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Global vaccine trust rising, but France, Japan, others skeptical

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People refusing to take any government mandated vaccine should be fined, and if they still refuse, imprisoned. It is unacceptable that anyone ever refuses a government-mandated vaccine for any reason.

-32 ( +3 / -35 )

They wouldn't be skeptical in Japan if it was a Japanese made vaccine. We'd never hear the end of how they'd made one but (insert country here) hadn't.

13 ( +19 / -6 )

I think you’ll find most people will take a vaccine if it’s free, although some won’t.

first thing’s first though, these wonderful concoctions need to be distributed around the world ready for use before you start faffing over silly stats like these.

-14 ( +0 / -14 )

anti-vaccine folk have a choice. They can either have V branded on their forehead, or be sent to China in a cage.

-14 ( +2 / -16 )

The French Government is actively putting off people from being vaccinated by making unsubstantiated claims about the vaccine.

-9 ( +3 / -12 )

The French government need to be condemned by all the free nations of the world. Casting doubt upon the vaccine is despicable. Millions will die if the French government are allowed to get away with this.

-19 ( +4 / -23 )

Glad to see vaccine trust rising.

I understand some are skeptical about it.

Personally, I will not think twice when I have my chance to get vaccinated.

Between the small risk of side effects (as any vaccine, and other medical procedures have) and the risk of getting a severe form of this aggressive COVID19 virus, I rather go for the first option.

Risk is in everything we do, it is all about managing the risk and go for the safest option, knowing that even the safest option is never risk free.

4 ( +8 / -4 )

I am not taking the vaccine. Its not your choice if I take the vaccine. I do not trust the vaccine. Easy.

-12 ( +12 / -24 )

Glad to see vaccine trust rising.

I agree!

I will take it as soon as it is available for the public.

But I understand that many people are sceptical according the vaccine.

There are too many scary news about the Covid Vaccine.

And there are too many self nominated specialists and self nominated experts.

It seems that everyone is an expert now and try to give his or her "internet-knowledge" to the public.

0 ( +7 / -7 )

Unfortunately this is again down to education. Vaccines are safe and essential to a healthy society - we have seen how much disruption is caused without one. And in a way it is not your choice the same as stopping at a red light is not your choice. You do it for the safety of others. Unfortunately SNS has lead to a massive dumbing down of the general popuation. I feel sorry for the poor doctors and national health services that have to deal with this level of ignorance.

9 ( +13 / -4 )

I think vaccinations should not be forced and let the people who want it to get it and those who would want to wait a little longer or just live without it completely live in peace. I'm more afraid of governments and people pulling strings behind the curtain forcing people to take it and coercing them to get vaccinated than the pandemic itself.

-2 ( +5 / -7 )

I am not taking the vaccine. Its not your choice if I take the vaccine. I do not trust the vaccine. 

Thanks for the big announcement, but big deal. No one is forcing you to.

6 ( +10 / -4 )

If we talk about the vaccine I suppose the vaccine introduced or developed by India is way more effective and safe as the research and testing has proved that the India vaccine is 90% accurate as we compare to the china's vaccine is 50.4% and if we compare to others still it has been proven better. After everything India has also helped Pakistan and hundred other countries then why won't it help others .What I think is every country must import the vaccine from India as to safe its own citizens.

-6 ( +3 / -9 )

I am still not understanding why the covid vaccine does not prevent spread of the illness. Flu shots do- if you are immunized against influenza it greatly reduces your chance of passing on the disease. It is a similar virus to covid as well. So...what is going on here?

-6 ( +4 / -10 )

The French government need to be condemned by all the free nations of the world. Casting doubt upon the vaccine is despicable. Millions will die if the French government are allowed to get away with this.

The French government has never cast any doubt about the vaccine, stop this fake news BS. What they did is to have an overly careful vaccine campaign since they feared that going too fast would clash against the skepticism of the population against the vaccination. This was wrong in my view but far from what you accuse them for.

France had the highest proportion of respondents who said they would not take a vaccine, at 44%, but saw a doubling in the proportion who strongly agreed that they would take a vaccine, from 15% in November to 30% in January.

This is quite a dubious to say things. In fact a recent poll from Odoxa-Backbone consulting published on January 14 concluded that 56% of the population there want to be vaccinated, period. Not sure what the 30% who "strongly agreed" actually means....

3 ( +7 / -4 )

French government and french people aren't that skeptical but the government was too much aware of a backlash against a mandatory vaccine (french people dislikes mandatory things) and took too much extra cautious steps in the vaccination process. The consequences were to slow the vaccination process and to make people too picky on the matter. The article mentions that the proportion of persons ready to take the vaccine is quickly rising as the example of others countries show us that we are too slow and overcautious (thinking that others people can pass over us in unbearable). In brief, we aren't anti-vaccines, we are French making things in the french way (messy, over debated and individualistic)... and we don't like others people criticizing France, is our thing!

0 ( +5 / -5 )

I am still not understanding why the covid vaccine does not prevent spread of the illness. Flu shots do- if you are immunized against influenza it greatly reduces your chance of passing on the disease. It is a similar virus to covid as well. So...what is going on here?

The main problem here is that you don't understand the huge difference between saying "we don't know yet if the vaccine prevents spreading" and saying "the vaccine don't prevent spreading".

7 ( +13 / -6 )

The earlier the better...don’t forget that it takes minimum 6 weeks alone to achieve those 90% plus minus x of immunity. That’s six weeks (or more) for the viruses to catch you unprepared, to distribute further, to mutate and resist your immunity despite being vaccinated then. In addition only the best few kinds of vaccines make some sense, not any vaccine that’s available at that day.

3 ( +7 / -4 )

Michael MachidaToday  02:35 pm JST

I am not taking the vaccine. Its not your choice if I take the vaccine. I do not trust the vaccine. Easy.

Sure it's your choice!

Just be informed, that like it or not, due to Covid most countries are already in the planning of "vaccine" or immunization passports:

https://www.schengenvisainfo.com/news/covid-19-vaccine-set-to-become-worlds-most-powerful-passport-in-2021/

Without it, you will be barred from travel, tourism, access to events and entertainment in the future. Have fun!

6 ( +8 / -2 )

At the moment those who dont want to take the vaccine must be a boon to places that are rolling them out but are short in supplies, less demand than what would have been if everyone wants the vaccine

People who otherwise wouldnt have been vaccinated early are surely grateful to the skeptics who are ahead on priority list but chose not to get the jab

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

Im afraid though that as the pandemic rage on there would be less and less vaccine skeptics.

Afraid that they become less and less not because they saw the light but rather because they went to the light.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

we are French making things in the french way (messy, over debated and individualistic).

Well I am not sure that's even true as far as I can see, Sure enough vaccination in France has been not smooth and somehow messy, but they started to vaccine people. Japan, the so-called super efficient country has provided the vaccine to ZERO people so far. And it seems that the French have incredibly well accepted the very severe lockdowns and restrictions. So the individualistic thing does not hold water either.

3 ( +4 / -1 )

I’m going to wait until most people have the vaccine and the virus is no longer iIn existence....

-3 ( +4 / -7 )

I am still not understanding why the covid vaccine does not prevent spread of the illness. Flu shots do- if you are immunized against influenza it greatly reduces your chance of passing on the disease. It is a similar virus to covid as well. So...what is going on here?

This might be worth a read. Hope this proves to be the case.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/europe/oxford-astrazeneca-covid-vaccine-transmission/2021/02/03/aab74906-6605-11eb-bab8-707f8769d785_story.html

3 ( +5 / -2 )

I’m going to wait until most people have the vaccine and the virus is no longer iIn existence....

That’s wonderful. Thanks for sharing.

4 ( +6 / -2 )

I’m going to wait until most people have the vaccine and the virus is no longer iIn existence....

And in that time you may catch the virus and spread it to someone who falls seriously ill or dies.

2 ( +5 / -3 )

No worries.

In Japan once they have finally got enough doses they will have another 'campaign' headed by AKB,a 'talento or a mascot recommending people get vaccinated ASAP and the whole country will be vaccinated as soon as you can say 'Tokyo Olympics.'

3 ( +4 / -1 )

In Finland 86% say they will take the vaccine. Which is a good number to create herd immunity after which by next Xmas life in Finland will be back to normal.

The problem is if only half of any nation takes the vaccine, the virus will keep on circulating.

5 ( +7 / -2 )

Everybody can go before me, by that I mean all 8 billion of you.

I do that as a courtesy and sense of civic duty.

-4 ( +4 / -8 )

Considering the very high survival rate for Covid-19 and the high number of serious adverse reactions to these rushed experimental vaccines, I'm not surprised skeptics remain. There are very effective treatments and preventative measures against Covid19, I wish there was more talk about that, instead of "vaccine vaccine vaccine...."

-5 ( +4 / -9 )

Covid has a very high death rate, and a very high rate of life changing, long term health issues for survivors.

0 ( +5 / -5 )

Where is the Japanese vaccine being developed by Osaka University and AnGes. No news at all, why is Japan so inscrutable

0 ( +2 / -2 )

"They wouldn't be skeptical in Japan if it was a Japanese made vaccine. We'd never hear the end of how they'd made one "

Is this applicable to France to?!

"France had the highest proportion of respondents who said they would not take a vaccine, at 44%"

Or Japan is the only country's name you know how to type?

-2 ( +3 / -5 )

They wouldn't be skeptical in Japan if it was a Japanese made vaccine. We'd never hear the end of how they'd made one "

Is this applicable to France to?!

Maybe. Irrelevant to the idea stated in any case.

As we have established, you know next to nothing about Japan, can’t read anything written in the language nor speak to anyone in the language. You are not qualified to offer an opinion on the poster’s view and so proceeded to give an irrelevant comparison to France, and then fell into your usual bawling about foreigners expressing views about a country you know next to nothing about.

Why bother?

2 ( +5 / -3 )

"can’t read anything written in the language nor speak to anyone in the language. "

This article is written in English.

"irrelevant comparison to France,"

Irrelevant?

"France had the highest proportion of respondents who said they would not take a vaccine"

"Why bother?"

Because it p***es you off.

Stick that in yer pipe and smoke it.

-5 ( +2 / -7 )

You have to separate anti-vaxx and people just thinking the current vaccines might have been a bit rushed.

And the pharma companies producing those are still not clear about amount of active subtance in it, the number of doses needed, the efficiency rate ...

And don't give credit to these polls, they are often wrong, esp. for elections.

And the question asked in France was not so direct.

You could answer i don't want to take a vaccine right now but eventually i will (when enough feedbacks, when other products arrive ...)

2 ( +3 / -1 )

You have to separate anti-vaxx and people just thinking the current vaccines might have been a bit rushed.

In a way the difference is between the people that spread bad knowledge and the people that believe that bad knowledge.

For example, the vaccines were accelerated in the parts that require money, but the safety trials were on the same scale for previous vaccines that we are using without problem, so there is no special danger in the rush. After all there is nothing they were supposed to improve upon (which is usually the difficult and slow part).

It takes zero effort to see the composition of all the approved vaccines, the phase III trials conclude with very strong statistical confidence what is the efficacy rate, and the number of doses is also perfectly clear. All that is information that is readily available.

The people that try as much as they can to mislead others are the ones directly responsible for such hesitancy, but the people that don't look for official sources to check if that invalid information is actually true or not are also in part responsible for letting themselves be misinformed.

0 ( +5 / -5 )

You have to separate anti-vaxx and people just thinking the current vaccines might have been a bit rushed.

Yes.

Vaccinations have already started so those just thinking it was rushed probably have more than enough info to make a decision in a year. If they cant decide to get vaccinated then, they probably never will.

And in a year the countrywide vaccinations probably wouldnt be nearly finished yet so those who have wait and see attitude wouldnt be that far behind after all in the vaccinations schedule

2 ( +3 / -1 )

@Peeping_Tom

'Or Japan is the only country's name you know how to type?'

Well, as I was born and have lived 52 of my 71 years here, I think it's the country I know best.

France, I don't know so well, but my French friends are in no way ignorant about the world, or full of pompous bluster about things from their nation. I'll leave it at that because I'll get told off for being off topic.

6 ( +6 / -0 )

I do that as a courtesy and sense of civic duty.

That may be what your sense tells you but for me if you have a sense of civic duty youll get yourself properly informed as to why its your civic duty to get vaccinated.

But im sure you already consider yourself properly informed

1 ( +2 / -1 )

Considering the very high survival rate for Covid-19 and the high number of serious adverse reactions to these rushed experimental vaccines, I'm not surprised skeptics remain

I dont know about them but if these are your reasons for not taking the vaccine you should also take into consideration the high number of serious adverse reactions due to covid.

A great number of those who got covid stopped breathing.

1 ( +3 / -2 )

In a way the difference is between the people that spread bad knowledge and the people that believe that bad knowledge.

That is quite a reduced view. Lot of "I want do wait" people do not give a crap about antivax statements.

It is more like, when you go eat some unknow food with your spouse and everyone is eating it and telling you it is good. Even thought you perfectly believe them you just have trouble taking the first step, sometimes needing your spouse to eat first. Then you will follow suit. Lot of people just need that, not being first. It is potentially why vaccine confidence is rising neither staying put nor decreasing.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

"or full of pompous bluster about things from their nation. "

Well.

As someone who does have quite a few cousins born, bred and only speak French I have nothing but the utmost respect for the country and its people. Very different from more than a few conceited immigrants posting here.

As someone who knows France extremely well, I can also assure you that (), they are the most arrogant lot out there. They are "full of pompous bluster about things from their nation".

Respek aside.

Nevertheless, the issue is that both Japan and France have "issues" with the vaccine.

Criticise both equally.

Alternatively, none.

-8 ( +0 / -8 )

As someone who knows France extremely well, I can also assure you that (), they are the most arrogant lot out there. They are "full of pompous bluster about things from their nation".

You can’t make that claim. Your ignorance of Japan is so unfathomably stupendous that you don’t have the ability to rule out the possibility that the Japanese are the most arrogant lot out there. I can’t make that claim either as my ignorance of most countries is as unfathomably stupendous as yours is of Japan.

As someone who knows France extremely well

Extremely well? I assume you’ve lived there for an extended period and probably speak the language well. A few trips over for a van load of cheap booze doesn’t count.

6 ( +7 / -1 )

Plus the Russian Sputnik V vaccine is over 91% effective according to a British study w/ 20K participants. It is 2-doses and there weren't any side effects or issues for the very old in their study. Over 2M people have been vaccinated, in 15 countries.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/russian-covid-19-vaccine-was-highly-effective-in-trial-study-finds-boosting-moscows-rollout-ambitions-11612269047

Nicely done Russia! If it was available here, I'd take it. The 2 vaccines deployed in the US from Moderna Inc. and Pfizer are only slightly better in studies.

The Chinese vaccine, CoronaVac, appears to be 50.4% effective, but the study used Brazil where they only delayed the 2nd shot 2 weeks, not the typical 3-4 weeks the other vaccines recommend. In other countries, the effectivity was higher. The Turkey trial reported that CoronaVac was 91.25% effective at preventing symptomatic disease with 1300 participants. CoronaVac does appear to prevent the most serious cases. https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-00094-z

5 ( +5 / -0 )

That is quite a reduced view. Lot of "I want do wait" people do not give a crap about antivax statements.

It is more like, when you go eat some unknow food with your spouse and everyone is eating it and telling you it is good. Even thought you perfectly believe them you just have trouble taking the first step, sometimes needing your spouse to eat first. Then you will follow suit. Lot of people just need that, not being first. It is potentially why vaccine confidence is rising neither staying put nor decreasing.

The difference is that in vaccination the other option is obviously worse, its like the restaurant having a sign saying that the people that don't eat the dish first will enter a lottery and the ones that win will have to eat the most disgusting item on the menu. Irrational fears are not a valid excuse to choose the worst option as if that had no risk at all. The antivaxxer statements are the ones that make people have those irrational fears because exaggerates any possible risk from vaccines while minimizing the well known risk of the infection. If people actually gave no importance to them and would spend an hour reading the evidence they would be much more afraid of the infection, enough to only hesitate about which vaccine to take, not about taking one.

1 ( +5 / -4 )

The difference is that in vaccination the other option is obviously worse,

No, the other option is not obviously worse.

The antivaxxer statements are the ones that make people have those irrational fears because exaggerates any possible risk from vaccines while minimizing the well known risk of the infection.

Some of so called "antivaxxers" make some very valid points. One thing that causes hesitancy in people hearing claims that vaccines are completely safe (as you used to say) and then seeing that many people suffer serious adverse effects or death soon after vaccination. What we need is an honest and open investigation of the risks and benefits of vaccinations, and not by industry insiders or those with other conflicts of interest. Pfizer has already been fined billions over the years for falsifying data and bribing people. I will certainly not take any covid vaccine any time soon.

-5 ( +1 / -6 )

No, the other option is not obviously worse.

The scientific consensus completely contradicts you, all proper data proves vaccines are much safer than letting the person be at risk of the natural infection. You are wrong on this.

Some of so called "antivaxxers" make some very valid points. 

They would be valid if not completely debunked by science very easily, the only "defense" they have is ignorance (and sometimes misrepresenting the information so they can deceive other people into hesitancy).

One thing that causes hesitancy in people hearing claims that vaccines are completely safe (as you used to say)

This is a good example, I have never said that vaccines are completely safe (so much that you have never found a quote of me saying so), the scientific point is that vaccine are simply hugely safer than the natural infection, which is demonstrably true, even if you personally don't like it.

We already have a honest and open discussion on risk and benefits of vaccines, the problem is that that requires people to tell the truth and do not twist and bend real scientific evidence to try to convince others about their fanatical beliefs, that is why antivaxxers are not included in those, honesty is a perfectly valid requirement that they are not interested in honoring.

3 ( +5 / -2 )

Like it or not, there will always be an element of risk involved in taking any vaccination, let alone a very new one. Depending on a person's physique, there can be mild or severe side-effects, especially for old people above 70 in this case.

Anyway, one has to trust someone and/or the vaccine somehow..

0 ( +2 / -2 )

Anyway, one has to trust someone and/or the vaccine somehow..

Do you trust big pharma? I don't.

I'll wait and see how these rushed experimental vaccines play out in the real world before getting it injected into my body.

-4 ( +1 / -5 )

Do you trust big pharma? I don't.

I'll wait and see how these rushed experimental vaccines play out in the real world before getting it injected into my body.

That is the thing, nobody is required to blindly trust any company, trials are designed to be examined by experts in many fields under employment of different government and the results can be dissected with all the time in the world by people that do that for a living to discover problems with the data. Up until now there have been no reports of disqualifying problems, so unless you believe a fantasy (that every professional scientist and health worker in the world is in the conspiracy to hide a dangerous vaccine that will be applied to their own friends and family) that makes no sense

You are free to act in an irrational way (exposing yourself to the much higher risks of the natural infection) but you are not free to pretend it is a logical decision when it can be proved it is not.

1 ( +3 / -2 )

@virusex

like the restaurant having a sign saying that the people that don't eat the dish first will enter a lottery and the ones that win will have to eat the most disgusting item on the menu.

Sorry to disappoint you but vaccine are not going to turn bad because you do not take it as soon as served. They are not going to start being careless about production when some % of the population will be inoculated. Neither are they going to put on some corner waiting for you. Nor are they going to inoculate people with random vaccine instead. Stop spraying bull.

If A doesn't take A's dose it is going to be given to B and so on. When A will come A will be given another dose. We are not in a situation where the supply ability is higher than the demands, so no big deal. That is just risk sliding instead of having H having to wait for H vaccine thus taking risk of getting covid-19, we got A taking the risk and H being safe.

Everybody is able to do risk assessment. If they do not eat the dish now it will turn lukewarm, they will be hungry longer, they can risk inanition, ... as they know having someone else take it first is not guarantee they will like it, do not start having rash, ...

If you want call it irrational but most people call it heritable trait of carefulness selected through natural selection. How do you think humanity as a species was able to subsist and spread all over the world even thought lot of food&co could have killed it ? You should study biology that is an interesting field. You should also study history when you are at it to learn about royal taster&co. And have a go with linguistic and start wondering how language can teach you about the perception of medicine by population. It is something we drink ; same for vaccine, similar word are used to talk about stuff entering the body, it is quite interesting that it even apply to sexual interaction in some slang, but I guess for this one you will also have to have a go with psychology&co.

As already said lot of people should care less about antivax statement, moreover as several do not even see/hear any of those.

If I were to make a study, I will put as hypothesis than fake provaccine which go around discretely spraying bull and antagonizing everybody and anybody are far more effective in creating antivaccine movement as they corner people into choosing a camp and display theirs as a totalitarian one.

So for people indecisive, some link about the vaccine with are for now expected to come to Japan :

https://www.who.int/news-room/feature-stories/detail/the-moderna-covid-19-mrna-1273-vaccine-what-you-need-to-know

https://www.who.int/news-room/feature-stories/detail/who-can-take-the-pfizer-biontech-covid-19--vaccine

If you have question, feel free to refer to any health/medical facility you trust, some have already put information on their website, some have system to report stuff you think could be hoax, ...

For the WHO :

https://www.who.int/emergencies/diseases/novel-coronavirus-2019/advice-for-public/myth-busters

https://www.who.int/campaigns/connecting-the-world-to-combat-coronavirus/how-to-report-misinformation-online

And do not forget that for months now people have be inoculated with vaccine (including testing phase) and days after days more and more people got these, we are already in the millions and things are ok and problem when arising were fixed or in the process of it (for the japanese freezer).

And do not forget to do your best to stop the spread and protect yourself and other since, as of now, we do not have any idea who will get long covid which can put ones in serious trouble including inability to work for prolonged period of time ; we already know some people will die from it and we have to protect our medical system and the people working for it.

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

Sorry to disappoint you but vaccine are not going to turn bad because you do not take it as soon as served. They are not going to start being careless about production when some % of the population will be inoculated. Neither are they going to put on some corner waiting for you. Nor are they going to inoculate people with random vaccine instead. Stop spraying bull.

Where did I said that the vaccine was going to turn bad, or wasted? The analogy was simple to make it easier to understand but apparently not enough.

The point was that not vaccinating is not free of risk, to hesitate about being immunized comes with the risk of catching the natural infection and their much more important negative effects in health, which will not magically disappear just because the vaccine is used on other people. You are discussing against a strawman that nobody argued.

If you want call it irrational but most people call it heritable trait of carefulness selected through natural selection.

So is being afraid from spoons, clocks, dead snakes or any of the other examples of irrational fears, saying that this exaggerated carefulness is inherited do not change the fact that is irrational, and that it is much more positive to make an effort to eliminate it instead of just be contempt by having them and have a lower quality of life because of them.

As already said lot of people should care less about antivax statement, moreover as several do not even see/hear any of those.

That is only getting for free half of the tasks a responsible adult had to do, the other half is informing yourself to make the correct decision based on realities instead of irrational fears.

And if the only thing that you have to think disqualifying antivaxxer false information does worse than letting it run rampant is an hypothesis then by definition you cannot say this is true, for that you have to prove it first. What if your hypothesis is false?

And do not forget that for months now people have be inoculated with vaccine (including testing phase) and days after days more and more people got these, we are already in the millions and things are ok and problem when arising were fixed or in the process of it (for the japanese freezer).

Things are ok only because huge efforts to stop overloading the health services, so are the problems in logistics, but there is no real effort being done to erase vaccine hesitancy or even to reduce the amount of antivaxxer misinformation that is being spread around. Protecting the vulnerable population and the health services providers is an excellent justification to be vocal and clear on the irrationality of refusing safe and effective vaccines and choosing a much higher risk with the natural infection.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

The analogy was simple to make it easier to understand but apparently not enough.

Puwaaaaah ! I was the one making the analogy and you are the one unable to understand it even with further explanation.

The dish is the vaccine.

If people do no take the vaccine they face the consequence of not taking the vaccine. If they take it later they will still have the vaccine.

exaggerated carefulness is inherited do not change the fact that is irrational

That is not exaggerate, that is normal. There is nothing irrational about acquiring knowledge from experience : I need food - I found something I do not know in enough quantity - I can get someone to eat it first - One die : I acquired knowledge do not eat it ; one do not die : I acquired knowledge eating it is ok. That is a perfectly rational way to acquire knowledge (thought not fair for the one dying). Other options exists if no one is available. Having a book stating it is safe is one.

So is being afraid from spoons, clocks, dead snakes or any of the other examples

Please give the rational about using it as analogy. I explained already why I used food. And in all fairness to people concerned as long as they do not know these object/being it is perfectly rational to be careful around them and to become careful even afraid if the knowledge through experience acquired deem these as dangerous.

That is only getting for free half of the tasks a responsible adult had to do.

I do not get it. Are you suggesting it is a problem that people do not care about antivax statement or just have no trouble no accessing these ? Are you suggesting that these people are not looking for informations by themselves ?

You get my hypothesis false : my hypothesis is that fake provaxer are more dangerous than true antivaxer. Provaxer are mostly able to give information and help indecisive people as they are not giving antivaxer ammunition neither are antagonizing hesitant people or provaxer. The one which are not able to do so and end up looking like fake provaxer should review their way as they are doing more worse than good.

I do not get why you bothered about the part for hesitant people. Are you hesitating ?

but there is no real effort being done to erase vaccine hesitancy or even to reduce the amount of antivaxxer misinformation that is being spread around

There are lot of resources available for people and work done to reduce misinformation. So to anybody which is hesitant : do not rely on here. Please check with acknowledged (no self-proclamed) health/medicine specialists you trust.

Some link which are widely considered reliable :

https://www.thelancet.com/coronavirus?dgcid=kr_pop-up_tlcoronavirus20

https://www.who.int/

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/index.html

https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/coronavirus-covid-19/

...

If you are not at ease with scientific studies, usually major media make explanation articles :

https://www.bbc.com/news/coronavirus

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

Puwaaaaah ! I was the one making the analogy and you are the one unable to understand it even with further explanation.

No, I made the analogy of the penalty for not eating first, why would you be discussing against your own analogy? that would make no sense, even less discussing it to me.

The dish is the vaccine.

If people do no take the vaccine they face the consequence of not taking the vaccine. If they take it later they will still have the vaccine.

See, that shows you never understood MY analogy, if people take it later they have to deal with a penalty which is the increased risks from the natural infection. Taking the vaccine after getting the risks is irrelevant.

That is not exaggerate, that is normal.

No, the simple fact you accept it is irrational makes it exaggerated. It is not logical, it is not justified, is a exaggerated fear without meaning because of which the riskier option is chosen without any real need. We are no longer bound by personal experiences to know things, we have science to understand reality and irrationally ignoring science for unjustied fears is still a negative thing that should be avoided.

Please give the rational about using it as analogy. I explained already why I used food.

And apparently you have a terrible time trying to understand anything that you did not wrote yourself.

Fears against things that are not more risky are irrational, vaccines can be easily demonstrated as such. So those fears are not valid, are not justified, are illogical. Not knowing about it is also an invalid excuse because people should know about it as part of the responsibilities of being functioning adults in society.

I do not get it. Are you suggesting it is a problem that people do not care about antivax statement or just have no trouble no accessing these ? Are you suggesting that these people are not looking for informations by themselves ?

No, going moooore sloooly for you. Ignoring bad information is half of the things a responsible adult should do, not being exposed to this false information means they easily did the first half of the work. They only need to do the other half, which is access the pertinent information to make a good decision.

What is a "fake provaxer"? that makes no sense nor is a real position that you can actually find in the discussions, antagonizing people distributing false or misleading information is not being it, and you have not demonstrated at all that it has any negative effect in the attitude of the people towards vaccines, so if you want to say people should not do it then prove first this negative effect.

There are lot of resources available for people and work done to reduce misinformation. So to anybody which is hesitant : do not rely on here. Please check with acknowledged (no self-proclamed) health/medicine specialists you trust.

We are talking about Japan here, none of your sources apply here, and if having truthful information available somewhere was enought to inform people there would be no vaccine hesitancy in the world, after all anybody could access it, right?

In reality efforts to erase vaccine hesitancy consist on active education campaigns, dedicate resources to expose the public to truthful information of the value and safety of vaccines and make clear that antivaxxer conspiracy theories are false and should not be taken as reference for a decision.

Again, if you think that having information available is the same as educating people you could not be more wrong, if that were true the wikipedia would represent "efforts" to educate everybody about everything, it obviously don't.

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Seems the less technical news organizations looked over the Russian vaccine study and assumed the data wasn't tampered. Seems some other groups aren't nearly as certain. I'm hopeful that no tampering occurred, but I'm just as hopeful that Russian athletes aren't doping to gain advantage in international sports too - and we all know who that's turned out. https://arstechnica.com/science/2021/02/russias-sputnik-v-vaccine-looks-good-in-early-analysis/

Two other companies used the same technique as the Russians in their vaccines, yet they aren't seeing the same level of effectiveness.

Yet Sputnik V seems to be significantly more effective than the offerings of Johnson & Johnson or AstraZeneca.

Do you trust big pharma? I don't.

I trust them to want to make money and try not to harm people they want as customers for the next 50 years. They will try.

Breathing is hazardous to our health. Given a long enough period, we will all die from deadly oxygen. The same applies to everything in our environment. Everything is out to kill us - and our bodies try to fight for a long time, but eventually fail. Healthy people my age are dying from COVID - these people are much healthier than me. I'll take the vaccine. It is a calculated risk to mitigate a larger risk for 20-40 yrs that would be worse. If annual versions of the vaccine are needed, the risk from each of those shots will be calculated (as well as my human brain can handle, humans are bad at that sort of calculation), and each year it will be decided whether the risk of not taking the shot(s) is higher than getting immunized.

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So in your analogy the vaccine and the virus are the same 8/. That is not as there was only one dish to start with. People are not having a choice between taking the vaccine as soon as proposed or catching covid. They have the choice in between taking the vaccine or facing the risk of catching covid for as long as they do not take the vaccine.

No matter what you think people are perfectly able to do risk assessment by themselves and take decision by themselves. If they are not sure they are perfectly able to reach to get accurate information. I get from your statement that you believe people are not able to do such.

I dare to remember you we are talking about knowledge acquisition by experience as perfectly rational way and carefulness as heritable trait. Thus being careful about a spoon is perfectly rational if that is an unknow object. For snake, let's just buwaaaa ! at people being irrational for fearing them, it is not like some can kill you by biting you, right.

I wonder why you have so much trouble understanding what is a fake pro-vaxxer and how to recognize them, and I never mentioned antagonizing true antivaxxer but indecise people (I kept changing the way I call them to reflect the high variability among them) or provaxxer.

Frankly speaking if you really do not understand why antagonizing people is bad, I have no idea where make you start with. Try going for management and the effect of blame for start then kept going : https://www.forbes.com/sites/annashields/2020/09/09/from-blame-to-empathy-lessons-for-leaders-to-diffuse-conflict/?sh=2b0bf302f5af . For the easiness of understanding : by blaming people for being unsure about covid-19 vaccine, they will tend to hide their insecurity instead of having them be addressed by someone reliable from the health/medical field. And that is only one of the aspect. There is also the phenomena of polarization, reactance and so on. Research about farm troll is interesting too as much as marketing strategies.

We are talking about Japan here

We are not : it is the world section and the article is : "Global vaccine trust rising, but France, Japan, others skeptical" thus about worldwide situation regarding vaccine trust.

And educating people is about giving people information, including information about how to get information and help them develop critical thinking to deal with these. Telling people : "Listen to me. If not, you are stupid or the like. Period." is not educating.

====================================-

For any people having questions, please refeer to specialists in health/medical field you trust. If you do not know where to start with, I posted several links which are widely trusted. If you have any question, feel free to refer to any recognized specialists in health/medicine you trust. They will gladly help you navigate these information. Here is not the right place.

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Even Sputnik V finally released their results in peer-reviewed Lancet publication, and showed over 90% effective with minimal side-effects

Hopefully, skeptical Russian people finally take their own vaccine

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So in your analogy the vaccine and the virus are the same 8/. That is not as there was only one dish to start with. People are not having a choice between taking the vaccine as soon as proposed or catching covid. They have the choice in between taking the vaccine or facing the risk of catching covid for as long as they do not take the vaccine.

Read again my analogy, both of the things you understood from it are wrong. I specified clearly that the infection was another thing that the person did not want to eat AND that they would have a risk of having it. If you want to discuss something at least make the effort of reading it first.

No matter what you think people are perfectly able to do risk assessment by themselves and take decision by themselves. If they are not sure they are perfectly able to reach to get accurate information. I get from your statement that you believe people are not able to do such.

You yourself gave reasons why this is not true, irrational fears that can easily be proved so, with valid scientific data that prove vaccines as the better option without any doubt. You are perfectly able to scroll up to read again my analogy but you refused to do it and misrepresented it to make a strawman argument, it is naive to think people will always search for information, specially if it contradicts their irrational belief.

My statement is that people frequently do not do it, because of personal bias or simple convenience, so this must be addressed with efforts to correct it.

I dare to remember you we are talking about knowledge acquisition by experience as perfectly rational way and carefulness as heritable trait. Thus being careful about a spoon is perfectly rational if that is an unknow object. For snake, let's just buwaaaa ! at people being irrational for fearing them, it is not like some can kill you by biting you, right.

Again that is trying to force an obvious situation into something that simply don't happen. What kind of adult would not know what is a spoon? but since you like so much to pretend not to understand very obvious examples. Being afraid of a spoon even when fully knowing there is no danger in it is an irrational fear. Being hesitant from vaccines that are the best option no matter how you compare it with the natural infection is also an irrational fear. Also I clearly specified a DEAD snake, you should think for a moment that if the only way you can discuss an argument that disproves you is to modify it to make it false that would mean you already gave up with the real argument.

If a patient requires live saving treatments but its irrationally afraid of medicines, your approach would mean treating those fears as valid and let it die, my approach would be to make an effort not only to let information be available to him but to actively educate him and make him understand that not treating the disease is much worse and in his best interests to take it.

I wonder why you have so much trouble understanding what is a fake pro-vaxxer and how to recognize them, and I never mentioned antagonizing true antivaxxer but indecise people (I kept changing the way I call them to reflect the high variability among them) or provaxxer.

The trouble is that your ill-defined fantasy based pro-vaxxer do not exist. It is just an hypothetical construct you need to base your invalid arguments on, a person that actively tries to promote anti-vaccination while pretending to support it (thus being "fake") How to recognize something that is not present anywhere but in your imagination?

The only people that would be antagonized by your construct (in reality anybody interested in having only real arguments used in the discussion) would be the antivaxxers, because those would be the people using false and misleading arguments to defend the anti-vaccine agenda. Why would you immediately assume indecisive people would do that? you got confused by your own misconstructed arguments.

Frankly speaking if you really do not understand why antagonizing people is bad, I have no idea where make you start with.

No, that is not your argument, you said that antagonizing antivaxxers would make indecisive people turn away from vaccines, that is a completely different thing, that you have not proved in any way.

Again, there is no need to antagonize people that are on the fence or hesitant, there is need to antagonize the bad information that is being used to put them in that position, the people spreading that false information are not just people hesitant but actively promoting lies to make other people hesitant so they also need to be antagonized too.

We are not : it is the world section and the article is : "Global vaccine trust rising, but France, Japan, others skeptical" thus about worldwide situation regarding vaccine trust.

Yes we are, because your reply was specifically for my comment

"Things are ok only because huge efforts to stop overloading the health services, so are the problems in logistics, but there is no real effort being done to erase vaccine hesitancy or even to reduce the amount of antivaxxer misinformation that is being spread around."

This comment comes specifically because you said that Japan is preparing properly for the vaccination efforts. It is not, because it is making close to zero efforts to correct vaccine hesitancy, neither putting information in the hands of the population so ignorance is no longer an excuse, nor attacking the false information that is being spread around.

Everything is written here, try to put more attention into what is being discussed (and not change the arguments used against you).

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