Cicada comments

kinniku:

In his recent post Tigermoth wrote:

The 6 million number will always be in dispute

and

there are few events in history of its equal.

These statements appeared contradictory to me, but I suggested:

go ahead and tell us specifically what events you have in mind.

Now, if Tigermoth does not want to provide specifics, that is fine with me.

You, on the other hand, are adding nothing to the discussion here. In your last post you once again rudely wrote:

Seriously, do you want me to recommend a reading primer for you?

So once again I will recommend that you (for your own good) refrain from personal attacks, distortions of others' posts, and ill-natured remarks such as these. Thank you.

ratpack:

I thought it was common knowledge that the real owners of Nova were the yakuza. Very easy way to clean money...

Yes, many guys would be told to sign up, never show up for lessons, and take the refund, or not even bother with the refund, since it's Yamaguchi money anyway. NOVA was a good money laundering front.

klein2

he would use their subsidiary companies to buy furniture and indoor plants at incredibly inflated prices.

Yet another scheme to launder money. Who knows just how many schemes they had in play?

forcibly confining Nozomu Sahashi, 58, former president of English conversation school chain Nova Corporation

Did he take money from them, or are they worried he may be talking too much? Interesting.

kinniku:

that Tigermoth was not saying the the number was not based on any historical reality. He was just suggesting that the number is less important than the suffering of that number of people.

Tigermoth, whom I was addressing (not you) wrote:

The 6 million number will always be in dispute, but in the context of human suffering and cold-blooded murder there are few events in history of its equal.

and I responded by pointing out Tigermoth (by his own admission) is not in a position to make those assertions about how other genocides compare. But I asked for the specifics of his assertions -- something more than emotive remarks.

Now you say "the number is less important than the suffering of that number of people" but that can be said for any number of other genocides as well. Therefore, the Tigermoth statement "there are few events in history of its equal" is without any basis.

I don't know about Tigermoth, but I suggest you go first

I'm not the one who made any claim about how many genocides in history can compare to that in WWII.

Again the trouble with reading and phonics. Do you need a good internet link to a phonics site?You are showing your true colors. It is obvious, even if you blindly choose...

I've grown tired of your repeated personal attacks on this forum. As I said in another thread, they only succeed in making your case less persuasive.

kinniku:

you have falsely suggested in other conversations that the numbers killed do not have any basis in historical fact... no matter what name you use when you post...

No, I have not discussed that. You are confusing me with other posters.

I made analogies with other genocides, and so if I am comparing genocides it is obvious that I consider "the holocaust" a genocide, but you falsely claimed I do not consider it a genocide, and have not even bothered to apologize, but continue with your baiting.

I do wish you would stick to historical fact and refrain from unfair trashing of other posters who do not share your views in every respect. You only succeed in making your case much less persuasive to any careful reader.

kinniku:

Well, you certainly seemed to be making an attempt to lessen the horror

If this is what you think, then why is it that you instead falsely claimed I don't

seem to consider what the Nazis did to the people in the camps genocide

That was deliberate distortion on your part. Not a tactic with much persuasive power.

flammenwerfer: Thanks for providing alternate photo. I agree it's a much better photo to show the overall design of tatoo.

aizoyurei:

The same stupid argument can be used for anyone with beauty or whatever...."when they are older they are going to be ugly.........." WHAT AN EPIPHANY!!!

Yes, these people are criticizing the girl because her skin will sag after many years, which has nothing to to with tatoos. I'll admit being surprised at such a ridiculous way of thinking. One could just as easily look at someone without tatoos, and say "gosh, after 40 years, when she is really wrinkled and sagging, she is going to regret not having tattoos". lol

kinniku:

this is obvious because neither of you seem to consider what the Nazis did to the people in the camps genocide. Go back and study some reading and phonics...

I'll thank you not to put words in my mouth. I have never stated that the Jews were not subjected to genocide, so I suggest YOU study some more phonics, if that's what you think it takes to read with comprehension and to digest the logic of what is set forth.

Moderator: Readers, we understand this is an emotionally charged topic, but if any of you wish to continue posting here, then you must conduct yourselves in a civil manner.

tigermoth:

The 6 million number will always be in dispute, but in the context of human suffering and cold-blooded murder there are few events in history of its equal.

Are you aware of the nonsensicality of your statement? First off, you admit that the number is not based on any historical reality, and yet yougo on to make the extraordinarily insensitive statement that their have been no other atrocities equal to this one. I would suggest that if you want to make such a statement, you first ascertain exactly how many were killed. Oh, but I forgot, it's illegal to discuss that!

Still, you confidently insist:

there are few events in history of its equal.

Since you seem to know of the few equal events, why don't you list them for us? Shouldn't be so much trouble, since there are so few. You are the one claiming that there are only a few events equalling "the holocaust", so go ahead and tell us specifically what events you have in mind.

kinniku:

How is the CONTENT of my post mistaken in any way?

I think if you observe the phonics and reading rules you sometimes loudly espouse, you will notice that I did not claim your posts were mistaken. I called them facile.

Clearly Hosny lost the job due to Jewish objections, but you have constructed a facade of argumentation pretending that these are not Jewish objections. Maybe some others find your repetitious circular reasoning persuasive, but I do not.

It’s good for a laugh, as is so much of “Capitalism.”

Regardless of Moore's personal philosophy, the main point is how much reality does his documentary represent? The author comes up with nothing to dispute the specific observations of Moore. Very poor writing and analysis, and obvious bias.

kinniku:

it would not be religion of the objectors but the CONTENT that would cause the person to lose their job.

Yes, I see, just as it is not your religion but the CONTENT of your posts that makes your arguments so facile.

The simple fact is that Jewish opposition prevented Hosny from getting the position. Why twist yourself into contortions trying to show otherwise?

yabits:

If it's good enough for our military vets and elderly, it's good enough for everyone else.

Exactly.

sarge:

"A bad investment" Yeah? They're probably richer than you, so I guess they probably know something you don't know about investments.

Is this an example of your typical argumenation? If so, you are truly in the league of someone like Palin. You know nothing about my wealth, and can only be assuming that I am not as well endowed as the idiots who paid for Palin to speak. Do you assume that all who post on this forum are as financially weak as you? I'd recommend you stick to argumentation based on facts, not on personal fantasy.

sabiwabi:

And they did not just set up a home within Palestine, they stole practically all the best land and left only a few scattered pieces of land for the "non-Jewish communities", and they control all the borders.

This is true, but you are being too kind or circumspect. What the Israeilis are doing is nothing short of genocide, deliberately hoping to wipe out the Palestinians by various means. And when the Palestinians resist with their home-made rockets and whatnot, they are called "terrorists".

How ironic that it is illegal to deny that the Jews were targeted for genocide, while yet the Jews are now doing the same thing to the Palestinians.

“The greatest threat facing the world today is the marriage between religious fanaticism and the weapons of mass destruction,” he warned.

Oh, no. Not WMD again.

The most urgent challenge facing the U.N. is to prevent “the tyrants of Tehran from acquiring nuclear weapons,” he said.

An even more urgent challenge is to take them away from Israel.

If President Ahmadinejad had insisted that the American genocide of native Americans (Indians) never took place, how many people would be objecting so emotionally?

It is not against the law to deny that Americans deliberately set out to slaughter and decimate the Indians. Indeed, ordinary Americans are encouraged to think that this is not the case! Yet the genocide is documented and seemingly "undeniable".

So why the big fuss when Ahmadinejad expresses his opinion regarding some other slaughter? Why the laws prohibiting dissenting views?

There's no consistency here. And yes, that is suspicious to many.

wikikibeach:

where investors and bankers are paying to hear her speak.

A bad investment.

molenir:

Although at times with Muslim extremism, its very hard to do.

And why do you think it would be easy to do with Jewish extremism?

grafton:

If I then failed to get that job because many, many Muslims objected to what I had said would I be right to say I had lost the job because of a Muslim conspiracy?

Yes, of course. You would have lost the job due to Muslim objections, just as Hosny did not get his job due to Jewish objections.

Naturally, there would be people blabbering that the religon had nothing to do with it, only the CONTENT, but clearly that's not the case.

Thank you for the clarifying analogy.

The same terrorists, who by the way, came onto American soil and flew planes into our buildings

Under the direction of your own government.

Why is it that you need to point fingers, when your President is exhorting you not to point them?

What planet do we live on where America is the SOLE CAUSE of everything bad that's happened in the last century?

It's called Earth.

Obama's point, it seems to me, is that people need to stop doing what many of you are doing right now-- pointing fingers.

How convenient -- cause all manner of chaos, turmoil, suffering and disaster -- and then preach about how people should not point fingers.

kinniku:

He lost his bid because of the content of the opposition. NOT because some Jewish people were among the opposing voices...

This is playing a game of semantics. More plainly speaking, he lost his bid because of the content of the Jewish opposition. You seem determined to claim that there was significant non-Jewish opposition, but you provide no specifics. What significant non-Jewish oppositon was there? (more significant than any opposition to Bokova). None. That is indeed why

Hosni was cited as a favorite for months before the election

kinniku;

Perhaps you could be a bit more specific about these 'other quarters' that opposed Irina Bokova. Why did they opposed her? I can't seem to find any reason why they would specifically oppose her.

If no one opposed her, then it was unanimous, eh? Are you saying that no one opposed Irina Bokova?

If so, then why is opposition to Mr. Hosny an issue?

Read the article, and you see that opposition to Irina Bokova (preference for others) was quite strong, which is why they needed to get other candidates out.

While Hosni was cited as a favorite for months before the election, Bokova gained ground at the last minute as other candidates dropped out

No one really cares who is in charge of UNESCO. The best thing would be for UNESCO to be dissolved -- that would be a great end to a stupid argument over whether or not Jews will let critics of Israel be in charge of the UNESCO farce.

kinniku:

Again, it is clear you [sabiwabi] would sit down smiling and share a meal with the devil himself if he would only bad-mouth Jews or Israel.

No, what is clear is that you feel the need of resorting to ad hominem attacks because your arguments fall short.

This is NOT a matter of Jews, some or all, it is a matter regarding a man, Farouk Hosny...

Nonsense. It is a matter of one man losing his bid for a job because of Jewish opposition. And I say that non-judgementally. It could be they are right that he is not fit for the job. But the attempt to hide the fact that the opposition was from Jewish quarters can only diminish your credibility.

Potsu:

Are they trying to lose the Olympics ?

Yes. This was the work of people who are opposed to Olympics in Tokyo. Now even Mickey Mouse cannot save the day.

Palin left office in part because of the toll of multiple ethics complaints filed against her. Almost all of the complaints were dismissed, but she says she amassed more than $500,000 in legal fees.

In other words, not all of ethics complaints were dismissed. My, what an effort it was to write up a sympathetic article like this for this doltish wannabe has-been.

zurcronium:

Many people walked out on her speech in disgust apparently.

Why would anyone even attend?

Opposition came from other quarters as well.

Well, yes, but the other candidate also faced "opposition from other quarters". The decisive opposition to Farouk Hosny came from a select group of influential Jews.

Not that it matters who is in charge of the UNESCO farce anyway.

Blue_Tiger:

So long as the Japanese Government and Media continues with fear mongering and showing people that there really is no hope for anything, suicides will continue.

Good point. The government promotes suicide as a cost-saving measure. But JR would like people to kill themselves away from their tracks.

So long as companies and employers continue to demand so much from their workers with so little in return, suicide will always be seen as the way out.

Companies also benefit from suicides, as long as they are not held liable.

LFRagain:

Are you trying to argue...

No, I'm not making any of those arguments. I simply pointed out that in many places it is illegal to hold those views regarding "the holocaust", whereas it is not illegal to hold contrary views regarding other genocides and massacres. This is a simple fact, not an argument.

Or are you trying to argue that it did happen, but it's no greater a tragedy than, say, the Rwanda Genocide?... In Rwanda alone, 800,000 to 1 million people were killed in 100 days.The Nazis had seven years to accomplish what they did.

I'm not "arguing", but if you are a Rwandan affected by the genocide in Rwanda, then that tragedy is far greater than any other. Also, if one judges by sheer ferocity of killing, "the holocaust" is less horrific than the killing was in Rwanda, as you essentially pointed out with the comparison of an efficiency of 100 days versus 7 years.

And somehow, 6 million Jews killed in a war that killed 70 million people is difficult for you to accept.

Well, you've misunderstood me, I have no problem accepting that, though others do dispute it.

I would muse that the death of 1 million Rwandans in circumstances that were not a war killing 70 million others could be another factor making that genocide more horrific than "the holocaust".

But my only point is that there are no laws preventing people from expressing dissenting views with regard to other slaughters, but there are laws that will punish people for disputing details of the Nazi behavior.

“I was first stunned by the odor when we opened the entrance door. I guess it must be raw kitchen garbage, but it was a sour smell and some of our men were covering their noses with their hands.”

Guesswork in such an important case !!?? You should be ashamed. Get back to us when you can tell us exactly what was causing the smell.

LFRagain:

There hasn't been a war before or since that involved the level of destruction and death that the world saw in Europe and Asia at that time...

But we are not talking about the nature of the war -- we are talking about the nature of the genocide or slaughter. And there have been plenty of episodes equalling or surpassing the Nazi efficiency, most notable Ruanda and Cambodia.

In Ruanda, far more people were slaughtered per day then by the Nazis. Cambodia -- you have seen the piles of human remains, I suppose. But you think that does not bear comparison with what happened to the Jews?