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Manning convicted of espionage, but not of aiding enemy

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Of course he was found guilty. He's being tried by the very institution that is trying to keep people from knowing what they are really doing around the world. And he's gay = guilty.

-3 ( +13 / -16 )

Manning should get a Nobel Prize.

We need more like him to prevent the U.S.A. turning into the 21st century version of the USSR.

-1 ( +17 / -18 )

Only too bad the traitor won't face the firing squad.

-16 ( +5 / -21 )

U.S. soldier Manning found guilty of espionage for passing documents to WikiLeaks

Nice job again with the title....(sarcasm) He already had pleaded guilty to around half the charges against him and he was found NOT GUILTY of the most serious charge which could have landed him in Leavenworth for the rest of his natural life

He was found NOT GUILTY on Tuesday of the most serious charge against him, aiding the enemy . Which would have been a more appropriate title considering the situation and charges against him. He still faces well over 100 years in prison if given the maximum sentence allowable for each of the charges he was found guilty of.

Again, he already plead guilty to nearly half the charges, so in effect he was only "found" guilty on 8 of the remaining 10 charges. The espionage charge that he was found guilty of will probably land him in jail for at least 15 years alone. And jail at Leavenworth is hard labor, this guy has a hard life left ahead of himself.

-1 ( +5 / -6 )

And jail at Leavenworth is hard labor, this guy has a hard life left ahead of himself.

I am not sure if he will make it there. Leavenworth is a very tough place to be.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Yubaru Jul. 31, 2013 - 07:46AM JST The espionage charge that he was found guilty of will probably land him in jail for at least 15 years alone.

This has never been a fair trial. The espionage issue was a bit of a stretch. The prosecution didn't make a strong enough case against Manning on this issue. More likely 40+ years if serving concurrently.

-7 ( +6 / -13 )

I am not sure if he will make it there. Leavenworth is a very tough place to be. Besides he is a gay.

Seeing as he is still in the army odds are he'll go to Leavenworth, gay or not won't make a difference. Besides that the Army has few confinement facilities in the US, besides a regional one somewhere out west I believe, the only option is Leavenworth.

2 ( +3 / -1 )

Bradley Manning will spend the rest of his life in jail, but the people who killed 92 children as 'collateral damage' remain free.

9 ( +15 / -6 )

On the one hand, I approve of wikileaks because I don't like the government keeping secrets. On the other, wikileaks is giving out the name of spies and putting a lot of people in danger. Not to mention, despite how much we hate it, there are certain parts of the government (only certain parts) that should be kept secret.

0 ( +6 / -6 )

Yeah, Manning already pleaded guilty to some of the charges, enough to get him at least 15-20 years in prison. But the count against aiding the enemy should be a high bar; otherwise, any journalism leak could be classified as aiding the enemy.

Some of the stuff he leaked could be argued the public has the right to know, like when the military mistakenly targets civilians. But some of the other stuff he leaked, like diplomatic cable stuff, doesn't really help the public good. If Manning had just focused on stuff that really matters, instead of the shotgun approach, then the focus of the trial story would be more on what's for the public good, rather than all the other sideshows the unnecessary leaks caused.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

jailed for a total of 136 years for handing classified information to WikiLeaks, the anti-secrecy website headed by Julian Assange.

This is ridiculous.

-1 ( +7 / -8 )

He dosen'yt look like a soldier at all, even in his full regalia.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

@Wooster-san

We need more like him to prevent the U.S.A. turning into the 21st century version of the USSR.

I'm no great fan of the US, but lets not get carried away here sir. If this had happened in the USSR (or in communist china today) this gentleman wouldn't even be receiving a trial. He would have simply "disappeared".

The military is a harsh institution no matter which country you serve. Its one of the few places left in society where you are expected to live up to your oaths. Mr Manning had a duty. A sworn duty. He was flagrantly derelict in upholding his duty. I have no sympathy.

2 ( +9 / -7 )

I hope they at least give him 90 years. Traitors don't deserve freedom.

A lot of secrets are secret for very good reasons. Places like Wikileaks, who give out secrets willy-nilly should be held accountable too.

Things that are to do with national/international security should be kept secret. I'm sure Wikileaks would still have enough tell-tailing to do if they only focused on the banks and big business.

And, the dumbest comment of the day award goes to:

Of course he was found guilty. He's being tried by the very institution that is trying to keep people from knowing what they are really doing around the world. And he's gay = guilty.

-3 ( +8 / -11 )

He was also guilty of leaking graphic cockpit footage of two U.S. Apache attack helicopters killing 12 civilians on a Baghdad street in 2007

Was this taken in mitigation?

But he was cleared of the courtmartial’s most controversial charge, that of “aiding the enemy.”

After all, one doesn't throw stones in glass houses.

0 ( +5 / -5 )

Manning should get a Nobel Prize.

We need more like him to prevent the U.S.A. turning into the 21st century version of the USSR.

He is getting a prize, life in prison, hopefully. The best outcome for him. As for a Noble, why NOT, you don't really need to do anything these days to earn it, like our President. Manning is getting exactly what he deserved.

-4 ( +7 / -11 )

He got off pretty light - considering that everyone who gets a security clearance fully understands the consequences of disclosing classified information (which isn't always life in prison).

0 ( +6 / -6 )

If he had just released whistle-blowing information I'm betting he would have walked away with a few scrapes. But since he release anything he could get his hands on, he brought this on himself.

He's going to be in prison for a long time. Better pack enough lingerie.

0 ( +5 / -5 )

What? Did anyone expect less from this kangaroo trial?

Washington will use Mannings verdict to persuade the world community to extradite other whistleblowers back to the US, since the leaker was acquitted of the capital offense of aiding the enemy, former UK MI5 agent Annie Machon.

Annie Machon:' It has been summed up by the Pentagon which said that no lives have been put at risk by his disclosures. By exposing criminality or the war crimes of the military or intelligence agencies, he is doing a service to the public, or countries and to our democracies. And by doing that, for him to have to face, now, probably 20 years in prison is still a disgrace. Whistleblowers should be protected. They should not be persecuted. They are doing the service to the democracies they live in. They are exposing crime and trying to improve the service of the military and intelligence agencies in their work to protect us.

I was hoping for it. I thought that they might be more heavy handed because the prosecution certainly really pushed. Their closing statement during his trial was incredibly illusive, innuendo laden, trying to make him out the biggest traitor in history. The very robust defense closing statement helped. But for most people, it is a sense of natural justice. This is a young man, self-consciously saying he loves his country, he wants it to improve, he wants to protect the very way of life. That is what he said in very private emails. So, yes sure, it is a good recognition. But it might be a subtle signal to other countries saying look, we are not a totalitarian state, were not going to prosecute whistleblowers at the end degree, send us back the other people that we want like Snowden and Assange.

They are doing it to be vindictive. The US government is doing it to deter future whistleblowers, which obviously has not happened because now we have it with Snowden and it is a complete overreaction to persecute future whistleblowers who are putting the information out there that is very much in the public interest which informs the public what their government and the military are doing and then to say that they are traitors to their country- they are not, they are performing public service. And for them to persecute this young man and for him to potentially spend his entire life in prison for informing us is a sign of a sick democracy. What are we now the enemy? Because he informed the general public around the world what has been going wrong with the American democracy.'

6 ( +11 / -5 )

so off to jail for this traitor... meanwhile, back at the NSA, illegal monitoring of everyone's calls and emails continues with no transparent accountability.... justice for some but not others I guess...

1 ( +5 / -4 )

The real crime occurred back on march 20, 2003, when bush & co. lied to us (yes, I knew he was lying) starting it. Manning did what he felt was right, and good for him. Not all of us Americans on here are muppets to the state.

Que Miss Piggy!!

-1 ( +6 / -7 )

There is a need for sececy but the Govt around the world are getting up to too many dirty tricks and need to be watched and disclosed

0 ( +4 / -4 )

This guy essentially made Wikileaks what it is. without his revelations what have they actually done? Nothing. Shame he is nowhere near as famous as the fraud who runs it. Looks the part too.

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

The message of late seems to be "don't embarrass your government publicly". People who murder others in the US get far, far less serious charges.

-2 ( +7 / -9 )

" The message of late seems to be "don't embarrass your government publicly". People who murder others in the US get far, far less serious charges."

Absolutely agree! How dare the pee-on expose the criminality of the most honorable, venerable, and genteel Empire! That's not treason, it's blasphemy!

3 ( +7 / -4 )

One down, one to go. The Euros can take care of that other guy.

-2 ( +5 / -7 )

This man is a hero, he exposed the brutality of the American army in Iraq and was brave enough to make that public. I think he deserves better than a nobel prize. People condemning him either don't know what they did or will soon get their wish of living in a fascist police state. Evil triumphs when good men stand by and do nothing, he had the courage to stand up.

-1 ( +7 / -8 )

It's simply outrageous he's being treated so harshly by the US justice system. Then again, when has the United States of America ever been known for treating people with fairness and respect? Over the past 60 years or so, it has started bloody wars, overthrown democratically elected leaders, and supported countless nasty dictators. Land of the brave and home of the free, my foot.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

hackney,

Bradley Manning will spend the rest of his life in jail, but the people who killed 92 children as 'collateral damage' remain free.

Excellent point!

Which makes one wonder how come Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, et al. are still walking around free when they indirectly killed hundreds of thousands for no actual reason whatsoever.

0 ( +6 / -6 )

"often the best source of information about waste, fraud, and abuse in government."

"acts of courage and patriotism, which can sometimes save lives and often save taxpayer dollars, should be encouraged rather than stifled as they have been during the Bush administration."

The above quotes are from Obama on his campaign trail talking about open government and the need to protect whistleblowers.

Now it seems he would like an example to be made of Manning and Edward Snowden if they get him.

Now that's change you can believe in!

0 ( +3 / -3 )

Poor guy, the American regime has always been oppressing freedom of press and knowledge of its people to retain control, much like the claims that they lay against North Korea, China, Iran and etc.

3 ( +8 / -5 )

This is not a case of whistleblowing, no matter how anyone tries to paint it. If he were a whistleblower, he could have taken the evidence to the Office of Special Counsel, or to members of the U.S. Congress. Instead, he chose to publicize it, causing damage to the mission, and inflaming sentiments against his fellow soldiers. That's simply treason.

0 ( +5 / -5 )

Which makes one wonder how come Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, et al. are still walking around free when they indirectly killed hundreds of thousands for no actual reason whatsoever.

Because they didn't directly do anything, also they have have nothing to do with Manning. He is the issue of this thread, I believe.

0 ( +4 / -4 )

This is not treason, this is a man who exposed war crimes and human rights abuses committed by the American military. The same war crimes that some of you get angry about dead Japanese people having committed generations ago. The hypocrisy here is baffling. It might not be the USSR yet but it soon will be. You will get the fascist police state you want.

-3 ( +3 / -6 )

Funny how bush and the rest of his gang of war criminals still walk free.

-2 ( +3 / -5 )

" That's simply treason."

How is that defined in your law dictionary? It's easy to say as a layperson that it's treason, and even the ignoramus congressmen throw around the word. But the prosecution didn't bring that charge, and the aiding the enemy charge (now, exactly who the enemy is has become classified) was dropped.

People like Manning, Snowden, Ellsberg, etc. are defenders of liberty.

-1 ( +6 / -7 )

JeanValjean,

now, exactly who the enemy is has become classified

That's something I've always wondered about, too.

The "enemy" according to Bush was "Terror," as in the "War against Terror."

I never managed to work out how you could have a war against a way of fighting. Usually it's people.

And what on Earth did Iraq have to do with terror to warrant the mass invasion and carnage?

Whether you spell it Nobel or Noble, Manning deserves one.

People like him, who switch on the light to show up the barbarism and atrocities are the only hope we have of any true freedom.

-5 ( +3 / -8 )

" People like him, who switch on the light to show up the barbarism and atrocities are the only hope we have of any true freedom."

Bertie, exactly. Instead of the ire being thrown at the messengers for bringing the dirty deeds to light, the anger should rightly be directed at the perpetrators of the dirty deeds. Is that such a difficult concept? For dyed-in-the-wool statists it appears so!

-2 ( +3 / -5 )

There will be some heartbreak in the tin-foil hat army when the numbers come out later on....he's going to get at least 30 years.

The old adage of "can't take the time then don't do the crime" certainly applies here. I don't doubt Manning''s naivety, but he was a willing pawn in the now faltered Assange Reality Show, the only real injustice here is that Assange is living it up with the Ecuadorian elite in a prison of his choosing and Manning whilst Manning takes the hard time.

Heh, still unlike Jules at least Manning will be allowed outside over the next 30 years!

2 ( +4 / -2 )

In a truly Orwellian memory hole style, a certain part of Obamas pre-election material has been scrubbed:

" A little bit from the "ethics agenda":

「Protect Whistleblowers: Often the best source of information about waste, fraud, and abuse in government is an existing government employee committed to public integrity and willing to speak out. Such acts of courage and patriotism, which can sometimes save lives and often save taxpayer dollars, should be encouraged rather than stifled. We need to empower federal employees as watchdogs of wrongdoing and partners in performance. Barack Obama will strengthen whistleblower laws to protect federal workers who expose waste, fraud, and abuse of authority in government. Obama will ensure that federal agencies expedite the process for reviewing whistleblower claims and whistleblowers have full access to courts and due process."

Yeah. Unless, of course, that damning information sheds light on the Administration's wrongdoing, as Mannings did.

That statement seems a bit embarrassing at the very same time Obama's administration is threatening trade sanctions against anyone who grants asylum to Ed Snowden. Also... at the same time that we get to see how whistleblower Bradley Manning's "full access to courts and due process" will turn out. So far, it's been anything but reasonable, considering that the UN has already condemned Manning's treatment as "cruel and inhuman." And people wonder why Snowden left the country...

-3 ( +2 / -5 )

JeanValjean,

You bring up some excellent points.

This article outlines the two "governments," the visible one and the invisible one.

It's an interesting read:

http://www.japanfocus.org/-Peter_Dale-Scott/3971

Again, without people like Manning, Snowden and Assange, we wouldn't know about these things.

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

Jean,

"That statement seems a bit embarrassing at the very same time Obama's administration is threatening trade sanctions against anyone who grants asylum to Ed Snowden."

Because they both ignored the legal whistle-blowing avenues and committed treason by giving stolen information to foreigners. Is this that hard to ingest and process?

One of your "hero's" sold the files he stole to a UK left wing mouthpiece and proceeded to fly into the arms of Chinese intelligence and then unbelievably on to Russian intelligence, before being granted asylum in a tin-pot dictatorship that restricts freedom of the press. The same paradise as the other little creep hiding in London from questioning about his alleged sex crimes.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

" One of your "hero's" sold the files he stole to a UK left wing mouthpiece"

Evidence, please.

Plus, your definition of treason comes from which legal dictionary?

You naively believe the state-approved avenues for whistleblowing are effective for anything other than the reality of silencing the whistleblower.

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

"Evidence, please."

Heh, give my regards to the tooth fairy. Tell her it's been a while.

I note you choose to ignore my allegations that super-powers Russia and China got the goods gratis. Is it a fair assumption that both foreign intelligence services have now had unfettered access to classified material Jean?

"Plus, your definition of treason comes from which legal dictionary?"

Possibly the same as Congress that have chosen for centuries to punish conduct which undermines the government or the national security. Manning has just been found guilty. Cry me a river.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

The invisible government of the Orwellian empire regime has spoken.

Let it be done.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

"You naively believe the state-approved avenues for whistleblowing are effective for anything other than the reality of silencing the whistleblower."

Oh and Jean,

Do you have any incidents to cite of this actually happening, or do I need to don the dapper headgear and watch all of X Files series 2 to fully understand?

0 ( +2 / -2 )

First, if you haven't seen the video of the Apache helicopter killing a reporter, you should. It's on youtube in various places.

Second, Manning should not have been kept in solitary confinement and treated so poorly before any verdict had been reached.

Third, Manning did release things he shouldn't have and needn't have released, aside from the above video, so finding him guilty of espionage is probably a correct finding.

Fourth, of late, not all those convicted of espionage have to do hard time, as some have suggested, but since Manning is basically a nobody, they will continue to treat him badly because they can, so who knows ... we'll just have to wait and see, and so will Manning.

1 ( +3 / -2 )

Mudverts, You can make assumptions if you wish, but you take all the associated risk.

" "Evidence, please." "

"Heh, give my regards to the tooth fairy. Tell her it's been a while."

Then, you have no evidence, do you? Only baseless accusation.

As for citing examples of silenced whistleblowers, you only need look at the list of those prosecuted by the Obama administration.

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

No bickering please.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

If he didn't release these files, who knows how long we could remain in ignorance. Just horrifying, there's more of what we don't know yet and what's awaiting to be revealed.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

Arthur Dumbolov,

You're too right there's more.

I'm waiting for the truth to come out about the events that led to the invasion of Iraq.

I wonder if Manning and Wikileaks know something about that!

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

Had Manning NOT leaked at least the Collateral Murder footage, does anyone actually believe it would have ever voluntarily come to light by the "official channels "? Believing so would truly be tinfoil hattery.

Both Manning and Snowden should be given Presidential Pardons. After all, they directly assisted the president in keeping his otherwise unkept campaign promise of increased transparency. Otherwise, the only transparency the Obama administration has shown is in being transparently pernicious.

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

Jean: Had Manning NOT leaked at least the Collateral Murder footage, does anyone actually believe it would have ever voluntarily come to light by the "official channels "?

Manning could have just as easily released that information and probably gotten away with it since it is legitimate whistle blowing. But not everyone is ignoring what you choose to ignore, and that is in addition to relevant whistle blowing information he also released generally private information for reasons that can be no other than just wanting people to see them. I've yet to hear any Manning/Assange supporter even come close to addressing that and I suspect you won't be any different.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

As the cables themselves were more embarrassment than damage, I'll not get drawn into the weeds. Have fun with that on your own.

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

SuperLib,

There's no excuse for the carnage and psychotic pleasure in it in Collateral Murder. Whether it would have reached public knowledge if Manning had put it through "official channels" or not is not the point. Personally I doubt that it would have come to light. There are many other examples of similar atrocities that were quietly pushed out of sight.

Manning, Snowden, Assange and other whistleblowers represent the only chance we have to halt the pace of the current insanity that is spreading worldwide, a visible government and an invisible one, operating in secrecy, outside the laws and mores of the population.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Jean: As the cables themselves were more embarrassment than damage, I'll not get drawn into the weeds.

heh those weeds just might have some information that paints a different picture of the mental state of your hero. You're smart to not consider them.

Bertie: Whether it would have reached public knowledge if Manning had put it through "official channels" or not is not the point.

My point is that the guy released information relating to where internet cables come onto land in the UK. That's not whistle-blowing. It's just handing out classified information. Anyone else would be thrown into jail for that.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

This case and the Fort Hood trial are perfect examples of two oxymorons: Military Intelligence and Military Justice. Since only Congress can declare war, the last war was WW II. Iraq and Afghanistan, conflict with al-Queda are just presidential decisions to protect the homeland. Military Intelligence should not have put him in such a powerful situation until he had proven himself and Military Justice should give him more than the 100+ years of prison. How would his situation been handled if information had been leaked before Normandy or Hiroshima?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

Since only Congress can declare war, the last war was WW II

So war is only war if the American government says so? How bizarre.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

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