Trump criticizes 'fake media' on Flynn story

Didn't see that one coming...

It is not a criminal act, it's even welcomed if leaks go against you opponents...

I wonder how much more DT has under his carpet.

President Donald Trump blamed intelligence officials and the media

In yet another attempt to undermine US institutions while simultaneously pointing the blame for another of his screw-ups away from him.

It's pretty scary that the 'media', the primary (only?) source for individuals to stay informed about out what's going on anywhere beyond their homes, is under such constant attack by Trump and rightists who want to limit the ability of the public to learn about what the government, the US citizen's government, is doing in DC.

Sitting at my keyboard I'm able to find a full range of descriptions of events happening throughout the world and multiple interpretations of them. That there are descriptions and interpretations I disagree with is a reality of having a free press.

Those who want to demonize a free press and restrict its ability to report information based on whatever set of beliefs they hold have the right to do so, but while doing so are encouraging a totalitarian state.

BurningBush: only if it is inconvenient for you it seems.

The important story is what Russian disinformation/propaganda operatives did to poison hearts and minds during the US election, and what Trump promised them in return.

This is just laying the rhetorical ground-work in his fanatics' heads for the idea that reporting on the wrongdoing of the President is itself a crime.

@brbush Leaking classified information to the media is a criminal offense, is it not?

Good question. Would you say Wikileaks is criminal? What happens in Russia when classified information is released, or does that happen?

http://www.businessinsider.com/russia-internet-trolls-and-donald-trump-2016-7

Trump, when leaks go after his political rivals: "WikiLeaks has given us a window into the secret corridors of government power.”

Trump, when leaks target him: “I think in addition to that, from intelligence, papers are being leaked, things are being leaked.” Trump added that the leaks were a “criminal action, criminal act."

Verdict: complete wuss.

As he did during the past week following meetings with leaders of Canada and Japan, Trump called on reporters from >>friendly news outlets.

he seems a pro of the "fake" news conference...give him a little bit more time and all the reporters in the room allowed to ask a question will be "sakura's" on the White House payrolls.

Didn't Trump himself call for Russia to hack and find Clinton's 33,000 emails?

For someone who claims to have the best it can be quite selective at times.

Trump's nominewof Secretary of Labors jawt declined tq accept nomition.

The important story is what Russian disinformation/propaganda operatives did to poison hearts and minds during the US election, and what Trump promised them in return.

Seriously? I remember this:

https://youtu.be/XsFR8DbSRQE

Liberals are experts when it comes to smearing and tarnishing their opponents, but when it comes to recalling any of their hypocrisies, they get selective memory.

This is getting painful to watch this FAKE president & his fool hangers on in action, what a disgrace.

Watch out US of A your on a dangerous road right now, hope you can get off it somehow!

Only would Republicans praise Wikileaks and talk about how great leaks are over an open mic and then once it starts going against them blame the leaks and the media for the problems instead of actually addressing the mistakes and errors of their cabinet. Trump engaged in treason and his cabinet criminal behaviour that they have vehemently denied? Well, that's the media's fault! How can we solve it? crack down on leaks in a government so untrusting of its corrupt leader that they won't share critical information for fear he'll sell it to Russia in exchange for them not leaking what they have on Donald.

Liberals are experts when it comes to smearing and tarnishing their opponents, but when it comes to recalling any of their hypocrisies, they get selective memory.

Oh please, Republicans are the most hypocritical humans that ever walked the planet, and always forget it whenever it gets called out ROFL!

@CrazyJoe "The important story is what Russian disinformation/propaganda operatives did to poison hearts and minds during the US election, and what Trump promised them in return."

Liberal heats and minds are originally poisoned. There weren't reasons for Russians to poison them more.

Instead of whining about leaks Trump should explain why he allowed Flynn to lie to Pence. Trump should at the very least apologise to Pence.

@yamashi, yes yes, Russian interference in American elections should be tolerated and encouraged if it helps the Republican party. A Manchurian Candidate in the highest office? Why not eh?

It is illegal for intelligence officials who have taken an oath of secrecy and are paid to control information to spread leaks to the media.

Illegal but common, just like hypocrisy. Leaks happen because some people (not Trump) have a conscience and morals, and not providing the information creates a moral dilemma.

Fake media" in this case is any information that contradicts the president. He wants to control information and the country like some modern gestapo. He was all for leaked information when it helped him.

Trump may have had a hand in those leaks based on the reports of his campaign and business associate's continuous contact with Russian officials over the last couple of years. Or more likely, he just dumbly repeated things those advisers told him that were supportive of Russia, just like he dumbly tweets what he sees on cable news.

My guess, he will avoid questions and continue to lie. Congress will want his testimony, and he will claim privilege.

There is no point in interviewing Conway since she doesn't answer questions and just lies.

Trump is on his way out. The question is how much damage is done to the country before he is impeached.

The problem I see here is that everything Spicer, Conway, and Trump says in relation to the media is fundamentally hostile and seems more out of spite than anything else, almost as if their only aim is to troll America as much as possible. Every press conference has this sort of tone to it. I get the feeling that there will be some serious violence during this administration

Liberals are experts when it comes to smearing and tarnishing their opponents, but when it comes to recalling any of their hypocrisies, they get selective memory.

That's liberals, that's republicans, that's politics. What's important is what is happening NOW... and you still support this guy Trump. Sick of the bringing up of past politicians. I believe Obama was a much better president than most, you believe he wasn't, so let's leave that at that and focus on NOW.

Burning BushFEB. 16, 2017 - 09:12AM JST

It's not illegal for private citizens to disseminate information to the public.

And how do you think the private citizens came by this information?

Who orchestrated the Flynn scandal and why:

http://freebeacon.com/national-security/former-obama-officials-loyalists-waged-campaign-oust-flynn/

Don't give us deplorables a thought. Listen to one of your own.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5sGWVLo7yyE

Can't wait to read the warmongers here tell us how Kucinich is a tin foil hat crazed conspiracy theorist. LOL

@askaze Who orchestrated the Flynn scandal and why:

As you're aware, the freebeacon is an example of a news outlet that's allowed to print its opinions. After all, a free press is critical to maintaining a free society. Though the opinions they print tend to be ultra-right and often lacking in facts, and many times their writers straight out twists truths to suit their perspective, they still remain free to print their news.

I'm curious, though, why Russians on this board criticize Ukraine for harboring people they demean, calling them neo-fascists, when many of these same Russians espouse beliefs that are ultra-right, that in fact sound to be pretty close to being neo-fascist. And if many Russians are in fact flip-flopping to the far right, then why are they criticizing their neighbor's beliefs?

They`ll soon be thrown in jail for the leaks. Lefties just stomping their feet like whiners.

I'm sure he and his cabinet will be yelling "fake treason!" when they're hauled off as well

Trump called on reporters from friendly news outlets. On Wednesday, he chose David Brody, a columnist for the Pat Robertson-founded Christian Broadcast Network, and Katie Pavlich, editor of the conservative web site townhall.com.

He reserves seats for a couple of fringe news sources and then the "reporters" ask him a softball question. Breitbart's reporter actually asked, "With all the problems that we’ve seen throughout the media over the course of the election, what reforms do you recommend for this industry here?" He literally asked that.

Verdict: wuss.

Asakaze: Who orchestrated the Flynn scandal and why: http://freebeacon.com/national-security/former-obama-officials-loyalists-waged-campaign-oust-flynn/

Let me help you.

Russian propaganda is different from GOP propaganda. The Russians will look at a video of Putin shooting someone in the face and draw attention to a candle that seems to be blowing in a different direction than everything else. You don't have to prove Putin didn't do what you just saw. You just have to open up an ounce of doubt about what you are seeing, then the whole video comes into question. Kind of like the billboard in the Ukraine.

GOP propaganda is more blunt. You show them a video of Trump shooting someone in the face and they just say, "Never happened." Trump offers a completely different parallel reality forced by sheer will. Crowds at his inauguration? Biggest ever. The end. He lost the popular vote? 5 million illegals voted for him. No investigation. The end.

You have to change your tactics if you want to get the GOP to follow you. It will be a while new ballgame for you. Yes, you will fool some of them. But Democrats will be sniping you the entire time. With lots of headshots.

Lefties just stomping their feet like whiners.

Go team!

@pointview They`ll soon be thrown in jail for the leaks. Lefties just stomping their feet like whiners.

The US is different from Putin's Russia. Many Americans don't want to have to live like you do. And it's not just because of the weather. LOL

Who orchestrated the Flynn scandal and why

Asakaze, that is the burning question. Did Flynn wander of the reservation alone, or was he directed by Trump? How far back do his back-channel communications with Russian officials go, who were they in addition to the Ambassador, and were other Americans involved? Was Pence lying, or was he out of the loop - and if so, why? Are there connections between Russian meddling in the election and the Trump campaign?

These are serious questions, and any article you post now pretending to provide answers is just fluff. A full-scale investigation is required; the dots are undoubtedly there - they just need to be unearthed and connected.

FizzBit: "Can't wait to read the warmongers"

Always cracks me up how a guy who supports Bannon -- who WANTS war and has flat out said so -- as well as Trump -- who leads illegal raids to kill children in Yemen, proves what ISIS is saying about the West's war on Islam, is pushing China towards not only a trade war but flat out war, and threatens everyone else under the sun, claims democrats are "war mongers". Ah, hypocrisy!

@PTownsend

the freebeacon is an example of a news outlet that's allowed to print its opinions. After all, a free press is critical to maintaining a free society

I hope this tradition will stay intact, though it is under threat now - people who do not share the mainstream media point of view are quickly branded "rightists or Russians", as it was demonstrated by several your posts.

criticize Ukraine for harboring people they demean, calling them neo-fascists, when many of these same Russians espouse beliefs that are ultra-right

I think this subject is off-topic here. Anyway, since I'm very interested in the conflict in Ukraine I'll answer this. The difference is very simple: In Ukraine people with swastikas, SS-emblems and other Third Reich insignias roam freely and make regular marches with torches while shouting WWII Nazi slogans, the police looks the other way. I don't know how many ultras in Russia, but they keep their beliefs to themselves and you can be arrested by the police even for wearing a cap with swastika (Nazi propaganda is banned there). Now you see the difference?

Only would Republicans praise Wikileaks and talk about how great leaks are over an open mic and then once it starts going against them blame the leaks and the media for the problems instead of actually addressing the mistakes and errors of their cabinet.

Oh, do stop! If the Wikileaks files would have found the level of corruption that went on with Democrats on the same level with the right, the left would hail it as a Christmas gift. Smith, don't even try, let's just move on.

Trump engaged in treason and his cabinet criminal behaviour that they have vehemently denied?

Wow, that's a serious charge, sir. So, uhhhh...how can you prove it? Oh, I reeeally want to see the proof on that.

Well, that's the media's fault! How can we solve it? crack down on leaks in a government so untrusting of its corrupt leader that they won't share critical information for fear he'll sell it to Russia in exchange for them not leaking what they have on Donald.

Didn't you say once that you liked Amsterdam?

This is getting painful to watch this FAKE president & his fool hangers on in action, what a disgrace.

Dude, I was saying the same thing for the last 8 years, but still alive and kicking.

Watch out US of A your on a dangerous road right now, hope you can get off it somehow!

We did about 2 months ago.

bass4funk: "Oh, do stop! If the Wikileaks files would have found the level of corruption that went on with Democrats on the same level with the right, the left would hail it as a Christmas gift. Smith, don't even try, let's just move on."

'let's just move on'... you mean like Benghazi? You mean like Trump losing the popular vote? It's always "let's move on" when Trump makes an arse of himself, which is daily, but even a private email sent at work from the other side and despite your ilk finding no fault on the part of the sender SEVERAL times you still harp on about it. In fact, I'm just surprised you haven't blamed Obama yet for Flynn... although of course you buy into the "fake news" garbage despite it being FACT.

And saying what would have been is only speculation. Saying what is fact -- Trump and co being the absolute biggest hypocrites in the world -- is fact. Did Trump or did he not praise leaks during his campaign? What does he think of leaks now? Did he not promote spreading such information in the past? Is he calling it 'fake news' when it happens now?

Those are rhetorical questions... I'm not interested in the hoops you're going to jump through to convince yourself of some alternate reality.

FAKE MEDIA!! Why stop there trumpy?? Why not just claim that the LEAKS are FAKE and that it was someone from the previous administration who made the call and use Flynn's voice to sabotage him after his confirmation!!!???

Laguna

A full-scale investigation is required; the dots are undoubtedly there - they just need to be unearthed and connected

Refreshingly calm attitude. Some trigger-happy posters of JT have already called Flynn a traitor. Why bother with stupid investigation? They already know The Truth.

I think there is more to come out about this. This is a "Wikileaks" in and of itself. I believe much of the leaked material from Wikileaks and I also believe there is something wrong with this situation as well, although we probably do not yet know exactly what transpired or how deep this really goes.

It is obvious the administration has serious internal problems, especially related to communications. I think much of this probably can be attributed to President Trump as he is not used to running anything as complex as the Executive Branch of the U.S. Government and his personality does not seem fit for the job.

Regarding the media; While I am no Trump supporter and more and more faults are appearing every day, one cannot blame the administration for lacking to acknowledge some of the media outlets as these same outlets were comparing him to Adolph Hitler, etc. Related to this matter both sides are at fault.

In the end it is finally nice to see the media challenge our President, something that was lacking during the Obama administration.

@GW, I am not sure if you are an American...or from which land you hail (I am American, but living in Japan over 2 decades), you stated, "Watch out US of A your on a dangerous road right now, hope you can get off it somehow!"........I think you are actually seeing the checks and balances in the U.S. really work. In spite of all of our problems (The U.S.....which we have many) our system of government seems to always have a way to work through issues such as this.

In the end, it will be interesting to see where this one ends up.

Fighting lies means you are "Fake News".

Trump probably doesn't want to attack the leakers too much because there is still more to be leaked.

He just stamps his feet talking about how it is illegal, which it is, and calls news that publishes the information "Fake news".

So, Trump's game plan is: (1) intimidate leakers of the truth, (2) discredit the media trying to uncover the truth, (3) limit media access to Trump if the media is trying to uncover the truth, (4) boost media access if the media supporting his lies or creating distractions from the truth, (5) send his people out to lie, (6) distract the easily distracted portion of the population with a conspiracy theory/lie.

'let's just move on'... you mean like Benghazi?

People died in Benghazi, big difference.

You mean like Trump losing the popular vote?

Liberals are whining about that, besides, that's not our system as to how we elect a president anyway. Move on...

It's always "let's move on" when Trump makes an arse of himself, which is daily, but even a private email sent at work from the other side and despite your ilk finding no fault on the part of the sender SEVERAL times you still harp on about it.

When Obama was president, you guys always had a move on mentality and now that the right is governing, the left can't have to keep the pressure and refuse to move on. Hypocrisy, the legend that liberals make so great!

In fact, I'm just surprised you haven't blamed Obama yet for Flynn... although of course you buy into the "fake news" garbage despite it being FACT.

Well to be honest, the sanctions were administered under the Obama admin., so I don't blame Obama for this, but I did think it was ridiculous for Obama to put puny insignificant sanctions on Russia that Putin laughed at and thought was a complete joke. Obama should have put the heaviest sanctions on them that would hurt them and make it stick to them, but that didn't happen. I blame Flynn for Flynn.

And saying what would have been is only speculation.

Which is true. You and I are not God, so we can't and shouldn't ever speculate without the full and indisputable facts.

Saying what is fact -- Trump and co being the absolute biggest hypocrites in the world -- is fact.

That's not a fact, that's a personal opinion. I hate mayo, I think it's the most disgusting condiment on the planet, but others might disagree with me.

Did Trump or did he not praise leaks during his campaign?

He sure did and the left are equally praising the leaks that are coming out of this WH. So what's your point?

What does he think of leaks now? Did he not promote spreading such information in the past? Is he calling it 'fake news' when it happens now?

Maybe or maybe not.

Those are rhetorical questions... I'm not interested in the hoops you're going to jump through to convince yourself of some alternate reality.

Right back at you, homie!

Leaking classified information to the media is a criminal offense, is it not?

It's a capital offence in Россия.

As the regime is very quickly learning, public interest trumps political expediency.

Can't wait to read the warmongers here tell us how Kucinich is a tin foil hat crazed conspiracy theorist. the last two wars were started by Republicans, one of which was the biggest lie , search for Iraqs WMDs which they found none. Democrats were left to clean up the mess that still rages today. Republicans have the shortest memories imaginable.

@askaze I hope this tradition will stay intact, though it is under threat now - people who do not share the mainstream media point of view are quickly branded "rightists or Russians",

I, too, hope the US can maintain a free press.

I have in fact been critical of posters who I believe have assailed media for reporting events and ideas differently from how they want to see them reported. I say it's rightists and Russians who've done this based on my sense of pattern recognition. I've done that because I feel rightists and Russians are trying to undermine media in the US. By constantly calling out the media, (e.g. every day in JT posts), by discrediting all outlets that don't report in ways fitting their worldview, by claiming the media is part of some global conspiracy, by yelling fake news, by reporting fake news and alt facts, I think Russians and rightists are trying to undermine it.

I read Russia Today. I read Murdoch. I read Breitbart and occasionally I steel myself and read infowars and other kook sites. I think they're dangerous because so many of their readers have been media silo-fied, only read kook sites and actually believe what they read.

But I would NEVER want to see a time when they're not allowed to print their messages and people aren't allowed to read them.

I know free press is a new concept to Russians.

Re seeing the difference between an ultra-rightist wearing a uniform and one not wearing a uniform, aside from the obvious physical appearances, no, I don't see a difference.

And the march towards impeachment has now become a steady trot...

"When Obama was president, you guys always had a move on mentality and now that the right is governing, the left can't have to keep the pressure and refuse to move on. Hypocrisy, the legend that liberals make so great!"

Yes, but the Obama administration was even more corrupt than Nixon's according to you. Hillary Clinton was the most corrupt and dishonest person ever to run for president according to you. Liberals are all, and you did say all, are completely devoid of morals. Of course they will be as dirty as can be.

The more honest conservatives are in power now with a fine, upstanding president.

Don't you think honest Don should release his tax returns and information regarding his business interests in the name of transparency? He's not crooked Hillary after all.

Some trigger-happy posters of JT have already called Flynn a traitor. Why bother with stupid investigation?

I haven't seen the word "traitor" bandied about on JT; if you have some examples, please bring them to our attention. It is a serious accusation.

Regarding "why bother with stupid investigation?" - I understand your ironic usage, but taken literally, you would sound like a generic GOP congressman. (Yes: inevitably men.) Chaffetz, who never met a Clinton scandal he wasn't willing to spend millions investigating, has said ““it’s taking care of itself.” (Whether he directed his comments solely at Flynn or at the wider situation is unclear.) Rep. Tom Cole, another foreign policy heavyweight, ventured: “We appear to know the facts, I’m not obsessed about this,” as if he knew the facts (clearly not) and as if paying attention to this serious issue is a simple obsession. My own congressman,Dana Rohrabacher, chalked it up to inexperience: “In this case, a very loyal, hardworking patriot did not know exactly what the parameters of his authority were because he was brand new.” Lame. Not only is it not true (look at Flynn's resume) but it is no excuse. Most repubs seem eager to simply draw a line over this: “Gen. Flynn has resigned. Case done,” said one GOP representative, pretty much summing up the futile dreams of the Trump administration.

No. Case not done. Case not even open yet. Case unfolding. This is inevitable. If there is nothing to fear, Asakaze, why oppose an investigation?

So Trump only commented when the media exposed the situation, pretending he had lost trust over a period of time and took it upon himself to act. And we've learned he didn't tell Pence for a couple of weeks. He refuses to answer questions about it. The right-wing media is pushing a "sweep it under the carpet and move on" angle. Republicans in the House are resisting an investigation.

Alrighty.

Every time Trump even mentions the phrases 'fake media' or 'fake news' he makes himself look ever more ridiculous. The fact that he seems blissfully unaware can only be due to a lack of intellectual capacity. The only people who believe what he calls 'fake' to actually be fake, are the kind of people who would believe literally anything. Meanwhile his two stooges, Spicer and Conway, are sent out to systematically lie in defence of the president, who himself also systematically lies about anything and everything. Pence can't have been thrilled to be kept in the dark by Trump about Flynn's lying, either. Pence should resign over that which would deliver the additional benefit of not putting Pence in the White House when Trump gets his just deserts.

bass4funkFEB. 16, 2017 - 12:59PM JST

'let's just move on'... you mean like Benghazi?

People died in Benghazi, big difference.

Lots of people died in the botched Yemen raid too. Trump's proved that he can orchestrate military operations just as badly as anyone, if not worse, so the indignation about Benghazi is starting to ring just a little hollow.

But that's okay, isn't it? As you keep saying, he's not a professional politician, the man's not perfect, got to expect a few mistakes... so I expect you'll give him a free pass over Yemen and whatever else he messes up while continually ranting about Benghazi.

And we've learned he didn't tell Pence for a couple of weeks.

...or did he? Was Pence speaking from ignorance, or was he lying as well? Inquiring minds want to know.

PTownsend

I say it's rightists and Russians who've done this based on my sense of pattern recognition

Lovely. And I say it's leftists and paid Clintonbots who've done this based on my sense of pattern recognition. I hope you would find this argument equally convincing.

seeing the difference between an ultra-rightist wearing a uniform and one not wearing a uniform, aside from the obvious physical appearances, no, I don't see a difference

OK, let me make it even more simple for you: in one country (Ukraine) all neonazi activity is officialy allowed and even encouraged, in the other country (Russia) all neonazi activity is strictly banned and the ban is strongly enforced. NOW you see the difference?

People died in Benghazi, big difference.

Wow, the right-side's Alamo. Remember Benghazi!!!

There have been at least 7 formal Republican investigations of Benghazi. The biggest finding was that the DoD, CIA, and DoS failed to understand the risks in the area.

Republicans spent over $8M on the investigations, and the last 800 page report produced by Republicans found no new evidence, much to the dismay of the right-siders.

Benghazi was an ill planned CIA operation. They wanted a low profile and used an ambassador as cover. It blew up in their face and people died. Sure, it should have been done differently, but there is no one person or political party to blame, other than the Republicans who kept reaching for something to pin on Clinton.

In this instance, we have constitutional questions, a president who lies and is too cozy with a historical enemy.

There have been at least 7 formal Republican investigations of Benghazi.

Seven investigations, 13 hearings, 50 briefings, and 25,000 pages of documents released on Benghazi, at a running cost of $9,539,781 and counting because these hypocritical a-holes are still at it. Despite each successive investigation turning up squat.

But the current administration violating the Logan Act en masse and collaborating with a foreign state that, in short space of time has assassinated foreign dissidents, invaded two sovereign nations, murdered 283 passengers and 15 crew of Malaysian Airline Flight 17, joined international war criminal Bashar al-Assad in intentionally bombing Syrian civilians and hospitals, and demonstrably interfered in the US presidential election in an effort to influence sanctions levied against them for the aforementioned s#$tshow they unleashed on the world? What does that garner?

"[I]t’s taking care of itself.”

Shame on the GOP and shame on anyone who continues to support this monstrosity of an administration.

Wow, the right-side's Alamo. Remember Benghazi!!!

Speaking of which, whatever happened to that never-ending Benghazi investigation? Before the election, Republicans insisted it wasn't a politically motivated attempt to sink Clinton. Just a good old fashioned quest for truth and justice. But since Clinton lost the election, I haven't heard a peep.

Meanwhile, we've got Russian hacking to influence the election, Flynn negotiating foreign policy with Russia as a civilian, Trump not reading executive orders before signing them (letting Bannon write his way into the NSC), Conway going on Fox to advertise Ivanka products, Miller barking to the media that the president's power will not be questioned, Trump insulting the judicial branch, top-secret crisis talks taking place in the middle of the dining room at Mar-a-Lago, Trump refusing to release his taxes, and . . . on and on.

Whatever happened to that good old fashioned quest for truth and justice?

What a whining manbaby.

Trump had no problem with Kremileaks deliberately releasing damaging , stolen info on his opponent, leaked at timed intervals by head of Wikileaks Vlad Put.

Heh. 'Ain't Karma a biatch Donny boy.

So I say "hackers if you're listening, find Trump's tax returns" . Let's see how deep the Russian rabbit hole really goes...

@askaze I hope you would find this argument equally convincing

No, but I wasn't trying to convince you and it's doubtful you'll ever convince me. Having read a lot of Russian history, beyond The Hermitage Museum there's nothing else about the country that interests me. In Russia's defense, Nazi Germany could not have been defeated and the allies could not have won WW2 without Russia.

Re paid posters, I have read this: http://www.businessinsider.com/russia-internet-trolls-and-donald-trump-2016-7

NOW you see the difference?

From what I've read, Russia has many restrictions. Though the uniform may make them uglier in my eyes, an ultra-rightist is still an ultra-rightist. Ultra-rightists want a totalitarian government. Any form of totalitarianism - fascism, communism, autocracy, kleptocracy, oligarchy, you name it - must be stopped.

Laguna

I haven't seen the word "traitor" bandied about on JT; if you have some examples, please bring them to our attention. It is a serious accusation.

Sure. Here you are:

dcog9065 Feb. 14, 2017 - 01:08PM JST

Well, he just resigned because he knew he was a traitor

And the next your question

Asakaze, why oppose an investigation?

Laguna, I'm not a US citizen and I'm not sure why the people you named are against the investigation. But from Japan the whole Flynn scandal looks so hypocritical. Why Clinton did not go into oblivion after Benghazi? Why other high-ranking US officials caught lying had it in easy way? It's pretty obvious that Flynn was singled out on purpose.

But from Japan the whole Flynn scandal looks so hypocritical. Why Clinton did not go into oblivion after Benghazi? Why other high-ranking US officials caught lying had it in easy way? It's pretty obvious that Flynn was singled out on purpose.

Sigh... Benghazi. Asakaze, your attempt to equalize these is like saying lightning has the same moral culpritude as a gunman. There is such a concept known as "intent," as will soon be made clear. Also, please give examples of "other high-ranking US officials caught lying had it in easy way" - you'll notice Petraeus is not NSA director precisely because he lied. Flynn was no babe in the wood. He knew what he was doing and likely knew that it was pushing legal limits yet did it anyway. Questions regarding why, who directed it, and how far it went will be uncovered. This in absolutely no way shares any similarity with Benghazi. I'm surprised you'd even suggest such foolishness.

But from Japan the whole Flynn scandal looks so hypocritical.

Well, that's one way to view what some Japanese may think about it. But some Japanese I've spoken with about this see the seriousness of what happened with Trump and possible collaboration with Russian intelligence agents being on a level far more severe and concerning than what happened in Benghazi.

To put things into better perspective, it would be akin to trying to compare the JASDF's gross mishandling of sensitive, classified data on the next-gen F-35 stealth fighter with, say, revelations that the DPJ received secret aid from China in order to install a Prime Minister more sympathetic to Chinese interests. No, that never happened (that we know of), but this is the equivalent of what's happened in America.

Trying to compare what amounts to an existential threat to the democratic institutions of the United States with botched intelligence -- not Clinton's fault, if the GOP-led investigations are any indication -- resulting in a fatal attack on a US consulate is missing the broader picture on a grand scale.

Even after their team has declared Hillary did nothing wrong with Benghazi, you still have players piping up about it. Haven't they had the speech from their coach yet? I'm guessing these are the same ones who are still spouting the team line about Obama being born in Kenya.

Everyone gets their turn. Funny how even foreign media, neither republican or democratic are aligning themselves with the bulk of American media. Trump has misplayed his hand by going after the media. He thinks his posts, (literal and even more literal) will alter the American landscape, and create a forged highway to drive his deregulations through. He says whatever he thinks works for him. The media is mean spirited? What do you think his posts about Obama were for eight years?

The media is mean spirited? What do you think his posts about Obama were for eight years?

Yeah, he wasn't complaining when the media was repeating his 'mean spirited' comments about Obama's birth certificate all those years.

Seems he never learned the saying about living by the sword.

Asakaze,

If you're having trouble seeing why Flynn is being "singled out", watch the footage of Flynn last year calling for Hillary Clinton to be charged for misconduct.

Lots of people died in the botched Yemen raid too.

So how many drone strikes did Obama undertake in Yemen, how many terrorists did Obama apprehended and questioned? Oh, I forgot, that was too much of a hassle for that administration, blowing them up is easier and saves time.

Trump's proved that he can orchestrate military operations just as badly as anyone, if not worse, so the indignation about Benghazi is starting to ring just a little hollow.

I'm sorry, but "When" did Trump order a military strike? And doesn't he have his National Security staff to execute that for him?

But that's okay, isn't it? As you keep saying, he's not a professional politician, the man's not perfect, got to expect a few mistakes...

That's exactly what the people voted for, an outsider.

so I expect you'll give him a free pass over Yemen and whatever else he messes up while continually ranting about Benghazi.

I'm not a liberal, I don't give free passes. I call it for what it is and NOT for what I want it to be.

@LFRAgain

You can save the Benghazi trying to hash over that Hillary was innocent, apparently, a large portion of Americans didn't. I mean, you don't see her in the White House, right and thank God, you never will.

But the current administration violating the Logan Act en masse and collaborating with a foreign state that, in short space of time has assassinated foreign dissidents, invaded two sovereign nations, murdered 283 passengers and 15 crew of Malaysian Airline Flight 17, joined international war criminal Bashar al-Assad in intentionally bombing Syrian civilians and hospitals, and demonstrably interfered in the US presidential election in an effort to influence sanctions levied against them for the aforementioned s#$tshow they unleashed on the world? What does that garner?

Question, what is it with you libs that get your undies in a bunch that this administration wants to have better relations with Russia, a year ago, you guys were fine with it, completely! When Putin went into Crimea, I don't remember a single outraged remark or a condemnation of what the Russians did. Obama didn't even want to send weapons to the Ukrainians to help them push Russia back. You guys were fine with the Iranians having a bomb, fine with the Castro brothers imprisoning political groups or murdering them. Maybe if Hillary would have kept her nose out of the Russian election in 2011 Putin might not have meddled in the election a bit. Greed is never good. Try again in 8 years and see if you can come up with a formidable candidate.

Meanwhile, we've got Russian hacking to influence the election,

Hacking, but not turning it. Wisconsin, Pennsylvania and Michigan as Putin rightly laughed, I am responsible to influence people from those states? The US is giving me more credit than I deserve.

Flynn negotiating foreign policy with Russia as a civilian, Trump not reading executive orders before signing them (letting Bannon write his way into the NSC),

Obama signed executive orders and that's how he pretty much governed and now, here we are. Remember, being stubborn and unwilling to meet in the middle with your opposition party because they don't agree with you, is signs of a bad politician that governs by threats and intimidation.

Conway going on Fox to advertise Ivanka products, Miller barking to the media that the president's power will not be questioned,

You guys had that Obama lap dog, Eric Holder that insulated the president from everything and then there is Susan Rice, the woman that would take it for the team should anything ever go wrong, Valerie Jarret was pulling the strings and most responsive for Obama making bad choices and then there's my favorite hustler, the Good Rev. Al Sharpton, the paid contributor, a man that has made more trouble than all the five NYC mafia families put together.

Trump insulting the judicial branch, top-secret crisis talks taking place in the middle of the dining room at Mar-a-Lago, Trump refusing to release his taxes, and . . . on and on.

But the judge can insult Trump? And remember when Obama was at the dinner whispering in Medvedev's ear, "I'll have more flexibility after the election." Trump didn't release his taxes and Obama didn't release his college transcripts. Bottom line, you guys on the left have nothing to stand on. You want to pounce on Trump as if he was the biggest mistake to happen to this country, many of us believe that about the last president as well. The knife cuts both ways.

Whatever happened to that good old fashioned quest for truth and justice?

ROFL...good lord...

Laguna

Sigh... Benghazi... your attempt to equalize

No! I do not equalize. Flynn's actions at least did not result with body bags. And if you equalize Flynn and Clinton, I'm really stunned.

please give examples of "other high-ranking US officials caught lying had it in easy way"

Powell. To lie to the whole world with his "show-and-tell" performance on Saddam's WMD, to start a war that killed dozens of thousands of innocent people - and nothing!

LFRAgain

what amounts to an existential threat to the democratic institutions of the United States

I do not see any "existential threat to the democratic institutions of the United States". I hear a lot of noise about it, I see a witchunt, but no solid facts. And the present brouhaha "we have 100-percent proof of hor-r-r-r-ible threat" reminds me exactly how the 2003 war started ("ooops, we were wrong, whatever").

To my opinion, Hillary is a much more serious threat to the US with her cozy relationship with Saudis. No intentions to dig there with the same zeal as with "the Russian threat"?

Readers, the Obama administration is not relevant to this particular discussion.

So speaking to the Russians (illegally) was okay, but reporting it wasn't? What's fake is this loon's grip on reality.... Can he really last 4 years? I doubt it.

Trump is the one who lost confidence and trust on Flynn and thus asked him to resign:

White House press secretary Sean Spicer: "The level of trust between the President and Gen. Flynn had eroded to the point where he felt he had to make a change. The President was very concerned that Gen. Flynn had misled the vice president and others. The president must have complete and unwavering trust of the person in that position. And that's what led to the president asking for and accepting the resignation of General Flynn."

Not just other people but Trump too lost trust on Flynn. Trump knew for weeks, but didn't let Pence know until last week that Flynn lied to him.

As for leaks, that's how WikiLeaks gets much of its information - and Trump praises WikiLeaks. And let's not forget that the Watergate scandal only became a scandal because it was chiefly leaked by the deputy director of the FBI - otherwise, there wouldn't had been a Watergate scandal.

So speaking to the Russians (illegally) was okay, but reporting it wasn't? What's fake is this loon's grip on reality.... Can he really last 4 years? I doubt it.

Low gas prices, low taxes and jobs everywhere. If this keeps up looks like he will last 8 years to me. Thumbs up to Bass4funk for his accurate posts.

Trump is the one who lost confidence and trust on Flynn and thus asked him to resign

Well, that's the official spin on it. But Trump is a narcissist and that's the only way he could spin it to try and not make himself look bad. I'm skeptical.

Is this the saga of a fake president versus the fake media?

No, I make an estimated guess, unless the facts prove otherwise.

That's nonsense. You're doing exactly what you accuse others of doing and try to say they have no right to do it but they've actually got just as much right as you. Get off your high horse.

The Trump house is off to an amazing start of a presidency! Unpresidented!

So speaking to the Russians (illegally) was okay, but reporting it wasn't?

I don't agree with his positions on Yemen or Iran but the fact still remains not a single Democrat has produced any evidence that shows he negotiated anything. Starting with Russians hacking the elections the anti-Trumpers have found their theme and they are going to beat it incessantly until they are silenced by an avalanche of evidence refuting their nuttiness.

Asakaze - please allow me to mix a few metaphors: Claiming an apple is larger than an orange does not change the fact that they are apples and oranges; and, despite desperate attempts by Trump, his GOP-allies, and his Russian cohorts to sweep all of this under the rug, chickens have a tendency to come home to roost. Whew - done.

Though the man has said "It's the coverup, not the crime," in this case, it appears increasingly likely that the reverse is true - that, in fact, Trump and his team have committed such egregious actions that a coverup is absolutely necessitated for the Trump regime to survive. Such a coverup in Putin's Russia may be run-of-the-mill, but that at least presently is not the case in America. The president is a civil servant serving at the will of the people and is subject to all standards applicable to other public servants.

My point is that Trump defenders hide their heads under the sand at their own risk - heads will roll regardless of location (don't believe me? - look at the difficulties Trump is having staffing his administration: the smart do not want to touch it). More prescient members, in fact, are already preparing their parachutes.

The Russians are understandably upset - their rat is out in the light now and he's going to get stepped on.

Democrats need to "man" up and bring into question the patriotism of the Trump Republicans. They are quite literally supporting the enemy. Good luck denying this one y'all, I'm really left wondering if this illegitimate administration will even make it to the midterms...

Local headlines: Orlando Sentinel- a new ride at Disneyworld, Florida Today- NASA wants to launch something. Daytona News- veteran gets beaten up trying to save sea turtle. Flynn? Yep. That's big news in Florida....I actually meant the new Disney cable car. Flynn is not even an after thought.

Trump used that question to complain about unfair media treatment of Flynn.

What a dolt. Trump fired Flynn (because he didn't have his trust) but only after the media (doing their jobs) brought the lie (the fact that he did talk about the sanctions when he said he had not) to light. Dishonest Donald.

He blamed people upset with his victory over Democrat Hillary Clinton for being responsible for media leaks.

He's going to whine about leaks now?

You have more immediate issues to worry about.

But they won't. After smearing Clinton for years, as you say she now provides a convenient distraction from the problems with the current overlord.

Democrats should borrow the GOP tactic of starting investigations and requesting tens of thousands of documents to pour over. Then in those documents you look for other things to go after while leaking select parts to the media. At the end the accused might get off on the original charges but you should be able to find little things to keep investigations going forever, or until after an election.

That's how the Benghazi investigation turned into a private server investigation and a failed real estate transaction investigation produced Monica Lewinsky.

We should know if Trump directed Flynn to contact the Russians. In order to investigate we need copies of all emails Trump and Flynn have sent, personal or private, and any notes from any private meetings they both sat in on.

Democrats should borrow the GOP tactic of starting investigations and requesting tens of thousands of documents to pour over.

Super, that only works if you control the legislature, which, at least for the next two years, the Dems don't. There are other ways, though. Apparently, Trump is planning a purge of intelligence agencies with accompanying investigations. Give him line, I'd say; eventually, he'll hang himself by his own petard.

Meanwhile, whatever happened to Trump's agenda? Really, it's all over for this administration; even if Trump does manage to survive his term, legislative time and public attention will be consumed by these scandals.

Kind of a waste of four potentially productive years, but better than the alternative.

Funny thing ~ bout Clinton, Fizz, is that Dems have decidedly placed her in the past; it is the Repubs who continually resurrect her ghost.

Wow! Now libs finally, finally get it!!

Several reasons exist for this, the most pertinent of which is Dems are focused on the present, a place most Repubs are quite uncomfortable with, so rather than defend their champion Trump, they prefer to revisit long-ended battles.

Really? Like what, Laguna? Please elaborate. Lol

The Russians are understandably upset - their rat is out in the light now and he's going to get stepped on.

Rats can be elusive at times and what happens if the rat evades the shoe or trap. Remember, highly smart and highly agile creatures.

Democrats need to "man" up and bring into question the patriotism of the Trump Republicans.

Will never happen, the left is too busy hugging trees, trying the latest Vegan diet or out in the streets, screaming, whining and having constant hissy fits.

They are quite literally supporting the enemy. Good luck denying this one y'all, I'm really left wondering if this illegitimate administration will even make it to the midterms...

Without a doubt.

I know Laguna, just wishful thinking. :)

And pour should be pore in my post.

Trump: "The leaks are absolutely real."

Trump is the one who lost confidence and trust on Flynn and thus asked him to resign

That is the official line from Trump's administration. The fact is the news outed Flynn, otherwise it would have been business as usual.

Pence didn't know about the lies until news broke because Trump didn't tell him or allow others to tell him.

Well Mattis does not agree with trumpys stance on the media! Is he gonna be fired soon??