Student rejects Limbaugh's apology as sponsors flee

“What does that make her? It makes her a slut, right? It makes her a prostitute,” Limbaugh said. “She’s having so much sex she can’t afford the contraception. She wants you and me and the taxpayers to pay her to have sex.”

lol wow...

Limbaugh is a fascist reactionary and this kind of behavior by him is par for the course. Sadly he represents a segment of American society who allow their hatred for anything that does not comply with their world view to be dehumanized and brutalized. Their desire to impose their view on others too often leads to the public abuse of others.

I am tired of hate mongering. The bottom line on this issue is simple. A company providing insurance should provide an equal and fair degree of coverage for standard services including birth control. It should not be subjected to the whim of religious groups.

Religious people should simply refrain from taking advantage of the equal coverage rather than trying to deny others. For a nation claiming separation of church and state, we are far too often imposed upon by religions zealots who, if they wish respect for their faith and religious lives, should equally respect and stay out of our lives.

Yeah, Rush is real contrite. He was bitching about Sandra Fluke today. This isn't like little boy Dominican playpet and Viagra thing. This isn't going away.

For anyone interested in getting Rush off of AFN, here is a link to the contact information for AFN. You're welcome.

http://afrts.dodmedia.osd.mil/contact-info.asp

I contacted my senators and explained that in todays military, with men and women working arm and arm, unit cohesion and respect are tantamount and Rush Limbaugh's words tear that down and have no place on the Armed Forces Network. I explained that military women in their work places should be able to listen to the Armed Forces Network without being offended or degraded. I explained, in short, Rush Limbaugh on AFN is bad for good order and discipline and bad for mission readiness and should be removed from AFN.

One of my senators emailed me back, saying she would look into it.

The Truth Matters. Well done and more power to you!

“What does that make her? It makes her a slut, right? It makes her a prostitute,” Limbaugh said. “She’s having so much sex she can’t afford the contraception. She wants you and me and the taxpayers to pay her to have sex.”

This is the kind of crap that Rush has been doling out for over two decades now.

I'm glad he's on the air because he represents the true face of conservatism in America today. Note how none of the so-called Republican "leaders" expressed any outrage for days over Rush's libel.

The Truth Matters: All members of the Armed Forces should be offended (and degraded) by this women asking them to pay for her birth control while they are in harms way everyday in Iraq and Afganistan.

Mitt Romney is or was Rush Limbaugh's boss by way of Bain's stake in Clear Channel. I wonder how that factoid is going to work its way into the presidential campaign now that Romney is poised to get his party's nomination.

Er, Tatanka, "members of the Armed Forces should be...degraded by this women" is close to indecipherable, and "while they are in harms way everyday" is a wholly different issue. If--as I understand it--one of the things the military is fighting for in Iraq and Afghanistan is a modern democratic society (which obviously includes more access to birth control), then why would American soldiers be upset, offended, or degraded about Americans getting that too?

This thread is already a game of Logic Twister and we aren't even ten comments into it yet.

And who can blame her. I boggles my mind that people are defending what he said. Whatever your thoughts on birth control, he was completely out of line here, and he doesn't sorry at all to me. Sorry that he's losing some pocket money maybe.

Wow. This one has really hurt Rush... though I think it is unlikely to topple him. Not that a few Republicans in high places wouldn't be happy to see Rush go...

Birth control is about more than just sex. For some women, it is a way to control crazy hormore spikes. For others, like me, it helps releive some of the mentstral cramping which can be so severe at time I pass out and vomit (like yesterday). Also, it is a way to properly allow people to plan financially and emotionally to become parents. I am ok if some people don't agree, but I think that people should also be aware of other uses of birth control.

I don't listen to his program very often but I find it hard to empathise with anybody that takes him seriously.

For some women, it is a way to control crazy hormore spikes.

If your doctor determines that a treatment in the form of an oral contraceptive should be a necessary part of your medical regimen they can file a form (I believe its a 'documentation of medical necessity form' or something to that effect) which is almost always accepted by your healthcare provider.

Even if contraceptives were only for the purpose of controlling hormonal or menstruation complications I'd still be against a government mandate on them. I'm against virtually all federal mandates. I would be among one of those included in the 'preexisting conditions' portion of the healthcare act due to my own genetic disorder but I'm opposed to it on philosophical grounds.

Sakurala. Well stated. There are more dimensions to this than sex. Birth control is and should be considered something that takes place between a woman and her doctor. The stoneage flat earthers should not be allowed to interfere with proper medical prescriptions.

Fluke is trying to get all employers to be subject to the same rules. I see nothing wrong with that.

The Republicans and Rush want to push their religious agenda on every person and extract government from every aspect of society.

We need government to establish a base-line of rights. I don't know whether birth-control pills should or should not be a base-line medical necessity. I believe the medical community assumes birth control is a medical necessity. If so, then all employer's health insurance should cover it, and churches and their affiliates should not be exempt.

I personally think birth control provides economic benefits to the U.S. by giving couples more power to have a child on their own terms.

Rush is being very stupid, or is saying this to get more attention. Following on his logic/rant, if a married woman is on birth control, she is also a slut, prostitute, and should make porn for the rest of the public to watch. Really?

The Republican's say they want to stay out of our bedrooms, but every other day they keep trying to intrude.

youtube has many examples of liberal hate speech. bill maher and ed schultz and keith olbermann hate conservative women and hillary clinton too.

Memo to potential employers: Don't hire any lawyer who graduated from Georgetown. They didn't have the time to learn anything.

RR

12 advertisers have abandoned his program. She needs to sue him in court for what he did to her reputation, then donate the money to any cause she chooses. He once said, "Words have meaning." Now it is time for him to learn the meaning of his words.

“Advertisers may appear to leave, but they more often simply move to the sidelines. Sometimes, they even come back.”

"She needs to sue him in court for what he did to her reputation, then donate the money to any cause she chooses."

she can represent herself and charge the judge with sexism when she loses.

youtube has many examples of liberal hate speech. bill maher and ed schultz and keith olbermann hate conservative women and hillary clinton too.

Heh, but leftists will be quick to shriek that those slanderous assaults are examples of free speech.

RR

He's had his right to free speech. Now he is being raked over the coals for it, because it is unacceptable behaviour.

And now rush is beibg clobbered in the two places that matter. His ego and his wallet.

Memo to potential employers: Don't hire any lawyer who graduated from Georgetown. They didn't have the time to learn anything.

You mean like former RNC Chairman Michael Steele? Fox News commentator Greta Van Susteren? Indiana Governor (R) Mitch Daniels?

All readers stay on topic please.

noriyosan73: Donate? That word does not exist in a Democrat's vocabulary -- they want the government (or someone else) to pay for everything.

Heh, looks like the conservatives' favorite racist pinup boy just had a bomb put under him.

Clearly, Limbaugh overstepped the line in every way.

Romney or one of the other Regressive candidates could have scored big by slapping down Limbaugh's comments immediately or soon after they were made.

But no, they waved the yellow flag and surrendered, not wishing to upset the most important conservative spokesperson.

Again, total capitulation from the GOP.

Too funny. :-)

Why don't Fluke's supporters demand her education be paid for as well ?

Romney or one of the other Regressive candidates could have scored big by slapping down Limbaugh's comments immediately or soon after they were made

. Limbaugh has the same right to free speech all Americans do, as much as that revolts totalitarians on the left. It is not Romney's job to answer to entertainers and opinionators.

Using what passes for logic in the world of sushsake3 Obama could slap down Bill Maher (who calls women sluts and tw-ts on his show) by returning the 1 million dollars Maher donated to Obama's increasingly unlikely re-election.

Fair ?

Americans United for Change, a liberal group, challenged Romney to demand that Clear Channel “fire him [ Limbaugh] today… Anything short of that can only be interpreted as a tacit endorsement of Limbaugh’s vile comments.”

When did liberals become so terrified of free speech ? If you don't like Limbaugh just change the station.

I think the PC term Rush should have used for the young "lady" is not "slut" but rather she is horizontally accessable...

Leiberman - "Using what passes for logic in the world of sushsake3 Obama could slap down Bill Maher (who calls women sluts and tw-ts on his show) by returning the 1 million dollars Maher donated to Obama's increasingly unlikely re-election. Fair?"

Ehr...no. The difference between president Obama and Mitt Romney is that the president isn't a joke candidate representing the morally bankrupt extremist ideologies of anti-American, ant-women, anti-freedom conservatives.

Leiberman - " If you don't like Limbaugh just change the station."

Thats fine. I don’t make a habit of listening to gutter-groveling Stone Age vitriolic tripe like that spouted by the Right’s pinup boy Rush.

Thankfully, the only time I usually hear of the guy is when he puts his foot in it, or insults yet another woman/minority/Liberal.

That’s becoming a pretty regular event now, a factoid the Right is no doubt celebrating over.

Still no serious pushback from the GOP candidates.

What a complete and utter embarrassment.

Sen. McCain was about the only one and he’s not even running, then he changed the subject and said, ‘Hey, let’s attack Syria.’

Unlike a fine wine, Sen. McCain doesn’t improve with age, but at least he has the guts to draw the line against Limbaugh, an act it appears next to no other conservatives are man enough to do.

Where are conservatives’ backbones???

"the highest-rated talk show on U.S. radio"

How is this possible?

"The Republicans say they want to stay out of our bedrooms, but every other day they keep trying to intrude"

They do not.

Limbaugh took a cue from Archie Bunker in "All in the Family" -- a 1970s TV situation comedy about an intolerant misogynist that wasn't really funny -- and turned it into political and social commentary on which listeners hang on to every word. Americans have heaped huge wealth on a bigot who's neither entertaining nor insightful, and gutless conservative politicians appear terrified of bringing down his wrath. Something has to be very wrong with a country that could take a buffoon like Limbaugh seriously.

Ehr...no. The difference between president Obama and Mitt Romney is that the president isn't a joke candidate representing the morally bankrupt extremist ideologies of anti-American, ant-women, anti-freedom conservatives

Bill Maher makes crude misogynistic "jokes" about Obama's own Sec of State, Hillary Clinton, wife of the Democrat Party's most poweful ex president. Obama still takes his 1 million cash donation. Who is the one here without principles ? Who is "anti-women"? Freedom? Dont make me laugh. ObamaCare is now opposed by 72 percent of the electorate.

"When did liberals become so terrified of free speech ?"

What nonesense, the left like to talk a lot you know.

Heh, it's not free speech the issue, it's obscene speech, and even hate speech people are shwing their disgust for.

That's why advertisers are "fleeing" limbaugh shriek-station.

And to think you were Denying defending this toad Mr Liebersman.

"'They do not."

You might wanna check your boy Santorum and his sodomite obsession. Though Rush is in no danger of transgressing Rick's paranoia, well unless he can man up and get a viagra prescription from the Doc instead of buying illegal drugs as he has in the past.

Has anyone actually figured out-

Why she was initially described as a 23 year-old student

And why the Pill can allegedly cost $3,000 ? Walmart has $4 prescription options for the pill.....

That's why advertisers are "fleeing" limbaugh shriek-station.

whaddya know, the free market system Obama pod people constantly deride has bitten the arse of one of its own staunchest proponents. Good. I hope lefties like Bill Maher ( who apparently thinks being on cable means he is not of the market system and "above" anything as grubby as the profit motive) are man enough to admit they are no better than limbaugh. Beyond that I must say Limbaughs audience is just too massive to ever be lost. He has Irish Kiwi and Birtish undies in a real twist here.

Has anyone actually figured out- Why she was initially described as a 23 year-old student

The reporters must have looked her up on Wikipedia.

And why the Pill can allegedly cost $3,000 ? Walmart has $4 prescription options for the pill.....

That's right -- that's what it cost. But you left off the amount skimmed by the insurance companies and hospitals for adminstrative paperwork and pension funds.

Obama, Maher, Clinton, Irish, British.....little green men!

Heh, anything but face the Reality of the hate speech your angry old white man hero is rightly getting shoved into the spotlight for.

Here's a tissue. There's worse to come in November.

Oh, I forgot to mzntion you're not defending him. Heh. It's too much. Fzzzzt.

Student rejects Limbaugh's apology as sponsors flee

Clever. That'll convince the 99 percent who never get anywhere near a 60thou/yr Ivy league school that she chose Catholic Georgetown because it reflected her values of tolerance, not to mention forgiveness.

Some info from Wikipedia –

"Rush Hudson Limbaugh III was born in Cape Girardeau, Missouri,"

Ah-hah, that’s where things started going downhill…

"His family has many lawyers, including his grandfather, father and brother David."

Lawyers? Isn’t that profession Liberal-only??

Limbaugh was not drafted during the Vietnam War draft lottery, as his birth date's high rank (152) was well above the 125 rank below which service members were drafted. He was classified as "1-Y" (later reclassified "4-F") due to a Pilonidal cyst”

That explains even more;.

“After dropping out of college, Limbaugh moved..”

A college dropout? No wonder so many conservatives see themselves in Rush.

[2000] “Limbaugh had publicized personal difficulties in the 2000s (decade). In late 2001, he acknowledged that he had gone almost completely deaf, although he continued his show. He was able to regain much of his hearing with the help of cochlear implants.”

Deaf? In more ways than one, it seems.

“In 2003, Limbaugh had a brief stint as a pro football commentator with ESPN. He resigned a few weeks into the 2003 NFL season after making comments about the press coverage for quarterback Donovan McNabb that caused controversy and accusations of racism on the part of Limbaugh.”

Rush making racist comments? No way!

“In April 2006, Limbaugh turned himself in and was arrested "on a single charge of prescription fraud".”

It gets even more depressing......

And why the Pill can allegedly cost $3,000 ? Walmart has $4 prescription options for the pill.....

walmart is where the little people shop. She can't be expected to stoop to their level.

"Big Pharma" - the same eeeevil corporations the left constantly rail against - have the last laugh, and it is on Obama supporters still in denial about the deal their hero cut with them.

"Who wins the Rush/Fluke squabble? Big Pharma, of course...and they're no longer evil since they're backing the politically-correct horse this time (thedailybeast.com)"

I'm impressed. The far left Daily Kos actually has a hard time also with this since one of their favorites on "The Left" Bill Maher has been insulting Conservative women for years. GOOD ON THEM....

If we don't call out Bill we are hypocrites for demanding that the right call out Rush. That is just a fact. We have NO moral high ground if we rationalize away our responsibility to clean our own house. We only have ANY moral high ground because so many of us already called out Bill for this when it happened. But we didn't demand that our party leaders (who frequent Bill's show) call out Bill for this. We are TOTALLY right to condemn Rush and defend Sandra, but we are hypocrites for demanding that the right call out Rush until we do the same with Bill.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/03/06/1071551/-The-difference-between-Rush-Limbaugh-and-Bill-Maher-?via=recent

Lieberman - "walmart is where the little people shop. She can't be expected to stoop to their level."

Heh, very condescending.

You've got to wonder why almost every time conservatives open their mouths, more voters decide to vote for president Obama and the Dems.

Never has so much been done by so many for their opponents as today's conservatives are doing for the Democrats. :-)

Great post, sail. I am surprised but encouraged to see that on a site like Kos.

Sailwind - "If we don't call out Bill we are hypocrites for demanding that the right call out Rush. That is just a fact. We have NO moral high ground if we rationalize away our responsibility to clean our own house. We only have ANY moral high ground because so many of us already called out Bill for this when it happened. But we didn't demand that our party leaders (who frequent Bill's show) call out Bill for this. We are TOTALLY right to condemn Rush and defend Sandra, but we are hypocrites for demanding that the right call out Rush until we do the same with Bill."

....um..yeah. I had to read that 3-4 times to get my head around it but I think I'm hearing what you're saying.

So if the Right call out Rush but defend Sandra while calling out Bill and attacking ObamaCare then they're not really conservatives but more closet Liberals? Based on that, I'd say the moral high ground basically crumbles unless Liberals call out Bill AND Rush.

Is that about what you're saying?. :-)

“At AOL, one of our core values is that we act with integrity,”

AOL, Rush, and others woke up one fine morning last week, had an epiphany, and discovered intergrity? I don't think so. If these sponsors had any integrity, they would not have supported the right's rabies-ridden attack dog Rush in the first place. But the guy gets ratings, so they went for the money.

Rush's phoney apology is not accepted. AOL's bid to try to get the dirt off is not accepted.

Lieberman – “Beyond that I must say Limbaughs audience is just too massive to ever be lost.”

Rush Limbaugh is a racist, thick-skulled, primordial slime-slurping, anti-women bigot.

And he has a huge fan base among American conservatives.

Really, that’s the truly scary thing.

**CHECK**LIST

Get GOP candidates talking about anything but the most important election issue - the economy. CHECK

Put out an issue involving religion and conservatives, and if possible, get a major Christian denomination involved. CHECK

Engineer the result so the GOP and conservatives appear to be against a major voting group, hey, why not women. CHECK

BONUS POINTS

Wind in a Right wing entertainer or talkshow host. CHECK

Make it Rush Limbaugh. CHECK

Get Rush Limbaugh to do a humiliating climbdown. CHECK!

ONLY IF WE'RE REALLY LUCKY BONUS POINTS

Get Rush Limbaugh to lose advertisers. CHECK!

Have to say it - Obama & co's strategy worked a treat. :-)

Obama & co's strategy worked a treat.

So the strategy you avdocate is one in which no actual diolog occurs, to cripple the chance of a reasonable debate, and leave people with no say in how your party governs by obfuscating the issues. Yeah, that sounds great, like a page straight out of Putin's play book.

I think that lovely list highlights exactly what is wrong with the two part system in the U.S and how it prevents us from getting anything done. By your standards it is perfectly permissable for the party you support to use underhanded tactics to undermine a national debate so long as it benefits your cause. By mine it should be unacceptable for either party to do so.

Your solution to a divided political landscape is to make it even more vitrolic and I find that flawed.

"So the strategy you avdocate is one in which no actual diolog occurs, to cripple the chance of a reasonable debate, and leave people with no say in how your party governs by obfuscating the issues."

That is sushi's dialogue, not team Obama's.

The Repubs tried to stiffle this woman in a similar manner by blocking her from speaking. Then a screaming radio jock put his foot in it, made some obscene comments, and radical conservatives are defending this kind of behaviour.

There's no more to it, but the fact is these angry wingers are doing more to get Obama re-elected than anyone. The irony of it all!

Why does the American public have to support someone on welfare or pay for someones birth control? These people think they are entitled to these things from the public when they are entitled to nothing. How about a woman that is responsible for her own children and her own actions? If she wants to have recreational sex she should find a way to make a lot of money so she can keep on having it and if she has a kid she can't support... too bad for her.

Why does the American public have to support someone on welfare or pay for someones birth control? These people think they are entitled to these things from the public when they are entitled to nothing. How about a woman that is responsible for her own children and her own actions? If she wants to have recreational sex she should find a way to make a lot of money so she can keep on having it and if she has a kid she can't support... too bad for her.

Because health care is a human right. This is the kind of repulsive selfish attitude that the rest of the developed world looks on in horror at. And because of your viewpoint being government policy, tens of thousands will die in the world's richest country this year.

oginomeMar. 07, 2012 - 06:40AM JST. Because health care is a human right. This is the kind of repulsive selfish attitude that the rest of the developed world looks on in horror at. And because of your viewpoint being government policy, tens of thousands will die in the world's richest country this year.

Because health care is a human right? Will we be debating if taxpayers should pay for new sneakers for all students that are interested in running to keep phyically fit and to keep our health care down? What happened to personal responsibility and accountability? Where do we draw the line? If this is accepted as the norm, what will follow? I don't think it is a topic that should reach a Presidential level. It is absolutely absurd that during these very serious political times, we are discussing personal sexual recreational activities before members of Congress.

Because health care is a human right? Will we be debating if taxpayers should pay for new sneakers for all students that are interested in running to keep phyically fit and to keep our health care down? What happened to personal responsibility and accountability? Where do we draw the line? If this is accepted as the norm, what will follow? I don't think it is a topic that should reach a Presidential level. It is absolutely absurd that during these very serious political times, we are discussing personal sexual recreational activities before members of Congress.

Yes, health care is a human right. The taxes are paid so ALL members of society, productive and non-productive, even the misfits, receive the right to a basic level of health care that is the norm in every other developed nation. So that tens of thousands don't die every year. The comparison with students running to keep physically fit and who need new sneakers is pointless. No, we are not talking about 'sexual recreational activity' but a medication whose prescription as a contraceptive is only one use, being denied to someone.

The Truth Matters: spoken like a true liberal. You have to be shown everything, since you cannot be bothered to look it up yourself. "If its not placed right in front of me, it never happened" is no way to go through life...

oginomeMar. 07, 2012 - 07:46AM JST. Yes, health care is a human right. The taxes are paid so ALL members of society, productive and non-productive, even the misfits, receive the right to a basic level of health care that is the norm in every other developed nation.

If that is the case, why do U.S. have close to 50 million people who do not have health insurance? Who is actually paying for these people when they are sick? Is this substainable for U.S. ?

If that is the case, why do U.S. have close to 50 million people who do not have health insurance? Who is actually paying for these people when they are sick? Is this substainable for U.S. ?

I don't think you understood my post, I was talking about paying taxes in countries which have universal health care and what the taxes are used for. As you know yourself, America has some of the lowest taxes in the world and no universal health care, which is why 50 million are uninsured, a shocking number for such a rich country.

oginome Mar. 07, 2012 - 08:29AM JST. I don't think you understood my post, I was talking about paying taxes in countries which have universal health care and what the taxes are used for. ginome Mar. 07, 2012 - 07:46AM JSTYes, health care is a human right. The taxes are paid so ALL members of society, productive and non-productive, even the misfits, receive the right to a basic level of health care that is the norm in every other developed nation. So that tens of thousands don't die every year.

Then tell me about Canada. Canada has universal health care. The healthcare costs are progressively being pushed to levels that cannot be sustained, and possiblity of reforms that involve more privatized delivery of services and options for people to pay for their own care. The sustainability concerns are real. Spending on healthcare in Canada continues to outpace growth in government program spending and economic growth. The provincial government spending on healthcare will consume more than half of total revenues from all sources in majority of Provinces by the year 2020. These trends leave the provinces with three immediate options: increase revenue, most likely through a variety of tax schemes, including higher rates to pay for the increasing cost of healthcare and reduce spending on education, social services, income support or roads and other physical infrastructure.

Fluke is right to an extent about the shallow nature of the apology and the fleeing of sponsors; the latter will probably slink back when this firestorm is over. Fortunately, Limbaugh has really stepped in it this time and the conservatives, in not doing more than simply 'distancing themselves' (I'm willing to bet at least Santorum agrees with Limbaugh) are going to have to face the music for his comments.

I wonder if OxyContin is still with Rush?

Then tell me about Canada. Canada has universal health care. The healthcare costs are progressively being pushed to levels that cannot be sustained, and possiblity of reforms that involve more privatized delivery of services and options for people to pay for their own care. The sustainability concerns are real. Spending on healthcare in Canada continues to outpace growth in government program spending and economic growth. The provincial government spending on healthcare will consume more than half of total revenues from all sources in majority of Provinces by the year 2020. These trends leave the provinces with three immediate options: increase revenue, most likely through a variety of tax schemes, including higher rates to pay for the increasing cost of healthcare and reduce spending on education, social services, income support or roads and other physical infrastructure.

The problems in Canada are related to the shrinkage of the work force which is going to occur over the next 20 years, it doesn't mean that universal health care just suddenly reaches a stage where it becomes 'unsustainable' and then that country suddenly switches to privatisation. The birth rate amongst USA's native born population is below sustainabilty levels, it's the massive number of immigrants that come into the country every year with their higher birth rates which causes the population to grow. As it stands, Canada's universal health care still costs less than America's privatised system does. If Canada had America's health care system, then costs would have gone through the roof even more then they already have. America's privatised health 'care' system before Obama's election was the most expensive in the world and still costing more and more every year, reaching real levels of unsustainability. Canada will keep its universal health care system, because it sees that America's own privatised system is even more costly. The sustainability fears don't get allevaiated, but instead exacerabed by the concept of privatisation. You don't seem to understand that countries outside 'The Land Of The Free' recognise health care as a human right and even if they run into problems, won't consider privatisation. People dying because they can't afford health care is considered barbaric by the civilised world.

oginomeMar. 07, 2012 - 09:36AM JST. You don't seem to understand that countries outside 'The Land Of The Free' recognise health care as a human right and even if they run into problems, won't consider privatisation. People dying because they can't afford health care is considered barbaric by the civilised world.

There are several reasons why health care should not be considered a human right. Health care is difficult to define. It clearly encompasses preventive care, public health measures, health promotion, and medical and surgical treatment of established illness. Is the so called human right to health care a right to basic provision of clean water and adequate food, or does everyone in the world have a right to organ transplant, cosmetic surgery, infertility treatment, and the most expensive medicine? For something to count as a human right the minimum requirement should surely be that the right in question is capable of definition.

The philosophical basis of all human rights has always been shaky. Most people can see some advantage in maintaining the concept of civil and political rights, but it is difficult to find any rational or utilitarian basis for viewing health care in the same way. To propose that health care be considered a human right is not only wrong headed, it is unhelpful. I suspect that the proponents of the notion think that to claim health care as a human right adds some kind of weight or authority to the idea that health care, and by extension healthcare professionals, is important. A more humble approach would achieve more in the long run.

There are several reasons why health care should not be considered a human right. Health care is difficult to define. It clearly encompasses preventive care, public health measures, health promotion, and medical and surgical treatment of established illness. Is the so called human right to health care a right to basic provision of clean water and adequate food, or does everyone in the world have a right to organ transplant, cosmetic surgery, infertility treatment, and the most expensive medicine? For something to count as a human right the minimum requirement should surely be that the right in question is capable of definition.

The philosophical basis of all human rights has always been shaky. Most people can see some advantage in maintaining the concept of civil and political rights, but it is difficult to find any rational or utilitarian basis for viewing health care in the same way. To propose that health care be considered a human right is not only wrong headed, it is unhelpful. I suspect that the proponents of the notion think that to claim health care as a human right adds some kind of weight or authority to the idea that health care, and by extension healthcare professionals, is important. A more humble approach would achieve more in the long run.

But this 'humble' (minimising) approach to human rights isn't working. America's privatised health care system costs twice the OECD average and leads to the deaths of tens of thousands every year, a disgrace for the world's richest country. It's funny you say how 'health care is difficult to define' when the rest of the developed world outside America has come to define and approach it in a remarkably similar way. The 'minimal level of health care' is providing treatment to people who need it. And 'the philosophical basis of human rights is shaky', sorry but it looks like you're minimising things again. Human rights are prerry clear cut. As you know, Americans love to wax about their 'right to bear arms', not to mention all the Republicans who throw fits because they say the Democrats are 'stealing their rights'. If we go by what you're saying, that human rights rest on shaky foundations and therefore imply that they're not valid, then these other rights which are argued over are rendered null and void. We both know this is ridiculous. America is a country based on people asserting their rights, it's the height of hypocrisy to basically enshrine the right to gun ownership while ignoring the right to health care. Ignoring one right while slavishly promoting the other leads to the collective deaths of over 50,000 people each year. Oh dear.

That is sushi's dialogue, not team Obama's.

Oh I know. I've stated before that I feel that Obama has good intentions but that his method is, in my opinion, flawed. My post was pointed more towards those that would deliberatly manipulate policy to drive the wedge even further between the parties in a misguided hope that it will drive the other off the edge.

But you left off the amount skimmed by the insurance companies and hospitals for adminstrative paperwork and pension funds.

Planned Parenthood gives out the pill for free.

Anything to back up the $3000 figure? If you go to Walmart and pick up a $4 pill prescription every month, where are you telling me the patient pays all that extra money?

She told the Washington Post that she chose Georgetown knowing specifically that the school did not cover drugs that run contrary to Catholic teaching in its student health plans. During her law school years she was a president of "Students for Reproductive Justice" and made it her mission to get the school to give up one of the last remnants of its Catholicism. Ms. Fluke is not the "everywoman" portrayed in the media.

She's 30, btw, an activist, not a poor student who can't afford the Pill.

Why is it ok for liberals to lie and misrepresent themselves?

Nothing to say?

Bill Maher is now defending Limbaugh.

Looks like those threats of boycott and hitting em in the pocketbook cut both ways.

"Bill Maher is now defending Limbaugh."

Well you birds of a feather......

Limbaugh apologized for using inappropriate words to refer to that perpetual student who thinks expensive birth control methods should be made available to her courtesy of taxpayers.

I want Obama to apologize for bankrupting the country.

Limbaugh apologized for using inappropriate words to refer to that perpetual student

That's wasn't an apology, not even close.

who thinks expensive birth control methods should be made available to her courtesy of taxpayers.

Obviously you don't understand what Sandra Fluke's testimony was about any better than Rush Limbaugh did.

I want Obama to apologize for bankrupting the country.

The country isn't bankrupt. I want Republican voters to apologize for the disastrous last presidency that got us where we are now but that's off topic here too..

"That wasn't an apology."

Of course it was.

"Obviously you don't understand what Sandra Fluke's testimony was about"

Please tell us what it was about.

"The country isn't bankrupt."

Whew! That's a relief!

"the disastrous last presidency that got us where we are now"

That would be the current disastrous presidency that got us where we are now.

I want Obama to apologize for bankrupting the country.

Obama bankrupted the country? That's weird, I was pretty sure America fell into economic collapse while good old Dubya was still at the helm. 2008, wasn't it? Before your hated Obama came into office (end of 2008).

Americans United for Change, a liberal group, challenged Romney to demand that Clear Channel "Fire him today... Anything short of that can only be interpreted as a tacit endorsement of Limbaugh's vile comments."

Typical Liberal dolts: Freedom of Speech, their way.

Ms Fluke is looking for something and it is obviously not sex........

Of course it was.

Nonsense. Agree to seriously disagree.

Please tell us what it was about.

Did you watch or read her testimony? It's readily available. You can find it yourself and read. Try finding the part where Sandra Fluke says taxpayers have to foot the bill. If still confused you can come back and ask.

Note how none of the so-called Republican "leaders" expressed any outrage for days over Rush's libel.

How much of a fuss did the Democratic "leaders" make about Maher calling Sarah Palin a c**t, or Dave Letterman's antics- "Talk show host David Letterman says he was “guilty of poor taste” after causing a stir with some sexually suggestive jokes about one of Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin’s teenage daughters, admitting he confused 18-year-old intended target Bristol Palin with her 14-year-old sister, Willow. " Oh, so he got the wrong sister and that makes it ok...

Not a Palin fan, but my point is that Maher and Letterman are still on the air, still have their sponsors, and we didn't see nearly the stink about their comments. It seems that if a liberal pulls something like this, it's all a big joke, and if you don't agree, you're a stick in the mud. Quite different from when a conservative is attacked. Conservatives are fair game. Did Obama call Palin and 'offer support' when she was called a c**t? 'Liberal' my behind.....it's the Democrats who are leading the charge to shut people up and get them off the air when they disagree with liberal tenets. Show me a huge Republican campaign to get Letterman or Maher off the air...

How much of a fuss did the Democratic "leaders" make about Maher calling Sarah Palin a c**t, or Dave Letterman's antics-

It's a stupid and pointless comparison. The Republican Congress in 1995 made Limbaugh an "honorary member," widely acknowledging his powerful influence on conservative voters. Has any Democrat bestowed or even suggested bestowing any such mantle on Maher or Letterman?

More than one GOP Congressperson has had to bow and scrape before Limbaugh -- the way a stray priest might have to bow before a cardinal -- when they've run afoul of him. (Example: Phil Gingrey (GA) in Jan 2009 publicly begging the drug-addled Rush's forgiveness for speaking off the page.) Got any examples of any Democratic representatives prostrating themselves before Maher or Letterman? (That's right; you can't come up with even one, can you?)

but my point is that Maher and Letterman are still on the air, still have their sponsors

Your point is false as it regards Maher. He has no sponsors. HBO carries his show commercial-free. That means he's perfectly free to call Palin whatever he genuinely thinks of her. Of course, this is where the comparison of Rush to Maher really gets stupid. Palin is a powerful public figure well able to defend herself. Who did the almighty Rush choose to pick on? Some unknown young woman called to give her views before Congress.

Did Obama call Palin and 'offer support' when she was called a c**t?

Sorry, not going to join you in that mental gutter.

It's a stupid and pointless comparison. The Republican Congress in 1995 made Limbaugh an "honorary member," widely acknowledging his powerful influence on conservative voters. Has any Democrat bestowed or even suggested bestowing any such mantle on Maher or Letterman?

Its an apt and appropriate comparison. Maher and Letterman are both extreme left wing nuts, and Rush is a right wing zealot. The difference in how they are treated is both obvious and offensive, and is what makes the comparison appropriate.

Got any examples of any Democratic representatives prostrating themselves before Maher or Letterman?

Ever watch either's show? They both frequently have politicians on. Obama has been on Letterman for example. Now did they bow and grovel, no. Actually, I take that back, Obama probably did, he bows to everyone these days.

It's a stupid and pointless comparison.

No, it isn't. The left gets to savage people using filthy language and nobody pulls out their sponsorship, do they? Limbaugh used two bad words (and I don't condone it), was attacked all over the media, and lost 21 sponsors. After he apologized.

About the Sarah Palin slurs-

"Jackson Lee, Schakowsky remain silent on Maher, showing they approve of the foul language he used against Palin.

Do female Democrats in Congress approve of Bill Maher's insult of Sarah Palin?

In a video by Frank Stategies that was posted at a number of conservative sites Wednesday, Democratic Representatives Sheila Jackson Lee and Jan Schakowsky refused to condemn remarks Bill Maher made about former Governor Sarah Palin - insults that were far worse than anything Limbaugh has ever said.

The citizen journalist in the video first confronted Jackson Lee, but the Texas Democrat ignored the question.

"Congresswoman, quick question. I know you’ve been outspoken about Rush Limbaugh; in light of Bill Maher’s comments that Sarah Palin is a “ct” and “dumb tt,” are you going to call on Obama’s Super PAC to return the million dollars they got from Bill Maher? And if not, why not?"

Jackson Lee continued walking, ignoring the question.

He asked: "Why are you refusing to condemn that remark, ma’am? Do you find that okay? That discourse?"

He continued as Jackson Lee ignored him: "Congresswoman, quick question. I know you’ve put out a statement about Rush Limbaugh, condemning his remarks, understandably. Have you put out a similar statement calling on the president’s Super PAC to return the $1 million that he got from Bill Maher? Why not? Is that an acceptable thing to call a woman?"

Schakowsky actually spoke to the reporter, but never answered his questions, eventually saying that she had "no comment.""

We are discussing liberal slurs against Republicans, I am saying that Maher is as or more foul-mouthed than Limbaugh, and your best comeback is 'he has no sponsors, so he can say what he wants?' Whether you have sponsors or not determines whether or not the First Amendment applies to you!?

Palin is a public figure so it's ok to call her a ct and a tt? That's an illogical line of reasoning, that all public figures should just live with having a target on their backs? As for Sandra Fluke,she must be somebody, for the President of the United States to call her personally to "offer support" after Limbaugh's insults. Ct and tt aren't exactly sweet nothings...

That 'mental gutter' is evidently where Maher lives, with the comments he makes. Those weren't my comments against Palin, but his. If you feel so strongly about them, denounce him!

BTW, Limbaugh was made an honorary member of the 'freshmen class' of Congress, a group of 73 Republicans, not a member of Congress. There is no such thing as an 'honorary member of Congress', the post does not exist. I find it interesting that 18 years have gone by and it still ticks you off!

Oh, so he got the wrong sister and that makes it ok...

Yeah, it does. It was an easy mistake to make. I was sure he was talking about Bristol Palin at the time for what should be painfully obvious reasons, reasons that would have made what he said comedic. (Letterman does comedy you know?) But he apologized anyway.

But you can't tell me that Limbaugh said "slut" but meant to say "liberated woman".

Molenir et al.: "Its an apt and appropriate comparison. Maher and Letterman are both extreme left wing nuts, and Rush is a right wing zealot."

It's amusing how you take yabits' VERY valid point about the non-sequiturs and red herrings you guys throw out and PROVE he's correct through syllogism. You never even bothered to answer his questions but instead tried to bend them to defend your comparisons (then of course you undermined your comment completely with the 'I take that back Obama may have prostrated himself...' etc.).

How do you guys put the nail in your own coffins when you're inside like that?

Bill Maher made about former Governor Sarah Palin - insults that were far worse than anything Limbaugh has ever said.

Again, that is totally false and just plain dumb. What Limbaugh said was far worse.

Maher's words were vulgar descriptions of a part of the female anatomy. "Slut" and "prostitute" are descriptions that impugn a woman's character.

I don't know whether it's out of dumbness or dishonesty that you ignore the important fact that Maher expressed his comments about a well-known and powerful public figure while Limbaugh chose to attack the very character of an ordinary, unknown young woman. No, what Rush did is far, far worse and what right-wing idiots try to do is continue to bring up Maher's vulgarities in an attempt to shield their beloved conservative icon.

As for Palin, she asserted to a national audience that the only difference between her and a dog of a particular breed was lipstick. Now, nearly everyone knows the technical term for a female canine. (I do think Maher called it right on that woman.)

Got any examples of any Democratic representatives prostrating themselves before Maher or Letterman?

Its the other way around. Just google NBC Brian Williams bowing to Obama.Or Chrissy Mathews telling viewers he believes it is "his duty" to help this president (Obama). Maher gave a million dollars to Obama's reelecttion campaign.

As for Palin, she asserted to a national audience that the only difference between her and a dog of a particular breed was lipstick. Now, nearly everyone knows the technical term for a female canine. (I do think Maher called it right on that woman.)

Obama compared himself to a mongrel. Do you really want to go there????

Your point is false as it regards Maher. He has no sponsors. HBO carries his show commercial-free. That means he's perfectly free to call Palin whatever he genuinely thinks of her.

But people are hitting HBO. Why else would Maher be publicly defending Limbaugh, who he would rather see off the air and six feet deep?

Obama compared himself to a mongrel. Do you really want to go there????

You bet I do. Please continue.

That won't be necessary.

Why else would Maher be publicly defending Limbaugh, who he would rather see off the air and six feet deep?

Principle. Something you obviously know little about to have called it so wrong.

Limbaugh has the last laugh. This too has blown up in the face of the ideologues who have taken the democrat parrty over the cliff.

But you're still not defending limbaugh, right Liebersbud?

That's some hero y'all have there.

I bet Limbaugh's talk radio show will still be the #1 talk radio show a year from now.

I like how they worked Bain Capital and Mitt Romney into the discussion...

I bet Limbaugh's talk radio show will still be the #1 talk radio show a year from now.

You will probably win the bet. But I question whether a hate speech show should be categorized under the title of "talk show".

Headline needs rewriting. Some of The Limbaugher's former sponsors are apparently trying to come back and he is, based on his listeners' reactions, telling em get lost.

"But you're still not defending limbaugh, right Liebersbud? That's some hero y'all have there."

I cant defend a shock jock I dont listen to. I am in Japan.

"Y'all" ?

"a hate speech show"

Heh, that would be the "Palin movie Game Change Premieres in the U.S." thread.

Since the women rejected his apology Limbaugh should retract it. It is odd that she does not want him to apologize for such an inflammatory comment. It could be that she really is a slut and doesn't want people to think otherwise.

Limbaugh never apologized for humiliating her publicly. He only apologized for using certain words when publicly humiliating her. She doesn't need to accept something that is not there.

Many people fall for a ruse like that.

Really wish that FEN Eagle 810 am radio from the Yokosuka base would pull this man off their air. Embarrassing to broadcast that idiot to Japan. Does he really "represent" the best face we could put forward?

yabits, no response to the news story I posted? I thought not. Typical liberal tap-dance, I'm not surprised. I brought up the fact that those in the liberal media have equally foul mouths, and you keep making it about whether the person targeted was a public figure or not...is it dumbness or dishonesty?

No, what Rush did is far, far worse and what right-wing idiots try to do is continue to bring up Maher's vulgarities in an attempt to shield their beloved conservative icon.

I've never listened to Limbaugh in my life....it's just that the press reaction is entirely different when it's a liberal putting their foot in it. The man is no icon of mine. It strikes me as childishly self-centered and ethically suspect that Maher can call Palin a cnt and a twt and get away with it. Do you remember all the posters here trashing Bush for his entire term? Oh, but let a Dem get in the White House and no question of the President is allowed....it's not that people think he isn't doing his job, they're racist! Liberals are basically little kids. Naive world view, everything is 'because we said so'*, and personal accountability is not required.

*Like your two dodges on this issue. Can't ever admit that Maher is foul-mouthed so the defense is

He's referring to female body parts so it's not name calling (eh? those words are not part of public discourse in any polite circles I frequent, your mileage may vary..) Sarah Palin is a public figure and so she just has to just suck it up....it's different than a private citizen being called names.

This passes for logic?