New Zealand’s largest city to remain locked down

Couldn't agree with you more SimondB. Stay home and stay safe 6 weeks, 6 months or 6 years.

Ridiculous thinking. There is more to living than trying to avoid death. It is reasonable to ask an entire population to waste years of their lives to save just a few? Thankfully the majority of countries have realized that it isn't, and there is no choice but to live with the virus.

SimondBToday  03:09 pm JST

NZ 20 cases a day, UK 25,000 a day, US touching on around (or approaching )100,000 a day. Who got it right? And although the Doomsayers won't like this, the lockdown is supported by the vast majority of the population. No-one feels their freedom is being taken away or they are living in a dictatorship, they feel that collectively they are doing the right thing for all concerned. And it will further upset some, and shock others, you can trust your government to do the right thing if it is done right. And that is what is happening in NZ. Just 27 deaths since Covid broke out. How's it going where you are?

Stockholm syndrome.

"Just another couple of weeks should do it..."

"We are so worried about your health that we are going to punish you mentally, physically and financially to protect it!"

When will you people get it though your heads that the fatality rate isn’t the serious issue? It’s the finite number of hospital beds that’s the serious issue.

Do you also blame governments for failing to take the threat seriously and not increasing the number of hospital beds and healthcare resources? Given that we're over a year and half into the worst pandemic in our lifetimes, what are they waiting for? If they were serious about being prepared for the worst case scenario, we would be swimming in empty hospital beds by now.

"COVID 0" is a failed policy.

25,000 applied for 3,000 quarantine rooms today. All were gone within the hour.

People can't go home ,leave , visit dying relatives , take up jobs etc etc.

New Zealand talks about " being kind" etc but is a brutally uncaring government

Why are so many impressed with New Zealand? With their tiny population and closed borders how can it even be compared to the US, UK or Japan? They have done a useless job when they could have procured vaccines much earlier in the year and have had the whole country jabbed by now. With that protection in place they would have been able to keep the medical services protected.

Useless Government, should resign now and call a new Election.

NZ and Australia. Guinea pigs for how much oppression Western "democracies" will tolerate.

I don't understand it.

NZ declared victory once and for all against corona 7 times.

Doesn't corona get it? Its been defeated!!

This has been disastrous for NZ. The economy has been wrecked and despite our naturally small, isolated islands managing to delay the inevitable the endemic nature of the virus means this has been nothing more than an expensive exercise in futility. Ardern must be called to account for her incompetence.

When you ask a government to decide the level of risk living your life instead of you doing it.

Yeah they will do this for the next 3 months and then the first inbound airplane, here is is again.

Didnt you see, they thought they had it locked down, until an infected prisoner was sent home. then there it was again.

COVID is never going away, it will just become another version of "the flu" at some point in the next 2-3 years.

Even at the peak of the last wave, Japan has a infection rate low compared to western countries where most restrictions are down. But here in Japan, with this low rate :

no way to drink alcohol in restaurants

no way to eat after 8pm in restaurants

14 day quarantine when coming back from overseas even with fully vaccination and 2 negative PCR tests (one before boarding, one after arriving)

And speaking of democracy, I do not think it's a word valid here seeing how political world is.

If lckdowns work how does a prisoner catch covid?

Bungle, Sweden got it right. Let 'er rip and build natural immunity, which is the best immunity.

Therapeutics are highly effective tools, too.

But relying exclusively on vaccines for all to get you zero COVID cases ensures Australia and NZ will be in this pandemic for many years to come.

Reckless

Well said JFX. Staying home and not traveling for a few years is a small price to pay to overcome this pandemic.

So from "2 weeks to flatten the curve" we now gone to "a few years" to "overcome this pandemic". Talk about changing goalposts!

Ridiculous thinking. There is more to living than trying to avoid death. It is reasonable to ask an entire population to waste years of their lives to save just a few? 

For those politicizing the virus to assert control over those they consider inferior to themselves- yes, losing years of other people’s lives is fine by them. Think if the government applied this same thinking to automobile accident deaths.

Which epidemiologists said that?

Bueller? Bueller?

Population of UK: 66m.

Population of NZ: Under 5m.

NZ's vaccination rate is inexcusable.

If the NZ government was a football manager, they would have been sacked ages ago.

NZ declared victory once and for all against corona 7 times.

No they didn’t.

@carpslidy, what are you talking about? With a few cases a day why would they need so many quarantine rooms?

This is all to do with the people trying to get back from abroad. It is extremely difficult to book a place in the mandatory managed isolation purely because of demand. I think the new booking system is just as bad as the old one. All spots were gone in 3 minutes according to one article I read.

If they have vaccinated the most at risk and also targeted the vaccine hesitant among that cohort there should be no need for further vaccinations or lock downs. People die every year it is a part of life. Healthy people aren’t dying from this virus! The main thing the Govts need to do is increase beds for monitoring at risk groups who have contacted severe COVID. For most it is mild to asymptomatic. These lockdowns are destroying peoples sanity and causing suicides depression at much more alarming rates than COVID could itself!

I see serious trouble ahead for New Zealand. Citizens can't get back into the country, and many skilled workers will leave as soon as the world is in a better place. Jacinda Ardern and her government botched the vaccine rollout, and this lockdown is the result of it. They've created such a climate of fear among their citizens that many are happy to be locked down at the sight of a single case. The elimination strategy that the NZ government has followed is just not sustainable, and they need to open up to the world soon, or face a materially lower standard of living.

From Tuesday, Aucklanders will be able to buy takeaway restaurant food, and some workplaces can reopen.

From Wednesday. The Level 4 ends at 1159PM on Tuesday night.

If they have vaccinated the most at risk and also targeted the vaccine hesitant among that cohort there should be no need for further vaccinations or lock downs

Which epidemiologists said that?

It's easy for the New Zealand economy to shut down, being dependent on Australia.

Bungle, Sweden got it right. Let 'er rip and build natural immunity, which is the best immunity.

Is that why at least 58% of Swedes have chosen to get vaccinated?

Robert Malone...the guy who helped invent the mRNA vax...

I don't think he said that. Are you sure? Also, notice how I asked a plural, and you've only maybe provided a single epidemiologist.

Along with if the vaccines are so great why arent countries who are 80-90% vaxxed having herd immunity and no cases...

Oh, sorry, did you think an open ended question makes an argument?

You arguments for mass vaccinations are old!

If by old, you mean present day right now, then yes, I would agree!

There is more to living than trying to avoid death.

Avoiding death is the first rule of staying alive.

theResident

@2020hindsighs:

In early 2020 the NZ zero Covid policy WAS a good idea. Sealing the borders WAS a good idea. But it's now September 2021. They just assumed it would go away.

No. Of course, they didn't assume it would go away.

If they had been on point with the vaccinations then with only 5 million people they should have been finished 6 in April, and that's a median guess.

You must be joking. NZ is at the back of the queue when it comes to get supply. Also, it took time to certify the vaccinations.

An Island state they may be, but Auckland is hardly a hub for international travel and trade like the UK or Japan are.

Yes, but we have the same kind of border policies.

Great idea almost 2 years ago. Now a complete failure.

Hardly a failure. Most of the country is free under level 2 restrictions, which are less strict that a start of emergency in Japan and Auckland have moved down to level 3 restrictions.

Vaccinations are going well. Better than the US for single dose vaccination rate. I expect in a couple of months, many people will be vaccinated.

Seems like they cant get out of this rut. If they ever do cases will anyway spike as imported cases happen and then spread happens. Sad

Good god, I had no idea.

Clearly.

There is more to living than trying to avoid death. It is reasonable to ask an entire population to waste years of their lives to save just a few?

It depends upon the population doesn't it. Different cultures have different priorities - in America, individual freedom nearly always takes precedence over group protection. In countries like Japan, people prioritize protection of the group over the freedom of an individual. The only metric by which to judge whether or not an approach was right for that locale, is to look at the satisfaction of the members of the culture, that have to abide by the decisions made by the leaders of their locale. And in New Zealand:

Exclusive poll: Resounding popular support for decision to take NZ into strict lockdown

a prodigious 84% supported the decision to move to alert level four. The vast majority of those, more than seven in 10 overall, expressed “strongly support” for the call. By way of comparison, 79% supported the decision to move Auckland to an alert level three lockdown in February 2021.

https://thespinoff.co.nz/politics/23-08-2021/exclusive-poll-resounding-popular-support-for-decision-to-take-nz-into-strict-lockdown/

Bungle

Sweden had the best plan for COVID: “Let ‘er rip.”

Is that what CNN et al are telling people now? It is actually far from a description of the Swedish policy.

@reckless

I do enjoy your sarcasm

Apologies in advance for any narratives that may have been ruined by that last post.

StrangerlandToday  04:59 am JST

If they have vaccinated the most at risk and also targeted the vaccine hesitant among that cohort there should be no need for further vaccinations or lock downs

Which epidemiologists said that?

Robert Malone...the guy who helped invent the mRNA vax...

Along with if the vaccines are so great why arent countries who are 80-90% vaxxed having herd immunity and no cases...

You arguments for mass vaccinations are old! People have had enough! VAccines are good for the old and infirm but natural immunity is shown to be much better and longer lived in those who have had the virus.

@2020hindsighs:

In early 2020 the NZ zero Covid policy WAS a good idea. Sealing the borders WAS a good idea. But it's now September 2021. They just assumed it would go away.

If they had been on point with the vaccinations then with only 5 million people they should have been finsihed 6 in April, and that's a median guess.

An Island state they may be, but Auckland is hardly a hub for international travel and trade like the UK or Japan are.

Great idea almost 2 years ago. Now a complete failure.

and there is no choice but to live with the virus.

True. But let us get vaccinated first.

Surely this government has to shoulder some of the blame for the slow pace of vaccinations in NZ?

There have been a few cases of Aucklanders trying to get out of the area, heading south etc, and for the majority of New Zealanders they are scathing of those not abiding by the restrictions set. Most people realize those not behaving will ultimately make this whole thing last longer. People are frustrated with the restrictions but generally just want to get it done and dusted.

No they didn’t.

Good god, I had no idea.

I didn't even think of that as a possibility.

I mean, that is just an airtight defense I can't possibly refute.

You win this time, worthy adversary..

GBR48

Population of UK: 66m.

Population of NZ: Under 5m.

NZ's vaccination rate is inexcusable.

If the NZ government was a football manager, they would have been sacked ages ago.

I don't think populations make a difference, because it is equalised by the infrastructure available. I would agree that NZ didn't get off to a fast start because they wanted to fully certify the vaccine before dispensing it.

However, if you look at the percentage of the population with at least one dose you have:

UK: 71.22

NZ: 63.63

USA: 63.06

So they are not far from the UK and doing better than the US (most likely due to hesitancy). The numbers for fully vaxxed is down because there is a lag, but I wouldn't be surprised if NZ got way higher numbers than both these countries in a few months.

So from "2 weeks to flatten the curve" we now gone to "a few years" to "overcome this pandemic". Talk about changing goalposts!

Yeah! The organizers of this pandemic should have thought that through better. Why didn't they make the virus so that it could have been defeated by flattening the curve in those two weeks, instead of deciding to make a virus that would be so difficult. Then they decide to make a vaccine that might take three shots?! Three?!

Seriously, we need to have a talk with the people who organized this pandemic. It's a freaking travesty. They should be fired.

It's easy for the New Zealand economy to shut down, being dependent on Australia.

In what way is their economy dependent upon Australia's? And I understand that they are extremely close trading partners with Australia and interlocked, but I'm referring to the relevance to this current issue, that makes it "easy" to be on lockdown? And are you saying that this dependence upon Australia's is a bad thing, or am I misreading the tone of your post?

M3M3M3

Do you also blame governments for failing to take the threat seriously and not increasing the number of hospital beds and healthcare resources? Given that we're over a year and half into the worst pandemic in our lifetimes, what are they waiting for? If they were serious about being prepared for the worst case scenario, we would be swimming in empty hospital beds by now.

That's a very simplistic way of looking at it. For a start, they have changed things around so that they can cope with increased pressure from covid.

But when they say, hospital beds, they mean the bed and staff to care for the person in the bed. Now, the staff take time to train, so you can't just ramp up.

They allow medical professionals into NZ, even if you aren't a NZer because it increases capacity. But that won't scale to a full on rush for hospital beds.

Level "3" is a little easier.

Level "3" does not mean Level Free though.

We still have tight restrictions just for 14 days.

99.9% of Aucklanders have "hung in there" so WELL DONE US.

I see serious trouble ahead for New Zealand. Citizens can't get back into the country, and many skilled workers will leave as soon as the world is in a better place.

Oh, has no one told you that the NZ approach is extremely popular in NZ?

I don’t think they’ll miss those that want to leave.

SteveinJapan - Ridiculous thinking. There is more to living than trying to avoid death. It is reasonable to ask an entire population to waste years of their lives to save just a few? 

I’m quite sure that if you or a family member were in the ICU on a respirator struggling for every breathe your flippant and naive opinion would be quite different.

Bungle

Would you prefer an approach where a democratically elected government implements policy which is against the wishes of the majority? 

Sweden had the best plan for COVID: “Let ‘er rip.”

14,734 deaths compared to 27?

Umm, no they didn't have the best plan. And their plan wasn't actually "Let 'er rip."

John

If lckdowns work how does a prisoner catch covid?

They caught it after they got out.

If people don't have a common sense to wear face mask at outdoors, the pandemic numbers shall remain high!

If lckdowns work how does a prisoner catch covid?

Lockdowns aren't absolute - people still need to eat and shop.

I don't understand it.

NZ declared victory once and for all against corona 7 times.

I can understand your anger from this, it must be confusing that this thing you made up in your head that never happened, isn't jiving with the reality of what's happening. I believe this is also why dementia patients are often very angry - it's a natural reaction to the confusion that what they are physically seeing isn't matching what they've made up in their heads.

Different countries have different approaches. I agree with how Australia and NZ are handling this for their respective countries. I also agree with Reckless that for those countries the lockdowns and travel restrictions should go on for as long as it takes. I think it will be years before those restrictions are lifted for Australia and NZ, as there will inevitably be more variants and cases will continue to pop up from time to time. Much respect to the people of Australia and NZ for doing the right thing and staying inside and giving up on their international travel plans. You're in in for the long haul, my friends. Hunker down and stay safe. Here in the U.S. people are out and about and traveling all over the place as if there is no pandemic. Not sure which country has the right approach, but again, much respect to you there for doing what you think is right.

theResident

Why are so many impressed with New Zealand? With their tiny population and closed borders how can it even be compared to the US, UK or Japan?

They can be directly compared to Japan or the UK. Island nations with closed borders. The population is irrelevant, but they are in the same order of magnitude as the UK.

They have done a useless job when they could have procured vaccines much earlier in the year and have had the whole country jabbed by now.

I agree they got off to a slow start. They waited to certify the vaccines rather than just go for emergency use. This hopefully will reduce vaccine hesitancy.

I will note that the percentage of the population with at least one jab is higher than the US at the moment, and they are just getting going.

With that protection in place they would have been able to keep the medical services protected.

They have got the medical services protected. All medical staff are already fully vaccinated.

RecklessSep. 20  03:09 pm JST

Good. As long as it takes.

And if that's what it takes, Look how the number of cases rose in Tokyo after the Olympics. NZ is once again leading the way in common sence.

Why are so many impressed with New Zealand?

New Zealand Covid deaths: 27.

NZ and Australia. Guinea pigs for how much oppression Western "democracies" will tolerate.

No need for the quotation marks around democracies.

The current government was elected in a democratic election during the pandemic where they gave the opposition an almighty hiding. It seems the majority of the electorate is still in favour of the current approach at this moment in time.

Would you prefer an approach where a democratically elected government implements policy which is against the wishes of the majority?

If you do, just say so, but that could be construed as less democratic than what is happening at the moment.

SteveinJapan

Couldn't agree with you more SimondB. Stay home and stay safe 6 weeks, 6 months or 6 years.

Ridiculous thinking. There is more to living than trying to avoid death. It is reasonable to ask an entire population to waste years of their lives to save just a few?

Waste years of their life? Talk about hyperbole. They've locked down for 6 weeks. And will for another 2 weeks with more freedoms. That's 2 months. So months (2) of their life, sure. But not years!

Thankfully the majority of countries have realized that it isn't,

Those same majority of countries that allowed 15 million deaths? Yeah right.

and there is no choice but to live with the virus.

True. But let us get vaccinated first.

If we had all taken the NZ approach at the start, Covid would just be that thing we'd remember from last year.

NZ 20 cases a day, UK 25,000 a day, US touching on around (or approaching )100,000 a day. Who got it right? And although the Doomsayers won't like this, the lockdown is supported by the vast majority of the population. No-one feels their freedom is being taken away or they are living in a dictatorship, they feel that collectively they are doing the right thing for all concerned. And it will further upset some, and shock others, you can trust your government to do the right thing if it is done right. And that is what is happening in NZ. Just 27 deaths since Covid broke out. How's it going where you are?

Stockholm syndrome.

A bit hysterical.

Perhaps it is worth remembering that NZ hasn’t vaccinated the same percentage of the population as the UK which was mentioned.

When (if?) they reach the percentage of the likes of the UK, surely these heavy-handed, economically damaging and disruptive measures can’t continue indefinitely...can they?