Obama unveils biggest financial rules overhaul since 1930s

Allow me to be the first to air the opinion of our Republican friends: "Socialism! Socialism!" :-)

He blamed the crisis on a ‘‘culture of irresponsibility,’’ the Great Depression-era regulatory system, reckless executive compensation, excessive debt, and markets filled with risky financial products.

this is why this "proposal" will fail. by framing it in terms easy to understand by potential voters, he is failing to address the underlying reasons for the recent troubles, which are far more complex than a three second sound bite allows.

And yes, SushiSake3, this does sound like socialism. All socialism ever does is take away the incentive to produce from those willing to do so, while claiming to give free stuff to those that aren't. It's never worked before, and it's not going to work now, unless of course you are an underachiever looking for mommy-government to take care of you.

Ive been known to underachieve. What is this mommy-government you are talking about and where can I find it?

rofl, "executive compensation" is a reason for the crisis. hilarious

Into the Obama fire and Obama solutions ,from the Bush fire ashes. We humans have risen from ashes of destruction,many times.

People can make things more cossy/warm and bake more bread.There is a way,if there is a will.

Willpower to do,is good.

There is more than enough wheat sprouting ,from the plains.

No choice for everyone, into Obama administration fire we go and hope we get lucky strikes,and bake more bread for all.

We need to do more, to rise up from the ashes and use the energy of flame fires,to bake more bread for all.

Sometime we are lucky or sometimes we are not. Everyone has his share of luck.

Flames/fires can be used to do more good and feed more people. We are at the crossroads,choose the right positive path, to do more good.

Rise people up and talk up the economy,do what is right, to get economic confidence up.

Get it fired up, with Obama .

People are ready to do more good, for better future.

Obama's,nuclear weapons-free world ,policies,is the way to go.

Yes, we can persuade others on this fine policy.

The potential is in all,to do more good.

Obama is going to fix everything. It'll take him four years, but he'll fix everything.

They just can't resist the totalitarian urge.

I don't know that much about the financial world so I'll let the usual experts come by to tell us all how it really is.

Nowhere near enough. The problem in the USA and other rich countries is not capitalism, it's that they stopped being capitalist years ago. Giving your money to somebody to bet on next week's stock prices, or to buy a company and then flip it is not capitalism, it's gambling. Allowing the "financial sector" to use their middleman position to siphon billions out of the real economy is not capitalism either. What the USA needs to do is get back to the capitalist model that built the country in the first place. Investing capital in new ideas, new technologies, new ways of doing things, and better ways of doing what you already do, instead of just gambling in a system rigged to inflate asset prices through debt. And they have no choice because the casino economy is dead.

Raj: "No choice for everyone, into Obama administration fire we go"

Lord help us.

Is this a fixed New Deal or a part of Obamanian Idealism? I wonder how it will affect his relationship with the Federal Reserve Board and the big powers in the Wall Street.

I'm happy to give back some gains in order to get more stability.

but it wont get more stable...

If you read the definition of Totalitarianism, it is more likely that we are living in it now. Not from an Obama/Government perspective, but from a Corporate perspective, in terms of regulation (Rent, Interest, Fees, Commissions, on almost everything we do), in terms of political power (Advertising, corporate regulatory bodies/associations/clubs, Media), the level of fear in losing work. I would call it Corporate Totalitarianism, of which for most, there's no way out but to join it.

The weak links as mentioned in the article are not the multiple regulatory bodies, it is the corporations behaviors themselves. Most of which have proven to be predatory psychopaths that profit for the sake of profit, so long as there are no snags with the legal system that would prove costly to themselves. Nothing so new here.

The rules should be simple, a corporation and its administrators whos actions are solely for the sake of profit, should be deemed psychopathic, and therefore not mentally capable of making business decisions, in light of its impact on society.

How do we do this, simple, starting with the largest and most profitable companies, begin investigating their affairs over the past five to ten years, in terms of the number of employees terminated (If excessive, then clearly antisocial), how much profits where channeled through offshore entities (If excessive, then clearly antisocial), what percentage was allocated to community or philanthropic causes (if minimal, then clearly antisocial).

Below is a small list of some of the largest companies in the world. There is quite a bit of evidence over the past ten years on the behavior of some of these entities, it is just a matter of proving sociopathic behaviors, and determining mental incompetence through this, which would have to be of course assessed by a professional health organization such as the American Psychological Association (APA), or Australian Psychological Society (APS), etc:

Wal Mart - United States (retail) ExxonMobil Corporation - United States (oil) Royal Dutch Shell - Netherlands [2] (oil) BP - United Kingdom (oil) Toyota Motor - Japan (automobiles) Chevron - United States (oil) ING Group - Netherlands (banking) Total - France (oil) General Motors - United States (automobiles) ConocoPhillips - United States (oil)

Of course some would worry about the employees and perhaps shareholders of these related to these companies, however, it is not the companies themselves, at risk, it is simply their behavior, particularly in terms of the level of unemployment caused, the lack of contribution to society in terms of taxes, community, and philanthropy, and generally where resources are spent, which is separate from the contributions and efforts of the individuals themselves.

In terms of individuals, another group of potential psychopaths could be in the following list of billionaires, of which Sociopathy can be determined generally by what or what is not being spent annually in more or less the same criteria as above:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:American_billionaires

Many Psychologists claim that Psychopathy or Sociopathy is incurable, however, it is the behavior of such mental incompetents, whether corporate entities or persons, that can actually be controlled and monitored.

Many would claim that then psychopathy is widespread and would include mnay people, however, we wouldn't propose investigation of an entire population, which would clearly make this a totalitarian regime, we would only be talking about the 1st percentile or perhaps 5th percentile of individuals and corporations, and determining what would be considered excessive or unreasonable towards society, especially when compared to the bottom 1st or 5th percentile of society.

I'm happy to give back some gains in order to get more stability." True, but wouldn't you feel better knowing what your money is doing? that's the problem, those who create what we need to pay into are more or less pushed by their interest groups.

Is this a fixed New Deal or a part of Obamanian Idealism?

It's The Ultimate Raw Deal.

It's Liberal Fascism, and "progressives" have dreamt of bringing it to America since the 1920's.

Has anyone seen the movie "Corporation"? They mentioned that most companies act as sociopaths. The documentary made some interesting comparisons between the sociopath and modern corporate behavior.

Sarge-

Every nation from North korea to somalia is being put, in some kind of administration's fire.

Hope JT readers with the help of the Lord, can help all via their wise solutions. Make all nations and citizens have good days via wise advise.

Best way is for all to help each other,via high thinking/high discussions/higher ways of doing things , that must be constantly improved on.

There are many people on JT,who are wiser but don't make it to white house.

If the wisest people become presidents/kings/PMs and all heaven will break loose.

All woes will be breaking loose ,with the unwise as leaders.

All JT readers must criticise and get wiser,for more positive outcomes for all.

ALL readers need to enlighten us all, to make all heaven break loose.

This is outstanding.

Yeah, we might have been in a recession, but nothing like what we're going through.

Derivitives and hedgefunds that do nothing but enrich a few people. Designed to work that way.

The jerks on Wall Street stole more than enough from hard working Americans and then we have to bail these jerks out.

But I invite comments from my republican posters telling of the errors in this plan. < :-)

I sure hope they know what they're doing.

I do think that restricting the FED is good though.

Obama wants control of the banks, he wants to personally regulate salaries for execs - but you can bet his fawning admirers in Hollywood and of course pro athletes won't see their salaries "capped".

Anti-capitalist, anti-business and unfit to lead.

He should be impeached for DealerGate.

The "bad" banks should have been left to fail.

I don't know how giving the privately owned Fed more power and reducing the number of regulators is supposed to "tighten oversight."

The financial system as we knew it has failed and the collapse of the system in the U.S. has brought the global economy to its knees.

While Republicans may wish to go back to the capitalist system that undoubtedly made many rich and yet at the same time widened the rich-poor gap, that system is broken, and rebuilding all or most of that system is a recipe for further instabilty and turmoil in global financial systems later on.

It's obvious that something has to change and that wishing for what was is unrealistic and naive.

Greed on the part of brokers and bankers (some of who earned 400-500 times what their workers did) as well as the sale of financial instruments containing bundles of debt products that in many cases not even the brokers could understand were keys to the fiscal meltdown.

It's obvious that something has to change.

Can we trust bankers and brokers again? While there are many honest guys out there, many have also proven themselves to be liars who will do anything to embezzle your buck.

It's obvious that something has to change.

I think more government regulation is part of the answer, although not the whole answer. These cowboys need to understand that there will be marks they cannot overstep and banks need to realize that charging exhorbitant fees is not in their interests.

For those who do not agree that more Government regulation is the answer, let's hear what you do propose, because up to this point, Republicans haven't made any constructive alternative proposals at all.

That said, they have excelled in their area of excellence - moaning about the proposals put forward by the president who is tasked with mopping up the disaster the GOP created.

teleprompter - "Obama wants control of the banks, he wants to personally regulate salaries for execs"

It seems like you personally want bank execs to continue earning hundreds of times what their staff do.

teleprompter - "Anti-capitalist, anti-business and unfit to lead."

Um...capitalism as we knew it as failed.

"anti-business"? The GOP-led global recession is about as "anti-business" as you can get. Your vote for the GOP was just one more reason we are in recession.

"unfit to lead" - compared to the last Idiot-in-Chief who presided over the start of the worst global recession in 80 years?

Please think before you post next time - you would come over with at least a shred of credibility. :-)

teleprompter - "It's Liberal Fascism"

How can you be so scared of something you clearly have no idea about? :-)

And if anyone had pipes dreams that the GOP might be the better party to tackle the fiscal meltdown that they were largely responsible for creating, it's interesting to note that support for the GOP has plummetted to 28%, reportedly the lowest ever.

Talk about irrelevant, as are its supporters. :-)

I do enjoy watching foreign "socialists" from flaky first world suburbia who have chosen to make their homes in uber-capitalist Japan Inc. tell us how misguided conservative Americans (and 3 bn Indians and Chinese...) are for resisting and wanting to ditch socialism.

The jerks on Wall Street stole more than enough from hard working Americans and then we have to bail these jerks out." No, we didn't have to and we shouldn't have. Anyone from a beginning investor could be making money right now, had they not bailed many of these companies out.

teleprompter, why is it that whenever you realize your argument has gone off the cliff, you start slamming "foreigners"?

Just curious.

"He should be impeached for DealerGate"

Har!

Sushi, why is it that whenever you've been slammed, you claim the slammer's argument has gone off the cliff?

Sarge, can you put forward some constructive, workable ideas to get the U.S. out of this fiscal mess?

C'mon, just 1. Please explain what it is and how it will/may be effective.

Thanks in advance.

Sarge - "Sushi, why is it that whenever you've been slammed, you claim the slammer's argument has gone off the cliff?"

I think I was slammed because teleprompter knew that yet another of his arguments had evaporated. :-)

Sushi - Constructive, workable idea to get the U.S. out of this mess:

Build a time machine, send someone back to the year 1999 and disable Governor Bush.

Ha ha ha, seriously, you'd have to go back farther than that, probably around 1976...

Seriously, make the government actually spend no more money than they take in. And get the government out of the business of running banks and car companies.

Sarge - "Seriously, make the government actually spend no more money than they take in."

So you repent for the last 8 years where $6 trillion went up in smoke?

Just checking. :-)

Sushisake3 - if you were more observant you'd notice I cite British, Canadian, Australian, Indian,Iranian, Iraqi newspapers,bloggers and media sources in my posts - from Japan, where I have lived for longer than you have been an adult.

I have no fear of foreigners, just a certain wariness of the ones like you who want America to become like whatever country it is you left for Japan.

90 percent of your posts focus on the same topic.

It is you who lives in fear.

Obama wants to bring fascism to my country. "Progressives" have wanted to do this since the 1920's.

You,son, need to study more history.

Simple as that.

Well I'm not from a foreign country. I'm right here in the good ol' USA. I've been watching the recession first hand. I've got friends who have lost jobs or taken a substantial hit to their salaries. I've watch businesses close their doors because nobody can afford to buy anything except from Walmart.

Then I see CEOs who really do nothing except hold down a seat earn $$Millions of dollars, when the people who work to earn their salary getting $45K or less. I watch them earn $$millions of dollars with their golden parachutes and then these companiers are struggling to stay in existance.

There's a difference in earning a salary and stealing a salary. There's a difference in earning a salary and skimming $Millions from a company for doing nothing.

Then you have the smart individuals who dreamed up derivitives and steal through hedgefunds. Hell yes we need some major changes.

We watched capitalism fail in the US these past couple of years and the republicans want the very same thing to rebound, so the same thieves who stole from us before still can continue to steall and maybe we can get some new thieves. < :-)

"Obama wants to bring fascism to my country."

Whooa.....I thought it was socialism. Heh, the radicals just make it up as they're frothing along....

capitalism as we knew it as failed.

The last time the U.S saw real capitalism was in the 20' everything since that point has been a mixed economy leaning towards a free market, just to set the record straight.

What we're seeing right now is part of the free market cycle to which there is no solution but to let it run its course. What is occuring now is a continuation of the government interfereing with private business matters which has never helped anyone.

Whatever happens, we need to get back to fundamentals. Investing in companies because of the products they build or the services they provide, etc. Things just seem to be out of control with people inventing ways to make money that doesn't actually involve creating anything, just moving numbers around on paper.

We've watched oil's roller coaster because the fundamentals no longer depend on supply and demand. The price is rising while we have a glut of supply and decade-low demand levels. People are running out of places to store it. Why? Because it's because used as an asset or hedge or for speculation. Demand is nearly irrelevant.

We watched the banking sector nearly implode due to derivatives that most bankers themselves don't even understand, creating a paper market worth tens of trillions of dollars with no oversight. Two statisticians literally sat in a Wall Street office and invented an entire house of cards for the simple purpose of generating fees and reducing capital reserves.

The real estate lending market became so far removed from its principals that you didn't even need to prove you made money in order to get a loan for a house. And golly, who could have predicted that it would have lead to record defaults and foreclosures?

We watched iconic GM fall due to outrageous health care and labor costs and somewhere down near the bottom of the list is the problems with the cars they actually produce.

The people behind all of this live in a bubble completely isolated from how the world works outside of Wall Street. Companies merge and get bigger and bigger and the numbers in their portfolios get bigger and bigger and suddenly taking a million dollars and giving it to a mid-manager makes sense since it's such a small percentage of the billions he's controlling. I think they're so used to seeing so many zeroes on the papers in front of them that they've lost all concept about the real value of money to those who actually work for a living. Their entire goal is to create the largest polls of money/assets they can possibly get their hands on and take a percentage for themselves at the end of the day. And who cares about how the money is created? The bigger the number the bigger the "responsibility" and the bigger the payout.

The markets are so ass backwards right now that no one knows what the price of oil will be next month or what the exchange rates will be or what their credit card interest rates will be. The markets keep getting broadsided by these massive lightening strikes that make long term planning guesswork. The price of oil is going up, demand is weak, and another spike is coming when the world sees the impact of reduced investment in exploration that's taking place today. People stop spending money when they're not certain about their future. It's not a good thing.

Personally, I'm tired of having my future in the hands of a tiny percentage of people who have the ability to completely screw up the system. And that's what we have today....literally a handful of people and companies that can sink the entire world economy based on the risks they're willing to take to make more for themselves. I'm not too excited about government control but some changes need to be made to prevent the bottom from falling out like it almost did.

Because of the money you give them, speculators are able to use that money to make bets = when the money dried up they had a much harder time making these bets = oil prices dropped. If everyone walked, took mass transit, bicycled you would be doing everyone a favor and the rich a disfavor.

=put solar panels on your house and buy an electric car and only invest locally. =Even Al Gore will hate you. Grow your own foods, buy organic local foods.

Yeah Sushi,

It is you who lives in fear. Obama wants to bring fascism to my country. "Progressives" have wanted to do this since the 1920's.

It's as simple as that. teleprompter is like rubber and you are like glue. Everything you say about him bounces off and sticks to you.

Or whatever 2nd graders are saying on the school grounds these days.

"progressives want fascism." THAT, is a keeper.

Taka

I can't wait for the loonies to start accusing Pres. Obama of reflecting beams of light. It's took them less than 6 months to run out of the normal "isms."

Well...at least they're fun to laugh at.

Taka

We watched capitalism fail in the US these past couple of years

Yeah. Too much government intervention and regulation, powerful unions, corporate taxes, government bailouts, social engineering, etc. No wonder capitalism has failing. Obama now wants to put the final nail in the coffin. It's a victory for the socialists, no doubt.

Question for Taka313: Of course since you've been living off the taxpayers for years, the Obama recession hasn't really negatively affected you, but what about your neighbors who aren't living off the taxpayers? Are they better off or worse off since Obama was elected?

sarge,

So, serving ones country is now "living off the taxpayers?" OK, so be it. If that's the way you want to roll, fine.

As for my neighbors...on one side of me is a sweet elderly couple who are retired farmers. They just kicking back, enjoying their retirement and you know, "living off the taxpayers." On the other side of me is a lady who is a govt. service nurse for the Army so I guess she's also living off the taxpayers and not affected by "Obama's recession" (he has the receipt and EVERYTHING).

Are they better off or worse since Pres. Obama was elected? I haven't asked them. I'm not prone to asking people questions that could get me labeled as a loser. That's the way I roll.

However, our base is benefitting greatly from Pres. Obama's stimulus package, to the tune of $25 mill. in much-needed renovations and infra-structure projects for the base and surrounding county to handle the bases growth. Also, a $600 million lithium battery plant is being built in the local area, which will bring in more than 2000 new full-time jobs to that plant alone, plus another 1500 construction jobs. So...what do you think their answer would be if I asked if things were better now with Pres. Obama at the helm?

Let me know how that crow tastes too, K?

Taka

Superlib,

I really enjoyed reading your last post. Thank you.

Enron leaped off the screen as I read your words. I will never understand why that didn't create a sense of outrage. They toyed with people's lives for profits. I agree with you and share your reservations about involving the govt. I'm not crazy about the govt. getting involved but I think it's plain to see that the status quo is not going to cut it anymore.

Taka

I've watch businesses close their doors because nobody can afford to buy anything except from Walmart.

Ever wonder why Walmart isn't asking for bailouts?

It's so bad even the Russians are saying Obama is too far to the Left:

"Prime Minister Vladimir Putin on Monday criticized U.S. President Barack Obama's plan to raise taxes on U.S. companies' foreign operations, saying it would amount to double taxation that will hurt the global economy.

"This is a serious decision for the world economy," Putin said at a meeting of the Presidium, the government said on its web site. "If taxes are imposed on all companies working abroad, then it will mean the total destruction of the system for avoiding double taxation."

http://www.moscowtimes.ru/article/1009/42/378802.htm

One more thumbs up for the excellent post from Superlib.

I would have loved to see AIG and Citi go down in flames like they deserved, but if you've read anything about credit default swaps and the way the financial sector is interlinked, you can see that would have brought the entire economy crashing down. The bailout sucked, but it was the better of two bad options.

As a result, the people responsible for this have escaped with only a slight dent to their fortunes, and taxpayers have footed the bill. After a few months of obligatory statements about the need to bring risk and reward into line, JPMorgan and Goldman Sachs are now eager to return the TARP money and allow themselves to set the casino wheel rolling again. Investors are sitting on the sidelines with huge piles of cash ready to pour into the next big thing.

So how do we stop this happening again? If these new rules require banks to hold more capital and stop them becoming "too big to fail" through regulating CDS and other derivatives, then maybe we can let the next bank that screws up come crashing down, rather than holding the whole world to ransom. That's far closer to the ideals of capitalism than what we have at the moment.

Taka: I think it's plain to see that the status quo is not going to cut it anymore.

Yeah, to me it's government incompetence vs. corporate greed. We've seen corporate greed nearly end financial life as we know it, and it's gotten me to the point where I'll accept some government incompetence to balance out the destructive nature of corporate greed. Call it the lesser of two evils, but someone needs to oversee things.

Altria: As a result, the people responsible for this have escaped with only a slight dent to their fortunes, and taxpayers have footed the bill.

That pisses me off more than anything else. The people who responsibly handled their finances will pay a majority of the bill. I'm already paying higher credit card interest rates even tho I have spotless credit. Why? Because B of A tripped over their own dicks with their real estate deals and they're making me pay for their mistakes. People with good credit shouldn't be paying high interest rates. Meanwhile people in default are getting offers to eliminate their bad credit with rock bottom rates just so the bank can make sure they get a payment every month.

Again....no fundamentals in play whatsoever.

What's weird is that I watched Wall Street yesterday and saw some of the same lessons. Martin Sheen plays the Dad in the movie and a lot of what he said back in the 80s applies today. His point is that the guys on Wall Street don't create anything, they just move numbers on paper. To them a company is numbers and nothing else. They don't see it as a job that someone depends on for survival.

What I really liked was the scene where he's lecturing the shareholders of the paper company. He says that there are over 20 Vice Presidents who make an excess of $200,000 a year....heh. Back in the mid-80s that was the outrage number. Today guys are pulling down a million a month as a consultant.

SuperLib,

His point is that the guys on Wall Street don't create anything, they just move numbers on paper.

One of the trends I have spotted in the Department of Defense is hiring Lean 6 Sigma consultants or sending people to L6S schools in order to save money.

We spend a lot of money hiring outside contractors to look for ways to save money (sorry if the blinding light of the obvious is causing anyone to now see spots).

In my opinion, well over half of the consulting industry is a fraud.

Taka

Hey sarge,

Since you seem to be so curious about how Pres. Obama's impact with my local area, allow me:

The base's ER is getting $7 in stimulus money for a complete renovation. Not only will the renovation provide for better facilities, it will double the space, creating better access to care and lowering the facility's insurance premium. Ultimately, the $7 spent will save the taxpayers money.

Damn him again for taking better care of those taxpayer leeches in uniform, while saving the taxpayers money.

Taka

Hey, taka313,

"our base is benefitting greatly from Pres. Obama's stimulus package"

No doubt.

"The base's ER is getting $7 in stimulus money for a complete renovation."

Wow! Now that's what I call cost-effective! But tell me, where's the other $786,999,999,993 of the total $787,000,000,000 stimulus money going?

geez sarge,

Do you think that maybe the rest is going to similar projects?

Do other people do 100% of your thinking?

Wow.

Taka

Taka313

I think the point sarge was making was that you used the figure $7 and that you did not add million or whatever. I'll give sarge credit on this one. It is so rare for him to be so clever. It was a good line when he said "Wow! Now that's what I call cost-effective!" Go sarge!

GD, Ah. I missed it. I've grown so used to the inane comments that when something lucid sneaked through, I missed it. Yes, it is a $7 million dollar renovation that in the end will save the taxpayers money.

Taka

So where's the other $786,993,000,000 of the porkulus money?

President Obama and certain posters here who have depended on the taxpayers virtually their entire lives simply do not understand that you can't spend your way out of a recession.

sarge

You have developed into quite the economist. But weren't you the one expressing elation when Lehman Brothers crashed and burned? Did you support not allowing all the major financial houses to receive money to escape permanent doom? Did you believe it was ok to let the banks and financial institutions fail and just go away? We did not need that financial structure anyway did we sarge?

I have not seen these rules so I cannot say I agree with all of them, or any of them, at this point. I did know we needed regulation in the recent past and the conservative leadership failed America.

Sarge it is clear that you do not yet understand the extent of our economic woes last autumn. It went beyond any recession. However if you live long enough you will be able to clearly read it in your history books. Our economy was in shambles and our various financial sectors were near collapse. Those are facts. In my opinion history will record Obama's actions as being a major contributing factor towards recovery of an economy in shambles. He used tools afforded him by large sums of money to restore confidence in short order and also provide the liquidity needed to advance in a very dire situation.

It seems, in this situation as in almost all others, the conservatives can explain the entire matter in one or two sentences and provide a solution that fits nicely into a slogan. Unfortunately that is not how the world operates and its complexities are real. There are no easy solutions after an administration allows an economy and its financial structures to deteriorate to such a horrendous state. But by all means sarge continue shrieking "you can't spend your way out of a recession" at the top of your lungs from the highest point you can find. Meanwhile the work will continue without conservative support to repair the damage that your ilk did to my nation.

gD:"history will record Obama's actions... he used tools afforded him by large sums of money"

He's spending large sums of your money all right.

"... to restore confidence in short order"

It's been over 5 months since he took office and the recession is worse than ever.

"the damage that your ilk did to my nation"

Damage? You ain't seen nuthin' yet.

"by all means sarge continue shrieking"

You've been hangin' with Madverts, haven't you?

Hopin' for Change - - - -

"39 Percent Now Blame Obama for Economy, a 12 Point Jump in a Single Month"

According to Rasmussen, 32% of the nations voters now strongly aprove of Obama's policies while 34% strongly disapprove. What's that tell us? Rasmussen must be lying!