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For 4th week, protesters in France decry virus pass rules

32 Comments
By SYLVIE CORBET

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32 Comments

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The 4th Wave will largely be a pandemic of the UN-VACCINATED; sad that these folks will have to learn the hard way by losing their lives or someone close to them...

I see your doom porn and raise

mRNA pioneer Dr. Robert malone points out that if 95% of severe patients in Israel were indeed vaccinated, and 85-90% of hospitalizations are among the truly vaccinated, it could suggest Antibody-dependent enhancement (ADE) is occurring, in which antibodies generated during an immune response can bind to a pathogen, but are unable to prevent infection - instead acting as a Trojan Horse.

7 ( +15 / -8 )

You MUST succumb to the Authority of the day.

You must have whatever they say you must have.

You must die when they say die.

5 ( +10 / -5 )

"Here, you don’t have COVID, but you have rage!” Philippot told the crowd, calling for a boycott of places requiring the pass.

Awesome. Boycott them. Do exactly what they want you to do and stay away if you don’t have a pass. Keep everyone happy.

4 ( +8 / -4 )

With French riot police on guard, a largely peaceful crowd walked across Paris carrying banners that read: “Our freedoms are dying” and “Vaccine: Don’t touch our kids.” Some were also upset that the government has made COVID-19 vaccines mandatory for health care workers by Sept. 15

The French protesters are right. Like the recent OCLA open letter in Canda say: It is entirely reasonable and legitimate to say ‘no’ to insufficiently tested vaccines for which there is no reliable science. You have a right to assert guardianship of your body and to refuse medical treatments if you see fit. You are right to say ‘no’ to a violation of your dignity, your integrity and your bodily autonomy. It is your body, and you have the right to choose. You are right to fight for your children against their mass vaccination in school.

( https://ocla.ca/a-letter-to-the-unvaccinated/ )

2 ( +8 / -6 )

We stand with you France!

Vive la France!!!

1 ( +14 / -13 )

Good for them. Discrimination and segregation of all forms cannot be tolerated. Next step....take the fight to the European Court of Human Rights.

1 ( +10 / -9 )

I don't know why I waste my time posting on these forums when everyone is already an expert and everyone's mind is already made up.

Still, for what it's worth, I would encourage those who reflexively dismiss the possibility that the vaccines themselves can act as an evolutionary selective force in favour of new more easily transmissible and virulent variants - such as the delta and lambda variants - to consider the following two papers.

Van Egeren et al. (2021) 'Risk of rapid evolutionary escape from biomedical interventions targeting SARS-CoV-2 spike protein'. PLoS ONE 16(4): e0250780. https://doi.org/10.1371/journal.pone.0250780

"Our modeling suggests that SARS-CoV-2 mutants with one or two mildly deleterious mutations are expected to exist in high numbers due to neutral genetic variation, and consequently resistance to vaccines or other prophylactics that rely on one or two antibodies for protection can develop quickly -and repeatedly- under positive selection.

Strategies for viral elimination should therefore be diversified across molecular targets and therapeutic modalities."

Read et al. (2015) 'Imperfect Vaccination Can Enhance the Transmission of Highly Virulent Pathogens'. PLoS Biol 13(7): e1002198. https://doi.org/10.1371/journal.pbio.1002198

"...vaccine-driven epitope evolution (antigenic escape), in which variants of target antigens evolve because they enable pathogens that are otherwise less fit to evade vaccine-induced immunity... has been frequently observed.

Here we show experimentally that immunization of chickens against Marek's disease virus enhances the fitness of more virulent strains, making it possible for hyperpathogenic strains to transmit.

Our data show that anti-disease vaccines that do not prevent transmission can create conditions that promote the emergence of pathogen strains that cause more severe disease in unvaccinated hosts."

Sound familiar?

While different viruses have different mutation rates, it is conspicuous that all the variants display changes to the spike protein that allow them to better evade the vaccine induced antibodies. My only hope is that we don't inadvertently created a much more lethal strain in our rush to get everyone vaccinated in the midst of an ongoing pandemic.

Best wishes to all regardless of your stance on the current vaccination programs.

1 ( +7 / -6 )

We stand with you France!

Vive la France!!!

Definitely! Love to see this

-2 ( +7 / -9 )

https://rumble.com/vktkoi-cdc-director-admits-on-tv-they-do-not-have-any-evidence-delta-is-making-kid.html

Did you just actually really post a heavily edited and dubbed video from an entertainment platform thinking that it had a semblance of relevance for any serious debate? That's almost impressive.

-2 ( +4 / -6 )

It's a tough decision because we are a global community and our actions affect others.

If we allow freedom to choose vaccinations then there will be more spread of Covid. If we force vaccinations some will die of side effects.

The only solution that preserves the rights of all is to guarantee the right to choose free of penalty. Then we are all equal.

-2 ( +4 / -6 )

If you need a good Covid-related chuckle in these dark times, Google “H. Scott Apley”. You won’t be disappointed.

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

The 4th Wave will largely be a pandemic of the UN-VACCINATED; sad that these folks will have to learn the hard way by losing their lives or someone close to them...

-3 ( +13 / -16 )

There is no Liberty - other than through death, and then ... you can't comment thereafter as there is no afterlife....

Peoples are so easily manipulated by Religion & Politics... it's a human need for belonging ... family... purpose in life.... yet sadly those in Power are often "milking the system" for their own benefits - nowhere blatantly obvious other than in China these days, but the UK has been doing it for yonks... and BJ and his cronies are clearly exemplary of such. (Oddly I would be considered a "Conservative" supporter)

Religion has no place in Politics

Politics and Personal gain has no place in Politics

How to ensure both the above are guaranteed in statue ?

Politicians should be reminded that they are "employed" by the "Democratic Society" to perform a job. If they can not perform such a job, then they should be replaced - this is why we hold "Elections".

Sadly our own workplaces are not as Democratic as that - ass kissing is rife - politics and religion is rife as too color and where you come from. Subtle enough to avoid blatant breaches of "Legal" rules of the land, but never-the-less the same as what goes on to mirror the Political landscapes.

The U.S. is not a true Democracy any more.

It has lost that bearing torch though the farcical Legal disputes within its own ranks.

Wheeling in dubious persons to provide accusations of a criminal activity is essentially the weapon of choice these days - a weapon which means you're guilty until proven innocent, and then its too late - your Political Career is already over... so whose Political foot did you step on, in order to warrant such ?

-3 ( +6 / -9 )

Awesome. Boycott them. Do exactly what they want you to do and stay away if you don’t have a pass. Keep everyone happy.

Perhaps the unvaccinated could also boycott hospitals if they need expensive, time-consuming, resource-draining treatment for Covid.

My elderly mother in the UK needs to visit hospitals quite regularly ( sometimes needs short stays ), but the quality of care she receives ( and deserves after spending almost all of her adult life paying into the system ) has been affected by Covid.

I’m not at the stage yet where I think hospitals should refuse to treat those unvaccinated by choice as I think it’s too cruel ( some just have low IQs and are prone to hysterics and conspiracy theories ), but I must admit to seeing the logic in this.

I’d be interested to know what those against vaccinations think of this as they tend to lean more libertarian than me.

-3 ( +7 / -10 )

The present covid "vaccines" do not prevent covid infection and transmission among vaccinated.

Totally wrong, the vaccines prevent infections. However no vaccine is 100% effective, so the chances of catching infections, especially from the unvaccinated are always there.

If so what is the point of vaccine passport?

Read above.

CONTROL

These are theories of people with no control over their minds.

-3 ( +4 / -7 )

So again, how are the unvaccinated hurting anyone else except for themselves

Massive burden on the health care system, raising the chances of creating a new stronger variant, prolonging the pandemic for no other reason than "owning the libs".

-4 ( +10 / -14 )

Sure. I saw this retort coming from a mile away. What a cliche

A massive burden on the healthcare system is now called a ‘cliche’?

One of the weakest attempts to get around a gaping hole in an argument I’ve ever come across. At least give us a crackpot conspiracy theory telling us these numbers are fudged . Give us something. Anything.

-4 ( +7 / -11 )

she especially protests “the disguised mandatory vaccination ... it’s an incredible blow to our fundamental freedoms.”

Your freedom to be irresponsible conflicts with others’ freedom to stay alive.

So protest all you want, nothing will come out of it.

-4 ( +5 / -9 )

Some of you commenters need to re-read the article. It's a protest against these "health passes" or vaccine passport or whatever you want to call them. These people still have the right to not get vaccinated. And the government and businesses have the right to refuse services to them. So everyone has their rights, right? If you want to drive a car, get driver's license. Quite simple.

-4 ( +5 / -9 )

So again, how are the unvaccinated hurting anyone else except for themselves—again, by choice?

How many times has this been explained, and ignored? This time, I think we should let nature do the talking.

-4 ( +3 / -7 )

While different viruses have different mutation rates, it is conspicuous that all the variants display changes to the spike protein that allow them to better evade the vaccine induced antibodies. My only hope is that we don't inadvertently created a much more lethal strain in our rush to get everyone vaccinated in the midst of an ongoing pandemic.

But here’s the thing. New variants, including the Delta variant we’re dealing with now, originated in unvaccinated hosts. The vaccines hinder viral mutation by denying them the hosts necessary to rapidly reproduce and spread. If the virus’s ability to reproduce is reduced, the speed and breadth of its evolution is reduced. Given that Covid has shown an ability to mutate, you all better get ready for an annual Covid shot, just like you get for the flu.

-4 ( +4 / -8 )

mRNA pioneer Dr. Robert malone 

Quote without a link + the infamous Robert Malone = Nope.

-6 ( +7 / -13 )

While different viruses have different mutation rates, it is conspicuous that all the variants display changes to the spike protein that allow them to better evade the vaccine induced antibodies.

There is nothing strange about it, it is relatively simple to understand that the main neutralizing antigenic epitopes are in the spike protein, which at the same time is the one mediating the infection. antibodies directed to other proteins are not neutralizing, so the virus never has the need to adapt to escape them.

The problem is assuming that changes can endlessly improve the spike mediated infectivity and that the reduced time of infection produced by the immunity from the vaccines somehow would be enough to select the improvements, in the real world situation variants have appeared in unvaccinated populations and more specifically in relation with immunity problems. The Marek example is specially inadequate because it requires extrapolation from veterinarian vaccines (that have much lower efficacy and safety standards compared with human vaccines) and that contradicts the evidence from previous human vaccines that are not sterilizing either.

The thing that needs to be proved is not that the possibility of variants exist even with vaccines, but that the risk is higher than in non-vaccinated people, because if this is not the case that still means vaccination should be done as widely as possible to avoid them.

-6 ( +3 / -9 )

Next step: the FAA should mandate proof of vaccination in airports.

Encourage vaccinations and stop the spread across the country via air travel.

-7 ( +3 / -10 )

Sure. I saw this retort coming from a mile away. What a cliche. I doubt you give a squat about the strain on the healthcare system. 

?????

Why wouldn't anyone sensible give "a squat" about the strain on the healthcare system? Every bed that's occupied by a covid patient is a bed that can't be occupied by anyone else. Less avaialble beds in hospitals means more complications and even deaths for everyone. The thought of being in an ambulance that can't go anywhere because hospitals are full isn't terrifying to you?

And even if you did, that isn’t a sufficient reason to invade someone’s body.

But "i don't care about other people" is a sufficient reason to let a virus invade your body, I guess? Is that it?

-8 ( +7 / -15 )

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