Where Ukraine's sunflowers once sprouted, fears now grow

albaleo, I believe we are all at a loss to how this stand off will reveal what action Putin will follow.

This is an interesting article from Politico....

Despite Biden and Macron, Western allies remain united against Russia....

https://www.politico.eu/article/russia-united-states-ukraine-nato-eu-emmanuel-macron-joe-biden-josep-borrell/

Macron suggested, hinted .........

The U.S. president’s stray remark suggesting NATO powers might tolerate a “minor incursion” by Russia into Ukraine came the same day as the French president’s assertion that Europeans should negotiate their own version of a new security order with Moscow.

"Where Ukraine's sunflowers once sprouted, fears now grow"

♫...They've gone to graveyards every one...♪

And, of course, Sun Tzu: “All warfare is based on deception.”

And who, here, if not us, is the most deceived? Try to imagine the American response had Cuba wanted to join the Soviet Union...oh, wait a minute...

It time bring Putin to his knees, if you cannot bring him to his senses

Given that Biden is already fielding questions from right wing media about why he's bothering to wait for Russia to actually do something other than noticeably not doing what Biden claims that it is about to, it is possible that someone on his reelection team will realize that America's right wing has become so radicalized that creating a 'paper tiger' and then threatening it into immobility doesn't impress them, and this 'crisis' created out of hot air and complicit media will be allowed to dissipate back into the nothingness it was spun from.

u_s__reamer 

"Don Cossack song, "Where Have All the Flowers Gone".?

Please tell me: Since when did this American song, written by American singer Pete Seeger in 1955, become a Don Cossack Song?

I am old enough to remember when the school girl from New England testified to congress about "witnessing" Iraqi soldiers throwing babies from incubators and when Bush told Americans that WMD's were as common as grass in Iraq. An unpopular president who needs a war and the way it is being sold to gullible American's is a worry. Regardless of what the situation is really like this story about sunflowers is pure propaganda designed to convince Americans to send their children to die in a sketchy foreign country.

There is no Russian invasion & there will be non. There is a US political & propaganda machines working at full thrust, preparing for Ukrainian provocation that will no doubt demand a Russian prompt & decisive response, allowing the West to scream to the whole world about Russian aggression.

Now guess where they, although a little bit growing because of that fear mongering hype everywhere, still have by far the lowest fear level of all? Exactly, also there, where still the sunflowers sprout… lol

We're pretty dangerously close to a WW3 at this point.

Putin's made clear the saddest thing he's ever seen and biggest 'regret' is the fall of the Soviet Union. Little by little, he's trying to get it back.

Why is Russian military might massed at the Russian border? I can think of two. One: The Russians fear Ukraine will join NATO. Two: The Russians are afraid of the U.S. (now) selling advanced weapons to Ukraine.

Solution: A treaty barring Ukraine from ever joining NATO. (Better yet, invite Russia to join NATO). Stop selling the U.S. from selling advanced weapons to the Ukraine.

Simple.

Oh yes, replace Blinken with someone more qualified.

What is all these interest in Ukrain?

Anyone has a relative there in danger other then Covid?

Anything the media throws in the ring you pick it up with expert eyes….

Sure. And then there's Kosovo.

So Europe should have allowed Serbia to keep comiting genocide? Each situation is different and common sense must come into play at some point. Saving live is also a concern but no one formula can be applied to all because of differing situations.

Normally the who nation would have to be in agreement wouldn't they?

Sure. And then there's Kosovo.

Normally the whole* nation would have to be in agreement wouldn't they?

By this token, though, are Texas and California allowed to break away from the US?

No. Look what happened last time some states made that attempt.

By this token, though, are Texas and California allowed to break away from the US?

Have the majority of them, or any of them shown a desire to do so? No

does Beijing have the right to leave China? Even Taiwan has issues with independence.

So what is your point? Nations do not disintegrate whenever a small part chooses to be independent. Normally the who nation would have to be in agreement wouldn't they?

A lesson for other countries: don’t rely on any agreement and never give up your nuclear program. 

So you support Iran and N Korea?

Of course not. What I am saying is that US, UK and Russia are to blame why nobody will ever give up their nukes.

options have run out, can we agree?

Not really. I feel quite in the dark and so not sure what the options are. Our leaders (meaning Western leaders) have said little about how they view any outcome. Meanwhile, I've seen far more military jets than usual flying overhead here in Scotland over the last week.

Were the Chechen people allowed to break away from Russia?

If that's what they wanted, it should have been allowed. Again, I don't remember any Western leaders pushing that option.

Does it not demand that the people of Donbas get to decide their own future - self determination of peoples (UN Charter).

Nobody really asked their opinion. This territory is de-facto under Russian control. People living there are getting Russian passports. It is not like they have many options.

A lesson for other countries: don’t rely on any agreement and never give up your nuclear program.

So you support Iran and N Korea?

Were the Chechen people allowed to break away from Russia

By this token, though, are Texas and California allowed to break away from the US?

Germany Has Little Maneuvering Room in Ukraine Conflict

Sounds familiar. Most of Western Europe behaved like that before and during WW2, aren’t they? No lesson learned.

Germany Has Little Maneuvering Room in Ukraine Conflict

https://www.spiegel.de/international/world/a-war-of-nerves-germany-has-little-maneuvering-room-in-ukraine-conflict-a-faece2a7-c098-48cb-a9cc-cd0d5daf78f1

This is a assessment from what could be described as the most independent German analysis

Were the Chechen people allowed to break away from Russia? NO Why Should Donbas be granted what was denied the Chechen's? Because Russia says so? Not good enough.

Russia with a population of only 146 million still thinks it has the destiny to be a world leader. Delusions of grandeur, nothing more.

Will they further carve up Ukraine? Only time will tell. Putin wants all of the old Soviet states back as part of Russia. Anything can happen. Russian ambitions know no limits.

The West must hold firm and respond appropriately if Russia invades friendly Ukraine.

A lesson for other countries: don’t rely on any agreement and never give up your nuclear program.

albaleo, options have run out, can we agree?

So twelve months from now, where does this leave EU Eastern European policy?

Come on, you must have given that some thought?

"Donbas get to decide their own future"

Donbas has with the interference, help of Russian obtrusion defined the bloody outcome

Freedom demands that EU/UK/NATO/US stand there ground without quarter.

Does it not demand that the people of Donbas get to decide their own future - self determination of peoples (UN Charter).

Does anyone for one moment believe had Ukraine retained that nuclear deterrent Europe would be in this nightmare situation now?

The photo depiction could and probably will come back to haunt President Putin, US/EU-UK Governments

The naïve belief any future Russian Government would accept such a scenario is beyond comprehension….

Just read   

That placid scene was, briefly, a launchpad for hope that the demise of the Soviet Union would bury the threat of great power war and mark the start of lasting peace in an undivided Europe. Today Ukraine is ground zero for worry that Russia will ignite a conflict that could engulf the region.

On that early-June day in 1996, the American secretary of defense, William J. Perry, joined his Russian and Ukrainian counterparts in ceremonies marking the completion of Ukraine’s nuclear disarmament. Under Western pressure, Ukraine had agreed to give up the weapons it inherited with the breakup of the Soviet empire in exchange for a Russian and Western security guarantee.

Perry likened the moment to the parting of a dark cloud of Cold War fear.

Putin has amassed an invasion force, awaiting the order to move, that could, without unequivocal military action over-run the patriotic Ukraine people within weeks.

EU commission rolled out the welcome mat, for the Ukrainian government only to run for cover when a push became a shove.  

The German Government is shameful, the dependence on Russian gas, over lives hundreds of thousands of Ukraine people, is a act of cynical appeasement.

Ukraine people could and will fight back. 

The losses could be horrific.

Freedom demands that EU/UK/NATO/US stand there ground without quarter.

Institute sanctions now. Kick the Kremlin up the backside.

In the turbulent history of the Ukraine so much blood has been spilled over the centuries giving rise no doubt to the lyrics of the Don Cossack song, "Where Have All the Flowers Gone". A Russian invasion would once again revive the reality of the words to this sad song reprising its cynical and mournful comment on the ruthlessness of warfare in the "Bloodlands" of East Europe.