world

With healthcare bill in disarray, Republicans demand revamp

73 Comments

The requested article has expired, and is no longer available. Any related articles, and user comments are shown below.

© Thomson Reuters 2017.

©2020 GPlusMedia Inc.

73 Comments
Login to comment

Easy solution.

Cut the DoD budget 10%. Use that money for health care (not insurance) for the very poor. Let the middle class buy their own insurance, like it was pre-ACA.

Everyone except the DoD will be happy, but they all have health care/insurance.

Good enough for the far-left-libs?

-10 ( +0 / -10 )

I am so tired of winning I don't know what to do with myself.

In a big setback to the seven-year Republican quest to undo Democratic former President Barack Obama's signature legislative achievement, U.S. Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell on Tuesday abandoned plans to get the bill passed this week.

Seven years at it and the incompetents cannot get it done despite controlling the legislative and executive branches.

Yoinks, Scooby-Doo. If it weren't for those repugnant, incompetent republicans, they could get something done!!!!!

7 ( +7 / -0 )

Just curious how many other Americans understand that working towards an arbitrary deadline, as opposed to working towards desired results, usually ends with a vastly inferior product?  

Apparently this basic premise is lost on The U.S. Congress.

The biggest threat to me and my family right now is not ISIS, Zika or illegal immigrants. It's the Republican Party.

5 ( +7 / -2 )

DT wants a quick victory. It will end with a half baked healthcare bill and DT will go nuclear to approve it.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

Fu:

You seem to be claiming that only far-left liberals want reasonable, affordable healthcare. Judging by the public backlash against both bills, so do a lot of conservative cupcakes.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

Prior to Obamacare, the US was paying double the OECD average total cost for healthcare and delivering service levels that bring it in at number 46 in the list. And only covered 70% of the population.

In some key markers, even Cuba, on a few hundred of dollars per head, was beating it.

If they followed, say, Germany's example, 100% of the population could be covered for half the cost and be cost free for everyone at the point of delivery.

If you ask me the vote was merely about not wanting to pay for healthcare for Black people, especially a system put in place by the first Black president. It's utterly irrational.

Americans have to get their heads out of their own little bubble, and look and learn how things are done elsewhere in the world.

Read this: half as expensive, free at the point of delivery, 100% of the population.

5 ( +6 / -1 )

We should just come up with versions by the moderates, the right, and the extreme right, then have everyone vote in rounds. In secret, with just the numbers released.

But in other news.... Did anyone see the Tweets from Sean Spicer and Trump intentionally misrepresenting the issue? Spicer's Tweet:

28.2M Americans are still waiting under Obamacare and remain uninsured. They need relief now. #RepealAndReplace.

Trump's Tweet (with graph):

Democrats purposefully misstated Medicaid under new Sentate bill - actually goes up.

What concerns me is that they should know they will receive a lot of scrutiny over the tweets for the lack of context but they're doing it anyway. And press conferences are getting more and more bizarre by the day. That tells me they feel they have a pretty good grip on their supporters and can craft a large part of their reality.

What worries me is that I think it will get worse.

4 ( +5 / -1 )

This bill is a fish - if it doesn't smell good now, it will certainly smell a lot worse in a few weeks. The common consensus is that the best thing the GOP can do at this point is just fold - rather than taking responsibility, it's simply much easier to simply continue blaming Obama. A sad state of affairs - but this is the "leadership" a minority of Americans chose. (Where does Trump stand on the bill, btw? His public pronouncements have been all over the map.)

4 ( +4 / -0 )

What concerns me is that they should know they will receive a lot of scrutiny over the tweets for the lack of context but they're doing it anyway. And press conferences are getting more and more bizarre by the day. That tells me they feel they have a pretty good grip on their supporters and can craft a large part of their reality.

Ok, so what do you want to happen next?

What worries me is that I think it will get worse.

There is absolutely No way it can get as bad as it was 7 years ago.

-9 ( +2 / -11 )

Oh, I don't know . . . Stop using twitter and hiding from the press.

The press does not want to report Trump speaking. On the few occasions Trump has held press conferences, they have tended to go his way. In his first press conferences, the press tried to hold Trump to account for his comments, or on Russia, or other matters. But instead of being contrite or evasive, as other politicians have been, Trump simply threw the issues back in their faces. The press still hasn't figured out how to deal with Trump yet, and until they do, they will avoid talking to him if possible.

In regards to the healthcare mess, the republicans don't want to repeal Obamacare. It doesn't matter that Obamacare is not universal coverage, that it is outrageously expensive, and that only a scant fraction of what it collects in fees is actually spent on healthcare. Obamacare is a politician's wet dream, a sea of regulations and red tape which can be used to reward supporters and punish opponents. Republicans are politicians, first and foremost (just like democrats are), and Obamacare is win-win situation for them. They can make promises to repeal it to satisfy their base, and get votes, while at the same time use Obamacare to increase their power and wealth. Don't count on a repeal or change anytime soon.

-5 ( +1 / -6 )

It shows how pathetic the Republican party is. They've been whinging and complaining about Obamacare for 7 years and in all that time it never once occurred to any of them to actually come up with a substitute plan until the very last second. Now we've had 2 GOP amateur hour attempts at a bill that are so embarrassing they get withdrawn after only a week of scrutiny.

If Obamacare is so bad, with seven years to think they should have been able to come up with a perfect system. These bills reveal that the whole time the GOP has been nothing but angry hot air. They aren't prepared to lead - the only thing they know how to do is invent misleading criticism. It's a party at the moment with nothing to it but lies and rage. Forget scrapping Trumpcare, it's time to scrap the Republican party and replace it with people who can think for a change.

2 ( +4 / -2 )

Not you, more like what and how possibly SCOTUS might ultimately rule on this issue. Did your nose just grow??

Really?

> June 27  05:16 pm JST Posted in: U.S. Supreme Court OKs partial implementation of Trump's travel ban  See in context

As usual, denying facts.

Not really. You've been going on for a while that the Supreme Courts would rule against the travel ban and well, it didn't happen.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

On the few occasions Trump has held press conferences, they have tended to go his way

Sure. That's why he keeps holding press conferences.

You people are hopeless.

5 ( +5 / -0 )

I honestly think the repubs are a professional opposition party. Once they are in power, they are so hilariously incompetent that it's actually deeply suspicious and possibly treasonous. No people this incompetent could possibly exist so there has to be ulterior motives.

They would be better served as a permanent opposition party

2 ( +4 / -2 )

Will the GoP consider the wishes of their constituents this time?

I'm not talking just the Koch brothers who do not represent all constituents, but all the Americans (rich, poor, different party) who the Senators and Congress represent.

No, they will do as they have done and ignore their constituents, and they will lie to distort to true impact on their constituents. The WH is already engaging in program of deceitful propaganda.

My prediction, the Senate will use the supposed $381B in savings to buy off a few senators, like Nevada's, by allowing them to keep their medicare funding intact. They will try to keep the buy offs as quiet as possible to prevent other senators getting greedy and wanting to participate the buy off. In the normal world, if the American public ever figures out what is happening, the GoP will be sunk in the 2018 election.

4 ( +4 / -0 )

it's time to scrap the Republican party and replace it with people who can think for a change.

Take it step further, also throw in the Democratic Party. They're equally useless.

I'm not talking just the Koch brothers who do not represent all constituents, but all the Americans (rich, poor, different party) who the Senators and Congress represent.

Each party is looking out for their constituents, remember: they all want to be reelected.

No, they will do as they have done and ignore their constituents, and they will lie to distort to true impact on their constituents.

To a small point you're right, but when it comes to the left, their supporters are so angry and hateful towards Trump, they demand their representatives resist Trump at all cost and this is one reason why you have someone like Chuck Schumer who was a very reasonable Democrat who all of a sudden became as loony as his fringe constituents. On the right, the GOP were promised to repeal and replace Obamacare and that's what they're working on because they have to equally appeal and satisfy their base.

The WH is already engaging in program of deceitful propaganda.

Not like the last administration, not even close.

My prediction, the Senate will use the supposed $381B in savings to buy off a few senators,

Can you prove it?

like Nevada's, by allowing them to keep their medicare funding intact. They will try to keep the buy offs as quiet as possible to prevent other senators getting greedy and wanting to participate the buy off. In the normal world, if the American public ever figures out what is happening, the GoP will be sunk in the 2018 election.

Huh? How? The Democrats haven't won a single election, none this year, they keep losing, they are so divided as a party. Liberals, antifa, progressives, moderate Democrats, no message, no econmical plan, they are the party of government checks and government jobs, they believe in more restorative justice, lost over 1000 legislative seats, the House, the Senate, the presidency and lose frankly elections they could win if they had a decent message. So if you think the GOP will be sunk by 2018, the Dems don't have a lot of time until 2018, it's right around the corner. They lost 4 big elections this year and if they keep losing, the only guarantee and outlook for the Democratic Party will be to stay where they are now at, in the dark.

-8 ( +1 / -9 )

bass4funkToday  11:54 am JST

To a small point you're right, but when it comes to the left, their supporters are so angry and hateful towards Trump...

I'd take that comment more seriously if someone else had written it.

5 ( +6 / -1 )

Next week is a vacation week for 4th July and all the politicians return home and can explain to their constituents why on America's 241 birthday, despite's being the richest country in the world, why it still does not have an affordable healthcare for all of its citizens. Do they need to wait another 241 years to have one?

3 ( +3 / -0 )

bass4funkToday  11:54 am JST

it's time to scrap the Republican party and replace it with people who can think for a change.

Take it step further, also throw in the Democratic Party. They're equally useless.

Hello?? The Democratic party made the ACA, and any inadequacies it possesses are the result of them trying compromise with the GOP. The Democratic party certainly does have its faults, but only an utter partisan hack could look at the party that made a successful if imperfect healthcare system and the party that spent 7 years whinging about it but can't even make a serious attempt at a replacement and say, "Yup, they're both equally useless."

2 ( +4 / -2 )

Hammerhead

20% of the US economy is related to health care. Guess all those people will accept a 50% pay cut?

Simple solutions, seldom are.

A migration plan that is predictable is necessary too.

But making 20% of the voters mad isn't smart.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

zichi - the USA isn't even in the top 10 richest countries on Earth list. Qatar is the richest according to a 2017 list.

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

Hello?? The Democratic party made the ACA, and any inadequacies it possesses are the result of them trying compromise with the GOP.

That is not true, Obama and the Dems controlled all 3 branches and pushed the thing through without a single GOP vote.

The Democratic party certainly does have its faults, but only an utter partisan hack could look at the party that made a successful if imperfect healthcare system

Successful? Ask every insurance company and ask the people that have to pay higher and higher premiums if the system is successful. You might not like what they might say.

and the party that spent 7 years whinging about it but can't even make a serious attempt at a replacement and say, "Yup, they're both equally useless."

You're right, they did have 7 years to come up with a better option, but they didn't and that's on them, however, from the polls, no one thought Trump would win and frankly the GOP got sideswiped, now they have the majority and didn't properly prepare, but however noble the intentions were from Democrats, they started this ball rolling, it was their mess, No one told them to overhaul the entire healthcare system and now here we are. This is a huge mess and however it goes or which party is in control, No one will ever be happy and you will never get 100% coverage for everyone.

-7 ( +0 / -7 )

But making 20% of the voters mad isn't smart.

First, the healthcare makes up 20% of the economy, not 20% of the electorate. Let’s not confuse the two.

Second:

Cut the DoD budget 10%. Use that money for health care (not insurance) for the very poor. Let the middle class buy their own insurance, like it was pre-ACA.

Does nothing to address rapidly rising healthcare costs. Without some sort of public option and price controls, the healthcare industry will control a larger share of the economy, damaging other industries and consumers alike.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

That's ok, the left never take anything seriously.

Can you prove it?

2 ( +3 / -1 )

The Democrats haven't won a single election, none this year,

Ohh, elections in historical GoP leaning districts count as decisive now and can be extrapolated to the whole country as a referendum?

The real news and importance of those elections should be how close the races in those districts were. They shouldn't have even been close.

Recent polls show the support for the GoP's plan and how they are going about trying to pass it at around 17% (the polls most favorable to the GoP put it at 35%). Among the GoP it is only 51%, for a plan hidden in secrecy. Yes, the GoP are still somewhat happy with sticking it to Obama, the only clarity in the bill.

Yes, I know, polls don't matter unless they support your position or polls don't matter because Trump beat the polls (with help from Russia and a dysfunctional Democratic party).

3 ( +3 / -0 )

bass4funkToday  12:55 pm JST

Hello?? The Democratic party made the ACA, and any inadequacies it possesses are the result of them trying compromise with the GOP.

That is not true, Obama and the Dems controlled all 3 branches and pushed the thing through without a single GOP vote.

Which has nothing whatsoever to do with what I said. The Democratic party made an effort to compromise with the GOP even though they didn't have to, and it resulted in an inferior program to what it could have been.

Successful? Ask every insurance company and ask the people that have to pay higher and higher premiums if the system is successful. You might not like what they might say.

I'm not interested in what insurance companies have to say. They aren't responsible for providing healthcare. In fact they're part of the problem.

As for your nebulous, undefined "people" I should ask, yeah, some people have had rising premiums. As a result of Republicans in certain jurisdictions refusing to accept the government subsidies that would keep prices low. So yeah, some people in red states are unhappy. Their unhappiness is manufactured by an incompetent GOP that would hurt its own constituents just to score political points.

You're right, they did have 7 years to come up with a better option, but they didn't and that's on them, however, from the polls, no one thought Trump would win and frankly the GOP got sideswiped, now they have the majority and didn't properly prepare, 

I'm sorry, but "We had no idea the public would be stupid enough to let us win!" is not an argument that's going to get any sympathy from me.

No one told them to overhaul the entire healthcare system and now here we are. 

You obviously haven't been paying attention. American health care has been broken, embarrassingly inferior to the health care of every post-industrial nation in the world since well before the 90s. The American people have been having their lives destroyed by predatory insurance companies for as long as most posters here have been alive. Whatever complaints people have about ACA, it is better than what we had before.

At least, assuming the complaint isn't and hasn't always secretly been that it was a victory for the nation's first black President.

5 ( +5 / -0 )

Half the problem is that the GOP misrepresented what Obamacare is to their base in order to get people angry about it, and now they are forced to repeal something that's actually popular. The country will have to suffer while this silly game continues to play out.

4 ( +5 / -1 )

American health care has been broken, embarrassingly inferior to the health care of every post-industrial nation 

To be fair, the US has great health care services, but only for those who can afford it. Nothing in the health care industry is broken or inferior. How it is offered to the customer is what's broken. Just another example of our legalized bribery system. The bought and paid for politicians can't even give Medicare the power to negotiate drug prices.

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

US has great health care services, but only for those who can afford it. Nothing in the health care industry is broken or inferior. 

America has less doctors, less hospital beds than other countries. The waste is high and the charges overpriced. There is less value for the healthcare dollar than other countries. Lawyers and drug companies are getting too many of those dollars.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

How it is offered to the customer is what's broken

The patient. Not the customer, the patient.

Seems it's the basic approach that's broken. If you start off thinking in terms of customers, you inevitably think in terms of payment and profit.

Bought and paid for, indeed.

2 ( +3 / -1 )

zichi - the USA isn't even in the top 10 richest countries on Earth list. Qatar is the richest according to a 2017 list.

The US has the highest GDP in the world.

Per capital GDP (probably a better measurement of wealth) puts the US at 15th ($56k/person) with Liechtenstein at 1st ($179/person) and Qatar at 9th ($73/person).

Japan GDP @ $35k/person has public health care. Health care is 7.7% of GDP.

UK GDP @ $44k/person has public health care. Health care is 7.8% of GDP.

Canada GDP @ $43k/person has public health care. Health care is 9.8% of GDP

Cuba GDP @ $7k/person has public health care. No information.

US GDP @ $56k/person NO Public Health Care Health care is 15.1% of GDP.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

but when it comes to the left, their supporters are so angry and hateful towards Trump, they demand their representatives resist Trump at all cost 

Sounds like the right towards Obama.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

The patient. Not the customer, the patient.

I was speaking of insurance.

-3 ( +0 / -3 )

however, from the polls, no one thought Trump would win and frankly the GOP got sideswiped, now they have the majority and didn't properly prepare

Are you seriously saying the republicans didn't expect to win? If true, it's just another piece of evidence of their incompetence.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

I was speaking of insurance

Exactly. Wrong place to start.

4 ( +4 / -0 )

America has less doctors,

True. But that is from the control of the Medical Boards and residencies.

The case of health care regulations is an interesting one, as state governments have empowered private medical boards with unilateral authority to set the rules for the medical profession, including the issuing and revoking of medical licenses. These boards effectively function like government regulatory agencies, with the important difference that they lack the opportunity for public comments, and thus are immune from any political pressure from citizens.

Of course BIG Med, Pharma and Insurance have their fingers on these boards. As I said many weeks ago, we really need a Teedy Roosevelt type to set things straight. The Bernie Sanders socialist plan is not the answer as it will lead to lower quality of care and fraud. Of course I got thumbed down so I'm expecting the same.

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

Exactly. Wrong place to start.

I don't follow you.

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

Socialized medicine is lower quality? Like in the military, Germany, Canada, etc.?

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

FizzBit, look at the way other countries do it. They don't start from first and foremost accommodating the insurance companies, ensuring their fat profits and then, only then, seeing how many 'customers' are willing and able to pay the hefty premiums.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

Cleo, no disagreement. Not sure why you seem to think I am in any way defending our current US system. I'm not. Just stating the current situation of the stranglehold the BIG 3 have on our health care system.

so to be clear, health care and profits should not be coupled.

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

Socialized medicine is lower quality? Like in the military, Germany, Canada, etc.?

Yes. Compared to the Cadillac service of those who are insured in the US.

-3 ( +0 / -3 )

Which has nothing whatsoever to do with what I said. The Democratic party made an effort to compromise with the GOP even though they didn't have to, and it resulted in an inferior program to what it could have been.

Yes, it was either Obama's way or I use my pen. helluva compromise. Sounds more like a threat and a promise to me.

I'm not interested in what insurance companies have to say. They aren't responsible for providing healthcare. In fact they're part of the problem.

Yup, more socialist talk.

As for your nebulous, undefined "people" I should ask, yeah, some people have had rising premiums. As a result of Republicans in certain jurisdictions refusing to accept the government subsidies that would keep prices low.

And with good reason, look what we have now, this is why the GOP and rightfully so hates government intervention on a massive level as in trying to take care of 320 million people, don't even start.

So yeah, some people in red states are unhappy. Their unhappiness is manufactured by an incompetent GOP that would hurt its own constituents just to score political points.

Hate to say it, but both parties do it. Anyway, they know exactly who concocted this mess and that was 7 years ago by the party of handouts, the party that had 7 years of working to keep premiums low and affordable and that didn't happen 

I'm sorry, but "We had no idea the public would be stupid enough to let us win!" is not an argument that's going to get any sympathy from me.

Stupid? Yup, another reason why Dems keep losing, with comments like that, the wilderness will be their home for a very long time.

You obviously haven't been paying attention. American health care has been broken, embarrassingly inferior to the health care of every post-industrial nation in the world since well before the 90s

For the people that didn't have healthcare, I agree. Not for the people in my line of work and in the industry that I am in, we had some of the best healthcare that you could get anywhere else on the planet and there were millions of Americans that had great healthcare, I never complained and there was nothing wrong with the system that was working well for those people, just fix the system that didn't include the people that didn't have any healthcare, I was never against that and most conservatives I knew never felt the same, but what the Dems did and now this mess with the GOP. Whatever happens in the future you are going to have people dissatisfied on both sides and the complaints will never end as well as the finger pointing.

The American people have been having their lives destroyed by predatory insurance companies for as long as most posters here have been alive.

And many haven't there were millions that didn't have a problem with the insurance companies and thought they were just fine the way they were.

Whatever complaints people have about ACA, it is better than what we had before.

At least, assuming the complaint isn't and hasn't always secretly been that it was a victory for the nation's first black President.

I'm not buying it, it may have been better for the poor, but not for the young or the middle class as the premiums were telling the tale of how this junk was slowly starting to implode, the system cannot sustain itself for much longer and another reason why the Dems were booted out of office and please stop talking about race, who cares? Obama was a man, yes, his polices were disastrous, but why do we have to always talk about race? I really don't get you guys.

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

bass4funkToday  09:15 pm JST

I'm sorry, but "We had no idea the public would be stupid enough to let us win!" is not an argument that's going to get any sympathy from me.

Stupid? Yup, another reason why Dems keep losing, with comments like that, the wilderness will be their home for a very long time.

Hey, you're the one who made the argument, not me.

3 ( +3 / -0 )

And with good reason, look what we have now, this is why the GOP and rightfully so hates government intervention on a massive level as in trying to take care of 320 million people, don't even start.

The GOP hates government intervention unless it's for kicking 20+ million people off insurance, legislating morals (telling women what to do with their bodies), "extreme" vetting of immigrants, etc.

The GOP irrefutable hates government intervention only when it creates equality. It's baffling how so many people that don't earn over $250k a year support the GOP despite the fact that that party is comfortable raping those that earn less than $250k a year. Of course, this includes most enoloyees of the media that are not members of the editorial boards or higher. And, no members of those groups would be wasting their time posting here.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

Hey, you're the one who made the argument, not me.

Well, when Democrats can start breaking records, have a sustainable plan for the people, quit their whining come up with real lasting ideas drop their socialist tendencies (just try it for once) then maybe we don't need to argue.

-3 ( +2 / -5 )

America's great healthcare system has created a crisis with opioids addiction. In 2015, 40% of Americans were using prescription painkillers. 100 million suffer from chronic pain.

1 ( +3 / -2 )

Anyways, why would anyone support this garbage plan anyways?

Gee, so what's your solution?

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

Gee, so what's your solution?

A public option and better pricing controls.

3 ( +4 / -1 )

Gee, so what's your solution?

"Single Payer"-otherwise known as "Medicare for all"--you know, the same plan that everyone in Congress enjoys.

4 ( +5 / -1 )

And yet the Republicans dare to lay blame on the Democrats, knowing full well that NOT ONE Democrat will ever vote for a repeal of Obamacare. Never mind the Dems -- what is the problem with you Republicans??

0 ( +2 / -2 )

Still surprised at US politics.

Back home a Reagan or Trump would never get elected, lack of qualifications.

3yrs minimum of Uni study to enter politics. Salaries are fixed too.

Neither can a new administration just unto the work of a previous one. Checks and balances.

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

A public option and better pricing controls.

I'll agree on the pricing control, you got my attention on that.

"Single Payer"-otherwise known as "Medicare for all"--you know, the same plan that everyone in Congress enjoys.

Congress gets FULL medical care, curtesy paid for by the tax payer, any hospital or doctor of their choice and everything is completely covered, now there is No way on God's green Earth that what Congress is getting, you can give equally to 320 million people FREE of charge and even if you were to steal it from the 1% you would barely cover 1/3 of the population.

And yet the Republicans dare to lay blame on the Democrats, knowing full well that NOT ONE Democrat will ever vote for a repeal of Obamacare. Never mind the Dems -- what is the problem with you Republicans??

They're both dodgy.

@pacint

Gotcha! So who cares about that and what is your point? And what country do you hail from?

-2 ( +2 / -4 )

. . . there is No way on God's green Earth that what Congress is getting, you can give equally to 320 million people FREE of charge . . .

Who said anything about giving 320 million people healthcare "free of charge?" There are many industrialized countries that provide universal healthcare or single payer plans for its citizens (Japan being one of them). However, plans like these will not be possible if the Republicans keep giving tax breaks to rich people who don't need them or allow lobbyists from the healthcare industry to write their legislation.

Just out of curiosity, what is your solution?

1 ( +1 / -0 )

Trump last year: "we're gonna repeal the disaster known as Obamacare. We've got an excellent plan; the best plan ever!"

Tommy, Gina, Bobby Sue, and Eustice: "well auriight! I'll b'dammned. I'm fixin' to give ya my grill cheese sammich ya keep a talkin' dem words like dat.'"

Trump: "Make America great again!" Repeal Obamacare!" Translation: keep America white; repeal every damn piece of god damn legislature that black s.o.b. ever pushed through."

Republican Party: "hear ye! hear ye! We don't like ya, but we's fixin' to nominate ya you keep talkin' like that."

Trump: 'we're gonna have the best plan...the best plan ever; it's gonna be so great it'll be the best health plan in the history of mankind; there's not a word in any human language to convey how great it'll be. We can even cancel NASA, because once word gets out into the universe about how great this plan's gonna be, all the aliens will be coming to earth I tell ya."

Tommy, Gina, Bobby Sue, and Eustice: " dem ain't lies... dem is foolin' bluffs. He's clevrin as sh**. Dat's why yall don' like 'm. Fake news evry god damn place. Dat's why he twitten.

Republican Health Care Plan designed to make America great again: 22 million previously insured will now be uninsured. Individual premiums will go up unless you're one of the 1%; if so, your rates will go down. Insurance companies' profits will skyrocket--a payback for all the paying lobbyists. No commie stuff here; uh uh! Just pure capitalism where, health, clean food and water, clean air, education are all commodities. Sell, Mortimer! Sell! God damn Winthorp.

Republican Party: "this guy ain't got no plan... never did in the first place. But it don't matter: we'll just slap something together that's in agreement with our rich constituency. Besides, our main goal is to just repeal every thing that black s.o.b. ever put pen to paper to no matter what the cost may be. We're running a goddam business here anyway. These people can go to hell and then to Havana if they want decent health.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

The GOP hates government intervention unless it's for kicking 20+ million people off insurance,

As opposed to millions that can't pay their coverage due to rising premiums or letting the entire healthcare system implode.

legislating morals (telling women what to do with their bodies), "extreme" vetting of immigrants, etc.*

I didn't like my parents always telling me to do things, but some of it was to help me be a better person and a lot was to protect us. I didn't understand that until later in life that my parents only wanted the best for us.

The GOP irrefutable hates government intervention only when it creates equality.

Obamacare, Sanctuary cities, open borders etc....doesn't really strike me as living a quality lifestyle.

It's baffling how so many people that don't earn over $250k a year support the GOP despite the fact that that party is comfortable raping those that earn less than $250k a year.

What about the rich elites that make over $250K that support the DNP the over taxation of punishing success and willing take the jobs and careers away from thousands of Americans?

Of course, this includes most enoloyees of the media that are not members of the editorial boards or higher. And, no members of those groups would be wasting their time posting here.

What's an "enoloyees"??

Who said anything about giving 320 million people healthcare "free of charge?" There are many industrialized countries that provide universal healthcare or single payer plans for its citizens (Japan being one of them).

I don't care about other countries, we are not them, they are not us and we have a more complex and different system and circumstances also, these countries don't have a population of 320 million people and not including the undocumented illegals

However, plans like these will not be possible if the Republicans keep giving tax breaks to rich people who don't need them or allow lobbyists from the healthcare industry to write their legislation.

Democrats had the floor, had 7 years do create something wonderful and affordable (if there is such a thing when government gets involved in healthcare) and it created a financial nightmare and the GOP are now following in their footsteps.

Just out of curiosity, what is your solution?

Honestly, I don't have one, but either way, the system stinks.

-4 ( +0 / -4 )

Democrats had the floor, had 7 years do create something wonderful and

affordable (if there is such a thing when government gets involved in

healthcare) and it created a financial nightmare and the GOP are now

following in their footsteps.

Nailed it. Perfectly stated. None of the proposals work.

Our elected representatives aren't up for the job, it seems.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

I don't care about other countries, we are not them, they are not us and we have a more complex and different system and circumstances also, these countries don't have a population of 320 million people and not including the undocumented illegals . . .

That sounds arrogant. The U.S. could and should learn from other countries. I'm not saying that the U.S. should copy what these places are doing exactly, but it can make adaptations to their plans to fits its system. What ever happened to the old American "can-do" attitude? (the one that it had when America was truly "great").

Democrats had the floor, had 7 years do create something wonderful and affordable . . .

The Democrats created the ACA despite Republicans best efforts to block it and get rid of it. The Republicans also added 160 amendments to it before it finally passed, so they own quite a bit of its content as well. The Republicans have had 8 years to come up with an alternative, and they haven't. All they have proven that they can do is obstruct and complain.

. . . it created a financial nightmare and the GOP are now following in their footsteps.

It's only a "nightmare" in the imaginations of partisan ideologues. Millions of Americans are quite happy with it, and millions more from all political affiliations recently told their so-called "representatives" not to replace it with the latest "plan" that the Republicans came up with.

Honestly, I don't have one . . .

Why not? How is constantly complaining and criticizing the ACA and other proposals like Single Payer helpful if you don't have a better idea? The Republicans have done this for the last 6 years, and they have nothing to show for it except for empty rhetoric and broken promises.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

bass4funk

I don't care about other countries, we are not them, they are not us and we have a more complex and different system and circumstances also, these countries don't have a population of 320 million people and not including the undocumented illegals

The EU has about 750 million people, twice that of America and every EU person are entitled to healthcare, in every of the EU 28 countries. The cost of the healthcare Euro is about half of the healthcare dollar.

American has a more complex and system which fails to provide healthcare for all Americans. Meanwhile all the politicians in congress are receiving full free medical care at cost to the taxpayers. What sort of sign is that?

Next week, 4th July, America is 241 years so at least, maybe America can create a healthcare system for all by 250 years?

4 ( +4 / -0 )

That sounds arrogant.

To some, maybe, but to others No.

The U.S. could and should learn from other countries. I'm not saying that the U.S. should copy what these places are doing exactly, but it can make adaptations to their plans to fits its system. What ever happened to the old American "can-do" attitude? (the one that it had when America was truly "great").

Its amazing how for so long the world has been trying to lecture the US to leave other countries alone and not get involved with their inside politics and mind their own business, now that the US is finally taking that advice, the world is now saying we should do as they do and being an isolationist is not the way to go we are all in this together, we have to think about each other...

This is the reason why more Americans want to permanently stay out of everyone's affairs and wish the rest of the world do the same and stay out of ours.

The Democrats created the ACA despite Republicans best efforts to block it and get rid of it.

Because they knew what it would do in the long run and here we are. Had the Democrats not been so greedy to overtake and overhaul the entire healthcare system instead of fixing the system for those that didn't have it, no problem and they would have been on board with it.

The Republicans also added 160 amendments to it before it finally passed, so they own quite a bit of its content as well.

That's not what the people thought or you wouldn't see Democrats losing huge margins everywhere.

The Republicans have had 8 years to come up with an alternative, and they haven't. All they have proven that they can do is obstruct and complain.

On that part, I can't really say anything, you're right on that part, but we are right back to where we started and the GOP are falling in the same trap.

It's only a "nightmare" in the imaginations of partisan ideologues.

That goes both ways.

Millions of Americans are quite happy with it, and millions more from all political affiliations recently told their so-called "representatives" not to replace it with the latest "plan" that the Republicans came up with.

Of course the people that are financially strapped are happy with it, but millions of people in the middle that had to carry the poor people's share, hate it, these people voiced their opposition to the rising premiums and the left did nothing, so they kicked the Democrats out.

Why not? How is constantly complaining and criticizing the ACA and other proposals like Single Payer helpful if you don't have a better idea?

Because with the mounting national debt we have and growing and with the population growing, there is no way, the country can handle that for too long, Dems said, Obamacare is the law of the and and will be here forever and boy were they wrong.

The Republicans have done this for the last 6 years, and they have nothing to show for it except for empty rhetoric and broken promises.

Then if that were the case, the Dems would still be in power everywhere. When you lose over 1000 legislative seats, the House, the Senate, that's something indicative and seriously wrong within the Democratic Party, that's solely on them and if they continue to recognize how destructive their policies are overall, it's going to be awhile before they win anything.

The EU has about 750 million people, twice that of America and every EU person are entitled to healthcare, in every of the EU 28 countries.

Ok, so what's your point?

The cost of the healthcare Euro is about half of the healthcare dollar.

I grew up half of my life in Europe and honestly, I'm not jealous of that system, lived it and used it as well as my mother. Not impressed, not at all.

American has a more complex and system which fails to provide healthcare for all Americans. Meanwhile all the politicians in congress are receiving full free medical care at cost to the taxpayers. What sort of sign is that?

I understand and agree, but there are No politicians that would dare dream of using the very healthcare they are forcing upon us, that's my problem. I want Congress to use the same healthcare they are trying to jam down our throats, if they used it for a year, I'll bet they would work on fixing it day and night to make a better system.

Next week, 4th July, America is 241 years so at least, maybe America can create a healthcare system for all by 250 years?

Personally, I don't want the government near my healthcare, that's why I pay cash for everything.

-3 ( +0 / -3 )

Personally, I don't want the government near my healthcare, that's why I pay cash for everything.

Why are you in Japan?

2 ( +2 / -0 )

bass4funk

Ok, so what's your point?

The point that you stated because America has a pop of 350 million healthcare is difficult and complex and forgot to also add, expensive and wasteful. In contrast the EU of 28 countries, with each country not only able to provide healthcare for its own citizens but also for any within the EU and at an average cost of about half of that in America.

I grew up half of my life in Europe and honestly, I'm not jealous of that system, lived it and used it as well as my mother. Not impressed, not at all.

According to this article, seven EU countries and Japan are in the top 16 for healthcare. Does not even mention the USA? I think America usually ranks about 35th.

http://uk.businessinsider.com/healthiest-countries-in-the-world-2017-1/#1-luxembourg-nestled-between-belgium-france-and-germany-the-wealthy-nation-of-luxembourg-tops-the-legatum-institutes-health-sub-index-the-countrys-average-life-expectancy-is-82-16

Personally, I don't want the government near my healthcare, that's why I pay cash for everything.

You have stated that several times and are part of the 11.5% without healthcare insurance so the other 88.5% of the pop don't agree with you. I have also pointed out to you that a single night in a hospital could cost you $50,000 so I really have to doubt that you could afford those levels of fees but nor can the majority of the people. Even the rich have healthcare insurance.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

bass4funk

Personally, I don't want the government near my healthcare, that's why I pay cash for everything.

Except when you are living and working in Japan, which you have also previously stated you do, you are required to pay the National Health.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

The point that you stated because America has a pop of 350 million healthcare is difficult and complex and forgot to also add, expensive and wasteful. In contrast the EU of 28 countries, with each country not only able to provide healthcare for its own citizens but also for any within the EU and at an average cost of about half of that in America.

I understand, but Europe's GDP isn't anywhere near that of the US and as I have said before, these are all smaller nations, we have the 3rd largest population after India and China and again, there is No way, the system can cover 320 million soundly and efficiently as the smaller nations.

I have also pointed out to you that a single night in a hospital could cost you $50,000 so I really have to doubt that you could afford those levels of fees but nor can the majority of the people. Even the rich have healthcare insurance.

With all due respect, you don't know my financial situation and yes, I do pay cash, have been for the last 15 years and No, not all rich people have healthcare insurance. I have a doctor in the States and I pay him cash every time and would never buy into this system. I have the financial means and the right.

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

The Obamacare law, according to the information, however, guaranteed subsidies for government medical programs. The new rules introduced by Donald Trump eliminate much of the subsidy and seriously reduce health care spending. Probably some congressmen enjoy it. Group insurance is already known in many countries, many employers offer such an insurance system ... Will this be a good strategic move? Time will tell ... Trump is a trader with many years of experience..

0 ( +0 / -0 )

With all due respect, you don't know my financial situation

We understand you are very rich. My question is would you trust the Japan system if you suddenly needed emergency heart surgery and you were hours or even minutes from death. If you realized you had cancer then you can zip back from Narita to the US on your private jet to get the latest and greatest care since you won't die in in minutes like you could with a heart attack. Do you trust the Japanese system on their skill alone? (cash or no cash)

No way, the system can cover 320 million soundly and efficiently as the smaller nations.

Sure it can. As you know it covers all those seniors with high health risks. And hey are the takers.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

bass4funk

I understand, but Europe's GDP isn't anywhere near that of the US and as I have said before, these are all smaller nations, we have the 3rd largest population after India and China and again, there is No way, the system can cover 320 million soundly and efficiently as the smaller nations.

You are not correct. USA GDP $18 trillion. EU GDP $20 trillion. The population of the EU is twice that of America. "Small nations" The EU operates like one country in many aspects. All 750 million of the EU receives full healthcare. If they travel to another EU country, like for instance, from Britain to France, they can also receive full health treatment there too. The total cost of the healthcare of the 28 EU countries is less than in America. The cost per person is half of that in America. At least 8 EU countries are in the top 16 for healthcare when America is 35th. Don't know why you continue to think the EU is a small nation.

All I have heard are poor excuses for its healthcare when next week the country will be 241 years.

With all due respect, you don't know my financial situation and yes, I do pay cash, have been for the last 15 years and No, not all rich people have healthcare insurance. 

Well they do because according to the government figures only 11.5% have no healthcare insurance. So you are able to pay $50,000 per night for a hospital bed if you need heart valve treatment? In three weeks that adds up to more than $1 million. I don't doubt your right only your means. I don't believe really don't.

No reply on your contributions to the Japanese healthcare system.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

zichi, I applaud your efforts and everything you write is on the ball, but you are trying to nail jelly to the wall.

2 ( +2 / -0 )

cleo,

thanks but its always difficult trying to educate some and maybe more like just throwing the jelly at the wall and hoping it will stick. With my parents in America, brother and wife, a mass of other family members, about 20 or so, I think, the issue of healthcare is an important one for them. They all manage to have it but like my 90 year old mother she pays a lot too.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

Instead of trying to lower costs and improve service, the GOP are trying to eliminate services, increase costs, and refund nearly a trillion dollars to those who least need a tax cut. Trumpcare is not a very good replacement for Obamacare.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

bass4funk

I grew up half of my life in Europe and honestly, I'm not jealous of that system, lived it and used it as well as my mother. Not impressed, not at all.

I think a good indicator of a country's healthcare system is the lifespan. Japan has been in the No1 position for year and followed by the USA in N043 position.

In fact, there are 17 European countries with longer lifespans than America. So how do you explain that?

1 ( +1 / -0 )

Another measure is Infant mortality rate. USA not looking well on that one.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

Half the problem is that the GOP misrepresented what Obamacare is to

their base in order to get people angry about it, and now they are

forced to repeal something that's actually popular. The country will

have to suffer while this silly game continues to play out.

About Obamacare - I have the monthly bills which are higher than our mortgage, if there was any confusion. They were 300% less a few years ago. It is hardly silly.

That fact that you think it is silly greatly concerns me. Perhaps people with corporate-provided insurance should pay $300/month towards the national insurance pool? That sounds "fair" to me.

0 ( +0 / -0 )

I don't think ACA was perfect but it seems the biggest reason to overturn it completely rather than look at the issues is not concern for businesses or people but that a black guy from the "wrong" party got it through.

Still I come from a place, like the most of the rest of the world, where a words like "social responsibility" and "for the better good" don't have people loading their guns and screaming persecution.

Even from simple economic points of view in medicine its much cheaper to help someone early than later.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

Login to leave a comment

Facebook users

Use your Facebook account to login or register with JapanToday. By doing so, you will also receive an email inviting you to receive our news alerts.

Facebook Connect

Login with your JapanToday account

User registration

Articles, Offers & Useful Resources

A mix of what's trending on our other sites