Romney raps Obama's 'tour of apology'

"Republican Mitt Romney, seen as a likely contender for the White House in 2012, scolded President Barack Obama on Monday for apologizing to U.S. critics in the global arena."

What's wrong with apologizing? Is it seen as weak?

It takes guts to apologize in many cases, something the GOP has proven time and time again it doens't have.

Mitt Romney needs to get back to his party's silly tea parties and focus on winning the next election.

"Obama has expressed regret while traveling abroad for America’s leadership failures and other past conduct."

Mitt Romney seems to be completely ignorant of the fact that Bush's failure to apologize for invading the wrong country (Iraq) and killing thousands in the process, inflaming the Middle East by abusing prisoners at Gitmo, and a long list of other crimes and mistakes has led to many of the problems President Obama has since inherited.

Mitt Romney also seems to be completely ignorant of the fact that it is people like himself who are part of the biggest problem with the GOP - a glaring lack of ability to self-reflect, note where they have gone wrong and take responsibility.

Watching the GOP is like watching a group of 8-year-old bullies in the sandpit, and the rhetoric coming out of the party is on an equivalent level.

That said, I hope Mitt Romney keeps talking - it will only alienate more of his party's supporters to vote either Democrat or Independant.

Embarrassing how badly our rookie prez needs these leadership lectures.

Embarrassing how badly our rookie prez needs these leadership lectures.

Truly. Especially when you consider that if Romney was president right now, I suspect the country would be on a much better path then its on now.

Romney is much easier on our president than some. The British press have dubbed Obama "President Pantywaist."

“The president also claimed on Arabic TV that America has dictated to other nations,” Romney said. “No, America has sacrificed to free nations from dictators.”

LOL!! Mitt, Mitt, Mitt.... Everyone in the world knows that, when behooves American interests, we will support and keep dictators in power, and even overthrow democratically-elected governments to do so. Guatemala, Iran, Chile, the list goes on.

As often as not, when America has liberated a nation from a dictator, it has only done so in order to put someone in his place who is more compliant with American interests.

Obama aplogizes because he believes all was wrong till he came along.

A'jad, Castro, Putin et al accept his weakness and stoke his narcissism.

The power-hungry understand one another.

They know Obama is mainly interested in transforming America, for the worse.

N Korea, Georgia, Iraq and other hot spots are distractions for him.

“I take issue with President Obama’s recent tour of apology,” Romney said. “It’s not because America hasn’t made mistakes—we have—but because America’s mistakes are overwhelmed by what America has meant to the hopes and aspirations of people throughout the world.”

And what Obama has done is to restore the hopes and aspirations of people throughout the world.

There is nothing wrong with apologizing for mistakes or for actions that we regret. And, yes, American values and ideals have overwhelmed our mistakes--at least in our own thinking about them. However, the mistakes of the previous administration were particularly egregious, no matter what its intent. An admission of error allows people to support a change of direction.

Everyone in the world knows that, when behooves American interests, we will support and keep dictators in power, and even overthrow democratically-elected governments to do so. Guatemala, Iran, Chile, the list goes on.

yabits, I guess the dictator that America helped overthrow in Germany back in 1945 should fall into that, as well as helping to change the political structure of Japan, but then again I must be reading my "revisionist history" books again.

So if being anti-dictorial is such a good thing, why is it that many on the left feel that it is good for us to open up negotiations with Fidel Castro and his brother in Cuba, or to play nice with KJI in North Korea?

Each country will act to their best interests. If Iran wants nuclear energy they are doing so in their "best interests" as well as many other nations around the world. But by far and large, even though some of Amerca's actions have been questionable when acting in our "best interestes" you have to admit that we have done more good than a lot of other countries.

Sushi3:

" Mitt Romney seems to be completely ignorant of the fact that Bush's failure to apologize for invading the wrong country (Iraq) and killing thousands in the process, inflaming the Middle East by abusing prisoners at Gitmo, and a long list of other crimes and mistakes has led to many of the problems President Obama has since inherited. "

That seems to be the current White House line, indeed. Now, by the same logic, this tour of groveling and apologizing will make everything well then, won´t it?

By insulting the traditional allies and brown-nosing islamists, Obama will stop the jihadists and their assorted dictator friends around the world, and we can all sit and sing Kumbaya together?

Wait and see.

And what Obama has done is to restore the hopes and aspirations of people throughout the world.

I'm sorry, but you can't have it both ways. Obama has merely continued the policies of a president people like you insist damaged our standing and imperiled our country. How, specifically, does a child of privilege like Obama restore hope throughout the world?

And, yes, American values and ideals have overwhelmed our mistakes--at least in our own thinking about them.

And the millions who flock to America?

"America's mistakes are overwhelmed by what America has meant to the hopes and aspirations of people throughout the world"

Exactly, exactly!

"President Pantywaist"

This is embarrassing.

Mitt had better make a better run for the Whitehouse then he did last year. < :-)

Ronmey-Palin in 2012!

SezWho: And what Obama has done is to restore the hopes and aspirations of people throughout the world.

If people's hopes and aspirations are the failed policies of socialism, then I guess you're right.

Molenir: if Romney was president right now, I suspect the country would be on a much better path then its on now.

Unquestionably. My 401K would certainly be on a better path.

Republican Mitt Romney, seen as a likely contender for the White House in 2012,

Yeah right. He had his shot, now he is yesterday's news. Nice puff piece by AP though - that good old left wing, liberal American mainstream media at it again I see.

He's doing exactly what he should do. A lot of people were regarding the US more and more poorly because they refused to recognise their mistakes publicly. Admitting to deficiencies and recognising them is the first step to repairs and to making others believe you are sincere.

This was the perfect time for Obama to be critical.

"America's mistakes are overwhelmed by what America has meant to the hopes and aspirations of people throughout the world"

Complete fail. The fact that this guy thinks America's good acts automatically outweigh its bad without any assesment, or that guilt is as simple as a balance of scales rather than a series of unconnected matters each with their own seperate responsibilites makes him extremely dangerous.

“I take issue with President Obama’s recent tour of apology,” Romney said. “It’s not because America hasn’t made mistakes—we have—but because America’s mistakes are overwhelmed by what America has meant to the hopes and aspirations of people throughout the world.”

Mittens doesn't seem to appreciate that the primary reason America inspires hope is that our government can be held accountable for mistakes by ordinary citizens.

“Arrogant, delusional tyrants can’t be stopped by earnest words and furrowed brows,” he said.

What is his alternative? Tough talk from the Iowa state fairgrounds while leaving others to do the heavy lifting?

Action, strong bold action coming from a position of strength and determination, is the only effective deterrent.”

Yeah, the fightings Romneys really inspire fear.

Mittens doesn't seem to appreciate that the primary reason America inspires hope is that our government can be held accountable for mistakes by ordinary citizens.

Bambi doesn't seem to appreciate that most Americans think his bowing to the King of Saudi Arabia and grinning through hour-long diatribes against the US made by thuggish South American caudillos is anything but presidential.

Guess they got all the mileage they're going to get out of Cheney, time for a the new "Republican Villain of The Week" by the MSM. I expect Rush to be recycled pretty soon after Romney gets his "air time" and starts to become stale again.

Bambi doesn't seem to appreciate that most Americans think his bowing to the King of Saudi Arabia and grinning through hour-long diatribes against the US made by thuggish South American caudillos is anything but presidential.

Yes, GWB looked very presidential last year when he went a callin' on the House of Saud twice over a period of four months to beg them to lower the price of oil. The answer was "nyet."

His presidency will be remembered for the ascendance of a bunch of petro-authoritarian states — principally Russia, Venezuela and Iran — and for that most Americans would like an apology.

teleprompter,

Not looking to have it both ways. I don't agree with what Obama is doing, but he is doing it--at least initially--in a way that restores trust in America and America's values. My excerpted passage clearly applies to people around the world.

Yes, many millions of people--especially the very poor and the very rich--flock to America. That is nothing compared to the billions of people who do not. The poor come for the money and the rich come for the tax preferences. They also come, from third-world countries, for the general atmosphere of freedom. They come despite the wretched rhetoric of the previous administration. They came before Bush, during Bush and after Bush. Their coming has little to do with whether or not confidence in America is being restored.

Which party has blocked any and all efforts to exploit our considerable domestic reserves?

I voted for GWB because he assured us he had the clout to "jaw bone" the Saudis. When the price falls, the oil companies have no economic incentive to expand production. Then when it shoots back up again, as is currently underway, well why weren't you drilling?

There's a way out of this boom and bust cycle that we are captive to, but it's ain't "drill, baby drill."

Moreover, as long as someone wants to buy oil, those petro-authoritarian states will have power. And Mitt no doubt will continue talking tough while downing corn dogs to show he's a regular guy.

Helter_Skelter,

If people's hopes and aspirations are the failed policies of socialism, then I guess you're right.

I guess you are trying to say that Obama is installing the failed policies of socialism. And you seem to have some kind of logical argument going that if people are hoping for a failed socialism, then there hopes are realized in Obama. You, however, have failed to show that Obama is installing such policies and you seem to have neglected whether or not he curing the failed policies of capitalism. That would be an argument for another day.

More tellingly, however, you have not refuted the statement. A hypothetical tautology is not a substitute for an argument.

Bambi doesn't seem to appreciate that most Americans think his bowing to the King of Saudi Arabia and grinning through hour-long diatribes against the US made by thuggish South American caudillos is anything but presidential.

Riiiiiiiight. He should have looked bilious and then come home and immediately put them on the list of the Axis of Evil. Bowing to the King is a courtesy as is showing a willingness to listen to what people have to say. When first you take offense then you stop listening.

Love the freedom of speech. Very healthy for a country and people to find a middle road. I like Romney and Obama. It is OK to apologize and move forward hoping not to make the same mistakes. Move on to build a better future.

I am not American, but I have to confess that the sight of President Obama apologising for the "wrongdoings" of America, as precieved by the left-wing Democrats, is nauseating. What he should really apologise for is the way America has sunk into the mire with regard to its internal mess. Abortion, Same-sex "marriage," the banning of prayers and Bible reading in schools, the teaching of evolutionism as truth in schools, greed and selfishness in the financial sector, etc. The list goes on.

America is in a mess today, and has been ridiculed throuout the world, not because of the actions or non-actions of George W Bush, but because it has abandoned its basic moral principles. The once-wonderful American Empire is on the way down. President Obama criticises America abroad, while his dear wife Michelle does a brilliant job criticising her country at home. Its a sick country, folks.

I generally support what Obama is doing because he's helping to take away the influence of anti-Americans who had a free ride during Bush's presidency. He's going to be successful in pulling more moderates back towards supporting the US and overall that should help us accomplish foreign policy goals.

In reality the US has things it needs to apologize for, but on the flip side the US tends to get blamed for everything anyway. Obama really has to be careful about what he says because it can be spun a lot of different ways. Romney's words are effective.

How much weaker can the GOP get to not have the spine to

1/ realize where they have gone wrong, and

2/ have the guts to stand up in public and apologize?

It's obviously below them to do what is right, which is yet another of the long list of reasons the GOP is not in power.

What new depths can the GOP and their supporters plunge to now? :-)

Superlib, good post. Keep it up.

Sezwho:

" Bowing to the King is a courtesy "

Actually, no. American leaders do not bow to foreign monarchs because that act signified the monarch's power over his subjects. Barrack Hussein Obamas bow to the Saudi king and financier of radical islam is a diplomatic first ... incidentally following directly his wife´s slapping the Queen on her back (a big no-no), and him giving her an iPod with his speeches as present.

It is truly amateur hour at the White House.

WilliB - "Actually, no. American leaders do not bow to foreign monarchs because that act signified the monarch's power over his subjects."

Actually, it's a polite sign of respect, something that would not go astray and that would be a good platform to launch a personal relationship.

On that note, how do you explain bush senior and junior lovingly clasping hands with Saudi royalty both in Saudi and in Texas?

That took brown-nosing to a whole new level in my book. :-)

It is truly amateur hour at the White House.

So, you're against shows of respect? Is that it?

WilliB,

American leaders do not bow to foreign monarchs because that act signified the monarch's power over his subjects.

Actually no. American leaders typically do not bow to foreign monarchs because we're Americans, dadgummit! And it is perceived as a sign of weakness.

It is not a weakness. It is a courtesy. Bowing is an age-old show of respect even among peers, but we don't bow to anyone, dadgummit!

Sez, lol! :-)

WilliB - "Actually, no. American leaders do not bow to foreign monarchs because that act signified the monarch's power over his subjects."

Why are Americans looked down on by so many people around the world?

One of the answers is in your quote above. :-)

SuperLib: Great post! I think, with exception to Romney's words being effective, you're more or less bang on.

People who blame anything and everything on the US will have no excuses to do so when Obama gets ties back up to what they were pre-bush, and said people will look all the more foolish for trying. Obama has a LOT of apologizing to do for the past 8 years, on behalf of the American people (for their former leader).

Meant to finish that last post by saying that apologizing is by no means a sign of weakness, it is a sign that one is taking the high ground in an attempt to heal rifts and improve relations, be it between nations or at home.

Smith, Obama would never get anything done if he had to apologize for the last 8 years. :-)

The President has, however, made a good start, despite the protestations of some on this board who - for some bizarre reason - think apologizing for obvious missteps is somehow below what an American leader should do.

How do you spell D-A-F-T? :-)

WilliB: "Actually, no. American leaders do not bow to foreign monarchs because that act signified the monarch's power over his subjects."

Thought you might like this picture of bush bowing to the Saudi King and 'and financier of radical islam', you know, Obama's bowing to him being a 'diplomatic first' and all. :) I think the pic was just before he took part in the sword dance. Is showing respect for someone and bowing, like Obama did, worse than bush holding the man's hand?

http://sheikyermami.com/wp-content/uploads/zz72682359.jpg

Smith, no, that's not George W. Bush - it's a Photoshopped body double stunt guy.

Bush would never bow to anyone, that's an all-American fact! :-)

SmithinJapan - "Is showing respect for someone and bowing, like Obama did, worse than bush holding the man's hand?"

What bush did to the Saudi King - 'holding the man's hand' doesn't quite do it justice - more like 'lovingly fondling the man's hand and sharing intimacy.' :-)

http://blogs.e-rockford.com/applesauce/files/2009/04/image690875x.jpg

and a kiss on the cheek! LOL! -

http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n158/codename_009/BushKissingSaudiPrince.jpg

What "Obvious Miss-steps" should we apologize for? I mean give me a good one ALL AMERICANS can really agree on.

Sail, invading the wrong country.

That's a pretty big one.

Read this - http://edition.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/06/01/cheney.speech/index.html

"I mean give me a good one ALL AMERICANS can really agree on."

Obviously loaded questions like that one set yourself up for failure.

Sushi,

Taking out Saddam and his brutal regime was like "A bad thing?".

But Sailwind, this thread is about Mitt Romney, and Mitt's all about flip-flopping depending on which way the political winds are blowing this week or next, it doesn't really matter to Mitt.

Sailwind - "What "Obvious Miss-steps" should we apologize for?"

Again, why are Americans looked down on by so many people around the world?

And again, one of the answers is in your quote above. :-)

Sushi,

We seem to have many people in the world look up to us again since Obama was elected. Though his foreign policy is almost like Bush's. He just puts it in a prettier package by the way he talks.

Care to explain that. Gitmo still in business....Check. Surge in Afghanistan using surge tactics learned in Iraq.....Check. Iraq still going to have major American troop presence and support for years to come....Check. Iran will not be allowed to obtain a Nuclear weapon.....Check. Israel to follow the two state solution endorsed by the Bush administration...check. On and on it goes, but you hate Bush, love Obama, but can't see that they only disagree on about 5 percent of his conduct in foreign policy.

I guess Bush's only fault was that he wasn't able to talk pretty enough to make it palatable enough for you.

Sail - "Taking out Saddam and his brutal regime was like "A bad thing?".

Why not take out Kim Il Jeong and Mugabe and their 'brutal' regimes while you're at it?

Looking forward to your list of reasons why that won't happen.

Why not take out Kim Il Jeong and Mugabe and their 'brutal' regimes while you're at it?

But if we did you'd protest that North Koreans were better off under Kimmie. And Zimbabweans live better under Mugabe than they did under Ian Smith.

smithinjapan: with exception to Romney's words being effective, you're more or less bang on.

Romney's words are effective. They strike a chord with Americans who think the world mostly ignores or otherwise refuses to acknowledge anything good that we do. He's smart and he's presenting it the right way to have maximum impact. Obama is doing the same. The onus is on Obama to make sure he chooses his words carefully. A lot of Americans think the world mostly takes us for granted and if it looks like Obama is apologizing to the world then those Americans will take issue with it.

Like I said, it has to be a two way street. I'm happy with Obama apologizing or making amends but it only works if the anti-Americans take their own step forward and stop with the obsessive criticism. If not then Obama's actions will only serve to embolden them. This site can be used as a microcosm. Obama's apology to someone like Jean Colmar will do nothing but encourage him to continue his anti-American rants. The same apology to someone like Madverts would probably make him have more of an open mind on the next issue. Romney's talking about the dangers of apologizing to people like Colmar. It's a valid point to make.

Sushisake: Again, why are Americans looked down on by so many people around the world?

Partly because of mistakes that we've made. And partly because of people such as yourself who work day and night to spread anti-American propaganda tirelessly to anyone who will listen.

Obama's taking a step forward. Will you? My guess is....no. You couldn't stop even if you wanted to. It's out of your control.

Well, if we are going to apologize, we might as well apologize to Japan, Germany, Italy, etc....

I don't see where kissing butt is going to get anything positive in the long run

Obama cannot cure the world's envy of America. Paradoxically, his presidency may only increase it.

envy of America

people "envy" the very attractive image america is able to create for itself; glamour, riches, cars, possessions, whateveryouhaveit. the reality is that america is not that much better a place than any other. it is just that; a place. i don't envy americans because i'm not naive enough to believe that if i lived there i would necessarily be better off than i am now

It loves to wave it's flag whilst being a latent european.

or else it gets the hose again?

Obama's taking a step forward.

LOL! He's taking a step forward by apologizing.

Why do you pretend to support Obama and then apologize for the people, like Romney, who are attacking him?

“I take issue with President Obama’s recent tour of apology,” Romney said. “It’s not because America hasn’t made mistakes—we have—but because America’s mistakes are overwhelmed by what America has meant to the hopes and aspirations of people throughout the world.”

Typical flag waving BS! I guarantee you that those conservatives are lining up behind him now. It is just a question of the influence of the christian right that does not accept the Mormon faith as christian. He already has the "patriotic" hero worshipers lining up in his defense.

Obama announced the increase in troops in Afghanistan long before the surge was ever announced. Back when Iraq did not have the proper troop levels in Iraq Barack spoke of the prior administration not having the proper troop levels in Afghanistan. I love it how the idiots on the right call finally manning the troop levels to a proper number a "surge." Hilarious. They totally screwed up the peace by having no credible plan. This in turn probably increased the requirement for a greater number of troops down the road. Remember Rummy? Yeah, he kept insisting that the war was proceeding just fine and we had sufficient troop levels. He insisted on that fact over and over. Then after he was fired they increased the troop levels under the guise of a "surge" and finally reached a level to get the job done. Then the Republicans scream success and wet themselves jumping up and down waving their flags. Logical people realize they had been screwing up until that point and finally met the demand required. What a joke.

You enter a war on a false pretense of what you represented to the American people. You certainly used disastrous timing for the engagement. You fail to plan for the period after you gain control. You understaff the war effort for years. Then when you finally reach a troop deployment level capable of quelling the violence you cheer success. All the while you let the actual leader, of the entire reason of conflict in the region, to roam free although you promised to get him. Furthermore your efforts in the region of the actual terrorists not only deteriorates but serves to deteriorate matters in yet another nation. You won't be audience to any "successes like that from the Obama administration.

How disingenuous can you get comparing Bush's "surge" to Obama putting more troops in Afghanistan. Obama is doing the opposite of Bush, he is lowing the troop numbers in Iraq. That was Bush policy - waste human life in Iraq. Not allowing Iran to build a nuclear weapon was not Bush policy; he was following long established foreign policy. The exact same thing with a two state solution for Israel. It was the Clinton administration that was able to get the most movement in Israeli foreign policy and solidified the two state solution. If Obama is following policies that Clinton maintained or established then it is far beyond being disingenuous to represent it as following Bush's policies or "almost like Bush's" whatever. It is clear that Obama plans to become very engaged with the Iranians This is so distant from Bush's policy it reeks of deceit to compare the two. If Gitmo is still an active prison by the end of Obama's term that will be a lack of departure from Bush's policy. But we can see that he has already requested $80 million in funding that was turned down. He obviously had serious plans to empty Gitmo. How deceitful it is to claim otherwise because Congress did not approve it YET. If the discussion is on foreign policy, and I believe it was, then Obama's has clearly staked out a foreign policy to empty Gitmo prison. Get ready for the red herring of mentioning trials, human rights and other bs now. The purpose in mentioning aspects other than Obama's statement to close Gitmo's prison is cause confusion and convolute the original issue. Obama said he plans to close Gitmo; tell these people who try to link the methodology of the trials to the closure to quit being deceitful. I have already heard it countless times and it just par for the course of a steady stream of deceit from some sources.

Bush made agreements in Iraq that we, as an honorable nation, must adhere to. There will always be an effort made to achieve continuity between administrations aimed at making international diplomacy as successful as possible. But when examples are given that are completely without merit of matching policies it is not conducive to an honest discussion. The facts were clearly misrepresented.

“The president also claimed on Arabic TV that America has dictated to other nations,” Romney said. “No, America has sacrificed to free nations from dictators.”

Wave that flag furiously beeoooootch!

Romney also urged Congress to fully fund and deploy a multilayered missile defense shield that he said was vital for the nation’s security.

/

“Arrogant, delusional tyrants can’t be stopped by earnest words and furrowed brows,” he said. “Action, strong bold action coming from a position of strength and determination, is the only effective deterrent.”

I got news for him. The tyrants can't be stopped by our current missile defense system either. But he knows that. He is using tried and true scare tactics.

Romney branded Obama’s proposal to cut missile defense programs a “grave miscalculation” in light of North Korea’s provocations, Iran’s near-nuclear status and Pakistan’s instability.

booga booga

We must back away from the missile sites in Poland and the Czech Republic because of the ramification for them. Russia said they will aim missiles at Poland and the Czechs. We are ascending from an era where we trample on other nations to get our way. Who out there doubts Russia will follow through with it's threats?

Obama's apology to someone like Jean Colmar will do nothing but encourage him to continue his anti-American rants. The same apology to someone like Madverts would probably make him have more of an open mind on the next issue. Romney's talking about the dangers of apologizing to people like Colmar. It's a valid point to make.

LOL!! This is pretty funny.

What the Colmars and the Madverts of the world likely see is a leader genuinely trying to do the right thing while the other side of America undermines him. This other side wants the America that arrogantly insists that it only does good and that it's a angel of light -- and woebetide any leader (especially a Democrat) who implies otherwise.

Many right-wingers like to profess that America is a "Christian country," but the Bible that I read has Christ saying something to the effect of "Those who humble themselves shall be exalted; and those who exalt themselves shall be humbled." Hasn't Romney read it?

There's a lot of humble pie that has to be served up after all these Republican orgies of self-exaltation.

Superlib: "Partly because of mistakes that we've made. And partly because of people such as yourself who work day and night to spread anti-American propaganda tirelessly to anyone who will listen."

Now you're just sounding a little upset. I agree with the first part, but I haven't seen Sushi spouting 'anti-American propoganda', I've simply seen him criticising some posters for what they've said (in particular, WilliB's comment that 'American leaders don't bow').

sailwind: "We seem to have many people in the world look up to us again since Obama was elected. Though his foreign policy is almost like Bush's. He just puts it in a prettier package.."

You've got to be kidding. You list Gitmo (now in legal limbo, but Obama still saying it needs to be closed), Afghanistan, and a few others, but fail to mention a WHOLE lot of others that are a complete 180 from bush (ex. South America, talking with Cuba, wishing dialogue with Iran, etc.). What's more, the one's you DO mention you only mention part of; Clinton is using a lot tougher rhetoric with Israel and their expansion that bush simply giving them carte blanche to do as they please, for example.

Romney's talking about of both sides of his mouth. First he says: "It’s not because America hasn’t made mistakes—we have..." (Yes, we have, Mitt.) Then he says, "America has sacrificed to free nations from dictators."

So what about all the help the Reagan and Bush gave the dictator Saddam Hussein back in the 1980s? Strengthening his brutal regime with weapons, intelligence and financial assistance.

Even when Saddam killed US sailors on the USS Stark in 1987, Reagan just patted him on the back and said, "That's OK, Saddam." When human rights organizations reported Saddam using gas against Iranians and Kurds, the Saddam-supporters within the Republican administration attacked the organizations for spreading false information. (Is that freeing a nation from a dictator, Mitt?)

After knocking Saddam out of Kuwait, Bush-41 gave a green light for the Iraqi people to rebel and overthrow the dictator. Then the US essentially backed off and stood by and watched while Saddam let his security details slaughter thousands. Everyone knows this is true.

And those are just the obvious missteps which pertain to Iraq. America can't claim to be purely for liberating nations from dictators. We'll support them when it suits America's purposes. Romney is only speaking to his Republican base, and for the people who want to apologize for them.

What the Colmars and the Madverts of the world likely see is a leader genuinely trying to do the right thing while the other side of America undermines him.

Sorry. I don't know where you are posting from but my experience of such people (20 plus years travel and living abroad) is that once their rather limited, comical grasp of US politics and history becomes apparent they are far, far more likely to insist lamely that "Well, in the end, both parties are really just the same."

teleprompter aid:

I shore do hope Mr Obama, President of the World, gets around to apologizin' to the Birtish.

/

If it wasn't for our arrogant interference in European affairs the Poms would enjoy gargling with sauerkraut each morn.

Such pompous, arrogant aggrandizement of others accomplishments assuming them as your own is usually a reflection of overcompensation. It doesn't take a stretch of the imagination to figure out the details.

You will find that individuals who like to present America as a savior will never admit that America has not only been the benefactor but also the beneficiary of kindness in this world. They will even deny the fact that we could not have won the Revolutionary war without France's assistance. I am so grateful that the rest of the world sees them as petty individuals. I would hate to be lumped together with their ilk. It is obvious from the international disdain for the conservatives and acceptance the majority of Americans receive from other nationalities that the good people in this world are able to differentiate the good Americans from the bad. I do not experience the hatred that is so often mentioned by the gloaters of America.

It is obvious from looking at JT posters that those unwilling to admit their mistakes just become more complacent and eventually irrelevant to those who value accuracy. If you own up to your mistakes and try to behave in a just manner you will be seen as strong. For those who say our apologies will be used against us. So what. Our detractors would have only found other faults in us. Perhaps I misuse the word detractors. I mean that more in terms of a hater. I hear these screen names being thrown around with a claim that they hate Americans.

They don't hate me.

comical grasp of US politics and history

The ignorance of so many Americans about history, geography and politics is also well-known throughout the world.

yabits:

The ignorance of so many Americans about history, geography and politics is also well-known throughout the world.

They accept your apology.

For those who say our apologies will be used against us. So what.

It's not even so much that our apologies will be used against us, but that our apologies won't be appreciated. Exactly: so what?

When I have done something wrong I apologize without regard for how the other person will take it, but because it's the right thing to do. If I ever get into a mode where I would refuse to apologize because it wouldn't be appreciated, I've now got something even bigger to apologize for.

I thought this artical was going to be filled with the hilarity of a conservative mormon rapping...I was soundly dissapointed.

Why is this rant becoming such a right left thing?

What Obama is plannng to do is apologize to the right wing Muslim world.

How could we ever expect the idiot conservatives to get this? They completely supported those in power during the era in which these "screw ups" occurred. They have not begun to come to terms with the damage they have done. We are busy cleaning up their piles of dung and they are still making excuses. These idiots try to brag about how the economy would be better with Romney. How so? To my knowledge he had the same exact policies as Bush. He would have lowered taxes. Yeah that worked real well. It is soooooo good to have someone intelligent at the top. The critics that are so dumb they can't understand how everything got this bad are far too stupid to understand how they will get better. It is already getting better; our economy is already beginning to recover. It sure helps when you can have confidence that your well educated President knows what he is doing.

I love it when the extremist conservatives still believe a smile and waving a flag will bring them success.

Can you believe someone has the audacity to criticize us for defending against Romney. They say we have moved on from Cheney and Romney is now our target. Like we just brought up their name out of the blue. They chose to come out and criticize Obama. What kind of an idiot would challenge us because we defend ourselves? They want to be able to make any BS statements they choose and we should not refute them? Wow! No wonder the Republican party and conservatives are swirling down the toilet.

In reality the US has things it needs to apologize for, but on the flip side the US tends to get blamed for everything anyway. Obama really has to be careful about what he says because it can be spun a lot of different ways. Romney's words are effective.

I like that. I hope that Obama listens to the words of caution from Romney, I like and respect both men even if I disagree with the views of the former more often than not.

Yadbits: What the Colmars and the Madverts of the world likely see is a leader genuinely trying to do the right thing while the other side of America undermines him. There's a lot of humble pie that has to be served up after all these Republican orgies of self-exaltation.

You're just anti-Republican. Moderates like me don't trust people like you because we see the same hardline thinking in you that we saw in the former Republican leadership. We see the same mechanics that are involved with racism when you speak and we get turned off by it.

We're not interested in fighting a war with other Americans, we just want to see America live up to its potential. Sooner or later you're going to realize that you might support Obama but he doesn't support you. That's when you'll return to your rightful place on the fringe of society.

We'll support them when it suits America's purposes.

Every country supports a cause as long as it suits their purposes. The lie you're believing and perpetuating is that America is the exception.

smithinjapan: I agree with the first part

The first part where I admit that America has made mistakes? I know you agree with that. It's the only thing you would agree with.

Good call Romney, someone who i have always respected. Sure shows how an intelligent guy can make Obama look like a total fool. Obama your days are nimbered ,you have been xeposed as a charlatan.

SuperLib: "The first part where I admit that America has made mistakes? I know you agree with that. It's the only thing you would agree with."

Not at all. While I agree the US has made mistakes, I don't at all say the US is limited to them, do I? You made a great post three posts back and then you started to get surly because you didn't like what people were saying. What I said in my post was that I agree with the first part, the the US has made mistakes, yes, but I didn't agree with the latter that Sushi was 'spreading propaganda'. If YOU choose to see that I think the US has committed NOTHING BUT mistakes, that's your problem, not mine.

But hey, since we're all in the spirit of admitting apologies can help mend ties even when one person isn't necessarily in the wrong (except Romney, of course, apparently he can't apologize for anything), I'm sorry if I gave you the wrong idea.

Anyway, back to you original point that Obama is improving things and this will in turn improve foreign policy, I agree with that (see! Not just that the US has made mistakes! :])

"He ( Romney ) had his shot"

Heck, that was just his first shot!

You're just anti-Republican.

I am anti-jingoism. When Republicans like Romney and Cheney spout jingoism, especially when doing it to undermine a sitting president, I am against it. I have high regard for Republicans like William Cohen, Dick Lugar, Lincoln Chafee, etc.

Moderates like me don't trust people like you because we see the same hardline thinking in you that we saw in the former Republican leadership. We see the same mechanics that are involved with racism when you speak and we get turned off by it.

I don't know how many this "we" is you are claiming to speak for, but you can't be both for Obama and the hardline Repubicans, and hardline wannabes like Romney who undermine him.

Sooner or later you're going to realize that you might support Obama but he doesn't support you. That's when you'll return to your rightful place on the fringe of society.

You claim you just want an America that lives up to its potential. If you go back and look at history, every great advancement made in human rights that the US has made was due to an idea that started from people considered to be on the fringe by the conservatives and so-called moderates who opposed them.

The lie you're believing and perpetuating is that America is the exception.

The lie being perpetrated is that America is exceptionally good. America stands a chance at being exceptionally good, but only if she acknowledges the things she does wrong, apologizes for them, and makes honest efforts not to repeat the errors.

I hope that Obama listens to the words of caution from Romney

I suspect that Obama will listen to the words, and then realize what makes him different in the eyes of the world than a jingoist like Romney. If Obama actually pays heed to Romney's words, he'll be selling himself out to conservatives worse than John McCain did.

But no, Barack Obama has far too much strength in his convictions of how to win hearts and minds to do that.

sarge: I hope you're right, Romney/Palin 2012 would absolutely guarantee a land-slide victory of unheard proportions for the Democrats, not to mention fodder for comedy for YEARS. I wonder if he's apologize that his running mate thinks Africa is a country. haha.

Anyway, Obama is fixing things with his apology -- mistakes made largely by the last Republican government -- so you can thank him and apologize to him later.

Anyway, Obama is fixing things with his apology -- mistakes made largely by the last Republican government -- so you can thank him and apologize to him later.

You've nearly nailed why it is that hardline Republicans are so opposed to a President like Obama making any apologies: When Obama apologizes for a mistake made by a Republican, it makes it that much more awkward for the next Republican to come in and perpetuate the error. It makes the two-faced nature of America towards the rest of the world all the more obvious.

And so the world is confronted with an America where a leader of decency admits past mistakes and apologizes for them, after having seen a predecessor who would never admit to a mistake. And they know could see such an arrogant leader in the future.

And so, according to Superlib, Obama should behave more like the leader who doesn't apologize than the one who does. While professing the goal for America to live up to its potential, he actually wants to drag the country down to the lowest common denominator.

smith - Don't worry, Obama-Biden are going to provide plenty of fodder for comedy for the next 3 and a half years.

"Obama is fixing things with his apology"

He ain't fixin' anything, all he's doing is making us cringe and putting us further into debt.

sarge: "smith - Don't worry, Obama-Biden are going to provide plenty of fodder for comedy for the next 3 and a half years."

Not worried about a thing, my friend, nor will I be particularly if your dreams of Mittens/Palin (I can see Russia from my house!) come to fruition.

And anyway, sorry, the comedy provided by Obama/Biden doesn't even come close to even the ELECTION with Palin running as VP. It is still funny to read a lot of the Right-wingers' posts though, you're right.

"He ain't fixin' anything, all he's doing is making us cringe and putting us further into debt."

Wrong, except that he's making YOU cringe, perhaps. Economy is showing signs that it could rebound, thanks to his efforts, from the damage done by your previous president that sent it spiraling. Again, you can thank him and apologize to him later.

For now, let's focus more on the fact that apologies, such as those Obama is doing, help make the world a better place. Relations will improve, and thus will everything else.

The lie being perpetrated is that America is exceptionally good. America stands a chance at being exceptionally good, but only if she acknowledges the things she does wrong, apologizes for them, and makes honest efforts not to repeat the errors.

I hate myself, I'm an American, I apologize to world for my sin, I promise to never to repeat my errors.

How's that Yabits?

I hate myself, I'm an American, I apologize to world for my sin...

You actually associate the act of apologizing with self-hatred?

Thank you for that little window into what passes for conservative thought. Perhaps that explains the high level of mistrust that others feel towards them.

Sarge - "He ain't fixin' anything, all he's doing is making us cringe and putting us further into debt."

Why are you complaining? You thought everything was going great as bush and co. buried your country under $6 trillion in debt - until the economy tanked on bush's watch and now you blame Obama for "putting us further into debt."

That would be funny if it actually had a shred of insight behind it.

Yabits [about SuberLib) - "but you can't be both for Obama and the hardline Repubicans, and hardline wannabes like Romney who undermine him."

That's what has been confusing me about SuperLib - thanks for making it clear that even SuperLib isn't sure which side of the fence he stands on, if he stands on a fence at all. :-)

I don't know how many this "we" is you are claiming to speak for, but you can't be both for Obama and the hardline Repubicans, and hardline wannabes like Romney who undermine him.

Why would anybody want to be hardline anything?

But no, Barack Obama has far too much strength in his convictions of how to win hearts and minds to do that.

So you're either unquestionably liberal or evil. I'm glad we cleared that up.

Sailwind - "I hate myself, I'm an American, I apologize to world for my sin."

Cheers, thanks for clearing that up. :-)

I wonder if when the economy rebounds, as it is starting to now, how many Republicans will say it was due to Bush's policies, lol!!!

You actually associate the act of apologizing with self-hatred?

I'm consumed with guilt, and do hate myself, after all I am a White American and everything is my fault, gosh I wish I was a poor black child.

I've been quietly amazed for years at how many non-Americans are actually more in tune and aware about what is good for America - than Right Wing Americans are.

If the Right Wing Americans on JT are in any way representative of Right Wing Americans in general, God help America! :-)

But of course they will deny this being the case while faux backing clueless cowboys like Mitt Romney who had they been elected, would only have dragged America further down into the quagmire than Bush and co. did.

Mitt Romney lost for a reason last year - he wasn't good enough then and he isn't good enough now, despite how much he desparages the sitting president, a man whom Mitt is not even in the same universe as when it comes to mental clarity, solidity of purpose and integrity.

Yabitys [in response to Sailwind] - "You actually associate the act of apologizing with self-hatred?"

The act of apologizing is actually the sign of a real man who knows when he has stepped out of line.

That's why Republicans are incapable of doing it. :-)

sailwind: "I hate myself, I'm an American, I apologize to world for my sin, I promise to never to repeat my errors."

Doesn't sound too sincere to me. Anyway, if YOU actually committed the sins, then damn right you should be apologizing. If not, and of course I know you are just being silly, then why bother posting? Seems a pretty childish post (and the second one, too), all told.

"I'm consumed with guilt, and do hate myself, after all I am a White American and everything is my fault, gosh I wish I was a poor black child."

Now you're just being racist. You think Obama is apologizing and whining that he had it bad because he's black or something? You've really, really lost any remaining credibility you had left.

Sushi: "I wonder if when the economy rebounds, as it is starting to now, how many Republicans will say it was due to Bush's policies, lol!!!"

No kidding! I bet even some of the die-hards will come on here and say Obama is responsible for the economic situation that happened before he was president, but bush is responsible for fixing the economy despite the fact that he long since left office (at least it FEELS like a long time, since a more responsible president is in place now). It'll be, "Obama destroyed our economy, but thank god bush brought it back!"

I'm consumed with guilt, and do hate myself, after all I am a White American and everything is my fault, gosh I wish I was a poor black child.

Sounds like you're taking the first step on the road to recovery.

Except that last part. A person of integrity and sincerity would be something more appropriate to wish to become.

I wonder if when the economy rebounds, as it is starting to now, how many Republicans will say it was due to Bush's policies

This is why people like Romney are working so hard to undermine President Obama. They sense he will be successful, and, when he is, they know they won't have any Republicans in power to attribute it that success to. Standing back and letting Bush have all the rope he needed to hang himself and the Republican Party was a very smart tactic, though it required a lot of patience.

Anyway, the improved economy will be due to the decisions of Justices Roberts and Scalia.

SmithinJapan, all jokes aside, I personally think one of the funniest things about the GOP - and Mitt Romney has supremely underlined this with his words today - is that Republicans in general are so stunningly clueless, that they will straight-face state utter fiction as if it were rock solid fact, even if they are talking about events that they themselves were involved in or voted for only a matter of months ago.

Sure, the Dems aren't perfect, but at least their leadership understands when their country has made a mistake.

Which brings to mind that bush moment when an interviewer asked him if he felt he had made any mistakes during his presidency (this was in year 6) - and there was a long, long, long pause before he mumbled something irrelevant.

Incredibly, nothing much has changed - it just blows me away.

Sushi:

" The act of apologizing is actually the sign of a real man who knows when he has stepped out of line. That's why Republicans are incapable of doing it. :-) "

Well, I am not a USer, so I can´t be a member of a political party there, but I definitely think the Republicans are the smaller of two evils.

So, in the spirit of apologizing that seems so appreciated these days and that "fixes things" according to Smithjapan, I hereby offer a profound apology for your ignorance and that of smithjapan.

See? Obama can do it, and so can I. Are things fixed now?

WilliB - sarcasm noted. :-)

Except that last part. A person of integrity and sincerity would be something more appropriate to wish to become.

Agreed, I don't wish I was born a poor black child like Martin Luther King who never considered him a victim....... But a man who wished to be judged by the content of his character not the color of skin.

You know a Conservative.

Sushi: "Which brings to mind that bush moment when an interviewer asked him if he felt he had made any mistakes during his presidency (this was in year 6) - and there was a long, long, long pause before he mumbled something irrelevant."

To be fair, bush did mention he regretted Iraq in the final days of his presidency (before the party demanding he start uttering 'stay the course' again), but he didn't apologize as he should have, either. Beyond that, I agree with you 100%.

WilliB: "So, in the spirit of apologizing that seems so appreciated these days and that "fixes things" according to Smithjapan, I hereby offer a profound apology for your ignorance and that of smithjapan. See? Obama can do it, and so can I. Are things fixed now?"

Obama apologized for your personal ignorance?

Nah, you see... an apology only fixes things when it's meant, not when it's a vapid and sarcastic gut-response from a person who's been sorely beaten in debate. Keep trying the apologies, though; you'll get it eventually.

sailwind: "Agreed, I don't wish I was born a poor black child like Martin Luther King who never considered him a victim....... But a man who wished to be judged by the content of his character not the color of skin."

So now what are you on about? Suddenly we're bringing up Martin Luther King after you said you wish you were born a poor black man, and that's related to Romney saying Obama apologizing is not a good thing?

Sailwind - "You know a Conservative."

Yes, we do, all too well, in fact - they are the ones who wrecked the U.S. economy.

SmithinJapan [response to Sailwind] - "So now what are you on about? Suddenly we're bringing up Martin Luther King after you said you wish you were born a poor black man, and that's related to Romney saying Obama apologizing is not a good thing?"

I'm struggling too...that's tough logic to crack. :-)

Romney had better keep his powder dry on this one. Dick Cheney just admitted that the war in Iraq was based on lies! LIVE: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/06/02/cheney-there-was-never-an_n_210145.html Whoooee! This is gonna push Romney right back!

Smith

I'm suppose to feel guilty because I'm an American and "God Forbid" a white one at that. I am in the liberal point of view the cause of every evil that has ever happened on the planet.

Martin Luther King was suppose to be a "Victim" who would just sit and take every injustice thrown at him by 'White America'.

He refused to be a victim and stood up as a man. I respect that, he is in my opinion one of the greatest people my country has ever produced and that is what America is all about.... Obama to apologize for America's mistakes?

If it WASN'T FOR AMERICA to try to correct her mistakes, and try to live to her promise that all men are truly created equal, he'd never be President in the first place.

I'm not real thrilled with his 'America Apology' tour right now, you might approve, I'm holding my nose at it myself.

sailwind: "He refused to be a victim and stood up as a man. I respect that, he is in my opinion one of the greatest people my country has ever produced and that is what America is all about"

And yet you use it as a very sad and sarcastic apology you never intended, injecting even racism into it, in a political statement intended solely to point out your disrespect for your Commander in Chief. It's utterly amazing that you could jump from a profound statement about a deeply profound man to using it as a justification for one of the most pathetic posts on this thread.

Again, I would like to apologize for smithinjapan, just like Obama apoologized for his predecessor.

I am sorry for the nonsense he is writing.

sailwind: "If it WASN'T FOR AMERICA to try to correct her mistakes, and try to live to her promise that all men are truly created equal, he'd never be President in the first place."

Seriously, your sending such bizarrely mixed messages it's beyond comprehension.

I hold my nose at what he's doing... which is what makes our country great and allowed him to be president... but I wish I were a poor black child and apologize for myself... and don't like what you are saying... because I utterly respect Martin Luther King... who didn't care what people thought about his skin colour... etc.

Obama is acknowledging what the world already knows, bush and the republicans screwed up everything for 8 years. The war, the economy, the environment and on and on.

But Obama is President now, rejecting the failures of the past. America is redeeming itself and Obama is starting the process by being honest. Of course honesty and the truth is the enemy of the republicans. Ol Mitt is one very fine example of a republican liar gone amuck, he use to pretend to be a liberal when he was governor of MA but now he pretends otherwise. He pretends to be Christian as well when we all know he is Mormon.

smith,

Just doing 'white guilt' thing and being a good liberal and apologizing for all the horrible things America has done to all the oppressed minorities in my country and all those oppressed in all the world. How I'm doing so far?

WilliB: "Again, I would like to apologize for smithinjapan, just like Obama apoologized for his predecessor. I am sorry for the nonsense he is writing."

No worries, mate. We all know what you're really apologizing for is setting the bar so low in terms of your arguments. And you still have yet to answer for your hypocrisy about the 'diplomatic first' of Obama bowing to the Saudi King -- bush's good buddy -- while your former president not only bowed to him but kissed him and held his hand.

Now, if you want to apologize for not answering THAT, I'm listening. Until then, let me know how deep you plan to dig to actually set the bar below ground.

Obama's apologies are very apt, his bowing to the Saudi King, especially with the US so utterly reliant on oil, are not only respectful but necessary since it's in his country. Likewise if he came to the US or went somewhere else I would expect he abides by the social customs of that country, or else I would lose respect for him.

That you can't see it only means you actually feel serious guilt about something and therefore are extremely offended by the need to apologize, rather than seeing it as it is: a way to make amends, and not necessarily indicative of the person who committed the wrong doing.

sailwind: "Just doing 'white guilt' thing and being a good liberal and apologizing for all the horrible things America has done to all the oppressed minorities in my country and all those oppressed in all the world. How I'm doing so far?"

Worse than bad, if you take into account this article isn't about the 'White Man' apologizing for racial wrongdoings in your country, but is about a right-wing nut's response to Obama apologizing for the wrong doings, real or perceived, of the nation. But again, if you want to somehow bring Martin Luther King into an argument about Romney saying he thinks what Obama is doing is wrong, by all means go ahead... just don't expect any of us to make heads or tails of what you're trying to say.

WilliB and Sailwind - what scares me is that you both appear to think you are serious.

I apologize for all the Democrats out there. Please excuse their constant racist rants and screeds, their head in the sand idiocy, and their defense of the indefensible. They truly can't help it. They earnestly believe that by making everyone victims, they're making everything better.

I'd also like to apologize for the republicans. For not understanding the Democrats need to be always right, even when they're wrong 90% of the time. For supporting the Democratic agenda the past 6 years. Definitely time they went back to their roots, and are Republicans again.

Yabits: And so, according to Superlib, Obama should behave more like the leader who doesn't apologize than the one who does.

You got that from my words saying that I generally support what Obama is doing? My point was to say that I expect others to meet Obama in the middle and stop blaming the US for everything, and also to say that he needs to be careful to not embolden anti-Americans. Meeting in the middle....moderate.....get it?

SushiSake: That's what has been confusing me about SuperLib - thanks for making it clear that even SuperLib isn't sure which side of the fence he stands on, if he stands on a fence at all. :-)

Why so confusing? I support what Obama is doing but I also think Romney has a valid point to make. I listen to what they have to say and I make an opinion based on the validity of their arguments, not the political party they come from. Surely a Democrat can agree with some arguments put forth by Republicans and vice versa.

Right?

Sushi, smith, Yabits, zurc.....if Obama read your comments do you think he'd support them?

What's with the "white guilt"? We are talking about America here not just white but all Americans. Also, I didn't hear Obama apologize to anyone for any of America's mistakes. Acknowledging that one has made mistakes is not apologizing for it. Obama also pointed out that non-Americans need to stop the American bashing. This of course gets little to no coverage while acknowledgment of mistakes gets turned into bowing before other nations. We need to just look at the way things are instead of trying to turn it into something else.

I support what Obama is doing but I also think Romney has a valid point to make.

Romney's point is that Obama should not be apologizing for anything. That point, which you say you find valid, is just as irrational as the position taken by the people who blame America for everything.

You say that Obama should be careful with his words because that might embolden the people who won't give America credit for anything. The ironic fact is that the people I see being emboldened are mostly the ones who, like Romney, are opposed to Obama, and are using his honorable gestures to score political points against him.

This strikes me more as equivocation rather than any respectable moderation. It is the political enemies at home who represent a greater threat to President Obama than anyone like a jeancolmar abroad. Any US person who believes that America should never humble itself is a FAR greater enemy to American self-interest than anyone who doesn't give us credit for anything. A voice such as that will soon be drowned out by other voices around him when confronted with a truly humble United States.

I should not pick on jeancolmar. I do not believe he is anti-American as much as he is against the kind of arrogance typified by people like Romney. Even if he doesn't come around, acknowledging wrongdoing and apologizing for it is the right thing to do, and we ought to be the kind of country that can do the right things without expecting anything in return.

if Obama read your comments do you think he'd support them?

Speaking for myself, I have no doubt.

SezWho: he is doing it...in a way that restores trust in America and America's values

One thing Obama is not doing is restoring American values. European values perhaps, but not American. C'mon, you know better than that.

Acknowledging that one has made mistakes is not apologizing for it.

Expressing regret for a mistake goes quite a bit beyond mere acknowledgement.

Where does Obama tell non-Americans to stop America-bashing?

Obama also pointed out that non-Americans need to stop the American bashing.

Sorry for repeating myself. It is just that when you search for Obama and "America bashing" you get page after page of conservative diatribes claiming that Obama welcomes America bashing.

Expressing regret is not a problem either. I think some folks are caught up with political alliances so that anything the other side does is bad. I don't see a problem with expressing regret while at the same time asking others to acknowledge their own biases. This is what Obama is trying to do.

He did so back in April,...This was the only link I could find with it after a quick search: http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2009/04/03/speaking-in-europe-obama-slams-anti-americanism/

A new dimension of apologia in political discourse? Quite interesting, because I cannot come up with any US president or politicians who make an apology tour to foreign countries.

Thank you caribjustice, for providing the link.

While the point that Obama brought up in Strasbourg has some validity, it is a little naive. I believe that the remarks were more meant for the American audience at home, rather than his French-German audience.

The thing Obama could have acknowledged was that much of the anti-Americanism is not directed at American ideals, but rather at the fact that America bestowed upon itself a leadership position in Europe and world -- and it is often human nature for ordinary people to carp and grouse at leaders.

I am going to cut the Europeans some slack. They've had to endure 8 years of a president whose style and philosophy is radically different from President Obama's.

Obama is absolutely restoring American values. These guys confuse American values with conservative ideology. If you want conservative ideology look to Joseph McCarthy.

"Obama is absolutely restoring American values"

He is absolutely not.

No problem yabits. It seems to me that Obama's style is to try to get the other side to agree with him that both sides have flaws but the more important thing is to get past that and build a future together. Not overnight and not in huge leaps but there have to be things even if small that both sides agree on. Let's start from there and move forward. Those are concrete steps we all need to take in this polarizing political environment.

Acknowledging your imperfections is the sign of a secure person and nation for that matter. Don't get caught up with what people are saying about your imperfections. Live by your values and strive for your ideals.

Yabits: Romney's point is that Obama should not be apologizing for anything

This is what Romney said: “It’s not because America hasn’t made mistakes—we have—but because America’s mistakes are overwhelmed by what America has meant to the hopes and aspirations of people throughout the world.”

He's not saying that we should never apologize or admit mistakes. My opinion, and I'm not a mind reader, is that going on a tour that focuses on what appears to be apologies without giving ourselves proper credit in other areas isn't equitable. I like the fact that Obama is taking a step forward. But I also expect others to do the same for us. Without the second part, the first part is useless. That's the danger.

You keep talking about jingoism and never apologizing and never admitting mistakes but I don't see any evidence of that position at all. It's certainly not my position.

I should not pick on jeancolmar. I do not believe he is anti-American

He is. Don't stand with him just because his anti-Americanism sometimes attacks people you personally don't like.

caribjustice: http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2009/04/03/speaking-in-europe-obama-slams-anti-americanism/

Excellent link. Once again I'm glad to see that my views and Obama's views are in line with each other.

Yabits: I believe that the remarks were more meant for the American audience at home, rather than his French-German audience.

From the link:

At a town hall meeting Friday in France, U.S. President Barack Obama lambasted what he called "anti-Americanism" in Europe and called on European nations to change along with the United States. At times in recent years, the United States has "shown arrogance and been derisive," he told the packed crowd. "But in Europe there's an anti-Americanism that is at once casual but can also be insidious. "Instead of recognizing the good that America so often does in the world, there have been times where Europeans choose to blame America for much of what's bad."

Your position is that the above message was meant for Americans?

I am going to cut the Europeans some slack.

Obviously. Obama's message isn't even an apology per se, it's more about reconciliation. You seem genuinely offended by the thought that some us of want Europeans to admit their own faults while we admit ours.

a tour that focuses on what appears to be apologies without giving ourselves proper credit

There is no shorage of Americans who give themselves ample credit. Many of these same Americans are the ones who misrepresent Obama's trip as an "apology tour."

But I also expect others to do the same for us.

You don't seem to be to put out at the fact that Obama's critics are not cutting him any slack. At times, you seem to be in their corner cheering them on, or at least lending your voice in their attacks against the people who support what Obama is trying to do.

But I also expect others to do the same for us. Without the second part, the first part is useless. That's the danger.

There is no danger, other than in someone's over-active imagination. If you do something wrong, you admit it and own up to it. The side that is wronged is the victim. What would anyone expect to squeeze out of them? Or is American aid and largesse partly a kind of bribe to get people to look the other way and sing the praises of America?

Obama is absolutely restoring American values.

The ones he learned in his church?

Your position is that the above message was meant for Americans?

Absolutely -- Americans more than Europeans -- mainly as a device to mollify these so-called "moderate" critics at home. You picked up on it and are using it, aren't you? In my view, President Obama is smart enough to know that he could leave himself very vulnerable at home with critics who obsess over tit for tat.

You seem genuinely offended by the thought that some us of want Europeans to admit their own faults while we admit ours.

I am more bemused at the notion that there are nations in Europe that have done something against the US to apologize for.

Let's take France, as an example. They told Bush that their intelligence led them to the conclusion that Iraq had no WMD, and that Bush's intent to start a war on those grounds was bogus. For their forthrightness, the French were subjected to these immature American pouting fits of "surrender monkeys" and "freedom fries."

The French turned out to be dead right.

And they should come forward and admit what faults exactly? Not kissing Bush's behind?

The French turned out to be dead right.

Yeah. Maybe. Even so, WMDs were hardly the sole reason we effected regime change.

Telepromter, what is with the we. Americans were fooled into support the invasion by bush and rove based on non-existent WMD. David Kay spent US taxpayers $400 million to try and find what bush and the CIA knew did not exist. It was one huge lie.

You are right that WMD was not the only fabricated justification, after WMD were not found bush and cheney came up with 10 more lie-soaked rationales for the failed invasion. And finally today cheney admits that Iraq and 9-11 were not related. Thats about 10 years too late now to finally admit the truth.

One more thing, the liberals were not fooled by bush. I was not as you know from my posts from years back. Only the weaker minded folks or those not really paying attention were duped.

Now its the MItt lying and the same yahoo peanut gallery is lapping it up. Second verse same as the first.

Even so, WMDs were hardly the sole reason we effected regime change.

Yes, the story changed a number of times, just as with any liar's.

When former President Bush presented his "evidence" to the United Nations, and told the American people and the world that he would insist on a UN vote before he would launch an attack, and then promptly reneged on that, it was again the mark of a liar.

It was those kinds of lies -- told on a regular basis -- that served to tear down the image of the United States.

yabits: "When former President Bush presented his "evidence" to the United Nations, and told the American people and the world that he would insist on a UN vote before he would launch an attack, and then promptly reneged on that, it was again the mark of a liar. It was those kinds of lies -- told on a regular basis -- that served to tear down the image of the United States."

Exaclty! And for which Obama is now proving he is the 'better man' by apologizing for the former leaders lies and mistakes, despite the fact that he did not commit them. This is something that all Republicans ought to be schooled in; but first and foremost they have to apologize for the actual mistakes they've made.

Or better yet, they just keep going down the same path, and the few strings holding their weakened party together will snap.

It was those kinds of lies -- told on a regular basis -- that served to tear down the image of the United States.

[Yawn]

Even Obama's Sec of State, Hillary Clinton, was on board for regime change.

As was her husband.

So I think we can conclude all the conjecture above from zurcronium and smithinjapan is sour grapes, eh.

Democrat Americans like yabits know Obama apologizes for ulterior reasons. Narcissism compels him. Obama,in his naivete and ignorance of history, apologizes for not having come along earlier. It's clear now that's what he meant with his fatuous "We are the people we have been waiting for."

Otherwise, as regards policy - all I sees Obama doin' is simply a-cementin' the legacy of George Dubya Bush.

Yabits: Absolutely -- Americans more than Europeans -- mainly as a device to mollify these so-called "moderate" critics at home.

Do you think Obama believed what he said? You either think he's lying to score politics points or you think he's being honest and you disagree with him. Which is it?

I am more bemused at the notion that there are nations in Europe that have done something against the US to apologize for.

He's talking about anti-Americanism in general, especially placing blame on the US too often, not one specific action taken against American interests by Europeans.

At this point I can't decide if you're refusing to believe anti-Americanism exists or if you're just justifying it. Either way your comments are making Romney's comments all the more credible.

zurc: One more thing, the liberals were not fooled by bush.

You have a mental condition that forces you to type that on this site about once a month or more.

smithinjapan: This is something that all Republicans ought to be schooled in; but first and foremost they have to apologize for the actual mistakes they've made.

I think it's pretty silly to demand that all members of one political party make an apology.

the liberals were not fooled by bush

There must be a dearth of liberals in America, then. Weren't Bush's approval ratings up over 90% immediately after the invasion? Most of those folks are now claiming they were fooled.

There must be a dearth of liberals in America, then. Weren't Bush's approval ratings up over 90% immediately after the invasion?

I'm the first to poke fun at "liberals" in America but I doubt approval for the war ever went above 70 percent.I recall something like 56 in July of 03.

And Bush's approval ratings were a different matter.

SuperLib: "I think it's pretty silly to demand that all members of one political party make an apology."

Not demanding anything, if you want to get technical. I don't necessarily mean that ALL Republicans need apologize, either, but clearly 'they' who have made mistakes OUGHT TO apologize, no? That goes for anyone else (ie. non-Republican). As for representatives of a party, country, group, or whatever else, regardless of whether or not they committed the acts or made the mistakes in question, I think it's important he/she/they do apologize on behalf of said group/country.

'they' who have made mistakes OUGHT TO apologize, no? That goes for anyone else (ie. non-Republican).

Fair enough.

I think Bush already apologized for outraging progressives' tender sensibilities by blurting out 'Bring em on!' on TV or something.

I could be wrong though.

If both sides can acknowledge fault in some way, they can proceed without posturing. That is Obama's angle wrt diplomacy. I would like to know how regret of a country's actions causes harm to that same country. The goal is to get people talking. If you come in with an air of moral superiority, it makes the person you are talking to (especially an enemy) less likely to want to negotiate anything.

If a person wants a country to figuratively press the heel of its boot into another country's neck as the strategy for diplomacy (especially amongst enemies) then Obama's strategy will not be viewed highly by that person.

There is nothing wrong with a leader acknowledging faults and regretting past actions with the goal of the other of acknowledging their own shortcomings to accomplish better diplomacy. Obama's speeches regarding American's actions always has that carrot and stick approach to the audience.

Romney can be most vocal now because he has no responsibility for anything regarding matters of state.

I doubt approval for the war ever went above 70 percent.I recall something like 56 in July of 03. And Bush's approval ratings were a different matter.

You're right, it was immediately after 9/11 that the polls showed an average of nearly 90% of people approved of Bush staring doe-eyed and trying to follow kids reading a book while the country was supposedly under attack. After the invasion approval shot up to 75, then immediately started to fall and fall and fall. Still works out at very few liberals, or a significant number of liberals being fooled by Bush.

http://www.hist.umn.edu/~ruggles/Approval.htm

The ravages of BDS:

Bush the idiot : "...after 9/11...nearly 90% of people approved of Bush staring doe-eyed and trying to follow kids reading a book..."

[...]

Bush the evil genius: "Still works out at very few liberals, or a significant number of liberals being fooled by Bush."

All in one post.

Amazing.

Moderator: All readers back on topic please.

Bush the idiot : "...after 9/11...nearly 90% of people approved of Bush....

Not so much Bush the idiot as nearly 90% of people the idiots

Bush the evil genius: "Still works out at very few liberals, or a significant number of liberals being fooled by Bush."

Nah, more like, 'fool me.. ya can't get fooled again', I think.

Just countering zurc's claim that the liberals were not fooled by bush, tele. A good number of them apparently were. Nothing to get your patriotic knickers in a twist about. :-)

Do you think Obama believed what he said? You either think he's lying to score politics points or you think he's being honest and you disagree with him. Which is it?

As long as there exists a tiny percentage of people in Europe who are so politically unsophisticated and unintelligent that they possess a kneejerk hatred of the United States, Obama's words were and are true. But the vast majority of ordinary people in Europe are not viscerally anti-American, and therefore do not apply. Most simply were extremely embarrassed for us at how we over-reacted after 9/11 -- and how we erupted at Europeans (old Europe?) who failed to get behind a president whom they had very little respect for in the first place.

Romney appears to want to carry on that tradition.

Otherwise, as regards policy - all I sees Obama doin' is simply a-cementin' the legacy of George Dubya Bush.

Thats rich telepromter, if obama fails miserably in every endeavor then you will be right.

Cleo, you are confusing the post 9-11 numbers and the support for the Iraq War. There are not the same thing. If you remember there were huge protests in the USA and even in Japan against the Iraq invasion. Public opinion was split on the invasion despite bush and rove putting on the full court press to fool the American people. And many were, but liberals in general were not. My representative for example did not vote for the invasion and many, many posters on this board predicted failure of the invasion. And we were right. Just like the French and even Putin who predicted total failure. After the US was attacked for the first time since 1941 the American people rallied behind their President, Bush of course misused that support to invade and eventually fail in Iraq.

You have a mental condition that forces you to type that on this site about once a month or more.

Superlib, when you right wingers finally admit and apologize for your huge mistakes in supporting the failed bush junior I will not have to constantly remind you all how wrong you all were. Its the first step in the 12 step recovery program that republicans need to come back into the real world. Odds are low any of you can do this. Like so many others you will simply just drop off this board in shame before you can admit the truth.

zurc, your repetition is nothing more than evidence of a simple mind. And the fact you think I'm Republican wold indicate something even less than that. Have fun with your paper hat and sword while you play the Guardian of Truth. It suits you.

zurcronium:

If you remember there were huge protests in the USA and even in Japan against the Iraq invasion.

Oh yeah. Huge. Brought Tokyo to a standstill. I remembers it like it were yesterday. Man on the TV said all the foreigners were out.

Gee, what a surprise that a Republican criticizes Obama! Romney wasn't even close to getting the nomination in the last election so his voice is rather uninfluential.....

Every Republican with White House dreams will wrap themselves in the flag and claim to be the voice of America. But what the Republicans have failed to realize is that last election America spoke up and removed them from power.

I just hope that people kike Romney keep on talking, this way America will finish the job next election....62 in the Senate and 300 in the Congress sounds like a nice round number......

Wow -- so many people unaware of history. Politics in the U.S. is cyclical. Liberals are in charge today, but by the mid-term elections in 2010, conservatives will be back It's the only reason that the U.S. hasn't been forced to the extremes. Every 2-4 years, control is passed from one party to another. Thankfully.

Senator Richard Lugar termed President Barack Obama's address to the Muslim world a "signal achievement" and dismissed criticism by fellow Republicans that the U.S. leader was too apologetic.

The speech Obama delivered June 4 in Cairo was important and necessary, said Lugar, the top Republican on the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, noting a "lack of sympathy for our country" in many Muslim nations. "We probably as Americans need to give a lot of speeches in the Arab world," the Indiana senator said in an interview on Bloomberg Television's "Political Capital with Al Hunt," airing this weekend. Lugar, 77, also said Obama's language on Iran was tough enough and was meant to reassure Arab countries, which share U.S. concerns about Iran's quest to acquire nuclear weapons.