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Ukraine ignores Sievierodonetsk ultimatum; urges faster arms deliveries

39 Comments
By Pavel Polityuk and Abdelaziz Boumzar

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39 Comments

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Russia has committed 10,000 war crimes in Ukraine and the number continues to rise. Kremlin has previously gotten away with war crimes in Chechnya, Georgia, Donbas, and Syria and doesn't therefore fear it will now brought to account in Ukraine.

NATO must give Ukraine the weapons asked for asap must and not be remotely willing to discuss any appeasement with Russia. France and Germany need to remember that they are western democracies and show some strength in dealing with Putin.

Oh, and try being more generous with supplying arms to Ukraine.

-1 ( +11 / -12 )

2 American mercenaries captured in Kharviv,in violation of American law

1 ( +9 / -8 )

Ukraine says more than 500 civilians, including 40 children...

So that probably means that 50 civilians and 4 children didn't know that hiding in the basement of an industrial plant was a bad idea compared with just moving to relative safety a few miles to the west.

Expect to hear more Kiev nonsense of "brave fighters" holding out in the next week ... They may have courage, but they will be just hiding in a hole waiting for the inevitable surrender.

-1 ( +10 / -11 )

Are the civilians holed up in that factory with last remaining Azov militants willingly?

These are the last remaining Azov are they?

Liberation will be complete after that will it?

How many US generals do you imagine are hiding in there this time?

5 ( +8 / -3 )

give us more money and more weapons!

Like that has had any impact at all so far.

-3 ( +8 / -11 )

Blacklabel - if it didn't have any impact, then the Russians wouldn't be complaining about it. Why don't you ask a Ukrainian if the aid is helping?

2 ( +8 / -6 )

of course they will say its helping.

because they want more of our money and more untracked weapons to sell when its all done.

But look at the results, hows it going? Russia controls 20% of Ukraine and the only thing a guy can argue with me about it that they already controlled some unknown part of that 20% before the war started.

thats not "winning".

-1 ( +7 / -8 )

Blacklabel - you don't think that the Ukrainians are using the military aid to fight the Russians?

Glad to hear that you are intellectually curious enough to seek out a more in-depth assessment than the AP or the Armchair Commissars here:

https://www.understandingwar.org/backgrounder/russian-offensive-campaign-assessment-june-15

https://liveuamap.com/en/2022/15-june-missile-strikes-in-pokrovsk-of-donetsk-region

0 ( +6 / -6 )

of course they will say its helping.

because they want more of our money and more untracked weapons to sell when its all done.

But look at the results, hows it going? Russia controls 20% of Ukraine and the only thing a guy can argue with me about it that they already controlled some unknown part of that 20% before the war started.

thats not "winning".

The US far-right - just call them the Neville Chamberlain's of the 21st century....

Afraid to stand up to a bloody tyrant killing innocent men, women and children...

They prefer to side with Putin, who they have shown outright adoration of for over five years...

Is it any wonder they plotted to stage a coup in the US, overthrow the Constitution, and turn the country into a version of autocratic Russia?

And as for "winning", not many would say that includes the deaths of most of their top Generals, their troops mutinying, their tanks death traps, and their vaunted flagship Moskva collecting rust at the Bottom of the Black Sea....

-3 ( +7 / -10 )

then the Russians wouldn't be complaining about it.

yeah Im sure the USA would be totally cool if it was Russia sending weapons to another country to attack us with, right?

Like if when the USA invaded Iraq or Afghanistan and Russia publicly announced 54 billion dollars and advanced weapons would be given to the country the US invaded.

USA would just say oh ok, no problem? I think there would have been more than "complaining"

Ukraine is using the weapons, but what about the remaining unused and untracked weapons when this is over? going straight to the international arms market.

0 ( +8 / -8 )

Blacklabel - if Russia doesn't like the US and others sending aid to Ukraine, they can always call off their war and go tf back home.

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Like if when the USA invaded Iraq or Afghanistan and Russia publicly announced 54 billion dollars and advanced weapons would be given to the country the US invaded.

That couldn't happen. Russia doesn't make "advanced weapons." LOL. Also, Russia spent decades arming Iraq and other basket-case countries to the teeth with its weapons as well as teaching its officers Soviet battlefield doctrine.

Almost every time US soldiers are sent to basket-case hellholes, they confront an enemy equipped with Ak-47s and RPGs.

3 ( +9 / -6 )

Ukraine says more than 500 civilians, including 40 children...

So that probably means that 50 civilians and 4 children didn't know that hiding in the basement of an industrial plant was a bad idea compared with just moving to relative safety a few miles to the west.

But the Russians say “up to 1,200 civilians may be inside”. So, in your assessment, why did those other 1,150 hide there?

5 ( +7 / -2 )

The US far-right - just call them the Neville Chamberlain's of the 21st century....

Afraid to stand up to a bloody tyrant killing innocent men, women and children...

That would be the far left...have no clue what's so ever on how to deal directly...and yes many left aligned commentators are openly suggesting that this would have never happened under DT.

-8 ( +0 / -8 )

The US far-right - just call them the Neville Chamberlain's of the 21st century....

Afraid to stand up to a bloody tyrant killing innocent men, women and children...

That would be the far left.....

I guess you consider Tucker "Comrade" Carlson a leftist then....LOL...

have no clue what's so ever on how to deal directly

????? Poor Russia to English Google translation or just MAGA-speak?

and yes many left aligned commentators are openly suggesting that this would have never happened under DT.

Of course it wouldn't have happened under "DT" - he would have sided with his banker Putin, threatened to send US troops to fight alongside the Russians, and Zelensky would have surrendered...

4 ( +6 / -2 )

mrtinjp - oddly enough, most of those who seem against supporting Ukraine or in favor of Putin/Russia are on the far right in the US (though thankfully not many).

I see plenty of far leftists also against supporting Ukraine, but these are mostly not Americans, but rather Europeans or others.

The far rightists in the US think a Putin victory makes Biden look bad. The far leftists elsewhere think a Putin victory sticks it to the US/NATO/the West/the Imperium. Horseshoe politics makes for strange bedfellows!

4 ( +5 / -1 )

U,what is Ukraine endgame,6 month from now Kiev will probably look like Marioupol, Ukraine has shown no interest of attacking inside Russia,Putin is just incompetent of his execution of this war,Kiev is his ultimate goal , Ukraine is just like an elephant to Putin,his goal is to eat Ukraine,one bite at a time

-5 ( +1 / -6 )

Yrral - Ukraine's endgame is for as much of its territory and for as many of its people to be free from Russian domination as possible. Kyiv may end up looking like Mariupol and that would be a shame. My city is beautiful and I love it, but given a choice between having it be controlled by Russians or Chinese or having it remain free as a pile of rubble, well, that's not a choice at all. Live free or die.

3 ( +8 / -5 )

Their endgame (as should all of ours be) is also to make it as painful for Russia as possible, so that they (and others) don't see grabbing land, resources, and people as a cakewalk. IOW, you can try and expand your empire, but it is not going to be cheap, easy, or painless.

3 ( +7 / -4 )

Blacklabel - you don't think that the Ukrainians are using the military aid to fight the Russians?

Glad to hear that you are intellectually curious enough to seek out a more in-depth assessment than the AP or the Armchair Commissars here:

@youchoose poorly

please google “Ukraine Right Sector, Azov Batallion, and Ukrainian corruption. And the history of Donbass and Crimerya .

-3 ( +5 / -8 )

Thanks for the suggestion, Rodney. Curious - are your politics more on the left or on the right, would you say?

0 ( +4 / -4 )

gintonic,

"..... ****to allow civilians to escape to Russian-controlled territory...."

You think those people really want to go to that territory?

They must be mentally handicapped if they did.

Ending up in some "filtration camp", being interrogated, maybe tortures, definitely humiliated and then sent to some Gulag far away? How sick can one be to even suggest this escape-route?

-2 ( +5 / -7 )

U, should Ukrainain respect Ukraine Russian speaking citizen,too speak in the language,they learnth while being part of the Soviet empire,Even Zelensky has a Russia birth certificate,like 75 percent of Ukrainain in Ukraine, denial of this is, denying your existence and welcome Russian speakers as part of the Ukrainian family, Russian are allowed to speak and practice their culture in America

-3 ( +4 / -7 )

U, should Palestinian make it painful for Israel too

0 ( +2 / -2 )

@Bronco

And yet the basket-case hellholes using AK-47s keep defeating the US army equipped with "advanced" weapons.

No they don't. US forces win their battles nearly every time, in Vietnam, Iraq, etc., usually overwhelmingly. Their problem is losing the wars.

The Russians, by contrast, are in the habit of losing battles, especially when the other side is equipped with Western weapons.

2 ( +4 / -2 )

Bronco - what's your point?

4 ( +4 / -0 )

Gintonic - Did you not grow up in a free country?

2 ( +4 / -2 )

Moscow said it had opened a humanitarian corridor from Azot on Wednesday to allow civilians to escape to Russian-controlled territory.

It must be getting hot in that frying pan. Come, jump into the fire!

they want more of our money and more untracked weapons to sell when its all done

If they don't put the weapons to good use now, they will be in no position to sell anything when it's all done.

 Im sure the USA would be totally cool if it was Russia sending weapons to another country to attack us with, right?

Ukraine isn't attacking anyone. They're defending themselves and their families, their lives, their land. If the Moskovites don't like being shot at then they can just go back to russia.

3 ( +6 / -3 )

we,re talking about civilians being able to evacuate from the plant. You prefer them being blown to bits for "freedom"?

What freedom? They're being taken to moskovite-held areas. If they're treated the same as civilians in Mariupol were treated, they'll be interrogated, beaten and tortured for the entertainment of the moskovite military.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-61683513

0 ( +3 / -3 )

@cleo

Ukraine isn't attacking anyone

Tell this funny story to the population of Donbass, to the thousands of killed, maimed, tortured and disappeared locals, who had to endure 8 horrible years (since 2014) of brutal occupation by the Ukroregime forces.

If they're treated the same as civilians in Mariupol were treated

Civilians at Mariupol have a lot to tell how thy were treated as human shields by the regime forces. Enough data for a war crimes trial that hopefully will take place.

-5 ( +0 / -5 )

Tell this funny story to the population of Donbass, to the thousands of killed, maimed, tortured and disappeared locals, who had to endure 8 horrible years (since 2014) of brutal occupation by the Ukroregime forces.

All started by pro-russian forces backed by (and some say led by) russian troops.

If violent separatist groups occupied government buildings in your country, what would you do? Shrug your shoulders and let them get on with it? Or do all you can to remove the traitors and invaders? By the end of 2017 the OSCE had counted some 30,000 russian individuals in military gear crossing at the checkpoints it was allowed to monitor, in addition to many instances of military convoys crossing into Ukraine on dirt roads away from the official border crossings.

The locals were subjected to the horrors of war due to the actions of russia. If russia had stayed out, there would have been no military action, no bombings and the pro-russian traitors who didn't want to be Ukrainian could have just gone and lived in russia. Maybe tried taking over some government buildings there, see what joy it would bring them.

Make no mistake, the suffering in the Donbas was caused by russia and pro-russian traitors, not by ordinary russian-speaking Ukrainians who just want to get on with their lives.

Civilians at Mariupol have a lot to tell how thy were treated as human shields by the regime forces

Funny, I tried googling 'Mariupol civilians human shields' and the only hits I got were TASS and less biased news outlets reporting 'Russia claims...' . Not a single word from actual real civilians from Mariupol. Like to share your unbiased sources?

3 ( +4 / -1 )

All started by pro-russian forces backed by (and some say led by) russian troops

Oh yes, the usual Ukrainian official line, "all was fine before the nasty Russians came".

If violent separatist groups occupied government buildings

The Donbass people were not separatists and definitely they were not violent before April 2014, when the Kiev illegal coup d'etat plotters like Turchinov started a brutal Ukrainization campaign. And who burned people in Odessa on May 2, 2014, bawling "Heil to Ukraine"? Who filled all media with jokes about "grilled colorados"? Who was violent then? People of Donbass just wanted to defend themselves from these gorillas.

pro-russian traitors

All people who do not want to live under Banderist yoke are traitors? All hundreds of thousand, even millions of them?

I tried googling 'Mariupol civilians human shields' and the only hits I got

Try social media, a lot of real stories.

-6 ( +0 / -6 )

Ukrainain are in denial, Ukrainain were partly involve with downing if MH17,will seperatist in Donbas be part of the EU,legally they will because they still part of Ukraine

-5 ( +0 / -5 )

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