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Wrong twin terminated in Australian hospital error

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© 2011 AFP

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So you think the whole decision was about giving the parents an easier time, bit shallow buddy.

I said it was the point first and foremost. Not the only point. Why can't you slow your roll and read?

I will remind you, you said

I know what I said. And I know what you projected into what I said. And I know you still have not answered the question or proven they got the best medical advice!

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

rumblebelly

Now you talk as if I said they should be arrested! Will you chill out bro? I never said it was not their decision. I am just pointing out that I think it was a poor one. Okay?

Nah your right you just said it would make the parents life easier.... So you think the whole decision was about giving the parents an easier time, bit shallow buddy.

Just trying to figure why you are so belligerent. Would not be the first time you got rude and in people's faces about something to do with Oz now would it? In fact, any time its something to do with Oz, it suddenly becomes a "my way or the highway" proposition it seems.

It was a simple question and you dodged it. Where did you get this best medical advice stuff?

I will remind you, you said "The article does not even mention a second opinion! But the article does mention a botched abortion!". So l will repeat for you, there are more articles out there that have more (and less) information than this one. Maybe you should try reading some other sources. Not dodging your question just saying just because JT doesnt have it in their article doesnt mean it isnt in another.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

You do realise that despite the baby being unborn they can still detect some problems with them or are you not aware of that?

Yeah. They can detect problems but just not which baby to jab.

In the end the parents chose not to allow their child to be born into such pain, it is their choice and they must live with that decision not you not me.

Now you talk as if I said they should be arrested! Will you chill out bro? I never said it was not their decision. I am just pointing out that I think it was a poor one. Okay?

What are you on about nationalist sentiment?

Just trying to figure why you are so belligerent. Would not be the first time you got rude and in people's faces about something to do with Oz now would it? In fact, any time its something to do with Oz, it suddenly becomes a "my way or the highway" proposition it seems.

Oh thats right JT is the ONLY news outlet in the world running the story

It was a simple question and you dodged it. Where did you get this best medical advice stuff?

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

rumblebelly

Try reading my comment again! I question the doctors' determination of the severity of the defect decided while the baby was still in the womb.

Oh sorry l didnt realise you where a doctor. You do realise that despite the baby being unborn they can still detect some problems with them or are you not aware of that?

If the baby was going to die so fast, then why not just let it die naturally? Why not take a chance on life? At least long enough to be born and see?

Oh ok then lets let the baby be born and if it does happen to not die then we can cut it open and subject it to massive pain and suffering and not let it have a normal life. Lets be incredibly cruel to the poor child and put it through immense pain and suffering and inflict this not only on the child but the rest of its family. Lets have the child there screaming in pain while the parents can do nothing to help, lets then watch this poor child have no quality of life all on a off chance it may actually survive to enjoy that sort of life.

Don't you understand the baby was already alive? And I say that as someone who is pro-abortion! But the baby was already 32 weeks old, enough to survive outside the womb though premature. Another 4 weeks is not so much difference. And so, I say its better to take a chance on life. Plenty of kids out there with heart defects glad to be alive. Plenty that have proven doctor's predictions wrong.

I do understand the baby was alive, as are people who have their life support turned off because of their quality of life and medical issues. In the end the parents chose not to allow their child to be born into such pain, it is their choice and they must live with that decision not you not me. But when you come out with comments like lets wait and see or it could be alright, put yourself in their shoes or the shoes of someone who has to sit their and watch their child go through the torture of repeated operations all in the slim hope it will survive let alone have anything like a semi normal life.

I was already thinking that your railing into me was some nationalist sentiment. And that made it more suspicious.

What are you on about nationalist sentiment?

Where do you get this "best medical advise" stuff? The article does not even mention a second opinion! But the article does mention a botched abortion!

Oh thats right JT is the ONLY news outlet in the world running the story, oh and they are running it in as much depth as ALL other news outlets sorry my mistake to actually believe there is more news on this story out there in the world. Maybe you should increase your sphere of reading beyond JT

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

Try reading the article again! There was a very good chance that the child would not survive until it was old enough for surgery, also if it did manage to survive this long it would have had to undergo years of painful operations with no guarantee of success.

Try reading my comment again! I question the doctors' determination of the severity of the defect decided while the baby was still in the womb. If the baby was going to die so fast, then why not just let it die naturally? Why not take a chance on life? At least long enough to be born and see?

maybe but it was also to prevent this poor child suffering a life (possibly a short life) of misery and pain.

Don't you understand the baby was already alive? And I say that as someone who is pro-abortion! But the baby was already 32 weeks old, enough to survive outside the womb though premature. Another 4 weeks is not so much difference. And so, I say its better to take a chance on life. Plenty of kids out there with heart defects glad to be alive. Plenty that have proven doctor's predictions wrong.

it was the parents decision based on the best medical advise available.

I was already thinking that your railing into me was some nationalist sentiment. And that made it more suspicious. Where do you get this "best medical advise" stuff? The article does not even mention a second opinion! But the article does mention a botched abortion!

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

Extraordinary negligence bordering on criminal behavior. And the hospital has the gall to say "correct" procedures were followed? I shudder to ponder the results of "incorrect" procedures.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

@j4p4n karma?? Sure! I'm Buddhist and karma is very strict. Do we really want to go up to these grieving parents now?? By the way you just lost your babies but it's karma so relax?? Just chill out and?? Be happy??

0 ( +1 / -1 )

In the States and Japan too obsitricians are the worst jobs for doctors. How about Australia??

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

This baby never gave consent to be killed.

It's absolutely wrong for one person to take the life of another.

What kind of a sicko would kill a helpless child anyways.

-4 ( +1 / -5 )

rumblebelly

The point was to prevent heartache of the parents first and foremost. And I question if the doctors' judgement was ever sound. Lots of people have lived for years with heart defects and no operation.

Try reading the article again! There was a very good chance that the child would not survive until it was old enough for surgery, also if it did manage to survive this long it would have had to undergo years of painful operations with no guarantee of success. So you say it was to prevent the parents heartache, maybe but it was also to prevent this poor child suffering a life (possibly a short life) of misery and pain. It would be a terrible decision to make and while people cant be expected to agree or disagree it was the parents decision based on the best medical advise available. Really is it any different from someone pulling the plug on a person on life support, it was deemed to be in the best interests of the people involved (including the child) and until you have been in that situation you cannot hope to comprehend how heartbreaking a decision it is.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

In the developed world doctors have a job that tries to save lives

By ending them prematurely? The point of this operation was not to save a life. The point was to prevent heartache of the parents first and foremost. And I question if the doctors' judgement was ever sound. Lots of people have lived for years with heart defects and no operation.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

during which the life of the sick fetus was also ended.

What do they mean by "was ended"

Was the fetus crying when his neck was snapped by the "doctor"?

-2 ( +0 / -2 )

Man, heart goes out to the mom.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

This is horrific.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

Unbelievable!! Idiot quacks for doctors!!

-5 ( +0 / -5 )

Am not going to get in to the discussion about the rights and wrongs of aborting a viable fetus, but the mistake itself was inexcusable, and the journalist who ran the story against the family's wishes should also be disciplined. What did he/she hope to gain? This family went through enough as it was & I'm sure they didn't enter in to this lightly. What a mess.

4 ( +4 / -0 )

If the baby will need surgery to live, and the parents can't afford it, then just don't get the child the surgery! Sounds better than just killing it. And if you are going to kill it, what is the difference between 32 weeks in the womb and 36 outside?

Are you serious?

A lot of people on this board have no idea how hard it is to see your child fighting a battle it cant win, your bible and holier than thy attitude is long overdue. A decision like this doesnt come easy and will keep the parents feel guilty for a long time to come, it was a no win situation, which turned into an even bigger nightmare. In the developed world doctors have a job that tries to save lives, but have the common sense too that some lives are not supposed to be lived. God doesnt provide painkillers and operations, doctors do. Doctors dont play god, they do what that imaginary creature fails to do.

4 ( +5 / -1 )

When doctors and others play God....

-2 ( +4 / -6 )

And it is true, the doctors could not possibly say that the baby was defected with a hundred percent surety.

-5 ( +2 / -7 )

The woman, I tend to think was more listening to what she would think were experts in the situation, the doctors. Yes, she should realize that what she was doing was murder, but the tune that is being playd wthin Australia would make that very hard to be heard. So that is why I question the doctors, and how could they possibly know for sure that the baby was ill. ANd then surely in their capability they would tend to offer the way of life, like techall suggests. Doctors are afterall a job that tries to save lives, right. Right you would think.(Especially if youre AUstralian)

-8 ( +1 / -9 )

That poor family.

3 ( +4 / -1 )

Doctors had advised the woman that one of the boys, whom she had already named, had a congenital heart defect that would require years of operations, if he survived at all

But could have possibly survived and with advances in medicine now and pediatric transplants, might have led a normal productive life.

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

Unbelievably sad.

2 ( +3 / -1 )

So they can tell one has a heart defect, but they cannot tell which one when it really counts?

And did the second baby die on its own or did they kill it? If they killed it, I sure hope they had it right that time! Would not be surprised to find they actually did kill the right baby the first time and the mix up was after!

And honestly, I cannot understand people in the first world. If the baby will need surgery to live, and the parents can't afford it, then just don't get the child the surgery! Sounds better than just killing it. And if you are going to kill it, what is the difference between 32 weeks in the womb and 36 outside?

Right now, there are kids all over the world with heart defects enjoying what little life they may have.

-8 ( +1 / -9 )

Wow! That's worse than a tragedy. I'm speachless right now.....how the....? What the....?

How can someone ever find peace when something like this happens? Unbalievable....

0 ( +3 / -3 )

I dont want to know, but I cant understand how you can even call the shot of that the baby would be defected.

-7 ( +1 / -8 )

Some people go into hospital and end up having the wrong limp removed, or instead of taking out a bad kidney they remove the good one. This mistakes can be avoided.

0 ( +3 / -3 )

Incredibly sad....

0 ( +1 / -1 )

I just cannot imagine what the parents must be going through. I ended up in hospital at 32 weeks on bedrest when I was pregnant with our twins. The thought of anything happening to them was terrifying....still is. All my condolences and prayers go put to the mother and father. RIP little ones.

1 ( +4 / -3 )

I think it's difficult to blame the hospitals or the doctor in this case. From certain viewpoints, one might even think that this is like a bit of karma at work. We all know and accept that abortion is a serious decision. While it certainly may be argued that it is too strong to call abortion murder, it must give us pause when events like this show us the fragility of human life and the beauty of parenthood.

-17 ( +1 / -18 )

How terrible. I hope she hits the hospital and the doctors very hard. This should never happen!

2 ( +4 / -2 )

Well, they sure won't get away with a bow and a "moushiwake arimasen" in Australia! This is indeed a terrible tragedy, and I hope at some point that the couple give it another try at some point in the future. The result of this is too sad, and I've no doubt the hospital will pay the price for their negligence.

1 ( +4 / -3 )

I feel deeply for them and the doctors that made the mistake.

3 ( +4 / -1 )

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