Hansaram comments

Posted in: Japan urges China not to focus on 'unfortunate history' See in context

@Kazuaki Shimazaki

Japanese version of what? The Lytton report? I read it in English before writing the above. I'm referring to Triring post, not yours.

In this one, the Chinese can only blame themselves for having a Boxer Rebellion and then losing. So you are saying because Chinese is weak and therefore, Japan has the right to occupy China? In that case, if modern day China go war to Japan and conquer Japan, then their rule is justify and China is not war aggressor then. China occupation on Tibet is not China fault but Tibet for being weak. That just how pathetic your logic is. Sorry, but Japan is still the war aggressor for the entire thing.

Blackmail generally involves using threats of exposure. Here are the facts of life. There are extremely few agreements in the world where the two sides are of equal strength, and because of this, the lines the agreement fall on will depend on the relative strength of the two sides. But a deal is still a deal. The concept of the "unequal treaty" really is only in China, and nevertheless is not an excuse to not follow it.

Blackmail is exactly what the Japanese did. Japan is stronger and use that position to make China into submitting to their demand. There's no reason to follow that treaty and China action is justified. Your logic and that is you use because Japan is stronger, therefore, it make sense to everyone to listen to them. How about if modern day China flex it muscle towards Japan even further and make Japan sign treaties according to what China want.

From the Japanese side, what seemed to have gotten Cai Gongshi killed was that some Chinese troops chose to see fit to fire from the same building he happened to be in. Needless to say, the building was immediately counterattacked and searched. Apparently, he was taken as a plainclothes soldier and killed. As for the whole slicing nose and ears part, that was denied, and indeed may have been a tack on by the Chinese - after all, their people sliced up some Japanese civvies so badly one of the photos from that time became a "Nanking photo", and this may have been an attempt to shove some blame back onto the Japanese.

As for those Japanese killed, in the sake of fairness, there have been claims (even from that time) they are opium sellers and their killers were not from the Army. OK, but sellers must have buyers. Further, they were killed just as the Chinese Army showed up. If we accept the claim that these guys are always hated, it would be rather coincidental for them to decide to attack just as more government authority just showed at the door. It would be like you deciding to execute the killing of your hated victim just as the police forces in your region was doubled.

Source for this claim please? Preferably not Japanese source.

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Posted in: Japan urges China not to focus on 'unfortunate history' See in context

@Seiharinokaze

In what way that Great Britain and China undermined them to the point Japan invade China?

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Posted in: Japan urges China not to focus on 'unfortunate history' See in context

Comprehension problem. No countries describe the Holocaust as collateral damage. It was unprecedented.

So what is the problem then? No one describe any of their atrocities as collateral damage then.

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Posted in: Japan urges China not to focus on 'unfortunate history' See in context

That's rich coming from someone that claims legitimacy over the occupation of Tibet and East Turkestan which is still under seize today.

Except, I don't recognize Tibet and East Turkestan as part of China. Yes, I consider Japan a war aggressor but at the same time, I support Tibet and Xinjiang independence. Does that sound shocking to you? You think everyone who think Japan is war aggressor is pro China. Come on, be mature.

Yep. It was unprecedented as their Chancellor stated in 1985.

Which means no countries describe it atrocities as collateral damage.

@Back@home No one give Japan it's share in China. Japan invade China and grab it.

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Posted in: Japan urges China not to focus on 'unfortunate history' See in context

Not really. It's been done by other countries before and after. Heck. They don't even describe it as an atrocity but use the term "collateral damage".

Didn't the German clearly describe Holocaust as atrocity?

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Posted in: Japan urges China not to focus on 'unfortunate history' See in context

Simple, because China was weak and was occupied by many nations, that is why. If you want the details here is a paragraph in Japanese.

Basically the Qingdao–Jinan Railway was loaned to Japan and many mineral mines were jointly operated around the line so the Japanese army was sent to ensure security and protect of Japanese interest in the Shandong region.

Long story short, Japan invade other country, making Japan the aggresor.

Like I said, the atrocity like Holocaust is Germany alone. It's unprecedented as Weizsäcker stated in 1985. That's why certain countries chose to have a law to outlaw the denial.

And Japan atrocities is Japan alone.. Japan should ban it's own people, or at least it's own politician from denying Japan war atrocities.

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Posted in: Japan urges China not to focus on 'unfortunate history' See in context

And just because Japan doesn't know Cai Gongshi is not emissary, that justify Japan slice off his nose and ears, and to gouge out his eyes and tongue.

@Kazuaki Shimazaki No, it doesn't this kind of truce is nothing more FORCE agreement and not a sincere agreement. We have a word for it which we call as 'blackmail'. Blackmail the weaker people into agreeing with him.

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Posted in: Japan urges China not to focus on 'unfortunate history' See in context

And how do we know Japanese version is accurate one? We don't even know any Chinese involvement in ENGLISH wiki.

More important, why is foreigners such as Japanese forces occupy itself in Jinan in the first place?No need to waste time trying to distort history and justify IJA. Placing Japanese soldiers in Chinese land of course will invite provocation.

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Posted in: Japan urges China not to focus on 'unfortunate history' See in context

@Kazuaki Shimazaki What does war aggressor mean to you? My understanding is that war aggressor mean country that started war first and Japan indeed started war first in Manchuria so the truce or not, it doesn't change the fact that Japan is the invader.

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Posted in: Japan urges China not to focus on 'unfortunate history' See in context

There is link. War aggressor mean people who first launch attack/war. That's what it mean to be aggressor. Who lost the war is not the issues here.

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Posted in: Japan urges China not to focus on 'unfortunate history' See in context

No, the right of Manchuria is not. Non of the treaties justify Japan rule on Manchuria. No Chinese that time acknowledge Manchuria as part of Japan. Convention of Peking is also an unequal treaties and Japan is not part of Convention of Peking. Convention of Peking did not says that all Manchuria is part of Russia, but rather, part of outer Manchuria.Let me guess, your logic is that the treaties agree part of Manchuria is agreed to belong to the Russia and due to Russia - Japan war, Japan become rightful owner of Manchuria? Something like that? This logic is so wrong because regardless of which treaties, Manchuria belong to neither Japan nor Russia. By that logic, Tibet is the rightfully belong to China then. But do you realize that later on, KMT manage to regain control on Manchuria. When Japan launch war aggression on Manchuria, they goes war against KMT and not the Russia. The Chinese already reclaim back it's land Manchuria just like how it should be before Japan launch another war expedition in Manchuria. Also, I think you are confuse between World War 2 and World War 1.

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Posted in: Japan urges China not to focus on 'unfortunate history' See in context

@Triring

Manchuria belong to neither Russia and Japan but the Chinese. By your logic then Russia is the rightful owner for Kuril Island where Japan lost it's influence.

I clicked it. Still very far from most. More importantly, it is a horrible idea. I think all ideas, including the Holocaust, must be able to stand on their own merits, and not have to be defended by an anti-Holocaust denial law.

The entire European Union does make those law. Asia should do the same too. No,it's not a bad idea but it's a good idea as it prevent people from distorting history. Denying any form of war crime is nothing more than incitement to hatred against segments of the population. These law must be implement in Asia and especially towards politician and ex politician so that people like Ishihara will not make stupid comments that tarnish Japan image or cause tension among countries.

So, unable to talk about 1937, we go to 1931? I don't mind so much the concept of Japan being the aggressor on the Manchurian problem, On the other hand, a truce was indeed signed and that should have disconnected it from future events, so the linkage to WWII, or even the Sino Japanese War is weak.

And how does this relate to what I said.

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Posted in: Japan urges China not to focus on 'unfortunate history' See in context

That's six. Still not even close to being "most countries in the world".

Did you click the link? There's more than 6. Only 6 is named in Japan Today as example. It tiresome to name every single one of them.

As Pukey stated, the Jewish Holocaust is irrelevant to Japan.

The point is, Japan should follow German and most other countries in dealing with Japan war atrocities denier.

Japan is indeed the war aggressor during WW 2 for attacking Manchuria first. The Manchuria territory do not belong to them in the first place. There is obvious attempt by the Japanese to steal the land Manchuria from the Chinese and Manchu when Imperial Japan try to change the demographic of Manchuria by sending their own Japanese citizen there.

Japan lost sovereign territorial rights through war for Kuril Island. Kuril Island is objectively belong to the Russian.

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Posted in: Japan urges China not to focus on 'unfortunate history' See in context

Most countries in the world have no such law where denying the Jewish Holocaust is a crime including Japan.

What? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laws_against_Holocaust_denial

According to the link, beside Germany, countries like Australia, Austria, Belgium, France, Hungary make it illegal to deny war crime/Jewish Holocaust.

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Posted in: Germany's past and present ties with Yasukuni shrine uncomfortable for some See in context

It's not just Xia Shuqin. Another Nanking Massacre survivor, Li Xiuying also win lawsuit case in Japan in Tokyo Court against Japanese write, Toshio Matsumura, another Nanking massacre denier.

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Posted in: Germany's past and present ties with Yasukuni shrine uncomfortable for some See in context

Those propaganda already exist since long time ago. It's never effective which is why German has positive image on Japan before Abe taking over but become negative when Abe takeover. Economy? There's no Japan bashing either before Abe become president. So no, there is no capitalist.

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Posted in: Germany's past and present ties with Yasukuni shrine uncomfortable for some See in context

No, it's not propaganda campaign. The fact that foreign media outside China and Korea also bash Abe pretty much prove it.

Wartime 'Abenesia' bad for Japan's international reputation http://edition.cnn.com/2015/04/30/opinions/japan-abe-united-states-kingston/

History problems cast a shadow over Abe’s Japan http://www.japantimes.co.jp/opinion/2015/04/18/commentary/history-problems-cast-shadow-abes-japan/#.VdyEMSWqqkq

Abe’s unconvincing attempt to whitewash Japan’s history http://www.japantimes.co.jp/opinion/2015/08/17/commentary/japan-commentary/abes-unconvincing-attempt-to-whitewash-japans-history/#.VdyENCWqqkq

Abe dig his own grave. That's all.

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Posted in: Germany's past and present ties with Yasukuni shrine uncomfortable for some See in context

China's anti Japanese propaganda has been going on for years and long time ago but it never work outside of China and people outside China can see through China anti Japanese propaganda which is why before Abe take over the office, German still have positive image on the Japanese.

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Posted in: Germany's past and present ties with Yasukuni shrine uncomfortable for some See in context

Huh? So you are saying Abe is attracting attention because Abe is boring? That doesn't make any sense at all. China certainly do not have power on whatever script/media that German people read. Did you even know that Abe been attracting controversy like sitting on a plane with the number 731 on it? You know what 731 mean right? https://timemilitary.files.wordpress.com/2013/05/rtxzp5y.jpg?w=480&h=320&crop=1 German PM, Angela Merkel told Japan to face up his past. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/japan/11458384/Japan-must-face-up-to-its-shameful-Second-World-War-past-like-Germany-did-says-Angela-Merkel.html

Seriously though, China had nothing to do with it and it's Abe himself that cause controversy and tarnish Japan negative image. Stop blaming China for whatever bad thing happen to Japan.

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Posted in: Germany's past and present ties with Yasukuni shrine uncomfortable for some See in context

Yes, news sites and social media have been personally centered on Abe the campaign because Abe has been attracting controversy. So Japan negative image is because of Abe himself, not China.

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Posted in: Germany's past and present ties with Yasukuni shrine uncomfortable for some See in context

Then how come German negative image towards Japanese only occur after 2012 when Abe take the office?

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Posted in: Germany's past and present ties with Yasukuni shrine uncomfortable for some See in context

If it is true, all that statistic really suggests is that the Chinese Communist Party campaign, and those allied to it by habit or their own prejudices, is being successful.

Naah...CCP had nothing to do with it. Stop blaming China for every single wrong thing in Japan. After 2012, Abe take over Japan as president. Hope that gives you a clue why Japan image among German people has turn negative. It's Japan own fault not China.

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Posted in: 63% say Japan should stop apologizing over war: poll See in context

Weird because the other poll by Kyodo said 67 percent said Abe should apologize.

Abe has repeatedly said that he will express remorse in the statement, expected out shortly before the Aug. 15 anniversary of the war's end, but that he will not issue a fresh apology - despite a recent poll by Kyodo news agency that found 67 percent of respondents thought he should.

http://ca.reuters.com/article/topNews/idCAKCN0PX0JB20150723

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Posted in: Germany's past and present ties with Yasukuni shrine uncomfortable for some See in context

Only 28 percent of German people think positively of Japan. Japan image among German has turn negative after 2012.

In 2012, 58% of German respondents said they thought Japan was making positive contribution to the world. The number had halved to 28% by 2014.

http://asia.nikkei.com/Politics-Economy/International-Relations/Germany-dismayed-by-Japan-s-inability-to-move-on?page=1

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Posted in: Chinese film on WWII summit lambasted online for distorting history See in context

KMT fought the Japanese. NOT the corrupt communist.

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Posted in: China says Japan should have made 'sincere' WWII apology See in context

It is not so much an apology that is needed. What is truly needed is for Japan to stop lying both in its official histories and its schools about what it did prior to and during World War 2.

This. I am more concern about Japan attempt at distorting history by denying or play down their war crimes than apologize.

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Posted in: Abe's 70th anniversary war speech more than just words See in context

When the historical revisionism stops

Agree. Japan need to stop distorting history.

Why don't Japan create a law like German where people who deny atrocities are put to jail. People who deny Nanking Massacre where thousands of innocent Chinese civilians who got murder and raped should be put to jail. Do that Japan.

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Posted in: 7 decades after WWII, many praise Germany, scorn Japan See in context

Ah, so you're saying Japan liberated Asia? I wonder how many in China and South Korea would agree with you. Japan has a lot to learn from Germany's remorse

Japan NEVER liberated Asia. Not only in China and south Korea, but here in SEA, no one think Japan liberated Asia.

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Posted in: 7 decades after WWII, many praise Germany, scorn Japan See in context

I haven't heard any anti-Japanese sentiments from anybody I've known from the Philippines, Thailand, or Malaysia.

Most people in SEA are more pro Japan. However, that is still no excuse for the way Japan handle their WW2 issues.

I believe Singapore is also quite pro Japan but even then, Singapore PM said:

"Japan needs to acknowledge past wrongs, and Japanese public opinion needs to be more forthright in rejecting the more outrageous interpretations of history by its right-wing academics and politicians," Lee said.

"Japan has already expressed remorse or apologies for the war in general terms... but on specific issues like comfort women and the Nanjing Massacre, its positions have been less unequivocal," Lee said.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/wires/afp/article-3102924/Asia-WWII-Singapore-PM.html

The way Japan handle their WW2 issues is not admirable. Japan should learn from Germany.

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Posted in: 7 decades after WWII, many praise Germany, scorn Japan See in context

In German, if you deny Holocaust, you are considered a criminal and will get sent to prison.

In Japan,if you deny Nanking Massacre, you are consider hero.

Yeah, there's a huge difference between those two. Japan need to learn from the German.

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