carash comments

Yeah. Sometimes fashion gets a little out of hand. :)

ColAmerica - I agree with you a 100% about the understanding others and sticking with convictions. Don't get me wrong at all. Jesus would be the first to say, "It's okay".

As to younger generation, that's probably a combination of things. I do have to say though, the younger people I know tend to say, they don't like being judged. I think openness and understanding is the only way for everyone to achieve their goals.

To ColAmerica: Thank you very much for that! You just made my day. I know that it will be an interesting topic of debate at your church, but I just want to you to know, I, on behalf of the community, thank you. I know there may not be a point when we are fully accepted, but I know that when it comes right down to it, we are all humans looking for our way in this world. I wanted to also say that I have greatly appreciated speaking with you. On most forums, I fear the art of debate and discussion boils down to name calling, and I appreciate the fact that we have actually been able to speak with each other.

To kirakira25 and 1001tlc: Thank you both for your beautiful posts. I first decided to post in this forum in order to help educate, and I can rest easier knowing that I have.

To borscht, lipscombe: Thank you for complimenting ColAmerica and my debate. I do take that as a high compliment. I know you have both been on my "side" since the beginning, and I really appreciate your help.

Now, to Blue Tiger: First, let me say, I hope you read over my previous posts before you post again because I'm afraid I really don't like repeating myself.

Also, as to your questions and statements about Ayana forcing her beliefs on others, I just have one thing to say, "I don't get it". Yes, the world is mostly Christian (that's all sects combined including Catholic, Jehovah Witnesses, Mormons, Baptists, etc...), and while transsexuals are not viewed as ideal, most sects of Christianity will either support them or just state they don't quite approve. They don't actually persecute. Their are a few stories about transsexuals being chased out of churches and those were incidents mainly concerning a local church and not the whole sect. That being said, Christians shouldn't have a problem with transsexuals.

However, if you want me to go about this discussion a little differently, do you protest a film Tom Cruise is in, purely because he's a Scientologist? Or golf clubs Tigerwoods is selling purely because he is Buddhist?

The hell of it is, both of the arguments I just gave deal with religion, and you are objecting to a transsexual because she exists. You are saying the only way she is shoving the belief that transsexuals are okay and are people too, is by not wearing a burlap sack and living in a dark room. We exist. Get used to it because we are tired of hiding.

To ColAmerica: Sorry about that. I just got an e-mail stating that it wasn't related to the article. Go figure. I'm removing the links with pictures of people, so this one shouldn't be removed.

A good podcast with a LOT of information can be found here:

http://www.trans-ponder.com

Also, if you're interested in the whole process that we have to go through, check out the site below:

http://www.tsroadmap.com

If you want to see some of what we have had to endure, visit the transgender day of remembrance site below:

http://www.rememberingourdead.org

Addendum: To ColAmerica: Not the response I wanted, mind you, but at the very least, it's progress.

To Blue_Tiger: This may sound clichéd, but what is normal? Is normal going around in the wrong body while being clinically depressed? Is it expecting to be treated like a human being? Is it not getting equal rights? Is it having your children taken away from you? Is it being told by the courts that you are not a human being? Is it expecting to be able to get a job without facing discrimination?

The only thing that is not normal is the fact that we are not being treated like human beings. We are being treated as sub-human, and it is all caused by ignorance and bigotry. We are not trying to "convert" you to being transgendered. We are not trying to "corrupt" anyone (especially the children since quite a few of us have them). All we want is respect and to be treated as human beings.

To ColAmerica: Without actually meeting or looking for a LOT more information on transgender people (especially transsexuals), your response is about the best that can be expected given the circumstances.

To ColAmerica and borscht: Yes, it has been thought of before, and seriously, what do you think the consequences were? Take teenagers who hate their lives, not because they are outcast, but because they cannot stand what puberty is doing to them and then pump more testosterone into them? You are practically signing a death warrant. It has been done before and it was SEVERELY detrimental.

By the way, hormone therapy is from the beginning. The timeline goes like this: realization you need some form of help -> Go to a psychologist (continue counseling on through this) -> Get a letter -> Go to doctor -> Get physical then hormones (which you take for the rest of your life) -> Start saving for operations -> Go back to psychologist to get another letter -> Get letter from Doctor -> Go to surgeon -> Get operations done -> Continue on with your life. This is of course simplified, but I think it works.

As to taking medicine to "ease suffering", we do take medications to ease suffering. They're called estrogen and anti-androgens (testosterone blockers). We can stop taking anti-androgens if we get an orchiectomy (having the testicles surgically removed), and we can cut back a lot on the taking of the estrogen. As to taking it daily, that really depends on what form of it you use. I, personally, take estradiol which is by injection every three weeks.

Life is actually a LOT LESS difficult for you after the surgery. The main hard points are during your early transitioning phase (roughly 2 months to a year depending on the person). That is the time when you are worried you will be picked on and bullied, you have become a lot more emotional, and your worried about if people will call you out. However, once you get over that hump, life becomes a LOT easier. Honestly, if you saw Ayana walking down the street, and you didn't know in advance, would you be able to tell? You're probably going to start looking closer at the picture and try to pick out something, but in real life, you wouldn't notice, and you would be none the wiser.

Last (because I've been dreading this one), I want to talk about your father. I'm honestly very sad to hear you believe he held you in so little regard. If he actually did, then I'm even more sorry for you. Most of America is not transsexual or transgender in any way, shape, or form, but most of them don't have home lives like that. It's not a matter of being morally loose or liberal, that sounds more in the oppressive field. I know you probably want to jump up and defend your dad here, but seriously, if that is the feeling you got from him, I have to wonder about it. Hell, he may have been more laid back if he was on the anti-androgens.

Another question that is for all you cisgendered people out there (if you have to ask what cisgendered is, you probably are one). Seriously think about this one, would you have a sex change surgery for a million dollars? Think it over.

To ColAmerica: Okay! So they need to talk to a priest and find God. Maybe someone like the Anglican reverend, Rev Sarah Jones (transsexual) or the Baptist minister, Allyson Robinson (also transsexual). Faith and the human condition don't have to be at ends. I've made my peace with God, and there is no part of me that questions who or what I am. Maybe it was God's plan to make us this way. I believe the saying is "God moves in mysterious ways".

And the part about family and friends and support networks, you'd be amazed at how far reaching those are. We are often eventually accepted by our families, and our friends almost never seem to mind. It's more about opening the hearts and minds of others that I'm concerned with.

As to why we have to continue taking hormones, our bodies do not produce it naturally. Sure the ability to make testosterone or estrogen can be removed, but then we would have no hormones, so we must continue to take the hormones in order to continue our life and development.

I'm not meaning to sound like I'm picking at you. I just want you to know that faith and religion are not the main points of contention here. By waving that flag to keep up your argument, you are, in fact, inviting trouble. I appreciate your honesty, and I do not feel you are a bigot. If I did, I wouldn't be continuing to chat with you. I just feel you are a little misguided and ill-informed in this particular situation.

Hey ColAmerica, I have to agree with borscht on this one. While I did not need therapy to realize I was a transsexual, I still needed to go to a psychologist for three months before they would write me a letter for hormones. Then, I had to get a physical done once every six months. That, in combination with the cost of the hormones (which I have to take for the rest of my life), and saving up for surgery, doesn't leave much in the way of free money. Trust me, being a transsexual is not a cheap or easy task. That is one of the many reasons why I support her doing this. Money is hard to come by when you are hemorrhaging it left and right.

So, in a sense, she has done the three things you recommended she do. She has had therapy and counseling. She has also started on medications which I'm betting are greatly helping her after she was probably pretty depressed. The medication is called estrogen.

I'm afraid that you have run out of logical and otherwise reasons for why you disapprove of transsexuals. Now, we are getting to the meat of the issue. Yes, you are a straight, incredibly heterosexual man, however, there are some personal insecurities about changing one's body that you seem to have. I think this one makes you rather uncomfortable because you have a hard time finding any reason for why a "man" might want to become a woman. The truth of the matter is, you will never fully know or understand why we do it. All you can do is be secure in yourself and love and help others.

To Anotsusagami, thank you very much. I must agree with you an applaud your post (not just because you complimented me of course). It is a case of Xenophobia in most of the people, and that is why I do try to promote equal rights for all people, especially the transgender community who feel often left behind.

The one point I have to disagree with you somewhat on is the idea that transsexuals have historically been viewed with fear and malice. In the Native American culture, intersexed people and transgender people were often seen as Shaman and great miracle workers. In Rome, they were prized. In India, they are known as the hijras, and while, yes they do face discrimination, they are considered to have great powers. They are always present at funerals and births, and if they curse you, you are ostracized. Even the people of Papua New Guinea revere intersexed and transgender people.

It's when you start looking at gender as binary that suddenly we are seen as freaks and outcasts. And as we all know, nothing in nature is purely binary. Everyday, people are born with intersexed conditions, people are born with mismatched chromosomes (EX: XXY, XYY, XXX, etc...), people are born with a brain that develops differently than other people of the same sex.

If you're interested in reading a VERY good book about what the transgender community has to go through, I recommend "Transgender Rights". It's a bit of a dry read, but the information is incredibly enlightening.

Because we were having a more intellectual debate than "Ooh... Transsexuals are icky!"

To Richard the First, good answer. You're definitely okay in my book.

To northlondon, the reasons I gave for why SHE (not he/she) is promoting the book was not meant to have any direct correlation with the film. She gives the direct correlation at the end of the short article: "Everybody often feels they want to change their lives. But once it happens in reality, there is often something new to worry about. The film reminded me of my own transition.” As to why she was treated poorly on a show, I think that just proves that some people are ignorant everywhere you go.

To ColAmerica, now you are backing into a wall by turning to faith and religion in the New Testament on this one. Let's gets biblical.

First comment, you may turn to the Bible and point out the line about the body being a temple. By having our bodies being temples, they are temples for our soul. While we should not soil our temples with filth (although alcohol, smoking, drugs, caffeine, etc... runs rampant and is a lot worse than Hormone Replacement Therapy or any surgeries we may have), should we not also show our respect and love for God by changing the temple to reflect the soul. The temple in and of itself is not what's important here, what is important is what is inside the temple. The temple staying clean was meant to be a reference to the fact that the temple should reflect the soul and vice-versa. So by saying all of that, you see that changing ones temple to reflect the soul inside is perfectly acceptable.

Second, you probably do not view us as women (or the reverse being men), and you probably just view us as eunuchs. That being said, I'd like you to open your Bible to Matthew Chapter 19 verse 12. Let's all read along from the King James Version (what most fundamentalist Christians view as the only proper translation) shall we. Jesus: "For there are some eunuchs, which were so born from their mother's womb: and there are some eunuchs, which were made eunuchs of men: and there be eunuchs, which have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven's sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it." This means that Eunuch's get a free pass into Heaven, so I guess it's a shame there aren't more eunuchs. Then there might be more people in Heaven.

Now, I would like to point out that even in the ultimate church state country of Iran, where homosexuality will get you stoned to death and morality police roam the streets, transsexuality is accepted. Their view of it is, if you change a tree into a table, is it a sin? A rock into a sculpture? No! So if you change a man into a woman or a woman into a man, is it a sin? No. You are only helping them to achieve a greater destiny with it.

ColAmerica, yes, it is a very deep rooted depression. I cannot even begin to describe how it feels, but thankfully, I did not submit to it. After starting on Hormone Replacement Therapy, I began to feel much better.

To RichardTheFirst, quick question in the "wouldn't wish it on worst enemy" statement, are you implying that there is something inherently wrong with transsexualism, or are you implying that the depression and culture make it harder to live in?

Oh! Almost forgot! As to why she's qualified for this, she's a model in Japan and wrote out her autobiography which is a hit over there. I hope they release it here as well.

Well, ColAmerica, while I definitely do not like your views AT ALL, I do definitely have respect for you. You seem well versed and rather eloquent. And while you insult transgendered people everywhere, you are not insulting to the forum posters.

That being said, I grew up with several good influences and much guidance. I went to church every Sunday. My father did not work on the weekends, and he took me out to do all the traditional "father son bonding" things. That argument just doesn't hold water. It's not a childhood influence or anything of that nature that makes me a transsexual. It's the fact that I am who I am, and that person is a transsexual.

There are many studies coming out more recently that point out that transsexuality is biological. I know no one here takes stuff at face value, so I'm including a link below to it. Also, one of the very first things that the fascinating book "Brain Sex" says is that gender identity is not a choice. A good book and great read.

Link to a study: http://jcem.endojournals.org/cgi/content/full/85/5/2034

As to why there are not any plastic surgeons who do the surgeries in your area, that is a simple law of supply and demand. Many transsexuals go to Thailand for their surgery because it is much cheaper. Many travel to different cities in the United States for an experienced doctor. Not very many want to be guinea pig for a doctor just learning the trade. Besides, most transsexuals don't want to out themselves in the area where they live and work for fear of persecution.

Here's one to chew over, what would you do if your child, your own flesh and blood, came out as a transsexual and began under going treatment? Keep in mind that roughly 50% of all transsexuals who never receive any treatment or therapy by the age of 20 commit suicide.

Wow! There is a LOT of ignorance flying here.

First, to ColAmerica, I cannot even begin to describe how wrong you are on just about everything you've said. As a transsexual myself, I have a pretty good understanding of how Ayana must feel, and you have no idea how much it hurts just reading what you have said. We are not freaks. We are human beings, and in America, I believe the it is life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. We (transgender individuals) strive to achieve our bliss and happiness in a world that treats us poorly because of ignorance like the kind you are spewing. The worst part of it is, you think you are speaking for most people! Most people aren't like you. People are (usually) kind and caring individuals. People like you are the reason why people go "stealth" (they disappear once they can fully pass in public and never let it be known). Let me ask you this question, if you woke up one day in a body of the opposite sex, what would you do? Don't just spout out an answer like, "Diddle myself". Seriously think about it.

As to why Ayana is promoting this movie, that's easy. First, SHE is popular in Japan. Second, it's an emotional story about change that a person is going through, and SHE can relate.

To clarify the situation (and so nobody tries playing these cards later), I was never abused, molested, or even raised in a liberal environment. My family would not let me play with dolls or anything overly feminine. I had never even met a transsexual (at least that I was aware of) until I hit 23. I always felt like I should have been born female. This wasn't a wake up one day and go "Hey! I wanna be a girl!" This was a serious decision. And before you even think of going there, I'm not doing this for a guy. I'm not into men, and I'm definitely not doing it to "diddle myself".

Thank you.