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U.S. Supreme Court justices in Trump case lean toward some level of immunity

60 Comments
By John Kruzel and Andrew Chung

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60 Comments

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Of course. Bill wasn't persecuted. Fair's fair.

-21 ( +3 / -24 )

JJEToday  07:04 am JST

Of course. Bill wasn't persecuted. Fair's fair.

All Bill did was be legalistic in a deposition. Trump ignored dozens of federal requests for compliance and started an insurrection.

13 ( +20 / -7 )

Any protections the conservative members discover will apply to Biden of course. Meanwhile they will be seen to be clearly throwing the outcome of the trial just like they did the 2000 election.

10 ( +15 / -5 )

Of course. Bill wasn't persecuted. Fair's fair.

“Waaaaah. Somebody before me also did crime. It’s not fair”

Is there anything you guys can’t complain about? Man up.

12 ( +17 / -5 )

Conservative Justice Samuel Alito said incumbent presidents who lose re-election would be in a "peculiarly precarious position" if they are vulnerable to vindictive prosecution by the next presidential administration.

Alito is part of the problem.

America has a two-tiered injustice system which favors the interests of conservative oligarchs.

https://www.propublica.org/article/samuel-alito-luxury-fishing-trip-paul-singer-scotus-supreme-court

11 ( +15 / -4 )

“Waaaaah. Somebody before me also did crime. It’s not fair”

Is there anything you guys can’t complain about? Man up.

Tell me you don't care about justice without telling me you don't care about justice...

-16 ( +3 / -19 )

commanteerToday  07:12 am JST

“Waaaaah. Somebody before me also did crime. It’s not fair”

Is there anything you guys can’t complain about? Man up.

Tell me you don't care about justice without telling me you don't care about justice...

Yeah, where would be if, uh, presidents could have affairs????

6 ( +9 / -3 )

Deposition was on camera. Interesting subject matter.

-17 ( +1 / -18 )

They all will be impeach and tried,if they give Trump any relief,not happening

-9 ( +1 / -10 )

Of course. Bill wasn't persecuted. Fair's fair.

*Prosecuted. And, what law is Bill Clinton alleged to have broken? Silly.

10 ( +13 / -3 )

Of course. Bill wasn't persecuted. Fair's fair.

Bill was definitely persecuted!

Bill wasn’t prosecuted!

(“Convicted” or “indicted” might be better terms.)

12 ( +14 / -2 )

It’s laughable to think any POTUS has absolute immunity. Nixon sure didn’t think so. Neither did Ford. That’s why Ford offered and Nixon accepted a pardon.

Qualified immunity won’t help Trump as only a fool would think that conspiring to overturn an election is an official act. (Oh, look who’s arguing just that?)

The real benefit for the felon in Chief is the delay while the scoliotic conservative SCOTUS justices fawn and hmmm around word smithing to tell us the patently obvious: in America, no one is above the law and we don’t have kings.

15 ( +17 / -2 )

The U.S. Supreme Court has lost all credibility these days, so they are going for broke to ensure that justice isn't served before the election.

9 ( +12 / -3 )

The Supremos are about to add another tier to Amerika's two. The three Trump judges are turning out to be his best ever investment and, with the disingenuous duo of Alito and Uncle Thom giving their usual thumbs up to any right-wing cause, in this case privileging a right-wing imperial presidency, Trump will be given months more time to game the system in the hope of gaining the power to "pardon himself" while more red meat will be thrown to the hungry MAGA voters champing at the bit. Justice delayed is justice denied! "Equal Justice Under Law" needs a makeover - Banana Republic USA here we come!

2 ( +8 / -6 )

That Thomas is even hearing a case in which his wife was directly involved speaks to the need for reform of SCOTUS to the same standards as every other federal court.

10 ( +12 / -2 )

Interesting - so Biden may actually be totally cooked come this fall, seeing as how little any of the lawsuits have done to damage Trump's chances prior to the election.

And as we learned from the 2016 election, the people that oppose Trump will literally opt for trying to get the country to collapse rather than working with him.

If the US can withstand the political turmoil and drama of the next five years, we may just survive as a Republic. If not, the great experiment will probably end. Buckle up folks.

-12 ( +4 / -16 )

"A federal judge on Thursday rejected Donald Trump's bid to throw out a $83.3 million defamation verdict in favor of the writer E. Jean Carroll, who said the former US president defamed her after she accused him of raping her decades ago.

US District Judge Lewis Kaplan in Manhattan said Trump was not entitled to a new trial, or judgment as a matter of law."

7 ( +9 / -2 )

Other developed democracies have criminally accountable leaders and sometimes do prosecute then, but for good reason - they have committed crimes.

There is no need to expect total immunity.

12 ( +13 / -1 )

And as we learned from the 2016 election, the people that oppose Trump will literally opt for trying to get the country to collapse rather than working with him.

And we learned from the 2020 election that Trump will write willingly overturn democracy and throw out the votes of 80m people to satisfy his desire to remain in power.

11 ( +12 / -1 )

u_s__reamerToday  07:59 am JST

Banana Republic USA here we come!

The US would be a banana republic if it didn't prosecute lawbreaking former presidents. You would know this from your heroes, though.

5 ( +10 / -5 )

wolfshineToday  08:10 am JST

And as we learned from the 2016 election, the people that oppose Trump will literally opt for trying to get the country to collapse rather than working with him.

Says the advocate for literally holding up aid to an ally in time of war.

4 ( +9 / -5 )

wolfshine

Interesting - so Biden may actually be totally cooked come this fall, seeing as how little any of the lawsuits have done to damage Trump's chances prior to the election.

Well, no. These cases have nothing to do with the elections in November, except that it may be unfortunate that the electorate won't see if Trump is guilty or not before the election.

Also, the expectation is that Biden will win the election.

And as we learned from the 2016 election, the people that oppose Trump will literally opt for trying to get the country to collapse rather than working with him.

What are you talking about? Can you give examples?

3 ( +7 / -4 )

And we learned from the 2020 election that Trump will write willingly overturn democracy and throw out the votes of 80m people to satisfy his desire to remain in power.

Cope til your hearts content. Covid-19 is not going to bail out Biden this time around.

Best you can hope for is people in the intelligence agencies cooking up some new conspiracy theory to use against him in 2025. I believe they most certainly will, and America's future kind of depends on their attempts failing.

-9 ( +4 / -13 )

If the US can withstand the political turmoil and drama of the next five years, we may just survive as a Republic. If not, the great experiment will probably end. Buckle up folks.

Yes. If we don't get a lazy, ignorant fool like Trump back into the whitehouse, our republic is finished. lool

6 ( +9 / -3 )

SCOTUS really isn’t doing its credibility any favors here. It declined to reach down and take the case , which is rare but it happens, to let the appeals court rule. Then it decides to take the case in spite of the mendacious claims and unanimity of the lower court rulings, and on a leisurely basis considering the magnitude of the issue.

Now the rumor is it will send the case back down to the trial court to litigate specific claims as official or unofficial acts. Rulings that would no doubt be appealed by a criminal looking to delay the trial.

The effect is to delay the people’s right to a speedy trial, and to have clarity before casting their votes.

I, unlike some, do not think that SCOTUS is in the can for Trump. Instead, I attribute these delays to cowardice.

In his efforts to give the appearance of political independence, Roberts and paralyzed the court from making legal decisions when it really matters. SCOTUS - at least it’s conservatives - would rather kick the can down the road than make a definitive ruling.

It’s called “Supreme” for a reason, John. Have the courage to make the decisions that need to be made or step down and make room for someone who does.

8 ( +9 / -1 )

wolfshine

And we learned from the 2020 election that Trump will write willingly overturn democracy and throw out the votes of 80m people to satisfy his desire to remain in power.

Cope til your hearts content. Covid-19 is not going to bail out Biden this time around.

Many governments around the world backed their leaders back into power based on their handling of Covid. Trump handled it so badly that the people voted him out. Under a real-world crisis, Trump crumbled.

Best you can hope for is people in the intelligence agencies cooking up some new conspiracy theory to use against him in 2025.

Why? There would be no need, for a start. The court cases don't end at the end of the year. They carry on and he will be adjudged guilty, I am confident in the strength of the cases.

5 ( +9 / -4 )

Trump -case - immunity, all in one headline sentence. This article is a surefire revenue winner for JT, lol. All our legal eagle poster friends at US embassy will be over this like honey to a bee. Clicks galore that never fails ;) Bring the popcorn and watch the heart rates go up.

-10 ( +2 / -12 )

Cope til your hearts content. Covid-19 is not going to bail out Biden this time around.

Best you can hope for is people in the intelligence agencies cooking up some new conspiracy theory to use against him in 2025. I believe they most certainly will, and America's future kind of depends on their attempts failing.

More usual fantasy from the usual suspect(s) regardless what your name is today.

Because......

What the court and Trump's own lawyers (Sauer) said was not legal:

"One might argue that it isn't plausible to order SEAL Team 6 -- and I don't want to slander SEAL Team 6 because they're -- no, seriously -- they're honorable, they're honorable officers and they are bound by the uniform code of military justice not to obey unlawful orders -- [but] I think one could say it's not plausible ... that that action would be legal," Alito said.

To Sauer, he said, "I'm sure you've thought of lots of hypotheticals where a president could say, 'I'm using an official power,' and yet the power uses it in an absolutely outrageous manner."

and....

"Counsel on that score, there does seem to be some common ground between you, your colleague on the other side, that no man's above the law and that the president can be prosecuted after he leaves office for his private conduct, is that right?" Justice Neil Gorsuch asked.

"We agree with that," Sauer answered.

> "You concede that private acts don't get immunity," she said.

"We do," Sauer said.

for example.....

Barrett, quoting from court filings, said, "I want to know if you agree or disagree about the characterization of these acts as private. Petitioner turned to a private attorney who was willing to spread knowingly false claims of election fraud to spearhead his challenges to the election results. Private?"

"We dispute the allegation, but that sounds private to me," Sauer said.

and...

Barrett continued: "Petitioner conspired with another private attorney who caused the filing in court of a verification, signed by petitioner, that contained false allegations to support a challenge. Private?"

"Also sounds private," Sauer said.

and finally ...

"Three private actors, two attorneys, including those mentioned above, and a political consultant, helped to implement a plan to submit fraudulent slates of presidential electors to obstruct the certification proceeding and petitioner and a co-conspirator attorney directed that had effort." Barrett said.

"I believe that's private," Sauer replied.

"Those acts you would not dispute," Barrett said. "Those were private and you wouldn't raise a claim that they were official."

Sauer said back: "As characterized."

Could a president stage a coup? And 9 more key moments from Trump's Supreme Court immunity hearing

https://www.yahoo.com/news/could-president-stage-coup-9-191800692.html

7 ( +11 / -4 )

Cope til your hearts content. Covid-19 is not going to bail out Biden this time around. 

Trump’s the one looking for bail.

6 ( +8 / -2 )

Liberal Justice: well that “sounds bad”.

me: so it’s not illegal, huh?

-14 ( +3 / -17 )

me: so it’s not illegal, huh?

remember whatever isnt illegal by SCOTUS will apply to Biden.

Biden is president LOL

imagine getting the OK to be immune from prosecution while youre a sitting president.

Joe can do WTF he wants and conservatives can just sit there and cry, Seal team 6 on standby

8 ( +10 / -2 )

Liberal Justice: well that “sounds bad”.

me: so it’s not illegal, huh?

Did you read the part about staging a coup to retain power? Ok with that are you?

Hardly surprising.

10 ( +13 / -3 )

I'll believe in American "justice" when presidents go to jail (with no "early" release). Lifelong scofflaw, Trump, has unwittingly done the nation a service by exposing the hollowness of the "Equal Justice Under Law" slogan that is fading from its marble facade.

9 ( +11 / -2 )

Did you read the part about staging a coup to retain power? Ok with that are you?

there was no coup and the person left office peacefully and in a timely manner.

Not sure what you are on about.

-11 ( +5 / -16 )

“Waaaaah. Somebody before me also did crime. It’s not fair”

Is there anything you guys can’t complain about? Man up.

Oh, don’t be discouraged, you can try after the election if this does go the way it seems there will be plenty of time, but with the appeals and everything this could drag out years, so if the left wants to waste more taxpayer money, fine.

-11 ( +3 / -14 )

You don’t seem to realize Trump wins either way.

no immunity- he becomes president and prosecutes Obama Biden and maybe Bush.

immunity- all his active cases fall apart and he becomes President in landslide due to unlawful political persecution.

-13 ( +3 / -16 )

All of this linguistic tap dancing from some of America's supposedly brightest legal minds just serves to obscure the obvious. If Trump doesn't face consequences or legal jeopardy from his election denialism and attempted coup, of course he'll try it again, and again, and as many times as necessary. Hacks like Alito and Thomas are all but counting on this, but they have to maintain the appearance of whatever dignity the court has left, so we get this ridiculous song and dance.

(Note that no one is legitimately expecting Biden to take any of these extreme actions that are supposedly being debated as immune from prosecution. If there was any thought Biden would actually do any of this stuff, the conversation on the court would be completely different.)

7 ( +8 / -1 )

Biden is president LOL

And one day he will be a previous President, astonishing as it might seem to liberals.

imagine getting the OK to be immune from prosecution while youre a sitting president. 

Yes, that means the next President could do the same and go after the previous President.

Joe can do WTF he wants and conservatives can just sit there and cry,

Until he becomes a previous President and if Dems get their way with Trump…..the Dems won’t be smiling later. You think they learned from years ago when they blew up the filibuster, how’d that work out in the end for Dems? Badly, but for Republicans it gave them 3 solid conservative justices, so thanks to the late Harry Reid, thank you!

https://www.vox.com/scotus/24140309/supreme-court-donald-trump-immunity-jack-smith

-12 ( +2 / -14 )

Very disappointing!!

It may as well be called the Kangaroo Court.

5 ( +8 / -3 )

well, the court may reaffirm immunity from civil suits in solely official capacity.

criminal, probably not.

the caveat being that this court has a nutty majority. you just never know with these people.

7 ( +8 / -1 )

there was no coup and the person left office peacefully and in a timely manner.

Not sure what you are on about.

You understand perfectly, just pretend not to as usual because you are in a hole as usual.

You’re “not illegal huh?” was in response to the ‘liberal justice’ Kagan and 45 lawyer Sauer arguing whether staging a coup or selling nuclear secrets is a crime.

Sounds bad.

Do you think staging a coup or nuclear secrets should be a crime or are you giving Biden a pass to do anything?

The correct and only answer is that all Presidents should be held accountable for breaking the law, but that puts you back in a hole again doesn’t it?

7 ( +9 / -2 )

You don’t seem to realize Trump wins either way.

Or somewhere in between. It's silly to believe that either a president has absolute immunity or 0 immunity.

It'll probably be somewhere in between for obvious reasons.

6 ( +8 / -2 )

You don’t seem to realize Trump wins either way.

no immunity- he becomes president and prosecutes Obama Biden and maybe Bush.

immunity- all his active cases fall apart and he becomes President in landslide due to unlawful political persecution.

The MAGA-wish-fulfillment fantasy of the day...

Much more likely Trump gets convicted in his four criminal trials, gets a combined sentence of between 2-4 years, Melania says "so long Loser" and dumps him, and E. Jean Carroll moves into Mar-A-Lago after her fourth defamation trial win...

Trump gets out in four years and moves to Moscow to manage one of Putin's palaces...

8 ( +9 / -1 )

You don’t seem to realize Trump wins either way.

no immunity- he becomes president and prosecutes Obama Biden and maybe Bush.

Ok. But no immunity means he possibly faces punishment for his crimes. Becoming President is in no way a given duh. Not a win for 45.

immunity- all his active cases fall apart and he becomes President in landslide due to unlawful political persecution.

Ok. But also immunity for Biden and he can do anything he wants. Not a win for 45.

There is no way you can spin this into a win for 45.

8 ( +9 / -1 )

The Supreme Court's conservative justices signaled support on Thursday for U.S. presidents having some level of protection from criminal charges for certain acts taken in office 

Thoroughly rational, although it provokes emotional responses from the extreme left.

-15 ( +0 / -15 )

Did you read the part about staging a coup to retain power? Ok with that are you?

there was no coup and the person left office peacefully and in a timely manner.

After an attempted insurrection to overthrow the government broadcast on live tv was put down.

Not sure what you are on about.

Of course you’re not.

7 ( +8 / -1 )

The counsel for the government agreed that if the Attorney General tells a President something is legal to do that there is immunity when it’s done.

so if the AG can set immunity, means that there IS Presidential immunity. And it’s quite unlikely a subordinate has power their boss doesn’t.

-12 ( +1 / -13 )

For a guy who did nothing wrong and did everything on the up and up, Trump sure isn’t trying hard to get his day in court and blow the government’s case out of the water.

It’s almost as if he’s pulling every string to delay accountability.

7 ( +9 / -2 )

After an attempted insurrection to overthrow the government broadcast on live tv was put down. 

There was no insurrection. This is why we are going through this and all of our times are being wasted because the Dems couldn’t get Trump on something even the DOJ couldn’t and wouldn’t file. A riot at best, but we have them all the time in this country.

Of course you’re not.

I don’t think even you know tbh…

-12 ( +2 / -14 )

The correct and only answer is that all Presidents should be held accountable for breaking the law, but that puts you back in a hole again doesn’t it?

This is an issue for US voters.

-14 ( +0 / -14 )

After an attempted insurrection to overthrow the government broadcast on live tv was put down. 

There was no insurrection. 

You cannot gaslight that. It was on live tv. I saw it. We ALL saw it. “Hang Mike Pence!”

The flag poles used as weapons. The bear spray. The storming of the lines. Cops beaten.

1,000 convicted criminals for taking part. Another 900+ facing trial.

It was an illegal violent attempt to stop the count of a certified election which was free and fair in order to allow a loser to stay in power.

That is THE definition of an insurrection.

9 ( +10 / -1 )

means that there IS Presidential immunity.

thats not whats being debated, absolute immunity is what Trump is claiming.

If Trump gets it then so does Biden, seal team 6 , stand back and standby

8 ( +8 / -0 )

Nice flag in the picture..

-9 ( +0 / -9 )

You cannot gaslight that. It was on live tv. I saw it. We ALL saw it. “Hang Mike Pence!”

The flag poles used as weapons. The bear spray. The storming of the lines. Cops beaten.

1,000 convicted criminals for taking part. Another 900+ facing trial.

It was an illegal violent attempt to stop the count of a certified election which was free and fair in order to allow a loser to stay in power.

That is THE definition of an insurrection.

Exactly, if he creeped his way into office again the first thing he would do is pardon all the criminals that followed his orders and he would fire everyone who was against him and his illegal bull. Little by little he is slowly trying to make another Russia.

7 ( +8 / -1 )

It was an illegal violent attempt to stop the count of a certified election which was free and fair in order to allow a loser to stay in power.

How oh how will Biden cheerleaders cope with the meltdown when Trump becomes POTUS in November.

-10 ( +1 / -11 )

How oh how will Biden cheerleaders cope with the meltdown when Trump becomes POTUS in November

My guess is they wouldn’t have unbridled hysterical meltdowns and start believing grifters on YouTube talking about stolen elections with no evidence.

It’s certainly not nailed on that Trump will win. He’s got a lot of obstacles ahead and his mental and physical decline in quilts shocking.

5 ( +6 / -1 )

quilts

quite

6 ( +6 / -0 )

It’s certainly not nailed on that Trump will win.

True enough.

He’s got a lot of obstacles ahead and his mental and physical decline in quilts shocking.*

Biden's decline is way worse. 4 more years - pause, gaffe just the latest example.

https://www.skynews.com.au/opinion/sharri-markson/profoundly-embarrassing-bidens-latest-slipup-reading-the-autocue/video/3d5ce6c05797505212eea8b4bc9dd57d

-14 ( +0 / -14 )

Blacklabel

You don’t seem to realize Trump wins either way.

no immunity- he becomes president and prosecutes Obama Biden and maybe Bush.

Nope. They did no crimes.

immunity- all his active cases fall apart and he becomes President in landslide due to unlawful political persecution.

Not going to happen, even though this Supreme Court is corrupt.

9 ( +10 / -1 )

Ramsey's Kitchen

It was an illegal violent attempt to stop the count of a certified election which was free and fair in order to allow a loser to stay in power.

How oh how will Biden cheerleaders cope with the meltdown when Trump becomes POTUS in November.

How oh how will Trump cheerleaders cope with the meltdown when Biden stays POTUS in November.

7 ( +9 / -2 )

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