Zelenskyy to meet Biden, Harris as Ukraine pushes U.S. to loosen restrictions on long-range weapons

Ukraine has every right to strike deep into Russia given the nature of the glide bomb attacks Russia is so proud of.

His running mate, Sen. JD Vance, said in a recent interview with the “Shawn Ryan Show” that Trump's plan would include establishing a “demilitarized zone,” and Ukraine would not reclaim territory that Russia occupies and would agree not to join NATO.

How much do you want to bet this "plan" is that Ukraine retreats like Putin instructs. No point in including a Putin NATO demand either, as the only thing achievable is a ceasefire.

The Biden administration still is not convinced that it should give Ukraine the authority to launch long-range missiles deeper into Russia, and U.S. officials say they are seeking more detailed information about how Kyiv would use the weapons and how they fit into the broader strategy for the war.

The US knows that war with Russia would not be without serious consequences and are understandably reluctant to have every major city in the US and Europe wiped off the face of the earth just so Zelensky can slow down the unstoppable Russian advance and merely forestall the inevitable.

BanthuToday 07:02 am JST

The US knows that war with Russia would not be without serious consequences and are understandably reluctant to have every major city in the US and Europe wiped off the face of the earth

Yes, the important parts of Russia are in Europe according to some definitions.

just so Zelensky can slow down the unstoppable Russian advance and merely forestall the inevitable.

Nothing is unstoppable as long as there is the will to resist enslavement.

His running mate, Sen. JD Vance, said in a recent interview with the “Shawn Ryan Show” that Trump's plan would include establishing a “demilitarized zone,” and Ukraine would not reclaim territory that Russia occupies and would agree not to join NATO.

IOW the great capitulator would give Putin everything he demands with zero negotiation whatsoever.

Not mentioned here but was widely reported that Zelensky is going to share with all the people mentioned in the article what he has described as his "victory plan".

Russia's last set of negotiating principles were outlined back in June (Fact check: Swiss conference happened in mid-June, not July as article asserts).

Since then, the price has gone up.

Moscow is only going to talk if there is a dose of realism about the state of the conflict.

Think about it: they have Kyiv on the ropes and winter is around the corner.

Putin is in the driver's seat and will only settle on terms favourable to Moscow.

Doesn't matter whether it is Harris or Trump.

He will meet Trump too?

This is why it's good that Trump is not the current president. If he even took the time out from raging on social media to meet Zelenskyy, he'd have no idea what was going on, while claiming that he could resolve the entire issue (without of course providing details).

At least with adults in the White House, there's a chance for meaningful dialogue.

What I don't get is that Ukraine has shown, almost by itself, that the claims about Russia's supposedly amazing military are complete nonsense. If Ukraine could harness the power of actual militarily powerful countries, of which the USA is without question the most powerful. the damage they could inflict on Vatnikland would be magnified no end.

Course, Putin is probably willing to sacrifice every Russian man of military age (isn't that, like, 15-70 in Russia now?) to keep his delusions alive, but that's a separate issue to the one at hand.

Yes, he is going to share his "victory plan" with Biden, Harris and Trump.

That's what was reported about his trip previously unless things have changed.

He will meet Trump too?

Why would he? Trump's not the president. however much you want that to be true.

And Trump would sell out Ukraine to Putin faster than JD Vance could say "wow, a couch, let me at it!"

JJEToday 08:01 am JST

Not mentioned here but was widely reported that Zelensky is going to share with all the people mentioned in the article what he has described as his "victory plan".

Yes the only option for Ukraine is to secure its independence.

Russia's last set of negotiating principles were outlined back in June (Fact check: Swiss conference happened in mid-June, not July as article asserts).

Yes the Russian proposal was nonsense and the Swiss proposal was endorsed by 93 countries.

Since then, the price has gone up.

Only the Russian believes in land theft for peace.

Moscow is only going to talk if there is a dose of realism about the state of the conflict.

Think about it: they have Kyiv on the ropes and winter is around the corner.

Putin is in the driver's seat and will only settle on terms favourable to Moscow.

Doesn't matter whether it is Harris or Trump.

The reality is that Putin will not achieve unconditional surrender. Free people don't just roll over for savages.

BlacklabelToday 08:01 am JST

He will meet Trump too?

I believe he said he will send the peace plan to Surrender Trump.

IOW the great capitulator would give Putin everything he demands with zero negotiation whatsoever.

Nowhere anywhere near to what Churchill and the US gave away to the soviets after WW2.

So how would you feel about Zelensky if you found he would….let’s say go see Trump at Mar A Lago?

would you feel betrayed?

would you finally realize Harris isn’t gonna win?

so many emotions you would feel, no?

So how would you feel about Zelensky if you found he would….let’s say go see Trump at Mar A Lago?

If he chose to do that, that's his business.

I can't see why he would, but he (Zelenskyy) is by default going to be the most informed person on the situation, so if he thinks that visiting Trump is worthwhile, he'll do it.

Given Trump's absolute hard-on for Putin, it doesn't seem like a rational decision, but there may be other factors at play that nobody knows about.

TobleroneToday 08:08 am JST

IOW the great capitulator would give Putin everything he demands with zero negotiation whatsoever.

Nowhere anywhere near to what Churchill and the US gave away to the soviets after WW2.

There wasn't much choice there and we don't know what other wars Putin will start.

BlacklabelToday 08:08 am JST

So how would you feel about Zelensky if you found he would….let’s say go see Trump at Mar A Lago?

would you feel betrayed?

would you finally realize Harris isn’t gonna win?

so many emotions you would feel, no?

What you don't understand is that a patriot would do ANYTHING for their country to survive. Meeting with Zelenskyy would probably be illegal for Trump, though, under the Logan Act.

Zelenskyy is notably meeting separately with Harris, who is looking to succeed Biden.

One meeting with Harris would be enough for Zelensky to realize how completely out of her depth she is. I’ve no doubt he is now mortified at the prospect of her being president.

There wasn't much choice there 

Not true.

Read the article again; closely examine paragraphs 3 through 6.

Biden administration officials - at least some of them - are increasingly pessimistic about Ukraine's chances for a variety of reasons.

This means they have woken up, smelt the coffee and realized that Ukraine can't militarily achieve 1991 borders, let alone 2014 borders.

The ultimate irony here is Kyiv privately realized it cannot win militarily a long time ago, thus adopting a "hybrid-PR-war-strategy", in which they seek to convince the sponsors and the western public they actually can win.

"What you don't understand is that a patriot would do ANYTHING for their country to survive."

Just like Trump. The biggest patriot of all. Would do anything to Make America Great Again. You are lucky to have him ey.

The vatniks are really pouring out of the woodwork here and are in real panic mode. They must be pretty scared at the idea of Zelenskyy meeting Biden and Harris. If he can convince them that a more forceful approach towards Russia is justifiable, then we're going to see some fun and games.

They can continue to earn their (almost worthless) rubles for parroting lies on the net, but if the US decides to give Ukraine the weapons they need, then the scores of liquidated Russian soldiers will be visual poetry.

Take the gloves off - let Zelensky have what he wants...

Just this week we saw the Ukrainians launch a major attack on a Russian ammo depot that caused one of the largest explosion of the war...

https://www.newsweek.com/russia-tver-ukraine-drones-1955582

The Russians are floundering, Putin is ransacking his military leadership, and Kursk is still occupied...

Let the Ukrainians rout what's left of the Russian bear...

Just this week we saw the Ukrainians launch a major attack on a Russian ammo depot that caused one of the largest explosion of the war...

The article on here about that was a classic. The vatnik brigade were absolutely livid, and it was great to read. They had to fall back on the usual "but Ukraine is on the brink of absolute surrender (sotto voce) like it has been for the last six months apparently, and this site is so biased, why don't they report on Russian wins, mods, it's not faaaaaaair!"

U.S. defense officials have repeatedly argued that the long-range missiles are limited in number...

This is the real elephant in the room for the US isn't it. Pentagon has depleted its arsenals, particularly in certain types of platforms, in which only very limited numbers are produced annually (and it will take years to ramp up).

Meanwhile, they have to build up a reserve for a possible conflict with China. Plus the mid-east is a powder keg waiting to go off. Who knows what else could pop up.

He will meet Trump too?

No reason to.

"What I don't get is that Ukraine has shown, almost by itself, that the claims about Russia's supposedly amazing military are complete nonsense. If Ukraine could harness the power of actual militarily powerful countries, of which the USA is without question the most powerful. the damage they could inflict on Vatnikland would be magnified no end."

Quite possibly right, but Putin spelled out his response to that scenario a few weeks ago. "If you arm our enemies to enable deep strikes at us we can do the same and arm your enemies also. It is a two way street. " Is US leadership willing to accept such escalation and its consequences?

I think the goal is to hold the invader back and inflict as much damage as possible using long-range weapons (drones, western missiles, etc.). Attack weak points like Kursk. Force Russia to give the territory back to stop these attacks, so Ukraine won't need to use head on assaults to try and take it.

Biden administration officials - at least some of them - are increasingly pessimistic about Ukraine's chances for a variety of reasons.

This means they have woken up, smelt the coffee and realized that Ukraine can't militarily achieve 1991 borders, let alone 2014 borders.

The ultimate irony here is Kyiv privately realized it cannot win militarily a long time ago, thus adopting a "hybrid-PR-war-strategy", in which they seek to convince the sponsors and the western public they actually can win.

burgers and beers

"What you don't understand is that a patriot would do ANYTHING for their country to survive."

Just like Trump. The biggest patriot of all. Would do anything to Make America Great Again. You are lucky to have him ey.

ROFL. Trump is a patriot to Trump and Trump alone. He couldn't care less about America. And he couldn't care less about Ukraine.

President Trump illegally withheld congress money for Ukraine.

I think the goal is to hold the invader back and inflict as much damage as possible using long-range weapons (drones, western missiles, etc.). Attack weak points like Kursk. Force Russia to give the territory back to stop these attacks, so Ukraine won't need to use head on assaults to try and take it.

This is illusion.

"The vatnik brigade were absolutely livid, and it was great to read. They had to fall back on the usual "but Ukraine is on the brink of absolute surrender (sotto voce) like it has been for the last six months apparently, and this site is so biased, why don't they report on Russian wins, mods, it's not faaaaaaair!"

I don't think that Ukraine is on the brink. I think the wapps ( Washington propaganda peddler ) brigade could be right on this one and the Western media could be lying in reporting about Russia's relentless advance on the Donbas frontline. It wouldn't be the first time. Hmmm....who is more likely to be right on this, western media or wapps? Tough one.

burgers and beersToday  08:43 am JST

"What I don't get is that Ukraine has shown, almost by itself, that the claims about Russia's supposedly amazing military are complete nonsense. If Ukraine could harness the power of actual militarily powerful countries, of which the USA is without question the most powerful. the damage they could inflict on Vatnikland would be magnified no end."

Quite possibly right, but Putin spelled out his response to that scenario a few weeks ago. "If you arm our enemies to enable deep strikes at us we can do the same and arm your enemies also. It is a two way street. " Is US leadership willing to accept such escalation and its consequences?

Putin is all mouth and no trousers, as the evidence of the last two-plus years has shown. You can't believe that sacrificing huge numbers of soldiers, and then recruiting from among the absolute dregs of society (while tanking his economy) is some kind of master plan. If Russia's army was everything he claimed, they would have subdued Ukraine ages ago. Instead, Ukraine is leveraging technology with far more skill, causing considerable damage to infrastructure.

Even if (and I'm not saying it's impossible, but it's hard to tell among the propaganda wars) Russia eventually "takes" Ukraine, only the vatniks and the brainwashed portion of the Russian population will be willing to overlook what the economic and human (OK, Russian soldiers aren't human, but you get my point) costs were. There is no way Russia comes out of this looking good - apart from people it pays to say so, of course.

"ROFL. Trump is a patriot to Trump and Trump alone. He couldn't care less about America. "

Naah, Trump loves America. What a great patriot. When he becomes POTUS again he will do many great things for the American people and to keep US safe. Then you might finally see the light and learn to love him. lol.

Harris/Biden, Starmer/Lammy are truly deluded if appeasement can persuade President Putin Russian federation to withdraw from Ukraine sovereign territory, the Ukraine innocent civilian lives lost, men women children ruthlessly murdered raped slain.

To offer Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy, the long range missiles, the method to strike back at military targets deep inside Russia, then purely for political expediency to callously pull back from allowing full independent use is a shameful cowardly betrayal.

Pick and side and be done with it, Own it,

World War Two was not ended with the defeat of Hitler Nazi Germany, by sending in squadrons of brave fighter pilots then insisting they must have one arm tied behind there backs.

TobleroneToday 08:20 am JST

Zelenskyy is notably meeting separately with Harris, who is looking to succeed Biden.

One meeting with Harris would be enough for Zelensky to realize how completely out of her depth she is. I’ve no doubt he is now mortified at the prospect of her being president.

I mean the alternative is Mr. "I will surrender the war at any cost" Trump. Which would you prefer?

burgers and beers

"ROFL. Trump is a patriot to Trump and Trump alone. He couldn't care less about America. "

Naah, Trump loves America. What a great patriot.

Not sure if you are trolling or part of the cult.

When he becomes POTUS again he will do many great things for the American people and to keep US safe.

Yeah, yeah, like last time when he cared more about his reelection than looking after the Covid crisis.

Then you might finally see the light and learn to love him. lol.

Nope. I know a grifter when I see one.

burgers and beersToday 08:30 am JST

"What you don't understand is that a patriot would do ANYTHING for their country to survive."

Just like Trump. The biggest patriot of all. Would do anything to Make America Great Again. You are lucky to have him ey.

Yeah, if survival is tax cuts, inflation, and no allies, that could make sense.

Naah, Trump loves America. What a great patriot. When he becomes POTUS again he will do many great things for the American people and to keep US safe. Then you might finally see the light and learn to love him. lol.

What was that about me bringing up Trump all of the time?

Quite possibly right, but Putin spelled out his response to that scenario a few weeks ago. "If you arm our enemies to enable deep strikes at us we can do the same and arm your enemies also. It is a two way street. " Is US leadership willing to accept such escalation and its consequences?

It's a bluff to be called like all of Putin's red lines that have since been blown past.

Nowhere anywhere near to what Churchill and the US gave away to the soviets after WW2.

Which was a failure. Yes. Any capitulation would be.

Also, it'll likely happen within the first few weeks if he's elected. His presidency is 4 years. Plenty of capitulation time.

"What was that about me bringing up Trump all of the time?"

He is your favorite topic so just quoting him for you., isn't that what you said? :) Besides Trump is included in the article above so it is relevant unlike when you bring him up on unrelated threads.

"If you arm our enemies to enable deep strikes at us we can do the same and arm your enemies also. It is a two way street. " Is US leadership willing to accept such escalation and its consequences?.............It's a bluff to be called like all of Putin's red lines that have since been blown past."

Better leave the "calling it out" or not to properly qualified experts rather than those on JT, shall we?

No more restrictions!

No more limitations!

Hit those Russian marauders where it hurts them most, on their own turf!

To end this invasion by Putain more has to be done, not just by the US.

Negotiations won't work because that dictator in the Kremlin only understands the language of military power and superiority!

Ukraine prevails! (more than 900 days already)

I’ve no doubt he is now mortified at the prospect of her being president.

I mean the alternative is Mr. "I will surrender the war at any cost" Trump. Which would you prefer?"

Ending the war and bringing peace is not surrendering, despite pro war camp disagreeing. Also, since Putin endorses Harris, US patriots should stand with Trump unless supporting Putin's choice is the next in thing, is it.

I'm ok with giving Ukraine more weapons.

Ukraine prevails! (more than 900 days already)

BEST COMMENT here today.

irony off

UA as we knew is DONE for good.

chance to win over Russia zero dot zero.

Kiev junta is getting more desperate day by day.

Meeting with Zelenskyy would probably be illegal for Trump, though, under the Logan Act.

then tell Zelensky he can’t and he is only allowed to speak to the loser of the upcoming election, Harris and/or beach bum Biden.

I’m sure he will demand to speak to Trump.

burgers and beers

I’ve no doubt he is now mortified at the prospect of her being president.

I mean the alternative is Mr. "I will surrender the war at any cost" Trump. Which would you prefer?"

Ending the war and bringing peace is not surrendering, despite pro war camp disagreeing.

It is the way that Trump wants to do it. Trumps way of ending the war in Ukraine will not bring peace, so it's a waste of time.

Also, since Putin endorses Harris, US patriots should stand with Trump unless supporting Putin's choice is the next in thing, is it.

Putin understands sarcasm. I'm not sure you do.

burgers and beersToday 09:48 am JST

"What was that about me bringing up Trump all of the time?"

He is your favorite topic so just quoting him for you., isn't that what you said? :) Besides Trump is included in the article above so it is relevant unlike when you bring him up on unrelated threads.

So the only requirement is that Trump be broached once in the article? Pretty thin rationale. I prefer to remind everyone that Trump says millions have been killed by Putin's war.

"If you arm our enemies to enable deep strikes at us we can do the same and arm your enemies also. It is a two way street. " Is US leadership willing to accept such escalation and its consequences?.............It's a bluff to be called like all of Putin's red lines that have since been blown past."

Better leave the "calling it out" or not to properly qualified experts rather than those on JT, shall we?

Waving surrender flags had better be left to qualified experts, too.

Ending the war and bringing peace is not surrendering, despite pro war camp disagreeing.

It is when land that is rightfully yours is lost forever or your independence is lost forever. Both are demands of Herr Putin.

Also, since Putin endorses Harris, US patriots should stand with Trump unless supporting Putin's choice is the next in thing, is it.

Nice try. And then you feign ignorance when I bring up Trump.

2020hindsights

Trumps way of ending the war in Ukraine will not bring peace, so it's a waste of time.

PROVE IT

Trumps way of ending the war in Ukraine will not bring peace, so it's a waste of time.

Not to the Ukrainians it won't.

Trump is 0ready to fold to Putin faster than a piece of origami paper.

EastmannToday 10:40 am JST

2020hindsights

Trumps way of ending the war in Ukraine will not bring peace, so it's a waste of time.

PROVE IT

Eliminating Free Ukraine is not real peace. It is emboldening the insane madman.

EastmannToday  10:40 am JST

2020hindsights

Trumps way of ending the war in Ukraine will not bring peace, so it's a waste of time.

PROVE IT

He couldn't even provide a health care plan despite promising one for ages. What makes you think he can resolve a complex diplomatic / military problem? You might as well ask a five year old to explain the poincaré conjecture.

He couldn't even provide a health care plan despite promising one for ages.

Nine years. He first said his plan was coming "soon" in 2015.

Nine years later he has "concepts of a plan".

And the right is whining because they want to know Harris' policies? MMkay...

Yesterday, Putin said at one of the forums that Russia will produce ten times more different weapons. And they will do! So, gentlemen enemies from NATO, you will also have to speed up. Flooding in Europe??? Have people lost their homes? No, no! First, arm Ukraine to the teeth! Ukraine is above all:)

Putin said at one of the forums that Russia will produce ten times more different weapons.

With what? Putin has been recycling old weapons with duct tape for the past year, because they can't get new supplies in due to crippling sanctions.

Putin said at one of the forums that Russia will produce ten times more different weapons. 

Now let's give credit where it's due. This is probably within Russia's capabilities.

1) Toothpick

2) Empty vodka bottle

3) Brick

4) Rock

5) Bigger rock

6) Used razor blade

7) Frozen potato

8) Hardback copy of War and Peace

9) Another toothpick

10) Chair leg

Clarification:

It was reported that Zelensky intended/planned to visit Trump previously.

Whether that is scheduled or an idea and whether he will actually meet Trump, one can't be certain.

Trump hinted he may the other day.

Relevant to keep in mind they spoke on the phone back in July - widely reported.

With what? Putin has been recycling old weapons with duct tape for the past year, because they can't get new supplies in due to crippling sanctions.

He'll ask you what to make with :) Omniscient of ours you are :)

With what? Putin has been recycling old weapons with duct tape for the past year, because they can't get new supplies in due to crippling sanctions.

He'll ask you what to make with :) Omniscient of ours you are :)

Yeah, that probably scans better in the original Russian.

The demographic situation in Ukraine is absolutely catastrophic. There are practically no men left capable of fighting. A few days ago, a 15-year-old teenager was caught by military officials in Odessa. Beaten, but let go, because he is still 15. Well, the situation with the fact that there is not a single legally legitimate leader in the country of Ukraine cannot exist indefinitely either. The discontent of the people is growing, people are demanding elections. And elections are impossible without the lifting of martial law. So, think, think... Although, the toothpick idea is good. Some dude, you're cool!!!

Trump/Vance plan, as outlined in the final paragraph of the article, at least keeps touch with some form of common sense.

Firstly, it basically admits that this is a civil war-style conflict, with millions of Ukrainians rebelling against Kyiv, and respects their choice; not all peoples out there are ruled by their former capital (and hardly the first case). Dispensing with the primitive "good vs evil" narrative that simplifies the underlying complexities and causes of the conflict is an obvious prerequisite to solving it.

Secondly, it acknowledges the fact that Moscow will not tolerate, in any way, shape or form, a militarized NATO-aligned regime on the traditional invasion routes from Europe. This means strict neutrality is non-negotiable.

A good start but likely Putin will be inserting the final destination as he is behind the wheel.

The demographic situation in Ukraine is absolutely catastrophic. There are practically no men left capable of fighting.

That's what you guys were saying in 2022.

Your predictions don't seem very good. Didn't you think you were going to take Kyiv right away as well?

@Eastman,

questioning those more than 900 days?

Sure, maybe in your opinion it's still that 3-day-limited operation.

Trump/Vance plan, as outlined in the final paragraph of the article, at least keeps touch with some form of common sense.

The Trump/Vance plan is to fold to Putin like a samsung phone.

Zelensky prepares his entire repertoire to go ask Washington for more money...

https://www.tiktok.com/@somins.art/video/7319941522789616928

LOOOOOOL

Ukraine prevails! (more than 900 days already)

What a good joke, you could make a good duo with Zelensky... LOL

Meanwhile, TaiwanIsChina in the comments section...

https://tenor.com/es/view/dragontan-gif-24234219

LOOOOOOL

That's what you guys were saying in 2022.

No, in 2022 the situation was not catastrophic yet, don't make it up. By 2022, Crimea and part of Donbass with 8-9 mln people had left Ukraine. Most of the adequate (and not only adequate, but also those who were able to foresee the development of events in Ukraine) have already left the country. And it wasn't a catastrophe yet. During 900 days of the war, Ukraine lost millions. I see you don't have the brains to figure it out. Use your Basic English

PrimusinterToday 11:16 am JST

The demographic situation in Ukraine is absolutely catastrophic. There are practically no men left capable of fighting. A few days ago, a 15-year-old teenager was caught by military officials in Odessa. Beaten, but let go, because he is still 15. Well, the situation with the fact that there is not a single legally legitimate leader in the country of Ukraine cannot exist indefinitely either. The discontent of the people is growing, people are demanding elections. And elections are impossible without the lifting of martial law. So, think, think... Although, the toothpick idea is good. Some dude, you're cool!!!

Sources of discontent or nonsense. A majority in Ukraine still don't want to see any handing of land to Russia.

TokyoLivingToday 11:28 am JST

Meanwhile, TaiwanIsChina in the comments section...

https://tenor.com/es/view/dragontan-gif-24234219

LOOOOOOL

Oh look, it is the crying chinese child. That looks like TokyoLiving more than me.

Meeting with Zelenskyy would probably be illegal for Trump, though, under the Logan Act.

then tell Zelensky he can’t and he is only allowed to speak to the loser of the upcoming election, Harris and/or beach bum Biden.

I’m sure he will demand to speak to Trump.

Only if the Rikers Island Warden grants the visit...

That's what you guys were saying in 2022.

No, in 2022 the situation was not catastrophic yet, don't make it up.

And yet you were making the claims that Ukraine was out of men even at the end of 2022. So why should you have credibility now when you were wrong then?

I’ll laugh if Ukraine comes out of this war owning Kursk AND Crimea!

The Ukrainians have been effectively cutting Crimea off from resupply for the last few weeks.