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© Copyright 2017 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.Trump on Russian election meddling: 'Nobody really knows for sure'
By KEN THOMAS and DARLENE SUPERVILLE WARSAW, Poland©2024 GPlusMedia Inc.
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FullM3taL
Except the FBI, CIA, and NSA, who briefed the President and his team extensively on it. And, of course, the Russians.
Black Sabbath
Russia interferes in our election.
Trump is silent.
Republicans are silent.
SuperLib
Was it a "nobody really knows for sure so I will not rest until I find who is responsible for this hacking and bring them to justice"? Or was it more of a "nobody really knows for sure, so....oh well, let's just move on and put the whole things behind us" kind of thing?
Republicans are on board with the Democrats in investigating and passing sanctions on Russia. They even helped to include language in the new sanctions that make it hard for Trump to roll back in the event he wants to do something nice for Putin. They do not trust him on this issue and Trump's behavior is the reason, and it goes beyond party lines.
Just my 2 cents...
Trump wants to be the single source of information for Americans and he does not want to have any kind of oversight. I don't think he colluded with the Russians but I think he has a great deal of....what's the word....jealousy(?) for the level of control Putin has over his country, and I think Trump wants that in the US with himself in the position of power.
In order to bolster his own power, he has to chip away at the integrity of those who provide checks and balances. He's attacked the media and judicial branch to try to erode people's trust in them. He's also attacked the FBI, CIA, NSA, voting, and really any organization that might be able to exert a limit to his power. That leaves Trump as the only "credible" source of information to his followers, which means he can make them believe anything he wants, just like Putin.
I think he will shower Putin with praise after he meets him. He admires what he's built in Russia and wants that for himself here in the US. The hacking didn't hurt Trump, it hurt his political opponent, so I honestly believe his reaction is a shrug and "what's the problem?" He's not responding to it because he's just not interested, regardless of being put in a position to protect all Americans. He'd rather the whole thing just go away so he doesn't have to keep tap dancing around questions.
katsu78
Pretty sure someone knows for sure. Namely the people who did it.
Laguna
Yeah, only that, plus expelling 25 diplomats, confiscating two properties likely used by Russian intelligence, and strengthening sanctions.
I think what Trump is trying to say is that Obama didn't publicly accuse Russia during the election. That is a valid point. (Obama has said he didn't want to appear meddling in the election.) But in the same breath, for Trump to say "nobody knows" is disingenuous.
takeda.shingen.1991@gmail.com
Obama failed so miserably, but no harm was done? That makes a lot of sense. ;)
Except for Flynn lying about his Russian connections. And Sessions. And Kushner. There's also the Manafort angle and others as well. Let's just let the investigation run and its course and see where it leads;)
theeastisred
Trump knows perfectly well the Russians interfered in the election, but he doesn't want to face the awful truth that he owes his victory to Putin. Clear as day.
Strangerland
If you're talking about Iraq, Bush & co. were advised by the intelligence agencies that the information was not that strong, but little Bush wanted to finish what big Bush started, and invaded Iraq anyways.
You can't blame that on the intelligence agencies. It's all on Bush & co.
Strangerland
Nope. You are arguing that the leaks of the emails are justified because the content is relevant to the people. Therefore Comey "leaking" his own documents is justified because the content was relevant to the people.
takeda.shingen.1991@gmail.com
Weird, just the other day you were saying there were some legitimate questions regarding Manafort and Flynn. Which is it?
ThePBot
Translation: Yeah, there's definitely evidence of Russian intervention in our elections, but I won't say that because I've always said it's fake news, and I won fair and square, and there were millions of people at my inauguration, it was fantastic and beautiful by the way, believe me, and so that's why I like to play as if other countries could've hacked the election, not just Russia who I have business ties with, but of course that's also fake news because I won the majority votes not Hillary who Obama thought was going to win, and it's all his fault for hiding this information when he was still the President, like just before I won bigly which shows that whatever Obama didn't release to the public about Russiarr, it's all fake news anyways because such as now I'm the Precedent and the Dems are still mad that I won and the fake news media who I beat in a wrestling match won't stop covfefe it.
PTownsend
By even asking this question you're admitting he's too thin skinned to handle the heat in the kitchen. The US President, as opposed to a company president - or a leader of a totalitarian regime, MUST work in adversarial situations. At all times.
I agree. It's strange that so many want to criticize those who think that a foreign government might have tried to 'meddle' (Trump's choice of word) with the US election and shut down the investigation before findings are made. I'm sure in Russia things would be handled differently.
Toasted Heretic
And there it is. It's not Trump's fault; the blame lies with the people. Oh yes.
Strangerland
Investigation completed? No.
Strangerland
No, the electoral college did. The people were for Hillary.
Toasted Heretic
And how many of Merkel's opponents have been murdered and/or met with mysterious deaths? How many German journalists have lost their lives because of their reporting on Merkel?
Strangerland
Ahh, so you'd agree that Comey's released notes only damaged Trump because Trump stupidly said the things Comey released, and because it was true, correct? Since you seem to be back to the idea that the leaks of the emails were ok because the content was relevant to the people. Same as with Comey's releases.
Swift_Justice
Not yet. But, to your clear chagrin, the investigations have't been concluded.
Swift_Justice
So it's okay for Trump to ignore the interference, but Obama's actions regarding the interference were unacceptable light? Got it.
Strangerland
There has never been anything that showed Trump Tower was being wiretapped, which was Dear Leader's claim. Anything else is a strawman.
Toasted Heretic
Finally he gets it!
Excuse momentary off topic observation but I am shocked at the amount of personal info people give away online.
However, if one is President; it's all up for discussion. Esp when one's private life and beliefs can affect the nation and its well being.
Strangerland
Nope. Trump got his 'information' from a Breitbart article, which turned out to be fake news.
As much as you would like to believe there was some basis in reality for his claims, there weren't.
His communications were not being monitored.
The end result, location, and method were all wrong.
Jimizo
There are those who think the previous president could have sued Trump and the other purveyors of rancid trash and filth for defamation.
I hope the MSM don't sink that low and end up in court. So far they haven't. I'd say that's a point to be praised, but when you consider that you are praising someone for not sinking to the level of the current occupant of the whitehouse, that isn't really a mark of virtue.
Reporting on the Russia issue is a newsworthy. Just don't go so far into the sewer you meet people at the level of the president of the United States.
Swift_Justice
Yes, that point. I said if Trump's people aren't clear or collusion is found, we'll hear you all start impugning the investigators. You promptly replied by claiming the investigators lacked credibility.
In an attempt to bolster your argument that the media is "out to get Trump."
Swift_Justice
You sure are doing your best to discredit the investigators. Somehow you think the investigators would go to the lengths of planting evidence merely because they supported democrats, but you don't think anyone on Trump's team could possibly have colluded with Russia.
The logical inference is that republicans are above suspicion but democrats are inherently corrupt. This is the exact same thing the Russian posters were spewing in social media during the campaign. But you know this already, comrade.
Your "fact" is an opinion, unless you have some evidence to back it up. I'm not holding my breath given your track record of making naked assertions without any supporting evidence and then bouncing on to the next topic when challenged, the hallmark of a good journalist.
Strangerland
I find it hilarious the right-wingers who are so hellbent on trying to say all the news is fake simply because they don't like the content of it.
plasticmonkey
Trump says it like he feels it, and most of it is juvenile, delusional, and offensive trash.
Besides using Twitter to demean anyone who bruises his ego or disagrees with him, what specifically has he done to 'stick an eye' into the corrupt system? You mean like not hiring family members or billionaires? You mean like not making money off the presidency?
I know. Because you've got a lot of grievances, especially against those who make you feel emasculated. That's the only reason Trump is in the WH.
takeda.shingen.1991@gmail.com
He should, this was one of the worst rabbit hunts and mole chasing in recent memory
Then its obviously not a rabbit hunt. How did those people get access to Trump? Hell, why did 3 members of his cabinet lie about having met with Russian officials. Just a coincidence? Maybe, but I doubt it.
smithinjapan
So, "Nobody really knows if Russia was involved" but in the next sentence he admonishes Obama for not stopping Russian meddling in the election?
Another senile, slurred speech by the king of stupidity and self-contradiction.
takeda.shingen.1991@gmail.com
He did act. https://www.google.co.jp/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2016/12/29/politics/russia-sanctions-announced-by-white-house/index.html
And I wonder what expertise he has in the field? Seems no intelligence heads seem to agree with him.
theeastisred
No, he selectively leaked the Podesta emails because they damaged Hillary, and did not leak anything that would have damaged Trump. As if you were not able to work that out for yourself.
Nobody ever claimed anything like that.
Toasted Heretic
Ah but there are tapes. Oh no, wait - that was another Trump lie.
Swift_Justice
Sure, because he only started spewing repugnant comments after he threw his hat in the political ring.
Swift_Justice
This is a demonstrably false statement. The intelligence agencies were not incorrect on Iraq, a republican administration cherry-picked intelligence to support its desire to go to war. Good thing facts last longer than some people's memories.
Swift_Justice
Again, nope.
Swift_Justice
Trump has already admitted it. Then, like most other things, he changed his mind.
Toasted Heretic
One party, one state, one voice, eh?
Strangerland
Fox "News" did this for Obama's entire eight years. You didn't have a problem with that. Since you were ok with it then, you have no place to be against it now. Live by the sword...
Jimizo
Yes, it is. As long as they don't cross the line into slander or libel, they have every right to air or print opinions.
I think news outlets shouldn't sink to the level of the president of the US but if there's a market for it, do it.
Keep playing that tiny violin and wake us up when CNN descends into something as disgusting as birtherism.
Toasted Heretic
The right have equal say every day. The right are the majority and control destinies. But they have to be challenged. Just like the "left" have been challenged. But the American "left" are an odd kettle of fish when you compare them to other countries. Hardly "left" at all.
But wanting them silenced is disturbing, to say the least. That's why Trump and the Polish leader get on so well. He's trying to control the media in Poland.
theeastisred
Trump claimed that Obama wiretapped him, which was total made-up nonsense, or to be more accurate, a lie. Anybody saying anything different on this topic is also telling a lie. Defending lies with lies is not a very effective tactic - take a look at Sean Spicer, for example.
Jimizo
It sounds like you are saying Trump's claim was utter trash.
Strangerland
Nope. Maybe some on his team, but not the whole team, and not his.
And regardless of that, this was not information he had when he made the claim. His claims were based off the fake news Breitbart posted.
Strangerland
The truth and convenience are unrelated. The truth is the truth.
You keep trying to rewrite the truth so that Dear Leader doesn't look like he was stupid enough to not only believe fake news, but to also tweet about it. But he did, whether you like it or not.
Swift_Justice
Two birth certificate from the State of Hawaii weren't enough for Trump . . . This argument is weak.
Keep repeating the Fox talking points. By your logic, no lawyer or judge that doesn't agree with your politics had any credibility.
Some members of his team was being monitored because they were speaking with foreign agents, namely Russians.
SuperLib
Let's clear some things up here.
The FBI, CIA and NSA have all concluded that it was Russia. They've even gone on record to explain how they did it.
Trump has even said he agrees. In a press conference in January he said, "As far as hacking, I think it was Russia."
So we're not waiting for the investigation to finish, it's already done, and they've already made their conclusions. Trump danced around the issue during the election but clearly came out and said he believe Russia was involved. What he's doing now is saying it could be Russia and "others", and we just don't know (about the others).
By discrediting the intelligence agencies he can convince his followers that the agencies can't be trusted, and he even throws in Iraq for good measure. All of that is being done to justify a softer response (or no response at all) to Russia.
This also goes to the heart of the issue when I said, "Trump wants to be the single source of information for Americans" above. We can see it here:
You can read more about the issue here: http://www.factcheck.org/2017/07/trump-misleads-russia-hacking/
Strangerland
Investigation completed? No.
Toasted Heretic
Yes; online Trump supporters being paid by the Kremlin. I posted 3 links but apparently frowned on?
Have 2, then.
https://www.theguardian.com/media/2016/nov/06/troll-armies-social-media-trump-russian
http://www.businessinsider.com/russia-internet-trolls-and-donald-trump-2016-7
Swift_Justice
More incorrect trash. Lawyers understand that complex issues take time to resolve; that's their job.
Do you want leaks so you can get information from the multiple investigations, or do you detest leaks? Oh, wait, your one of those "it's vile when it dies t support my position, but completely acceptable when it does" people.
Swift_Justice
Assuming Trump is cleared, etc. If your side doesn't "win," we'll get to hear whinging about how the investigators were biased, etc. The right has already begun by attempting to impugn Mueller and his deputies.
So you agree Fox and Breitbart are full of partisan political hacks?
Wait, you allegedly are a journalist with a respected news outlet. How is your alleged employer not MSM?
gcbel
its trademark Trump, position himself on all sides of an issue admit, sort of admit, deny it... allows his supporters to point to any of his statements that comport with their view at the time. Pick one. Time after time same modus operandi. Makes reducing cognitive dissonance easy. The ultimate dishonest politician.
And who's he kidding he knows darn well the Russians meddled. Muddying the waters at this point.. impeach the...
PTownsend
Are you arguing for the MSM (whatever that means) to push for US media to become state controlled? I think that's what Bannon, Trump etal want, that's why they bash it daily. They definitely want to undermine it. Trump already has FOX 'news' among other outlets under his control, so he's clearly made a start.
Toasted Heretic
Do I have to? Seriously; where is Sean these days?
gcbel
Really simple. It's part of his job description to protect and defend our country and institutions against foreign attacks. If he can't do the job (as in not be clear and not respond to such attacks - because ego narcissistic issues) then yeah, impeach or article 25. That simple.
For the record, I've never claimed the Russians actually succeeded in swinging the election or that Trump was guilty of colluding (just being stupid about how he handled it).
They did. He is president. His actions are making it clearer day by day that he is unfit to stay president. Nixon was elected. Would've been impeached.
theeastisred
people bussed in for a fee. the cheering crowds were promised by the Polish government as a condition for Trump's visit - like the 'rider' for music performers who demand a Rolls-Royce, champagne backstage etc.
plasticmonkey
OK then, he is "ein Übermensch". He controls not thousands, but millions. Do yourself proud. He is a now a bona fide big man (little man) that makes other big men (little men) feel great again. Put it on a hat, t-shirt, bumper sticker, tweet, whatever. As someone who lost relatives to so-called "übermenschen", I am appalled by your flippancy in regard to this term.
Maybe you ought to read a little history while you're at it. We've gone through millions of years of evolution to arrive at this idiotic Trump moment. Is this your utopian resolution? As you must have learned in school, some of the more important duties of journalists are to frame issues in social and historic contexts, to reflect on the implications of rhetoric, to give voice to those without a voice (and not to vilify them), and to leave open to the public the possibility of something better.
Swift_Justice
Funny how you are so omniscient when it comes to things that support your opinion.
You, for one. And:
https://www.google.co.jp/amp/www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/russian-trolls-hilary-clinton-fake-news-election-democrat-mark-warner-intelligence-committee-a7657641.html%3Famp
https://www.google.co.jp/amp/s/amp.businessinsider.com/russia-internet-trolls-and-donald-trump-2016-7
plasticmonkey
Socratic dialog, begone, I will have no more of thee!
plasticmonkey
Then prove it's not true, and stop with the whining. You're a journalist. Wield your mighty pen/keyboard.
7sky7
Trump continually acts and says ridiculous things. I, and others in the world, hope he does not do the stupid thing and lead the world into war, but if it's financially a gain for him and his rich cronies, he'll go there, Russian intervention be damned, I mean ignored. What a dangerous, egotistical and crass idiot he is, prioritizing the Russian intervention for friendship with Putin over wanting to find the truth. He wants to be a fascist, like Putin, but he's too dumb to realize it, as he puts down the CIA and all the agencies he should be respecting, but such an infant, decides they are incompetent because they don't kiss his butt. The worry is, he'll kiss Putin's.
Jimizo
Only by very stupid or very partisan people. There are still reputable outlets such as the Washington Post that you wouldn't trust completely, but would trust over trash right and trash left outlets. The journalists of this paper tend to be extremely bright and literate, presenting arguments in a logical and often educational way. I particularly like the financial section which helps people who are semi-literate on economics like myself. Their coverage of the Russia issue has been very refreshing in its balance.
It depends who is coming out with 'facts'. For example, I can't imagine Washington Post journalists making fake claims about non-existent sex tapes, Muslims celebrating 9/11 in New York or the existence of non-partisan historians writing that the Bush years were a success,
I think the likes of Twitter, Punch and Judy media and the internet itself have increased the proliferation of stupid trash and lies, but I still have faith in those with a respect for truth.
I'm sure you'd agree.
plasticmonkey
Ouch. Clever.
mukashiyokatta
Nobody really knows for sure -- can the same thing be said about US "voter fraud??" THAT bothers you, yet Russian intervention doesn't -- hmm.
MeanRingo
Let's just face it, the election was rigged. Trump called it. He already knew. Hopefully he doesn't destroy the world in the next four years and that Americans will get their heads out of their asses and not re-elect this con man again.
PTownsend
All? Bifurcate much? But then I've read in totalitarian systems people are taught to think only in us - them terms.
I think there's enough evidence for me to believe that.
One form of meddling, the sockpuppets posting on social media and online forums, probably affected many Trump supporters.
I think Trump has business dealings with different Russian oligarchs.
That's for the investigations and courts to determine.
Who knows if they do and how 'bad' they were. I do wonder if Russians somewhere do have pictures of the golden shower scenes, though.
I'll wait until the investigations conclude.
I'll wait until the investigations conclude.
There was voter fraud, like there is every election. What I question are the numbers Trump and his people claim.
CNN has shown bias. But that's a reality of a free press. The good part of having a free press in the US is that people have choices where they get their news and have the ability to decide for themselves what to believe unlike counties with state controlled media like in Russia, North Korea, Iran, Turkey, Saudi Arabia and others.
They're working for a private for profit business. They can 'attack' all they want, as long as they don't break laws and their sponsors continue to pay up.
Why won't he release his actual tax info, not the sanitized leak Maddow used?
PTownsend
I don't think extreme rightists and people from countries with state controlled media understand how a free press works. Nor the 1st Amendment to the US Constitution. The US has laws to protect people from slander and libel. In a market economy, media businesses are affected by the market.
Strangerland
Do what I say, not what I do. Seems legit.
PTownsend
Extreme rightists and those from states that control their media (and their people) are the ones I find constantly complaining about a free press and for profit media.
They don't seem to understand the notion of choice, they don't seem to understand that people can choose where they get their information and reason for themselves. They want their leader to tell them how to think and what to believe.
No true conservative would argue for limiting what the media print and how they report it, assuming what's printed is not illegal.
Jimizo
Great. Now let's shout down stupid trash on Twitter such as fake sex tapes, Muslims celebrating on 9/11, and shout down those people who claim the existence of non-partisan historians writing favorably about Bush.
Then we can both say "Kudos!"
gcbel
Gotta hand it to Dishonest Donald, he knows how to muddy an issue and sow confusion.
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/07/donald-trump-present-reasonable-doubt/532779/
Nessie
Police officer: "Sir, do you have any idea how fast you were going?"
Driver: "Nobody really knows for sure."
toshiko
I wonder if Put in will bring his dog to meeting. The dog scared German Chancellor who was recovering dog bytes.
Or he will be in time. Abe waited three hours.
The former KGB agents have all tricks.
smithinjapan
Blacklabel: "So it's a positive thing to call out the leader of a country and accuse him personally of election meddling when it's unproven still?"
This from a guy who supports a man who perpetually lies about wiretapping and what not with ZERO proof and then later DEMANDS you no longer as questions about what he said? hahaha.
Swift_Justice
You too. Until next time, eh.
Laguna
Anyway, he gave a great speech in Warsaw, the first attacked, the center of resistance to the Nazis and Stalin's Soviet Union, until it was brutally crushed and then enslaved for a half century:
Inspiring. I'd never considered the war from that angle. No doubt that will be listed by historians alongside Kennedy's "Ich bin ein Berliner" or Reagan's "Tear down that wall!"
The rest of his speech was more forward-looking, concerning how Western civilization must betray the very values that has made it so successful in order to save itself. Finally, a rallying point: Trumpism - destroy the village to save it.
Jimizo
I'm not saying they should be shut down. I'm saying they should be criticised for coming out with such trash.
Do you think people who put out lies like non-partisan historians writing that the Bush years were a success should be criticised?
Toasted Heretic
Trump tells it like it isn't, you mean.
And it is too bad for America as it continues to slide into further isolation and internal division.
How utterly sad to see the US become a pariah. A rogue nation. Putin must be delighted with the outcome.
takeda.shingen.1991@gmail.com
Honesty, that doesn't make sense to me. How is it that he can accept that a country interfered in the olympics, but he can't bring himself to say the country's name. Odd.
Simon Foston
No? Well, here's an interesting thing - quoth UN Ambassador Nikki Haley:
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/nikki-haley-everybody-knows-russia-vladimir-putin-donald-trump-cut-it-out-hamburg-a7831381.html
So Trump "tells it like it is", does he?
Daniel Naumoff
The integrity of seeing the same "people" with the same reasoning and the same "scores" is disgusting, of course, but still an integrity... Wish this U.S.A. circus would not wind up on the side, though.
Swift_Justice
Odd.
Jimizo
Trump has spewed more trash in the last year than any other president has spewed in a lifetime. He's in a trash class of his own.
WilliB
It is not only amazing how the media are still repeating this stupid "Russia" claim without even having defined what "Russia" is supposed to have done, it is also amazing that there is a whole group of commentators here who actually repeat this nonsense. CNN clearly has a loyal customer base here, who happily stay within their low-information bubble.
Blacklabel
Exactly what Im getting at. How does Russians meddling in the election= Trump himself must be impeached? 62 million people VOTED for him, dont they get any say in who is their President?
Thats why he wont clearly say either way, cause people try to use it against him like that.
Blacklabel
Yeah I watched CNN last night and they went out of their way to talk about how much Poland loves 'US Presidents' and that their warm welcome had nothing at all to do with Donald Trump. This was being said while people were chanting DONALD TRUMP! DONALD TRUMP! in the background lol
Everyone have a good weekend, and enjoy whatever combination of beach/beer/bikinis/family time suits you.
We all have some of that in common at least.
bass4funk
No, I believe in democracy and freedom of speech even if the person utters something idiotic and there's No shortlist of that.
We can say that now, we have all the reason to!
No, but when you have 98% of the media thinking one way and especially when it involves someone they despise, you can most definitely call it fake, seen more than enough of it, but libs should be happy they control the media, now if only they can translate that power into winning elections, they might be taken as credible....might.
Wolfpack
Those trying to defend Obama's failure to protect against Russian meddling in the 2016 election keep pretending that he did act but can only offer up actions taken after the election was over and Hillary lost. By then Putin already had Podesta's emails and was waging a propaganda campaign utilizing American media platforms. Any minor actions to close down a few compounds and expell diplomats was too little and way too late. America needs a special counsel to investigate the Obama Administrations failures leading up to the November election.
FizzBit
IM sure the NSA is recording all of this, So, the NSA knows. Anyone who believes the corporate news is just a fool.
bass4funk
Hmmm, so you want the right to have an equal say and equality between the two parties? You don't thing think anyone believes that, do you?
And with good reason, once you closely examine the players in this.
But the difference is, the individuals that ARE don't deny it. Hannity never would hide the fact that he is a conservative or a Trump supporter, nothing wrong with that, now on the other hand, Morning Joe tries to pass himself off as a conservative when he clearly isn't, not even close and again, nothing wrong with it, but at least he should own up to it. I don't have a problem with a person being a partisan, but I do have a problem with people pretending or leading people to believe they are not.
How about this, my private life and the details of it are my business only.
Blacklabel
Mueller did that to himself by hiring every Clinton lawyer he could find. He could have at least made an attempt to not look partisan in who he selected. But I still have hope that the investigation will be fair and get to the bottom of it.
yet there is proof that his phone calls and those of his team were being monitored and transcripts being leaked. We didnt know that before Trump brought up wiretapping. So it served its purpose to say it and Im sure Susan Rice will be asked more when she finally testifies.
bass4funk
For example?
Gosh, I wish the left would live by that same creed.
I felt the last 8 years was exactly like that.
The only thing that I know for a fact are liberals that think the progressive and socialist is the ONLY way and the RIGHT way to go.
Actually, it's not the point at all.
Some of them, yes. To coheres someone or to plant evidence is not something that is a possible far stretch. Remember, they are human after all.
bass4funk
I try, but yeah, I am proud of my country for the first time in a long time.
i know full well what it means, thank you.
All that evolution and all the division, it's all so sad, but a huge relief to that disaster we had over the last 8 years, I just hope that the left will calm down and realize that moaning and crying won't help at all and nothing will change No matter how they try and try.
Yes, sadly, the journalistic standards of what we learned back in the day is behind us, we now live in a day where you don't need a single verifiable source to be believed. Now you can say anything and it's just considered "fact."
Yes, I do believe that, can I prove it, of course not, but I think it's just so strange that Mueller hires this dream team of lawyers and 5 of them are huge Democrat donors.....you may think nothing is wrong with it, but I smell blood in the water. I can see a mile away what this thing is morphing into.
Not true, but Dems do think they are smarter, slicker and more calculating than conservatives.
Who are these Russian posters you keep referring to and do you have any verifiable proof of this?
bass4funk
No, I just don't see things through rose-colored glasses.
Prove it.
I don't whine, but I will say this, Dems the party of know it all believe in everything for the reality that they are a party lost in the wilderness, all the smarts and all the education, and vegan lifestyle still couldn't help them win elections.
Calling the Democratic party stupid is an understatement.
I am glad we get along! Kudos!
bass4funk
As long as it is done fairly, you should scrutinize the president, but every president or leader spews trash to a certain extent, Trump tells it like it is and if other countries don't like it, that's too bad because the man is not going to change and that was one of the reasons he was chosen for being direct, sticking an eye into the corrupt system and to call out both parties and tell the Washington elite what they needed to hear for a very long time as well as the Europeans and that makes me feel good.
Blacklabel
Nice try on an apples to oranges/strawman type thing. Comey's leaks are simply his perception without any context of what happened. Trump is disputing some of the things he said as incorrect, remember? There is no evidence Trump said those things outside of Comey himself writing it down in a self serving way.
Emails, different story. The person who sent it cant say they didnt say it, plus I get to read it in context with the replies to determine what it means.
Blacklabel
It has not been proven to his satisfaction based on the evidence presented to him. Obama on the other hand, confirmed that he was satisfied with the evidence, yet did nothing. Two different things.
Blacklabel
So for whatever reason, he knew people had information they shouldnt have about his and his teams phone communications. So he reasonably considered it must be that Trump Tower was wiretapped. However, it appears that his communications WERE being monitored, just not in the location and by the method he thought. Its not like he wasnt being monitored at all and transcripts being sent throughout the government. The end resylt was correct, he just got location and method wrong.
Blacklabel
His and his team's . If they werent, where did the leaked transcripts of Michael Flynn's phone calls come from?
No it sounds like I am saying Obama and his buddies were listening in to his and team's calls for political purposes. Investigation into that is ongoing.
Blacklabel
Thats convenient. Only the ones who I can prove were being monitored actually were, but no others.
Im quite sure that a person knows when they hear things repeated in the media that the media would have no way to know, that someone is monitoring his conversations. Details of a phone call between himself and a trusted person, as an example. He knows he didnt tell the media and the trusted person didnt, so how else is what they spoke about the basis of a NY Times article?
But its ok, to try to prove Trump collusion they will have to also admit to wiretapping/illegal surveillance/unmasking as the methods to get the information they have.
bass4funk
Not that point.
I'm not adding or trying anything personal not my style. I'm just mentioned what I do.
Do the left know about this???
FizzBit
I find it hilarious the insane lefties defending the neo-liberal corporate MSM warmongering. I'm guessing the Russiapologists have Silicone Sally to talk to.
Blacklabel
Oh yeah that could have had some impact on voter decisions, if true. If they actually believed what was written in the articles and on social media. But it still didnt change any actual votes to Trump from Hillary within the voting systems. It seems there was also enough confirmed real stuff within Podesta and Wikileaks things to also hurt Hillary, so I dont know how we can measure the impact of these troll/bot armies on the election.
More importantly, we should be looking into ways to stop that method from working next time as part of this overall Russia investigation. As I keep saying, deal with technology and systems to prevent this from happening again instead of witch hunting individuals. The systems and their security are the key to attempted hacking/influence not becoming actual hacking/influence.
Blacklabel
Yeah Putin voted- not 62 million Americans. Putin also wrote all of the Podesta emails and installed the server in Hillary's house and everything else that made her lose.
He knew just enough about the Electoral College system to make Trump win while actually getting less votes.
He was able to accurately consider any voter fraud that might happen and where, predict that Comey would let Hillary go and lead Trump to victory. Seriously?
Asakaze
This election meddling / hacking thing is getting more and more weird. No hard evidence presented, only grim-faced statesmen with speeches and long documents full of "we are positively sure", "we definitely presume" and "we absolutely believe" as selling points. And then deafening choir of the press and ordinary zealots - "yeahh, Russians did it! Anybody who does not believe in it is a traitor to the cause!!!"
Sorry, but you want to make sober and sane people to believe in all that vague CIA stuff? Seriously, after Colin Powell performance at UN with "100-percent proof of Saddam's nukes"?? I remember it, the hysteria was the same - "Those French scoundrels do not believe us, let's punish them, let's rename French fries into Freedom fries".
Blacklabel
Sorry, Podesta's emails only damaged Hillary because (a) he stupidly wrote them and (b) they were true. Putin had nothing to do with either of those things.
the investigation into Russian interference in the election is ongoing as you guys live to say. So proof that is actually WAS Russia or not will be part of that.
Blacklabel
The media (and some of you) just cant wait until Trump admits that Russia meddled in the election.
You will ignore the fact that no votes were changed and no one has proven the meddling was a success.
The media wants to say:
Trump admits Russia meddled= Trump knew= Trump asked them to do it= Trump only won because of it= Trump is illegetimate= must be impeached for something= he knew! thats proof of collusion= impeachment
Yet the guy who actually DID know is just:
Obama admits Russia meddled= Obama knew= ah well, thats ok he's a good guy must have had a good reason to not tell us= continued luxury vacations
Blacklabel
I just cant understand how in spite the investigation not being done and despite no released evidence to confirm any of it, all of you seem to think that:
Russia certainly meddled in the election
This meddling somehow elected Trump despite no votes being changed
Trump personally colluded with Russia
Trump obstructed justice
Russia has Trump emails as bad as Hillary's but chose to not release them
All parts of the Russia dossier are true
Everything that James Comey says is true, except the parts where he said Hillary committed crimes or the part where he said Loretta Lynch obstructed justice.
There is no way that any illegal votes were cast, despite people in jail for election/registration fraud.
CNN has rarely, if ever, reported news with bias, incorrect news or fake news specifically with the purpose to screw Trump.
Mika and Joe have never unfairly attacked Trump over policy or personal issues, to include appearance.
Did I miss any?
Blacklabel
yes, it is. Once it is confirmed as accurate and true like the emails already were.
bass4funk
Here is the difference, the left control the media and the print media overwhelmingly 5 to 1, so I really wouldn't call that balanced at all.
You are joking, right???!
No one wants the left silenced, I don't, I just want them to act like responsible adults and do their job WITHOUT interjecting their personal feelings into politics unless they are paid to express their opinion, if not, just deliver the news and shut up about your personal beliefs.
If Trump has THAT kind of power to control thousands of people, then he is without a doubt "ein Übermensch"
Blacklabel
@smithinjapan Because Obana himself said he knew it was Russia, after the election. so if he believed that he should have acted. trump however is not convinced it was Russia and only Russia.
investigation not finished as you guys like to say. Prove it and he has to believe it.
Blacklabel
Smart answer by the President. He is not required to believe the 4 intelligence agencies about who did it. It seems he understands it happened but the who part it still in question to him. Nothing wrong with that.
Like he said the intelligence agencies have been wrong before and caused a war. Let's wait until the investigations are all done and see what proof they show us about who did it and how.
Blacklabel
Once again there were attempts at interference that were seen by intelligence. No one has proven it was successful and no one has proven any votes were changed. This is what should be investigated not witch hunts on individuals.
As the President, he can accept or refuse the intelligence opinion of who it was. He can choose to act or not act based on what he thinks is best. Powers of the president.
Blacklabel
so Trump takes the intelligence agencies at their word despite the fact that they obviously haven't proven to HIS satisfaction that it was Russia. Despite the fact that no actual vote changes happened. Despite his FBI not having seen the DNC server.
so he confronts Putin harshly , ruins any potential collaboration on things like Syria and puts us closer to all out war. Then we find out from the ongoing investigations that it wasn't really Russia after all. Will you be blaming intelligence agencies? Nope you will blame Trump just like Bush was blamed.
we elected Trump for president so it's his decision, we didn't elect any intelligence agencies.
Blacklabel
So it's a positive thing to call out the leader of a country and accuse him personally of election meddling when it's unproven still? Do you think he will react well to that and want to be friends and work together on common issues?
When trump calls out Merkel for legit things you guys talk how mean he is and how it is non productive. But putin? To suit the media narrative just accuse him of anything and everything with no thought of consequences
bass4funk
Why weird? I meant what I said about them, haven't changed my positions about them. I was referring to the president.
bass4funk
I hope and pray they continue, so that we can get this behind us, shut the left up and move forward.
True, but NOT to do a purposely orchestrated daily hit jobs, that's not being part of a FREE press, that being a political partisan hack.
...and with the help of the MSM the US as well.
bass4funk
Anyone arrested? No. Anyone impeached? No.
Again, if there were something on that reel, it would have been brought out to the public.
Keep looking under the stores and the biggest thing that might be uncovered is either Blackbeard's lost treasure or dried up bugs.
Wolfpack
I feel pretty sure that Russia did. President Obama knew and could only muster a stern "cut it out" to Putin. Of course the US has meddled in the elections of other nations quite a bit over the years so what's the big deal? The Russians didn't change any votes - they only played the propaganda game - which is quite similar to the propaganda game the Leftist American media plays domestically.
Mitt Romney made a fool of Obama by correctly stating that Russia is a significant threat to America's interests ( though I personally believe China is the bigger threat to all free nations). Russia tried to mess with the French election but they somehow had no trouble combating Putin's influence. How Obama failed so miserably leading up to the 2016 election is a mystery to me. But in the end no harm was done. There remains little if any evidence for the ridiculous charge that Trump colluded with Russia to defeat Clinton.
bass4funk
The left would never do if hundreds of agents and lawyers would testify that Trump had nothing to do with any of this, they would just find something else to pound him with. Just a fact. So if I were Trump, I would just ignore the media and do what I need to do and stop following the left down their rabbit holes.
That depends, most Republicans just want this behind them, many of them were former attorneys and they know if there was a gold nugget, we would have heard about it a long time ago.
I really don't think so, I think he just wants the media to be fair and they haven't and everyone knows it whether you are a hater or supporter. Yes, some of what Trump says is self-inflicted, but overall, the MSM have been brutal from day one and will continue to be towards Trump or any conservative.
I don't he's jealous, we all know that Putin runs the country with an Iron fist and through fear and intimidation. I think if the left would tone down their hostility towards this president, I lot of the rhetoric that comes from him would equally resolve itself.
And with good reason, you have to be either on some serious drugs or a complete idiot to believe those 3 agencies on any issue after what we have seen with Comey and what the rest can do.
He should, this was one of the worst rabbit hunts and mole chasing in recent memory.