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Russian sentenced to life in Ukraine's 1st war crimes trial

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By ELENA BECATOROS, OLEKSANDR STASHEVSKYI and RICARDO MAZALAN

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80 Comments

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I think a life sentence is not justified, all things considered. I would say his sentence will be commuted at some point in the future, or reduced in a deal with Russia for Ukrainian soldiers to get similar leniency. It may be reduced upon appeal, after the war is over.

2 ( +9 / -7 )

Sgt. Vadim Shishimarin, 21, will be back home in Russia drinking tea with his mother within 18 months. Regardless of him being guilty or not.

-10 ( +6 / -16 )

Not since the Geneva Convention was signed has a POW been charged in a civil court by the country that he was captured by.

The ICC exists for a reason.

They are supposed to handle war crimes cases, not the countries involved in the war.

-3 ( +14 / -17 )

Yes, this is totally wrong that the capturing country gets to do their own trial.

But its ok, its Ukraine!

dont question anything, just be quiet, send money and spread the one sided propaganda.

-10 ( +13 / -23 )

I think this is a strategy by Ukraine to be able to swap for their own surrendered soldiers who will also in turn be sentenced to life and sent to gulags.

5 ( +9 / -4 )

https://theconversation.com/amp/war-crimes-trial-of-russian-soldier-was-perfectly-legal-but-that-doesnt-make-it-wise-183586

4 ( +7 / -3 )

I suppose the folks decrying this trial by Ukraine will be equally quick to jump on the Russians if/when they put Ukrainians on trial in Russia.

4 ( +9 / -5 )

He also said Russia's Ministry of Foreign Affairs is all about "warmongering, lies and hatred.”

As a veteran Russian diplomat for over 20 years he would know more than anyone here.

4 ( +10 / -6 )

dont question anything, just be quiet, send money and spread the one sided propaganda.

The rightists on here question literally everything Ukraine and the west does. The irony of such as statement. I guess we're all supposed to heap scorn on Ukraine, and say nothing about Russia.

1 ( +10 / -9 )

Not since the Geneva Convention was signed has a POW been charged in a civil court by the country that he was captured by.

And if Putin's plan had been successful and Ukraine has fallen within days, there wouldn't have been any trial at all.

0 ( +6 / -6 )

dont question anything, just be quiet,

Penalty in Russia for questioning the "special military operation": 15 years in prison.

2 ( +12 / -10 )

He will not spend life in prison. Down the road, he eventually will be used as a bargaining chip and traded for Ukrainian prisoners.

11 ( +11 / -0 )

It must be right!

After all, it's a war crimes trial by Ukraine!

-8 ( +5 / -13 )

Everyday that this war goes on Ukraine,head toward the stone age,the US government will not give Ukraine ,the weapon they need to pacify,maybe the US satisfied the way Ukraine is doing in the war

-10 ( +3 / -13 )

harming the national security and sovereignty of Ukraine, identifying Ukrainian patriotism with Nazism, and inciting hatred toward the Ukrainian people, their culture and language.

-8 ( +1 / -9 )

This dude killed an innocent man. Think about that. What is the man was your Father or Son or Uncle. Then you might care. Jail him for life.

5 ( +10 / -5 )

The following says everything I have been saying.

Mary Ellen O’Connell, an expert on international law at the University of Notre Dame, said that putting Shishimarin on trial could prove “extremely detrimental to Ukrainian soldiers in the hands of Russia.” She said Russia may decide to hold “show trials” of Ukrainians to boost the morale of its own soldiers and spread disinformation.

> “Maybe it would have happened without the Ukrainians beginning trials,” O’Connell said. “But the timing suggests that the Ukrainians should have held back and perhaps still should, so that the Russians can’t say, ‘We’re just doing to their soldiers what they did to ours.’”

As my mother would say "Time and place" it was and is not time for war crime trials you do that after the fighting stops and you secure the safety of your Soldiers that are POWs of your adversary.

But today logic is gone as we see intelligent people say right is left, lefte is right, up is down, down means up, advancing means losing, surrendering means evacuation, feelings are fact, facts are opinions and my favorite right is wrong and wrong is right.

-2 ( +7 / -9 )

They should just execute him and save the money! One less commie!

-16 ( +1 / -17 )

Murdering women, children and the elderly is always wrong. Just because they’re trapped in a war zone doesn’t give the invaders the right to be cruel to them.

3 ( +8 / -5 )

plasticmonkey

Today 08:25 am JST

dont question anything, just be quiet,

> Penalty in Russia for questioning the "special military operation": 15 years in prison

Yes and we and the international community have pointed out it is wrong.

Now Ukraine is doing the same ( nothing to do with this trial,) rounding up Ukrainians Suspected" of supporting Russia, arresting opposition politicians, banning political parties, etc.. laws near identical as those in Russia but we make excuses to justify this action by Ukraine, Russia is the most corrupt country in Europe Ukraine was ranked one above Russia which tells us both these countries and governments are not trustworthy, fair, legitimate, etc... Remember the two MOST corrupt.

-3 ( +7 / -10 )

@Bronco

For better or worse the ICC is actually a court of last resort intended only for situations where countries are either unwilling or unable to prosecute war criminals. Countries are basically free to hold war crimes trials in their own domestic courts, even against enemy soldiers. I expect Russia and its allies will hold their own trials in the coming months, as is their right.

5 ( +8 / -3 )

Absolutely vile.

-4 ( +2 / -6 )

Steve

Today 09:21 am JST

They should just execute him and save the money! One less commie!

Genius idea and that will be followed by 2,500 POWs just taken in Azovstal.

There was a reason why no war crime trials were held until after the fighting stopped in WW2.

2 ( +7 / -5 )

I suppose the folks decrying this trial by Ukraine will be equally quick to jump on the Russians if/when they put Ukrainians on trial in Russia.

Not anymore. because Ukraine did it first, is being cheered for it and it’s been decided by the media that it’s perfectly legal.

so would be nothing to complain about if Russia did it.

-6 ( +7 / -13 )

 I guess we're all supposed to heap scorn on Ukraine, and say nothing about Russia.

No, you just aren’t supposed to excuse wrong things just because it’s Ukraine doing it.

wrong is wrong.

-4 ( +6 / -10 )

Blacklabel - I am ok with the two sides holding legal, fair, and transparent trials for war crimes. We have to be consistent.

4 ( +9 / -5 )

No, you just aren’t supposed to excuse wrong things just because it’s Ukraine doing it.

Explain how it's wrong. As Uchoose has already shown, nothing Ukraine did here was illegal. You may not like, but it seems legal to me.

wrong is wrong.

Except, again, the rightists here never, ever criticize Russia. Only Ukraine. It seems to me "wrong is wrong," only applies to Ukraine and not Russia.

4 ( +10 / -6 )

Except, again, the rightists here never, ever criticize Russia. 

i see it all the time. Never seen any criticism of Ukraine here, ever.

Why would I criticize Russia for what only Ukraine has done so far that is supposedly perfectly legal to do?

will you support Russia having these trials too?

-6 ( +6 / -12 )

see it all the time. Never seen any criticism of Ukraine here, ever.

Nonsense. The rightists here only criticize Ukraine, not Russia. Period.

will you support Russia having these trials too?

Will I support Russia, who invaded Ukraine, kidnapping Ukrainians, and trying them in their kangaroo courts? Absolutely not. These are not the same.

-2 ( +7 / -9 )

As Uchoose has already shown, nothing Ukraine did here was illegal

says “the media”.

it’s actually wrong.

-7 ( +6 / -13 )

it’s actually wrong.

Then prove it already.

3 ( +7 / -4 )

Zelensky said it was. So, it must be right!

-2 ( +4 / -6 )

They are supposed to handle war crimes cases, not the countries involved in the war.

This is not a War !

It’s just a “special military operation”, remember ?

Keep to the Putin script*
2 ( +6 / -4 )

Feel sorry for him and his family. He was only following orders. If he didn’t stop the Ukrainian spy, their position would of been compromised and many young military men and women would of lost their lives.

this is why I hate war. A civilian died because of his president.

-9 ( +2 / -11 )

Blacklabel - are you able to find anything from appropriate experts who would suggest that this is illegal under international law? I’m not interested in right/wrong/good idea/bad idea. I am just curious if it is illegal. I will search as well.

2 ( +5 / -3 )

Let's hope he sees his sentence carried out in a Ukrainian prison, in the general public, which is hopefully made up almost entirely of Ukrainians. Maybe his life sentence won't last so long.

-4 ( +2 / -6 )

U,if you were a country like the Ukrainlan and ask for certain weapons and did not receive what you wanted, would it make wonder ,if the US government and other countries did not want you too be victorious,you would buy your own weapon, instead of asking them

-7 ( +1 / -8 )

UChosePoorly

Today 09:35 am JST

Blacklabel - I am ok with the two sides holding legal, fair, and transparent trials for war crimes. We have to be consistent.

But is isn't and it will never be and you know that.

We have watched as the media our governments say one thing about Russia then turn a blind eye to the Same by Ukraine.

We read every day what can only be called Ukraine/western propaganda saying what only someone with low mental ability or an agenda could possibly believe,

"Russia is losing" but it is still taking more territory.

"Azovstal evacuation not surrender" but 2500 Ukrainian soldiers surrendered and taken as POWs.

"Ukraine recaptures territory" Right after Russia announced it had pulled back and attacking elsewhere.

"Russia bans opposition, arresting anti war supporters" the west the media and all of us here condem it.

Ukraine arrest opposition politicians, band political parties, arrest suspected Russian supporters under "Marshal law powers" the west stays silent or like some make up excuses and act like Ukraine is special and trustworthy compared to Russia but in reality it is/was as corrupt ( they are #1&#2 in Europe) .

So "legal & fair" in Ukraine or Russia is a joke a sad joke but a joke.

-6 ( +3 / -9 )

AS - I have confidence in the expertise of the international observers of the forthcoming war crimes trials, of which will likely be many, and held by both sides. If the international observers are ok with the fairness and legality of these trials according to the Geneva Conventions, then I will be too.

3 ( +5 / -2 )

Simple challenge for the lynch mob who claim that the charge, trial, and sentence are legitimate.

There have been 4 War Crime courts, covering wars where units get separated and find themselves in hostile territory, trying to avoid detection and rejoin the main force, where units have been dispatched to perform missions behind the frontlines lines that need to avoid detection, and the like.

Now, find a case where one of those courts took up such a charge and found the soldier guilty because they caused a single civilian death to preserve 'occupational security'.

Between Nuremberg, the ICTY, the ICTR, and the ICC, you have the entirety of adjudication of war crimes by independent courts (or at least multinational courts).

If you can't find one, it's for the simple reason that no competent war crimes court thought the charge legitimate for a single death. Slaughtering hundreds would be a War Crime. A single death, well, it's a tragedy of war, not a War Crime in an active war zone when identified members of the warring parties do it for such a purpose.

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

tooheysnew

Today 09:48 am JST

They are supposed to handle war crimes cases, not the countries involved in the war.

This is not a War !

It’s just a “special military operation”, remember ?

Keep to the Putin script*

Please don't,

Putin didn't come up with this idea.

Look at history, the Korean war still isn't a "war" a police action as the USA called it. The UN calls isa Conflict, not even China called it a war, the USA did the same in Iraq, China in Vietnam, etc...

You people give Putin to much credit as if he invented this kind of war or invasion.

-3 ( +3 / -6 )

Richard Pearce - if the ICC (or anyone else, for that matter) takes exception to the legality of this trial, then I am sure you will be the first to let us know.

3 ( +4 / -1 )

AS - I have confidence in the expertise of the international observers of the forthcoming war crimes trials, of which will likely be many, and held by both sides. If the international observers are ok with the fairness and legality of these trials according to the Geneva Conventions, then I will be too.

You mean from the same international community that says Donbas, Abkhazia, and every other Russian region are illegal and cannot declare independence but go ahead and bomb Serbia, then forcibly remove Kosovo declaring it independent!

You mean that "neutral" community.

Seriously!

The same international community that has swallowed the Ukrainian propaganda that the ethnic Russians were brought into Ukraine by the Soviet Union, totally ignoring well over a thousand years of facts including the 9 century Kievan Rus federation ( Rus meaning Russian today Kievan Ukrainian).

You mean trusting that community?

-4 ( +3 / -7 )

AS - do you know of any other international community? Who would you recommend we trust instead? And why?

1 ( +3 / -2 )

The Russian supporters are feeling all kinds of anxiety that the guy who shot a civilian in the head will spend time in jail.

Oh, the humanity!

1 ( +5 / -4 )

Cutting to the chase, the take-away from this homicide committed (under orders or not) by a raw youth is the blatantly obvious far greater war crime of cruel and despicable old men sending the young of Russia to kill and die for NOTHING, but their own worthless vainglory. Let's make it clear for those obtuse souls who close their eyes and ears to the truth: Shishimarin is also a victim of the criminal intent of those who planned this war of aggression. They, not he, should be given the maximum sentence. The Russian popstar, Yuri Shevchuk was arrested after speaking truth to power: Russian and Ukrainian boys are dying like dogs, perishing FOR WHAT? "Motherland" is not the President's zhopa (a common Russian reference to a rear end) that must be kissed and slobbered over, but the beggar grandmother at the station trying to sell her spuds. Yep, you can't fool all of the people all of the time. If there's any justice at all, it's not the likes of Shishimarin, but the real Russian war criminals that deserve the "Nuremberg Noose" in public to put future psychopath leaders on notice.

5 ( +7 / -2 )

legality of these trials according to the Geneva Conventions, then I will be too.

Then this trial was illegal.

You see there is a reason it states ICC.

Under the Geneva convention revision of 1977 and 1979.

No "trials" can be held while hostilities are still going on.

This was specifically included in order to avoid the exact situation we are now entering.

A tit for tat Russia putting Azov battalion on Trial followed by more Russians by Ukraine, filled by More Ukrainians by Russia, etc....

So the trial violates the Geneva convention but is somehow legal under ICC.

Clear as mud.

-2 ( +3 / -5 )

UChosePoorly

Today 10:18 am JST

AS - do you know of any other international community? Who would you recommend we trust instead? And why?

Sadly the west is in for a ride awakening as the power shifts towards other regions less willing to blindly follow.

India has already shown it is not following blindly.

You want more even news check out Indian news services.

-1 ( +4 / -5 )

AS - I am happy to take a look at the source of your claims if you would be so kind as to share a link or something more specific.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

Sadly the west....

AS - that’s all well and good, but not really an answer to my question. Who would you trust as an authority as to whether or not these trials are legal under international law?

0 ( +2 / -2 )

would be nothing to complain about if Russia did 

A man fights his way into a country, without benefit of passport, visa or due immigration process, assists with the wide scale and wonton destruction of life and infrastructure, and on top of that shoots and kills an unarmed civilian in cold blood.

There would surely be no complaint if Russia reacted in the same way as Ukraine in the same circumstances.

How many unarmed Russian civilians in Russia have been killed by rogue Ukrainian soldiers?

The Azovstal fighters were defending their country against invaders. Stuck underground for two months or more, I fail to see what war crimes they can legitimately be accused of.

Not that the moskovites ever seem to be much concerned with legitimacy.

2 ( +5 / -3 )

AS - I am looking through the Amendment Protocols I and II from 1977 and I am just not seeing what you are describing. Odd. Is there a chance that your source for this claim (no trials during wartime) is mistaken?

1 ( +2 / -1 )

Blacklabel - are you able to find anything from appropriate experts who would suggest that this is illegal under international law? I

I see nothing that says it IS legal.

not that it “might not be” illegal.

thats where I always start.

not from biased “experts” but from laws or treaties or agreement. I also look for historical precedent.

-5 ( +2 / -7 )

Blacklabel - I am pretty sure murder is illegal in Ukraine. Did you want me to dig up the specific statute? Or can we agree that murder is illegal in Ukraine?

1 ( +3 / -2 )

Sgt. Vadim Shishimarin, 21, will be back home in Russia drinking tea

I dunno. He might wanna skip the tea. I heard there are some funky additives since the Putin era began.

1 ( +4 / -3 )

It’s not “murder” in this type of situation.

Are you certified to practice law in Ukraine? If not, how could you possibly know this?

2 ( +4 / -2 )

UChosePoorly

Today 10:42 am JST

Keep looking.

But also use logic, in 1949 and 1977 military genelas were part of the revision of the convention and as they are not as stupid as people think, they clearly understood the consequences for their own soldiers held as POWs and they knew politicians don't care about the soldiers.

Just use the following logic ( yes I know logic not something people like) .

From the article:

Mary Ellen O’Connell, an expert on international law at the University of Notre Dame, said that putting Shishimarin on trial could prove “extremely detrimental to Ukrainian soldiers in the hands of Russia.” She said Russia may decide to hold “show trials” of Ukrainians to boost the morale of its own soldiers and spread disinformation.

> “Maybe it would have happened without the Ukrainians beginning trials,” O’Connell said. “But the timing suggests that the Ukrainians should have held back and perhaps still should, so that the Russians can’t say, ‘We’re just doing to their soldiers what they did to ours.’”

It seems this person understands logic.

Remember the basic point of the Geneva convention: You treat our POWs the same way we treat yours.

So you think the generals didn't think about this after the WW2 trials?

It is called logic.

-1 ( +4 / -5 )

I would have preferred to see him tried in The Hague instead of the Ukraine. The trial and judgment are questionable at best and his "confession" make me wonder if it was forced.

0 ( +3 / -3 )

"Russian sentenced to life in Ukraine's 1st war crimes trial"

If all things in our Human World were equal and all combatants who have killed unarmed civilians were prosecuted in this kangaroo court sort of way, and the defense attorneys not looking at a dangerous charge of "Russian sympathies", how many Americans would be jamming prisons in Iraq, Afghanistan, Columbia, Syria, ... all over the world essentially? Only one guy went to prison for a time for massacring an entire village in My Lai, Vietnam. No one was even accused in the recent Afghanistan airport attack that killed an entire family and multiple children, or the U.S. bombing of women and children in Syria who were then described by the U.S. as 'terrorists'. We KNOW, if we read media other than just the 'managed media' of the West, that the Ukes have been summarily killing 'traitors'. And who shall we blame for ANY war when history shows us that war is Humanity's most characteristic and common behavior as groups. The 20th Century was 100 years of continuous war.

And a common side effect of war are the lies such as the bulk of this article which labels the Russians as the 'bad guys' when the azovskyys have been making war upon the eastern provinces and killing civilians for eight years. Why is so much attention for Ukraine being shoved in our faces by craven Western media outlets and SO VERY MUCH MORE AND WORSE in other parts of the world completely ignored? But such questions are "Off-Topic", I'm sure

2 ( +6 / -4 )

Blacklabel - I don’t always agree with the laws or criminal penalties of different countries, but their county, their rules. If you don’t agree with getting hanged for drug trafficking, or flogging for adultery, etc, then don’t go to those countries.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

AS - so nothing in the Geneva Conventions states what you had earlier said it did (no trials during wartime)?

0 ( +2 / -2 )

UChosePoorly

Today 11:13 am JST

AS - so nothing in the Geneva Conventions states what you had earlier said it did (no trials during wartime)?

Again incorrect.

Look up the third convention.

Here is what legal experts that are impartial are pointing out.

This man was paraded before cameras before ever being charged (first violation,) he was "forcibly" interviewed on TV/internet before being charged ( second violation) he was removed as a prisoner of war and charge outside the Geneva convention ( so Ukraine can have it's show trial ( third violation).

The conversation clearly states all prisoners are to be kept safe and under the protection of the convention until the end of hostilities and then repeated as quickly as possible, if war crimes are suspected then those suspects can be retained for trial.

Look it up, this gives the accused and his country a realistic chance to defend themselves.

This was a show trial a blind mole could see this.

-1 ( +4 / -5 )

Blacklabel - I don’t always agree with the laws or criminal penalties of different countries, but their county, their rules

there is no country that I know of where murder IS legal.

yet I have never seen a trial like this, ever. So we will be expecting a murder investigation and trial for every single civilian on both sides that lost their lives?

"murder" is what you come up with when you are looking for loopholes to prove something isnt ILLEGAL.this isnt a a war crime trial that isnt allowed, its a murder trial now!

this is not legal. can you find a loophole to argue its not illegal?

sure, even more so when everyone is making errors/judgment/benefits of the doubt in the favor of Ukraine.

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

AS - I happen to have the Third Geneva Convention open right now. Which Article and Clause are you referring to that prohibits trials during wartime? Be specific!

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

Exactly. blacklabel - this was not a “war crimes” trial. This was a murder trial.

1 ( +3 / -2 )

UChosePoorly

Today 10:35 am JST

Sadly the west....

AS - that’s all well and good, but not really an answer to my question. Who would you trust as an authority as to whether or not these trials are legal under international law?

Let me remind you who is the leader of the present "international community" backing this trial.

The one that has Guantanamo the place where no trials no legal protections and violations are the norm so much so that Canada had to pay $10 million to one Canadian held there and is going to have to do the same for another because it even minorly helped in their being there and not protesting.

This is the leader of the international community baking this trial and sayin it is fair and legal.

-1 ( +3 / -4 )

actually not a murder trial at all.

"Russian sentenced to life in Ukraine's 1st war crimes trial"

-1 ( +3 / -4 )

Blacklabel - The ICC is in Ukraine now and are investigating a whole lot of crimes.

https://www.aljazeera.com/amp/news/2022/5/17/icc-sends-largest-ever-investigative-team-to-war-torn-ukraine

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

Exactly. blacklabel - this was not a “war crimes” trial. This was a murder trial.

So you are admitting that the POW right were violated.

Because under the convention he is a POW.

Ah I get it you subscribe to the USA system, " disarmed enemy combatants" so the convention doesn't apply.

Ok got it.

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

Blacklabel - it looks like the headline does call it a war crimes trial, but the charge and conviction were for murder.

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

AS - he was a PoW until the Ukrainian legal system decided to hold him to account for a criminal act, which is their right.

0 ( +3 / -3 )

he was a PoW until the Ukrainian legal system decided to hold him to account for a criminal act, which is their right.

so Russia can do the same, as their right if a Ukrainian POW did something against Russian law?

Sure, right?

0 ( +4 / -4 )

Blacklabel - murder typically requires intent and malice, which it sounds like they proved in the Ukrainian case. Accidents typically aren’t charged as murder, but could rise to the level of negligent homicide or something similar. That is different than shooting someone on purpose.

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

Blacklabel - Russia is going to do what Russia is going to do. I would argue that they can charge Ukrainians for violating a specific Russian law where Russia has jurisdiction.

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

The reason war crimes are supposed to be triad by independent tribunals is that killing in war is murky grey zone.

Is shooting an enemy soldier while he takes a piss with his rifle lying against a tree a war crime?

How about bombing a bridge while a civilian truck is on it?

This can't be decided fairly during a war hence POWs are supposed to be detained only, with their fate settled after the fighting stops.

1 ( +3 / -2 )

murder typically requires intent and malice, which it sounds like they proved in the Ukrainian case.

Really?!

I guess all those Black men found not guilty especially in the south USA after decades in prison and unfair trials were nothing.

The same in Japan as DNA and Prosecutors violation of rights.

Common we can't even guarantee a fair trial to minorities in non war torn countries, we can't even have fair trials in general of minorities here, USA, Canada, EU but you are telling us that in the middle of a war Ukraine gave a Russian a fair trial the same Ukrainian government that in July 2021 said ethic Russians were not native to the region despite being there as long as the ethics Ukrainians?

Remember this is the country that says Russian Ukrainians are basically outsiders ignoring their own Kievan Russ Federation that was started way back in the 9th century.

This place is to be trusted to put a Russian on trial?!

Face palm!

1 ( +5 / -4 )

this is not legal. can you find a loophole to argue its not illegal?

lol Black, it's on the accuser to prove their point. I mean, if someone claims something is illegal, prove how it's illegal.

If your argument is that this was I dumb move, then I could be persuaded. However, I am unconvinced what Ukraine did is illegal or even morally wrong. Shooting someone in the head, of course, is.

2 ( +4 / -2 )

AS - I agree with you that minorities in the US have suffered a ton of injustice. I am not sure what that has to do with this case, though. If we follow your argument to a logical conclusion then nobody anywhere could ever be put in trial.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

so Russia can do the same, as their right if a Ukrainian POW did something against Russian law?

Absolutely. Putin should concentrate on rounding up all the young Ukrainian conscripts roaming the Moscow suburbs shooting unarmed Russian civilians in the head.

Let him withdraw all his troops to within his own borders, to defend Russia and the Russians from these hordes.

you are telling us that in the middle of a war Ukraine gave a Russian a fair trial

A fairer trial than Mr Shelipov got.

1 ( +5 / -4 )

Sentence much too light. Fascist Russia would not have been so light if the tables were turned - fact.

The coward should have been put up against a wall.

-8 ( +3 / -11 )

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