Russia hopes for 'progress' at Saudi talks: negotiator

Yeah, russia hopes for progress in getting Trump to push for surrender.

I suspect most therapists don't recommend shuttle dialog when one of the parties is trying to kill the other.

Yeah, russia hopes for progress in getting Trump to push for surrender.

Not surrendering, but Zelenskyy will more than likely have to give up a lot more land, no NATO membership, that’s the only way. Trump will never put our people in harms way or deploy troops fight this war. If Europe wants to step in and threaten Russia, then they should, it’s essentially their problem to deal with, we just the back up

bass4funkToday 07:42 am JST

Yeah, russia hopes for progress in getting Trump to push for surrender.

Not surrendering, but Zelenskyy will more than likely have to give up a lot more land, no NATO membership, that’s the only way.

Under what circumstances would you recommend the US give up land for no security guarantee?

This bromance between putin and trump does not bode well for any US ally let alone Ukraine.

bass4funk

Yeah, russia hopes for progress in getting Trump to push for surrender.

Not surrendering, but Zelenskyy will more than likely have to give up a lot more land, no NATO membership, that’s the only way.

NATO membership can come later. But this war will not stop under Trump. He has no power over Putin.

He said he and fellow negotiator, FSB advisor Sergey Beseda would take a "combative and constructive" mood into the talks.

I.e., Putin is in no mood to give up anything. With that attitude, why should Zelenskyy?

The FSB in 2014 admitted that Beseda was in Kyiv during a bloody crackdown in the Ukrainian capital in the midst of the country's pro-EU revolution.

Many people like to suppose that the CIA was involved in the Maidan protest. Apart from moral support and speeches to protestors, the CIA had a small role.

The FSB, however, were much more involved and encouraged Yanukovych to come down hard on protestors with his Berkut thugs.

Fos

As usual a bit of confusion here from the usual suspects :)

Where?

Let's remember the role of the US administration here and the big US industrial military complex for this full scale disaster. If there had been no decision to expand Nato into Ukraine

Really? When did that happen?

What is clear from the beginning is that Russia could not have the US nuclear missiles bases in Ukraine, same as Washington would not allow Moscow to hold military equipment in Canada.

No NATO member since the 50’s has had nuclear weapons installed in their country, so was never a threat. Russia knows this.

It is a very elementary principle of satellite countries and big empires. The rest is American style manipulative narrative

Oh, so satellite country Finland became a member of NATO and Putin is fine with it. How can this be? It completely debunks your elementary principle.

As usual a bit of confusion here from the usual suspects :)

and then proceeds to lit off a bunch of false narratives and misinformation.

Step by step progress, but naturally not easy, so they'll be times when it's two steps forward, one step back.

It's just highly complicated nature of trying to end a conflict that started in 2014 and escalated in 2022 into a global conflict involving dozens and dozens of countries.

Maintaining status quo conflict is 'easy', but very $costly, deadly and with no military solution ending the conflict except WWIII escalation. While ending this war via this Peace Process is 'hard', requires tough compromises.

Voters have spoken, clear majorities in US, EU, Ukraine and Russia want Peace and for Ukraine to recover ASAP

HopeSpringsEternal

It's just highly complicated nature of trying to end a conflict that started in 2014

It's not complicated. Putin annexed Crimea in 2014, and started the war in the Donbas by sending in troops.

and escalated in 2022 into a global conflict involving dozens and dozens of countries.

It didn't escalate, Russia engaged in a war of aggression against Ukraine, because Putin doesn't think that Ukraine is a sovereign state. This is called imperialism.

Voters have spoken, clear majorities in US, EU, Ukraine and Russia want Peace and for Ukraine to recover ASAP

Russia wants peace, but Putin most clearly does not.

HopeSpringsEternalToday 10:45 am JST

Voters have spoken, clear majorities in US, EU, Ukraine and Russia want Peace and for Ukraine to recover ASAP

Clear majorities in Ukraine do not want any land concessions to russia.

The second guy in on the Saudi meeting tomorrow is basically the 2IC of the FSB - of which Putin was once head. Not one to muck around, demonstrated as a numbered directorate chief.

This is a clear warning shot that Moscow is playing hardball. See if you can guess which is his pistol hand.

This war has its roots in aggressive alliance expansion. In 2008, they arrogantly announced Ukraine and Georgia would be expanded into. There was meddling which culminated in the anti-neutral, unconstitutional coup of 2014, provoking a civil war and also next door. Moscow was forced, as per signed Budapest Memorandum, to take defensive action to correct this blemish. More so, the Kosovo precedent was made and it can be applied in this 'special case' too.

"I don't regard Putin as a bad guy. That is a complicated situation, that war, and all the ingredients that led up to it," Trump's envoy said.

Witkoff is provocatively hinting at all the provoked factors of this very complex and 120% provoked conflict.

Certain quarters can't hack the righteous 'unprovoked' narrative crumbling. Truth is that was a lemon, if not worse.

JJE

This war has its roots in aggressive alliance expansion. In 2008, they arrogantly announced Ukraine and Georgia would be expanded into.

Nothing arrogant about it. Sovereign nations are allowed to join defense alliances. You will note that neither Georgia and Ukraine did not join NATO, not in 2008 and not in the years since. So the NATO pretext is baseless.

There was meddling which culminated in the anti-neutral, unconstitutional coup of 2014,

No meddling. No coup.

provoking a civil war and also next door.

The civil war was provoked by Russia sending in troops. Ever heard of Igor Girkin?

Moscow was forced, as per signed Budapest Memorandum, to take defensive action to correct this blemish.

Moscow was forced to do nothing. Putin invaded Ukraine because he believes it isn't a sovereign nation. I.e., imperialism.

More so, the Kosovo precedent was made and it can be applied in this 'special case' too.

Nope. It can't.

JJE

"I don't regard Putin as a bad guy. That is a complicated situation, that war, and all the ingredients that led up to it," Trump's envoy said.

Witkoff is provocatively hinting at all the provoked factors of this very complex and 120% provoked conflict.

Witkoff is an idiot. He and Trump have been outsmarted by Putin.

Certain quarters can't hack the righteous 'unprovoked' narrative crumbling.

The truth isn't crumbling just because some idiots believe in Russian propaganda.

JJE

Witkoff is provocatively hinting at all the provoked factors of this very complex and 120% provoked conflict.

BTW Witkoff said that Putin had commissioned a portrait of Trump by an accomplished artist. He also said that he went to church and prayed for Trump after he was shot.

Clearly this is Putin manipulating Trump. Trump and Witkoff are clearly outmatched.

This bromance between putin and trump does not bode well for any US ally let alone Ukraine

Not sure bromance is the right word here.

Putin is more like the mistress with the whip.