UK's Labour set to vote against Brexit deal; open to second referendum

Labour has listed six tests it would apply to any Brexit deal, including a strong future relationship with the EU that delivers the same benefits Britain has as a member of the bloc's single market and customs union.

As things get closer, it becomes more and more obvious to the politicians that they are doing a hell of a lot more than shooting themselves in the foot, they are setting Britain up to fail.

Meanwhile, the issue of the border hasn't gone away, you know.

https://www.ft.com/video/33264c1e-c744-4b24-bdb7-b89b09716517

Don't give people a choice, then take it away from them.

The establishment have tried extremely hard for 2 years to pump out as much anti-Brexit propaganda as possible, but it still hasn't worked. Politicians are started to get scared that the public fully accept the consequences of leaving, and still want to go ahead.

Only 16% in the latest survey (Huff Post) wanted to Remain in the EU. All others went for various leave options, with the Canada style trade deal being most popular.

https://order-order.com/2018/09/25/chequers-remain-crushed-new-poll/

Kier Starmer doesn't care about result of the referendum, the people or democracy.

Starmer is one of the few Labour MPs with a brain. Corbyn and his Momentum fan club are too busy jockying for position within the party to be bothered about the wider picture.

Starmer is only popular with people who wanted to remain, and still want to remain in the EU.

Starmer is only popular with people who wanted to remain, and still want to remain in the EU.

That's pretty much half the population, then.

On a personal level, I accept the outcome of the referendum (even if it was fanned by outright lies and jingoism) and wouldn't want to see the result changed.

Saying that, putting the GFA in jeopardy is a deranged move. Don't think there won't be consequences.

It was not fanned by outright lies and jingoism. People who keep saying that reveal what they think of the average voter. They also say it because to convince themselves that they are morally right. BOTH campaigns lied, but voters made their own choice.

GFA is not in danger. Does Northern Ireland want a hard border? NO. Does the British government? NO. Does the R.O.I.? NO. Does the EU? Probably not, and they wouldn't fund it anyway.

It was not fanned by outright lies and jingoism. People who keep saying that reveal what they think of the average voter.

I guess you didn't read the right wing headlines castigating the judges who ruled on Article 50.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/nov/04/enemies-of-the-people-british-newspapers-react-judges-brexit-ruling

Not to mention the promises of all the money that would be saved and used on the NHS.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/sep/18/boris-johnson-350-million-claim-bogus-foreign-secretary

GFA is not in danger. Does Northern Ireland want a hard border? NO. Does the British government? NO. Does the R.O.I.? NO. Does the EU? Probably not, and they wouldn't fund it anyway.

I certainly hope so. Both Jacob Rees Mogg and Johnson have shown utter contempt for the people of Ireland - north and south. They are capitalising on Brexit for political gain and care not a jot for the average voter.

The only good that comes out of this is international businesses chosing to move to the Republic and/or the unification of Ireland (but not a return to the war in which more than 3 thousand people died).

Not to mention an independent Scotland.

I accept the outcome of the referendum (even if it was fanned by outright lies and jingoism)

You just said the OUTCOME was fanned by outright lies and jingoism, but the judges ruling on Article 50 was long after the referendum. What connection do the headlines about that have to the result of the referendum?

Again, people go on about the bus because in their mind's other voters couldn't possibly have voted for any other reason than that. Many Remain voters have convinced themselves that the other side are too "simple", and were misled by a bus.

And on that note, you said "Promise". The word "Let's" was actually written on that bus. "Let's" doesn't mean, "We promise to" or "We will", does it?

The majority of Scottish people are not interested in independence, and won't be for quite some time. They are fatigued like we all are. The polls haven't changed.

http://whatscotlandthinks.org/questions/how-would-you-vote-in-the-in-a-scottish-independence-referendum-if-held-now-ask#line

You just said the OUTCOME was fanned by outright lies and jingoism, but the judges ruling on Article 50 was long after the referendum. What connection do the headlines about that have to the result of the referendum?

The judges ruling was part of the outcome - the outcome of the referendum is still ongoing, as we can see from the news on daily basis.

Many Remain voters have convinced themselves that the other side are too "simple", and were misled by a bus.

You're the one questioning the intelligence of brexiteers. There was misinformation and lies peddled by the pro-Brexit side. Not my fault some people swallowed them.

The majority of Scottish people are not interested in independence, and won't be for quite some time. They are fatigued like we all are. The polls haven't changed.

We'll see. Some English folk seem to believe they will have dominion over the neighboring countries ad infinitum. But if the UK can leave the EU, there's no reason why Scotland can't leave the UK. Fatigue is easily curable. If it wasn't the likes of your good self wouldn't be posting on the same topic over and over.

the outcome of the referendum is still ongoing

It really isn't.

I'm trying to point out that some people who voted remain are still trying to peddle this myth that those who voted leave are lacking intelligence.

Yes, I also think it's best to leave it there.

It really isn't.

Do we have to get into semantics now?

outcome

ˈaʊtkʌm/

noun

the way a thing turns out; a consequence."it is the outcome of the vote that counts"

synonyms:result, end result, consequence, net result, upshot, effect, after-effect, aftermath, conclusion, sequel, follow-up, issue, product, end product, end, development, offshoot, outgrowth, wake, denouement

I'm trying to point out that some people who voted remain are still trying to peddle this myth that those who voted leave are lacking intelligence.

You're the one who mentioned voters' intelligence. I don't doubt for a minute that there were many, many voters who saw the EU as a bureaucratic nightmare and wanted out. But at what cost?

I lived in the UK long enough to see the unrest stoked by opportunistic politicians in order to make a name for themselves. They've got what they want now and the tensions will not easily be defused. I wish the UK the best of luck and the eventual independence for Scotland and the unification of Ireland. It won't be easy but it's the natural progression of things, post-Brexit.