Sentiments comments

No worries fw360 but pro-china arguments come in many shapes :-). In principal I think you make a good case for transcending unnecessary opposites. However since there is also a discursive war going on in several forums on the net I thought I best give you a few counter arguments. For quite some time now the Chinese position in the conflict has been quite aggressive. No doubt the clear involvement of the US has affected their position. I think it would be wise for China to try to change strategy and see what they can gain from a peaceful and diplomatic approach. The bullying approach has only created fear and hostility in the region so far. However I think we will not see such a development in the foreseeable future. The Chinese military has their own agenda and are benefitting greatly from this situation. And of course now the Japanese military has a chance to get more influential, no doubt contributing to an escalation. The only good side is that the emerging new military industries will create more jobs, and the rest is just sad.

fw360 - catching up it is not logical. Who decides what level of catching up is appropriate? Aggressions is not determined by Chinas own estimate of what they are doing, but also what their neighbors feel. Obviously Chinas gov thinks in their own reality and are incapable of understanding smaller nations feelings. This is exactly what is dangerous with a rising power. Putting up an ADIZ that covers Japanese controlled territory is only aggressive, nothing else. Seems to me Chinas talk about Abes militarization is only based on 70 year old references. These are a few reasons why Chinas actions and rhetorics doesn't make any sense.

Well China is pushing so Japan has no choice but to by hardware and start developing some really nasty stuff of their own. Mr Geng from Chinas defense department just stated that Japan aimed at playing up the "China's military threat", increasing regional tensions and using the pretext of safeguarding Japan's own national security and regional peace for its military expansion. How is it possible for someone to be so completely unattached to reality? Unless of course he/they have their own reality, like in a political propaganda war. Looking back at the statements from Chinas different ministers and militaries over the last year there is one thing that stands out quite clear. The speaker is almost always positioned from top to down, in psychological terms, a parent talking to their kid. I guess it could reflect their view (hubris) of themselves or possible a planned propaganda strategy, or both. However Japans officials has not uttered the same kind of propaganda in response. Are China thinking that they can contribute to improved relation by this or is an attempt to make Japan angry?

Just a note for you war oriented nut cases here. The question in an all out war today is not how to inflict damage to the opponent. The real question is how to survive at all. In a missile war between China and Japan/US the only interesting question is how many times each and every city in China and Japan will be flattened. Don't fool yourself into thinking there is a tomorrow if such a war breaks out.

A bit strange that several commentators seem to think that whatever China does it is only because Japan did something similar beforehand. That can only lead to the conclusion that Japan is leading and China is following. Is it about a little brother complex? By the way I thought the ADIZ critic was about covering land that China does not control, not establishing an ADIZ itself. How many other countries has established an ADIZ over land that they do not own/control? Can Vietnam establish an ADIZ over Hainan?

No its not only about Japan and Abe "secret plans" to go backwards. China could not make up half of what they are doing only as a response to Abes intentions. Instead it is as usual in this world, it takes two to tango. China makes moves, Abe responds, then China responds, and then Abe responds and so on. Basically they are supporting each other but I seriously doubt that they know what the consequences may be. To this day I find Chinas covert and "secret plans" more interesting than Abes.

Flowers, I respect your persistence and the fact that you want to position a Chinese perspective on the issues concerning the Senkakus. Democracy comes in many colors and yes Japan is one, even if the system needs a bit more maturing measured against some western nations. However I believe I have followed the controversies through the media lens for well more than a year. I’m well aware about the facts of the declarations pre and past ww 2 and most of the historic issues concerning the Japanese and Chinese relations. If you look back you will most likely see that there are no simple way to determine what is right and wrong from a supposedly neutral ground. There are only different viewpoints and the difference between the viewpoints has been increasing for at least 2 years now. Being tired of the old discussions about pseudo facts and blame game I think China understand that strong rhetoric’s, claims (and yes an ADIZ) in a situation with strong tension will only fuel the tension more. Thus Im surprised that instead of showing calmness and responsibility this wannabe superpower is acting to increase the tension. I think the right word for such behavior is aggressive.

The only thing missing from your perspective flowers, is that the facts point to China rather than Japan when it comes to war mongering. You know very well that Japan is a democracy and that the state can't make the people do anything it wants. The Senkakus was bought by the state to stop nationalists from doing something strong to provoke China. If China can't see such a simple fact it is worrying. Instead it seems that Chinas gov took the chance to attack Japan with unnecessary threatening rhetorics. To lay it out a bit simplified it would seem there is an agenda from the Chinese gov to use every means possible to gain control of the area around the Senkakus. The gains are of course possible economic profits, strategic military use and some kind of old style payback. I agree about that the US is likely to get more involved over time for strategic purposes. But basically China is pushing and giving Abe the momentum he need to change Japans defense policy. Of course that is Japans own business but i find it a bit sad that one of the most peaceful countries in the world is changing as a response to outside threats. With Chinas new Adiz Abe got what he needs to push for a change of article 9.

Well one part of history that could be interpreted as repeating itself seems to be Japan responding to the presence of a bigger power. Last time it was the US and this time it is China. Seriously I can't think of another people in the world that has to listen to a comparison to history every time someone wants something as much as the Japanese. The fact that China can't move on to find better arguments for their expansionism is a statement in itself, and that is very worrying when it is combined with building military muscles. If I recall correctly Chinas behavior seem to be a perfect match with the history about how Germany moved after the ww1. Well who would have thought...

As usual the pro-China comments are avoiding the crucial point. The right to set up an ADIZ has not been questioned. It's a non-issue. The right to set up an ADIZ over the Senkakus when the political tension is high is the real issue here. As a political move it can only be understood as hostile and aggressive, an act from someone that is trying to increase the tension, maybe even looking to start a war. No rhetoric´s or pseudo discussion can change this fact. I still haven’t seen a reasonable answer.

I find it to be an interesting formulation from Hong: Japans politicians has no right to talk nonsense. I wonder what they have a right to talk about then? I guess only China has the right to determine what other countries politicians has the right to say. I fear this may be a glimpse of the future if China is allowed to rule.

Well there are many angles put to use in order to understand this move by China. For my part one is enough. Why did China start up this ADIZ now? Of course it is a game of increasing the stakes to see who backs down first and yes this move is all China. This gives Abe the legitimacy he needs to push forward on his agenda and in a rather short while China will realize that they miscalculated the game, again. The US is not going to play ball for completely different reasons than Xi can imagine. I wonder when he will learn...

Probably, the long term benefit for China, if not forced to back down by international pressure, is to argue that they can fly and monitor, or create incidents for that matter, "legally" above the Senkaku islands. So far any kind of incidence in the airspace over the Senkakus would have been blamed entirely on the Chinese, simply because it is Japanese controlled territory. In that sense the ADIZ has to be regarded as a powerful push for the control of the East China sea. The US seems to understand this and I hope more do. The process here will determine the outcome for many neighbors. When Xi is ready, it will be hardball.

Well Xi is moving to clean up corruption and assert his power domestically, thats one important reason why increased tension with the US and Japan is necessary right now. The attention on Japan will make it harder for his adversaries to gather public support. Chinas air force is not of paper but this ADIZ fiasco is. When Xi, if he ever will be, is ready domestically, he will try to maximize the value with the ADIZ Hes playing a risky game, it could easily blow up in his face.

Sure these groups of people have no idea what war means in a real sense. Im sure they don't even now how to behave when shells start raining. Unfortunately the hotheads have been known to start wars before. Of course they will be the first to be killed but sadly many other may as well. Better that you Chinese internet guys take an aspirin, flush it down with a coke and then get back to your video games.

I wonder if the purpose of this article is to try to show the real face and opinions of the Chinese people. If it is true then of course all rhetorics from China about international cooperation, peace and nonaggression can be flushed in the toilet.

Is it likely that Chinas intelligence are so out of contact with the world so that they do not understand that this controversy is exactly what Abe and especially Obama needs to boost his support? Or could it be the other way around, they do indeed want the democrats to stay in power so that they can launch another agenda in the coming period? This assumes of course that the republicans have a reputation of being more hawkish in foreign policy, thus less attractive for China.

Its funny to see that there are some commentators trying to defend the Chinese act of aggression. However they seem to be perfectly without arguments, of any kind. Makes you wonder why they post at all. The Chinese aggression can not be more clear than this, short of a military invasion. Please understand that your posts can only be read as a declaration of your own state of non-rational mind. In practicality I don't think we will see any Chinese fighters chasing Japanese fighters over the Senkakus. The statement give them the right to sit on their homeland doing nothing.

Just one more political move to show that they are nowhere near to back down yet. In practicality I guess the Chinese fighters and Japanese fighters have to tell each other that they are actually flying here. Japan still claims sovereignty and keep the right to shoot down Chines aircraft if they come to close. Still strange that China keeps showing stupidity (like this act) as there main diplomacy. Hard to know what they are thinking? I had higher hopes.

Hey I'm wondering if there is some culturally blindness here. Japanese politicians don't act as politicians in west and I think that the same goes for much of the people compared to peoples in the west. Heck not even the politicians in the west act the same. Just compare italy and germany. The difference could indicate a different political space. Thus demonstrations with riots and police brutality may not be necessary in Japan. However a stronger habit to debate politics and a few degrees stronger political engagement may be needed for the population in general, at least if they are to reflect the democracy in the US. These kinds of statements from the government and and following debates is exactly what the opposition needs to revise themselves and become a serious contender again.

This is the stuff I like to see. It confirms that Japan is maturing as a democracy. Unfortunately a lot of people has strong daily regimes of routines that is not easy to break. But it is a start. This may attract attention and then engage more and more people in to discussions on policy and politics. Indeed Tokyo could rally massive demonstrations over time.

Abes job is to lead the country in to the future. Nothing strange if they want to revise whatever the national agenda for morals and citizenship is in Japan today. That is simply what happens in every democracy I know of. An elected government are supposed to impose their agenda as much as possible during their reign. And the next one will of course try to change that to something else. More interesting however is if Abe indeed have instructed the ministry to revise uncomfortable but internationally recognized truths about ww2. If so I believe Abe has chosen to step in to the beginning of the end of this government. Japan risk loosing face in the internationally community and that will of course be bad for business. Lets wait and see.

Well not bad Huang. However it seems a tad unlikely that it is still possible to speak about China with a "never changing" character or policy. Could it be that the resent economic and military/militaristic developments has changed peoples perceptions about the their capability, their god given rights and role in the region/globally? Moreover internal difficulties are usually connected to external ones. Maybe its reasonable that internal issues affect the foreign policies in the same way as external happenings affect internal issues. However a fact is that China has only escalated rhetorics, ships and planes in the disputed areas as part of their alleged wait-and-see strategy. No actual invasion of the islands yet. From a hardcore view I guess it is still as it has been for a long time.

Hey Ashley I think you may be making things a bit too simple in your pro-china argument. If you are of Irish decent then you know that the problems in the northern Ireland is brewing under the surface. The political initiatives and the tiredness of constant violence made the difference in achieving the somewhat peaceful situation. No apology can change the situation. And by the way the british politicians that you mention don't go to war shrines, they go to the many imperial war museums. Don't make a mistake about how proud many british are over their imperial and war history. In speaking of proper apologies then you should go back to read the apologies uttered by Japanese PM:s over time. There is some very real stuff there. No the problem is not Japanese, its SK and China that need to take a few steps out of their policy around historical atrocities. The responsibility lies with their governments that refuses to start a systematic help service for those of their own people that needs to deal with personal traumas. Stop using your people for petty political purposes.

Dont mistake strategic innovation with competition. Im not sure were Tim C is going with Apple but I think they have stayed on focus, which is to satisfy their customers. Why do you think they have so many loyal customers? The so called hysteric competition with Samsung in media is mostly Samsungs media concerns/marketing together with market analytics I think. They do their best to try to affect the markets psyche in order to gain more profits. Ive tried a Samsung Galaxy and I was not even close to impressed in terms of usability. The camera was okay. Ill stick with Apple.

Indeed it is political tongue. "Extremely disappointed" in my book reads this is a matter we are interested in, consider to respond more positively, deliberate on the things you may gain from accepting our proposal.

Okay Narusawa Muneos text is very critical, well argued and seem to be thoroughly founded in an understanding of the political scene in Japan for some time. However even if the historical accounts about Abe is reasonable you still have to separate between what Abe did and what he is doing now. I still cant se how Abe actually could get away with seemingly idiotic revisions about Japans ww2 history. Rather I think such changes, given that he still is a revisionist, would be the final blow to his government. Surfing the wave of threats from China to strengthen the self-defence is one thing but treating the Japanese people as idiots is another thing. They will not accept such a move.

It is very hard to see anything convincing with your point SaxonSalute. A few fundamental problems may look like this. The argument is based on a few choices of words, lifted out of its context. Im sorry but that can't support your point. Did you read the japanese text in original or as a japanese person understand them when you identified what was an apology and the status of it, or did you read a translation without a cultural interpretative frame? If the latter holds then Im sorry to say that there is no legitimacy whatsoever in your choice of words. You may as well state your point without support. You know intercultural relations only work when you start by avoiding to define for the the other how they should speak and construct meaning to you. Park seems to understand this even if I think she is making the wrong choice here.

Chucky I looked at your reference. Wow, you may want to read such articles with more critical glasses. There will probably never be a shortage of pseudo-science on the net in order to help people convince others about some point, no matter how weird. Id call the article a nice contribution to fiction with enough relevance to make it sell to those who are selectively looking for confirmation. Please stay somewhat rational.

The arguments in this thread are as usual based on a limited set of ideas. Japan did something wrong a long time ago, therefore they should forever be treated with suspicion of wanting to do the same again. If Japan makes a minor change in military spending – the whole country is becoming militarized and aggressive. I wonder how that logic works?

Japan can not be a real democracy and therefore they can not be allowed to express different opinions within the diet or among its people. Basically they should think as one (which fits with the accusers, sometimes racist stereotypes) and that is in line with what China and SK thinks.

Since Japan in fact was guilty of war crimes a long time ago every apology from the government will forever be dismissed as “not sincere”, fake or virtually non-existing. This seems to be a necessary idea in order to keep the complaining running indefinitely. Japan is isolated and not liked by anyone. On the contrary, Japan is very well liked for good reasons by most countries in the world. Only very few countries (read two) dislike japan. That’s all.

The whining from people is one thing but from the politicians perspective there is definitely something else than the obvious issues in play here, people. Might be worthwhile investigating a bit.