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Zimbabwe: American lion killer's extradition being sought

53 Comments
By FARAI MUTSAKA

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Make an example of this bonehead. This kind of sick behaviour needs to be discouraged.

11 ( +12 / -1 )

Apparently, he has also previously been convicted for lying to federal agents about the location of where he killed a black bear.

I'm also amazed that a person in Minnesota is allowed to keep his licence to practice dentistry even after being convicted of a criminal offence involving dishonesty. How can his unsuspecting patients or the insurance companies he bills trust him?

11 ( +11 / -0 )

Someone is lyin', that's for sure.

To the pro-hunters out there: this was not food necessity, nor was it an attempt to demonstrate proficiency with a weapon. It was simply a human pathology. Let him serve as a warning.

9 ( +9 / -0 )

Palmer issued a statement saying he relied on his guides to ensure the hunt was legal

He obviously relied on no one to ensure the hunt was moral. To paraphrase Ricky Gervais, What must have happened to this dentist to make him want to kill a beautiful animal and then stand next to it smiling?

He is sick. I hope he gets extradited to Zimbabwe, found guilty (as he obviously is), fined more than his dentistry practice is worth and jailed for at least 15 years. That should be plenty of time to 'cure' him of his mental illness.

7 ( +9 / -2 )

I find it odd the outrage on the killing of this lion when minimal attention goes to the aborted baby body parts. Also very strange the POTUS comments on the lions candle but never a word on Kate Steinle.

This is a shame and as pointed out not very sporting. I'm no anti hunter, it actually has benefit on some species but the game needs to be used otherwise it's just a kill. Trophy kills are senseless. Then again, human encroachment culls are in the same category. Wildlife needs its territories and humans need to maintain those.

-10 ( +4 / -14 )

He is sick. I hope he gets extradited to Zimbabwe, found guilty (as he obviously is), fined more than his dentistry practice is worth and jailed for at least 15 years.

The only justice for this piece of human excrement would be to throw him in a closed compound with a hungry male adult lion. Sure, give him his cellphone so he can take a selfie if he manages to vanquish the beast in a fair fight.

It's time to call this crime what it is. Cecil was murdered.

4 ( +6 / -2 )

'This is a shame and as pointed out not very sporting.'

The expression 'blood sports' never ceases to get my back up. Stop using the word 'sport' or 'sporting' as if trophy hunting qualifies as anything approaching sport. Call it what it is - a sick, degenerate practice.

7 ( +9 / -2 )

Call it what it is - a sick, degenerate practice.

I call the hunting for trophy of an endangered species murder.

It's kind of disturbing to hear the extreme right ranting about foetuses on this thread when human beings are clearly themselves the cancer on this planet.

6 ( +8 / -2 )

MarkG: "I find it odd the outrage on the killing of this lion when minimal attention goes to the aborted baby body parts."

Quick question: is this a thread about aborted baby parts? So, why deflect?

I was going to say that he should lose his practice -- either being shut down or just flat-out shunned -- but beyond that I couldn't really see what punishment he could receive for being downright morally reprehensible, but it seems he has indeed lied in the past about a similar thing with a black bear. So, let him be extradited, if the coward ever comes out of hiding (I wonder if he likes being hunted?), and tried, and if they find guilty let him suffer the consequences. Those who led him on the expedition most certainly need to be punished to the full extent of the law as well.

2 ( +4 / -2 )

Cecil has a brother Jericho who is protecting his cubs so hopefully they'll survive from any attacks by rogue male lions.

What a waste of a beautiful animal.

6 ( +7 / -1 )

@smithinjapan... regarding your asinine comment to MarkG. It isn't deflection at all... it's a poignant finger-point to what morons hold of highest value. The death of a lion sparks more outrage than baby parts sold to the highest bidder. This is a CLEAR snapshot of what encompasses the Liberal mindset, which you defend... obviously... from the inside. A human life for that of an animal, as Amerika eats it's young. I wouldn't intentionally take the life of a bug... nor would I shed a tear over the loss of those that think like you.

-6 ( +3 / -9 )

The right wing in America certainly has a strange mindset: because abortion exists, we should kill lions. Can't wait for one of the GOP hopefuls to pick up on this meme.

Planned Parenthood charges for delivery of neonatal tissue at levels which cover their cost of preservation and delivery. Recent events make quite possible that the organization will halt this activity, which would cause great inconvenience to doctors and researchers striving to save and prolong human life. If you desire a ban on abortion, look to the Supreme Court. Just don't go out killing lions.

3 ( +4 / -1 )

The right wing in America certainly has a strange mindset: because abortion exists, we should kill lions.

One more insanity screamed from the GOP Asylum. Look at the rantings of that nut Ted Nugent. He's living proof that abortions are necessary, even at his age.

1 ( +4 / -3 )

The only justice for this piece of human excrement would be to throw him in a closed compound with a hungry male adult lion. Sure, give him his cellphone so he can take a selfie if he manages to vanquish the beast in a fair fight.

It's time to call this crime what it is. Cecil was murdered.

Agree 100%. This guy is not a "hunter". He pays outrageous sums of money to have others track, and in this case, lure, his prey into a killing zone. There is nothing sprorting about that. In addition, he is such a bad shot, Cecil had to suffer for nearly two days, before they shot him at close range. All so he can have another "big game trophy", for his "man cave", and, as another poster mentioned, another gratuitous selfie. Jimmel Kimmel was spot on the other night when he asked if it "is so hard for this guy to get a hard-on" that he needs to do this kind of thing.

4 ( +7 / -3 )

In the total US ban on ivory of any age, Obama made an exception and allowed trophy hunting to continue.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

'@smithinjapan... regarding your asinine comment to MarkG. It isn't deflection at all... it's a poignant finger-point to what morons hold of highest value. The death of a lion sparks more outrage than baby parts sold to the highest bidder. This is a CLEAR snapshot of what encompasses the Liberal mindset, which you defend... obviously... from the inside. A human life for that of an animal, as Amerika eats it's young. I wouldn't intentionally take the life of a bug... nor would I shed a tear over the loss of those that think like you.'

Stupendously irrelevant. Do you have any opinion on the killing of lions? I think it's wrong. What do you think?

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

MarkG: I find it odd the outrage on the killing of this lion when minimal attention goes to the aborted baby body parts. Also very strange the POTUS comments on the lions candle but never a word on Kate Steinle.

Did you hear someone say that and now you're repeating it?

4 ( +5 / -1 )

If only half a million Zimbabwans would shout out their disgust with Human Rights conditions & poverty under Mugabe- That would be NEWS!- As for this murderous nimrod, Extradite him!

2 ( +2 / -0 )

Walter James Palmer, the murderer of Cecil the lion, deserves prison just as ivory hunters who kill elephants.

What a disgusting human being, if this wretch can even be considered a human.

Zimbabwe might feed Palmer to the lions, but that would be cruel, the lions don't deserve such rancid meat. Right now the FBI should track and trap this despicable freak before he kills again for his sadistic pleasure.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

Based on reports today, Jericho has also been poached and killed. Feed this and other hunters to the lions. I hope this guy loses everything. Sick, deranged and vile.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

1: Agreed that a person already convicted of lying about previous poaching shouldn't be practicing medicine.

2: Agreed that a person who has broken foreign laws re:poaching should be extradited. At the very least he was too stupid/ignorant to realize what his paid trackers were doing.

Now, with that out of the way, some of the emotionally-driven savagery displayed in this thread is just as reprehensible as this incompetent "hunter's" antics. Tossing him into a lion cage? Don't we look down on the Romans for doing that to Christians?

@cleo

What must have happened to this dentist to make him want to kill a beautiful animal and then stand next to it >smiling?

Do you think polar bears are cute and fuzzy too? Lions and bears are predatory carnivores that CAN and WILL kill and eat you.

Men have a strong drive to enforce their will on the environment around them, usually through a combination of intellect and cunning, since we aren't the most physically-capable creatures on the planet. Pretty much all of civilization's progress is men figuring out ways to overcome nature. Sometimes it manifests in productive ways......like the invention of air conditioning.

I assume that this guy, as a dentist from Minnesota, lived a reasonably privileged and boring life and came to the (misguided) conclusion that challenging apex predators was his only outlet for enforcing his will on the world around him. But he couldn't even go about that properly, since it seems like he regularly "cheated" on his poaching (I don't want to call it hunting), and, as said, is such a bad shot that they had to track the lion for 40 hours before they finally killed it.

IMO, hunting Big Game should involve the following question: "Is there a chance, however minimal, that this thing could actually outsmart and kill me?" If the answer is no.....you're probably cheating.

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

@superlib, no way did MarkG actually come up with his rant by himself. Look at the comments on this story at the source, the Minneapolis Star Tribune, and you will see 5% parroting the same rubber baby buggy bumper nonsense. I guess thinking for themselves about wildlife poaching is too hard, so they have to obfuscate.

1 ( +1 / -0 )

I find it odd the outrage on the killing of this lion when minimal attention goes to the aborted baby body parts. Also very strange the POTUS comments on the lions candle but never a word on Kate Steinle.

This is a shame and as pointed out not very sporting. I'm no anti hunter, it actually has benefit on some species but the game needs to be used otherwise it's just a kill. Trophy kills are senseless. Then again, human encroachment culls are in the same category. Wildlife needs its territories and humans need to maintain those.

I totally agree. It just goes to show you how insane and delusional we as a society have become. I'm not sure if the killing of this beloved lion was intentional, premeditated or just pure coincidental, but you have in the US organizations like Planned Parenthood harvesting baby parts and all the while posing as something that they are evidently not an undercover group exposes them for what they really are and what they do and now they want to go after the people that made the video, but not the people that are doing this inexcusable act, but it's perfectly Ok to try to extradite this guy and possibly give him 15 years for killing a lion??? This is just complete madness gone totally amok!

Walter James Palmer, the murderer of Cecil the lion, deserves prison just as ivory hunters who kill elephants.

Perhaps, but 15 years? That's overkill. One year perhaps with the possibility of parole and some harsh stiff penalties should suffice.

What a disgusting human being, if this wretch can even be considered a human.

I think the act is more wretched than the person, we don't know anything about this person, none of us are perfect.

Zimbabwe might feed Palmer to the lions, but that would be cruel, the lions don't deserve such rancid meat. Right now the FBI should track and trap this despicable freak before he kills again for his sadistic pleasure.

This is just madness, getting the FBI involved in this. Once he's extradited, he should get a fair hearing, his side should be heard and the ruling and subsequent punishment should be based on the facts and NOT on emotion. Do I think he should be incarcerated, I do, however, people are getting so worked up over this and having their priorities all over the place is seriously frightening.

1 ( +5 / -4 )

What do you mean we don't know anything about the person? Palmer, besides getting busted for poaching in the past, had to pay off an ex-employee he sexually harrassed to the tune of six figures. You've never heard of a criminal record being accessible to the public? Now you know.

1 ( +3 / -2 )

While what Palmer did was certainly reprehensible the whole government of Zimbabwe is far worse. The idea that Palmer could get a fair trial is laughable. That will stop the extradition.

2 ( +3 / -1 )

Hunting down and killing animals that pose no threat, rather are faced with extinction, just for the fun of it, is not only cowardly, it is despicable.

1 ( +3 / -2 )

Hunting down and killing animals that pose no threat, rather are faced with extinction, just for the fun of it, is not only cowardly, it is despicable.

I wish I could give this post 100 thumbs-up. And in case it has not made the news there, every single one of the hunting/big game associations that Palmer was a member of, have booted him out. And the Animal Planet cable channel is running a special commercial stating how disgusted they are with the killing of Cecil.

-2 ( +3 / -5 )

Noble73-

Do you think polar bears are cute and fuzzy too? Lions and bears are predatory carnivores that CAN and WILL kill and eat you.

Cute and fuzzy? Who ever said anything about cute and fuzzy? But, beautiful? Yes, polar bears are beautiful.

Lions and polar bears are predatory creatures, but they will not kill me unless I stray or deliberately trespass on their territory. The dentist was in no danger of being killed and eaten by either a lion or a polar bear in Minnesota, so your 'but they are dangerous animals' argument holds no water. Though it is rather wet.

bass -

I'm not sure if the killing of this beloved lion was intentional, premeditated or just pure coincidental

He made the trip from the US to Africa, hired guides to lead him to his prey, armed himself and set out to lure the animal to where he could get a shot at it, went out again the next day to finish it off. There was nothing 'coincidental' about it. OF COURSE it was intentional. OF COURSE it was premeditated.

The sad thing is that the fuss is only because he killed the 'wrong' lion, not that the sad excuse for a human killed at all.

we don't know anything about this person

We know he gets his jollies from killing unsuspecting animals, posing beside their dead bodies with a big stupid grin on his face, then sending body parts back home as trophies. How is he any different from whoever it is in Kobe who is currently going around decapitating domestic cats?

people are getting so worked up over this and having their priorities all over the place is seriously frightening

As someone who has previously declared his own penchant for 'sport' killing, I'm not surprised you might feel uneasy.

Killing for the heck of it, whether it's a lion, polar bear, domestic cat or whatever, is SICK.

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

cleo

Lions and polar bears are predatory creatures, but they will not kill me unless I stray or deliberately trespass on their >territory.

Who decides where polar bear territory ends and human territory begins? The polar bears? No thank-you. http://www.peacockproductions.tv/specials/deadly-after-dark-polar-bear-invasion/

Killing for the heck of it, whether it's a lion, polar bear, domestic cat or whatever, is SICK.

So you've never used a fly swatter either, right? Oh, but those are ugly nuisance insects, so they don't deserve life like beautiful lions...

-1 ( +3 / -4 )

Who decides where polar bear territory ends and human territory begins? The polar bears?

Clutching at straws much? How far is it from Minnesota? And what relevance does it have to big-game trophy hunting by bored rich people who are under the illusion that paying to kill things makes up for their inadequately-sized reproductive equipment?

So you've never used a fly swatter either, right?

Followed by posing beside the dead body with an inane grin on my face, cutting off the head, sticking it on the wall and bragging to my friends about how brave I am?

No, not once. Ever.

But we're not talking about dealing with nuisance/dangerous animals who pose an immediate threat to human life or health, are we? We're talking about bored rich people who can find no better way to spend their time and money than to kill on a canned hunt. The fly equivalent would be a spoiled little brat pulling the wings off the fly just for the fun of it.

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

Cleo, bored rich people like Palmer also ensure the survival of species like lions and elephants. They support local businesses in countries where the local governments don't give a crap about preserving animals or their habitat.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

While not 'getting' hunting for sport on a very visceral level it is possible to understand and appreciate the economics involved. Even National Geographic acknowledges how much regulated hunting benefits wildlife and can include a conservation ethic if conducted properly..Without hunting dollars, the local populations would simply decimate the wildlife populations for food; however, because they don’t want to lose the hunting dollars, they view the game animals as a resource they can benefit from. Hunting is literally saving these wildlife populations. The locals have a vested financial interest in maintaining the game populations.

1 ( +2 / -1 )

@cleo

Clutching at straws much?

You regularly make totally erroneous statements and when called on your BS evade. YOU stated that apex predators don't pose a man-eater risk and act purely defensively. That's FALSE. Regularly weaving arguments around a collection of half-truths is intellectually dishonest.

that paying to kill things makes up for their inadequately-sized reproductive equipment?

Ah yes, the reflex argument of the unimaginative female: belittle the man's penis. Do you have data to support your assertion regarding Mr Palmer or just spouting libel?

0 ( +0 / -0 )

You regularly make totally erroneous statements

??

YOU stated that apex predators don't pose a man-eater risk and act purely defensively.

I stated no such thing. I said that the dentist was in no danger of being eaten by either a lion or a polar bear in Minnesota and therefore had no reason at all to go out in search of a lion to kill. If you feel that statement is erroneous, please explain your reasoning. I made no reference to predators acting defensively: that is a totally erroneous (dishonest?) statement on your part.

Regularly weaving arguments around a collection of half-truths is intellectually dishonest.

Don't do it, then. The argument that Palmer was justified in killing a lion because it is a dangerous predator isn't even a half-truth. Not only did he travel half way around the world and pay a stack of cash to get in shooting range, he used the carcass of another animal as bait to deliberately lure it out of a national park, where it was doing neither him nor anyone else any harm.

Apart from the lion, the killer dentist posed for pictures with animals he killed that were in no way 'predators', including herbivores like longhorn sheep, elk, buffalo, antelope and endangered rhino. he took his shirt off and posed topless for a photo with a leopard he'd killed. What's that all about?

the reflex argument of the unimaginative female: belittle the man's penis

In my experience it tends to be men who belittle other men's attributes and suffer anguish over their own; we ladies know that it isn't size that matters. Palmer the Killer Dentist used pictures of his dead 'trophies' to try and impress a barmaid; apparently he himself didn't feel his own studly attributes were sufficient to the purpose.

bored rich people like Palmer also ensure the survival of species like lions and elephants. They support local businesses in countries where the local governments don't give a crap about preserving animals or their habitat.

Real men shoot with cameras, not guns or bows and arrows.

0 ( +1 / -1 )

He made the trip from the US to Africa, hired guides to lead him to his prey, armed himself and set out to lure the animal to where he could get a shot at it, went out again the next day to finish it off. There was nothing 'coincidental' about it. OF COURSE it was intentional. OF COURSE it was premeditated.

But seriously, I hear a lot of animal activists that say that, but can ANYONE say that wasn't coincidental?

The sad thing is that the fuss is only because he killed the 'wrong' lion, not that the sad excuse for a human killed at all.

But doesn't he have that right to go hunting if he has a license and the country where he is doing the hunting allows it? To be honest, I don't see the allure with having animal heads hanging on the wall, but that is just MY own personal feelings, but again, putting aside the emotion, doesn't the guy have the right as a licensed hunter with the permission to hunt any animal that is NOT on an endangered list for the sport of it?

We know he gets his jollies from killing unsuspecting animals, posing beside their dead bodies with a big stupid grin on his face, then sending body parts back home as trophies.

That may be, but is that a crime?

How is he any different from whoever it is in Kobe who is currently going around decapitating domestic cats?

But now you are making an Apples and Oranges comparison. Killing cats in Japan is illegal and should be. Killing lions or other wild game if allowed is not a crime. Again, if this guy broke the law and if they gave the guy a year in prison and a hefty fine, I think that would suffice, but the animal activists want to hang this guy, want his blood. Actress Mia Farrow put this guys address on Facebook, seriously, what the hell is that? If I were that guy, I would put out her address. These people are nuts, if you take a step back and look at the madness, it's as bad as killing the lion. People have lost their minds trying to attack and harass this guy. People should allow the justice system to take its course and let it play out. but personally and physically attacking this guy and his workplace and giving out his address is nauseating and it's really showing how far down the drain we are going as a society. You don't justify bad behavior with more bad behavior and two wrongs don't make one right.

As someone who has previously declared his own penchant for 'sport' killing, I'm not surprised you might feel uneasy.

When I hunt, I hunt and the animal that I hunt is consumed, I use the meat. I don't hunt for the sheer fun of it. Also, I eat meat. I eat chicken, pork and beef. These animals are slaughtered as well. Either way, if I hunt the animal or a farmer takes the domestic animal that most of us in the world eat, the result is the same. Is that equally a crime? Because if we go by your argument, then none of us can eat any kind of meat, poultry or seafood. If you are a vegetarian or a vegan, I understand and totally respect that. My wife doesn't really like meat, if it were up to her, we would eat meat once a year, but I love my meat and whether I buy it at the market or go on the occasional hunt, I don't think as long as you consume the meat it should be a problem or that we can only be selectively outraged about the killing of certain animals.

Killing for the heck of it, whether it's a lion, polar bear, domestic cat or whatever, is SICK.

I agree and you won't get any arguments, disagreements or disputes from me about it.

-4 ( +1 / -5 )

bass, do you understand the difference between legality and morality? I'm guessing not.

Killing for the heck of it, whether it's a lion, polar bear, domestic cat or whatever, is SICK.

I agree and you won't get any arguments, disagreements or disputes from me about it.

The dentist killed for the heck of it, over and over, revelled in it, bragged about it, yet you defend him and his rights?

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

I think the Dentist should be sent extradited to Zimbabwe.

-1 ( +1 / -2 )

do you understand the difference between legality and morality? I'm guessing not.

I most certainly do, but what you think is moral another person might not think the same.

The dentist killed for the heck of it, over and over, revelled in it, bragged about it, yet you defend him and his rights?

Apparently, you just glossed over what I was saying earlier. I am not defending the man as far as him killing the lion, meaning, I wouldn't do such a thing for the sport or the fun of it unless I was going to eat it and I wouldn't, that's just not me, but if this guy was allowed to shot the animal and he was allowed to hunt, then he is within his rights, but what he feels or how he feels about an animal may be different from how you see and view how an animal should be treated, I'm not saying that you are wrong, not at all, but I think you need to see it from another perspective. I try to see it from the angle of an animal activist, but also as a hunter. The only thing that really got me angry is that people are trying to kill this guy, ruin his career and that's way too over the top and overkill and as a society, we shouldn't do that to anyone, right or wrong, otherwise, we just have complete and total anarchy.

That's all I am saying.

1 ( +3 / -2 )

I'm also a bit alarmed at the hysterical reaction to this story. "Man kills lion" wouldn't gain any headlines. I really wonder why people are advocating long prison sentences, business devastation etc for someone who at worst committed a minor offence.

Plus, in all the chest beating and one upmanship demanding harsh punishment, a few things get lost. First, the dentist's patients. By all accounts he is a skilled surgeon. Shut down his business, and where do they go? Second, the dentist's employees. They are innocent bystanders that have been put on the sidewalk by the cyber-lynching of their employer. Finally, his family. Should THEY be victimized too? I think not.

2 ( +3 / -1 )

Obviously this dentist is overcharging his patients if he can toss around that much cash to satisfy his ego and show off to childish hunting buddies.

0 ( +2 / -2 )

Shut down his business, and where do they go? Second, the dentist's employees. They are innocent bystanders that have been put on the sidewalk by the cyber-lynching of their employer. Finally, his family. Should THEY be victimized too? I think not.

That's the problem that I have with this story, you can be outraged, I do to a certain degree, but now this guy and most importantly his family and his employees are out of a job, out of business, how is this man going to survive. Mia Farrow has millions of dollars, she'll be fine, but this guys life is ruined and for what. When Mike Vick went to prison for the dog fighting scandal as he should have was given a second chance, he went to prison, he paid dearly and is working his way back up, but this time, everybody just mowed this guy down and NO one is thinking about the other lives that are connected to his life. For what do we have a justice system then for?

0 ( +2 / -2 )

@bass4funk

Palmer should be extradited. That being said, is there anyone, anywhere in the world, that believes the U.S. will actually honor the treaty? The American track record is consistent, and it isn't good: pretty much the only time the U.S. honors a treaty with anyone is when the U.S. wants something, not when it is something that someone is entitled to seek from them. Treaties, trade agreements with the US? Not really worth the paper they're written on. The extradition treaty with Zimbabwe? Oh.. you're worried about their human rights record and their justice system (which hasn't changed)? Then why on earth did the U.S. make an extradition treaty with Zimbabwe in the first place? Clearly, if Zimbabwe's human rights and justice systems are of concern to the point that extradition of an American citizen to Zimbabwe wouldn't be honored now, the U.S. entered into that treaty with no intention of ever honoring it–at least, not when the request is from, rather than to, Zimbabwe. Unpleasant reality check: Palmer will not be extradited to Zimbabwe, and not prosecuted in the U.S., this serial poacher will actually be protected by the U.S. It lacks integrity, it isn't right, it isn't just, but it is what will happen.

-2 ( +1 / -3 )

Obviously this dentist is overcharging his patients if he can toss around that much cash to satisfy his ego and show off to childish hunting buddies.

If his clients are willing to pay the price that he is charging, then there is no overcharging, there is just charging. Overcharging would be if he couldn't get clients because his rates were too high.

-1 ( +2 / -3 )

I am not defending the man as far as him killing the lion

Mmm, yes you are : doesn't he have that right to go hunting if he has a license and the country where he is doing the hunting allows it?.....is that a crime?... he is within his rights

I'm not saying that you are wrong, not at all, but I think you need to see it from another perspective.

You mean from the perspective of What fun it is to kill things and then pose beside them with an imbecilic grin on my face? Sorry, no can do. It's way off the scale of my understanding. If I were able to see things from that perspective, I would book myself into a mental hospital because I would hate myself if I were that kind of sick person.

Killing a lion, any lion, any animal, just for the fun of it, is morally despicable and the act of a bloodthirsty pervert, that rightly exposes the perpetrator to the vilification of society at large. I would not want any such piece of scum living in my neighbourhood or pretending to be an upstanding member of society. I would not want to support their sick way of life by paying for their services, or by selling my labour to them.

Killing Cecil the lion, a protected individual living in a national park animal sanctuary, and then trying to hide the fact by removing the collar, is a criminal act that deserves legally-sanctioned punishment. I hope sfjp330 is wrong, and that Palmer does get extradited to Zimbabwe. And I hope he gets to spend a long, long time there.

NO one is thinking about the other lives that are connected to his life

Either those other lives knew what he was and were happy with it (his wife is apparently also a 'hunter') in which case I have no sympathy for them, or they didn't know and now they do; they can heave a sigh of relief and get on with their lives in a more wholesome environment.

-3 ( +1 / -4 )

Perhaps a little time in an authentic African prison is just what Dr. Palmer should experience to satisfy his curiosity about exotic bow hunting safaris and the Dark Continent.

-1 ( +0 / -1 )

@Strangerland

If his clients are willing to pay the price that he is charging, then there is no overcharging, there is just charging. Overcharging would be if he couldn't get clients because his rates were too high.

Thank you for pedantically pointing that out. So I will rephrase to make my point clearer and suggest that this dentist tossing around such cash for sport hunting further shows that economic redistribution is a pressing matter.

1 ( +3 / -2 )

Mmm, yes you are : doesn't he have that right to go hunting if he has a license and the country where he is doing the hunting allows it?.....is that a crime?... he is within his rights

Condemning someone and recognizing a persons right are two entirely different things!

You mean from the perspective of What fun it is to kill things and then pose beside them with an imbecilic grin on my face? Sorry, no can do. It's way off the scale of my understanding. If I were able to see things from that perspective, I would book myself into a mental hospital because I would hate myself if I were that kind of sick person.

So what do you the courts to do with this guy? Execute him? Tar and feather him? Give him life without the possibility of parole? Should we gather up a lynch mob as well while we're at it? condemnation is one thing, but this is getting kind of scary with everyone harassing this guy and his family. Again, I was kind of disturbed by this, but I think what many people and particularly Hollywood has taken this entire thing to a totally different level.

Killing a lion, any lion, any animal, just for the fun of it, is morally despicable and the act of a bloodthirsty pervert, that rightly exposes the perpetrator to the vilification of society at large.

Fine, but that's your personal opinion which I do share, however, there are some people that would completely and totally disagree with that statement. You're never going to win. It's like the abortion issue, some people are for and some against it and you will NEVER persuade EITHER side of what is moral or immoral.

I would not want any such piece of scum living in my neighbourhood or pretending to be an upstanding member of society. I would not want to support their sick way of life by paying for their services, or by selling my labour to them.

And if such a person lived or would move into your neighborhood, you would harass them, gather up signatures to force this person to move or just outright shun him for doing something HE likes and is happy doing, minding his own business and not bothering anyone.

Either those other lives knew what he was and were happy with it (his wife is apparently also a 'hunter') in which case I have no sympathy for them, or they didn't know and now they do; they can heave a sigh of relief and get on with their lives in a more wholesome environment.

That was not a nice thing to say at all! Surely you don't mean that. Are you telling me that the life of an animal is greater than that of a human? Honestly, if someone murdered this guy over this incident, how would you feel? Me, personally, I think the guy should get a year in prison and pay whatever damages he caused regardless of the amount, make some kind of contribution to the WWF and make a commercial promoting the sanctuary and safety of these animals. That should be more than enough or you don't think so?

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Condemning someone and recognizing a persons right are two entirely different things!

Yes they are. I see you doing one but not the other.

So what do you the courts to do with this guy? Execute him? Tar and feather him? Give him life without the possibility of parole?

I would like to see him sent back to the country where he committed his crime, to be tried by the courts of that country, convicted (because he's guilty as hell) and subjected to the relevant punishments. That would probably include a huge fine (equivalent to the economic damage to ecotourism caused by the loss of a famous lion, plus expenses plus a punitive factor) and jail time. How long? Well, the two lowlifes who helped him bag his trophy apparently face sentences of around 10 years for poaching, and in this case I would say that what's good for the goose is good for the gander.

Then when he's out and back home, hopefully a reformed man, he should get psychiatric help to contain his psychotic killer lust.

there are some people that would completely and totally disagree with that statement.

So what. If they think it's perfectly OK and normal to want to kill just for the fun of it, they're as sick and despicable as Palmer.

you would harass them, gather up signatures to force this person to move or just outright shun him for doing something HE likes and is happy doing, minding his own business and not bothering anyone.

I certainly would not give him money to support his vile 'hobby'. I would certainly shun him. And let's get one thing straight, this sad apology of a man is NOT minding his own business, and he obviously IS bothering a lot of people. What if it were not lions, leopards and rhinos in Africa? What if it were cats in your neighbourhood? And don't go off again on 'one's legal and the other isn't'. I'm talking morality and character.

Are you telling me that the life of an animal is greater than that of a human? Honestly, if someone murdered this guy over this incident, how would you feel?

I've never suggested this loon should be killed, but if he were shot, left to suffer for 40 hours, then chased down and shot again, I do not think I would lose much sleep over it. As for family and friends who choose to associate with a psychopath - they know him and accept him for what he is, they deserve no sympathy.

I think the guy should get a year in prison

Not enough.

...and pay whatever damages he caused regardless of the amount,

Even as a rich dentist (whose practice is unlikely to be viable in the future), he does not have enough money to pay for the damage he has caused.

...make some kind of contribution to the WWF

If he's made to pay the appropriate fines and damages, there would be nothing left over to pay blood money to the WWF.

...and make a commercial promoting the sanctuary and safety of these animals.

Totally meaningless. Who would believe him?

That should be more than enough or you don't think so?

No, what you are suggesting is a mere slap on the wrist.

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bass4funkAUG. 04, 2015 - 07:35AM JSTHonestly, if someone murdered this guy over this incident, how would you feel? Me, personally, I think the guy should get a year in prison and pay whatever damages he caused regardless of the amount, make some kind of contribution to the WWF and make a commercial promoting the sanctuary and safety of these animals. That should be more than enough or you don't think so?

Your worried about extradition treaty with Zimbabwe? And your worried about their human rights record and their justice system? Too bad, he should've known about the rules before he went there.

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I've never suggested this loon should be killed, but if he were shot, left to suffer for 40 hours, then chased down and shot again, I do not think I would lose much sleep over it.

Which makes you no different than him.

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Which makes you no different than him.

Rubbish.

If I lose no sleep over the fact that a person like Myra Hindley died in prison after 36 years of incarceration, does that make me no different from a serial child killer?

If I lose no sleep over the fact that a person like Peter Sutcliffe will spend the rest of his days behind bars, does that make me no different from a serial killer of prostitutes?

If Palmer saw nothing wrong in his prey being subjected to terror, pain and horrific mutilation, he should see nothing amiss in experiencing the same himself. (He's already experiencing what it's like to be hunted. May it give him some insight, though I doubt it.) I would worry though at the mentality of the person who was able to carry out such a 'sentence'.

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Yes they are. I see you doing one but not the other.

No, I just want to be fair. You are getting way too emotional about this.

I would like to see him sent back to the country where he committed his crime, to be tried by the courts of that country, convicted (because he's guilty as hell) and subjected to the relevant punishments.

So let the justice system decide his fate, of course you are allowed convict opinion-wise, but that's all we can do.

That would probably include a huge fine (equivalent to the economic damage to ecotourism caused by the loss of a famous lion, plus expenses plus a punitive factor) and jail time. How long? Well, the two lowlifes who helped him bag his trophy apparently face sentences of around 10 years for poaching, and in this case I would say that what's good for the goose is good for the gander.

If he did indeed break the conservation laws and did illegal poaching and if the penalty is 10 years, by all means he should serve the sentence with the possibility of parole if he is sincere and promises contribute to the preservation of endangered wildlife as a condition of early release, provided he gets it.

Then when he's out and back home, hopefully a reformed man, he should get psychiatric help to contain his psychotic killer lust.

That's stretching it a bit, seriously.

So what. If they think it's perfectly OK and normal to want to kill just for the fun of it, they're as sick and despicable as Palmer.

In your opinion.

I certainly would not give him money to support his vile 'hobby'. I would certainly shun him. And let's get one thing straight, this sad apology of a man is NOT minding his own business, and he obviously IS bothering a lot of people.

Yes, I would agree with that, but there are people that would disagree.

What if it were not lions, leopards and rhinos in Africa? What if it were cats in your neighbourhood? And don't go off again on 'one's legal and the other isn't'. I'm talking morality and character.

Again, you may think it's immoral, some may not. You are not going to win on this issue because there are a lot of people that love to hunt and will always hunt, you can't change that. They will not be able to convince you nor you them.

I've never suggested this loon should be killed, but if he were shot, left to suffer for 40 hours, then chased down and shot again, I do not think I would lose much sleep over it. As for family and friends who choose to associate with a psychopath - they know him and accept him for what he is, they deserve no sympathy.

I think you're being overly harsh and insensitive, I don't believe you actually mean that.

Not enough.

So what would be an appropriate sentence. 3 years? 5, 10, 20 years? I think 1 year and a bunch of fines and as I outlined before should be a warning to ward off potential poachers from doing this kind of thing again.

Even as a rich dentist (whose practice is unlikely to be viable in the future), he does not have enough money to pay for the damage he has caused.

Wait a minute now, how do you know what kind of money this guy has? You don't know what he can or cannot afford, what house he has savings etc. No one has the right to take another persons livelihood away. The man has a family that he is responsible for and people don't have a right to sabotage his business and harass the man and his family. His wife and kids have absolutely nothing to do with his act. They should be completely off limits! I was totally beside myself when Mia Farrow put out this guys address. I would have sued her for damages which he still can do (and hopefully will do) who the heck does she think is doing something like that. Imagine someone came looking for the guy wanting to kill him, hurt him or do some other kind of bodily harm, he's not there, so they take it out on his family. No, sorry...this is just stupid. Arrest him, let him stand trial, give him his day in court and allow the justice system to do its job, but leave his family out of this.

If he's made to pay the appropriate fines and damages, there would be nothing left over to pay blood money to the WWF.

You don't know that. You are not working for the courts.

Totally meaningless. Who would believe him?

They don't have to. As long as he makes the effort, does his part and does everything to change his image, people can either see and feel he is sincere or not. That decision is left to the individual. I believe everyone deserves a second chance.

No, what you are suggesting is a mere slap on the wrist.

No, not at all, but I feel you want the guy to be lynched and I think that and all the animal activists are going way too far off the reservation (No pun intended)

Your worried about extradition treaty with Zimbabwe? And your worried about their human rights record and their justice system? Too bad, he should've known about the rules before he went there.

No, I just want the guy to receive a far trial, I want the justice system to prevail and whatever the outcome will be, accept it, leave his family alone and move on.

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he should serve the sentence with the possibility of parole

Why parole? What chance of 'parole' is there for all the animals he killed just for the fun of it?

...if he is sincere and promises contribute to the preservation of endangered wildlife as a condition of early release

We know he is not sincere. He has apologised for killing one particular lion that was protected, and is sorry for getting found out - not for the act of senseless killing. With nothing more than a slap on the wrist, we can expect him to continue with his psychotic ways. There are plenty of 'sport' hunters on the web proclaiming that so-called trophy hunts help preserve wildlife - he could just go on his merry way throwing money at 'guides' , taking potshots at animals and claiming he was doing it in the name of conservation.

you may think it's immoral, some may not. You are not going to win on this issue because there are a lot of people that love to hunt and will always hunt

It isn't a matter of winning or losing. I'm stating my opinion that people who kill for the fun of it, people who shoot down wildlife in order to mutilate the body and make an 'ornament' for their wall, are immoral. They are sick. They need psychiatric help.

I think you're being overly harsh and insensitive

Maybe you'd prefer me to be all soft and empathetic, like Palmer was on his many rampages through Africa and America. (/sarcasm off)

So what would be an appropriate sentence.

You're asking a question that has already been answered. If 10 years is appropriate for his local henchmen, then that is at least what he should also face.

The man has a family that he is responsible for and people don't have a right to sabotage his business...His wife and kids have absolutely nothing to do with his act.

His kids are adult, he is not responsible for them any more. His wife (another sick trophy hunter) is a grown woman and surely capable of looking after herself. Palmer is responsible financially for no one except himself, and he has shown himself to be totally immoral and irresponsible. It doesn't take much googling to find out that the $million houses (yes, that's plural) he shares with his wife are full of dead animal heads, so it would appear she shares his depravity.

Imagine someone came looking for the guy wanting to kill him, hurt him or do some other kind of bodily harm

Replace 'the guy' with 'the lion' and you have exactly what Palmer did, repeatedly, without even the excuse of a burning sense of revenge.

As long as he makes the effort, does his part and does everything to change his image

You mean like when Japanese executives bow before the cameras and mutter a trite 'sumimasen' and then everything is OK again? Yeah, I'm sure that would work....

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