To people who are putting thumbs down to me: please, tell me, how do you call that "social distance"? I am speechless.
-4 ( +3 / -7 )
@SJ: yeah, I got the feeling South Koreans don't care about their privacy at all. Look at this
I don't know why we need a "face pay" system... seriously, I don't even.
-1 ( +0 / -1 )
@The original wing: oh, maybe because I saw also situations way worse than that. Look at this pic:
"Market visitors in Taiwan Thursday April 9"
-6 ( +1 / -7 )
Look at the pic. That's how you do "social distance". Facepalm. But magically everything is good there...
-11 ( +0 / -11 )
"Phase two", how they call it in Italy, will be very slow and progressive. It will include the use of massive tracing system by app smartphones like those used in China and South Korea.
0 ( +0 / -0 )
What Reziger said isn't true, also patients who are suffering of other illnesses are included in the covid-19 death toll in Italy.
0 ( +0 / -0 )
@flowers: people are also in denial about what the "contact tracing" used in South Korea is actually, despite the article that I linked explains everything. The point is that how you said, if China uses this system, it's bad. If the same system is used in South Korea (whose government and society is anyway very different from a Western democracy, and strongly influenced by Confucianism), or in Singapore, which they forget conveniently being a totalitarian regime too, well this system is "good". These people's incoherence is so blatant and showed by their political bias.
-2 ( +0 / -2 )
@Fuzzy: contact tracing implied also the tracking system by Internet. Anyway I prefer honestly articles how this one, in terms of analysis.
It's about the US, but every Country should ask itself where it actually failed in these years, especially in terms of healthcare and social equality. I think valuations of this kind are more important than how good IT technology can be in a pandemic.
-5 ( +1 / -6 )
This virus is REALLY bad, it's a tragedy. But I dont think the main solution is in IT technologies, and this looks to be the message. I think the key is in a strong and well prepared healthcare system, and civic education about public hygienic norms, including the use of masks, basically not existing in Europe before this pandemia. The situation in Europe is particularly bad because of the cuts made in the healthcare systems for years, probably in Countries like South Korea and Taiwan the healthcare system is in a way better shape. But I often see way more emphasis about the role of internet in succeeding against the virus than in having a functional healthcare system.
-5 ( +2 / -7 )
Someone could also say that today it's impossible to go out without your smartphone, but how Luddite said, someone could remove the battery, go to many different places, and put the battery only when he needs to call someone or check his emails.
-6 ( +2 / -8 )
I'd like that people that praise these models told us how we are wrong when we say that there's the possibility that someone leaves the phones at home, or that the system have some bugs. But I guess they are not able to reply.
-6 ( +2 / -8 )
@Luddite: exactly, if someone leaves the phone at home, he can't be traced obviously. He can cheat the authorities, because the tracing system will say he is at home, while he can go to spread the virus everywhere. Plus, there's always the possibility that some bugs can give incorrect data. These articles, that look like huge advertising for this kind of technology, don't consider absolutely the most obvious limits of this "tracing system" thing. It's all rainbow and unicorns. If they want to trace people seriously, besides using smartphones and digital payments, maybe they should implant some microchips in our bodies...At this point, I wouldn't be surprised if this became an idea.
-7 ( +3 / -10 )
Bill Gates, a notorious epidemiologist, praised Taiwan's and other "tracing system Countries models". In Japan, CEOs like Son an Mikitani, other notorious epidemiologists, told what the government should do. When I said "epidemiologist", I was ironic, of course.
Countries like China and South Korea, are Countries where the society is almost completely cashless already. South Korea in particular. It looks like if your society is cashless and internet is widespread in your life, you can treat with coronavirus well. The Countries where IT technologies are less developed, and not because there's not the technical ability to do it, but because there is some resistance from the population, afraid for civil rights, privacy, tracing of any single payment, etc., are huge victims of this virus and failures. There's a lot of material for deep reflections...
-6 ( +4 / -10 )
Basically, all these articles do is saying mainly that contact tracing is the way, despite also common sense says that it's not so trustworthy (if people let their phones at home, they can't be tracked). We are in the situation where we have IT companies CEOs saying to us like the emergency should be handled (naturally with solutions that give huge advantages to their business). If all this isn't a bit...oh well.
-4 ( +2 / -6 )
Germany will buy millions of packs of Avigan:
Millions, uh? Interesting enough for a drug that they say is still being tested.
3 ( +4 / -1 )
@dougthehead13: Spain is the only Country in Europe that I see in a similar situation to Italy. Maybe also France, but not at the same level. I don't know exactly why in our Countries the virus is so aggressive. Honestly, it's not like the other European Countries reacted so fast or better. I believe we have also the strictest laws about lockdown. I wish you all the best.
8 ( +11 / -3 )
I don't get the thumbs down. You must prepare yourself for a very long period of limitations, it's a fact. But these limitations aren't the same in every Country, so maybe I should have said that how much they will be able to affect your life is obviously related to how much strict they will be.
-10 ( +4 / -14 )
The lockdown could be necessary, but remember that it can destroy people emotionally if it's done for real, not only like some kind of "voluntary social distance". So, prepare yourselves, especially if you live alone. You will experience some kind of freedom limitations and loneliness that you never tried in your Country, if you lived in a Western democracy.
-13 ( +6 / -19 )
1 ( +1 / -0 )
@tooltalk: yeah, Italy joined China's Silk Road Initiative. And? Are you implying we were "punished" by someone for that? I don't know it anymore.
1 ( +1 / -0 )
@tooltalk: in Pronto? Maybe you mean in Prato. I know only something really bad is happening in my Country, and we Italians are doing way more efforts and sacrifices than people did in S.Korea, Taiwan or Singapore. But this virus continues to spread highly anyway. There's something really weird and scary.
1 ( +1 / -0 )
@Flute: Sorry, but what you wrote didn't convince me. For example, about South Korea everyone is praising their model about "social distance", but seriously, how do you even call this "social distance"?
Here in Italy we have a real lockdown. Italy had tested people very fast too. I doubt in South Korea the virus was contained because of some tracking app and "social distance". Honestly I think the virus we have here and probably also in Spain isn't the same thing. It's apparently way more aggressive. I don't know why. I had read a nonsense theory always in a Korean newspaper by some doctor based in New York about the fact the strain of the virus in Italy and Iran was evolved because of the "traditions" in those Countries. It looked such a stupid theory honestly, not scientific at all. Which "traditions"? Sorry, but while I don't like conspiracy theories, I am reading and seeing so much absurdity lately to the extent I don't know what to think anymore.
1 ( +1 / -0 )
I get the feeling Italy was used like the "test" for every Western democracy. It's like if someone thought if a very social Country like Italy can stand months of lockdown and isolation, well also any other Western democracy can do it.
0 ( +0 / -0 )
@Yoshisan: if people look at the worldometers data, currently you can see how Italy tested way more people per capita than South Korea, despite the narrative that South Korea is testing basically everyone. I think there are many things about this virus and whole situation that we ordinary people don't know.
0 ( +1 / -1 )
@zones2surf: I found absurd how, since the beginning, the Korean (Chinese) tracking system was praised. I feel how here in the West they adopted the lockdown because they knew Western people would be way more scared by some kind of blatant tracking system. But I am sure the so called "phase 2", to come back to "normality", will involve some tracking system app, that people will accept way more easily after months of lockdown. The scary thing is that some guy on 4chan had predicted this situation with a post at the end of January, saying like Italy was the Country that will start the lockdown of the whole Country. You can say he probably wrote only some conspiracy theory that accidentally became true, but I still wonder how this was possible.
2 ( +2 / -0 )