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© 2022 AFPWar fears mount as Ukraine mobilizes; Russia evacuates diplomats
By Dave CLARK and Anna SMOLCHENKO i KYIV/MOSCOW©2024 GPlusMedia Inc.
108 Comments
0rei0
Russia evacuates 'Diplomats'; first chuckle(not) of the morning.
Russia and diplomacy: Never the twain shall meet.
Yrral
Russian politican are delusional
Monty
Someone has to withdraw Putin from his position.
This man is insane and he will draw the world in a big war.
Someone must stop him before it is too late.
dagon
The U.S. ambassador to the United Nations, Linda Thomas-Greenfield, warned that an all-out Russian invasion could displace five million people, triggering a new European refugee crisis.
If this is not a fifth column endorsement of the Russian actions, by a former president, as reported by a conservative outlet, then what is?
https://fortune.com/2022/02/23/trump-cheers-putin-ukraine-invasion-as-savvy-genius-russia/
Ignoring his bone spurs and enlisting in Putin's army?
quercetum
Russia provides some 40% of the energy to Europe. Nothing has passed through this pipeline.
German banks handled Iranian oil money back in the Obama days. Penalties are not imposed on financial violators, and energy companies violated US sanctions.
The US will be busy sanctimoniously sanctioning the sanction violators.
PTownsend
Though the Putin cultists spent months posting anyone even questioning their idol is a warmonger, it's clear to reasonable people, (i.e. those who do not blindly follow Tucker/Trump etal) that Putin is a warmonger. It's probably not possible to find out what percent of the Russian Federation's various military defense corporations is owned and/or controlled by Putin and his oligarchs but I think it must be substantial. War is not just profitable for the US and NATO nations and their masters of war, but it is also profitable for Putin, as if he needs any more money given the reputed profits he has made from state owned Russian oil and gas. Russia is like Venezuela and Iran, fossil fuel rich with the money going to a fraction of the country's wealthiest people, while the rest of the country struggles to make ends meet. In the oil states it's as if they never left the feudal era. Will the Russian Orthodox Church which Putin claims to be such a staunch member go back to owning serfs?
It's the far rightists who disdain the notion of progress.They want to keep the world hooked on burning huge amounts of oil and gas so their idols, the modern royals can have even greater riches, more palaces and luxury yachts. The tsars and kings of old are jealous rolling in their graves. What other modern politicians today want to rob from their democratic nations so they can live like Putin and his fellow authoritarian ilk?
vic.M
All those that villify Putin and Russia need to go and learn History and the past agreements between Russia and Ukrain which still stand today.
Monty
I cannot think of anything else but that it's all just warmongering and fear mongering from the US
Let us all hope that you are correct.
Because if you are wrong, and Russia really attacks Ukraine, incl. Kiev, then the world has a big big problem.
Michael Machida
Putins final chapter.
The Avenger
Isn't the very presence of Russian forces in Ukraine an attack?
FizzBit
Quite obvious many don’t realize they’ve been spoon fed anti-Putin propaganda for the last 16 years. After all, with a military the size and cost the US has, you certainly wanna convince as many as possible that everyone else is the bad guy. LOL It’s an amazing thing to witness.
0rei0
Right, so those that DON'T 'vilify' (think that's the word you were looking for) Putin and Russia and support him, don't need to learn any history.
Sounds about right, after hearing Putin's rant on Ukrainian history.
takeda.shingen.1991@gmail.com
lol Propaganda? One need look no further than Putins speech. It sounded like something a Nazi would say. Anyone want to defend this rhetoric?
2020hindsights
FizzBit
The sad thing is that it isn't propaganda. I mean the guy murders journalists and imprisons his opposition through his corrupt courts. He does this in full view. First he poisons Navalny then he throws him in jail.
lincolnman
And the daily Fox News talking point from the previous evening - this was the theme of Comrade Carlson's show last night - along with a lot of other Putin fan-boying...
"Don't believe your eyes, there aren't 160K Russian troops, tanks, aircraft, and missiles encircling Ukraine....just like there weren't thousands of violent insurrectionists rioting thorough the Capitol on Jan 6th....in both cases, these are just "peaceful tourists"....
The far-out, wacky, deluded world of MAGA....partnering with Putin to destroy American democracy from outside and within...
And since we got no takers yesterday, once again help us understand how the Russian invasion into Ukraine is "wonderful"....
Sven Asai
No complaints please, forgotten?, they’ve been one of your ‘allies’ for decades and you’ve made them afterwards such too big that they now can become aggressive themselves. Errors in history have a price too and this is to be paid one day sooner or many decades later, whenever.
takeda.shingen.1991@gmail.com
The difference, of course, being the government's of those countries want them there. The Ukrainian government most certainly does not want or need Russian troops in Ukraine.
bass4funk
Idol? Hardly, but when the previous President tried to normalize relations with Russia and NK the left seemed like they were cheering on these dictators, now it’s a bad thing? No one likes Putin, but when you think how easily he checkmated Biden, it is kinda astonishing.
No, because none of these people even want the US to be in the region and they have been very clear on pointing that out every single not and no one on the left can prove that people on the right wholeheartedly support an invasion.
Doolittle
And it was just what, 3 years ago or so when we didn't have to worry about China, North Korea, Russia, Trudeau . . .
bass4funk
War always is and will be for any nation, that is one small part of it.
I think that’s the last thing anyone is thinking about….really..
No, quite the opposite, we love progress just don’t burden the US taxpayer with new progress. Pitch and push the private sector to invest into future progress and development.
No, we want to find cleaner, and more environmentally efficient fuel sources, but it needs to be 100% reliable and long lasting and that it can replace the many usages of crude oil, but until that day comes, we need to keep fossil fuels.
marc laden
Biden was declaiming a victory kind of stand after his stupid sanctions .....
Watch the real situation by the weak leader and effects ..
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/02/23/world/europe/china-russia-ukraine-sanctions.html
marc laden
Call Trump and save USA and Europe ...And next Taiwan ..
Mark
This morning DW Germany news reported that 73% of Russians support Putin's moves in the Ukraine, now Putin must be thinking he can go all the way and fulfill his dream of re establishing the old Soviet Union.
itsonlyrocknroll
Taking a step back, to 2014 to be precise.
Joint Statement of the NATO-Ukraine Commission......Sept 2014
https://www.nato.int/cps/en/natohq/news_112695.htm
*European Parliament resolution of 18 September 2014 on the situation in Ukraine and the state of play of EU-Russia relations*
https://www.europarl.europa.eu/doceo/document/TA-8-2014-0025_EN.html
The distance between Kiev and Moscow is just 860 km.
There is a debate to be had as to why the EU NATO did not stop and think of the future consequences of such a proposal. President Putin clearly did.
Blacklabel
so again WHY is Biden so insistent that only he can "save" Ukraine? Actually Germany is leading the way, to block the pipeline that Biden supported.
Why do we as Americans care about this? could it just be a Biden specific issue due to those paychecks his family received and cashed there?
Biden had huge praise for Putin previously, called him the second coming of Peter the Great and was "close to amazed" how Putin was moving towards democracy.
SuperLib
New conservative motto:
"I'll praise Vlad if it makes Biden look bad."
takeda.shingen.1991@gmail.com
Where did Biden say only he could save Ukraine?
Baseless conspiracy theory. The US has long supported Ukraine. Also, most countries support them as well. The EU does, Japan does, Turkey and Israel as well. I think the US is in good company backing Ukraine. And lastly, why shouldn't the US back Ukraine?
Open-minded
The conservative (GOP and "independents") motto: "Party First!"
bass4funk
Actually, it's "America first" just wish this admin would support that feeling.
Biden is making Biden look bad...for the second time.
Open-minded
Actually, it was "Trump first" which explains the problems the country has been facing the last 6 years!
China, Russia, and North Korea was made fools of thanks to the Obama's administration, and Trump opened up Pandora's box!
Trump was Putin's best investment ever against the West and democracy.
Open-minded
And Trump keeps on giving back with all the public and support that he gives handler on the world stage.
Maybe Putin will help to install Trump into office again if he is luckily.
lincolnman
I see you're criticizing your fellow far-rightist for regurgitating what Carlson said the night before....I agree, we don't need mindless Fox News talking points repeated verbatim...
https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/tucker-carlson-hate-putin-americans-suffer
I see you don't have the ability to see the parallels....unfortunate....
The go-to reply when they're put in a corner and have no answer....
And one more time, care to explain what is "wonderful" about Putin's invasion?
itsonlyrocknroll
President Biden announced a fresh tranche of sanctions directed at NORD stream 2.
How Blocking the Nord Stream 2 Pipeline Hurts Vladimir Putin's Plans
https://www.newsweek.com/how-blocking-nord-stream-2-pipeline-hurts-vladimir-putins-plans-1682010
"Today, I have directed my administration to impose sanctions on Nord Stream 2 AG and its corporate officers," Biden said in a Wednesday statement. "These steps are another piece of our initial tranche of sanctions in response to Russia's actions in Ukraine. As I have made clear, we will not hesitate to take further steps if Russia continues to escalate."
Open-minded
The Russian oligarchs should be next!
2020hindsights
Blacklabel
I think he called him a murderer.
Blacklabel
no, he called him Peter the Great and was amazed by him 20 years ago.
Want the video?
Doolittle
The fact is, this is happening on Biden's watch.
bass4funk
That would be the other way around.
marc laden
Watch the fearing real situation of this war
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_yz0AXHWz5E
Blacklabel
Biden started all this nonsense on his own. these other leaders had their separate meetings with Putin to resolve it without Biden, didnt work. Putin smells the Biden weakness.
So these other countries have no choice but to follow Biden as member nations of NATO.
So why did Biden care about Ukraine so much to start all of this?
MSNBC says its his overconfidence in his foreign policy abilities and his ego that only he can stand up to Putin. Plus he thinks it will help his polling and unite the American people in a way that he has been unable to do.
Problem is American people care about the Mexico border more than the Ukraine one.
bass4funk
Why? When you see a train wreck in progress, why would you get in the middle of it.
Nothing partisan about seeing that Biden is going for round 2
Ok and?
Basically, the majority of the establishment Republicans side with Biden and the non-establishment want no part of this, the Ukraine is lost and we all need to deal with that reality. Biden THINKING he could dissuade Putin from annexing Ukraine was delusional at best. Not surprised at all that this is happening Putin thinks Biden is weak, he’s not going to stop, Europe can’t and won’t stop him and the US won’t. Putin checkmated Biden. At this point, we need to make sure all of our people can get out safely.
Rodney
Wow Suddenly no 24\7 news about SARS-cov-2 virus. Only nuclear war.
Blacklabel
so what was he?
Oh......
Blacklabel
nope. just asking why would we care and "siding with Russia" are totally different things.
Just dont care, like most Americans (I notice you just said they support this but didnt provide any evidence)
Blacklabel
So Biden didnt personally go "toe to toe" with Putin, as he claimed?
takeda.shingen.1991@gmail.com
It's not different. If folks who shared your opinion were in power, Ukraine would have already disappeared. Russia is actively invading and occupying parts of Ukraine, and you don't think the US should care.
Blacklabel
they didnt disappear in 2016-2020, did they?
a TV guy was breathlessly saying "oh what would have happened if Trump were in charge".
Nothing, Proven by the fact that Trump was in charge for 4 years and nothing happened.
takeda.shingen.1991@gmail.com
because Ukraine is being invaded now. Not then.
bass4funk
Obama was and he got rolled over by Putin as well.
takeda.shingen.1991@gmail.com
And there people rallying in favor of Ukraine in Mariupol. What is your point?
Blacklabel
exactly, although I dont think they are really being "invaded" yet.
so please tell us why NOW and not then when you said:
Folks who "share my opinion" were in power yet Ukraine is still here, in 2022.
Bob Fosse
Buy a plane ticket?
But you’re already salivating at this and hoping it gets worse. Compared it to the Game of Thrones Red Wedding even. Bit poor taste no?
Blackstar
@Monty
Someone has to withdraw Putin from his position.
This man is insane and he will draw the world in a big war.
Someone must stop him before it is too late.
He may be many things, but Putin is most definitely NOT insane. To discuss this topic with any seriousness, you have to be well-versed in the history of the post-1989 years, at the very least. Are you? I somehow doubt it. The US, and its NATO underlings, has to own up to its missteps over the past 30 years. Russia has reached the limits of what it can possibly stomach (I'm not Russian, or an American right-winger, by the way), in terms of NATO expansion to the east. No Russian president, Putin or otherwise, could accept Ukraine joining NATO.
In the immediate aftermath of the cold war, sensible discussions/proposals about the status of countries between East Germany and Russia were held, and the prospect of understandings/satisfactory security arrangements (as far as Russia was concerned) were almost reached. This was absolutely essential for the Russians. They needed to feel safe from eastward expansion (Napoleon, Hitler, yes?) But after a bit of reflection, American arrogance kicked in and they decided to go ahead with the expansion anyway. Republicans & Democrats were equally guilty. So here we are today. Many things are not black and white, but grey/gray.
takeda.shingen.1991@gmail.com
There are already Russian military assets in the breakaway regions. That's an invasion. Besides what difference does it make? You've already stated you don't care what happens to Ukraine.
Uhh, folks like you aren't in power. It's the fact that the EU, US, Japan, Israel, Canada, and Turkey are openly backing Ukraine that they haven't been conquered yet. If those nations agreed with you, Ukraine wouldn't exist.
stormcrow
If the Russians do completely invade, it's going to be a slaughter and many souls will be sacrificed. It's difficult to understand how one man's ego, even that of a war criminal's, can ignore such cruelty.
Blackstar
On an optimistic note, NATO can't accept countries that don't maintain 100% territorial integrity as members. So if Russia decides to park their tanks indefinitely in the newly proclaimed "independent" areas in eastern Ukraine, there's a very slight possibility that Putin would be prepared to leave things at that, for the foreseeable future.
Sven Asai
Better hope for that they still have some little self-constraints, because if that war machinery ever starts moving they won’t be stopped by anything significantly until they have reached the coast in Portugal, then for example it’s all their own pipelines and their own bank systems or whatever sanctions include, it’s becoming inner-Russian and will just be out of reach for any sanctions.
Blacklabel
you said if and were.
not are. Yes they are not, But they were. 2016-2020, and what happened? Nothing.
So why NOW? your comment-
Monty
*He may be many things, but Putin is most definitely NOT insane*
How do you call someone who is one step away to bring the world in a possible 3rd world war?
How do you call a man who is ready to kill thousands and thousands of innocent people incl. children?
Wise, Clever, Intelligent?
Should we say thank you to Putin for that?
Paustovsky
From a global US interest point of view, conservatives seem to have gone full blown traitor.
Blacklabel
for the most part I agree that they dont, I mean its only the 2nd most powerful role in a country of 330+ million people. so i think you underestimate what a VP can do/be involved in.
Its just very disingenuous when you say "Biden wasnt President then" acting like he was working at McDonalds or something.
But then again maybe I am wrong about Biden's role at that time because it was also said by his boss-
'Don't underestimate Joe's ability to (expletive) things up'
So yeah, he is showing that special ability with Ukraine right now.
Antiquesaving
I keep asking myself, if it was the other way around, if it was a Ukrainian enclave of Russia that rose up in arms, then declared itself independent would the western nations be as vocal, would they refuse to acknowledge the new country?
And I keep returning to Kosovo a region that basically all said was part of Serbia until the west decided it wasn't.
Now look at all the other places in Eurasia and see which new countries the west recognises and which they don't.
If the "minority" wishing indepence isn't Russian, then it is close to a slam dunk they are recognised by the west, if the " minority" wishing indepence is ethnic Russian well then we here " the integrity of XYZ country can not be challenged, this (insert region name) in an integral part of XYZ country".
I am like most here an outside observer, I have zero connection to either side (well unless you count my uncle's second wife being "ethnic" Ukrainian 3 generations born in North America.)
Do the research, it seems very odd that the west is fine dismantling countries that it sees an advantage in it.
takeda.shingen.1991@gmail.com
I made a hypothetical statement using an unreal or third conditional. The fact is most, of the world doesn't agree with you, and that is why Russia hasn't invaded all of Ukraine yet.
Don't take my word for it, Putin came right out and said in his speech that Ukraine belongs to Russia.
Monty
I am like most here an outside observer, I have zero connection to either side
Yes like most of us.
But we will all get drawn into a connection if Putin attacks Ukraine incl. Kiev.
We will all feel the impact of that in a very bad way.
Blackstar
How do you call someone who is one step away to bring the world in a possible 3rd world war?
Even in the worst case scenario, and I truly hope it doesn't come to that, it's not going to be a "world war".
How do you call a man who is ready to kill thousands and thousands of innocent people incl. children?
Wise, Clever, Intelligent?
I don't know. How about George W. Bush? Or Dick Cheney? The list goes on. Think Iraq, 2003. Thousands and thousands of innocent people incl. children killed then, and it wasn't even in defence of US territorial security. A total lie about WOMD in the grubby pursuit of oil & (far away) regional dominance.
Should we say thank you to Putin for that?
No. We should recognise that he doesn't really want to do it, go to the bargaining table in good faith, and address Russian security concerns.
Blacklabel
All of which makes the “It's been over 70 years ... as I mentioned yesterday, there has been peace and security.” statement by the US VP even more ridiculous and uninformed.
Bob Fosse
Supply arms to Ukraine! Stay out of international affairs! Look Biden is doing nothing!
All over the place and frankly embarrassing.
mz16
Invasion sure is late... checks calendar running a week late here
Ingvar
The vast majority, at least up to the Dnieper, including Kiev will support the Russians. Even in the west they are absolutely fed up with NATO's puppet neo-Nazi militia's running wild, above the law.
wtfjapan
no, he called him Peter the Great and was amazed by him 20 years ago.
Want the video?
like Trump saying Putin invading Ukraine is genius
heres the video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gNxvSxaGeDE
takeda.shingen.1991@gmail.com
That Neo-Nazi claim would have been more impactful before Putin's little blood and soil speech.
Antiquesaving
zichiToday 11:58 am JST
I didn't say why, I said the west was very open even pushing for Serbia to be dismantled.
You omitted the fact the it was started be calls by the ethnic Albanians for independence.
You and others seem to have a very selective memory.
I remember the images of the western backed Ukrainian Nationalists, marching chanting anti Jewish, anti Russian, anti Pole, etc...in the streets of Kiev.
The same nationalist whose leaders had previously declared Stepan Bandera and his OUN national heros ( only retraction it after Jewish groups protested as well a Poland, etc...).
With these people in power we can easily see what was in store for the ethic Russians under that regime. And for that one just has to look at how nicely the Ukrainian Nationalists cooperated with the Nazi in WW2.
Honestly if I was ethnic Russian, at the time of the overthrow of the elected president by USA backed Ukrainian Nationalists. I would have probably packed up my life and gone some place safer. ( I'm not much of a soldier type).
mz16
Isn't the very presence of NATO forces in Ukraine an attack?
Same logic
lincolnman
Ronald Reagan, 1983: “The Soviets preach the supremacy of the state, declare its omnipotence over individual man, and predict its eventual domination of all peoples on the earth; they are the focus of evil in the modern world.”
Donald Trump, 2022: "You gotta say, that's pretty savvy," Trump said of Putin's decision to declare certain breakaway regions in Ukraine as independent. "This is genius," Trump said. "Putin declares a big portion of the Ukraine....Putin declares it as independent. Oh, that's wonderful."
Welcome to the new GOP...it isn't your father's conservative party....in fact, it isn't conservative at all...
It's a Russian-worshipping third column whose goal is to destroy American democracy...
Reagan would be appalled...
wtfjapan
Supply arms to Ukraine! Stay out of international affairs! Look Biden is doing nothing!
All over the place and frankly embarrassing.
there already US troops in Ukraine, 400 tonnes on ammunition and anti tanks weapons so far.
Bidens sanctions dwarf anything Trump did, Trump dropped two missile treaties with Russia, now theyre busy making hypersonic weapons
Khaos
It would be worst war in decades, if NATO is actually willing to go to war in order to support Ukraine's interest and retake the pro-Russia territories by force.
Sooner or later though, people would ask "Is it worth dying for?" and so far only Russia seems to have good enough reasons for doing that.
rainyday
I would say Ukrainians have pretty good reasons for doing so.
Monty
Even in the worst case scenario, and I truly hope it doesn't come to that, it's not going to be a "world war"
Yes, I also truly hope for that!
stormcrow
pariah: an outcast
Putin, and Russia as well, are both about to become really big pariahs. Enjoy life in your self-constructed bubble.
Antiquesaving
MontyToday 12:00 pm JST
Why should we feel the impact?
Putin and Russia want nothing to do with controling a region packed with hostile ethnic Ukrainians.
At worse he will annex the ethnic Russian parts and leave a rump Ukraine with a majority ethnic Ukrainians who will probably cleanses the area of "unwanted" groups.
And as long as we keep our noses out of it that is where it will end.
The problem between these 2 has been going on for centuries, and everytime the western European put their nose into it we end up expanding the problem to involve a far greater conflict.
Does Europe and the west ever learn?
Let them settled their own bloody problems, we are not going to fix a darn thing it has been going on since before the golden age of Kiev and isn't about to stop for the time being.
This is very sad but some things we cannot fix and another major European war or world war isn't going to fix this never ending circle between Ukraine and Russia.
Ingvar
So the "Right Sektor" and "Azov Battalion" militia's aren't neo-Nazis? That'll be news to them. They are, or until now have been, very proud of the fact.
Ingvar
That's right. Any regime unfriendly to NATO (even though the majority of the population of several of those NATO countries are unabashedly pro-Russian and anti-American) is "a pariah"?
Most of the world hates NATO. Even a large part of NATO hates NATO. This will make Putin more popular than ever in most of the world.
takeda.shingen.1991@gmail.com
No, I am saying Putin is every bit the neo-Nazi as the Azov battalion is. His speech made it very clear. He has no respect for the people of Ukraine, and he thinks the country is his for the taking.
Blacklabel
The Associated Press @AP
BREAKING: Just 26% of Americans say the U.S. should play a major role in the Russia-Ukraine conflict in a new AP-NORC poll. President Biden has argued that fundamental American values are at stake in Eastern Europe.
"AP-NORC poll: Most in US oppose major role in Russia strife"