New Zealand's legal brothels gear up for busy World Cup

steve@CPFC

This is disgusting and no doubt many of these men will have wives and children back home. I can understand single people going out and looking for partner but paying for a womens company is the lowest of the low. It may be a good idea for dcent people to film these perverts and put the videos online in a bid to stop them. A man with a family who goes to a prostitute deserves to lose the house his marriage and and at least half his income.

Here we go again, the moral compass of the world at it again! Steve, if a person wants to use the services of these people and it is legal then you have no right to call them perverts or want to tape them and put it online. Maybe you should look in your own backyard before worrying about what others are doing.

“The English are known to be particularly deviant,” she said, citing the public school background of many England rugby fans. “Whenever I hear an English accent I know there’ll be some good business there.”..........................................................

we all know that. LOL.

steve@CPFCSep. 04, 2011 - 03:42PM JST

paying for a womens company is the lowest of the low.

Murderers and rapists will be relieved to hear this! And perhaps some johns will consider "moviing up" on your terms. Just brilliant Steve!

It may be a good idea for dcent people to film these perverts and put the videos online in a bid to stop them.

May be? I tell you what is definitely a good idea: You realizing that your morality is like your love, its yours and belongs to no one else. You don't force it on others. If for no better reason, because your morality WILL NOT make the world a better place. It will make it worse for both sexes. And it will make it worse for the sheep too.

steve: "A man with a family who goes to a prostitute deserves to lose the house his marriage and and at least half his income."

It's not my, and most certainly not your, right to say whether it is right or wrong for them, it is only your right to say whether it is right or wrong for YOU. These men (and while few, possibly some women) are doing NOTHING illegal, are they? Stop trying to push your warped sense of morals on everyone. There is no way engaging in the world's oldest profession is 'the lowest of the low' -- rape, murder, and spousal abuse (even smashing cell phones!) is far lower.

Steve@PC

" This is disgusting and no doubt many of these men will have wives and children back home. "

I suppose the old rule applies: What happens in New Zealand stays in New Zealand.

""paying for a woman's company is the lowest of the low."

Bah, it's better than them supressing all that pent-up frustration that ends in a sexual crime is it not? Steve?

I'd never pay for sex, but I'd watch her dance round that pole in my hotel room :)

And as Zichi rightly sez - you pay for it one way or the other!

Even as a woman and a wife, I cant honestly say I have any issue with prostitution as a service. There are men (and women!) who cant easily get it and need a little relief, be they single or married but in a sexless relationship.

I would be very upset if I knew my husband had ben to a prostitute - but mostly because (aside from fear of disease) I would feel I had let him down or not been good enough! But I would still rather he went to a prostitute than actually had an affair. That would be crippling.

Wow! Cant believe I expressed that opinion out loud! Please - none of you tell my hubby (who is away on a business trip at the moment - eek!)

I think the most bashing you deservedly received was regarding your desire as a "decent" citizen was to secretly film and broadcast on the net individuals during paid sex. And in offering that gem you became the lowest of the low yourself!

What makes you think that being married is requisite for visiting a prostitute anyway? Heh, you sound guilty 'o summat meladdo.

“The English are known to be particularly deviant,”

Might depend on your definition of deviant.

“I’ve had some American clients who have been quite excited about the fact that they don’t have to be so covert,” she said. “It’s quite different for them, a bit of a novelty.”

Whips and chains got nothing on that sort of deviance. And the most deviant of all are those who created the social stigma to be so scared in the first place.

Steve some disabled people use the services of prostitutes as they are unable to attract the opposite sex, stop your narrow moralising on others, open your eyes and your mind alittle.

Others go to practice various fetishes that are best satisfied with someone who knows about the finer points.

There are many a varied reasons why someone might use a hooker, it has nothing to do with being immoral at all.

People who moralise strongly on others have their own issues that need to be addressed, as some are making blindly obvious.

"People who want to lay their "moral codes" on others are highly dangerous."

Yeah, in my opinion it's just another example of latent behaviour. Vocally opponent anti-prostitution types probably have had a dabble with a pro. Just like latent homosexuals always "despise" gays.

paying for a woman's company is the lowest of the low

I'd never pay for sex,

I beg to differ. But in one form or another, men ALWAYS pay for sex. Its just a matter of what means that they are paying for it (whether it'd be for one night of a more long term deal) Especially in Japan, where a lot women view marriage as a business partnership (sex in exchange for a steady income)

Sometimes a bit of straying is what is needed, IMO.

Funny you should say that.....I am absolutely not advocating cheating in any way shape or form, but - without going into painful (and ancient history) details - lets just say that in my experience what doesnt kill you (both) makes you (both) stronger.

I would like to believe we could never cheat on each other now, but I am not naive enough to say it would never happen, just hope it never does.

Cheating would be if he had a love affair, involving emotions and telling lies all around.

That's right, married men who go with pros don't tell lies.

"Right dear, I'm just off down the brothel for the afternoon. I'll pick the kids up from school on the way back."

Yeah. That's how it goes.

HonestDictator:

" It would be in everyones best interest that the people that do NOT want to commit to just one person should only mess around with other people that do NOT want to commit to just one person and leave the people that DO want to commit to just one person alone. If a person cannot be loyal to the one they CHOSE to commit to then they should not do it in the first place. "

Nobody "commits" to anybody when visit a brothel. That is why it is a totally different concept than having love affairs. You and Steve@PC continue to obfuscate the difference.

“It’s going to be very busy, tens of thousands of visitors, they will predominantly be men and many of them will be looking for some type of sexual activity whilst they are here,”

Well, jeez... isn't THAT appealing? Anyway, to each their own. I think it's better legal than illegal, since it's going to happen any way. I just hope people are smart and 'protect' themselves should they opt for such activity.

Must phone stockbroker to buy shares in Durex

If the man is single and the woman was not coerced into prostitution, I wouldn't mind at all.

Soccer Hooligans pay for sex.

Couple of points here steve -

some disabled people are also rugby fans.

Secondly the above poster is not the only one giving you thumbs down :))

and There is nothing pathietic about a single guy going to a hooker, hell i know of fathers who have taken their sons so they can learn a few tricks ..

Hookers have their place in society, as do people who are unpopular.

The topic is rugby and hookers steve just so as you know what the topic is and my posts are right on topic, and did you know every rugby team needs to have a good hooker.

The hooker gets right amongst it and thoroughly enjoys it, you will often find them bent over or lying down, or Right between the two biggest guys in the team.

The more the hooker does the more the team likes them, the number on the hookers jersey is No: 2 that is the position of the Hooker in a rugby team in the middle of the front row.

Lots of rugby teams also go to brothels after a good game and a few beers, its not seen as imoral or pathetic.

steve@CPFC filming someone and putting it on the internet like you want to do is deviant.

Prostitution in nz is legal deal with it PC Steve

Spidapig

Enough of the sheep jokes, Kiwi's dont screw sheep thats the welsh and the aussies not NZers

I think that New Zealand people esp wimmin) are entitled to supplement their lives and finances in whatever legal ways they have......hear hear!

Not everyone who goes to a brothel is married, and in NZ there are male prostitutes too, so it is available not just for men.

And Spidapig yeah mate I am a kiwi :-))

naruhodo1Sep. 04, 2011 - 07:51PM JST

Why dont you see those men coming home saying tadaima, oh by the way hon, went to a whore house...BECAUSE its morally WRONG!!

No. That isn't it. People don't tell there spouses because of some moral dilemma. They don't tell their spouses because they will be angry. Its a lot like when the wife has some new jewelry and she tells you it was a heck of a lot cheaper than it actually was. The reason for the lie is not morals, not even when they lie about it to their preacher. Its because he might tell.

All you liers and cheaters will get caught sooner or later

No. Not all of us will. Some of us are very good at it.

Steve, for once i agree with you. And the only reason others here are against it is because the have gone to brothels and they need to justify their wrong actions by finding others to support.

Actually, its you reaching out to Steve for support. We don't need you or him to know that our bodies are our bodies. Curse any person that brings a disease home to their spouse though. And curse anybody that holds a double standard on this. Your spouse's body is also theirs. And sex is not love. Nor is it a marriage. Its just an act, that when done responsibly, is no one's business but the two involved, even if one has paid.

This is disgusting and no doubt many of these men will have wives and children back home. I can understand single people going out and looking for partner but paying for a womens company is the lowest of the low. It may be a good idea for dcent people to film these perverts and put the videos online in a bid to stop them.

A man with a family who goes to a prostitute deserves to lose the house his marriage and and at least half his income.

You serious?

Prostitution is the oldest profession in the world. Just because your outlook on sex is totally different from other people, doesn't make paying for sex wrong.

The funny truth is that the church, the moralists, used to tolerate prostitution.

"If you expel prostitution from society, you will unsettle everything on account of lusts".

Who said that? None other than Saint Augustine.

When both the agnostics and the church find themselves in agreement, you know the naysayers are simply lost at sea.

"steve@CPFC

Anyone who thinks visiting a prostitute and paying for sex is not cheating has lost the plot.

It is not cheating if the person isnt married is it

I also heard richard branson wanted to sponsor the english team but martin johnson declined saying he didnt think it was appropriate having Virgin on their jersey when the english team were getting screwed every weekend.

steve: "Should we be able to hire people to beat up if we have anger management problems. if the consent what is the problem?"

Sounds like you're looking, and given your recent posts on a few threads that's no surprise (you'd smash your wife's phone if she disobeyed you, etc.). Saying a disabled person is 'pathetic' because he or she can't find a significant other to sleep with is really what's pathetic, steve. Moreover the most pathetic posts on this site of late seem to mostly come from you, and the 'bad' ratings prove that. A few bad ratings here and there cannot be helped because people will click on them for no reason other than the fact that they've disagreed with you in the past, but in your case, being the top 'bad' winner, there is no question.

Stop trying to pimp your morality on others, steve. You are the only one who thinks the way you do, which makes you the odd person out, to be euphemistic. There is nothing wrong with prostitution so long as it is legal and the people are safe, and it's non of your business what another person does -- you desiring to video tape them is what's sick, my friend.

This thread is clear evidence that while everyone is entitled to an opinion, some people think forcing their beliefs on others is totally acceptable, and we must be wary of them.

While everyone has the right to pursue happiness, it does seem that some people's happiness is contingent on the non-consensual misery of others, and that is a problem.

Those people want prostitution illegal and cracked down on because they want to force their morality on the world. They say prostitution is a sickness, but the real sickness is their lust for power and the desire to use it to make others unhappy.

steve@CPFCSep. 04, 2011 - 03:42PM JST

This is disgusting and no doubt many of these men will have wives and children back home. I can understand single people going out and looking for partner but paying for a womens company is the lowest of the low. It may be a good idea for dcent people to film these perverts and put the videos online in a bid to stop them.

A man with a family who goes to a prostitute deserves to lose the house his marriage and and at least half his income.

OMG Steve@CPFC You mad, bro??

You can't judge another man. You don't walk in that man shoes. He may not be getting anything at home. If you aren't getting fed at home, you get your food elsewhere. Plain and Simple.

I was down in New Zealand, not too long ago. Auckland. It was very discrete actually. Couldn't find em anywhere. It wasn't OUT there like Japan is. Japan has their women on TV teasing you with cleavage shots and butt shakes EVERYDAY. It's on the trains, Friday magazine ads hanging just about you or at eye level.

New Zealand had none of that In-Your-Face booty stuff out in the open. My hat's off to the Kiwis, they give a bloke a proper welcome. Those guys who love Rugby and are going to NZ for the show. They are about to have the best time of their lives. It's a wonderful safe nuclear free country with great food, people and entertainment. Stop hating on another man for what he does with his Jimmy. That makes you low.

P.S: The Japanese girls are already working down there too. Got student visas going to English Conversation schools. They stay down there for a year or more. See for yourself. Prostitution is legal there, so are their websites.

Nicky WashidaSep. 07, 2011 - 08:36AM JST

but let's be realistic -- you don't have the right to force your partner (married or not) to have sex when they are not willing, and likewise they cannot force you to simply endure while their own desires are not met.

Really? Okay, I agree, but here's the flip side of that. You do have the right to sue your partners AND GET PAID for emotional pain. I kid you not. You can check it on CNN. I heard about it on the Phil DeFranco show which comes on everyday on YouTube. Well, it's not really a show but YEAH you can take your partner to court for not giving up the booty.

So yeah, you can't force your partner to do the deed but you can take em to court for....NOT taking care of business.

I walked away from this story and couldn't stop laughing. Those KIWIs are so smart . They are PUMPING money into their economy, literally. The whole Rugby World Cup is the biggest STIMULUS package ever. Stimulating thought isn't it?

Can you imagine the clientele? These guys will go to the matches. Screaming, consuming heaps of beer and alcohol, all the while, because it's such a MAN sport, their testorone levels will surge as the mind continues to produce more and more adrenalin.

After the game it'll be time to take a load off........hahahahahahahhaha Furthermore, the yen is strong. The exchange is beautiful right now. You could go down to New Zealand and spend a boat load of money.

Absolutely brilliant of New Zealand.

Despite the free-wheeling nature of the sex industry in New Zealand

Oh the sheep jokes that could come from this!!!!

expect to be rushed off their feet

Pun intended?

As the saying goes—Man cannot live by rugby alone.

oberst

There used to be a TV show called Blah blah Black Sheep, think it was filmed in the NZ too, now that's deviant................LOL

Nah deviant is the movie Black Sheep. Where the guy is having sex with the sheep to breed a mutant race of sheep. Those kiwis are damned scary lol

Disgusting? I assume many here live in Japan, where prostitution and porn are "technically" illegal. Plus all the Thai trips and God knows what my wife says about her Japanese colleagues trips to China! Get over it! New Zealand, as usual has one of the best ways of dealing with something that is always there, just not above ground. Make it above ground and suddenly, there's health regulations, labour practices, the lot. Getting closer on the same thing with weed.

Any time in Japan should tell you the more uptight and the more conservative you are about something, the weirder it gets. Hell, not just Japan, ultra right, anti-gay American politicians having sex with little boys? Think what you want, things above board are better than below...

Nicky.

Nothing to be ashamed off.

And you are 100% right(sad to say), most people blame their partners 100% for an affair but refuse to look at their own short-comings that might have caused their partners to stray.

Said that my parents hit a rough spot in their marriage and went on a 2-week separate(no questions asked) holiday and it did them good. Sometimes a bit of straying is what is needed, IMO.

People get contend and dissatisfied with what is ready and a given and take if for granted = BAAD news for any relationship.

Not saying you should give your hubby a free-ticket nor should you have one while he is ... ;)

naruhodo1.

Gentleman's agreement. ;) And who knows what the wifes were up too? You just got to trust in your partner and YOUR ability to keep them happy and fulfilled.

Myself never resorted to paying for it in monetary terms, granted we did so in my younger years in suppers, cinema tickets, etc. ;)

I think some people see a clear distinction between sex and love and others don't. I personally pity these poor people who don't. I cannot imagine that people are truly happy when sex is not accompanied by whatever level of feelings - in fact I even can't imagine that from my point of view - but if people perceive it differently, I don't really care.

I see no reason to forbid anyone to pay for sex, as long as it is a fair deal. I don't see any reason to forbid anyone to receive money for sex, as long as it is a fair deal. I have a problem with prostitution, if it goes beyond the acceptable standards, in case of child prostitution of involuntary women or men dragged into it. But in principle, it is just a business, which is neither better nor worse than most other businesses of the service sector. Condemning those people who find no better job than prostitute to make a living reveals a disgusting haughtiness.

Cheating is something completely different. It can be combined with prostitution, but there are plenty of other opportunities as well. And I honestly believe that the majority of cheating partners cheats together with a friend or a colleague, or even with somebody met a the right time under right circumstances instead with a prostitute. Cheating is among the worst things You can do. It is the worst, a lie that will overshadow a couple's future, which can never be truly forgotten. However, if both partners don't care, it is not cheating.

People don't tell there spouses because of some moral dilemma. They don't tell their spouses because they will be angry.

Maybe in your case. For most couples, it IS a moral dilemma. Married couples tend to be monogamous for the most part, and both parties pledge to be true and faithful to each other. Cheating is an infringement of that moral framework they've created.

Steve@PCFC

" the Odeman; So what if the profession is old, cheating is cheating "

At the risk of sounding like a broken record: paying a professional for services is not "cheating". Cheating would be if he had a love affair, involving emotions and telling lies all around. You might refuse to see the difference, but others do.

Cleo - lol.

Steve@CPFPC:

" Paying a woman for sex is vile and immoral. "

So, not paying is moral? Telling lies and involving feelings to get a free ride is OK? Really now. THAT is what I´d call low.

cheating is cheating. Men who have loving wive sand family back home are using the family income to pay to cheat with another woman. How can anyone want to have sex with someone they do not have strong feelings for? Now, that is a alck of morals.

My point was that everyone has different views about everything. Some people like yourself believe its a disgusting thing, while others believe its not that bad, depending on the situation. Everyone is different, you should respect everyones opinion and accept that we are all different.

I personally wouldnt go to a brothel, but if I had a long distance relationship, got a bit lonely, I would go to a place like that after a few years most likely. Do I love my partner less? No. If I started a relationship with another girl then thats cheating in my opinon. Sometimes we just gotta let out that stress. Again, all depends on your opinion. Please refrain from bashing peoples opinions, same goes for everyone else who has been bashing yours.

Said that is self-pleasuring also cheating? All that different from having a person doing it to you that you are not emotionally involved with?

Granted those are points you have to answer for yourself. Ditto for a quickie.

Anyone who thinks visiting a prostitute and paying for sex is not cheating has lost the plot.

It is not cheating if the person isnt married is it

Nice logic ExportExpert. You made me laugh.

Good points Export. Never thought about the handicap issue. The fetish issue is interesting too. Seems like lots of men I have known were into some sort of fetish. But I guess it is healthy for them.

@Export

the english team were getting screwed every weekend.

Keep the jokes coming, my friend... it'll make it all the sweeter when we kick your a*ses!

haha lucabrasi - you have to get past south africa first, that aint gonna happen

@Export

I fear you might be right.And we've got to get past Argentina and Scotland first. :(

Ah well, I'll concentrate on the cricket for now....

Good luck all anyway Lucabrasi I just hope it's a good tournament, and if nz get beat i hope its by south africa and not those aussie bastards lol

steve@CPFC

spidapig and Oracle; Sorry but these are forums to xepress views and as a respectabl;e family man with high morals i wish to make my points.

Ok make your points but do you have to call people titles like pathetic, disabled, immoral just because they dont live by the same high moral standard as you. If you have such a high moral standard as you claim then surely you can make your point without the need to lower yourself to gutter like name calling to make your point. And l say this because every-time you weigh into a debate you lower yourself and start be derogatory to people with different morals to you.

How can i force my beliefs on anyone on an internet forum? I do not have a brain washing conncetion. We are here to discuss and i ma against prostitution and in most countries it is illegal , i am not an extremist but the norm in my views re prostitution.

Well obviously not because this discussion is about NZ and in that country prostitution is legal so in this case l would say you are the odd man out.

New Zealand can pass whatever laws they want but i am suggesting ways to prevent spousal and child abuse by perverted men. Yes, a married man who goes to New Zealand to visit thes eplaces is abusing his family, morally and using family money is a selfish way that is breaking his marriage vows.

What a joke, so men who happen to visit a prostitute is a wife and child abuser. Now that is a classic. There a many many people who dont visit prostitutes that abuse their wives and or children. Some of them even have high morals.... The fact is Steve you are imposing your beliefs on this situation and damning everyone and anyone who doesnt agree. The fact of the matter is l have never visited one am happily married and never would. But l will not critisise another for doing so, that is their business and their business alone and has nothing to do with me, you or anyone else.

steve@CPFC:

" quite simply humans are socila creatures and if a man breaks up his family due to visiting prostitutes "

You are still mixing issues. Of course breaking up families is bad. But where do you draw the connection to legal prostition? To the contrary, I would argue that countries where prostition is legal have more stable families than countries with morality police and sexual hangups.

Also, I continue to find it degrading to the concept of marriage that you want to reduce it to "sex". That is a very narrow and shallow view.

Moderator: Sorry, but we already ruled that this line of discussion is off topic.

so men who happen to visit a prostitute

happen to... yeah.

"Sorry I'm late for dinner dear, on the way home I happened to visit a prostitute, you know how it is, right out of the blue, and one thing led to another......is my dinner cold?'

She also said that international visitors should be aware that sex workers in the country had rights.

Huh? Sex workers in all countries with functioning legal systems have rights.

Guess I'm kinda late on this string - but as for paying a person for their company - you're NOT paying for their company - you're paying for them to LEAVE when you're done.

Looks like some people will more ball games than just Rugby on their Agenda. ;)

But for every major event anywhere in the world it usually is a major boon for that particular profession.

As they say "When the Cat is away the Mice like to play", seen it often with business contacts(CEO's, etc). Got quiet a few blackmail pics. :p

There used to be a TV show called Blah blah Black Sheep, think it was filmed in the NZ too, now that's deviant................LOL

ExportExpert,

Judging by your last comment your a kiwi? Wont hold that against you :-)

We aussies have better taste than to screw sheep. We chase anything else that moves though

Nicky.

Gotcha 100%. ;)

The sheep will be jealous...baaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!

Readers, no more sheep jokes please.

Its just an act

If that's really all you think it is, for you ... that's all it is.

How sad.

@Novenachama: what you're saying is mostly right, in the case of illegal prostitution. In places where it's legal and regulated, the conditions are much, much better.

Jesus, sanitized sex, what a turn off! Forgive me for uttering that word....

Steve@PCFpc

" paying for a womens company is the lowest of the low. "

Oracle

" Murderers and rapists will be relieved to hear this! And perhaps some johns will consider "moviing up" on your terms. Just brilliant Steve! "

This must be the first time I 100% agree with Oracle. Hanky-panky has been part of human (and especially male) condition since time immemorial. And while it might be against your moral compass, to call it the lowest of the low is simply ludicrious. It is a victimless crime, and realistically it also saves marriages. Have you ever considered that the the Japanese approach to morality of "don´t ask don´t tell" is a better approach than the Western "let it all hang out" one?

You are free to have your morals, but at least acknowledge that there are other ways to look at this.

Moral compass aside, everyone has to take responsibility for their own actions. Its better to have legal and regulated prostitution where women can go to a brothel and sell their "services" with help available when needed compared to a back ally, jumping into random cars, or being invited to a home with nobody knowing where they're going.

Personally, why pay for sex when one can get it for free? Sure even "that" may be up for debate but lets just leave it at that for now xD.

My favorite story of morality dealing with prostitution is when a married man with children visits to local brothel consistantly. He keeps it up and eventually sees a new girl being advertised. Out of curiosity and the desire for some new flesh he pays for the service but when he enters the room finds his own daughter is the prostitute. One of the various morals of the story is WHY get married in first place if you can't stay loyal to the person you're married to?

"legal brothels"

Shouldn't they be illegal?

Steve@CPFC

" Are you awind up or summink? Physical contact and sexual activity wheteher paid for or free is cheating. "

I am not and it is not. Actually, if you reduce the concept of marriage to simply "sex", that is pretty degrading. Ever considered that?

All readers back on topic please. This discussion has nothing to do with marriage vows. Please focus your comments on what is in the story and do not be impolite to each other.

Nicky/It"s Me: "And you are 100% right(sad to say), most people blame their partners 100% for an affair but refuse to look at their own short-comings that might have caused their partners to stray."

I'm not sure when going to a prostitute became akin to cheating, since many who go to such services, including some women, are not married, but you guys both make very interesting posts. I disagree with It"s ME to an extent; I don't think in most cases of adultery a spouse who cheats blames it on their partner. I think they must to an extent, unless absolutely cold-hearted, blame themselves for the act, and for the cowards in the lot blame their spouse later to justify it if caught. "The passion that burns brightest is the soonest to burn out" or something like that, was written by Shakespeare, I believe, but it holds true for a lot of relationships, and especially in marriages. For whatever reason, while I believe couples may continue to genuinely love each other, the passion just fizzles out and there is little or no physical intimacy. This is a sad thing, but a fact for many, and leads both men and women to seek out that missing piece in the arms of others. As with Nicky, I'd rather it be with a prostitute, as a mere physical function, than for a spouse to have feelings for the person he probably often sleeps with on the side. Ideally the home fires keep burning and a couple is comfortable enough to carry on physically over the ages, and talk things out if not, but let's be realistic -- you don't have the right to force your partner (married or not) to have sex when they are not willing, and likewise they cannot force you to simply endure while their own desires are not met. It's a two way street.

Regardless, my first point remains -- it is not all married people who use such services, nor is it illegal, so there should be no one pushing their values on others here. If it's not right for you, then all the power to you. If it's okay for you, and you are safe, then as Oracle says it's no one else's business.

JapanGal.

" Rugby is pretty rough. I think the guys look more cute though then the Americans with all their football gear. "

LOL, the last adjective that would come to my mind when describing an Aussi or Brit rugby player is "cute".

@Oracle, marriage is much more a "sexual contract" it was a commitment. Even if a man or woman live in a country that allowed poligamy, if they sleep around with someone that is not one of their many wives or many husbands, then why did the marry (aka "commit") to that person in the first place??? What you responded with is what a person who wants their cake and eat it too would think. I remember Magic Johnson was married, fooled around with someone who wasn't his wife, got AIDs and gave it to his wife, sure one could say he wasn't careful but my point is, there are people in the world that are happy being with only one person. There are also people in the world that don't want to be commited to just one person and would like to play around as much as they'd like. It would be in everyones best interest that the people that do NOT want to commit to just one person should only mess around with other people that do NOT want to commit to just one person and leave the people that DO want to commit to just one person alone. If a person cannot be loyal to the one they CHOSE to commit to then they should not do it in the first place. It saves a lot in the drama bank.

Wonders if they have any legal "beefcake"?

I can't believe I'm in agreement with WilliB!!

Readers, please keep the discussion civil. This is not a morality discussion, nor is it about marriage vows. The story is a humorous look at how sex workers are getting ready for the rugby World Cup. Please focus your comments on that.

I read the story and do not see any humor. I see the rights of NZ to make their own rules and it seems to be a healthy position.

Let the women work. They make a lot of men happy, and probably some women too.

@WilliB I do know the difference, if an unmarried person decides they want to visit a brothel then there is no issue. If a married person decides they want to visit a brothel then its an issue between them and the person they're married to and shows a lot about their personality and self-discipline. As I said, for those who are married it usually involves a 3rd person that doesn't know the person they're with may come home with another persons "cooties" loyal unless before they married it was understood that the marriage was "open" and they BOTH agreed that they want to fool around with other people when the chance arises.

When I travelled to Hong Kong you would not believe how many married men from the US/UK and other EU countries WITH children travelling on business were doing the nearest prostitutes or trying to get a new girlfriend overseas. It was quite sickening to know the indescretions of others, but its their life and they have to deal with the consequences of their choices.

but let's be realistic -- you don't have the right to force your partner (married or not) to have sex when they are not willing, and likewise they cannot force you to simply endure while their own desires are not met.

Absolutely. Completely agree with this, and if I was withholding the goods I feel I would have no right to expect my husband to "gaman". However, if I am NOT withholding the goods, I would not be very happy if HE was dishing up the goods elsewhere!

@Steve: I had a friend who privately told me he went to prostitutes (he was single) because he was just too busy to have a relationship and didnt want to use anyon or hurt anyones feelings, and didnt want the pressure of having to be someones partner. I didnt see anything wrong with that and actually thought it was quite a thoughtful approach (he is happily married with 2 kids now by the way).

but as for paying a person for their company - you're NOT paying for their company - you're paying for them to LEAVE when you're done.

ha ha! yes, so true! That was my biggest objection to some (insert expletive) who wanted to meet me every Tuesday afternoon in his office. At least hookers get paid for it!!! Aside from the fact that we were both married and I wasnt remotely interested in having an affair, especially with him, he hadnt even bought me a beer for Gods sake!

Man I'm in the wrong profession.

Let's be honest. Both men and women know that prostitution is not a good thing. People vary on how "immoral" or wrong it is, but we all know deep down that it is wrong, bad, or at the very least unfortunate. Here are some things you are very likely to hear.

The prostitutes workmates giving a toast at her wedding praising her for her commitment to her job.

A prostitute telling her daughter that she is so proud that she has decided to follow in Mummy's footsteps.

A father proudly telling everyone that his daughter told the teacher that she has decided on a career in prostitution.

Face it, people defend it because men want to justify themselves for going there. Women who are prostitutes want to continue getting the money, but don't want to be condemned.

Men and women are different. Steve said he can't understand having sex with someone he didn't love. Steve, you are a saint. Most men won't go to a prostitute, but if they were given a free ticket to either the Tonga-Japan game or three hours with the top girl at the Pleasure Dome ... the reason they will go to the game is because they are trying to be moral, religious, or being true to their woman. In other words, lots of men can easily think it would be a good time to have sex with a woman they don't love.

Women on the other hand are different. Which is why women become prostitutes when the price is right. Because they DON'T WANT to do it - but the money becomes worth overriding what they feel in their hearts.

If people love their jobs, they sometimes retire and do similar work on a voluntary basis. I doubt whether many of the NZ prostitutes will do that.

We all know it's wrong. Prostitutes are simply waiting for the day when they won't have to be prostitutes. (And nobody HAS to be one anyway. More than 99% of women choose to simply have less money).

Steve, everyone knows you are right - people just hate being told.

Thanks netninja! I always said to my husband whats sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander buddy, but based on your post I have changed my mind now to "You want sauce buddy, its gonna cost ya!"

If you go to NZ and need to call / visit a hooker there is something seriously wrong. The women there are some of the most 'liberal' on the planet and rank up there at or near the top when it comes to most sex 'partners' in the world.

Hmm, its pretty interesting. With comments like, "Well I'm not getting it at home so I may as well get it somewhere else..." I'm pretty sad at the state of affairs people are in. Its never occurred to some people that even if they don't feel like having sex with the person they're with that they should learn to do things they don't feel like doing to make the other person happy? As many folks say, a relationship between a couple requires work on BOTH sides to keep it going forward. When one drops out of doing their "duties" then everything falls apart. I know there were times my missus wanted to have at me and I was absolutely in no mood for it, but guess what? I did it anyways because I took her feelings into consideration above my OWN. It's what people in a relationship should be doing but many do not and most often ends up in a very sad state of affairs if not completely destroyed. Too many of us are selfish, and are pretty much using the other person for our own wants and desires.

@MickBell70 too true. Back in my free-wheeling days, I knew there were people out there that didn't want a relationship and just wanted to fool around. So since I was not tied down myself and wasn't in the mood for a relationship beyond that I knew where to find them and it worked out pretty well. Of course I had to make sure they weren't fooling around on someone they were with also because drama sucks.

it’s usually the local sex workers who are there to greet new clients

that's rather unfortunate. just saying.

Spidapig24,

Here we go again, the moral compass of the world at it again! Steve, if a person wants to use the services of these people and it is legal then you have no right to call them perverts or want to tape them and put it online. Maybe you should look in your own backyard before worrying about what others are doing.

I find it FASCINATING that you would make comments like this!

We aussies have better taste than to screw sheep. We chase anything else that moves though

Heh, whale humper.

We don't need you or him to know that our bodies are our bodies.

You could do with taking this advice yourself. If a girl wears short skirt, it's HER body and you have no right to do anything you want because you feel sexually attracted to them.

Oracle, you really have an awful attitude towards women.

oginomeSep. 05, 2011 - 12:04AM JST

Maybe in your case. For most couples, it IS a moral dilemma.

Here we go again. You seem to have major trouble understanding the meaning of sentences as they relate to other sentences. It does not help that you parse sentences too. I did not say it was not a moral dilemma. I said it was not the reason they lied.

Married couples tend to be monogamous for the most part

Oh sure. I am sure you have the stats right in your pocket!

, and both parties pledge to be true and faithful to each other.

Marriage vows are not sexual pledges. They are spiritual.

Cheating is an infringement of that moral framework they've created.

This is primarily in the wetware between the ears of people like yourself, who see what you want to see and think you have a natural inherent right to control the sexuality of your spouse with dictatorial power.

HonestDictatorSep. 05, 2011 - 06:55AM JST

One of the various morals of the story is WHY get married in first place if you can't stay loyal to the person you're married to?

My question is why get married if you think marriage is a sexual contract? If that is your stance, prostitution is what you are actually looking for.

Here we go again. You seem to have major trouble understanding the meaning of sentences as they relate to other sentences. It does not help that you parse sentences too. I did not say it was not a moral dilemma. I said it was not the reason they lied.

You were the one that came out with this huge generalisation 'People don't tell because of a moral dilemma' when in fact, you were only basing that on your own experiences and moral system. What goes for you isn't true for everyone. You're the one who has trouble understanding.

Marriage vows are not sexual pledges. They are spiritual.

Faithfulness is NOT the preserve of spirituality. Many agnostic and aetheist couples pledge to be faithful and true to each other, and in fact many don't even need to say it, as they feel such a standard goes without saying in a healthy, functioning relationship.

This is primarily in the wetware between the ears of people like yourself, who see what you want to see and think you have a natural inherent right to control the sexuality of your spouse with dictatorial power.

Lol, no. It's about a couple being honest with each other.

When both the agnostics and the church find themselves in agreement, you know the naysayers are simply lost at sea.

Not really.

Just got out of the shower. Putting a new pink coat on but decided to take a look at the rules of this game. Pretty interesting.

Rugby is pretty rough. I think the guys look more cute though then the Americans with all their football gear. Aren't there a lot of injuries?

Just wondering, and not saying one sport is better than another.

I agree WilliB

steve@CPFC

I am not forcing anything on anyone , can you people read? Nowm i give mt views, do NOT order what people should post., butt out !!!

Steve you are forcing your beliefs on people as you do and have done numerous times in the past. You call people names (pathetic, immoral etc) because they do not subscribe to your beliefs. What right do you have to judge others on how they live their life. Would you like someone to judge what you do in your life and pass judgement call you pathetic, disabled, immoral whatever else. You continually offend people on this forum with your beliefs. If a person wants to pay for sex whatever their reason that is up to them and they will face the outcome, it has nothing to do with you and you have no right to pass judgment.

Some say i am forcing my beliefs, how am i doing that? One person says that and you all jump on the bndwagon!! A person who pays for sex whetehr in New Zealand or anywhere is pathetic.

So you find them pathetic, some may find you pathetic. You get upset when people criticize you yet you believe it is your right to call people pathetic for their life choices. Whether it be this topic, raising children, wives working whatever you get offensive and call people names if they dont subscribe to your lifestyle. Steve the only pathetic person in all this is the uptight man who cant accept people live their life different to him.

If married why not pay for help if their is a problem with you or your partner? The money spent on prostitutes could be spent pn helpong both in teh marriage , NOT satisfying just one person.

A single eprson could spend the money improving themselves ,whether on a diet, better clothes, social skills or whatever.

They could they could also spend THEIR money on whatever THEY want to and it has nothing to do with you so tho quote you "BUTT OUT!!!"

Thanks for that info Lucabrasi.

When my mistakes come across with spelling, there is a dotted red line under the word. Perhaps he turned that off in his Windows XP system's browser. Could also be a color blind issue with red and green.

The fact that it is legal there to sell one's body probably allows to mandatory health checks and that is good.

All u lads who are FOR married individuals goin to such places, and therefore think it is morally ok, then why do those husbands lie about it to their wives. Why dont you see those men coming home saying tadaima, oh by the way hon, went to a whore house...BECAUSE its morally WRONG!! Nothing right about it!! Otherwise there would be nothing to feel guilty/ashamed about after the deed has been done! Steve, for once i agree with you. And the only reason others here are against it is because the have gone to brothels and they need to justify their wrong actions by finding others to support. All you liers and cheaters will get caught sooner or later and you will get what you deserve. HOWEVER, if your significant other has no problems with your whoring, then thats up to the COUPLE and therefore see nothing wrong with it.

Prostitution is a despairing, horrible condition for any women and girl who should end up there. There is much harm in prostitution. Mortality, homicide, suicide, sexually transmitted disease, violence, beatings, shootings, stabbings and rape. It is no life for anyone period. Prostitution violates the right to physical and moral integrity by the alienation of women's sexuality that is appropriated, debased and reduced to commodity to be bought and sold. Hence prostitution is an enemy to the good, the true, the beautiful that are the crowning excellencies of the world.

Personally, why pay for sex when one can get it for free?

What makes you think everyone can get it for free? What makes you think all spouse even provide? What makes you think sex with ones spouse is the same as with a prostitute? Have you ever seen pictures of a wedding, then looked at how the wife looks today? So many balloon up after having babies, and odds are that if a man did not marry a balloon, he does not fancy a balloon as a sex partner.

Prostitution is a good and valuable service. It keeps many men married for the sake of the children and his own mental stability. If you are not going to further this service and help it along, then step aside.

cleo; Well said. Seems like those visiting the places in New Zealand including some posters here think this is an everday incident.

spidapig and Oracle; Sorry but these are forums to xepress views and as a respectabl;e family man with high morals i wish to make my points.

How can i force my beliefs on anyone on an internet forum? I do not have a brain washing conncetion. We are here to discuss and i ma against prostitution and in most countries it is illegal , i am not an extremist but the norm in my views re prostitution.

New Zealand can pass whatever laws they want but i am suggesting ways to prevent spousal and child abuse by perverted men. Yes, a married man who goes to New Zealand to visit thes eplaces is abusing his family, morally and using family money is a selfish way that is breaking his marriage vows.

I find it very odd that most men interested in Japan have these morals whereas paid sex and cheating is fine Whereas the majority views it as wrong,

WilliB; Are you awind up or summink? Physical contact and sexual activity wheteher paid for or free is cheating.

What can be lower than some sad loser who has to pay for a womans company?

the Odeman; So what if the profession is old, cheating is cheating. Men who have loving wive sand family back home are using the family income to pay to cheat with another woman. How can anyone want to have sex with someone they do not have strong feelings for? Now, that is a alck of morals. As ever i get bashed, for what? Saying that being unfaithfull is wrong. As i have said before the world haa lack of morals. A man who does this does not deserve to have a loving wife and children. How could a man ever look his wife and family in teh face after commiting such perversions?

The reason a man without severe disabilities or the like would go to a hooker is because he is patehtic and cannot control his urges. Should we be able to hire people to beat up if we have anger management problems. if the consent what is the problem?

I have said that it is also wrong for single people. what kind of loser would need to pay a woman for sex? Guess the type who cannot attract one for whatvere reason.

Olrik; Of course that is just as low and vile but this is about men in New Zealand.

WilliB; What are you atlking about? Physical realtionship is one part of the relationship. You do not seem to have the ability to grasp what marriage vows mean.

Anyone who thinks visiting a prostitute and paying for sex is not cheating has lost the plot.

WilliB;Yes paying a woman for sex is immoral. Physical relationships work because both partners have strong bonds and feelings not just to satisfy themesleves in a selfish manner such as a man cheating on his wife.

I have never said telling lies is ok, have i? As many others have done here recently you assume things about me but in doing so you make uourself look very foolish. I think you need to grow emotionally before you embark on aserious relatiionship.

Madverts; You call me the lowest of the low. What prray tell do is ound gulity of? Trying to protect marriages and family is a good things. Paying a woman for sex is vile and immoral. I did not say i "desire" to film the perverst but that filming it and showing online would be the correct thing to do. If anyone is afraid that they will be filmed is in the wrong. The men are wrong, the men are low. They are cheating on their whole family and destroying their own souls.

This is disgusting and no doubt many of these men will have wives and children back home. I can understand single people going out and looking for partner but paying for a womens company is the lowest of the low. It may be a good idea for dcent people to film these perverts and put the videos online in a bid to stop them.

A man with a family who goes to a prostitute deserves to lose the house his marriage and and at least half his income.