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UK data suggests hospitalization is less likely with Omicron

41 Comments
By JILL LAWLESS and LAURA UNGAR

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41 Comments

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Interesting. In South Africa, 1.7% of Omicron cases led to hospitalization. Of those, most were given medicine for pain and inflammation and sent home. In the U.S., there is not one confirmed omicron death yet. Seems like the U.K. is getting the worst of it.

0 ( +7 / -7 )

this is what the data has been TELLING, not suggesting, for several weeks now. but i doubt it'll make one iota of difference to the japanese public who irrationally fear omicron like the bubonic plague.

3 ( +12 / -9 )

The British agency’s research said the protection a vaccine booster shot gives against symptomatic Omicron infection appears to wane after about 10 weeks,

If the booster wanes after 10 weeks it means that a 4th shot should start around mid February for the general public.

0 ( +7 / -7 )

Bronco I agree people fear it, but it is because of the messaging. Even though we keep hearing that Omicron is not as serious and if you are vaccinated like many are in Japan, it will be ok. But many, keep telling us, it is too early to know for sure, and these are preliminary results. It almost seems like they want us to remain in a state of uncertainty and fear.

1 ( +8 / -7 )

The findings from the UK Health Security Agency add to emerging evidence that omicron produces milder illness than other variants. But scientists caution that any reductions in severity must be weighed against the fact that omicron spreads much faster than delta and is better at evading vaccines.

This is why the experts recommend to act with a lot of caution, if the infection is only 30% as likely to produce severe disease, but it spreads 5 times more that still means a 50% increase compared with other variants. This is specially important to people that were considered protected by vaccination or previous infection because it may no longer be the case.

If the booster wanes after 10 weeks it means that a 4th shot should start around mid February for the general public.

That applies only if the immunity is reduced to levels where the general public are again at the same risk of developing serious problems, and if that is the case what is the alternative? to let people get the higher risks? obviously not.

0 ( +9 / -9 )

If the booster wanes after 10 weeks it means that a 4th shot should start around mid February for the general public.

Yep!

That is what I mentioned yesterday. Israel is already preparing for the 4th booster, because they said 4th booster is necessary 4 months after the 3rd booster.

And I guarantee, if it will be official that we need a 4th booster already after 10 weeks, more and more people will refuse and questioning this vaccine.

I mean, what Kind of vaccine is that, which loses its effeciency already after 10 weeks?

-8 ( +5 / -13 )

I mean, what Kind of vaccine is that, which loses its effeciency already after 10 weeks?

The definition of vaccine was changed in 2019 (immediately before the pandemic) from "provides immunity" to "provides an immune response"

Prior to 2019, the products currently called "vaccines" could not legally be marketed as such, because they do not provide immunity, they only generate a short term (10 weeks) immune response.

Hence the clever change in definition.

Nice trick.

-2 ( +7 / -9 )

@virusrex - do you know anything about the new SpFN vaccine that the U.S. military is starting trials of? It’s said to offer excellent protection from all variants but I’ve only seen one article with very limited info.

-3 ( +2 / -5 )

Can't put it back in the box now! Let her rip and push Delta of the perch!

Natural immunisation was always the best way to go once a "less Dangerous" strain emerged.

3 monthly boosters aren't the answer!

-4 ( +4 / -8 )

And I guarantee, if it will be official that we need a 4th booster already after 10 weeks, more and more people will refuse and questioning this vaccine.

"guarantees" from nameless people on the internet that have no access to tne data necessary to make that conclusion are worthless. ("in my experience" so apparently it became impossible to be wrong).

I mean, what Kind of vaccine is that, which loses its effeciency already after 10 weeks?

Any vaccine would do that if in the middle of the outbreak a variant that can make the immunity less effective appears, you are too used to have herd immunity preventing that for most of other infections.

The definition of vaccine was changed in 2019 (immediately before the pandemic) from "provides immunity" to "provides an immune response"

In medicine both things are correct, but the first was being abused by people trying to deceive others by saying that "immunity" only means perfect protection, which is false. There is nothing wrong with making the definition less likely to be abused this way.

Prior to 2019, the products currently called "vaccines" could not legally be marketed as such, because they do not provide immunity, they only generate a short term (10 weeks) immune response.

Imaginary arguments about imaginary situations that do not happen in reality are not valid.

 do you know anything about the new SpFN vaccine that the U.S. military is starting trials of? It’s said to offer excellent protection from all variants but I’ve only seen one article with very limited info.

At this point only the developers know anything, in principle it should work because it is just a mix spike proteins with different sequences, so it would be like getting different vaccines all in one shot (like in influenza) but the tricky part is how strong is the response and how many side effects are observed.

Natural immunisation was always the best way to go once a "less Dangerous" strain emerged.

Since the "less dangerous" strain is still much more dangerous than the vaccine by definition natural infection can't be the best.

Immunity from previous infections is also short lived against new variants, and there is nothing stopping just another variant appearing and making the immunity from omicron obsolete again (nothing except widespread immunization of course).

-2 ( +5 / -7 )

the middle of the outbreak a variant that can make the immunity less effective appears, 

3rd booster is for Omicron, right?

So then tell me, which variant is coming to make the 4th booster necessary?

And please show evidence!

-1 ( +4 / -5 )

Translation—hospitals in areas with low vax rates will be overwhelmed.

-1 ( +5 / -6 )

Think I mentioned yesterday, an interview on PBS Newshour with an emergency room doctor in New York City. She said that hospitalizations for Covid in her hospital, which peaked at 600 last year, are now at around 30. That is a 95% decrease.

And nobody mentions the theraputics (medicine) that is now available and coming onstream for the general public. This panic should be over. The shots provide some limited protection, medicine will help 90% of those who somehow still get sick. What more is there?

2 ( +8 / -6 )

so when does the story change that omicron only hospitalizes unvaxxed?

Now it seems like it is equally mild to both unvaxxed and vaxxed people, which is great.

Two new pills have been approved in the off chance that someone gets infected.

So all done for the vaccine mandates?

Whats next letter of alphabet for the next variant? Oh..."Pi", the number that never ends.......

Equivalently, its decimal representation never ends and never settles into a permanently repeating pattern.

-2 ( +3 / -5 )

3rd booster is for Omicron, right?

Again your understanding is backwards, boosters are to increase the immune response, this protects against all variants known until now.

So then tell me, which variant is coming to make the 4th booster necessary?

So your argument is that it is impossible for more variants to appear? well that means you just proved yourself mistaken and no boosters would be necessary then?

You contradict yourself, saying that boosters will be necessary (because the disease would keep representing a risk) but then that no other variant is there, so there would not be any need of a booster.

And please show evidence!

Evidence that you have no evidence to prove boosters are going to be necessary in the future? or that your personal opinion is a terribly poor guarantee? Precisely the lack of evidence is what proves my point. And remember, according to you it is impossible for me to be mistaken because its "in my experience".

-1 ( +4 / -5 )

Now it seems like it is equally mild to both unvaxxed and vaxxed people, which is great.

And even better, being vaccinated gives an extra protection against hospitalization, which means there is still a big benefit coming from vaccination.

So all done for the vaccine mandates?

Sure, as long as it is proved there is no benefit coming from them or that the risk from the infection is down to background levels, neither of those things have been proved to be happening yet.

-4 ( +3 / -7 )

No one finds it odd that politicians are saying "we couldnt have seen omicron coming" while pharma already has "proven safe and effective against Omicron" boosters?

0 ( +4 / -4 )

@virusrex

You said, vaccine loses efficiency when a new variant appears, right?

We all get told by your expert friends a third booster is necessary to cover the original strain, delta and omicrom, right?

So, again, what is then the new variant, according to your own words, makes the 3rd booster's efficiency going down already after 10 weeks?

You didn't answer that!

And you do not show any evidence which makes the 4th booster necessary.

Basically you never show any evidence, but you always request evidences from other posters.

So stop finding excuses and answer directly to my question:

What is the new variant which brings the efficiency of the 3rd booster down after 10 weeks and makes the 4th booster necessary?

If you can not answer that, then that contradicts what you said, vaccine loses efficiency when a new variant appears.

Because if there is no variant which brings down the efficiency of the 3rd booster, what is then?

What brings down the effeciency of the 3rd booster after 10 weeks, if not a new variant?

1 ( +4 / -3 )

Just saw that the UK has a total of about 6,500 critical/ICU beds, so Covid is taking up about 15%. Hardly an apocalypse.

2 ( +6 / -4 )

Good news.

Omicron has only just emerged though, and it is too early to say that health policy should be definitively set based on the little evidence so far. It's a shame its happened during the holiday period, but caution is still the way to go. I'm as sick of this as anyone, it strongly affects my income, not just my ability to party or travel to see family, so I hope Omicron and later variants do prove to be something we can coexist with.

1 ( +3 / -2 )

Don't care. i am currently enjoying my winter time right now. Skiing. Please just let me and my family enjoy a few days of peace and let the year end without any problems. Stay healthy and don't get sick. Not interested what is happening to the outside world. Happy holidays.

-2 ( +5 / -7 )

You said, vaccine loses efficiency when a new variant appears, right?

Backwards, the vaccine is as efficient as before, this efficiency is lower against the new variant.

So, again, what is then the new variant, according to your own words, makes the 3rd booster's efficiency going down already after 10 weeks?

Simplifying it even more since you seem to still have problems understanding the problem. Immunity drops slowly after vaccination, for a new variant the original immunity is lower from the beginning, that means that after some time it will not be enough to protect against the most stringent requirements (protection even against very mild symptoms) this is the same as many other vaccines like measles, or yellow fever, vaccinated people still get infected, but instead of developing pneumonia or encephalitis they simple get a mild fever and a couple of days of feeling bad. For people with health problems that lower their immunity even more they could be susceptible even against the serious disease, and (again also for other vaccines) they need extra boosters to avoid this.

I have not seen any data that proves an extra booster is necessary for the general population in order to avoid serious consences after the first two doses and the fist booster.

And you do not show any evidence which makes the 4th booster necessary.

Congratulations, you got my point, your "guarantee" is based on no evidence and no authority. Nobody has even proved extra booster are necessary, so saying "it will be official" is not relevant. At this point, for the general population the first two doses are enough to protect against serious disease and death for at least 6 months or longer, and an extra booster protects against mild symptomatic or even asymptomatic infection for as long as it has been examined. No data has been published that say 10 weeks later the vaccinated people (of the general population) are are susceptible to serious disease, hospitalization or death to the point of needing an extra booster.

-3 ( +2 / -5 )

Translation—hospitals in areas with low vax rates will be overwhelmed.

Hospitals in South Africa were not overwhelmed by omicron.

Some experts worry that frequent vaccines might result in desensitization, rather than immunity, against the virus. Just like allergy shots.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

Nobody has even proved extra booster are necessary,

I have not seen any data that proves an extra booster is necessary for the general population

Now I am really confused.

You always telling us only Data counts.

If there is no data which proves it, why do you and the experts and whoever push or recommend the people to take the booster?

Just out of personal opinions?

You always tell us, only data counts!

Personal opinions and personal experiences are irrelevant.

And how in the world, without any data, can the scientists and experts in Israel say, a 4th booster is necessary?

And how do they know already, even the 3rd booster just started to get implemented in the society, without any proving data, that a 4th booster is necessary?

*
1 ( +4 / -3 )

The signs that Omicron may cause less severe disease than Delta also align with lab data suggesting Omicron does not grow as well in cells derived from lungs, Li said.

Yes, I want to believe in it, that is a relief to us in Japan. Howver, the elderly people's antibody amout is rapidly decresing and remains very low but they have to wait until next Feb. for a booster shot. So, compared to UK with high rate of booster shots, the augument the above can be applied to Japan? I don't thik so. Japan's Government should start a booster as early as possible because it has a stock of enough amout of vacination for the elderly. Why not!

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

Boosters every 10 weeks now?

https://thehill.com/policy/healthcare/587212-uk-health-agency-report-suggests-booster-effectiveness-against-omicron

-3 ( +3 / -6 )

Well, what about-" NO. Those are your only two choices. Vaccines or death.

Yet tens or hundreds of millions of unvaccinated in poor countries live.

as do millions of “anti-vaxxers”. Even during Delta.

Who is going to break the bad news to them that every single one of them is dead or near death already.

0 ( +5 / -5 )

In the UK, you are a 'covid death' if you die and have tested positive for covid within the previous 28 days. You do not have to have died of covid.

So all UK stats for 'covid deaths' have been tilted higher than they really are since the start of the pandemic. This is not a secret. It is mentioned on most UK news sites that log the stats.

-3 ( +4 / -7 )

This pandemic, the variants, are suffocating in the toxic merry go round of insidious political grandstanding.

Th proven reality is simple, vaccination, social distancing, hand dispensers, masking up.

Nations, peoples know the risks,

No more lock downs, take responsibility as adults.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

Not interested what is happening to the outside world.

@hiro

How very Japanese of you. You're interested enough to read and comment though.

5 ( +6 / -1 )

The choice is not "vaccine or death". The choice is "cower or live". Risk is inherent in life. Those who want to decrease their own risk are free to do so. Those who don't, the same. Just don't involve ME in decisions you make about YOUR personal risk aversion or acceptance.

2 ( +5 / -3 )

Exactly. Still don’t understand how someone else’s vaccination stops working if I’m not vaccinated too.

2 ( +5 / -3 )

Exactly. Still don’t understand how someone else’s vaccination stops working if I’m not vaccinated too.

We are aware daily that there is much you still don't understand about this topic.

Me being vaccinated benefits me, you and everyone. You not being vaccinated negatively affects you, me and everyone.

The choice is not "vaccine or death". The choice is "cower or live".

Both of those statements are ridiculous and the product of partisan minds. It's ironic that by 'cowering' you have a better chance to 'live', but I think that is beyond some people's comprehension.

Of course you could just get jabbed without the ominous cowering bit.

0 ( +3 / -3 )

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