noypikantoku comments

o much moaning and complaining. stop whining over a city's right to not be disturbed by your dirty and unwelcome presence.

Exactly! So Japan should give Kyoto a favor by stop promoting tourism in this city. Let it be available to well mannered Japanese Citizen and Japanese apologists only. Of course it can be open for everyone, but if the promotion is less, then tourists will not go there and can find better city or place to visit where they can be welcome and appreciated more.

Nippori Nick

Actually it does. That is the point of government. Elected officials to represent the people.

You think so? Please give me a data of how many percent of Japanese citizen voted this pass election?

They also like the tourist money.

That's why it is binary, the only reason why the locals are still allowing tourists to come is just because of the the profit and they've been there eversince, but do they want these tourists there? Not at all. So I agree , you cannot have both as if you promote tourism in that place it will be congested and people will flock, even if these people don't grab Geishas or walk to designated paths, if the streets become crowded some will end up passing or blocking "Private" driveways because the streets are congested. So if residents don't want that? Move to a non tourist area OR stop promoting tourism in that city. It wasn't like that before , it was more tolerable but since the government boosts up the tourism in Kyoto these problems started. So if the residents are not open to that then stop promoting Kyoto.

So the government is trying to find a balance between tourism, and respecting the locals.

Deciding a designated spot to take photos or allowing but with limitation is balancing, total prohibition to take pictures is not a compromise.

It’s not a binary issue.

Unfortunately it is. The leniency of Japan to tourism is actually part of this current government's plan to raise profits. Few years back coming to Japan is not so easy compare to today and the locals like it that way.

Thunderbird2

Thank you for making me so welcome in Japan... Seriously, I'm glad not all Japanese are so anti-tourist.

I've only been to Kyoto once and it was nice... and no, I didn't grab a Geisha/Maiko, I never wandered into private roads and went snap-happy... I respect Japanese culture, I know a fair number of people in Japan... Hell, my partner is from Japan...

Don't be so isolationist... that's a HUGE leap backwards. Or is it that you just don't like foreigners?

Uhm it's not us who decide for this prohibition but it's the city and people of Kyoto. It's not just the grabbing of Geisha that they prohibit but even just normal picture taking and if tourists are not allowed to take pictures for remembrance? Then what is the point of going there? Perhaps the solution is to make compromises but NO they are prohibiting these at all. So I think the best solution is to stop promoting Kyoto's tourism, of course people can come because you cannot really stop that, but they should stop promoting it like the way the government promote it now. With that foreign tourist will stop flocking and coming, take out Geisha and Maikos out of these ads and brochures, so atleast the very determined tourists know what to expect if they still push to go there.

Unfortunately Japanese don't think like you do and you cannot change them at all. Remember the Sarin Gas terrorist attack during the 90s in Tokyo? Their solution is to get rid of all trash bins, Japan is really not the best problem solvers. Their solution is always too extreme. So they are doing the same thing in Kyoto. They don't care if majority of tourists still behave and follow the ettiquete , the 1% messed up so let everyone suffer from it and save the pureness of this great city and get the tourists out. Their city, their rights! Unfortunately no matter how you admire the beauty of this city, it is not for you and the locals don't really want you there. If they do at least there will be some protests and pushbacks from many of them but there was NONE, it seems like this was a landslide decision.

Here we go again - the world famous spirit of omotenashi.

Nothing is too much trouble for our honoured guests, just so long as you do exactly as you're told and don't expect us to accommodate your enjoying your holiday.

Japan has to make its mind up: You can either base your every hope for economic recovery on increased tourism, or you can be hostile and unwelcoming to tourists. You can't have it both ways.

Well said!

The government needs to manage tourism better, it didn't have to end up in the mess we're in now. Yes, the government has set a huge numerical target, but then they've done nothing else to work out what to do with the people that come. I'm not surprised a lot of people have come to despise tourists with the way that some intentionally and unintentionally behave. It's bad now and it's only going to get worse, the Olympics will pale in comparison to 40mln people...

Even Beat Takeshi has weighed in on this remember https://kotaku.com/tourists-are-causing-headaches-for-japan-1835043188

I've never heard or seen a Japanese person say "We need tourists!" This is all a government strategy that somehow happened to work for once (maybe too well)

I agree! The government is the one who wants to boost up the tourism and not the Japanese people. I once saw an ENGLISH LESSON TV show where they are discussing how troublesome tourists are in Japan. It is an English lesson program right? They should be promoting tourism as this is where they can enhance their english skilss, but instead it's the inconvenience of having foreign tourists is what they concern more! I wish I can paste in this thread that photo I took using my mobile phone of that show.

Kyoto is indeed a beautiful place but it is not for tourism and locals don't embrace tourists. So they have to choose, save the pureness of this sacred city or make it a popular tourist spot? If they choose the first one then stop promoting it as the way they do now. Promote Tokyo Disneyland and other places in Japan.

Glaon333

The point is that the prohibited area is Gion district. It’s not about the whole city of Kyoto, nor this whole country.

Yes we are aware of it and we are talking about Gion District because it is what the tourists visit and not some small suburbs in Kyoto. The solution is just simple, stop promoting the tourism in Kyoto so tourists won't flock there. It's lame to sell the place for tourism and then prohibit the tourists to take pictures, so if the locals don't want tourists? Then stop promoting Kyoto!

goldorock

No it's not. Spending your hard earned $ doesn't mean you get a free pass to act ignorant & rude i.e climb uluru, take a selfie/touch Buckingham palace guards etc.

Well I am talking about simple picture taking of a passing Geisha (without grabbing or stopping them) which is also forbidden. It's common sense that grabbing anyone is not a good idea. But taking a photo of a place and people for remembrance? Jeez!

That's why if these things are prohibited then stop putting them on tourism brochures! And if they don't want tourists to flock to Kyoto, then stop promoting it. I totally agree with what the local residents want. If they don't want their properties and face on tourists photos then stop the tourists from coming.

Nothing wrong with 'look but don't touch' sometimes.

Who says to touch? We are talking about simple photographs!? And yes indeed nothing is wrong with it that's why I suggest to just stop promoting Kyoto's tourism, have tourists go somewhere where they can take photos and keep memories of their once in a lifetime tour and keep Kyoto to the people of Kyoto. Save the tourists to spend their money somewhere else where they are more appreciate and embraced. And obviously that is not Kyoto.

Entitled much?

If they paid for it especially when it's overpriced, yes they should at least get some of what they paid for.

seandw20

As for Geishas and Maikos, they don't mind being in photos 

Uhm how about this?

They are also passing out leaflets reminding them not to take unsolicited photos of geisha and maiko.

We have been to Kyoto more than 50 times and never experienced any problem from the Kyoto people or the service in the restaurants. Crowds and getting on buses, bust tourists places in the spring/autumn. We have never regretted visiting and always enjoyed our visits.

Again that's what we all thought, until these prohibitions now. :) It reveals the reality of what the locals really think. I am bringing back the Venice argument. I thought Venice embraces tourism, we were served nicely at restuarants, we never got scammed , we enjoyed until a local chatted with us and told us what they truly think.

Japan should just stop misleading tourists about GEISHAS , you see Geisha and Maiko photos on their tourism ads and videos making foreigners believe that it is okay to take photos of them only to find out later that these women hate it and it's forbidden. And for me why do these Geishas walk outside, why not just stay inside their shops and dress up there. OF COURSE they will get noticed and attention from foreign tourists when they see them. Grabbing them of course should not be allowed, but taking photos? Come on! This is why I think Japan should just stop promoting the tourism in Kyoto.

seandw20

Well if you saw the signs Kyoto put up, it is also written in Japanese. There you go, this new rule is not only limited to tourists.

ridiculous! Of course everyone is obliged to follow that law, but this law now exists to prohibit tourists. And why would a local resident who lives there his/her entire life would need to take a picture of their neighborhood?

seandw20

When did I say 'Japanese are never rude'? You're twisting my words. Are you brave enough to say that all Italians hate tourists? Or are people in Japan judged differently?

I am talking about the travel bloggers you mentioned who say that Japanese people are nice, and my point is, yes they will act and be nice to you because Japanese people are not RUDE and they will not show that they hate you compare to other countries. But that doesn't mean that they embrace and welcome tourists!

I didn't say ALL ITALIANS, I am particular to VENEZIAN LOCALS. And same with Kyoto, of course not all Japanese hate tourists but Kyoto local residents don't embrace them.

Oh quit freaking out. Unbridled tourism just ends up in a situation like Thailand, where the people in the industry hate the tourists, but are dependent upon them, ending up in a volatile situation.

Can you please prove that the locals hate tourists? At least they never ban taking simple pictures of the things they promote on their travel books.

Responsible tourism finds a balance between respecting the home and rights of the locals, with both the pride of being a place people want to visit, as well as the money the tourism brings.

Perhaps you should tell the Japanese tourism ministry to be more responsible on what they promote than asking tourists to be responsible. Taking a simple pictures is a normal tourist activity. You put these places and things (Geishas) on your travel books, brochures etc. and then you prohibit people to take pictures after spending so much money, isn't that a scam? Tourists went there to take remembrance, so prohibiting them with these activities that they paid for is not good.

People are acting like Kyoto put out a press release stating tourists are scum.

Obviously, they will not do exactly like that . But these prohibitions on simple tourists activities is a way of saying the same in a professional way.

Take a deep breath.

Yes take a deep breath when people spent thousands of dollars , fly all the way for several hours just to get to Kyoto just to find out that they are not allowed to take photos. What's the point?

So I think the best and beneficial to everyone is to just stop promoting the tourism in Kyoto.In that way you are giving the locals their right to preserve their culture, "Privacy" to Geishas and at the same time you are saving the tourists from not spending so much money and spend it somewhere else better where they can enjoy more.

I've read lots of blogs of travellers prasing Kyoto as a beautiful city and full of nice people. 

Obviously this prohibition changes things going forward. Yup they are nice people, as Japanese are never rude! But are tourists welcome? Not really. I've been to Venice before, and like Kyoto its a very beautiful place and the locals are so kind and helpful to us, but they told us how they hate tourism in their town. Yes they can be kind and nice to you , but wanting you to stay there is a different story.

I've read lots of blogs of travellers prasing Kyoto as a beautiful city and full of nice people. Are you going to say they were brainwashed or what? Your claim can be applied to Italy and Spain, whose governments want tourists, but the ordinary citizens do not.

And now who banned taking simple pictures for remembrance? If Kyoto locals understand and embrace tourism this simple act should be given to the tourists after spending so much money on their overpriced commodities. Again you keep on pushing about what the tourists and travel bloggers say, the whole point of the article is what the people and government of Kyoto want and not what the travelers say, as these travelers are the problems of Kyoto locals. It is indeed a beautiful city but it is not for tourists.

Zichi

Tourists are attracted to Kyoto because of the history and culture and the city was spared by the American bombing while every other city was bombed and destroyed. Parts of the city remain as it was before.

Indeed it's beautiful, but sadly the locals don't want tourists. It's like Venezia in Italy. When we traveled there, I was so in love with the city's beauty. But while we are claiming for our tax refund one local resident told us how they don't want tourists in their town. She is a nice person and helped us with the access to the tax refund office which is inside the same old building she is living, but she honestly told us how she hates tourism there. I have to apologize to her for visiting the place and I cannot blame her as everyday it's hard for them to go to local stores and move around as their narrow alleyways are congested by tourists. It's a beautiful city but unfortunately the locals don't really want us there, and they have their own reasons. So I feel the same for Kyoto, It's beautiful but tourists are not really welcome.

Uhm, have you not been keeping up to date with the Japanese government's targets. If they didn't want tourists, the country would not be setting a target of 40 million tourists by 2020, which was changed from 20 million in a few years ago.

The Japanese government don't represent the people. Government and politicians' decisions are mostly not what the people really want. Come on, it's not me who wants to ban a simple photo remembrance in a supposedly popular tourist attraction, it's the people of Kyoto. So if you support and respect the natives in Kyoto, then you should agree with what they want.

seanwd20

Where are you from, if I may ask? So just because you've never been robbed in Thailand, but I have, you think its a better place? But I'm 'careless' if I get robbed but if you were to get robbed in Japan, you'd blame the locals. You're a hypocrite.

I live in Japan. I am not saying that Thailand is a better place, but they welcome tourism more than Kyoto. Yes of course Japan is way more better and safer than Thailand, but the whole point is they don't want tourists, so why would we force ourselves to push and overcrowd Kyoto while the locals don't want it? So I am suggesting an alternative, go to a place where they embrace tourism more (Thailand). And if you like and respect Japanese people then you should agree with what they want. Kyoto is not for tourists , Kyoto natives don't want tourists so we foreigners should respect and understand that.

Toasted Heretic

Hmmm. That sort of outlook doesn't usually have a positive outcome. See history for examples. I believe we can educate ourselves and not just get along but live and love with our brothers and sisters in other countries and cultures.

Well said! I totally agree, but unfortunately the locals don't share the same thinking, and sad to say their opinion and demands should matter more than what we think. They don't want tourism in their land so what can we do about it?

while Japanese tourists can do whatever they want in other countries, Japanese people want you to Look, but don't touch. Touch, but don't taste. Taste, but don't swallow in their own country. They will smile and be polite, but they don't want you.

Or just stop visiting Kyoto. It's boring there anyway, what is so entertaining about old temples that all look the same? Why would you need to see a clean and old Japanese neighborhood while locals don't want you to be there anyway. And why would you pay overpriced hotels, restaurants and ryokan when you are not welcome at all. Go to better and tourism friendly places like Thailand and Bali, at least you can enjoy nice and beautiful trpoical islands, eat good food, relax, party and most of all the locals will welcome you with open arms. Kyoto is overrated but boring.

Ban tourism in Japan and in return ban Japanese tourists who travel in other countries as well. Maybe it's better that we all just stay in our own countries and enjoy our own private properties. In that way we can all achieve peace and culture preservation!

Just ban tourism , problem solved. Culture preservation is more important than tourists who do nothing but destroy things, they are also the culprits who take pictures of Geishas, they don't understand that these Geishas are not for tourism. Tourists are Jama! Keep it the way it was before, when Japan let all the tourists out. Japan is a very wealthy country they don't need tourism to survive.

HJSLLS

I have a better idea. How about plan the Olympic events in safe conditions for athletes early in the planning process or don’t host the Olympics at all.

Well Said!

These alternatives should be thought about during the presentation when they were bidding not months before the event opens! I love sports but I think Olympics is too extravagant and wasteful! The funny part is , the people who support and promoting GREEN and ENVIRONMENT SAVING agendas are the same people who support the Olympic which is a very unresourceful event. HYPOCRISY!

Isn't it funny that there is a Ninja club with children members, maybe hundreds of years from now some universities in the future will make a club named after Loss Pepes, the assassins who put Pablo Escobar's gang down. Because I think these are the equivalent of the Ninjas in the modern era. Ninjas ambush, assassinate and spy exactly like LOS PEPES. Ninjas have cool outfit and weapons though, unlike los pepes (jeans, boots, cadillac) . The Los Pepes club.

creepy! But this is the funny thing about Japan, they arrest these people but at the same time does nothing about fueling these creepy fetishes, just look around the trains, sometimes you will see hanging tabloids sexualizing children and high school girls. And the Adult Industry isn't regulated much, and these are the kick starters of these creepy thoughts.

WilliB

None of us was there to witness the scene. The article does not give a detailed description. You assume the child was just crying; I a rather imagine she cried violently and gave the impression she did not want to be with the man in question. So what would you do in that situation?

First I will find out what is the kid crying about, is she asking for HELP!? or not. You can tell easily when a kid is asking for help or just having tantrums. And then ask the adult if he/she is related to the kid, then ask the kid if she knows the adult she is with.  Do you really think a kidnapper will take it's victim inside a crowded train especially when the victim starts crying? Common sense people!

girl in tokyo

The point being this: if you see a man with a crying child, it is best to err on the side of caution - which means keeping an eye out to see if you can discern if the situation is a kidnapping, or merely a father caring for his fussy child.

The same, by the way, would apply to a woman. If the situation seems off, act.

But why not confront the adult and ask the kid first before calling the cops?

And how are you sure that all abducted children go hysteric? If we would follow your point then we should ask all children with adults as all of them are potentially taken against their will and just being silent or quiet due to fear.