Five years on, the economic impact of COVID-19 lingers

Remember it was the overreaction to the disease, not the disease itself, that caused the massive disruption.

Oh what, so now they're admitting the authoritarian lockdowns, heavily coerced vaccinations, and mass censorship - did more damage than the virus itself? The global economy was wrecked not by COVID-19, but by the power-hungry elites who used it as an excuse to tighten their grip, print endless money, and funnel billions to pharmaceutical conglomerates, while CRUSHING small businesses and personal freedoms that massively impacted mental health. And now they have the audacity to act like passive observers, as if they weren't the ones who orchestrated this entire disaster?

The only real "legacy" of COVID-19 is the blueprint for future control... but the good news is, the majority of us have woken up, so good luck trying to run the same playbook again. We're not having it.

Remember it was the overreaction to the disease, not the disease itself, that caused the massive disruption.

Over 7 million people died worldwide, but yeah, it's the lockdowns that were a disruption! Sure.

Oh what, so now they're admitting the authoritarian lockdowns, heavily coerced vaccinations, and mass censorship - did more damage than the virus itself? 

Nope. You should read the article.

And the retconning starts already. Covid was the dry-run for a really scary disease and we all failed. It killed a lot of people, was responsible for as much as a 3% bump to the deathrate world-wide. But it could have been a lot worse. Black plague in the middle ages worse. Ebola worse. Whatever those kids ate from a Bat in the Congo worse.

Instead of preparing for the next threat though, most of the right leaning people are just crying that they had to stay home and actually let some poor people have some money for once. Vaccinations save lives, and if you believe otherwise you're just a giant baby afraid of tiny needles and you don't understand science.

The same people will try to tell you about the 1 in 250,000 people who had a reaction to something, in reality or placebo-type, and then buy a lotto ticket expecting to win. Nobody understands statistics and they think safety is fascism and fascism is safety. The only people harmed by the vaccine were actually in Japan where they had metal fragments in that one batch. Studies show vaccines prevented millions if not 10s-of-millions of deaths.

The CARES act in the US incentivized hospitals to add covid-19 as a comorbitity to any death it deemed related, thus providing additional funding to that hospital. That institutional incentive paired with the rejection of the Barrington declaration which called for limited government response prolonged an otherwise insignificant disease. The mortality was massively inflated and the prevention measures were a farse.

most of the right leaning people are just crying that they had to stay home and actually let some poor people have some money for once

I'm a little confused by this line. Worldwide government responses to the pandemic have been harder financially on the poor than anyone else: catastrophic inflation plus job losses hit them the hardest. The whole situation has been a giant funneling of wealth from the poor and middle class to the ultra-rich.

Japan did not have strict lockdowns. There was no enforcement only social shame for not following along with the charade. Private institutions like theme parks and hospitals made it their mission to enforce masking within their facilities. Businesses could voluntarily certify as "covid safe" and they would get the payout compensation for not serving alcohol or closing early. So no, no "lockdowns" in Japan.

Remember it was the overreaction to the disease, not the disease itself, that caused the massive disruption.

No such thing, world experts clearly say that in general the measures saved millions of lives that would have made the situation much worse. If anything countries reacted too mildly in many cases.

Oh what, so now they're admitting the authoritarian lockdowns, heavily coerced vaccinations, and mass censorship - did more damage than the virus itself?

No, no part of the article does that, in fact measures prevented something much worse, economic disaster on top of millions more of unnecessary deaths.

Japan did not have strict lockdowns.

Nor mask mandates, because the population has a much higher level of scientific literacy, meaning that people did what they were told by the experts was better for their communities without having to be forced to do it. The measures were in place, just done mostly voluntarily.

Over 7 million people died worldwide

died "with" covid. Remember that.

So, what effects from the Korona are evident in Japan today? In my rural location, Covid did a big number on public transportation and on small tourist oriented businesses including rural ryokan and minshuku. Many places that were just scrapping by lost customers and went out of business. Bus services were cut during Covid and have not recovered. Cities and towns cut services and many have not be revitalized. And the young continue to flee rural areas to live in the large regional cities. Covid's long-term effect in southern rural areas of Japan may be the easing of visa requirements for South Asian workers and a hollowing out of some sectors.

So no, no "lockdowns" in Japan.

Anyone who says that was not in Japan in 2020.

died "with" covid. Remember that.

Which is a well known factor that ends up causing the death, saying there are millions of children dying "with" malnutrition is a similar situation.

Anyone who says that was not in Japan in 2020.

Wrong.

Which is a well known factor that ends up causing the death, saying there are millions of children dying "with" malnutrition is a similar situation.

False equivalence. Starvation and malnutrition are directly related. The vast majority of deaths were listed with covid as a comorbidity (died with), not as a cause of or necessarily related to the cause of death. This was incentivized by providing additional funding to hospitals experiencing high rates of covid infection.

Did they die? Yeah. Did their PCR test show positive? Yep.

False equivalence. Starvation and malnutrition are directly related. 

So what? covid and immune problems are directly related, covid and coagulation problems are also directly related, so are kidney problems or lung problems. etc.

The vast majority of deaths were listed with covid as a comorbidity (died with), not as a cause of or necessarily related to the cause of death. 

Which again is something that very frequently happens with malnutrition. What you are trying to misrepresent is that something being listed as a comorbidity means it had no effect on the death, which is false. Incentivizing the correct identification of all the factors that contributed to a death is perfectly fine and desirable.

Did they die? Yeah. Did their PCR test show positive? Yep.

Did the infection contributed to their death? extremely likely as the epidemiological studies quickly demonstrated. That is the whole point.

I already told everyone a long time ago, the inflation was a direct result of the failed policies during the pandemic. And finally after 3 years, the press catches on.

There is nothing in the article that represent the policies as a failure, much less unnecessary. When something is a clear consequence of the pandemic, and doing it prevented much worse consequences then trying to misrepresent the measures as failure makes absolutely no sense. Is like having someone that had to undergo a risky surgery as a last resort because of a 100% lethal condition and pretending the surgery was the one that killed the patient.

Lockdowns didn’t save anyone, masking didn’t save anyone.

The experts say they did and can show the data to prove it, nameless people on the internet without any evidence are not really something that can disprove the valid authorities in the field.

https://telegrafi.com/en/masat-bllokuese-parandaluan-miliona-vdekje-nga-covid-19/

Not disputing this however this is not an effect of covid but rather an effect of the reaction to it. 

For this claim you need to demonstrate first that the measures were not the best possible under the circumstances at the time and second that they did not prevented something worse, without it you are just making a baseless claim that nothing bad would have happened without those measures, which contradicts what the experts say about it.

To stay on topic, the reaction and excessive measures that were called out by the rejected Barrington declaration are what caused the lasting impacts of the pandemic period.

For this claim you need to demonstrate first that the measures were not the best possible under the circumstances at the time and second that they did not prevented something worse, without it you are just making a baseless claim that nothing bad would have happened without those measures, which contradicts what the experts say about it.

Which experts? All experts? What about the ones that warned the overreaction would have long lasting negative effects on society especially those in lower socioeconomic status? That's what ended up happening.

Do you disagree that there was institutionalized incentivization for declaring covid as a comorbidity?

I disagree with your misrepresentation that this in any way make it the importance of covid inflated, when people with the same chronic diseases can live for decades well controlled or get covid and die in days it is very clear that listing it as a comorbidity has meaning and has to be incentivized to actually know how important it is as a cause of public health concerns.

What if the covid case was asymptomatic, as was incredibly common? 

So asymptomatic patients that suddenly die? is that your new argument? And what problem do you have if it is common? that only means it is much more likely to cause problems in a population. Do you also believe that if malnutrition is very common on a country it should no longer be taken into account as important?

To stay on topic, the reaction and excessive measures that were called out by the rejected Barrington declaration are what caused the lasting impacts of the pandemic period.

The problem is that you keep making claims that the measures are excessive or unnecessary when that is the opposite of what the scientific consensus say about them. And instead try to use as an argument something that has been proved beyond any reasonable doubt to be criminally incorrect and that would have mean literally millions of extra unnecessary deaths if the authors succeeded in misleading more people with their unscientific ideas. Again, take a guess how many of the authors of the declaration said that covid would have no more importance by summer of 2020, you will be surprised at how many were this wrong.

Which experts? All experts? What about the ones that warned the overreaction would have long lasting negative effects on society especially those in lower socioeconomic status? That's what ended up happening.

No, still just a baseless claim you are unable to support with any evidence. How about you search for any well recognized institution of science in the whole world that say the measures in general where unnecessary or did not prevented countless deaths? None say so? that is because the measures were justified and the negative effects are much less than what would have happened without them.

Biggest impact by FAR has been on consumers across the globe. Everyone far more health conscience now which is a good thing if you think about it.

Younger cohorts suffered most with remote work and school and loss of their social lives. For middle aged in many cases, benefits were huge, especially more time with family and less time wasted with drinking parties etc.

Elderly, a mixed bag but largely negative, as many lost their freedom to enjoy their 'golden years', and living in far more fear due to having more health risk.

How about you search for any well recognized institution of science in the whole world that say the measures in general where unnecessary or did not prevented countless deaths? None say so?

The same authorities you fallaciously appeal are the very ones responsible for or beneficiaries of the overreaction I claim was unwarranted. The heavy handed opressive response was warned against by experts but that warning was disregarded. There's no way to know what could have happened because there was almost no legitimate observations made after the first wave. Just immediate excessive overreaction having lasting effects to this day.

The same authorities you fallaciously appeal are the very ones responsible for or beneficiaries of the overreaction I claim was unwarranted.

Every single public health system, university, big hospital, science institution of the world?

This is not an argument, it is just baseless accusations that you can never support with any evidence or argument, the same excuse antiscientific groups try to use to explain why there is no evidence of anything they claim and plenty of evidence to refute them. Flat earthers claiming all the astronomers of the world are in a global conspiracy of which they are beneficiary, creationists claiming the same for all paleontologist, etc. etc.

Evidence of this impossible conspriacy? none, once again Bro, just trust me!

There's no way to know what could have happened because there was almost no legitimate observations made after the first wave

This is the fallacy of appeal to ignorance, where you try to argue that since you could not possibly know something then the professionals of the world could not know it either. Surprisingly for many the experts of the world have many different kind of tools to know what would be very likely to happen, but since this proves the opposite of what you want to believe your argument is that they must be wrong (and apparently in a conspiracy as well). Completely wrong.

Every single public health system, university, big hospital, science institution of the world?

How about the ones who were silenced, censored, and de-platformed for daring to question the hysteria? The ones who signed the Great Barrington Declaration, warning that lockdowns would DEVASTATE the working class, increase poverty, and cause long-term harm to mental health and education? The ones who pointed out that prolonged school closures would set kids back for YEARS? The ones who correctly predicted that shutting down economies would cause inflation and supply chain collapses?

Just immediate excessive overreaction having lasting effects to this day.

You know what the worst lasting effect of COVID is? Being dead from covid. I think if given the choice about 99.9% of the people who died from covid would happily take a few months of inflation over... Being dead.

After all of that, there's still no denial that the response has had lasting negative effects just like was warned in 2020. Only the claim that "the experts responsible for the measures said it would have been so much worse!"

You know what the worst lasting effect of COVID is? Being dead from covid. I think if given the choice about 99.9% of the people who died from covid would happily take a few months of inflation over... Being dead.

Yes, the only two options in life were "lockdowns forever" or "instant death by COVID." No middle ground, no nuance - just a binary choice. Never mind the 99.9% of people who didn't die from COVID but suffered from job losses, business closures, mental health crises, learning deficits, delayed medical treatments, and skyrocketing poverty. Nope, according to the Uber "Liberals", they should all just be grateful they weren't corpses!

How about the ones who were silenced, censored, and de-platformed for daring to question the hysteria? The ones who signed the Great Barrington Declaration, warning that lockdowns would DEVASTATE the working class, increase poverty, and cause long-term harm to mental health and education? 

Again, these are the same people that claimed that on the summer of 2020 (at latest) everybody would already be completely immune to covid so people would no longer had to do anything.

When you try to use as an argument the opinion of people that were so horribly wrong you are also accepting that you have no better argument than that, this works much better against your point than for it.

The people that suggested isolation measures were the first ones that said this would have negative effects, but that those problems would be still much much better than not taking the measures and end up with at least the same economic damage on top of millions of extra deaths. Your misrepresentation of how the measures were presented when used is still false.

After all of that, there's still no denial that the response has had lasting negative effects just like was warned in 2020

No such thing, the actual conclusion is that the negative effects are justified since it prevented things that were much much worse. And against this argument you have provided zero evidence to refute it. If you can't refute this argument calling it false do nothing, if anything it only makes it obvious you could not refute it.

The people that suggested isolation measures were the first ones that said this would have negative effects, but that those problems would be still much much better than not taking the measures and end up with at least the same economic damage on top of millions of extra deaths. Your misrepresentation of how the measures were presented when used is still false.

Ah right, so the people who got everything else wrong - from infection fatality rates to vaccine efficacy - are suddenly infallible when it comes to predicting an imaginary alternate timeline! The same "experts" who said "TWO WEEKS to flatten the curve" but ended up dragging lockdowns out for years are now demanding blind faith in their hindsight justifications?

Oh and NOPE: no serious person claimed everyone would be immune by summer 2020. What people DID say is that natural immunity + early treatment + focused protection would have been FAR SUPERIOR to locking people in their homes and pretending the virus would disappear if we just destroyed small businesses hard enough. Instead, it sounds like you're cheering ob on the massive overreaction that wrecked economies, crushed mental health, and ruined education, all while COVID still spread anyway.

Talk about just moving the goalposts and hoping nobody notices.

Ah right, so the people who got everything else wrong - from infection fatality rates to vaccine efficacy - are suddenly infallible when it comes to predicting an imaginary alternate timeline!

Yet another false claim that has been repeatedly debunked but you still use as if not. Nobody got anything wrong, the vaccine was even better than predicted, still effective against variants that were clearly told would appear.

The easiest way to see how these are just false claims is how you can never support anything with references or other evidence. Just again claiming that the experts supposedly said the measures would prevent any and all cases forever, nobody said such a thing.

Oh and NOPE: no serious person claimed everyone would be immune by summer 2020. 

https://bsky.app/profile/joho.bsky.social/post/3lea2jdxoc22h

See, all three of the authors made false claims about reaching "herd immunity" in 2020. What you are correct in is that the authors are not serious people, their purpose was always taking advantage of the people. Of course now is where you try to move the goalposts and hope nobody notices what they clearly and publicly said.

Yes, the only two options in life were "lockdowns forever"

Except absolutely no doctor or expert on Earth advocated for "lockdowns forever", so your point is moot.

Never mind the 99.9% of people who didn't die from COVID 

OK, so how many people do you think we should have sacrificed to "save the economy"? 7 million is clearly a laughable number to you, so what's your upper limit? Would you have considered lockdowns were a good idea at 70 million? 700 million?

Take a moment and think about how those policies did NOTHING to stop the virus

But they provably did, though.

Sweden skipped the mass lockdowns, kept kids in school, preserved civil liberties, 

Yeah they did! For a few months. And then when they saw cases and deaths skyrocket, they introduced thougher measures:

On 18 December 2020, Stefan Löfven, the prime minister of Sweden, announced new and tougher restrictions and recommendations including the use of face masks in public transportation and closure of all non-essential public services. In January 2021, a new pandemic law was passed that allows for the use of lockdown measures and legally limited some gatherings. Further measures were introduced in July and December 2021, such as vaccine passports.

If you want to name other countries as examples, why not talk about New Zealand? Who actually eliminated covid 19 from their country with strict lockdowns? Was that just a fluke?

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC7252131/