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U.S., Russia ratchet up their rhetoric over downing of drone

60 Comments
By ELENA BECATOROS and DARLENE SUPERVILLE

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“What do they do thousands of miles away from the United States?” he said in remarks his embassy released. “The answer is obvious -- they gather intelligence which is later used by the Kyiv regime to attack our armed forces and territory.”

...because Russia started a war with Ukraine?

4 ( +16 / -12 )

said the incident was part of a "pattern of aggressive, risky and unsafe actions by Russian pilots in international airspace

Still claimed as "International airspace" even it's already nearby sovereign country border.

-5 ( +9 / -14 )

@bronc0 In order to appease environmental groups, the Russian 

In order to appease environmental groups Putin's military forces should return to Russia to clean up their own oil/gas contaminated environment, and pay Ukraine to clean up the environmental damage done by Russian forces there.

4 ( +15 / -11 )

Moscow should respect international airspace, says UK defence secretary after drone crash. That’s like asking a person who has just poisoned a family of cats to kindly put the empty bottle of poison in the bin, rather than toss it on the floor

And then the next straight faced headline the following day:

Russia plans to recover wreckage of US drone downed over Black Sea

Like that’s even remotely ok 

America needs to toughen up fast

-6 ( +6 / -12 )

Russians as always twisting the facts .......

Too bad Turkey closed the Bosporus area.

They (Erdogan) should also reconsider which side they're standing on.

In addition: *" ......closest ship regardless of nationality has the right and duty to retrieve it."*

This is just another "wish-it-was-so-comment"!

There is no "duty to retrieve"! Russians want to salvage the drone to get some more information on how it works. Hope that UAV is completely destroyed, nothing remained.

0 ( +9 / -9 )

Miley is going to do what in response to downing our drone? Been a few days now. I would call that the very definition of appeasement.

What should he do?

3 ( +9 / -6 )

The other way around, Miley is going to do what in response to downing our drone? Been a few days now. I would call that the very definition of appeasement.

‘Our drone’. So now you want the US to get involved in a war? What a turnaround.

3 ( +8 / -5 )

The other way around, Miley is going to do what in response to downing our drone?

What do you suggest be done?

I'm guessing you are holding your cards for the momemnt. If Biden does something he will be seen as 'warmongering', If he does nothing, he will be 'weak'.

If I were you I wouldn't tell anyone what you want done, just in case it actually happens.

4 ( +10 / -6 )

Bass - what would you recommend he do? What would you do?

0 ( +6 / -6 )

I'm guessing you are holding your cards for the momemnt. If Biden does something he will be seen as 'warmongering', If he does nothing, he will be 'weak'.

Bingo!

3 ( +7 / -4 )

Yrral, NO!

The drone is in international waters.

But since Turkey closed the Bosporus straight for navy vessels, the US can't just send in some warships.

So, what's your take?

Glory to Ukraine!

Glory to the heroes!

Ukraine prevails!

-2 ( +8 / -10 )

What should he do?

Increase our presence and fly more drones, while giving the Russians a strict warning our own response should another incursion like this happens again in international airspace.

I'm guessing you are holding your cards for the momemnt.

No, I would be very direct and calculated.

If Biden does something he will be seen as 'warmongering',

No, you don’t need to go to war, they don’t want a war, and neither do we, but we Stil can respond decisively and measured.

If he does nothing, he will be 'weak'.

Well, Vlad and Xi already think that, why you think this is even happening in the first place?

If I were you I wouldn't tell anyone what you want done, just in case it actually happens.

Well, I can say what I want as an American.

-12 ( +3 / -15 )

https://twitter.com/Gerashchenko_en/status/1635720607143690261

Just a Russian Occupation Admin saying that the Black Sea will one day be all Russia's, but yeah, this is not anything like 1930's Germany :-I

-1 ( +6 / -7 )

The Russian plane did not enter the airspace of Estonia, a NATO member.

what an odd way to say it was actually in “international waters”. Why would the plane have been “intercepted” then?

International waters- that was a big deal, yesterday,

-8 ( +5 / -13 )

But since Turkey closed the Bosporus straight for navy vessels, the US can't just send in some warships.

isnt Turkey a NATO member that is supposedly being protected in the region by the US drones?

-13 ( +3 / -16 )

Blacklabel - Interception is fine in international waters, using force is not.

4 ( +8 / -4 )

Russia should send some drones to US airspace and see how they react....

-7 ( +6 / -13 )

Sanji - it is perfectly legal for Russia or anyone to send drones up to 12 nm from our coasts (our territorial waters or airspace). They do this from time to time, with ships too. It's not that rare.

3 ( +9 / -6 )

International waters- that was a big deal, yesterday,

Yeah, notice how they didn't shoot the plane down?

Russia should send some drones to US airspace and see how they react....

lolz It wasn't Russian airspace either with the drone or the Russian plane, and they:ve flown in US airspace before anyway.

3 ( +9 / -6 )

Yeah, notice how they didn't shoot the plane down?

Russia didn’t shoot down the drone either.

-7 ( +8 / -15 )

Russia didn’t shoot down the drone either.

Oh, right they just dumped fuel on it, and then crashed into it. Big difference.

1 ( +9 / -8 )

Big difference.

yes it is. Words have meanings for a reason.

CCP asset Milley calls it a “collision”, could even be unintentional.

but whether the collision itself was intentional was still unclear.

-3 ( +8 / -11 )

yes it is. Words have meanings for a reason.

No, it's not. My point is the US didn't intentionally down the aircraft in international airspace, like the Russians did.

4 ( +10 / -6 )

What did the Russians “shoot down”?

-10 ( +5 / -15 )

Funny the USA and most news forgets to mention that in this case the Drone's transponder was off!

Yes as is clear in all reports, the USA has been conducting these provocations for months but I'm accordance to international agreements, the drones have always turned on their transponders.

The reason this time was different was because the transponder was off causing the jets to be scrambled and to intercept.

In such a case a military vehicle capable of carrying arms no transponder heading in your country's direction.

Well in most cases it would be shot down.

-4 ( +7 / -11 )

Bass: Increase our presence and fly more drones, while giving the Russians a strict warning our own response should another incursion like this happens again in international airspace.

Agreed.

3 ( +7 / -4 )

What did the Russians “shoot down”?

Regardless of how they did it, they still caused a US plane flying in international airspace to come out of the sky. How they did is irrelevant.

-1 ( +7 / -8 )

If it wasn't shot down, and it was an unnamed drones and as the USA claims a collision.

The drone is at fault under aviation rules.

More so if the report of the transport being off.

But remember we are talking about the USA, experts at false flag operations, "remember the Maine" and "the Gulf of Tonkin incident" plenty more,

-7 ( +6 / -13 )

main questions is what american drone did faraway from US soil?

I believe was on spy mission and flew towards russian border right?

if we can agree on that than we have to admit that it was US who have threated sovereignty of Russia,right?

what is all talk about that?

days when US drones could fly everywhere they like are over.

take a note guys and stop provoke Russia and escalate tensions faraway from your own shores.

since russian bear have send posseidons etc nearby you and this time you may not remain untouchable.

got it?

-11 ( +5 / -16 )

Lol, you just made up a new law.

If the wreckage is in international waters, the closest ship regardless of nationality has the right and duty to retrieve it.

Especially if the wreckage contains toxic fuel which is harmful to the environment.

In order to appease environmental groups, the Russian Navy should retrieve the drone.

4 ( +7 / -3 )

to come out of the sky. 

That’s super odd phrasing.

Milley says the cause of the collision isn’t known yet.

Is he lying or incompetent or both? Because you seem to know already.

-5 ( +4 / -9 )

Eastman: got it?

Nah, we'll pass on your proposals.

Was there something you were going to do about that?

1 ( +5 / -4 )

Is he lying or incompetent or both? Because you seem to know already.

Oh, please. You make quite a few assumptions yourself there friend, I'm only going off media reports.

0 ( +6 / -6 )

“The answer is obvious -- they gather intelligence which is later used by the Kyiv regime to attack our armed forces and territory.”

And some still think the US is not in this war. It just shows their fear of Russians. If Russia didn’t have missiles, the U.S. would have long bombed them like in Iraq.

The world needs more nuclear weapons in Iran and North Korea. The more there is the more effective the deterrence.

0 ( +8 / -8 )

No, he said the Russian aircraft clearly collided with the drone, but they're not sure it was intentional yet.

That’s super odd phrasing.

Milley says the cause of the collision isn’t known yet.

Is he lying or incompetent or both? Because you seem to know already.

3 ( +6 / -3 )

The world needs more nuclear weapons in Iran and North Korea. The more there is the more effective the deterrence.

I would be ok with this if you include Ukraine as well.

-1 ( +4 / -5 )

fallaffel

Today 09:55 am JST

No, he said the Russian aircraft clearly collided with the drone, but they're not sure it was intentional yet

So if the USA doesn't come out and clearly accuse Russia of deliberately doing it then under international aviation rules the drone ( unmanned craft) is responsible.

Especially if the claim the transponder was off!

It is a simple concept, manned aircraft have priority over unmanned drones.

So unless the USA is ready to say 100% it was done deliberately and outright commit to that, then by default the USA is at fault.

2 ( +8 / -6 )

Russia should send some drones to US airspace and see how they react....

A) The US didn't send any drones to Russian airspace.

B) All the Russian drones are busy right now, if you hadn't noticed.

C) Russia sends bombers to the edge of American airspace all the time. US doesn't clumsily crash its fighter jets into them.

1 ( +9 / -8 )

I'm only going off media reports.

But oddly ignoring this article and the media reports where Milley says it was a collision and unknown yet if intentional or not.

kinda ruins all the “crashed into”, “shot down”, “forced down”, “ come out of the sky(!?)” rhetoric though.

-1 ( +6 / -7 )

And some still think the US is not in this war. 

It’s not a war, remember? It’s a “special military operation”.

If you’re in Russia now, I advise you not to stand near any windows.

3 ( +8 / -5 )

The russian army kills children every day. Do you really think they care about technicalities such as "international space"?

1 ( +8 / -7 )

*they gather intelligence which is later used by the Kyiv regime to *attack our armed forces and territory

No one is attacking russian territory.

If you want them to stop attacking russian troops, that's easy - just pull them out of Ukrainian territory.

Nikolai Patrushev, the secretary of Russia’s Security Council, said in televised remarks the drone incident was “another confirmation” of direct U.S. involvement in the Ukraine conflict

OK...so what are you waiting for? If you think the US is attacking you, go and attack the US, directly. See how long it takes Article 5 to bring russia to its knees. (Vladimort has already got it halfway there, by wrecking its economy, sending hordes of its young men into a meat grinder, and instigating a massive brain drain of the intelligent young men who avoided the draft.)

Listened this morning to a news podcast of some russian bigwig 'explaining' how it was all America's fault that the brave and gallant russian armed forces were selflessly engaging in a smo to save the Ukrainian people from its 'fascist, nazi regime'. Almost made me want to stomp on my iPhone.

0 ( +6 / -6 )

Salvage in international waters is a race - whoever can get there first. It will probably be Russia this time. There's no duty, just intense interest. I'd expect nothing less.

The drone had plenty of time before hitting the water to fully encrypt all data, burn out all sensitive electronics, and eject that electronics miles away from where it hit the water. Good luck finding it Russia.

The most important data AND the video from multiple cameras was recorded during the flight.

If the US says the Russian plane hit it, there is proof that happened.

There is also proof they tried to foul the aircraft by dumping jet fuel in the flight path of the drone. No doubt that the Russian pilots were told to knock it down without using any weapons by the Kremlin. No doubt at all, just like there isn't any doubt it was flying in international airspace.

Russia hopes to find offensive weapons on the drone, but won't find any because it was a surveillance mission. But they can look. Let them waste more rubles, if they like.

Next week, we might get the drone video and see the Russian lies. That will depend on whether the US determines declassification of that video is worth it or not. Most of the cameras are long range, meant to provide high resolution images/video of the ground up to 60+ miles away. Showing accelerometer data which proves the drone was hit from behind won't be sexy enough to show the world, but engineers in the military will know exactly what happened from those readings.

4 ( +6 / -2 )

In embattled Bakhmut, where a Russian assault has gone on for months, Ukrainian forces have successfully fought for northern parts of the city, Ukrainian Deputy Defense Minister Hanna Maliar said.

Not sure what he is talking about, even pro Ukrainian site and battle recaps based on "confirmed" Ukrainian reports, Wagner has push passed Ukrainian troops in the North taken 2 more villages, taken the metal works factory, etc...

Ukraine in North and South are in full retreat Russia is extending the encirclement to include 2 more smaller cities cutting off them and Bakhmut. That is what pro Ukraine reports are saying, pro Russian reports are far worse.

Those analyzing on the more neutral basis say what Ukrainian sources say is far lower and Russian claims to high, as usual it is somewhere in the middle.

But in any case Ukraine has lost more territory and now instead of encircling just Bakhmut Russia looks like it is going for Ivanivske in the encirclement.

If we are only talking about Bakhmut, at this point confirmed control are Ukraine 15 Km2 Russia 29 Km2.

It is obvious Ukraine is going to lose and the western allies long ago told Ukraine to pull back.

Now after months of flying near Russian controlled space the USA drone just happens to crash as Bakhmut and Ukraine are going to take a major loss!

How convenient look look look over here not over there where we are losing.

-6 ( +3 / -9 )

Putin is now conscripting female convicts from prisons and sending them to fight in the Ukraine where 1,000 Russian troops are killed every day.

Dozens of women have been recruited from prisons in the south of Russia and sent to Ukraine by train, said the founder Olga Romanova of Russia Behind Bars.

3 ( +8 / -5 )

If the US says the Russian plane hit it, there is proof that happened.

> There is also proof they tried to foul the aircraft by dumping jet fuel in the flight path of the drone. No doubt that the Russian pilots were told to knock it down without using any weapons by the Kremlin. No doubt at all, just like there isn't any doubt it was flying in international airspace.

So if you are willing to accept the USA evidence then you should be willing to accept Russian at the same level, (remember WMD, Gulf of Tonkin, etc... the USA are not saints or about fabrication of evidence). So if Russia evidence shows no transponder ( remember no transponder on a military aircraft is an automatic act of aggression) then regardless of USA evidence the Russians had every right to stop the drone.

It may sound silly but no transponder is a danger also to civil aviation, and in the case of a drone an internationally acceptable response is to shoot it down.

-5 ( +5 / -10 )

Blacklabel: kinda ruins all the “crashed into”, “shot down”, “forced down”, “ come out of the sky(!?)” rhetoric though.

What are Trump/Russia fans calling it? A success?

-1 ( +6 / -7 )

Awa no Gaijin: Since when does the United states not escalate conflicts of other countries and regions ?

Spoken like a true Trump supporter.

2 ( +7 / -5 )

Russia views the Black Sea as their private lake, even though many other countries are also situated around it.

Yep, Russia has gotten too big for its britches. The Russians think they can kill, destroy and steal with impunity.

2 ( +8 / -6 )

Most likely scenario, USA has launched navy seals to the Black Sea minutes after this went down. They will sit in a small boat, and attach a cable to the sunken drone, until the timing is right to recover. If Russia does dare touch them, well, it won't be good.

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

Spoken like a true Trump supporter.

Why do libs love war so much, even more than America itself. Sad.

-6 ( +2 / -8 )

Oh, right they just dumped fuel on it, and then crashed into it. Big difference.

if this USA propaganda is true, why isn’t there Breaking News on all US MSM with footage of the incident. This drone is not some sort of a kite on a piece of string. It is one of the worlds most sophisticated surveillance devices. It is connected in real time feeds on land and also satellites in orbit. It doesn’t just stores things on an SD card and return to base.

very fishy.

-3 ( +5 / -8 )

vendingmachinemusic

Today 11:42 am JST

Most likely scenario, USA has launched navy seals to the Black Sea minutes after this went down. They will sit in a small boat, and attach a cable to the sunken drone, until the timing is right to recover. If Russia does dare touch them, well, it won't be good.

Hahaha that is funny!

BBC

Russia has confirmed that it is attempting to recover wreckage of the drone, which may have sunk to depths of up to 5,000 feet (1,500m) below the surface.

But more hilarious is

Length: 36 ft 1 in (11 m)

Wingspan: 65 ft 7 in (20 m)

Height: 12 ft 6 in (3.81 m)

Empty weight: 4,901 lb (2,223 kg)

I would like to see Navy seals in a small boat move it from that depth.

-4 ( +5 / -9 )

Didn't we agree that the US should send strong messages to Russia and increase drone patrols?

You sound like a liberal warmonger to me.

No, I shouldn’t, calm down. I’m not a liberal, big difference, sending a strong message and just wanting appease the Russians. You don’t need to be a warmonger, you just need a pair. This President doesn’t have that. Ask the Saudis and the Chinese.

-8 ( +1 / -9 )

Obviously, US was spying on Crimea. If Crimea had been true Russian territory, I say, shoot down the drone. Though, Russia stole Crimea. Sloppy of the Russians to collide, damaging their own plane. And what are US drones doing in Crimea? Put a Ukrainian flag on it!

-3 ( +2 / -5 )

Though, Russia stole Crimea.

Funny that!

In 2015 Ukraine passed a law: Decommunization in Ukraine.

It somehow included a section making it illegal to claim OUN UPA and the rest of the nationalist groups that help Nazi Germany and participate in ethnic cleansing were anything other than freedom fighters.

It also exempt the forced annexation of Crimea into the then Ukrainian Soviet Socialist Republic.

How convenient. Everything the USSR did was criminal it was an illegal occupation according to the 2015 law all but the transfer of Crimea to Ukraine, funny that one!

-8 ( +2 / -10 )

Russia and the United States ratcheted up their confrontational rhetoric Wednesday over a U.S. surveillance drone

This "surveillance drone" was used to guide strikes against Russia, so this is legal aim.

-6 ( +4 / -10 )

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