Girl who jumped off building roof, killing herself and pedestrian below, to be prosecuted

Sooooo.... what's her punishment going to be if found guilty?

Anyway, I might feel a little sorry for the young woman, but in her absolute cowardice and selfishness she murdered another person. Hope she realized that in her final moments.

If she's prosecuted and found guilty posthmusly, what exactly would the punishment be? What's the purpose? Wouldn't it just be a waste of taxpayer's money?

Prosecuting a dead girl is peak government ridiculousness - bureaucrats so obsessed with following their rigid, outdated rules that they’ve completely lost touch with common sense and human decency. Instead of serving justice or protecting the people, Japan’s legal system shows it is nothing more than a cold, unaccountable machine more concerned with its procedures than the lives it impacts. This is what happens when government overreach and a lack of accountability go unchecked - an embarrassing mockery of justice that is an absolute embarrassment.

It appears as though they are trying to discourage the behavior in a country known for a high suicide rate.

Maybe the victim's estate can make a claim against the girls estate. Unlikely that a 17 year old is going to have much wealth. Seems rather pointless, but this is Japan.

What's the purpose? Wouldn't it just be a waste of taxpayer's money?

Yes. Waste of time, money, etc. The child “assailant” is dead. The adult victim is dead. Move on.

If it was a case of bullying that resulted in her suicide they should go after the bullies, but knowing this is Japan they allow bullies to be bullies

If she's prosecuted and found guilty posthmusly, what exactly would the punishment be? What's the purpose? Wouldn't it just be a waste of taxpayer's money?

I am not for or against the punishment, but one would assume that because she is a minor........was a minor, that her parents or guardians would take the punishment. If there is one.

Whatever that may be.

IDK what the laws are, but wouldn't it be similar to if a teenager were to jump in front of a busy commuter train?

Well she already got the death penalty what else is there? Sadly though it will leave a mark on her and her family for generations.

Mr KiplingToday  05:04 pm JST

Maybe the victim's estate can make a claim against the girls estate. Unlikely that a 17 year old is going to have much wealth. Seems rather pointless, but this is Japan.

This is the only way such a prosecution would make sense. Maybe because the girl was a minor, her parent/s could be held legally responsible for the damage, or perhaps it could open the way for a claim against the girl's parents' life insurance. Don't know, but it would be interesting to find out where this leads.

So someone with obvious mental health kills herself and accidentally kills someone else in the process is to be prosecuted after her death. Are he grieving relatives of the accidentally killed woman going to demand compensation from the grieving parents of the girl who killed herself? Seems rather unsavoury to me

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I guess this is just another way to punish the 17-year-old parents and family. The girl had no intention of killing anyone else or hurting anyone else. It was a terrible accident. and let's be honest, this makes no sense. Do we need to punish the girl's mother, father, and extended family further?

Peeps, I don't think punishing the family is going to help here. I mean, what is the family of a potential suicide going to do to try avoid it, guilt them into not doing it -- ie. make them feel horrible about living? Punish them pre-emptively to stop them from committing suicide? The person killing themselves is doing the ultimate calling of a bluff.

What I think they are trying to do here is leave a record on this person's life so that she cannot even be mentioned ever again without shaming those around her in a number of ways. THAT might help prevent it a little -- the idea that in your final act you will isolate yourself posthumously even more than you were in life. That will be your only legacy.

Needless judicial resources being put towards this tragic case. For what? To cause even more trauma and stress to the kids family?

Rest in Peace to the poor girl and the tragically unlucky pedestrian.

Anyway, I might feel a little sorry for the young woman, but in her absolute cowardice and selfishness she murdered another person.

Your definition of "murder" is incorrect. There is zero evidence the girl intended to kill this pedestrian.

My guess this is so family of dead pedestrian can claim money from her family

Well this will certainly harm here future! Somehow I think she does not care

How much more stupid can you get, prosecuting the dead. Total waste of resources that could be better spent on other issues with living criminals. Someone needs a demotion!

the charge is gross negligence resulting in death

nothing says japan more than this. no wonder the poor girl wanted out.

quite disgusting if you ask me...

shame on you!!

Fighto!

Anyway, I might feel a little sorry for the young woman, but in her absolute cowardice and selfishness she murdered another person.

Your definition of "murder" is incorrect. There is zero evidence the girl intended to kill this pedestrian.

I think they are partly correct. First degree murder is premeditated which is what you are thinking. Second degree murder is committing an act knowing that someone could die. Then you step down to manslaughter. This could possibly come under Second degree murder but most certainly manslaughter. But as per my comment above I don't see the point.

“Maybe the victim's estate can make a claim against the girls estate. Unlikely that a 17 year old is going to have much wealth. Seems rather pointless, but this”

The victim’s relatives could instigate a civil action to seize the girl’s “estate” to get compensation. But that’s nothing to do with prosecution of the dead girl.

Not much point prosecuting a corpse.

Are they going to stick her ashes in the defence dock? How ludicrous.

So what, are they going to nab her next time around? "In your previous existence as a 17 year old schoolgirl, you committed suicide and killed a pedestrian. I arrest you for this crime!"

smithinjapanToday  04:52 pm JST

Anyway, I might feel a little sorry for the young woman, but in her absolute cowardice and selfishness she murdered another person. Hope she realized that in her final moments.

I guess you’ve never met or know anyone who has killed themselves or tried to kill themselves. The biggest predictor of someone trying to kill themselves is a sense of “hopelessness”. Second if they have a plan, and finally the means. It is by no means cowardice. They see it as a way out, maybe they’ve searched for help,(you don’t know anything about the case) I think the biggest selfishness is probably an inability to have empathy. You may not understand or agree with someone’s choice but you can atleast empathize. Oh no! I talked to many who’ve had those feelings, and they all have one thing in common they don’t see the future, no hope, a sense of hopelessness. And probably don’t want to burden anyone with their problems. maybe if you can use the internet to understand it, rather than condemn it no person with suicidal ideation ever stopped because they thought they were selfish. Never! They think there doing their family a favour.

This looks totally nonsensical and will surely have lots of criticism. However, I wouldn't be surprised if the family or children of the dead Ms. Chiba file for a civil suit to demand compensation. It could be fair, especially if she was a bread winner. This is why all parents should have insurance to cover most damage by kids, not least bicycle insurance which can pile up hundreds of million in damages if the kid mowes down the wrong person and it results in disability or death.

This trial should be recorded in the Guinness world records 2024 Book. I am assuming she will be served in her grave by a couple of marshals.

Under Japanese law the act of comitting suicide itself is not a crime. However,  if a suicide attempt causes harm to others or property, the individual may be held liable for damages.

Under the Japanese Civil Code, Article 714 states that the guardians of a minor may be held liable for damages caused by the minor if the child is found incapable of understanding the consequences of their actions. The article makes clear that;

"Police say the girl was old enough to recognize that she could be at risk of hitting pedestrians walking below, and have asked for an indictment to be officially recorded.

The parents of the girl are typically the legal guardians. If the child causes property damage or injury, the parents may be required to compensate the affected party. Or the survivors.

As the child is deceased in this case, the parents would have a tough time mounting a defense if sued in Civil Court.

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Suicide itself is killing someone's daughter in this case.

Sadly It' all about $$$$$$, that's all what everyone involved is thinking about.

OssanAmericaToday  08:58 pm JST

Under Japanese law the act of comitting suicide itself is not a crime. However, if a suicide attempt causes harm to others or property, the individual may be held liable for damages. 

*Under the Japanese Civil Code, Article 714 states that the guardians of a minor may be held liable for damages caused by the minor if the child is found incapable of understanding the consequences of their actions. The article makes clear that; *

"Police say the girl was old enough to recognize that she could be at risk of hitting pedestrians walking below, and have asked for an indictment to be officially recorded.

The parents of the girl are typically the legal guardians. If the child causes property damage or injury, the parents may be required to compensate the affected party. Or the survivors.

As the child is deceased in this case, the parents would have a tough time mounting a defense if sued in Civil Court.

Then in this case the law is an @SS

This is a tragedy for both parties. Families on both sides are suffering. The girl who jumped obviously was not mentally stable and it seems Japan doesn't do enough to help people who are suffering from depression. Suicide rate is very high compared to other first world countries. If anyone should be held responsible it should be the government for not having more support for teenagers and people in general who are suffering from depression or mental illness. This country needs Jesus. And we should all have compassion for everyone in this situation.

A sad story all round

It's similar to if someone drops in front of a train that persons family are liable for the millions of yen it costs the train company in delays

Moral of the story, please don't kill yourself.

Disgusting they would put the family thru that. It’s near government bullying and the lack of mental health in Japan is ridiculous. Waste of tax payers money and I hope karma comes back to bite the people involved in the butt sooner rather than later.

This tragedy bothered me for a week when it happened and just now I had to reread the headline multiple times to reconfirm that both ladies didn’t survive because the situation sounds that bizarre. This latest update adds to the tragedy. While the judicial formalities do seem a bit insensitive, it may be the only way for Ms. Chiba’s family to access insurance in order to get their late daughter’s affairs in order.

The girl is dead though so why are they prosecuting posthumously? Two lives already lost. No need to drag this tragedy out further in court.

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Well, she is dead already and is paying now, you knoe where..

Sorry for the innocent victim..

How much more stupid can you get, prosecuting the dead. Total waste of resources that could be better spent on other issues with living criminals..

I am wondering if this is to set a legal precedence for the future, so if this happens again ( hopefully not) it could be used to bring about a case.

How can she be prosecuted if she has no ability to defend herself?

How can she be prosecuted if she has no ability to defend herself?

She can't. But the Japanese "justice" system doesn't care much about suspects' ability to defend themselves or any other rights they might have. It's mainly about retribution.

So be very careful in Japan, especially doing things like driving a car. They'll punish you severely even when it's not your fault.

OssanAmerica

Under the Japanese Civil Code, Article 714 states that the guardians of a minor may be held liable for damages caused by the minor if the child is found incapable of understanding the consequences of their actions.

The minor was capable of understanding the consequences of her actions. The news reports clearly states, “Police say the girl was old enough to recognize that she could be at risk of hitting pedestrians walking below.”

Article 14 states that if the minor is incapable, the person who has the obligation to supervise the minor could be found liable if the person supervising “failed to perform their obligation to supervise.” You deceptively omitted this last part. Why?

shame on japan!!

putting good use of time and money to work.

I would be curious to see how cross examination goes...

Abe234 - Good post.

A lot of people seem unable to grasp that someone who is contemplating suicide is at their lowest and darkest point, and thinking rationally or reasonably is either very difficult, or impossible at that point.

Yet people call them 'selfish', or 'cowards' and try to apply a cold, rational rule based assessment to a nuanced, emotionally wrecked situation that requires compassion and empathy, not some cold a**ed indifference.

I bet that poor kid didn't want to hurt someone else. I bet she wished she wasn't in a mental state where she was considering jumping off a building. I bet she would be horrified by the outcome. Society, and the people around her have probably already failed her enough - why now try to punish her further? That's so dumb.

To those here at JT that think these people are selfish cowards, all I can say is: take a knee this morning and say a little prayer to whoever, that you don't ever find yourself in the same situation. You hight get a hard serve of humble pie.

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Anyone read Akutagawa's short story "In a grove" (藪の中)? The final account is delivered through a medium as the witness is deceased. Wonder if that's how they're going to do it here.

Girl who jumped off building roof, killing herself and pedestrian below, to be prosecuted

No disrespect to her or the judicial system, but how can you prosecute someone who has passed? Again, no disrespect, but that's like kicking a dead horse. What's the punishment and who would serve it? It doesn't make sense.

How can they prosecute? Surely they have to put her in a psychiatric hospital for three months to test whether she is sane enough to stand trial or not?

Railways sue the families of suicides all the time.

OssanAmerica

You deceptively omitted this last part. Why?

Curious to know why myself.

railways sue the families of suicides all the time...

shame on them!!

Yeah it's for the purpose of money

Just just like disturbing the train schedules.

Sure the charged the family of a old man with dementia who walked onto the tracks in Aichi and was killed.

All to do with money, no decancy

The logic behind the prosecution explained here: https://news.yahoo.co.jp/articles/4950b895d14946221f7f5fd183673b12931da711

Clearly the girl wasn't thinking in the right frame of mind. The prosecutors need to be reminded that this wasn't something a person would do with a logical mind! What a complete waste of tax-payers money!

Albert Einstein — 'Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe.'

And he already said that not even knowing this case here, when a dead person is 'prosecuted'.

Well, she is dead already and is paying now, you knoe where..

No. Where? Please enlighten us with your unquestionable insight.

I am surprised that no one in these comments has come up with a reasonable explanation for the actions of the police in referring the matter to prosecutors. Surely someone, somewhere, has an inkling of an idea of the rationale of the Japanese judicial system in this matter?

Well, many people may don't know but when someone jump onto the train tracks, his family is charged for the cost of his actions, train delay, cleaning, repair...

This is not the first time a dead person was convicted, even dead if someone commits something that is against the law, they will prosecute him and get the case closed.

It amazes me how so many people does not know that Post-mortem trials and judicial processing is a common practice in many countries....

Before you get amazed by the how "stupid" the Japan is you may check your country penal and judicial codes.

when someone jump onto the train tracks, his family is charged for the cost of his actions, train delay, cleaning, repair

to be paid from the insurance money no doubt...

a civil case brought by the dead woman's family? understandable.

a train company wanting some of the insurance money? no, suck it up.

the police prosecuting a dead suicide? SHAME-ON-JAPAN!!!

Just as an addendum... I make a quick serach and there is even a legal therm for this type of cases

"Dyadic death"...

"In dyadic deaths, a second victim acts in consort with, is associated with, or is killed by a person who, contemporaneous with the first death, then suicides. Dyadic deaths thus include both homicide-suicides and suicide pacts. "

and here some examples in the US.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0015736885723900

Since the definition of the Dyadic death, states the second death also includes "homicide" it means some deahts are considered a criminal case.

For this particular case, it may be "unitentional manslaughter"

Brian TroutToday  06:17 am JST

Article 14 states that if the minor is incapable, the person who has the obligation to supervise the minor could be found liable if the person supervising “failed to perform their obligation to supervise.” You deceptively omitted this last part. Why?

Because the sole witness who could collaborate the parent's defense position is dead.

And congrats for being the only person on the planet who feels "deceived".

Err what? Do they want her to appear in court? And then go to jail? Questions questions