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U.S. professor's Holocaust-Gaza comparison stirs debate

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I think it will be interesting to see how this plays out.

On the one hand, I don't offhand see how "parallel images of Nazis and Israelis" relates to the "Sociology of Globalization". To the extent that it does not relate, the prof would seem to be pressing some issue or other.

On the other hand, we are kind of in the dark here as to how the prof claims these images pertain to the issue. To the extent that they are pertinent, the furor that this has caused will tend to suggest that over-sensitivity (or outright manipulation) leads to the false proposition that to criticize Israel is to be anti-Semitic.

As far as students being intimidated is concerned, it's difficult to see how the prof could be intimidating with respect to a single point. I can see how the prof's opinion is personal, but that is a professional prerogative. As for his opinion being political, no one seemed to say what political agenda he was pressing.

My bottom line here is that professors have an obligation to make sure that the materials in their course are relevant to the general subject are of the course. To the extent that materials are relevant, the are free to, well, "profess". Students have an obligation to contest their professors. And Israel is not above criticism--even criticisms that are couched in particularly painful terms.

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The person who is being intimidated is Professor Robinson. This is a simply and awful fact of American life: You criticize Israel in the US at your peril. What the professor is saying is essentially right: Gaza is like the Warsaw Ghetto. At this point the Israelis are not seeking a systematic Final Solution to the Palestinian problem, but then neither did the Nazis at first. A better parallel is South African apartheid or the US vicious policies toward Native Americans. But the hideousness of what Israel did in Gaza, as the world stood silence, is damnable in itself without comparisons.

This is only one reason Professor Robinson is in trouble. He dared criticize Israel.

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Pretty clever move in this economy - draw attention to yourself, become a cause celebre "victim" of some sort, and at least have that advantage over the rafts of other soon-to-be laid off "sociology" professors in Obama's America of Greatly Diminished Expectations.

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The word, "Holocaust" seems to have been trademarked by the modern state of Israel, in much the same way as Japan owns the rights to "Atomic Bomb Victims." As such, any person stupid enough to use these terms in reference to any other nationality or racial group does so at their peril.

With living conditions and infant mortality rates that are some of the worst in the world, what term would Israel prefer that people use when discussing its treatment of the Palestinians? What about "The Final Solution" which I believe the previous trademark owners (the Nazis) have relinquished rights to? Unfortunately, "Ethnic Cleansing" cannot be trademarked because it is a generic term.

And these people wonder why Palestinian concentration (refugee) camps are ripe for terrorist recruitment.......

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I thought Professors were supposed to be objective not opinionated. That is for the students. so they can debate it with each other. If students see a Professor's opinion outright and oppose it they have reason to fear that their marks could be compromised. This guy should also be accused of professional negligence.

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The prof in question has a Flicker account - lots of photos with people waving red flags.

He is like, totally down with the locals in El Salvador, and their, you know, struggle.

"Towards Socialism through the Democratic Revolution."

http://www.flickr.com/photos/wirobinson/page3/

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Of course this is true, only the whitewashed US press does not call it as it is in the occupied territories. You have to read outside the US press to know what is really going on there and it is very similar to the nazi party policies as they ramped up their purification efforts.

The whole is issue is a national shame for both Israel and the USA unfortunately.

Carter got the same treatment when he linked israel to apartheid.

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What an idiot.

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SezWho2: My bottom line here is that professors have an obligation to make sure that the materials in their course are relevant to the general subject are of the course.

1) it was an e-mail. Students could take it or leave it. It would seem no one's time was wasted. 2) I would not want professors to get pigeon-holed so much, or any teacher for that matter. Going off topic about matters they are passionate about is perfectly ok with me so long as the teaching of the course matter is adequate. Keeping teachers too focused on the subject matter is a threat to a well rounded education. Life is not a textbook, and you cannot learn about it with your nose buried in one all the time.

Students have an obligation to contest their professors.

Yes, and that applies to both point one and point two. As far as one, they should check to see if its going to be on the test. As far as two, if they are not being taught enough of the subject matter, they have to claim so.

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Yet ANOTHER Jew criticizing Israel.

The Holocaust comparison is valid. I have made it myself.

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“That’s like saying if I condemn the U.S. government for the invasion of Iraq, I’m anti-American,” he said. “It’s the most absurd, baseless argument.”

Bang on! and I think that's the problem in particular that posters like teleprompter are having (particularly because he called anyone who was anti-bush an 'anti-American' but believes the same thing doesn't apply when you are against a Democratic president).

I agree with what the man is saying in regards to him being allowed to teach what he is teaching, and express his opinion. I don't agree at all with the people persecuting him on it, though of course I know that the holocaust is a sensitive subject and needs to be treaded on lightly. I'm not sure about showing the graphic pictures to the class, but the subject matter on this topic is one that has been expressed world-wide by all sorts of people; that the Palestinian camps are much like the Warsaw ghettos and the treatment of said peoples can be akin to the Holocaust. I say AKIN to because, while I believe ghetto living conditions were no better than things are with the Palestinians, of course the Nazi executions of Jews was much more outright and as was said in the article, 'calculated'.

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smithinjapan: I say AKIN to because, while I believe ghetto living conditions were no better than things are with the Palestinians, of course the Nazi executions of Jews was much more outright and as was said in the article, 'calculated'.

Concentration camps were part and parcel of the Holocaust. Palistinians now live in mass concentration camps.

I'm not sure about showing the graphic pictures to the class

It was an e-mail.

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bushlover: "I thought Professors were supposed to be objective not opinionated."

Did you not attend university/college? The professors are required to be objective, to an extent, on student opinions and discussions, and motivate a variety of opinions on the subject matter (depending on the class, of course), but the professor chooses his/her own texts, etc. What's more, it's up to the prof to present a framework of subject matter for students within which to argue. It's never, "What do you think of this book/article/issue", it's always, "compare/contrast this book with another in a different period on a similar subject", or, "compare/contrast the atomic bombings of Japan to their colonization and atrocities in Asia from a moral stand point", etc.

But if you want to get down to it, it's up to the prof to present the material, and the students to be as objective a group as possible when arguing it (not to mention the admin and community). Basically, because it mentions 'Holocaust' and doesn't support Israel outright it's raising red lights.

Compare/contrast this issue to a school in Iran: you wouldn't object at all to a professor talking about how Islam could be harmful, but you can darn well bet the prof in question would be persecuted (probably killed, in Iran) and simply called Anti-Muslim.

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likeitis: "Concentration camps were part and parcel of the Holocaust."

True, and I'm not denying that, but I'm referring to the literal practice of stuffing people into dense rooms to be gassed, or burned to death, which is not being carried out by Israelis (again, hence my 'akin' to, since you can argue that in a way they are being slaughtered similarly through Israeli invasions). Not quite the same thing.

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while I would be happy to let the prof speak, and I'd listen to him. He should be open to the criticism at the same time. What he is not mentioning anyway is that the holocaust was started from step one out of hatred. This crises is not. This a result of a war that is still on going. second, I don't see Israelis rounding up the people of Gaza to be put to work, nor do I hear of human testing, lamp shades being made from human skin, torture of women and children.

He can have his opinion, but comparing the people of Gaza's problem to the Holocaust which was to wipe Jews off the face of the planet is a bit extreme. additionally, as a prof, he should point out more than he has, that Hamas can fix a lot of this, not all, but a great deal of it.

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Tossing my two cents into this one.....What exactly was in the mailer? If anyone has that mail please do share it. I would like to see what he has so say and then judge him on the merits of his work.

Somethings do bother me;

He is Jewish and is using his freedoms to speak out against something he views as wrong. Now that he has spoken he is being attacked as an antisemitic.

The term Holocaust appears to have been trade marked. When it was used by the professor he was attacked for using it.

His attackers are not speaking about what he wrote. They are trying to discredit him as a Communist Jew hating Jew. No one is speaking about his works and trying to show that his writings are wrong. Why is that?

I for one believe that if you look at the Gaza issue from just the Palestinian side that would be wrong. You also need to see the Jewish side and look at what they go through.

To get a better idea of the situation you need to try to see it through both sides.

I think that this Professor should be allowed to speak his mind. It is up to his students to accept his writings or not. I really do not like the way the media is going after him.

I for one believe in Freedom of Speech for all no matter if you agree with it or not. I also believe in Freedom of the Press.

But if the Press joins in the lynching of one person or group, then that right should be striped. The press should be objective and not one sided. It appears that a majority of the press is being one sided in this case. The press is the one that looks bad.

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bushlover: I thought Professors were supposed to be objective not opinionated. That is for the students. so they can debate it with each other. If students see a Professor's opinion outright and oppose it they have reason to fear that their marks could be compromised. This guy should also be accused of professional negligence.

This a reason why liberals have traditionally dominated academics. So many conservatives just don't get it, and I am sure that many would agree with your statements.

If the educated among us do not share their opinions with us, then we are doomed to constantly re-invent the wheel for every subject that comes up. It is also an educator's duty to provide direction, not just be a neutral debate mediator from start to finish.

What an educator does not do is FORCE his opinions on others by such tactics as: giving you a lesser grade for having a different opinion, or making you the constant whipping boy of his lectures. Hiding their opinion at all times would be extremely backward.

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"What an educator does not do is FORCE his opinions on others by such tactics as: giving you a lesser grade for having a different opinion, or making you the constant whipping boy of his lectures. Hiding their opinion at all times would be extremely backward."

You obviously did not go to university in the States.

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A Jewish university professor

Gee, do you think this guy might be a leftist? :-D

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likeitis,

Yes, it was an email. Emails from an instructor are, generally speaking, part of the materials of the course. They need to be relevant. Your instructor is your instructor, not your friend--unless of course he is your friend, in which case it rather beggars belief that 80 students in his class happen to be his friends.

I think it is difficult to judge this case without knowing:

a) whether emails were a regular part of the course;

b) whether the subject of this particular email is related to the main matter of the course;

c) if neither a) nor b), how the subject arose--whether this is further to the matter of an issue that a student raised in class, for example, or whether it is a gratuitous and irrelevant opinion offered by the instructor;

and d), the exact content of the email unencumbered by the hostile opinions of those who objected to it.

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Trouble with this tired, silly "Israel is just like Nazi Germany!" meme is that Left, when parroting this, forgets that the Hitler was a Lefty, and that NAZISM stood for Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei.

Israel is democratic, pluralistic, capitalistic, and invites immigrants.

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Teleprompter, it has ceased to be surprising the way you pile assumption on top of assumption on top of assumption. Just like those in the video who see a black man and assume he is for affirmative action, or poor. Just like people who see a Jew and assume he supports Israel. Or the way people assume that those who criticize Israel are anti-Jewish.

You obviously did not go to university in the States.

Actually, I did. Now, I did not say that we did not have dogmatic opinion forcing leftist teachers. We did. I think it is obvious, to everyone but you, that my meaning was that it is wrong to be so, not that we did not have them.

Despite having them, I have grown up to be a free thinker toward the middle of the political spectrum. But, as bad as some of those miguided liberals were, I shudder to think what it would have been like being taught by mostly conservatives. Fighting wars with the standard conservative type on your side is welcome. Having them as teachers us is not.

I would much rather weed out the bad-for-thought liberals from a group of liberal professors, than try to weed out the bad-for-thought conservatives from a group of conservative professors. Call me lazy, but I like to do as little weeding as possible.

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I don't think many teachers give a lesser grade to students who hold different opinions. I think, however, many teachers give a lesser grade to students who cannot defend their opinions.

That should not be surprising, especially if the opinions that they hold are outlandish and indefensible. Neither should it be surprising that such students are the last to recognize the poverty of their arguments.

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The guy can say what he wants, but he also has to deal with others criticizing him for it.

He talks of genocide, when obviously this isn't the situation in Gaza. One can get cute and break out a dictionary and start making a series of weak links and say that the beginning equals the end, but that's about the best one can do. In the end it doesn't overcome the mountain that's called common sense. Usually people get creative with the vocabulary in hopes that it will distract people from using common sense.

My guess is that this guy is angry and emotional so he's using the most graphic terms he can because he's angry and emotional. It doesn't matter that they aren't appropriate because he's not trying to be appropriate. He's trying to lash out as best he can, and these are the strongest and most shocking words he can imagine so he's applying them here. I don't think he's an anti-Semite, I just think he's childish.

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SezWho: Yes, it was an email. Emails from an instructor are, generally speaking, part of the materials of the course. They need to be relevant.

You are asking for less information. I prefer more, even if unrelated. Another reason, I disagree.

Also, wasting 20 minutes of class time is one thing, but sending me a mail I can simply disregard is quite another. If somebody saw that and thought they had to read it to make the grade, then I am afraid they are fools not even a more rigid professor is going to help.

I would only object if my inbox were getting full of such mails and I did not like them. At that point, I would suggest the prof make two lists of names and remove me from the non-essential one.

I appreciate your list of points though. It is hard to judge, but I am going with "unrelated", and all students should have either known or asked.

But yes, (d) is still quite the problem. I have seen lots of professors torn up for just speaking by the very tactic of hiding what he or she really said, or ignoring it.

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teleprompter: Trouble with this tired, silly "Israel is just like Nazi Germany!" meme is that Left, when parroting this, forgets that the Hitler was a Lefty, and that NAZISM stood for Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei. Israel is democratic, pluralistic, capitalistic, and invites immigrants.

Bad news dude: The world cannot be broken down into right and left, with all ideas either on one side or the other. This is not about either of the four things you mention at the end. This is about rounding up your perceived enemies into concentrion camps. Hitler did it. Israel did it, and maintains the situation.

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Helter_Skelter: Gee, do you think this guy might be a leftist? :-D

No, I was thinking he might be a centrist and a free thinker.

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So despite the Muslim Arab collaboration with Nazi Germany and Hitler, their continued quest to annihilate Israel and the Jewish people, and their making Mein Kampf a best seller in the Middle East, it's somehow Israel that's like Nazi Germany? Too funny. Note to Leftists - just because the "Palestinians" are weaker than Israel doesn't make them noble. Best not be confused as to who the real Nazis are here.

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JB: I don't think the media is coming down on him that hard. I agree, this should be wide open for a debate, but check this out, a complete flip: http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,518636,00.html

So, now we have left leaning teachers stumping on students for reading Fox news.

I'd like for people to get off the left and right, conserv/lib crap as soon as possible.

This is about rounding up your perceived enemies into concentrion camps. Hitler did it. Israel did it, and maintains the situation." I'd like to know how many people were rounded up and put in the Gaza. You purposely left another group that rounded up a particular group out of your post. I think that is why sez is coming down on you.

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So despite the Muslim Arab collaboration with Nazi Germany and Hitler, their continued quest to annihilate Israel and the Jewish people, and their making Mein Kampf a best seller in the Middle East, it's somehow Israel that's like Nazi Germany?

Yes. You will never guess what country a lot of Israelites came from.

Anyway, it is quite possible for two Nazi groups to oppose eachother. I guess you never heard of the Night of the Long Knives?

Dude, you really need to back off this Us vs. Them, left or right, childishly simplistic and unproductive world view. SERIOUSLY.

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skipthesong: I'd like to know how many people were rounded up and put in the Gaza.

So its not that it was done, its how many that counts?

Anyway, maybe I should have said "driven into concentration camps". My bad. But I always did maintain that Israel improved on Nazi ways, including the point of doing things in a more "news-friendly" way.

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The guy is the very definition of a fringe left-wing moonbat.

I went to his website. The first most important link he uses to support his work......... Well take a look.

http://www.soc.ucsb.edu/faculty/robinson/links.shtml

A real freethinker and centrist? You have got to be kidding.

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But I always did maintain that Israel improved on Nazi ways

Then why is the "Palestinian" population increasing? The population of Jews decreased during the Holocaust.

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The guy is the very definition of a fringe left-wing moonbat.

Undoubtedly. But likeitis believes he's a "centrist and a free thinker" like himself. :-D

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like: You mean like a great many of the Jews were once driven out of the place and sent wandering? And only after just a few moments of declaring independence, including a great many already from the area, they were attacked and attacked and attacked.

Sure, Israel has a lot of bad on their side, but a great many of you are leaving out, and on purpose, of what has brought them to act in such a way. This is teacher, unless proven otherwise, is at fault for ignoring the same catalysts so many are recently.

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you really need to back off this Us vs. Them

So, I guess according to your world view, you would see little difference between, say, the Allies and the Third Reich. You'd take a centrist approach, viewing Adolf Hitler and Winston Churchill as essentially equals. Well, that certainly says a lot about you likeitis.

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Hamas runs their own concentration camp in Gaza and they're committing a holocaust against its citizens.

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Likeitis:

" Hitler did it. Israel did it, and maintains the situation. "

You sound like you took a course with Professor Robinson (or have been listening to Al Jazeera.... same result).

The claim is of course nonsensical. Nobody was "rounded up" in Gaza; to the contrary, Israel has removed existing Jewish population from Gaza (which had been there for thousands of years), and instead of peace got more rockets.

Meanwhile, the Arab muslim population of Gaza has multiplied from originally about 200,000 to now around 2 million, and keeps growing. Some "concentration camp".

You know, there is a line where blatant ignorance stops being cute and becomes offensive.

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I teach at a University and I have to tell teach my students reality and the facts, and secondly also what is in the subject texts. The first is is to assist them when they go out into the wider world to be a success, the second is to get a high mark from the subject exam.

I was accused last year of racial vilification by a Zimbabwean student who had failed the subject twice with other tutor/lecturers and had attended just one of my compulsory classes. It turned out his Visa had run out and to have it renewed he had to be regularly attending classes, passing his subjects and of good character. He failed all three but still his complaint went through University process for months, without me ever being officially notified. The eight different people the matter went through, fell over backwards to assist him. They sent emails to an address I don't have and letters to a University mail box I don't use. They got angrier with every unresponded to communication. You would think that someone amongst these "University" academics could have had the sense to just pick up the phone and asked me why I wasn't responding. The lack of a response suited their bias and preferred outcome. Fortunately, every other student in that class signed a statement to say the accuser's claims were untrue and did not happen. But being run mainly by women and the politically correct they could not just find him guilty of lying - they sort an "equality of outcome". They dismissed his claims but kept him on and assisted him to get his visa. I got high blood pressure. 96% of students in my classes pass, with over 70% obtaining high distinctions, distinctions or credits. I don't mark their exam papers so the pass rate is genuine. I pity Professor Robinson because he will be judged by people under pressure from the local and international Jewish diaspora. There is a Jewish school next to my Univeristy that looks like a concentration camp. It has high cyclone wire fencing all around similar to a concentration camp and huge double tiered electronic security gates, CC TV cameras etcetera. It would almost impossible but for the invited to enter. Whereas my University with thousand of students from China, India, Sri Lanka, Africa, Japan, Indonesia, Europe Australia has no fences or security. It is a wide open campus welcoming everyone.

The difference between the Moslems on the Gaza strip and the Jewish people who suffered in the hands of the Nazi's is the Moslems are not passively going into walled ghetto's and concentration camps like the Jews did. The people of Gaza are fighting back. Most German Jews had until April 1942 to lawfully immigrate and most did. The Polish Jews, most of whom only spoke Yiddish and lived in enclaves separated from the Polish speaking people new the Germans were coming, but most did nothing. Many did get, going to Britain and then Australia the US etc. The Gazan people are walled in by the Israeli Army and Navy, cut off from the free world. And they are being starved and humiliated. One would think Israel is looking for a cheap domestic labor force of non-citizens. I don't want to say any more, but just read President Jimmy Carter's recent book on the Israeli apartheid.

The reason the Jewish Diaspora get so bitter about people like Professor Robinson and call him a racist or an anti-Semite is because they are unable to intellectualize an intelligent response and resort to the usual response we are witnessing. The funny thing is, the Professor is a Semite and so are the Arabs from Gaza, just like the Israeli's. Genetically, they are all the same people just born into different followers of the scripture. I am saddened for all the people who died in WW11 whether actively or passively involve.

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WilliB:The claim is of course nonsensical. Nobody was "rounded up" in Gaza; to the contrary, Israel has removed existing Jewish population from Gaza (which had been there for thousands of years), and instead of peace got more rockets.

The claim is historical. Yet you are talking about recent times and small numbers of people moving.

It seems like every time I read about the Arab-Israeli conflict, I get new information which puts things in different light. The issue is very complicated and is FRAUGHT with politics politics politics which means it is near impossible to get the straight truth. This is from Wiki:

As a result of Israel's victory in its 1948 war of independence, any Arabs caught on the wrong side of the cease-fire line were unable to return to their homes in what became Israel. Likewise, any Jews on the West Bank or in Gaza were exiled from their property and homes to Israel. The main difference between the two is that Arabs were allowed to stay in Israel and gain citizenship post-1948, while Jews were completely removed from Arab-held areas after 1948. Today's Palestinian refugees are the descendants of those who left, either out of fear for their lives or in response to instructions from the Grand Mufti and/or Arab armies to leave their homes, so the Arab armies would have a free-fire range to evict the Jews from the new UN-created State of Israel.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab-Israeli_conflict

This of course puts Israeli Jews in a slightly more favorable light. But look at that last sentence. U.N. created? I thought they declared independence on their own? Further, Arab-held areas were NOT Palestinian held areas. So you cannot blame the Palestinians for booting the Israeli Jews. But you can blame the Israelis for booting the people who became Palestinians. Another reason you can blame the Israelis is because the Palestinian areas have been so controlled by Israel and are part of Israel. They could have let Palestinians have their homes back. They declined. They kept the Palestinians penned up, and penned up on land that is not very fertile.

Now if you want to lay accusations at the Arab counties that attacked Israel of evicting Jews from Palestine, go right ahead. They are guilty. Just don't blame Palestinians for what they did. The Palestinians were caught between them, but its been the Israelis in control of their land, and their fate. Israel literally has them walled up, with razor wire on top of the walls, just like any concentration camp.

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WilliB: Meanwhile, the Arab muslim population of Gaza has multiplied from originally about 200,000 to now around 2 million, and keeps growing. Some "concentration camp".

You have concentration camps confused with death camps. Not the only basic idea you are confused on by the way.

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SuperLib: Hamas runs their own concentration camp in Gaza and they're committing a holocaust against its citizens.

To a degree its true. A small degree. Israel still has the overwhelming majority of control and influence though. Basically, what you are doing is of the same calibur as blaming the Jews that dropped the Zyklon B into the gas chambers for the mass murders of Jews. They bore a degree of guilt its true. A small degree. But you are not letting the Nazis off, are you?

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Brunobear at 07:03 PM JST - 2nd May

I must say that was a very good post. I just hope that folks here will read it and not try attack your post.

I wish to find Professor Robinson's paper and read what he said, and not what everyone is saying he said.

teleprompter at 02:03 PM JST - 2nd May Trouble with this tired, silly "Israel is just like Nazi Germany!" meme is that Left, when parroting this, forgets that the Hitler was a Lefty, and that NAZISM stood for Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei.

Once more into the breech, your attempts to re-write history never ceases to amaze me.

Now your claiming that Nazi party was a left wing political movement. You must be reading from the far right wing neo-con play book.

Now for the FACTS on where the Neo-Nazis stood.....

First site will give an idea of what the political spectrum looks like... Please note that Fascism (far right) is the complete opposite to Communism (far left).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:European-political-spectrum.png

Next let us go to the right and left ideologies....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Left-right_politics

I do hope that this has helped you with your confusion. You will see that the Nazi's were a far right wing political movement and not a far left.

Remember Fascism and Communism do not get along....One is far right the other is far left...

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skipthesong: You mean like a great many of the Jews were once driven out of the place and sent wandering?

If this were the 600s, and the Byzantine Empire was murdering and expelling Jews, I would side with the Jews. But that was a long time ago.

Sure, Israel has a lot of bad on their side, but a great many of you are leaving out, and on purpose, of what has brought them to act in such a way.

I am really not accepting history over 1000 years old to excuse today's behavior. Nor does it justify oppressing the Palestinians for what Israel's Arab neighbor countries did.

And only after just a few moments of declaring independence, including a great many already from the area, they were attacked and attacked and attacked.

Independence was declared over the heads of the Palestinian poplulation. They never should have done that. They knew they were bringing an invasion down on their heads:

The ceremony to proclaim independence was to be held in the Tel Aviv Museum (today known as Independence Hall) but was not widely publicised as it was feared that the British Authorities might attempt to prevent it or that the Arab armies might invade earlier than expected.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Declaration_of_the_Establishment_of_the_State_of_Israel,_May_14,_1948

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Likeitis:

" You have concentration camps confused with death camps. Not the only basic idea you are confused on by the way. "

No, I don´t. The Gazan population has multiplied from 200,000 to 2 million since the 67 war. Neither did Nazi camps receive fuel, electricity and other assistance from the Nazis, plus enormous funds from the EU and the UN and responded by shooting rockets back over the fence, and make forays across the border to kidnap German soldiers.

The concentration camp comparision is ignorant and obscene beyond belief.

How deeply have bought into to radical islamist propaganda?

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Brunobear:

" There is a Jewish school next to my Univeristy that looks like a concentration camp. It has high cyclone wire fencing all around similar to a concentration camp and huge double tiered electronic security gates, CC TV cameras etcetera. "

And why do you think that is? To keep out leftist professors like you, or because of the very real threats of violence from radical muslims and Nazis?

Reality check, please.

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On January 19th. an American professor sent an email with his view of the Gasa conflict to 80 students. His reasoning was politically very one sided & lacked any historical background. As a teacher he failed because he didn’t give an over all view leaving it to his students to find & argue against his view. Many of these students if not all will have lacked the confidence to argue back either because they don’t know enough or are fearful of low grades. They are not even sure if they can or should ignore this email. A single compliant to the university administration would have been enough but for some reason the press have gotten hold of this & turned it into what we are reading above.

This man took his own views & tried to impress them on to his students, he used typical media propaganda juxtaposing words & images designed to inspire emotional responses rather that intellectual reasoning. The actual subject is not the issue here, what he did & how he did is. I do however have to congratulate JT on yet again having a good understanding of the Pavlovian approach to reporting news on this site. From the above number of posts we can see that they really know their business & their posters. The above story is not about Israel or Gasa, this story is about a not very smart professor & if it does involve anything of more importance then that is free speech. Does this man have a right to say what he believes? Free speech really is important, but then it is different things to different people, I for example have been prevented from defending myself on this site against an insult, I was deleted & the insult still stands. But we have grown to accept this one sided treatment here. (bushlover at 09:51 PM JST - 2nd May. I did answer Alf’s post & point out that I come from London & have a right to talk about my own city how I like, you didn‘t see that post, it was deleted). But back to the nutty professor, he had the right to send his email to his students but what he didn’t have is the right to lie & that I believe is the central issue when we look at free speech. Anyone should have the right to give their opinion & say what they believe, but only when it is a truth. In the case of this man’s opinion he deliberately missed out a whole history & combined two subjects, the holocaust & Gasa. Yes they are related but in the way that this man related them. Germany designed a policy to exterminate a peaceful section of it’s own (originally) society. Israel has been in a state of conflict from it’s inception & is still fighting against these people who are actively supported from outside with money & weapons. Germany could never have claimed that it was defending itself against the Jews, Israel can say that with some justification. When we look at these two situations there is a world of difference, yet not in the professors email & that is the reason that this is not a matter of free speech, propaganda is never free speech.

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likeitis,

You are asking for less information.

No, I am not. In fact, vis-a-vis this case, it is quite the opposite.

If the emails are part of the course--as, for example, they are in the courses my brother teaches--there is no difference in using 20 minutes of class time or 20 minutes of reading email. If they are not part of the course but arise out of issues raised by students during the course, then whether students would have to use their time for this particular email depends on their understanding of the course requirements. Only if emails are not part of the course and are offered gratuitously, are students any more free to ignore them than they are to ignore what takes place in class.

I think the problem here is that we do not know the particles of the course, nor do we know its syllabus. We do not know how this issue arose and why the professor involved chose to couch his comparison in the terms that he did. What we do know is that his claim is controversial. He may be able to defend it, but he has to know that it will at least be offensive to some if he claims a genocide of Palestinians on a basis parallel with that of the Nazi implementation of the final solution to their "Jewish problem"--particularly since he is arguing an emerging effect against an established policy.

I am not troubled by the comparison. But I am not Jewish and I think there is something to consider in the comparison. I think it is silly for Jewish groups to demand an apology, for in demanding an apology they only reinforce a notion that Jews will not tolerate criticism of Israel within the borders of the US. No American is harmed by the professor's claims, however much or little merit they have.

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sailwind,

Professor Robinsons's website is precisely why the case against him is weak. He is a self-described "scholar activist" and his views are widely known and easily knowable if you happen to find yourself in his class.

The only wrong-doing here would consist of his insisting upon the correctness of his views of the Israeli/Palestinian issue and not allowing for those who can defend other positions. Just because his opinion hurts your ears or the ears of some of his students is not in itself cause for complaint.

I think there is much that is not known about this case, but it looks to me as though the true intimidation is coming from the pro-Israeli camp and not from the professor.

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I think professor Robinsons is right inwhat he says about the Israelis practices not only i Gaza but also in the WestBank . It is a combination of Nazis and the apartheid . Let's not forget charls Freeman a month ago how he was intimedated and his character was defamed by the jewish lobby in Washington , and now it's Robinsons. This is intimedation from the israelis , anyone dare say the truth will face the same fate . But more and more people are saying and observing the truth . the older days have gone and new tide of media and thoughts are prevailing .The Israelis are like an Ostrich dipping it's head in the sand and says nobody sees me .their pracices are already exposed , more and more people are daring to say the truth and oneday the Israelis will find themselves isolated and exposed and begging for forgivness.

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Hamas runs their own concentration camp in Gaza and they're committing a holocaust against its citizens.

And during Hitler's time, there were Jews who preyed on other Jews in the camps and ghettos. And to imply that such a thing would absolve the Nazis is grossly foolish.

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Thanks Smith and likeitis for clearing that up for me. It's totally ok for Professors to give an inkling on which side they take in conflict as to adversely affect the debate/discussion by students and make them wonder if their marks would be compromised due to having an opinion that may not be favorable to a fanatic Professor.

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Israel still has the overwhelming majority of control and influence though.

In Gaza?!?!?!?!?!?

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StanButler: I think he made a good

Ewww...that creepy European guy is back with yet another new handle.

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The concentration camp comparision is ignorant and obscene beyond belief. How deeply have bought into to radical islamist propaganda?

Pretty much sums it up. Well said, WilliB.

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The concentration camp comparison is provocative, but hardly ignorant and definitely not obscene. Nor is it Islamist propaganda. Doctors, scholars and reporters from many non-Islamic countries have visited the area and hold similar opinions. You will also find Jewish Israelis who agree.

This comparison and the implicit criticism of Israel arise from human considerations and not from Islamic indoctrination. Far more ignorant and obscene is the inability to respond to such comparisons without dismissive name-calling.

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The comparison is idiotic.

What the world witnessed when Israel withdrew from Gaza settles it.

The "Palestinians" destroyed multi-million dollar greenhouses provided to them by philanthropists like Bill Gates (to "enhance" the "peace process") and immediately started tunneling, rearming and turning what could have been profitable land into one more front from which to continue their campaign of genocide, attempting to finish what the Nazis couldn't.

People like Prof Robinson, large swaths of the international Left he clearly identifies with (like those defending him here), and of course the extreme right (particularly in Europe) unwittingly, sometimes tacitly, and often outright encourage and support the "Palestinian" and the wider Arab/Mohammedan world's bloodlust and genocidal designs.

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Oh, la!

Those castigating him here are doing so without knowledge and with very little thought. Perhaps we could speculate that this characterizes the American Right.

The comparison is flawed, but not idiotic. Robinson could make his point quietly and more accurately but that would be (and has been) swallowed by the ongoing unequivocal support for Israel. In other words, it would be ignored and dismissed with arguments for Israel's right of self-defense.

When righteous claims are ignored, trouble escalates. The pity is that Robinson needs to make such an in-your-face comparison to get the message across.

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WilliB and other readers. I apologize for racing off my above blog without re-reading it and correcting spelling, syntax etc. However, I live in Melbourne and the AFL footy was about to start and it comes before everything, even bloggs.

WilliB, I don't know you and you don't know me. I am not a leftist or a rightist or believe in any sort of "ism". I comment on the world based on the facts as I find them. The City I live in, is the most advanced Society on earth. We have 4 million people from 180 different nationalities and even more in number of different cultures. We all get along very harmoniously. My point about the Jewish school is that the people who run it have turned it into an enclave or school ghetto. My comparison was with the large international University on the other side of their fence where their are thousands of international and Australian students of all religions with no racial issues, except the wrongful one visited upon myself by a miscreant. The penalty in Australia for Racial Vilification is incarceration and heavy fines, and obviously the end of your professional working life. Fortunately my international student class stood up for the truth when confronted by the University and its process. The process was a disgrace and was unfair. They sought what is known as an "equality of outcomes" by gratuitously applying 50% of the blame to me when the remarks I was accused of were never made.

That is why I feel for Professor Robinson. Doubtless, the people who are going to judge him are academics. So many academics I have come across have little real experience with life and hide away in their little offices in the safety of the University and spend their day playing office politics or rewriting other peoples work, rather than seeking and conveying knowledge. To be able to deem someone a "Racist" would thrill many to their back teeth. I hope I am wrong on this.

Secondly, the international Jewish Diaspora have grown into a worldwide group of bullies who go to any length to discredit/ruin anyone who challenges anything about what they term "the Holocaust", something they stole from the Ukranians for the unspeakable cruelty and theft the Russian "Bolsheviks" did to them and millions of Russians in the twenties and thirties. Who were the main 600 leaders of the Bolsheviks. Go and do some research - you might be surprised. They were almost entirely of Jewish.

You might also have a look at the history of the Zionist Stern Gang in Palestine during WW11. They sided with the Nazi's against Britain and its allies.

There were Jews in Palestine prior to Hitler's arrival but they were a minority. Many Jews were wise enough to get out of Germany its neighbors and go to Anglo Saxon Protestant Christian countries like the USA, Britain. Canada, Australia, South Africa and NZ. And they were welcomed.

A minority chose Palestine. The newly formed United Nations sick of war; and to stop the Jewish/Arab fighting in Palestine, and to give the evacuated Jews from Europe a homeland, gave them part of Palestine. And they moved in their thousands and took it from the Palestinians kicking many out of their homes. Tens of thousands of Palestinians were just shoved over the new border to starve on concentration camps. Only the British Military's presence kept them alive for years after 1948.

Then well after WW11 was over, Jews from around the world flocked to Israel and still do. A convenient homeland that has no extradition for wrongdoings done in other countries and one that is based entirely on the Jewish religion. Israel was a second choice really. The Zionists tried Australia first led by Dr A L Steinberg, the Russian Minister of Justice in the thirties and forties, who the Australian Prime Minister at the time, described as a man who had signed off more death warrants in Russia than anyone else. Australia rejected their numerous approaches to excise part of north western Australia as a Jewish homeland. Australia rightly welcomes refugees and people of all religions and races, but the come on our terms and form part of Australia's democratic Society.

Israel was formed on a bad premise and will never be secure. The Jewish people would have been far better off relocating to the six major Anglo Saxon Protestant Christian democracies where they are free, safe, respected and able to prosper and practice their religion. These countries will fight to the death to defend them as citizens. Why place 50% of your mere 14 million total population in a little arid spot on the Eastern edge of the Mediterranean surrounded by hundreds of millions of hostiles? It is no more a Jewish homeland than it is for Christians or Moslems. We are all people of the Scriptures and just as well we don't all decide to move there.

What Israel is doing to the Palestinians only increases their insecurity.

Goodluck to Professor Robinson, he will need it. Just watch.

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Bruno:

" My point about the Jewish school is that the people who run it have turned it into an enclave or school ghetto. "

A "ghetto" is usually considered something that the ghetto dwellers are forced into, not something that they turn it into themselves. I don´t know what school you are talking about, but the CCTV cameras, fences, and other security measures are alas typical for Jewish schools everywhere, necessitad by very real threats of violence from Nazi and muslim groups.

" Who were the main 600 leaders of the Bolsheviks. Go and do some research - you might be surprised. They were almost entirely of Jewish. "

But of course. Jews are behind every evil, including when Jews are the victims. Next, you treat us to the "Protocolls of the Elders of Zion", I suppose?

" Tens of thousands of Palestinians were just shoved over the new border to starve on concentration camps. "

Tens of thousands of muslim Arabs did indeed flee the area when Israel was created. But many more Jews fled from Arab countries to Israel during the same period. What has happened to the huge Jewish diasporas in Morocco, Tunesia, Libya, Syria, Iran, Iraq, etc? Shouldn´t they have a right to return likewise, in your perfect world? You are blanking out context. And the "concentration camps" as you call the Palestinian settlements in surrounding Arab countries are built by the Arab government, not Israel. It is the Arab governments that keep "Palestinians" in artifical ghettoes, refuse to integrate them, and use them as a demographic and political weapon against Israel. All which an academic like you could find out easily, if you wanted.

" You might also have a look at the history of the Zionist Stern Gang in Palestine during WW11. They sided with the Nazi's against Britain and its allies. "

I don´t know about WW 11, and I don´t defend the Stern Gang. But before you continue this sick accusation of Jews being Nazis (and murdering themselves), please look up on intense connection between Nazism and islam. Check what the Mufti of Jerusalem was doing in WW 2, read up on the Bosnian SS regiments and their doings.

" There were Jews in Palestine prior to Hitler's arrival but they were a minority. "

And how had they become a minority in their homeland? Jews are the original "Palestinians"; I don´t know where get off stopping history at random at the point where islam had overrun the holy land. By the same token, you could also scroll back to 1100, and decide that Spain, Bulgaria, and Greece are muslim countries too, illegally occupied by infidel invaders. (Incidentally, radical islamists say exactly that).

" It is no more a Jewish homeland than it is for Christians or Moslems. We are all people of the Scriptures and just as well we don't all decide to move there. "

You say you are a professor, and you are unaware that Jewish history precedes christianity by 3000 and islam by 4400 years? And no, we are not all people of the same book. The New Testament is very much a moderate reform of Judaism, and the Koran/Haddith are very much war manuals against all other religions, with a special regard for Jews/Christians (they are allowed to live as second-class dhimmis). To say that is all the same demonstrates total ignorance on the topic.

That muslim invaders built a mosque on top of the holiest site of the Jews and then declared it their own is standard procedure for islamic conquerers. Read some history please.

" Then well after WW11 was over, Jews from around the world flocked to Israel and still do. "

A land without people for a people without land. And a land which is the ancestral home of these people, going back 5000 years in time. It did makes sense at the time, and it still makes sense. But alas we have collectively lost our identity, forgotten history, and swallowed the islamist propaganda hook, line, and sinker. So you are right in that: Israel is not secure.

But your big mistake is in believing that Israel is somehow special, and by sacrificing Israel, the infidel world will get peace. That is tragic mistake. Israel is only another step on the slippery slope -- ultimately we all, including your country (Australia?) will have to decide if we stand up against radical islam or submit and join the Ummah.

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[...to to Anglo Saxon Protestant Christian countries like the USA, Britain. Canada, Australia, South Africa and NZ. And they were welcomed.] [Tens of thousands of Palestinians were just shoved over the new border to starve on concentration camps.]

Then maybe those poor refugees could have been accepted by their Arab brothers in many other countries. Like why all crowd into Gaza when most of the Sinai is still uninhabited? El Arish could become a growing community. Thing is the Palestinians lost and they just don't know when to give up and get on with life. Once they have done that and start contributing to their own cultures across the Middle East then they will gain my respect. Until then they will not.

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No matter what true facts are presented when it comes to making remarks regarding Israel one is slandered as being "Anti-semetic." There are plenty of discussions found on numerous International TV stations, and in the US "Democracy Now", "Free Speech TV." The US is owned by Israel, so you won't find anything negative in either 4 major channels or print media regarding Israel. The politicians in the US are owned by AIPAC the long arm of Israel. The Palestinians are treated like caged animals.

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making remarks regarding Israel one is slandered as being "Anti-semetic."

Pfft. There's no shortage of criticism of Israel, most of which is complete nonsense. Get over it.

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The US is owned by Israel, so you won't find anything negative in either 4 major channels or print media regarding Israel.

The circular firing squad again. The other half of the int'l Left insists we are owned by Saudi Arabia.

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teleprompter - No, the other half insists we are owned by China.

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WiiliB. I am a financial and political strategist invited to teach at a University, I am not a professor or an academic. I merely use my 50 years of business experience and knowledge to assist widening the knowledge of the mainly international students I have the privilege of teaching. I teach about "Money and Capital Markets", something the US and Europe has really stuffed up. I influence my Federal Government and we are doing very well indeed. The free-est and most prosperous country on earth.

I don't believe that "Elders of Zion rubbish" or that it is necessary in Melbourne, Australia to wall your School in. We don't have Nazi or Islamic groups in Melbourne attacking anyone. The school's fences help wrongfully to enforce a siege and difference mentality in the Jewish students which is a tragedy. To me they are just other Aussie kids and that is how all Australian's essentially think. There is no history of violence against Jews in Australia. Australian's feel the same about Moslem kids. In Melbourne the only religion that counts is AFL (Australian) football. Choose a team and you are one of the tribe. Our AFL football clubs are not ethnically, religiously or class based. Everyone, rich or poor, black, yellow or white, Jewish, Moslem, Hindu or Christian all sit together. All that distinguishes us is our different team colors. Fans of opposing teams even all sit together. Families go to matches together. That is how the whole world should be. Get off the plane from wherever, choose a team and you are one of us. Its that easy WilliB.

My christian mother, who served in the Australian Army fighting the Nazi's as did my war hero father, died when I was a teenager and thankfully my assimilated German Jewish, and Polish Jewish next door married neighbor's became my major influence. The wife tells everyone I am her son. I love her dearly and though he died fifteen years ago I could not have found a better person on earth. Both got out of their respective countries to escape the Nazi regime in the late thirties and came to Melbourne as many other Jews wisely did. Though they lost family in the concentrations camps it was rarely ever discussed. They were more concerned about getting on with their lives. They disliked the Zionists, seeing them as little better than the Nazi's.

If you wish to talk about rights to an historic homeland, perhaps we should all migrate to a place near the borders of Angola, Namibia and Botswana in Africa where our human ancestors originated from.

I don't regard Britain as my homeland just because my ancestors once lived there. My allegiance is solely to the country in which I live, Australia. If Britain was to say all people of British stock throughout the world should return to Britain it would sink into the Atlantic Ocean under the weight. The only reason Israel can do it with people of Jewish background is because there are only 14 million on earth, half of whom now live in Israel. They need more space to accommodate the numbers they have and for further migration, so they continue to just take it from the poor Palestinians. I note that number of Jews in the world, 14 million, has not changed since the end of WW11

The birth of the 1948 State of Israel may be emotional but it was founded on dispossession of the Arab families that had a continuous occupation for thousands of years. Christianity, Islam and Judism all link back to Abraham through the Old Testament and are variations on a religious theme that anti-cede him back to Egypt and India. The essential premise of which is "do unto others as you would have them do unto you". The rest in the scriptures WilliB, is just padding.

In terms of your emotional cry "A land without people for people without land". In 1691 in Britain, the Government passed laws that gave ordinary people property rights. The right to own land and laws and courts to enforce those rights. For the first time on earth we were no longer slaves to the emperor or king. Jews, Christians or who ever were enabled to have land and a business. That is why the industrial revolution started in Britain and why Jews were able to own land in countries that flowed out of British expansion such as the US, Canada, NZ, Australia as well. And that is why most of the other seven millions Jews on the planet live in these countries, mainly the US. They don't need Israel, they are safer and have a better future in these countries, without stealing and physically and mentally abusing the poor Palestinians. Hopefully, most of these Jewish people give their real allegiance to the country in which they live and not Israel. Artificially propping up Israel is not the answer. It either stands on its own to feet or fails. It should not need to resort to the cruel and brutal tactics is has been against the Palestinians.

WiiliB, I have not read what Professor Robinson said, so I am not able to comment on it. Perhaps JP can publish it and inform us all. I am mainly concerned about his right to speak and criticize. His freedom of speech and action and ability to question propaganda is essential, particularly at an esteemed University like University of California and is what separates us from the Nazi's. I thank you for your comments.

You might have a look at the Bolshevik Revolution in Russia in 1917 and see who was actually running the Soviet empire. The facts are they were mainly Jewish people and they led a very brutal regime that dispossessed millions of their properties and personal wealth. Try and get a copy of respected writer, Malcolm Mugerridge's 1932 book, "Winter in Moscow" if you can. An enlightened man went to Russia and saw through the Soviet lies and propaganda and told the world the facts.

If you knew anything about Jewish ancient history in Palestine you would know that it is a place that was invaded numerous times and locals were regularly slaughtered by the invaders. So to keep their numbers up for survival of their culture early Jewish forces used to simply conscript nearby Arabs into their religion and culture. Moreover, the reason why Jewish accepted lineage is via the mother is because of the prolific raping of women by invading forces. Not really as chosen as some would have us believe.

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"Democracy Now!"

Hosted by neo-Marxist Amy Goodman. The real name of this show should be "Bolshevism Now!". I certainly hope you don't take this show seriously as "news" regarding the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, Adamwesti.

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This professor grew up in a different time when students wanted to think more. I'm sure he would give an A+ to any student who wrote a good paper with an opposing view. These days many, but certainly not all, students are just trying to get a piece of paper without having to think. Are students so dumb these days to accept, as fact everything a professor says?

Anyway, as he is Jewish, he will probably skate away even if the Academic Senate finds he broke the rules.

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I graduated from UC Santa Barbara, I know the campus well. Most of the students are WASPs (white anglo saxon protestant) or of Jewish backgrownd from many of the wealthy areas of Southern California. UCSB is a very pro Israel campus. Good old professor Robinson, bless his heart. He is an intellectual and very brave to stand up to these thugs (feel sorry only for the Jewish victims of the Nazi holocaust but the hell with all Arabs, the hell with all Muslims mentality at UCSB) it is scary, to think that in the USA, the land o freedom, a professor can not try to teach, give his own opinion, with out these rich kids from Beverly Hills calling all their lawyer friends to try and intimidate one tiny, university professor. Some of the kids at UCSB are great but you also have many closed minded religious fanatics (born again Christians, die hard Jews) who want to control everybody, me a Mexican and a Buddhist, had a great time there, proving them all wrong, there is no god, if there were, places like Gaza, the West Bank, the South Bronx would, East LA etc..would not exist right?

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I see the basic problem here...

The professor doesn't understand the definition of 'holocaust'.

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WEll done professor for speaking the truth about Israel. Please don't bow down due to pressure from extremist Jewish groups, who want these facts hidden from the world. The Gazan's continude genocide must never be forgotten.

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bushlover: "Thanks Smith and likeitis for clearing that up for me. It's totally ok for Professors to give an inkling on which side they take in conflict as to adversely affect the debate/discussion by students and make them wonder if their marks would be compromised due to having an opinion that may not be favorable to a fanatic Professor."

Appreciate the thanks, but it's funny to hear your hypocrisy about being 'objective' with the subjective drivel you spill out raging against people who present you with facts and objective opinions (hence the 'fanatic Professor'). Good job in sinking your own arguments, as usual.

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NeilWarnock:

" he Gazan's continude genocide "

It is an incredibly tacky insult to the holocaust victims to call Gazah a "genocide". But I guess it is a testimony for what passes as education in the West today.

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Unfortunately, this professor will have the same fate as of that one of another professor, Ward Churchill, from University of Colorado, who dared say, correctly, that 9-11 victims were ¨little Eichmanns¨ - refering to Adolf Eichmann, one of the most influent nazi SS officials. By the way, his fate: he was convicted, even if symbolically, for something that should be deeply analysed instead of just dismissed without further questioning. Professor Churchill said in an essay that 9-11 eleven victims were just the exposed part of a politic system that had continuosly sponsored terror too. Only that this terror was official and applied by US and Israel against all mid-eastern people. And as Eichmann who just sided blindly with Hitler, without considering his actions, 9-11 victims were also some sort of ¨co-workers¨ just by simply being Americans, whose governments continuosly sides with Israel. Professor Robinson´s ideas deserve being analysed too, instead of just being bullied. Jewish people deserve a land, a place they can call their own. But the way they are doing it somehow erases their horrible suffering in WWII.

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WilliB. We should never blow out someones else's candle just to make our burn brighter.

What passes for many people as education is referencing to only of one part of the European 1917-1947 "Wholecaust", namely that committed by the Nazis and not addressing the much larger and wider issue of the Bolshevik Holocaust which was equally as cruel and brutal but caused the death of far greater numbers. 10 million Ukrainian's were starved by the Russian Bolshevik leadership in one example in in 1932-33 and historian Robert Conquest described the Ukraine at the time as a giant version of the later Bergan-Belsen death camp. The Ukrainian's called this the "Holodomor". Goodness knows how many tens of millions of people in the Soviet empire or countries they overran in conflict, were treated equally as bad as anything that was metered out by the Nazi's. If the international Jewish diaspora want to be treated with creditability then they need to campaign on behalf of all Europeans that suffered during this horrible 30 year "Wholecaust" period. Instead they just publicly and loudly claim credit where Jews do something good, without facing up to and admitting to events were Jews that did terrible wrongs against mankind. We all want Jewish people to be okay but the same applies for the Palestinians. A a fair and just political solution based on good faith by both sides is the only road map to peace but it seems inpossible because "fair", "just" and "good faith" have remained absent for 61 years.

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LostinNagoya, the problem with these analogies is always one of proportion. Eichman at least was one man in control of much, who knowingly took part in doing a lot of damage. You will note that his office cleaning lady was not executed whereas the vast majority of the victims of 9-11 had about as much control over finacial affairs as she did but were killed all the same.

Do I approve of Isreal's occupation of the West Bank? Well, no, I think Isreal is very unjust in this. As it is an artificial state, begun with a history of oppression and injustice, one would like to think they would want to avoid committing injustice themselves. But no, people will be people and Isreal wants to (and feels entitled to) expand. Oddly, Isreal is turning up the rhetoric about the Holocaust and ant-Semitism just as the last survivors of the death camps are dying of old age. Worried about something, are they?

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Brunobear:

" We all want Jewish people to be okay but the same applies for the Palestinians. "

That´s the typical cover for the antisemitic propaganda today. Jews are Palestinians, in fact they are the original inhabitants of Palestine, long before islam was even invented.

The definine muslim Arabs as "Palestinians" was a invention of Yassir Arafat, and a stroke of genius as that. You will not find the term "Palestinians" used for muslim Arabs only before the 70s, but since then we have swallowed this mislabelling hook, line and sinker.

Note that the hatred against Jews and Israel only emanates from muslim Arabs, and not from other groups in the region (Christian Arabs, Druzes, Alevites, etc.).

Note also that the hatred against Jews and Israel is not limited to residents of Palestine -- Iranians are not Arabs, and are thousands of kilometers away. Yet, they join the Jihad against Israel. Note also that Zoroastrian and Bahai Iranians have no beef with Israel.

In trying to blank out the islamic aspect of the hate against Israel, you demonstrate our faulty education.

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WiiliB. Choose the behavior, and you choose the consequences.

Jews from Eastern Europe mainly, have flooded into Israel over the past 60 years at the brutally crude expense of the long term inhabitants.

Where did the Palestinian "Arabs" flood to Palestine recently from? Arabs have occupied Palestine at least as long as the Jewish culture/religion has and for at least the two more recent milleniums, the Arabs have been the vast majority.

The fact that an Arab man, concerned with the violence in his homeland, comes up to Palestine from Arabia and studies Judism and Christianity in the eighth century AD., and takes it back to Arabia to create his own religion called "Islam" has nothing to do with two thousand years of continuing occupation by Arab Palestinian families whether they eventually became Jews, Christians or Moslems. All it means is that the three religions are all based on the same original common historic Jewish scriptures and practices that themselves have antecedents well before Judism.

Some Jews, and a very small number indeed, had continuous occupation of a small piece of arid land(deemed in 1948 as Israel) during those same two milleniums. Most Jews had long ago abandoned Palestine and spread elsewhere, especially Europe. Today about half live in the US and almost the same number have relocated back to a part of Palestine residing in Israel or the occupied West Bank.

Everyone hates bad behavior. If a particular groups behavior causes a form of universal disdain (hatred you call it) then at some point in history, it might be sensible for the group to see why this is so and if reasonable, what can be done to ameliorate it instead of blaming everyone else and worse more, putting a racist slur nomenclature to it. No group can just keep being brutal (in all its senses)to those around them without consequences. Look at the Nazi's and Bolsheviks. Eventually the world will pay the group back and when it does its punishment, I have observed, is severe. Better to do unto others as you would have them do unto you.

WilliB, the way you think, determines the way you feel and the way you feel determines the way you act. That applies to leaders too.

As a financial and political strategist, I simply put fresh new thoughts into leaders minds when I see them going in the wrong direction. That is all I do WilliB. Then I see them gradually change whether instantly or over six months. I don't expect thanks or acknowledgment. I just want to see the world more cerebral, honest, fair, just and progressive. All people on earth are valuable assets. That is why I decided to write in 'Japan Today" on this topic. In fact I would love to get into President Obama's head and sort out the US economic and social debacle. There is about an hours work in it. That's all. The US's problem is the way they think. The US is as great and powerful a force for good and prosperity as ever. They don't know how to handle what abundant riches they have for the common good.

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Brunobear:

" Jews from Eastern Europe mainly, have flooded into Israel over the past 60 years at the brutally crude expense of the long term inhabitants. "

So many wrong statements in one sentence... The "long term inhabitants" of Israel are Jews, so Jewish immigration into to the Jewish state is not something outlandish. There is nothing "brutally crude" about the treatment of non-Jews in Israel, in fact Israel is the ONLY country in the middle East that offers modern human rights and freedoms to all its citizens, including the hostile Arabs. To wit, the Israel has muslim Arab members even in the Knesseth (who often agitate against the interest of Israel, and quite legally so). You´ll find nothing comparable in the neighbouring countries.

" Where did the Palestinian "Arabs" flood to Palestine recently from? "

From other Arab countries, plus from the wombs of Arab women. The Arab muslims are the only group in the world that has managed redefine the term "refugee" to include anyone who wants in in eternity -- thus, the number of so-called "refugees" from Israel keeps growing and growing, even though hardly any of them has ever fled from anywhere. By the same token, we would all be refugees, because way back some of our ancestors surely ran away from somewhere.

" Arabs have occupied Palestine at least as long as the Jewish culture/religion has and for at least the two more recent milleniums, the Arabs have been the vast majority. "

That is ridiculous. Jewish history in Palestine goes back 5000 years; Arabs have have lived in the same neighbourhood for a long time too, but only began to define their identity when islam was founded in 700, and then proceed its violent, explosive conquest of the region (and ultimately the world). Incidentally, islam also got rid of the Jews of Saudi Arabia -- ever wondered what happened to them?

All that you are demonstrating is your ignorance on the topic -- alas, typical.

Moderator: Do not be impolite to other readers just because you disagree with their opinion.

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There is no comparison. Jews were not steadily bombarding Germany with missiles. Jews didn't refuse to recognize Germany as a state. Jews weren't trying to wipe Germany off the map. No comparison at all.

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WilliB. Everyone is entitled to their opinion but no one is entitled to be wrong in their facts. The bigger picture is what is important here and I am only interested in the wider facts and a solution that might flow from them. I am not cheering for any side. If the world has to hear about the Jewish Holocaust everyday, year in and year out, then the world might as well hear the full tragic story of the Wholecaust.

The adoption of we are the only people that matter attitude evident from your comments and those of Shark1 won't help anyone in Palestine on either side of the divide. The haughty anger of the international Jewish Diaspora due to its daily inability to offer an intelligent and factual response is no reason to resort to legitimate criticism as hate speech or anti semitism. Most of the deaths and abject misery between 1917 and 1947 by the Bolsheviks and the Nazi's weren't caused by missiles. It was caused by highly organised official mass starvation, mental and physical torture, despair and hopelessness and the theft of wealth and property amongst a long list of evil behavior. 100 million died and countless more suffered as a result. The Japanese still don't admit to their 1936 - 1945 attrocities in Asia and the Pacific, nor do numerous others fess up to theirs. If the hat fits, wear it. Eventually the truth always comes out. Why not now. So we can move on to a better world.

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Not all Jews live in Israel, not all Israelis are Jews. Yet there exists, and has existed for a long time, the idea that to criticize the state of Israel is somehow anti-Semitic. To say that at least some of the actions carried out by the Israeli state military in Gaza means you are intolerant of a religion.

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This guy is actually an intellectual. He studies groups and society for his living and is an expert. The Zionists and their sympathizers who criticize him are merely fundamentalist radicals, hell-bent on their personal viewpoint, clouded with emotion. Thank you Brunobear for your interesting points. 1.5 million Jews died so we shouldn't use their deaths as a propaganda tool...we should learn from this lesson, and many others, and stop the oppression.

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WilliB. My final comment on this matter is the Jews in Iran have far more freedom than the Palestinians in Gaza or the West Bank. There is no fool like and old fool, that applies to religions too. Cheers to all the readers for caring to read this article and comments on the besieged Californian Professor. UCSB is a respected University and not a kindergarten. If some students feel threatened by facts perhaps they are at the wrong level of education. A Uni can only be fun if it challenging. The Professor knows that.

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