts about this subject, you use quotations around the world holocaust, which to most people would suggest you don't think it should be called that...

So, I apologize for suggesting you don't think the holocaust was a genocide. I guess it is that you don't think it was as big a genocide as other genocides...that you can't mention. Do I have your 'opinions' correct now?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Skip the song:

I have no idea what your rant is trying to say, but it seems that you do not understand my prior posts.

For example: " I really think if Israel sat back and got bombed, you would be cheering and if they retaliated, you would cry foul. So"

Right. I would be cheering. Sure. I told some people to read a book. I think you should read my name--KLEIN--and some of my posts. Get a clue before you go blowing off at someone like that. You kook. If your post were not at 10:53 AM, I would think you were drunk. Liquid breakfasts?

Save your bile for the anti-semites and deniers.

And to contribute to the discussion, I should add that I think that there is plenty of evidence and that the 6 million number is eminently supportable. Also, the 6 million does not include all of the non-Jews who were also killed. The Soviets lost about 20 million dead in WWII, which started for them in 1941. Pol Pot killed millions. Stalin killed millions. I am not going to quibble or rank these atrocities. I did the math, and I think that 200,000 is a preposterously low number. It is implausibly low if you consider persecution from Kristallnacht to VE Day.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

I would think that Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu giving such an important speech, trying to connect Iran with the holocaust, he would bring the most convincing documents. Seeing the documents he brought only further confirms how flimsy the evidence supporting the holocaust is. Common Bibi, if the story was true, you could do better than that. This great man probably did more harm to the holocaust industry than Raul Hilberg's appearance at Zundel's first trial in Canada.

the 6 million number is eminently supportable.

Are you referring to 6 million Jews murdered in the camps? I strongly doubt it!

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Seeing the documents he brought only further confirms how flimsy the evidence supporting the holocaust is.

Specifically, how so? Your post is lacking in detail about that point.

This great man probably did more harm to the holocaust industry than Raul Hilberg's appearance at Zundel's first trial in Canada.

Ahhh, yes. You mean the trial that Zundel lost. It seems Hilberg was quite a good witness.

I strongly doubt it!

Why? What is your specific proof to make you doubt it?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu delivered his most passionate and public riposte yet to Iranian president Mahmoud Ahmadinejad’s questioning of "the Holocaust".

sabiwabi:

This great man probably did more harm to the holocaust industry than ...

Well, yes, one would have hoped that he could actually back up his "riposte" with documents. It's not quite enough for him to get emotional about his wife's grandparents being killed in the war.

And this is a high stakes duel between the leaders of two countries. That was the best he could do?

This leaves a bad impression upon the majority of people, who are neutral and not taking sides at either extreme. Not to mention that Ahmadinejad’s people are in the vast majority already highly skeptical.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

It seems Hilberg was quite a good witness.

Yes Raul Hilberg, the number one holocaust expert at the time, was forced to admit under oath that he was not aware of any scientific investigation of the camps or documents showing the nazis' intentions. Wow, some mountains of documents and evidence.

Specifically, how so? Your post is lacking in detail about that point.

I spelled it clearly above. When you enter a discussion, you should have the common courtesy to find out what has been discussed.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Mr. Hilberg was a good enough witness that Zundel lost his trial. The documents are there and you have seen some of them, especially those referring to homicidal gas chambers and admitted they exist no matter how much you attempt to backtrack. It is just that you now claim, that they don't matter or that you don't care.

When you enter a discussion, you should have the common courtesy to find out what has been discussed.

No, in your 12 or so posts you barely commented on the documents at all. Maybe you should do the courtesy of reading what you write. Anyway, you didn't specifically say why seeing those specific documents he brought only further confirms to you supposedly how flimsy the evidence supporting the holocaust is. So, get to it. Why, specifically, clearly and consisely, did seeing these documents make you think that? Again, this is a simple question. In the time it took you to write what you did, you should have been able to answer it instead of deflecting it.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Well, yes, one would have hoped that he could actually back up his "riposte" with documents.

He did bring documents (blueprints). It is in the article. Sabiwabi just doesn't like the documents, although he is being coy about why he doesn't like them.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

The Israeli leader came armed with original documents handed to him last month when he visited Germany...

The article does not state specifically what "documents" he was given. And, huh?, these very important documents he did not have until last month? Oh, come on.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

He did bring documents (blueprints)

The "deniers" do not deny the existence of the camp. Yes, the Nazis had concentration camps and they put many people in them, about half of them Jews. So he brings the blueprints of the camp; big deal. The problem is most people will blindly gobble it up, thinking its real proof of a plan to systematically kill European Jews.

This whole charade was meant to distract from the nearly 600 page UN report dedicated mostly to Israeli war crimes in Gaza. The report confirmed that Israel used weapons (including illegal weapons) against a defenseless civilian population in Gaza. The report also stated that Israel not only committed war crimes, but indeed may have also committed crimes against humanity.

This charade gives puppet leaders the opportunity to ignore Israeli war crimes and focus instead on punishing Iran, who has done absolutely nothing wrong.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Cicada,

I don't understand what your complaint is.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Sabiwabi,

You still in your 13 or so posts did not specifically say why the blueprints he brought further confirms to you supposedly how flimsy the evidence supporting the holocaust is. So, get to it. Why, specifically, clearly and consisely, did seeing these documents make you think that? Again, this is a simple question. In the time it took you to write what you did, you should have been able to answer it instead of deflecting it.

This whole charade was meant to distract from the nearly 600 page UN report dedicated mostly to Israeli war crimes in Gaza.

Baloney. Humans are not goldfish. We can pay attention to two horrible events at the same time.

Still waiting for specific proof and easy to understand, concise and specific back up of your fantastic claim of the unrealistic number of only 200,000 Jewish inmates that you claimed 'died' and were not killed by the Nazis. Let's keep it short and simple. Were does this number come from and how can you simply, concisely and specifically back it up?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

You still in your 13 or so posts did not specifically say why the blueprints he brought further confirms to you supposedly how flimsy the evidence supporting the holocaust is.

I spelled it out so clearly, let me try to explain it in a way you might understand.

This very very very important speech.

Therefore he bring number 1 best proof.

EVERYONE agrees there was a camp, but he bring blue print of camp, duh!

Baloney. Humans are not goldfish. We can pay attention to two horrible events at the same time.

But the UN report of Israeli war crimes and crimes against humanity certainly disappeared from MSM. Its not the first time that Israeli crimes are followed by a "hey-look-over-there" event.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

sabiwabi,

This very very very important speech.

What gives you the idea it was such an important speech? I don't think it was.

Therefore he bring number 1 best proof.

He wasn't trying to 'prove' anything. He knows it happened, as do most normal people. It was not a trial, it was a speech. He brought a blueprint of a place that was used to kill people. That is plenty for the kind of speech he gave.

But the UN report of Israeli war crimes and crimes against humanity certainly disappeared from MSM.

The reports names war crimes by both parties. Funny how you always managed to make that part disappear.

"hey-look-over-there" event.

Umm...nobody seems to be talking about this particular event much in the MSM or anywhere else except for us, or hadn't you noticed. In fact, if Ahmadinejad would just be quiet, the subject would probably come up a lot less.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Sorry, I forgot to ask:

Still waiting for specific proof and easy to understand, concise and specific back up of your fantastic claim of the unrealistic number of only 200,000 Jewish inmates that you claimed 'died' and were not killed by the Nazis. Let's keep it short and simple. Were does this number come from and how can you simply, concisely and specifically back it up?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

kinniku:

I don't understand what your complaint is.

Why do you assume I am complaining? The news media presented this as Netanyahu having recently obtained important evidentiary documents:

The Israeli leader came armed with original documents handed to him last month when he visited Germany

I would have thought that any important evidence was already on display in some "holocaust" museum, or even perhaps available for viewing on the Internet. How surprising that the Israelis are still in the process of obtaining important documents.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Why do you assume I am complaining?

The 'Oh, come one' remark, among others certainly appear to be complaints.

The news media presented this as Netanyahu having recently obtained important evidentiary documents:

This article presents this as Netanyahu hitting back or responding to Ahmadinejad. The article further mentions he had some blueprints. I don't see a whole lot more to it than that. This was not a trial to convince a judge. The world is quite familiar with what happened during WWII not matter how much deniers claim otherwise. Witness how sabiwabi is unable to back up his numbers.

I would have thought that any important evidence was already on display in some "holocaust" museum, or even perhaps available for viewing on the Internet.

Meaning specifically what, exactly? You are very unclear.

How surprising that the Israelis are still in the process of obtaining important documents.

Same question, as above. You are very unclear. What specifically is it you want to say?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

I'm not sure about all the other countries surrounding Israel, but I'm pretty sure that Israel will survive.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

I'm not sure about all the other countries surrounding Israel, but I'm pretty sure that Israel will survive.

Well, the Nazi and Soviet regimes aren't around anymore, so lets see what happens.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Login to leave a comment

Facebook users

Use your Facebook account to login or register with JapanToday. By doing so, you will also receive an email inviting you to receive our news alerts.

Facebook Connect

Login with your JapanToday account

User registration

Articles, Offers & Useful Resources

A mix of what's trending on our other sites